Subaru Legacy/Outback

sowr · February 2002

Here's my experience of extended warranties (and warranties in general):

1) 86 New Subaru 4WD Hatchback (with LO and adjustable suspension those were the days!)-- got suckered into extended warranty never used it sold the car to a friend who still has it 300,000 miles a never a problem.

2) 1991 Legacy 4WD Wagon -- did not buy the extended warranty gearbox quit at 65,000 miles (too much mountain driving) got it fixed for $700. Sold the car at 120,000 miles no other problems.

3) 1996 Outback -- No extended warranty, vehicle chronically overheated after about a year, dealer and factory technician uninterested in my problem, told by my highly experienced Subaru mechanic that my "engine was wrecked" by constant overheating, dumped the car in 2001 swearing never to buy another Subaru, long time customer got treated like dirt by SOA.

alwaysjeff · February 2002

Well I would like to thank everyone here for helping me with the purchase of my new 2002 L.L Bean. It was a fun learning and buying experience. The car is beautiful. I should be able to pick it up Tuesday morning. They made me such a good deal I decided to get my son a Outback sport too. I was just reading all the new post on the extended warranties and I'm still undecided what to do. HELP I have till Tuesday morning when I go to pick them up to make up my mind. We didn't discuss prices yet. This will be my 3rd and 4th Subaru. I hope they will be as good as number 1&2

c_hunter · February 2002

Statistically, extended warrantees are overwhelming ripoffs for the consumer and gravy for the manufacturer. I have never been tempted to get one, usually because I have a high degree of confidence in the products I buy. That said, some people luck out with extended warrantees if something does go wrong.

If you finance a car, use the money as a down payment instead of spending it on the warranty. You will have saved a good deal of money in interest over the life of the loan. If nothing ever goes wrong, that's money in the bank. If something does go wrong, that's your contingency repair fund. The odds will be on your side in this case, instead of the manufacturer's!

Craig

p0926 · February 2002

Jeff- Actually, there's no need for you to rush your decision. You can purchase Subaru's extended warranty at any time prior to the expiration of the 3/36 bumper-to-bumper warranty.

-Frank P.

jjay5 · February 2002

Just bought an Outback base model. Would have liked the cargo area light, but didn't want all the other options of the Limited model. Has anyone installed this light aftermarket?

Jimmie

c_hunter · February 2002

Can you clarify what you mean by the cargo area light? I had a base Outback and now have an LL Bean. Both have lights on the ceiling in the hatch area (in addition to the light up near the seating area). I do not see any lights on the Bean that were not on the base wagon except those in the doors.

Craig

jfhsea · February 2002

Hello! (sorry if this issue has been flogged here, but I got exhausted browsing posts!)

My friend just bought a 2002 Legacy L wagon which came with a basic radio/cassette. I had previously removed the stock double-DIN radio/CD changer from my WRX to make way for my beloved Empeg, so I offered to give it to her.

Once I get the dash apart, I think the install should be easy; the harness connector is the same AFAIK. She'll just sacrifice one of the 2 pocksts that are there now.

Getting the bezel off on the WRX was easy, but I chickened out yesterday when trying to remove the Legacy trim/bezel. I removed the shifter trim piece, the change holder cup, and the screw holding the brace behind the ashtray. I saw no other screws, and I assume that the piece is just held with spring clips, but the amount of leverage that I was applying to the bottom of the bezel was making me nervous.

Short of buying a shop manual, does anybody have any advice on this? Have you done it? Is there perhaps a little tool to pull the edges of the bezel to pop the spring clips?

It's a big piece, going all the way over to the steering column, so I figure it would be serious $$$ if I break it!!

One other Legacy question: Her car was not delivered with any sort of front license plate bracket. Does such a thing exist, or do they just tap the front bumper???

Side note: she got what seems like a pretty good deal on the AT wagon, about $18.5K or so. It came with 16" WRX wheels and RE-92s. I assume these were take-offs from a WRX wheel upgrade at this dealer.

Thanks in advance for your insights

Jim Hogan
Seattle

tshin99 · February 2002

Do rear bumper covers come standard on 2002 Outbacks (specifically the LL Bean) or are they an additional accessory?

There is also a plastic wrap/full tank of gas fee of $61. Is this also a standard dealer fee or just some way for them to get money for nothing?

