Lease Questions - Ask Here

mjfloyd1 · September 2003

Any idea what the new toyota and lexus programs are for sept?

Thanks in advance,
Mark

dan__2 · September 2003

Hello Car_man.
I saw your post regarding the new G35 lease details due out Sept. 3. Have you had a chance to look at the details? I'm purchasing a 2004 coupe for $37k, 12k miles/year...$2,000 is due at the signing which includes $1,000 cash down and the other $1,000 includes a $555 1st mo pmt (and some other stuff). My lease is for 39 months and i'm supposed to sign in about a week.
Thanks for your help!
Dan

dan__2 · September 2003

oh by the way i'm in MN (regarding the G35 coupe).
thanks.
Dan

pgill · September 2003

Hi Car_Man -

Can you please check to see if 2003 BMW X5 3.0 lease program has been extended beyond Sept 2nd? Can you provide the residual and money factor for 36 and 42 month leases for 12k miles per year?

Thanks,

Peter

CarMan@Edmunds · September 2003

Hey multiplechoice. As one might expect with such a popular new model, Toyota has not been providing any sort of support on the 2004 Sienna. So, if you were to lease one through Toyota Financial Services, you would have to use its standard lease program. I have not seen if TFS' program has changed for the month of September yet. I will look into it and see what I can find out. Please check back with me at the end of this week or early next week with a quick reminder and I will let you know what I have been able to find out. Talk to you then.

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CarMan@Edmunds · September 2003

Hi Mark. I should have had an opportunity to take a look at the new Lexus and Toyota programs by the end of the week. Please feel free to check back with me late this week or early next and I would be more than happy to give you an idea of what the current lease program is like on the model or models that you are considering. Talk to you soon.

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CarMan@Edmunds · September 2003

Hello Dan. Yes, Infiniti did introduce a new lease program yesterday. I do not know all of the details of its September program yet, but I do know that it is not providing any sort of lease support on the 2003 or 2004 G35 Coupe (neat car by the way). This means that Infiniti Financial Services' base lease money factor on it is probably .00200. If you would like the exact details of the lease program for this model, please check back with me in a few days with a quick reminder and I will fill you in on what I have been able to find out for you. I would even be happy to calculate a sample lease payment for you on the car that you are interested in if you provide me with its full MSRP and selling price.

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CarMan@Edmunds · September 2003

Hi Peter. I will look around and see if I can find out what BMW's September lease program is like for you. Please post a reminder for me in a few days and I will let you know what I have been able to find out. Thanks.

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c182skylane · September 2003

Car_Man:

Acura now has a $1500 Dealer Cash program, so I'm re-interested in their lease. Has anything changed for Sept? Here are the latest specs you provided from August...

2003 Acura TL Type-S
15,000 Miles Per Year
3 Year Lease
Residual = 56% of MSRP
Money Factor = 0.00102 (no security deposit reqd)

THANKS!

pgill · September 2003

Thanks Car_Man. I also heard that BMW started offer a rebate on X5's (not sure 3.0 or 4.4 or both) for September...can you please check on that as well?

djdez · September 2003

I too was considering this, and was HOPING that holding out has now HELPED .. if you were to combine the $1500 with the lease deal (assuming it's still available) that Acura was running, you're looking at a payment in the mid $300's for a TL-S !! That's a STEAL !
This would BEAT the deal I was able to get my dad at the end of July, when they TOLD me the lease deal was ending, then it ran all through August !

So, Car_man .. are the money factors and residuals on the TL-S STILL the same from August ??? If so, it's a GREAT DEAL and I just may go get one !!!

They gotta be eager to move these, with the '04's ready to arrive soon !

Also, Car_man, if you don't mind .. did you have a chance to check the lease programs I asked you about earlier this week -- Infiniti G35, I35 and M45 - did they get any better ???... and any new #'s on the TSX for September ? Thanks again !!!

