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ron
You may also wish to check the "reliability" thread on the vans message board for information about Chevy/GMC full sized vans.
Check out the specifications on the GMC website to see the height, width and length of the van. That way you can see if it fits in your garage. My 3500 Extended van is too tall and too long for my garage.
As far as towing, longer wheelbases are better than shorter wheelbases. I have only towed enclosed utility trailers and haven't noticed they are behind me.
Yes, you can order a passenger version of the 3500.
Good luck shopping.
Causes for the excess noise can be from improper oil used (mechanic made a mistake)...try replacing it, improper break-in from driving at higher speeds (gears need time to break in too if you want it quiet, high speed leads to excess heat and short life on the gears).Try the additive, but things may be worn out.
Orville
Also, I did read something about being able to buy the balance of the factory warranty 7/70. If I'm buying from a small independent dealer, can I still do it?
Isn't the original factory warranty transferable to the next owner at no cost?
I've heard that, in general, extended warranties are available up until the time the original warranty runs out. I'd get one for this vehicle, and I'd get it from the manufacturer (not aftermarket). Supposedly the price is negotiable.
Good luck. I've had 4 Dodge full-size vans as my daily drivers over the years. I'd have another Dodge if I needed another full-size van. I don't know about that 6-cylinder engine, though. I loved the slant-sixes (had 3), of course.
Ralph
Maybe this article will be of interest.
Steve
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Good luck, and hope you get a great deal on one!
Steve
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I took out the back bench and one of the rear captains chairs, then put in a twin size air mattress with sheets, blankets and my own pillow. I slept like a baby at the rest/truck stops and showered in the truckers lounges each morning.
I had a plug-in cooler for refrigeration (I located it between the two front seats and used one of the two power outlets located on the dash). I took a cookstove, but with snow in Ohio and rain in Pittsburgh, I never used it, so I lived on cold cuts and cereal.
I was only gone 4 days, but I would like to see someone try that in a mini-van!!! I had more room than I needed, with the seats taken out.
My van is running just fine!....How about yours?
vguard
eating out on the road is great fun too (and I don't mean MickeyDee's). I mean, you go to Nashville, you gotta hit the BBQ and fried catfish joints :-)
Steve
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Well, unfortunately I got sick this winter with advanced pneumonia, and it pretty near killed me! So the van has been in storage all winter for the most part. Soon as it warms up (nights), I plan on doing a lot more travelling. So far only have about 5300 miles on it, how many miles do you have?
The van has been good so far, except for a regular check up, and the mechanic decided to replace two injectors. Well, when he put it back together I have since heard a slight hum sound from the exhaust at certain speeds. So it will have to go back, likely something was not torqued to specs, or it could be something loose. No major problems yet, but so far it's too new to tell.
Yup, all this is not really possible (at least in comfort) with a mini van. I also felt real safe (from deer when your sitting so high) when in the Adirondacks, NY and White Mountains of New Hamsphire. Heck, already have the cooler and stove with me, some venison would be nice....LOL.
Glad to hear your having good luck with your van!
I can recommend crashing in larger hospital parking lots too - you get woken up early with the morning shift change, got clean restrooms and a cafeteria just steps away, and if you get sick, well, there you are.
Steve
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Another good place is crashing (sleeping) in front of the police station, or if your real lucky yu might end up for the night in a cell with breakfast in the morning.....just kidding!
Or try the motel parking lot. I wonder about these guys parked there with their motor homes. If your smart yu keep the lights off in the RV.
Seems like I was wrong steve, anything is possible. Looks like (based on your profile) you have done a lot of serious driving and camping in your vehicle too prove me wrong. I just like the extra space of my extended passenger savana with seats removed, I like a full size mattress and room for luggage, camp gear and still have lots of space.
Steve
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But boy, were they roomy.
Steve
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Steve
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I find myself sitting around now, thinking of ways to improve the van camping experience !
Trouble is, with a wife and three kids, the van, extended or not, has it's limitations. I think it works great for one, or even two people. I'm now finding myself staring at those "Pop-Up" campers I see people pulling, thinking I may need to get one myself !
Another idea I have been thinking about is getting one of the older "Airstream" trailers (25-30ft) and renovating it. I could use it as a "guesthouse" when it was not on the road, and if properly restored, it would continue to go up in value.
My full size van would have no problem pulling the Airstream, since I can pull up to 6000 lbs (unlike the 3500lb limitation of a minivan).
xfiles, glad to hear your healthy again !!!!
vguard
Hey, I was thinking about your problem of needing room for a family of 5 when camping in your van. Well, I got some ideas good for a laugh (that's it).
1. Add a high roof, then add bunk beds....LOL
2. Buy a second van or better yet to save on gas
tow a second van (it's safer then pop-ups in
bear country). If your going to tow, whats the
difference what yu tow...LOL. At least you
get hard side walls, but your going to look
weird. Expect more tickets. But hey, your then
a true blue van camper!