Thanks,
tom

cptplt · February 2002

Sob, just ruined my 98 GT wagons front bumper! Pulled into a parking space and "grounded" the front on what I thought was just some snow/ice -just heard a very transient scrape - but there was actually one of those stupid concrete barriers there and this one had a 1/2 in metal bolt protruding up about an inch. When I backed out, it pulled off the driver side of my bumper, two fasteners got messed up.The scraping sound going back seemed to be a lot longer than the one going into it and I stopped. I had just picked up the kids so I thought maybe the extra weight had lowered the car sufficently to make it scrape more but it was worse than that. Managed to jam the bumper back on but the fit is not great though it would probably pass for a badly manufactured car (like your average GM :-)). Unless you are looking for it or knew it was there its not real obvious. i just hope the fender doesn't start rusting where the fasteners are.

hypov · February 2002

Plastice Wrap, what's that?...
or
Full Tank of Gas for an extra $61.00?! 8-o Bring your own gas! When I bought my '98 OB, it had a full tank - no extra fee.

-Dave

cptplt · February 2002

maybe the dealer gassed up at a British gas station? the plastic wrap was for the shipping back stateside!

eric102 · February 2002

My 02 Outback came with a full tank of gas and no extra fee's for anything. Not sure what the bumper cover is that you are talking about, but the Outback comes standard with a black bumper cover on top of the bumper behind the hatch area.

Eric

c_hunter · February 2002

I did this a month ago, so my memory is a little foggy. If I remember right, you have to take the ashtray part completely out. Then, the bottom of the bezel should pull away from the dash, and then you can pop the rest of the panel out. There are some pretty firm clips and tabs holding it in.

Check this out: http://www.subaru-parts.com/_instructions/2001MY68JH4Security.pdf

It shows instructions for the security system, which involves removal of the center console bezel.

Good luck!

Craig

jfhsea · February 2002

Thanks for that pointer to the security system install PDF (I didn't think to look under that category!)

Anyhow, i was on the right track, but didn't see those 2 ashtray assembly retaining screws (No wonder it didn't want to pop out!). I'll try again, maybe save her a few dollars.

Thanks,

Jim

ochssk · February 2002

Thank you all for your help over the last several months. On Saturday we bit the bullet and drove off with an LL Bean. Beautiful car. My wife is so scared to drive it she keeps wanting to give it to me but being male the insurance is higher! Anyway, great car. Bought it through the Costco program so we dealt with fleet sales instead of the regular pressure sales. Wonderful buying experience! Got a "free" cargo net, rear spoiler, and rear gate bar. Planning to add the acrylic hood guard, differential protector, and window tinting (buying through fleet the addons are at invoice cost).

Now for those newbie questions. Anyone know of seat covers you can add to the seats with side airbags. It gets over 100 deg here in the summer and the leather will be a killer to sit in.

Thanks

Steve

aps5 · February 2002

Does anyone know how to keep the dimming mirror in "always dim" mode, as opposed to automatic. I am tinting the rear 5 windows of our 02 Bean OB, and assume that the tint will render the dimming mirror useless.
And, can anyone recommend a reputable tint shop in Northern NJ?
thanks..

nagohd · February 2002

Has anyone had any sucess or have tips or tricks for installing the Britax Roundabout car seat in the center position rear facing (and eventually front facing). Thanks in advance for any advice you can share.

paisan · February 2002

Not sure where in North Jersey you are, but in Edison on Rte 1 there is a great place called "The Tint Shop" it's on Rte 1 North just before you hit the Ford Plant.

-mike

fibber2 · February 2002

Tom,

The bumper has a basic step pad designed into the cover. The optional dealer add-on is a nice addition that wraps around the rear lip and offers some real protection to the painted surface. I think it ran around $50 (sticker price) and I deemed it well worth the cost. Now the curious issue is that I have never seen this item officially listed anywhere. I bought my car in NY, but a dealer in Conn had never even heard of an additional cover, so it may be something they get from their own supplier. If so, there is no guarantee that the one your dealer gets is the same as I got!!

