FWIW, it was a manual with a Dealer Retail TMV of 14,921 and listed as an "internet special" at $14,770. As I left the dealership, my salesman said he didn't know how the GM pulled it off since his wholesaler got off the Sequoia at $12,500.
After all the times I didn't do well, it's nice to get a good deal now. Knowledge is a good thing; thanks for imparting some.
This is a great thread! I’m in the process of buying a new truck, and I would like to trade the old one in for convenience and tax reasons. Here’s the deal:
2002 Chevy 2500HD 4x4, Duramax/Allison, extended cab, short bed, LS package (cloth). Victory red, tan interior. Power everything, single CD. No 5th wheel or gooseneck ever. Tires are 50%. 75k miles, truck is very clean and I have detailed maint records. Area is Huntsville, AL.
My research on Edmunds, KBB, NADA, and Blackbook trade-in value average out to $18,643. KBB was the lowball at $16.8k, the other two were closer to $20k. This is for clean/avg condition.
Average retail between those sources, as well as comparable dealer trucks on Autotrader w/in 500 miles, is $22,335. I subtracted 10% from the dealer ads to bring them in line with the others.
Diesels still seem to be selling pretty well compared to the gassers. This is a late LB7 motor, probably the most popular Duramax model based on various diesel forums. Still has the 200k mile GM factory injector warranty, which is a great deal and something that could be listed on the window sticker.
I know that they will stick it on the lot at $24k and probably sell at $21.5k pretty quickly, easy $3 grand profit. I wish I was in a position to go the private party route
I think that the truck is worth at least $18k on trade, and I’d rather see $18.5k. What do you think?
I think that it's easily worth $18k... the thing is, it's got 75k miles, which is VERY low for one of those... go read the ads, they all have over 100k on em.
I'd say to shoot for $19k... you just don't see these with miles that low. Also, you're in Alabama.. trucks like that are a real hot down there. If you were here even in Jersey a clean, low-mile Diesel pickup is hot merchandise.
Throw it in the local paper for $23,900/bo, stress original owner, never used commercially, all records, etc.. try it for a week or two. But $18-19k is the # I think.
2) Besides everything you listed, Also has E36 M3 5-speed transmission and E36 M-3 steering rack.
3) The engine swapped in has 110K on it. Not sure how much that changes the value of an engine.
4) Most '96 M3s in good shape bring $10K-$14K (as far as I can tell), depending on condition.. but, I think the competition is other E30 325is models.
5) I thought the car looked pretty solid for 20 years and 180K miles (at least in the pictures).
I was thinking that a stock 325is in that shape, with a freshened stock drivetrain would bring $7K-$9K, so the conversion is basically free. I realize it would cost a lot more to duplicate the car, than to buy it.. But, I'd never base a value on the cost of modification.
I was wondering if dealing with this one would be any more trouble than a stock unit, assuming you knew from which model all the parts came from?
Also, who is going out to San Diego to check it out for me? :surprise:
Thanks for the reassurance. I feel like the books and actual sales are lined up pretty well, but it is sometimes hard for a consumer to get the no-BS data.
I agree that the private party route would be ideal, but just not practical right now. I'm on temporary duty in school living out of a hotel room in Huntsville.
I've been looking at trucks on/off for a month or so, and it came down to a new Tundra as the best fit right now. Toyota is running some unusually good rebates right now, and I wanted to take advantage so I ordered one through the local dealer. Should be here in around the 25th, after the "port" options are installed. Already settled on a written price on that.
The Chevy is prepped and cleaned and I'm going to get it appraised at the dealer on Tuesday. Hopefully will be a fairly painless process, I just hope they don't turn it into a marathon by lowballing significantly.
Is it worth bringing in a single-page analysis of my market research along with the supporting info from edmunds, etc? Seems like if I can back-up my numbers it could make the process easier. Any thoughts on that from the dealer side of the house? Any consumers who have tried that?
I've got an '05 Ram SRT-10 I'm looking to sell. It is the regular cab (2 door) model, and it has just a bit over 8k miles on it. I'm in Houston, Texas. It is the "base model" SRT-10 with no options other than the mountain of options that came standard on the SRT-10. Condition is VERY good...no french fry invasions, door dings, scratches, never been modified or raced. Still has 2 years left on factory warranty. Options are: Black inside and out Manual trans (all reg cab SRT-10 had a manual trans) Power everything (windows, seat, locks, pedals, steering, brakes, mirrors) ABS dual zone climate control leather 4 kajillion watt Infinity system w CD changer 22" rims w/ plenty of tread on tires
Worth every single penny. A clean Plastic-Bumper 325is 5-speed is a $4k+ car. With a stock drivetrain..... You would spend $8,250 doing the swap.
2) Besides everything you listed, Also has E36 M3 5-speed transmission and E36 M-3 steering rack.
I figured that in on my numbers.. also the E36 M3 rack isn't the one you really want, you really want a Z3 1.9 rack.
3) The engine swapped in has 110K on it. Not sure how much that changes the value of an engine.