More seriously, a van is best for 2 or at most 3. The pop up is a good idea, the adults can sleep in the van while the kids sleep in the pop-up so you have your "privacy". Both RV units can have their own TV's, and towing a pop up would be the most economical on gas, and the easiest to store, and would save on wear on tear on the engine/tranny on your new van. You also wouldn't have any problems driving down narrow roads with low branches along wilderness lakes, and it would be easy to turn around too. Best part of it is pop-ups are cheaper new or used. Another nice thing is I bet it being light you could move it up right alongside your van and perhaps create a walk through from the van to the pop up using the side double doors (guess sliding doors can be
handy).
The pop up behind the van can also be handy while on route to a camping place. You could park I bet anywhere overnight wihout a complaint so long as you sleep in the van, and the pop up is not set up...... try that while towing a trailer or 5th wheel.Then when you arrive at your destination you could set up and have all the comforts.
Another important advantage is during peak seasons (eg-fall leaf season) all the motels and campgrounds are often FULL! At least you have the van to sleep in. You might have problems with 5th wheels and trailers and be driving all night for a place that allows them or has available space. Bigger is not always better in the wilderness.
I think I just convinced myself, when the need arrives for more space or additional comforts, I plan on doing the same....LOL. Thanx for the
idea(s)!
I am a long time town hall member generally because I like to keep up with what others are saying about different vehicles. This time, I've found something I hope someone can help with.
I am located in the Nashville area and have found a dealership in the area (very large volume dealership, by the way!) that have FIVE different 2001 Chevy Express LT trim vans (all the same color and equipment except one...it's got leather) for sale. It doesn't seem like they can get rid of them. I'm looking to see if I can get a deal on one. They sticker for approximately $35,700, but since 2003 versions are coming out, I was hoping to get in on one for about 24K or 25K.
For the record, these vans are "loaded", meaning they have front/rear air, power doors, locks, and mirrors, as well, as the combo CD & Cassette system with 12 BOSE speakers. Again, these vans have NICE equipment.
The question is, what should I pay for this now 2-year-old, but brand new van? Is 24K too low? Any ideas?
Terrence
I originally was looking to buy a used extended savana passenger van loaded, but they wanted so much for them that I went out and bought a new 2001. They don't depreciate like cars do, they are considered functional vehicles, age doesn't seem to have the same weight. The dealer likely bought up the last 5 in the country and knows someone will buy them. To them they are NEW 2001, not a used 2001, look at what the used ones go for and then decide (considering full warranty, zero mileage, etc). I doubt you will be getting a deal. They know that the commercial market wants a vehicle now rather then wait 3 months to order one, to them (rental market) it's lost profit to wait. So they are willing to pay the big bucks, even a bit of savings is still worth it to them, but not to you. If they are regular length, you might have a better chance in my opinion, but not by much.
Good luck!
My van has a poptop, rear bench/bed, and two seats in the front. That's probably the way I'd spec a new Ford/Dodge/Chevy if buying new. I just don't like cooking and all that inside the van.
Van campers are great if you are doing short camping trips (weekend ventures) or a lot of driving and don't want the long set up time or disadvantage of driving a land yacht. It's also helpful if you enjoy more minimalistic camping (if that can be said of someone who sleeps inside rather than in a tent or under the stars.
Bill Sid
Lotsa new features on the new chevy/gmc. I hope this provides the impetus for similar upgrades to Ford and DC. The increased nose length allows for upgrade safety. Driver side doors. AWD. If they just put a few dollars into a modern seating arrangement (removable or hideaway seats.) I think people will return to these factory passenger vans.
I like boxes on wheels a lot, but the proposed new Microbus "box" seems like a better size to more people. Gotta love the prices for the full size vans though.
Steve
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I drive a 2001 GMC 3500 extended wheelbase van on a daily basis and I always get comments on why I would drive it every day / gas mileage / size / etc.
The ride is actually a lot better than people suspect. The front two rows are very comfortable;I've been in a lot of SUV's that are more rough than my van. The rear seats are bouncy, but the ride softens with 5-6 people and luggage.
The mileage is a drawback: 11 mpg.
The size is similar to a Suburban's, but the interior capacity is huge in comparison, and the price is cheap compared to a 1-ton Suburban.
For 2003 GMC can rename the van the Yukon XXL and market it as the biggest SUV on the road; maybe that will jump start sales!
Steve
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A suburban looks small to me when they pull up along side of me at a red light. I wish they would make a XXL Savana, after a conversion it would have a limousine look.
Me & the wife are thinking of the above mentioned full size van. Is there some suggestions on these vehicles or should I be steared away & look at conversion done by outside vendors & not GM. We like the Safari but w/ the AWD system I get worse gas mileage than my friends w/ full size vans & I have alot less room than they. Any insight or suggestions is greatly appreciated.