Steve

mrk610 · February 2002

I know this topic has been talked about b/4 . The other nite on my way home from work my CEL came on . So the 1st thing I did was check the gas cap.Yep it was loose . I usally check to make sure the gas pumper but it on tight but the last time i got fuel I was in a rush .Here in the good old Garden State NJ we are not allowed to pump our own gas . Has this happpened to anybody else .How long did it take for the CEL to go out . IT says in the manual that it could take a couple of driving cycles . Sorry its a my02 base outback wagon 6mnths old with 6100 miles on it . Should I take it to the dealer or see if it goes out by itself . Thank you in advance .

mike k
I leave for Daytona Fla on tues for the 500 nascar race . Not taking the subby though .

paisan · February 2002

It should go off when you hit the 1/4 mark IIRC. That is when it does it's self-test.

-mike

ffsteve · February 2002

I have tinted windows on my LLBean. The auto-dimming mirror simply sees less light (because of the tinting) and therefore dims less. Net result is that there was no difference in the appearance of following headlights after installation of the window tint. I leave the dimming function turned on.

Have the same tint on all my cars (without auto-dimming mirros) - appearance of following headlights is the same in the Bean.

Steve

goosegog · February 2002

Re: #4520 of 4522 Rear Bumper Cover

Dear fibber,

The OB does not have an add-on rear bumper cover listed and I assume this is because it already has blackstuff there. But as you point out (the underpant thing does not seem to have affected your mental powers although there's obviously some unresolved trauma) there is one which is much more durable, does a better job of protecting the bumper's edge, and is intended for the Legacy which is sans blackstuff. I eventually got one last fall while passing through Kamloops BC and it has "Legacy" moulded into it. My big Vancouver dealership and the Kamloops one denied knowledge of the item but fortunately I was carrying around a picture of one complete with part number I downloaded from Subaru's website, and this convinced them to dig out the last remaining one in stock. It was covered in dust and the entire parts and sales team came out to marvel at it.

It is thick, tough plastic but not as wide as the blackstuff, which looked difficult to get off so I didn't try. It doesn't look perfect but no-one except those on this list would ever notice. I'll try to remember to take a pic and post it.

Ironically, about two weeks after I stuck it on I saw a late 90's Legacy with one of these on it, but this one had "Outback" moulded into it!

Love, Goosegog

kmclean · February 2002

Andrew -

Your mirror should have a light sensor in the front of the mirror (the windshield side) so that the dimming function only operates at night. Try covering it (them? I've heard some say their mirrors have a couple of sensors - mine has only one) with your hand during broad daylight and see if the mirror dims (make certain you have a tight seal to exclude all the light). If it does, then I'd say make it "permanent" by putting on electrical tape - and I'd say you're home free.

Let me know if this works.

Ken in Seattle

subaru_team · February 2002

You should be fine. When your fuel guage gets to about 1/2 a tank, it should go off. Have a great trip!

Patti

gazzerdc · February 2002

Apparently I'm one of only two lucky owners in the Washington DC area experiencing this problem. When I turn, left or right, occasionally I get a vibration that comes up through the floorboard and lasts through the turn. The dealership has another customer that had the problem; they think it's the power steering whateveroranother. But nothing to worry about. That's not it. I didn't buy a new car to have an intermittent vibration. Any one have a "fix" on this one? Subaru still has no answer. The car is a 2002 with (now) 4000 miles on it. This started at about 150 miles.

mortpeaberry · February 2002

I don't have a britax, but our baby group friends do, and I've put it in a bunch of times. I think I had to put the belt under the cover, but that was the hardest part. Just put your knee into the seat (to compress the seat foam) as you pull the belt tight - then hold the belt at the seat while you pull the belt all the way out of the retractor and release it to activate the ratchet mechanism. Clip the side clip for good measure and you are good to go. as for the teather you can get the double loop thingy and pass it around the pass seat rail.
Forward facing is a real breeze - though the same steps.
If you have a latch model (or you call and britax sells you the latch straps. You just attach the hooks, put you weight in the seat and cinch down belt. you can get the seat tighter than you ever could with the seat belt. Subaru does not "support" using latch in the center position, so you have to check out the brackets and use your own judgment, But I have been using my latch seat in the center for almost a year and a half now.
Incedently, If you need to carry more than one seat at a time, putting your bitax in the center allows for better fit as it will sit slightly higher than most seats.
Great choice in the seat It reminds me of people who can't 'afford' a $30 bike helmet for their kid's noggin, but will spend $100 for shoes, It is never easy to write a $200 check on a seat unless you balance it with what price is your bundle of joy worth.
ramble ends
steve-v

mrk610 · February 2002

Patti I was wondering if you could look up my case # and see whats going on with it . # 364809 I talked to lana . I haven't heard anything from the dealer . Was wondering if I should wait and see if I hear from them .I don't want to be a PIA ,and keep calling them . Thank you in advance .
Thank you for wishing me fun on my trip .Its going to be my 1st time at Daytona . I usually only go to the 2 Dover Del races and the 2 pocono races . Not taking the subie though were driving down a friends full size quad cab F 350 trailering a 30' self contained camper

mike k

mrk610 · February 2002

subaru_team · February 2002

It looks like Lana is trying to get some technical resources in your direction. You should hear from us within another day or two at the max.