Jeffmust .. regarding the registration ... I just had mine renewed yesterday ... yet, I only have 3 months left on my lease, and I might be out of it even sooner than that! SO, I had to pay the FULL amount ... but, does anyone think they will reimburse me ? I'm in NJ, if anyone knows ... THANKS !

fish8 · September 2003

Can someone please let me know what money factor is? Sorry for my ignorance!!

g17 · September 2003

Money Factor is just the finance rate. To calculate, here is what you do: Take any money factor for ex. .00150 and * by 2400 you get 3.6...That is your finance rate for the lease term.

fish8 · September 2003

Where is the 2400 coming from? Is that the cost of the vehicle?

bowke28 · September 2003

money factor is similar to an interest rate, in that its the money you pay the bank to borrow the value of the car. other than that, its figured entirely different. take the MSRP of the vehicle in question...lets say $20000. this vehicle may have a 50% residual for 3 years. here's how you figure it:

money factor: (hypothetical) 0.00150
MSRP: $20000
Residual:$10000

add the MSRP to the difference between it and the residual: ($20000+$10000=$30000)
multiply the total by the money factor: ($30000X0.00150=$45) this is your monthly lease charge.

now...divide the $10000 difference by the term (36 months)...($10000/36=$277.78) this is your base payment.

now add the lease charge to that...($277.78+$45=$322.78) this is your lease payment without state taxes.

multiply the last # by your sales tax %, and VOILA!!!

here in KY, it would end up being $342.15 at 6% tax.

rwright · September 2003

Car_Man:

I finally decided on the 2004 BMW 325Ci - I've been tracking the rates for a while. Unfortunately, none of the dealers in the area had the car spec'd the way I wanted it, so I had to order a vehicle. It is supposed to arrive at the dealership in early October. My salesman says I should fill out the BMW FS credit app so that we have our pick of rates between today's date and delivery date. Do you know if this is possible? Will we get to use the lowest rate from the date the credit application is sent to BMWFS to the delivery date (BMW FS Credit applications expire in 60 days)?

Can you also give me the lease info. for the 2004 325Ci for a 36 month lease for both 10K and 12K miles per year. Also, please let me know how long the current BMW lease program is scheduled to run.

Thanks again for all the help!

jratcliffe · September 2003

Your #s are correct if the car is selling at MSRP, but if it's not, then you have to make a few edits:

money factor: (hypothetical) 0.00150
MSRP: $20000
SALES PRICE: $18000
RESIDUAL: 50%

First calculate the residual value: MSRP*residual % = $20000*0.50 = $10000

add the SALES PRICE to the difference between it and the residual: ($18000+$10000=$28000)
multiply the total by the money factor: ($28000X0.00150=$42) this is your monthly lease charge.

now...divide the total depreciation, the SALES PRICE ($18000) minus the RESIDUAL ($10000) by the term (36 months)...((18000-10000)/36=$222.22) this is your base payment.

now add the lease charge to that...($222.22+$45=267.22) this is your lease payment without state taxes.

multiply the last # by your sales tax %, and VOILA!!!

here in KY, it would end up being $283.25 at 6% tax.

hooops · September 2003

Hi Car_man,

Can you please provide me with the residual and money factors for a "2003" VW Jetta GL and GLS as well as a Passat GL for a 36 month / 15K mile
lease. I live in the New York City metro area.
VW Credit is offering current lease holders the opportunity to turn in their current vws and take a 2003 without any penalties if you have 12 months or less left on your lease.

Thanks

liannell · September 2003

I'll leave it up to Car_man to confirm all the rates, but the BMW website updated the fine print on their "Special Lease Offer" for the 325i. It previously said the offer ended Sept 2. Now it says Sept. 30. Wahoo!

Lianne

meinrad · September 2003

Just checking back even though I haven't given you much time since your message on the 2nd.

I think I've got a deal to pick up the Element tomorrow. I don't know what numbers they used but their monthly payment was right about what I expected it to be.

But if you did have time to check them out, the more info I have the better, before I sign the papers.

We decided on a 36 month, 15k mile/year lease.

kyfdx · September 2003

3yr/45K.. I'm aware of the $1500 marketing support.. MF and residual please.

Thanks!!

kyfdx

c182skylane · September 2003

wouldn't it be great if the money factors and residuals were the same as August?

prior to the $1500 dealer cash, two different dealers were quoting me $28,500 for the TL-S. that's about $500 below invoice of $29,052. So, do you think that $2000 under invoice using the dealer cash is possible?

I'm looking forward to Car_Man's response on the MF and residuals....

kyfdx · September 2003

I think if you got quoted $500 under, then $2000 under is definitely possible now. Although, I feel its highly unlikely the MF and residual will stay the same. My guess is the MF will be higher. Residual, I'm not sure about.. I think maybe only looking at about $10 per month better when all is done on a lease. Cash buyers are much better off, but I'm betting 2.9%/60 mos. is gone also.