Engine's worth $2,500-3k if it's an S50 (95 M3.. 3.0), $2800-3300 if it's an S52 (96-99 M3 and 98-00 M Coupe and roadster, 3.2L) for just the long block.
4) Most '96 M3s in good shape bring $10K-$14K (as far as I can tell), depending on condition.. but, I think the competition is other E30 325is models.
That's about right but people rarely cross-shop swapped E30s vs E36 M3s.. very different feeling cars... an E30 with an S50 or an S52 is a real screamer.
5) I thought the car looked pretty solid for 20 years and 180K miles (at least in the pictures).
It is a solid car. I've never seen it but it's a California car since new, it was only in Minnesota for a short period of time and not used in the winters there.
I was thinking that a stock 325is in that shape, with a freshened stock drivetrain would bring $7K-$9K, so the conversion is basically free. I realize it would cost a lot more to duplicate the car, than to buy it.. But, I'd never base a value on the cost of modification.
$7-9k in AMAZING condition and with well under 100k miles. Really, an E30 325is worth that kind of coin is going to be a 5-speed plastic bumper car with VERY low miles that's faultless.. more of a condition rarity car.
I was wondering if dealing with this one would be any more trouble than a stock unit, assuming you knew from which model all the parts came from?
If anything, it's going to be more troublefree to a degree. M20s require timing belts every 60k max or 4 years, 50/52 engines use timing chains. M20s also need valve adjustments every 15k, 50/52s use hydraulic lifters. Now, on early S50s there is an issue with valve retainer failure but it's rare. Also, you want to make sure that the oil pump nut is either tack welded or at LEAST lock-Tited. Also, www.uucmotorwerks.com for some Tranny Mount enforcers with the cups. Other than that, excellent engines and VERY durable. Vanos units can fail, but that's primarially down to extended oil change intervals. Overall, these are bulletproof engines, my 95 525iT has 196k on the original long block and the previous owner did not maintain it well, it still runs beautifully.
Also, who is going out to San Diego to check it out for me?
If you're serious, I know people who can do a pre-buy for you.
Also, does the car have working AC? If not, it's easy enough to rectify, zionsville sells the adapted AC hoses for about $250.
This does not include Labor. Most competent shops charge $2,500-4,000 to do the swap. I charge $3,000.
Here's the parts list that we send to customers...
You will need...
S52 Long Block, about $3,000 OBD1 Vanos engine wiring harness, about $200 506 or 413 DME (Engine computer) About $250 OBD1 Intake manifold, about $150 E34 M50 Oil Pan, about $100 Oil pan Gasket, about $20 Valve Cover gasket, about $30 Conforti Software for 24# injectors and 3.5HFM, about $300 3.5HFM, about $150 used 24# injectors, about $200 Water pipe adapter, about $50 Wiring harness adaptor for engine temp sensors, about $50 E28 535i Motor Mounts, about $60 Intake manifold seals, about $50 Vacuum lines, about $15 Cold Air Intake, about $150 3.5 HFM Intake adapter, about $50 Spark Plugs, about $40 Coil pack plug boots, about $50 Synthetic oil and filter, about $50 Engine coolant, about $20 New Radiator Hose set, about $250 New Water Pump, Thermostat, aluminum thermostat housing, about $100 SPAL Electric Fan, about $250 New Radiator about $150
Engine alone is about $5,700 or so.
ZF 310/320 Transmission. About $600 E30 M3 Driveshaft, about $250 UUC Lightweight Flywheel and Clutch, Stage 1 about $850 UUC Evo 3 Short Shift Kit and DSSR, about $475 UUC Tranny Mount Enforcers with cups about $70 Synthetic Trans fluid, about $20 New Guibo about $65 New Center bearing about $60 New Driveshaft hardware about $10 New Clutch Slave from E36 325i/is about $70 New Clutch release arm about $25 New clutch release arm spring about $7 New Pilot Bearing about $10 UUC Braided stainless clutch line about $30
I have a pristine 2004 Lexus LS430 that I've owned since new. 45000 miles, new tires, new brakes, flawless condition. KBB shows values from about $29,000 (fair) to $33500 (excellent) as trade-in.
The stealer offered me $27000, showing me "auction reports" with similar vehicles going thru at about that price. After I got home, I realized that the report may be legit, but don't auction cars represent the crappy vehicles? Wouldn't the dealers KEEP for resale the better ones?
So is KBB wrong or is the dealer showing me a skewed sample of just crappy cars?
Any thoughts on this one? Carmax offered $6500, which is KBB 'fair' condition. Seems fair enough to me? Baja's are hot up here because we have a snow area nearby (San Bernardino, California).
2003 Subaru Baja AWD (not turbo or sport) Yellow 114,000 Miles (!) Standard options (power, sunroof, leather - standard on this model). MANUAL transmission
Good stuff: Inside is in excellent condition - leather was covered with covers since purchase so it's pristine. No kids, pets or smoking. Shifts well, original clutch Has had almost all recommended service (see below). front driveshaft/cv boot recently replaced so that's done at least. Brake pads replaced recently. No fluid leaks noticed.