You are not being a pain at all. I'll try to keep an eye on your case.

Thanks!

Patti

oclvframe · February 2002

Andrew,

No need to alter the operations of your mirror if you are going to tint your windows...mine works just fine. The light sensors on the front and back of the mirror simply compare the amount of light coming in on one side to the other..so, as long as there is more light coming in the rear than the front(ie someone's high beams) it should dim to fix that.

BTW why tint just the back 5 windows and make your car look like all those SUVs and minivans that come from the factory that way? If you are going to tint, tint all the way around (except the windshield of course). First thing I did when we got our Odyssey is I tinted the front driver/passanger windows with the max allowable tint that matched the rear...It gives the windows and the van a much more uniform appearance. My Bean's windows are tinted all the way around and it looks outstanding.

-r

fibber2 · February 2002

Brian,

Unresolved issues with my mother? I love her dearly, but members of my English family (especially my grandma) still seem to believe that the sun (still to this day) does not rise or set on the British Empire, and that the Colonies are not fit to rule themselves. All Americans are hooligans, and only proper British moms know how to raise kids. There, I got that off my back....

Now back to the subject of bumpers:
I ran out to the parking lot to check after reading your post. I do not believe that the 'step pad' standard on the current OB is removeable. It looks to me to be masked base black plastic that was not painted titanium. The step pad I got is unadorned (no "OB" or "Legacy"), and covers the flat portion, leaving the base black that climes the sidewalls exposed for about 3" on each side.

Interestingly, my friend's '99 parked nearby has a added pad that does say "Outback".

Steve

paisan · February 2002

OCLV, here in most US states it's illegal to tint the driver and passenger side front windows and the windshield below a certain # of inches. On my Trooper I tinted the driver and front passenger windows 35% and the rear 5 are at 20%

-mike

otis123 · February 2002

Good to know the diming function works OK after tinting. The mirror never worked right for me until I finally stored the middle headrest!

I have a black LLBean I'm thinking of tinting (all 7) at whatever New York State allows. Any pictures of your tinted Bean?

Thanks.

goosegog · February 2002

Told you so.

paisan · February 2002

You cannot tint the front 3 windows on any vehicle in NYS, legally. I am actually going to go with 20% on my 2 front sides when I have to re-do in a few years. I've had 35% on the front 2 sides of the Trooper for almost 2 years w/o any problems.

-mike

ochssk · February 2002

We're planning on tinting our new Bean also. What are people paying to have their outbacks done?

ccampbell4 · February 2002

Over the weekend I was out on an unfamiliar gravel road on the way to a trail and ran off the road on a tighter-than-expected turn. The bottom front end banged down pretty hard before I came to a stop. I found that the under carriage protector (black plastic sheet) had broken into several pieces. Luckily the lower part of the bumper is still intact, but is scratched up a little. Unless you inspect closely you can't tell anything happened. I called the dealer today and was told the part is $101, and it would cost me $79 to get it inspected for other damage. I guess I will need a little touch up paint as well.

My questions:
Is there a way to get these parts cheaper than from the dealer? How do you find part numbers for these kinds of things?

What are the chances that I did some other damage to the car? It still seems to drive okay, but I suppose it could have alignment issues now.

Thanks for the help!

paisan · February 2002

Might as well get a front skid plate from primitive racing probably around $150ish and it will be metal not plastic!

-mike

bat1161 · February 2002

Actually the skid plate to fit a 2000 OB goes for $235 + $25 shipping to NY from Primitive Enterprises. That includes all mounting hardware, and it is the 3/16" thick one.

I scraped mine off when I did the Pine Barrens pre-run back in September. I was looking into the skidplate (and still am) but my last time at the dealer, they said they noticed it was missing and would order it for me. Best part is it is covered under warranty, according to the dealer. I'm not sure if that is the normal warranty, or the the Subaru Gold that I purchased with the car.