1) 8.1L V8
2) Mixed driving, 50% around town,50% highway
3) I have a heavy right foot
4) I had a fiberglass "bubble top" added (more headroom & room for TV/VCR)that adds weight and probably doesn't help the aerodynamics.
Recent road trip to Vegas with 4 adults, 3 kids & luggage was 13.5 mpg, mostly highway miles.
Also, I am not sure what transmission they use, but if you read a number of the messages here, you will see some comments of reliability issues with the lower-end transmissions. You will also see prior comments I have made about my choice of a GMC 3500 15 passenger van after owning a GMC conversion van. We have really enjoyed it, and the ability to remove different rows of seats has proven very helpful.
For example, for the above mentioned Vegas trip, I removed the row right behind the driver; that gave the next row back incredible leg room. Most of our luggage fit behind the last row, with a few bags set down right behind the drivers seat.
That still left three rows behind me: the last row for my two oldest sons (6 and 4), a row for the baby (1), and a row for the in-laws. With the TV and VCR, we never hear a peep from the boys. And we even have a porta-potti in the back (behind the last row) for "emergencies".
We're considering a used 2000-2002 Ford E-350 or a GMC G2500 --- without a conversion. Not sure about extended or not. According to spec, the E-350 has 7" clearance and the G2500 has 8". I think the low point is the rear axle. Our Subaru outback has 7.3", so I think we're okay there.
I'm a little worried about the RWD and the wheelbase. The E-350 has 138" wheelbase, and the G2500 has 138" and 155" with the extended version. I plan on getting a slip-differential installed if the van doesn't already have it.
I don't want to pay an extra $8K on a Quigley 4x4 upgrade if we don't need it.
We will have lots of photographic equipment, 2 bikes, camping gear, laptops... we *try* to travel light.
We don't want a package conversion, but plan to do a little work ourselves, like a separate 12-volt power system.
QUESTIONS:
1) Has anyone on this forum had off-road experience with these FSVs?
2) Any opinions on whether the RWD w/ slip-differential will be enough?
3) Do folks think I'll need the 4x4 Quigley package?
4) Should we get the regular or extended version? Again, only 2 people + gear. We plan to sleep in van.
5) Is a longer wheelbase a help or a hinder when it comes to off-road hills and gullies.
We went with a short minivan after shopping full size vans and extended minivans since we knew the rig would turn into a commuter car when we settled back down. Otherwise, the extra room would be nice.
Steve, Host
First, to solve the electrical issue, get yourself 2 Trojan T105 golf cart batteries and hook them in series (they are 6 volt batteries, but in series are 12 VOlt). This will give you lots of juice for a small 300 watt Statpower power inverter (does 12V to 120 Volt conversion). You want a small 300 watt, because one 13" TV and a VCR only draw 70 Watts, any bigger unit is my feeling a bigger drain on the battery just to run the inverter(they use a fan). Of course if you want, get a 1500w inverter if you carry a micro wave, but keep the smaller one to save on battery power for everythinig else (there really cheap $50, the 1500W inverter on the other hand is about 7x more expensive).
Next, I would go with limited slip, the shoulders of the roads in all the national parks around Utah are soft sand. Hate to see you stuck because of one wheel on ashpalt, the other (the power wheel) in sand. Most parks have roads paved in asphalt, and even cars have gone throught the offroad sections iin Monument Valley. Of course there are places I would like to go but wouldn't risk. THen again they are within 10 miles, and you mentioned you have bikes. Remember also, the farther you go in, the farther a tow truck has to go to get you out (using a bike is safer). No van is designed to go where only a 4 wheeler can, but it will get you close enough.
Road clearance has never been a problem with an extended van, were only talking 20 inches longer. Turning around may make some difference, but not in open desert areas...remember they are only about 3 feet longer then a full size car, its how the space is used in a van that makes them look bigger.
The big advantage with the extended (passenger van) is that if you leave the second row of bench seats (removing first row bench seat) and remove all others, you end up with a living and bedroom area. The rear becomes your bedroom and accepts a full size sponge (single size) mattress. The area left just behind the front buckets is now huge (4.3 feet)...giving you space during rainy times, room for TV's etc, and great access from the side barn doors. This space also can accept a "second" full size mattress (only 5 inches cut off the end of a sponge mattress, and re-stitch the cloth) when layed sideways next to the barn doors. I toss that mattress on top of the other mattress in the back till needed at night. You can use a double mattress in the rear area (especially if your shorter), and not worry about the front mattress. If your hunting, your buddy might not like a double mattress to share though....LOL.