Problems (don't laugh!): Timing belt not changed at 100K miles ($600?) A/C not in working condition. Minor fender bender ($1K damage) a few years back (shown on carfax), no known frame damage but rear bumper replaced and painted. Scratch/scrape on rear bumper about 3" long. No dent. Paint otherwise in good condition except for a SMALL door ding and a few rock chips in hood. Tires have a decent amount of tread remaining (maybe 10K of wear) but they do NOT match and were replaced at different times. Rotors noted as 'thin' at last pad replacement (have been machined once. Recommended replacement by mechanic. No pulsation.. yet.
Car sometimes stalls/runs rough briefly at high altitude with CEL PO519, subaru boards say this is some sort of engine intake that needs cleaning, not a major problem. No one has been able to fix this yet.
4) Where ya located? I'm an evil dealer myself so don't post your home address But a Metro area helps.
5) What condition? Any paintwork? Damage? How many dead bodies in the trunk?
Auction reports are legit.. and they are the best determination of the market. There's lots of crappy cars there and lots of nice ones too.
Take a look at what's driving by you on the street, that's a good approximation of what's available at auction.
I have seen 3 month old creampuffs with 2,000 miles there, some of the worst rebuild junkers you can imagine, pristine Jaguar E-Types, that 15 year old Cadillac from Retirement City, FL with 20k actual miles, that nice 40k mile 4 year old Lexus, etc...
Otherwise I have to assume it's Purple with a yellow interior in Iowa and it's been in 3 accidents. Then you won't like me.
Come on.. gimme info and I can help ya.
PS, if a dealer is giving you actual auction block prices on trade that's generally ALL the money.
Rule #1, no dealer uses KBB.com to appraise cars, not if they have a brain anyways. You know, I need to yell at the hosts to change the little red type FAQ on here...
Anyways... let's see here... Check engine light on, that means it will fail smog. Period. That's no help. It's Yellow but it's a Baja, I think they're all Yellow. Maybe they make Taxis out fo em down on Bajaa California.. I dunno. It's also got average mileage for a 4 year old... airplane.
You didn't change the timing belt.. shame on you. If it breaks I can refer you to some places with cheapish used engines, won't cost but $2-3,000 to fix it. I ought to send you to your room for that... russian roulette is no game to play with your wallet silly!
Anyways, you're selling it.
$6,000-6,500 is about right. If it didn't have the issues you'd be $7,500 or so, but you have accident history.. and, wait, that shows on a Carfax in the people's republic of California? That's new.. they didn't used to sell data to CF.. maybe Arnie needs the cash. Oh well... irrespective, if it's had paintwork a dealer will catch it unless they are stupid, which some are.
That Check engine light can be an issue out in Cali.. OBD2 car with a check engine light means your smog certificate will be made out of invisible paper, you don't want that.
Hows about you fix the Check engine light, clean it up and put it on Craigslist for $9,500/best offer? Take in the $8500 range and use the $1,000 or so that you'll net (After losing trade-in tax credit) and go to Hawaii for the week, Courtesy of your old car?
Forgot to mention, we have a Scanguage, so we turn the CEL off when it comes on. And it ONLY comes on when we go up to about 6K feet (we live at 5800)..
It's hubby's car, blame him for the timing belt (and the rotors, which he says are 'just fine, they just want money')..
Thanks for the advice! No trade in credit (I don't think you get that in California, but we already have the new car anyways). I'm also a little leery about selling this privately. For sure we'd have to fix the A/C, which would be about $800 to start - no one in this 100F heat would buy a car with no A/C I am guessing. Plus who knows what else is about to go wrong in a car with this mileage? :P
It's a 2004 LS430 with Modern Luxury that includes Mark Levinson and NAV, 44600 miles. White with tan interior. Never had/doesn't require any paintwork whatsoever. Not a scratch on it...handwashed and garage kept since new, Dec 2003. 5000 mile new Michelins. The original mats are still in the plastic bag, never used. All service records.
Yeah, my number is even loser now! Might wanna shop it a bit but Carmax stepped up.
Scanners aren't the point, the car has to set its' readiness monitors. Basically, it has to not throw off the light for a week ro two.. a certain # of cold start cycles before it will show that it's "ready" to be scanned.
This prevents people from buying $79 OBD2 scanners and resetting the light while waiting in line for inspection...
So it's not just a light reset.. reset the light, take it in for a smog 5 mins later, it's going to fail.
I'd still like to know where in the country the car is.. but let's see here.
Color is a plus... These cars are sensitive to color and pearl white/tan is about as good as it gets on an LS. Had you bought a green or burgandy one it would cost you $2k right now.
KBB is on Heroin. I figure the car for in and around the 26k mark. That's real money. I'd bid the car at $25,500.
If you can get $27k, take it and run. But then I'm basing this on where I'm located, North Jersey.. if the car's in Miami/Tampa/Orlando/Phoenix/San Diego/Los Angeles you can add a few bucks.
I just looked up Nationwide auction results for the car... it's not going to pull $30k unless two dealers are fighting for it and it's an ultra lux. Even then it's a 1 in 100 shot with 45k on it. An Ultra Lux with, say, 30k on it would do $29-30k at the right auction, MAYBE a few bucks more... but the cars that consistently pull in the low 30s are ULs with very low miles.