We shall see, regards,
kyfdx

djdez · September 2003

OK .. from what I've been told, the LEASE deal that was running on the TL's from July/August with the REALLY good Money Factor is unfortunately ... GONE. I hear the 2.9% financing deal is ALSO gone, but none of this has been confirmed by Car_man -- let's wait to see what HE says !!!

Residuals shouldn't change much though .. maybe drop 1-2%, but that should be it. So, I tried to work the deal out using Honda's STANDARD money factor of .00205 and USING the $1500 off the invoice (for a price of around $27500 on the TL-S) .. and the lease actually came out a few dollars a month HIGHER !!!

Perhaps a different bank may have a more competitive money factor, but it's not likely .. plus the residuals may be different ... this isn't over yet, I'll continue to try and work a deal !!!

bowke28 · September 2003

you are right about the payment being less, but after going through close to 500 lease contracts, the money factor is based on MSRP+depreciation...not selling price+depreciation.

the lease charge is the same whether you get a $5000 discount or nothing at all. thats why you pay tax the way you do in a lease...on the total cap cost reductions, instead of on the selling price of the car...the same way the money factor applies to the MSRP. the only thing you change by getting a discount or putting money down is the base payment...thats why leasing experts tell you to never put money down on a lease. you cant change the lease charge, so keep your money in your pocket.

kyfdx · September 2003

The money factors before the latest deal were about .0015 on the TL. My guess is the money factor won't go back to the standard, but will still be somewhat higher. Also, 2% equals almost $640 on the TL-S, which negates a substantial portion of the marketing support, assuming it does go down 2%. I sure wish Car_man would get back soon, so I can quit talking out of my ___!!

regards,
kyfdx

kyfdx · September 2003

The money factor is applied to cap cost plus residual, not MRSP. The residual is based on MSRP, but the money factor is not.

regards,
kyfdx

c182skylane · September 2003

correct.

so, where else can a consumer look up MF and residuals? I checked the honda financial services web page, but couldn't find anything. I've come to realize that dealers don't readily give out those figures. so far, this page seems to be the best source.

kyfdx · September 2003

Right here is the only place... If you want to know what the independent banks are using, you can go to leasecompare.com and it will tell you the money factor, and you can do the reverse math to figure the residual. But, that still won't tell you what the captive finance companies are offering.

regards,
kyfdx

djdez · September 2003

Actually .. the lease deal on the TL had a MONEY FACTOR of .00092 .. and if you wanted to WAIVE the security deposit, it became .00102 ! So, I'm not sure who told you .0015 ... that is incorrect, since I know - we LEASED the car for my dad, and it was through AHFC, and the MF was .00102 and the residual was 58% ...

However, a MF of .00102 equates to an INTEREST RATE of approximately 2.45% ...

eggend · September 2003

Hi CarMan...I am interested in the September money factors and residuals for three different 2004 models. Please assume 36 mos lease/12k miles a year. I also don't know if any of these models have any discounts/specials re: leasing. I am in the DC area.

The vehicles are:

--Audi Allroad 2.7T
--Volkswagen Touareg V6
--Volvo XC90 5-cylinder

Thanks!

c182skylane · September 2003

Okay, I think I have answers on MF and residuals... (provided by 2 local dealers. same numbers from both, so I think they're real. Car_Man: feel free to confirm)

36 Month Lease and 15,000 mi/yr
MF = 0.00215
Res = 55%

48 Month Lease and 15k mi/yr
MF = 0.00190
Res = 50%

djdez · September 2003

Wow, if those are the NEW Money Factors on the TL then I think we may have MISSED THE BOAT !!!

They basically doubled them .. while the residuals dropped .. however, the 58% residual was on 12000 miles .. so that couldn't have dropped to lower than 56% .. I think you quoted for 15k ...

.00215 equates to 5.16%
.00092 equates to 2.208%
.00102 (waived sec deposit) equates to 2.448%

I still don't think the $1500 incentive makes up for that much of a markup in the MF .. oh well !

kyfdx · September 2003

The .0015 was the program before the .00092. They haven't used the standard lease rates on the TL since before March. But, it looks like they are now. If residual for 15K is 55%, then residual for 12K is most likely 57%. So, $1500 less cap minus $295 less residual (on TL) equals $1205 less depreciation. Or about $33.50/mo less.
If money factor increases to .00215, then thats about $50/mo more.. Meaning on the same deal, the lease price just went up about $16.50/mo.