You will find that even the extended van has barely enough space. Camera bags, heavy duty tripod, 2 batteries, TV, porta potti, luggage, battery operated cooler between the front seats, etc all consume your space fast. You will be glad you had the extra 20 inches of length for extended trips. IF the hills and gullies on the roads are that bad, you shouldn't even take a regular length van on such roads, get a trailer with a ATV and tow it with you. Now your talking serious access to anything and anywhere in style.
Buying a ATV with trailer is cheaper then a quigley 4x4 conversion that will just increase maintenance costs on the van and kill your gas mileage. Gas mileage is everything if you travel a lot, the savings alone will pay for the ATV over a few years.
I also plan on adding one one of those tool boxes you see in the bed of pick up trucks. Some are perfectly rectangular (no cut in corners to fit over the top of the truck bed). This can be mounted at the rear of your van, provided you have a trailer hitch option. This gives you room for a small coleman portable generator to recharge your batteries, room for boots, extra clothing, water jugs, satellite dish,coleman stoves, fishing tackle, etc). I've seen one van with two of these stacked (each about 6'x2'x2').
It sounds like a motorhome or 5th wheel is too big and won't cut it for what you plan on doing. Then again don't go too small, the extra 20 inches in length for an extended will make a big difference on those long trips. The ride is also better, real smooth on a 2500 GMC. The GMC also has incredible leg room, and comfort is important for long distance driving.
One other thing, national parks do not allow cell towers. These parks are huge, your going to need a bag 3 watt cell phone in case you are in trouble (injury, mechanical trouble, or plain stuck in the mud). I have been in the dead center of Death Valley (except lowest point) and still had a signal of 1-2 out of 6. They have 5 times greater range.
Never had problems getting great pictures whether in Arches, Monument, Death, Bryce, Yellowstone, etc. Only hard part is controlling that dang dark cloth over my head when it;s windy when using a 4x5 camera. All worth it though. Watch out for the Buffalo, with the extended van you will match him pound for pound in a dual if he is in the middle of the road. I think 255 ponies beats one buffalo, I think.
It depends on what you are doing of course. With all the weight you will have with the camping gear you'll probably be ok. But if you do want a little more performance, try a true locked differential like a detriot or lockright. Here a link to a van guy who did just that: http://mark.legendz.com/4x3/ Note these are somewhat loud on the interstate.
To me, the Quigley conversion would be difficult to justify unless you live in an area with lotsa snow. The van body (length, width, departure angles) would still be a limiting factor probably more so than the rear wheel drive. Here's a good link to people into 4wd and camping. http://www.glinx.com/~sbest/ They have a list that often discusses both issues.
Here's quigley for those who don't know anything about them. http://www.quigley4x4.com/AboutQM/Whoarewe/WhoAreWe.htm. Used by ambulances and delivery folks. $8000 + for a conversion.
Remember that GM is now making AWD available on new fullsize vans but 1500 only.
No. But I do quibble a little with your choice of terms. You plan on poor-roading not off-roading. FSV's and Subarus will do the first, not the last.
>2) Any opinions on whether the RWD w/ slip-differential will be enough?
See post above. If I were adding a locker, it would not be a limited slip.
>3) Do folks think I'll need the 4x4 Quigley package?
For poor-roading no. For offroading- you need a Jeep + $10-15K in customization and a tent.
>4) Should we get the regular or extended version? Again, only 2 people + gear. We plan to sleep in van.
Look at them. Lay down inside. Imagine where that expensive gear is going.
Price would a big factor for me. A new extended van is several thousand dollars more expensive, but a used van may be similar.
Overall, as you are buying used, condition of the vehicle would be more important to me than whether or not it has that extra 1.5 feet of body.
5) Is a longer wheelbase a help or a hinder when it comes to off-road hills and gullies.
A longer wheelbase will generally hurt you on poor roads and help you on highways.
As far as extended models go, most areas that you need to access in national parks already have asphalt roads to handle tourist volume. They are designed to go to the best scenic areas. Unless your talking flat desert areas, deep areas of parks are better accessed by donkey, horse, bike, canoe, hiking, or pre-arrangements made with outfitters who supply you with donkeys, (eg- grand canyon has tours for the bottom areas). In cases like this, a Quigley will just get you stuck and maybe dead if your by yourself deep inland 50 miles or more (you need to then go in with 2 vehicles for safety), whereas a horse/donkey will get you out without worries about gas stations, breaking down or rough terrain (another benefit is they sense there is a rattler around before I do).
I covered a lot of U.S. parks, made prints as large as 40x60inches, never needed a 4x4. A good nights sleep is what yu need, organized storage, safety from bears, snakes, the cold(coleman catalytic black Cat heater...no flame, therefore no monoxide). A van does all that in a compact package. A van can also park anywhere, in a motorhome or 5th wheel you will be asked by the police to move on to a trailer park. They are just as full as motels during the peak seasons.