KBB is way way way off the mark here... Strongest #s for a car like that are in Florida or the southwest/SoCal.
Where are you located?
I also checked Edmunds.. they're high as well. Based on the auction values you mentioned, I figure you're in the Northeast or Midwest.
Location: Seattle Year/Make/Model: 2001 Dodge Grand Caravan ES Minivan; 3.8-liter automatic AWD Mileage: 94,000 Color: [White/tan] Major Options: alloys, leather, rear-seat DVD, power liftgate and sliders. Everything except heated seats. Condition: Exterior -- average. No dings or to-the-metal scratches but could use a detail. Seats and carpets clean, no rips, just some wear spots. we don't smoke. Tires - 50% Brakes - new Maintenance -- recent 90K service, tranny flush, etc. Other: Indicate prior damage/insurance claims, repaints, etc. A/C needs a charge.
Like I said, this is why a lot of us in the biz dislike kbb.com, it's helping nobody when it's this inaccurate. Customer gets upset bc they think the dealer's trying to steal the trade, the dealer gets upset because they might lose a sale.
And then if you go and shop the car all around and get hit at $26-27k, you think that we're all out to get ya.
Actually, I paid $58K and the car will be FOUR years old in December.
And yes, it will only cost another $12K (plus maintenance, which will be a little bit more than for a new car) to drive another 3 years, 45K more miles.
Well look at it this way...the auction prices you were shown represent what the *highest* risk-taker in the auto re-sale biz is willing to pay for the car. Not all the auction bids will turn into successful sales for the bidders...some aren't good at this.
I doubt it. I figured the car for high 4s maybe $5k if it's just super clean with cold AC... Ya might try getting it charged, but it's rarely just a recharge. Either the compressor died, or it has a leak... you could spend $500-1,000+ to fix it and not get much more for it.
Now, if it was May and you were selling privately, then yeah.. fix it.. it's nigh-on impossible to sell a car with hot AC in the summer.
Have you been talking to the seller, or just looking at the ad? Do you know who did the engine & trans. swap, etc? Have you found a good indie bmw shop in San Diego to check it out?
It's not exactly huge $$, based on what im_brentwood is saying. And how much is a plane ticket say on Southwest anyway?
Gee, I bet it'd be fun to drive it to the bmwcca local chapter annual picnic in your area (& probably every place else you drove it). Your excuses are your own.....
Just looking at the ad.. The link above has the pictures, but that isn't the ad. The pictures are from the last guy who owned it, and the ad is on another forum.
The other answers are: No and No...
Don't get me started on airline prices... lol..
I was just curious.... I'm not sure I could see buying a car from that far away.. Plus, I'd have to transport it.. No way that I'm driving a 20 yr old car across country, and burning 4 vacation days along with it..
Color - Black Saphire Metallic/ Black Leather Wood Trim
Major Options - Sports Package, Premium Package, Cold Weather Package, DVD NAV, 19" Alloy, 6 Disc Changer, Park Distance Control, Logic 7 Audio, Xenon Lights, Sports seats/ steering wheel, All weather mats, pretty much every option but the adjustable suspension and heated rear seats. Extended Maintenance til 6yr/100K
Condition - Shiny Paint with a couple of small dings on left rear door. Interior in excellent condition.
Tires - about 1 yr old.
Brakes - pads and rotors replaced according to service
Maintenance - Every scheduled service was performed.
Other: Never damaged, never repainted, wind shield was replaced once. According to last inspection at 55K, front CV boot needs replacing.
Looking to trade in my 2005 Infiniti G35X. It has the premium package which includes heated, leather seats, Bose six disc, moonroof, etc. The car is in excellent condition with only 10,460 miles on it. I'm going to trade it in and lease an '08 Cadillac CTS. Anyway, Cadillac wants to give me $21,000 for it. How does this sound? I live in MA and its Platinum Graphite in color. 3.5 liter, 5 speed auto. Interior and exterior and near mint. I have all maintenance records. Thanks for any help. Also, I qualify for the GM employee program so they will not be making up any lost ground on that end.
Hmm, I'll point to the achilles' heel of each, and you decide what matters more to you.
The ES300 had the 3.0l V6 that was known for having sludge problems. Some said the oil passages were too narrow, Toyota said owners neglected oil change intervals. You make the call.
The I35 is more reliable, but they had a rather unsophisticated torsion beam rear suspension, originally from the Nissan Quest minivan (last thing you want to hear is "minivan derived" when you're shopping for a luxury/sport sedan). Drive over uneven roads and you may feel some axle hop, but it's really not *that* bad.
Between the two, I think I'd take the I35, only because the Lexus didn't handle any better.
Unless the car's got Navi that's a realistic # I'd peg the car at 21 to no more than 21,500.. miles are low but graphite is a weak color on G35s.. why I have no idea because it's gorgeous.
Rule #1: The best deal is the car that you actually like better. Drive them BOTH and go from there.
$16,500 seems high for the ES but it's an asking price. Fair is in the mid 14s-low 15s. I love the options list that they posted.. Air Con is optional on a Lexus?