Good deal for cash buyers, not for leasers..

regards,
kyfdx

boo20 · September 2003

There seems to be some misunderstanding here about how the money factor is applied. The idea behind the money factor is very simple. The monthly interest due on a loan is approximately (in the case of a lease, exactly) equal to the 1/2 the amount of money due at the beginning and at the end of the lease. Lets say a car has an MSRP of $90000 and that you get a $5000 discount and put $5000 down. That means the leasing company has to pony up 90000 - 10000 = $80000. That is how much they are 'lending' you so to speak and that is the amount upon which you will be paying interest. Furthermore lets assume in this case that the residual is 50%. It is calculated on the basis of MSRP so in this case it is 90000 - 45000 = $45000. Now at the beginning of the lease you owe interest on $80000 and at the end of the lease you still owe interest on $45000. The average amount of money owed is (45000 + 80000)/2 over the term of the lease. Note that is the residual PLUS the amount you have borrowed by negotiating down the selling price and placing a down payment (ie., the amount you have effectively BORROWED). Now what is the monthy interest charge? Well it the (yearly interest rate div by 12) times the average money owed at any time. I.e., (45000+80000)/2*(yearly int/12) OR Residual + cap cost)* money factor where the 1/2 and 1/12 have been multiplied together to get the denominator of 24 which is divided into the yearly interest rate to get the money factor i.e., 1/2*1/12*yearly interest rate is money factor.

So if you are paying interest on the MSRP and have gotten a cost reduction or placed a down payment you have gotten royally RIPPED OFF and do not understand the mathematics behind lease payments. I sincerely hope that you have not purchased 500 cars using YOUR calculation and further hope you have not SOLD 500 cars like this as well

multiplechoice · September 2003

Hi Car-man, just wanted to see if you had an opportunity to look at the programs for the '04 Sienna. The dealer has informed me that the residual for 36mo/15K is only 51%. Did it really drop so much since last mo. (You had previously quoted 60%) This is for a XLE. I understand that the residuals are lower for the XLE limited. So, my question is what is the residual for the XLE and XLE limited for the 36mo/15K and 48mo/15K programs? I'm in southern california. Thanks for all of you invaluable info.

gmanusmc · September 2003

CarMan - Any info yet on MF (I guess lease rate in the case of GMAC) & residual for 2004 Corvette Hatchback Coupe 36 & 48 Month, 15K per year.

Thanks in Advance!!

Bill G

liannell · September 2003

Hi Car_Man, I'm adding another car to my list of those under consideration. Once you get the Sept rates, please post the new residual and MF for both a 2003 and 2004 Infiniti G35 Sedan. Use 15k miles/yr and both 36 and 39 month terms. Thanks!

cc3z · September 2003

What a tremendous forum! Car_man, have you been able to digest the Sept. 04 Infiniti lease terms? I'm looking at a 2003 G35 Coupe. They're quoting me a high money factor (.002430) and I want to come back with something more reasonable. I saw that as of Aug. the money factor was 0.00200. I'm looking at a 36 or 39 month lease, 15K mi., and nothing down except security deposit and drive-off fees. The total MSRP on the vehicle I'm considering is $37000. (They're quoting me the same 55% residual you posted in msg. #7600)

metmdx · September 2003

Hi Car_man:
I'm sure you're spending this gorgeous weekend pouring over all the new deals (I hope not for your sake).

Anyway, for the '03 4Runner LTD with MSRP of 38,089 and selling price should be approx 33,500. I will do 15K miles a year. What should be the lease payment? What MF does Toyota have now and what incentives in NY metro area? Do you know what the residual % is?
TIA,
metmdx

CarMan@Edmunds · September 2003

Hey c182skylane. You are correct, Acura did indeed introduce dealer cash on the 2003 TL for the month of September. Unfortunately, this dealer cash replaces the special lease money factors that it was providing on this car last month. As a result, if you were to lease one through American Honda Finance Corp. right now, you would have to use its standard lease program and use the dealer cash to reduce its capitalized cost. I haven't worked out any lease payments on this car using both programs, but I have a feeling that the August program and the new September program will result in very similar monthly lease payments.

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CarMan@Edmunds · September 2003

You're welcome, pgill. Much like Acura did with the TL, BMW replaced its special lease money factors on the 2003 X5 with dealer cash. Specifically, in September it is providing $3,000 dealer cash on the 2003 X5 3.0 and $4,000 on the 2003 X5 4.4. If you want to lease one of these models, you may use this cash to lower its capitalized cost and then lease it using BMW Financial Services' standard lease program or lease it through an outside lending institution.