One more reason to like that dealer!

Mark

paisan · February 2002

Was that flemington? or SI Subaru? My guess is flemington! Too bad you can't make it to the PB this trip, it's got 20 vehicles already!

-mike

ccampbell4 · February 2002

Is that metal skid plate a direct replacement?

Is there anything else that I should be worried about having damaged in that area?

bkaiser1 · February 2002

Hi Steve, I had my 01 OB wagon tinted last year for $235. That was for all windows (sans the windshield) with LLumar premium (metallic) tint. It carries a lifetime guarantee, too. It's not cheap, but definately spring for the highest quality tinit you can get...teh cheaper "dyed" tints are prone to fading. I have the LLumar film on a car that I had tinted about 8 years ago that is still beautiful -- no fading, no bubbles, etc. Looks the same as the year old OB.
Brian

aps5 · February 2002

Thanks for the tint advice. I think I will go with the Tint Shop in Edison - $219 for the back 5 windows - they use Madico which I think is pretty good, with lifetime guarantee. If anyone knows a Llumar tint shop in North Jersey, let me know. I will try covering the front of the mirror if need be.

Wind noise: As I've mentioned, there was a howl from the rear crossbar over 60 mph. I moved it forward to the specified 6 inches from the seam, and this helped, but over 70 mph it is less but just too annoying. I removed it, and - no howl. Does anyone have the rear crossbar on with no howl?
I do know that gas mileage has got to be better with no crossbars on top...

Andy

dzn · February 2002

I recently purchased a 2001 OB program car.
At about 40 mph (sometimes earlier) the driver's side window produces an annoying wind noise. The service department ordered a new rubber window seal and installed it today. After installing it they admiited that the noise was still there. They said it was not seated properly and would order another seal and try again. In part of their testing they taped the portion of the window seal near the mirror and noted that the noise origin was there. Has anyone encountered this problem and if so were you able to remedy it. I have sneaking suspision that this repair process could last awhile.

hondafriek · February 2002

I don,t why anybody would want to drive around with the cross bars on permanently when they are so easy to remove and replace.

They are always noisy to an extent, and it has been proven that they waste gas.

Cheers Pat.

bat1161 · February 2002

Mike- Yeah it was Flemington. The couple of things that I had to replace, they've covered under the warranty (fog light cover, bottom engine cover).

As for the skid plate, the fellow at Primitive said it replaces that plastic cover, thereby giving better protection. It has 4 bolts, and you can still do oil changes. He seemed pretty helpful on the whole thing. You just have to tell him what year OB, and if its MT or AT.

BTW, aps5 let me know how the tinting comes out. It's something I've been thinking about for a while.

Mark

herbruss · February 2002

I had this happen on my 01 OB. Seems that the seal isn't tight where it transitions from the trim to the glass. You can see with the door open the window trim by the mirror deflecting when you roll window up and down. In my case it sealed tight when you closed door and then leaked when you rolled window down and back up. I stuck a drinking straw in the middle of the "v" in the window seal which helps.

More people had this problem on the VDC board.

Herb

oclvframe · February 2002

I too have had the wind noise...it is only on the driver's side window...it goes away if I simply lower the window an inch and close it again after I have already closed the door. It has become a habit to lower and raise window. Someone suggested putting a drink straw in the fold of the rubber seal to make it push out a little more. I tried that but it didn't work too great for me. If you feel that seal where the mirror sail ends and the glass starts, it has some extra rubber to make it stand out. Obviously Subaru added that to help, but it probably was not enough. I think it is worse on the driver's side because that is the door I open and close the most.

Mike - As for the tint...35% is the max allowed in GA for the front side windows. It illegal to tint the windshield. I like the 35 all the way around. It is too bad that some states don't allow even the 35% on the front...as I stated before, it gives the vehicles an incomplete appearance when only the back is tinted and not the fronts.

-r

paisan · February 2002

Wow In NYS I think you can tint the top 5" of the front window and nothing below that. I agree, it looks incomplete w/o the front sides tinted, but I also understand the reason for not allowing the tint as a few members of my family are in law enforcement. What I usually do is put down the 2 front windows whenever I get pulled over so it isn't an issue.

-mike

Subaru Legacy/Outback

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