I35 is quite overpriced IMO.. should be buyable in the $13,500-14k range, retail.
You're in Texas, half the guys who sell cars cheap on eBay are in Texas.. I'd look there.
Thanks for the reply im-brentwood. I'm surprised that the graphite is weak because it seems to be very popular in this area of the country. It does not have navi so I guess I'm doing okay. Now the only wrench in the works is I have to order my CTS and they are telling me it's approx. a two month wait time. I told the trade guy that I would need that 21K figure to hold into November and he said he would try his best to honor it then as well. At least I'm under no obligation to buy the CTS if the appraisal on my G35 goes down. I'm assuming the appraiser would have given me 21.5K on the spot but he's figuring in $500 depreciation between now and November. I tell ya, this car business is very interesting...
"I'd have expected a reality trade difference of at least $5,000! That fit is a $15k wholesale piece or more.. so figure $16,500-17k retail, the Sequoia is worth what it's worth... wow. "
not that i want to question your knowledge or anything, but this fit would sticker for 15,700 new, so you are saying that this car actually appreciates in value?
Ok, just got back from having the dealer take a look at my 2500HD Chevy. I went in with my ducks in a row and fairly confident in the numbers - my bottom dollar was $18k, and goal was $18.5k. Seemed reasonable based on my research, and further confirmed on here. I even shopped it with the local Chevy dealer at their tent sale this weekend, and their used car manager was ready to make a deal; they can't keep diesels on the lot.
I started the process today by telling the Toyota dealer I wanted $19.5k, and then let the used car guy check it out. He came back 45min later with an offer of $16k and acting like he would be doing me a favor at that price. After all "the diesel truck market is slow right now..." I told him he had 24 hrs to get another $2k on the table or I would take my business down the road. Then I left. :mad:
This deal has been too easy up until this point. Two test drives and 15 min of negotiations on a fair price on the new truck, and wait for it to show up from the port in 2 weeks.
Now it's getting painful. I'm sticking to my guns though - it's not exactly a prime sellers market on full-size V8 gasser trucks. Lots of good deals out there to be had, but I hope they can make this deal right tomorrow.
Any ideas on how to squeeze them any more? :confuse:
Hi, im_brentwood, could I ask a follow-up on my Passat Wagon...is it worth getting the dent in the rear bumper fixed? It's in the gray plastic, not body-color part. I got a verbal from a body shop I trust; $200-300 to repair it, which I'm afraid may not look perfect, and $800-900 to replace the bumper. I also thought about having them machine the rough edges off the wheels from my rush parallel parking jobs. What's a dealer's perception about these minor things--is that considered part of a "recondition"? Or will it really hurt my trade-in value? Thanks again!
I was rear-ended in my Forester, which had an unpainted bumper like that, and a new bumper skin was just $150 from an on-line Subaru parts wholesaler. Pay them an hour or two of labor to mount it, and it's cheaper than the repair is.
Comments
And I left off a bunch of stuff as well... it's easy to spend $10,000 on the conversion, or more.
'11 GMC Sierra 1500; '98 Alfa 156 2.0TS; '08 Maser QP; '67 Coronet R/T; '13 Fiat 500c; '20 S90 T6; '22 MB Sprinter 2500 4x4 diesel; '97 Suzuki R Wagon; '96 Opel Astra; '11 Mini Cooper S
After all the times I didn't do well, it's nice to get a good deal now. Knowledge is a good thing; thanks for imparting some.
I owe you the beer!
2002 Chevy 2500HD 4x4, Duramax/Allison, extended cab, short bed, LS package (cloth). Victory red, tan interior. Power everything, single CD. No 5th wheel or gooseneck ever. Tires are 50%. 75k miles, truck is very clean and I have detailed maint records. Area is Huntsville, AL.
My research on Edmunds, KBB, NADA, and Blackbook trade-in value average out to $18,643. KBB was the lowball at $16.8k, the other two were closer to $20k. This is for clean/avg condition.
Average retail between those sources, as well as comparable dealer trucks on Autotrader w/in 500 miles, is $22,335. I subtracted 10% from the dealer ads to bring them in line with the others.
Diesels still seem to be selling pretty well compared to the gassers. This is a late LB7 motor, probably the most popular Duramax model based on various diesel forums. Still has the 200k mile GM factory injector warranty, which is a great deal and something that could be listed on the window sticker.
I know that they will stick it on the lot at $24k and probably sell at $21.5k pretty quickly, easy $3 grand profit. I wish I was in a position to go the private party route
I think that the truck is worth at least $18k on trade, and I’d rather see $18.5k. What do you think?
Thanks,
duckhunter6
A, say, Boston Green over Dove is going to be cheap.. Estoril Blue over Black is going to be money.
All that being said, it must have been quite the jump to go from a Sequoia to a Fit!
I think that it's easily worth $18k... the thing is, it's got 75k miles, which is VERY low for one of those... go read the ads, they all have over 100k on em.
I'd say to shoot for $19k... you just don't see these with miles that low. Also, you're in Alabama.. trucks like that are a real hot down there. If you were here even in Jersey a clean, low-mile Diesel pickup is hot merchandise.