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CarMan@Edmunds · September 2003

Hi djdez. As I mentioned in my previous post, the new dealer cash that Acura is providing on the TL replaces the special lease money factors that it was providing on this car in August. So, unfortunately AHFC's factors on the 2003 TL in August will be about double what they were last month.

Infiniti's September lease program on the 2003 G35 Sedan, I35, and M45 are very similar to its August program. In fact, I believe that the G35 Sedan and I35's factors and residuals are exactly the same. Infiniti did lower its money factors on the '03 M45 slightly, but this was just to offset a slight decrease in its residual values so any leases on it should have very similar payments. As far as the Acura TSX goes, I do not believe that Acura is providing any support on it, so like last month if you were to lease one through AHFC, you would have to use its standard lease program.

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CarMan@Edmunds · September 2003

Hi fish8. There's no need to be sorry, leasing can be very confusing for consumers who do not have any experience with it. The following article that is available here at Edmunds.com will any questions that you have on the definitions of lease terms: Edmunds.com Leasing Glossary.

Car_man
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teck2u2 · September 2003

Hey car man,

I am in the market for an SUV, 7 seats. Period.
Who has the best deals out there for 3 years, o down etc. I amlooking to pay over $350 pm. How does that sound. Thanks

CarMan@Edmunds · September 2003

Hi again rwright. Yes, many captive finance companies, I believe including BMW Financial Services, provide consumers who have filled out credit applications with the ability to lock in lease programs on ordered vehicles for a certain period of time. Having said this, if you don't feel like filling out a credit ap right now, you really aren't risking losing much because BMW FS' current program on 2004 3-Series models is nothing to write home about. I do not believe that BMW is providing much lease support on any '04 3-Series models in September. The worst thing that would happen if you waited is that BMW's lease money factor might increase slightly or its residual values might drop slightly, but it's current program is nothing special.

Here is the September lease information that you are looking for. If you were to lease a 2004 BMW 325Ci through BMW FS right now for 3 years with 10,000 miles per, its base lease money factor and residual value should be .00220 and 60%, respectively. It's 12,000 miles per year residual value would be 1% lower. I believe that this program is scheduled to run through September 30th.

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CarMan@Edmunds · September 2003

Thanks for the reminder, hooops. Here is the info that you are looking for. If you were to lease a 2003 Volkswagen Jetta GL 1.8T Sedan through VW Credit this month for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, its base lease money factor and residual value should be .00165 and 49%, respectively. The numbers should be exactly the same for an otherwise identical lease of a 2003 Volkswagen Jetta GLS 1.8T Sedan. If you were to lease a 2003 VW Passat GL 1.8T Sedan through VW Credit this month for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, its base lease money factor and residual value should be .00165 and 47%, respectively.

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liannell · September 2003

Hi Car-Man,
Reposting this now that the Sept terms are available. Can you provide MF and residuals for 15k miles and 36 months on the following:
2003 BMW 325i
2004 BMW 325i
2003 Audi A4 3.0L Sedan (not quattro)
2004 Audi A4 3.0L Sedan (not quattro)

Also, when do all these programs expire?
Thanks!

CarMan@Edmunds · September 2003

Hi again meinrad. I have had a chance to look at Honda's new September lease program. Here is the information that you are looking for. If you were to lease a 2003 Honda Element DX 4WD through American Honda Finance Corp. this month for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, its base lease money factor and residual value should be .00210 and 50%. the 2003 Element EX 4WD would have the exact same money factor, but its residual value would be a much more attractive 55% for this term and mileage.

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CarMan@Edmunds · September 2003

Greetings, liannell. You snuck a post in in the middle of one of my posing frenzies, so I better answer your questions now so they don't slip through the cracks. If you were to lease a 2003 BMW 325i through BMW FS for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, its base lease money factor and residual value should currently be .00245 and 54%, respectively. The reason why this program is so unattractive is that BMW has replaced its lease support on this model with $1,500 dealer cash. If you were to lease a 2004 BMW 325i through BMW FS for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, its numbers should be .00220 and 61%, respectively.

As far as the Audis go, if you were to lease a 2003 Audi A4 3.0L Sedan without quattro through Audi Financial Services this month for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, its base lease money factor and residual value should be .00190 and 46%, respectively. Again, the reason why this car's lease program is so much worse than it was last month is that Audi replaced its lease support on it with $2,000 dealer cash. If you were to lease a 2004 Audi A4 3.0L Sedan without quattro through Audi Financial Services this month for 3 years with 15,000 miles per, its numbers should be .00180 and 55%, respectively.

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