Throw it in the local paper for $23,900/bo, stress original owner, never used commercially, all records, etc.. try it for a week or two. But $18-19k is the # I think.
2) Besides everything you listed, Also has E36 M3 5-speed transmission and E36 M-3 steering rack.
3) The engine swapped in has 110K on it. Not sure how much that changes the value of an engine.
4) Most '96 M3s in good shape bring $10K-$14K (as far as I can tell), depending on condition.. but, I think the competition is other E30 325is models.
5) I thought the car looked pretty solid for 20 years and 180K miles (at least in the pictures).
I was thinking that a stock 325is in that shape, with a freshened stock drivetrain would bring $7K-$9K, so the conversion is basically free. I realize it would cost a lot more to duplicate the car, than to buy it.. But, I'd never base a value on the cost of modification.
I was wondering if dealing with this one would be any more trouble than a stock unit, assuming you knew from which model all the parts came from?
Also, who is going out to San Diego to check it out for me? :surprise:
Thanks!
kyfdx
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Thanks for the reassurance. I feel like the books and actual sales are lined up pretty well, but it is sometimes hard for a consumer to get the no-BS data.
I agree that the private party route would be ideal, but just not practical right now. I'm on temporary duty in school living out of a hotel room in Huntsville.
I've been looking at trucks on/off for a month or so, and it came down to a new Tundra as the best fit right now. Toyota is running some unusually good rebates right now, and I wanted to take advantage so I ordered one through the local dealer. Should be here in around the 25th, after the "port" options are installed. Already settled on a written price on that.
The Chevy is prepped and cleaned and I'm going to get it appraised at the dealer on Tuesday. Hopefully will be a fairly painless process, I just hope they don't turn it into a marathon by lowballing significantly.
Is it worth bringing in a single-page analysis of my market research along with the supporting info from edmunds, etc? Seems like if I can back-up my numbers it could make the process easier. Any thoughts on that from the dealer side of the house? Any consumers who have tried that?
Thanks again for the help.
duckhunter
Options are:
Black inside and out
Manual trans (all reg cab SRT-10 had a manual trans)
Power everything (windows, seat, locks, pedals, steering, brakes, mirrors)
ABS
dual zone climate control
leather
4 kajillion watt Infinity system w CD changer
22" rims w/ plenty of tread on tires
What's it worth private party and wholesale?
Worth every single penny. A clean Plastic-Bumper 325is 5-speed is a $4k+ car. With a stock drivetrain..... You would spend $8,250 doing the swap.
2) Besides everything you listed, Also has E36 M3 5-speed transmission and E36 M-3 steering rack.
I figured that in on my numbers.. also the E36 M3 rack isn't the one you really want, you really want a Z3 1.9 rack.
3) The engine swapped in has 110K on it. Not sure how much that changes the value of an engine.
Engine's worth $2,500-3k if it's an S50 (95 M3.. 3.0), $2800-3300 if it's an S52 (96-99 M3 and 98-00 M Coupe and roadster, 3.2L) for just the long block.
4) Most '96 M3s in good shape bring $10K-$14K (as far as I can tell), depending on condition.. but, I think the competition is other E30 325is models.
That's about right but people rarely cross-shop swapped E30s vs E36 M3s.. very different feeling cars... an E30 with an S50 or an S52 is a real screamer.
5) I thought the car looked pretty solid for 20 years and 180K miles (at least in the pictures).
It is a solid car. I've never seen it but it's a California car since new, it was only in Minnesota for a short period of time and not used in the winters there.
I was thinking that a stock 325is in that shape, with a freshened stock drivetrain would bring $7K-$9K, so the conversion is basically free. I realize it would cost a lot more to duplicate the car, than to buy it.. But, I'd never base a value on the cost of modification.
$7-9k in AMAZING condition and with well under 100k miles. Really, an E30 325is worth that kind of coin is going to be a 5-speed plastic bumper car with VERY low miles that's faultless.. more of a condition rarity car.
I was wondering if dealing with this one would be any more trouble than a stock unit, assuming you knew from which model all the parts came from?
If anything, it's going to be more troublefree to a degree. M20s require timing belts every 60k max or 4 years, 50/52 engines use timing chains. M20s also need valve adjustments every 15k, 50/52s use hydraulic lifters. Now, on early S50s there is an issue with valve retainer failure but it's rare. Also, you want to make sure that the oil pump nut is either tack welded or at LEAST lock-Tited. Also, www.uucmotorwerks.com for some Tranny Mount enforcers with the cups. Other than that, excellent engines and VERY durable. Vanos units can fail, but that's primarially down to extended oil change intervals. Overall, these are bulletproof engines, my 95 525iT has 196k on the original long block and the previous owner did not maintain it well, it still runs beautifully.
Also, who is going out to San Diego to check it out for me?
If you're serious, I know people who can do a pre-buy for you.
Also, does the car have working AC? If not, it's easy enough to rectify, zionsville sells the adapted AC hoses for about $250.
Bill
Here's the parts list that we send to customers...
You will need...
S52 Long Block, about $3,000
OBD1 Vanos engine wiring harness, about $200
506 or 413 DME (Engine computer) About $250
OBD1 Intake manifold, about $150
E34 M50 Oil Pan, about $100
Oil pan Gasket, about $20
Valve Cover gasket, about $30
Conforti Software for 24# injectors and 3.5HFM, about $300
3.5HFM, about $150 used
24# injectors, about $200
Water pipe adapter, about $50
Wiring harness adaptor for engine temp sensors, about $50
E28 535i Motor Mounts, about $60
Intake manifold seals, about $50
Vacuum lines, about $15
Cold Air Intake, about $150
3.5 HFM Intake adapter, about $50
Spark Plugs, about $40
Coil pack plug boots, about $50
Synthetic oil and filter, about $50
Engine coolant, about $20
New Radiator Hose set, about $250
New Water Pump, Thermostat, aluminum thermostat housing, about $100
SPAL Electric Fan, about $250
New Radiator about $150
Engine alone is about $5,700 or so.
ZF 310/320 Transmission. About $600
E30 M3 Driveshaft, about $250
UUC Lightweight Flywheel and Clutch, Stage 1 about $850
UUC Evo 3 Short Shift Kit and DSSR, about $475
UUC Tranny Mount Enforcers with cups about $70
Synthetic Trans fluid, about $20
New Guibo about $65
New Center bearing about $60
New Driveshaft hardware about $10
New Clutch Slave from E36 325i/is about $70
New Clutch release arm about $25
New clutch release arm spring about $7
New Pilot Bearing about $10
UUC Braided stainless clutch line about $30
$2,500 in the drivetrain.
Plus some other misc stuff....
Yeah, $8k in parts to really do it right.
The stealer offered me $27000, showing me "auction reports" with similar vehicles going thru at about that price. After I got home, I realized that the report may be legit, but don't auction cars represent the crappy vehicles? Wouldn't the dealers KEEP for resale the better ones?
So is KBB wrong or is the dealer showing me a skewed sample of just crappy cars?
2003 Subaru Baja AWD (not turbo or sport)
Yellow
114,000 Miles (!)
Standard options (power, sunroof, leather - standard on this model).
MANUAL transmission
Good stuff:
Inside is in excellent condition - leather was covered with covers since purchase so it's pristine. No kids, pets or smoking.
Shifts well, original clutch
Has had almost all recommended service (see below).
front driveshaft/cv boot recently replaced so that's done at least.
Brake pads replaced recently.
No fluid leaks noticed.
Problems (don't laugh!):
Timing belt not changed at 100K miles ($600?)
A/C not in working condition.
Minor fender bender ($1K damage) a few years back (shown on carfax), no known frame damage but rear bumper replaced and painted.
Scratch/scrape on rear bumper about 3" long. No dent.
Paint otherwise in good condition except for a SMALL door ding and a few rock chips in hood.
Tires have a decent amount of tread remaining (maybe 10K of wear) but they do NOT match and were replaced at different times.
Rotors noted as 'thin' at last pad replacement (have been machined once. Recommended replacement by mechanic. No pulsation.. yet.
Car sometimes stalls/runs rough briefly at high altitude with CEL PO519, subaru boards say this is some sort of engine intake that needs cleaning, not a major problem. No one has been able to fix this yet.
$6500 sound fair?
1) KBB is usually off the mark.
2) What color combo?
3) What equipment has it got?
4) Where ya located? I'm an evil dealer myself so don't post your home address
5) What condition? Any paintwork? Damage? How many dead bodies in the trunk?
Auction reports are legit.. and they are the best determination of the market. There's lots of crappy cars there and lots of nice ones too.
Take a look at what's driving by you on the street, that's a good approximation of what's available at auction.
I have seen 3 month old creampuffs with 2,000 miles there, some of the worst rebuild junkers you can imagine, pristine Jaguar E-Types, that 15 year old Cadillac from Retirement City, FL with 20k actual miles, that nice 40k mile 4 year old Lexus, etc...
Otherwise I have to assume it's Purple with a yellow interior in Iowa and it's been in 3 accidents. Then you won't like me.
Come on.. gimme info and I can help ya.
PS, if a dealer is giving you actual auction block prices on trade that's generally ALL the money.
Bill
Rule #1, no dealer uses KBB.com to appraise cars, not if they have a brain anyways. You know, I need to yell at the hosts to change the little red type FAQ on here...
Anyways... let's see here... Check engine light on, that means it will fail smog. Period. That's no help. It's Yellow but it's a Baja, I think they're all Yellow. Maybe they make Taxis out fo em down on Bajaa California.. I dunno. It's also got average mileage for a 4 year old... airplane.
You didn't change the timing belt.. shame on you. If it breaks I can refer you to some places with cheapish used engines, won't cost but $2-3,000 to fix it. I ought to send you to your room for that... russian roulette is no game to play with your wallet silly!
Anyways, you're selling it.
$6,000-6,500 is about right. If it didn't have the issues you'd be $7,500 or so, but you have accident history.. and, wait, that shows on a Carfax in the people's republic of California? That's new.. they didn't used to sell data to CF.. maybe Arnie needs the cash. Oh well... irrespective, if it's had paintwork a dealer will catch it unless they are stupid, which some are.
That Check engine light can be an issue out in Cali.. OBD2 car with a check engine light means your smog certificate will be made out of invisible paper, you don't want that.
Hows about you fix the Check engine light, clean it up and put it on Craigslist for $9,500/best offer? Take in the $8500 range and use the $1,000 or so that you'll net (After losing trade-in tax credit) and go to Hawaii for the week, Courtesy of your old car?
It's a thought...
It's hubby's car, blame him for the timing belt (and the rotors, which he says are 'just fine, they just want money')..
Thanks for the advice! No trade in credit (I don't think you get that in California, but we already have the new car anyways). I'm also a little leery about selling this privately. For sure we'd have to fix the A/C, which would be about $800 to start - no one in this 100F heat would buy a car with no A/C I am guessing. Plus who knows what else is about to go wrong in a car with this mileage? :P
What's it REALLY worth?
Yeah, my number is even loser now! Might wanna shop it a bit but Carmax stepped up.
Scanners aren't the point, the car has to set its' readiness monitors. Basically, it has to not throw off the light for a week ro two.. a certain # of cold start cycles before it will show that it's "ready" to be scanned.
This prevents people from buying $79 OBD2 scanners and resetting the light while waiting in line for inspection...
So it's not just a light reset.. reset the light, take it in for a smog 5 mins later, it's going to fail.
I'd still like to know where in the country the car is.. but let's see here.
Color is a plus... These cars are sensitive to color and pearl white/tan is about as good as it gets on an LS. Had you bought a green or burgandy one it would cost you $2k right now.
KBB is on Heroin. I figure the car for in and around the 26k mark. That's real money. I'd bid the car at $25,500.
If you can get $27k, take it and run. But then I'm basing this on where I'm located, North Jersey.. if the car's in Miami/Tampa/Orlando/Phoenix/San Diego/Los Angeles you can add a few bucks.
I just looked up Nationwide auction results for the car... it's not going to pull $30k unless two dealers are fighting for it and it's an ultra lux. Even then it's a 1 in 100 shot with 45k on it. An Ultra Lux with, say, 30k on it would do $29-30k at the right auction, MAYBE a few bucks more... but the cars that consistently pull in the low 30s are ULs with very low miles.
KBB is way way way off the mark here... Strongest #s for a car like that are in Florida or the southwest/SoCal.
Where are you located?
I also checked Edmunds.. they're high as well. Based on the auction values you mentioned, I figure you're in the Northeast or Midwest.
The $27,000 was the honest number. I dunno. For that kinda money it's probably the best deal ever for a BUYER (or a keeper, if I become one!)
Year/Make/Model: 2001 Dodge Grand Caravan ES
Minivan; 3.8-liter automatic
AWD
Mileage: 94,000
Color: [White/tan]
Major Options: alloys, leather, rear-seat DVD, power liftgate and sliders. Everything except heated seats.
Condition:
Exterior -- average. No dings or to-the-metal scratches but could use a detail. Seats and carpets clean, no rips, just some wear spots. we don't smoke.
Tires - 50%
Brakes - new
Maintenance -- recent 90K service, tranny flush, etc.
Other: Indicate prior damage/insurance claims, repaints, etc. A/C needs a charge.
Thanks much!/tim
When has it ever been that the ONLY repair to an A/C system is that it needs a charge?
It is a Dodge/Chrysler with probably a bad evaporator coil, only a $1500 repair!!!!!
Van is wholesale fodder to any dealer.
If you want any real money, you need to fix the A/C, get a super detail, and sell it yourself.
$27k is wholesale.. you could probably get $31 maybe $32k if you retail it. OTOH, you probably paid $60k for the car. In 3 years it's dropped 50%.
Keeping it another 3 years will not cost you another $33k.......in fact, an 01 with, say, 90k on it right now is worth about $15k as a trade......
Food for thought indeed. If all you lose over the next 3 years is $12k, that's not bad to keep driving a nice car.
Hmm.. miles and hot air, this is not a help..
Probably in and around the $3500-4k range. Might be an easy private sale for $5900 or so in 2 months time.
Bill
Like I said, this is why a lot of us in the biz dislike kbb.com, it's helping nobody when it's this inaccurate. Customer gets upset bc they think the dealer's trying to steal the trade, the dealer gets upset because they might lose a sale.
And then if you go and shop the car all around and get hit at $26-27k, you think that we're all out to get ya.
It's frustrating... :sick:
And yes, it will only cost another $12K (plus maintenance, which will be a little bit more than for a new car) to drive another 3 years, 45K more miles.
A/C season has come and gone here ...
Now, if it was May and you were selling privately, then yeah.. fix it.. it's nigh-on impossible to sell a car with hot AC in the summer.
Both are in Dallas, Texas:
#1: Brand: Lexus Model: ES 300 Year: 2001 Style: Sedan Drive: FWD Mileage: 51,000 Exterior Color: Cashmere Beige Metallic Interior Color: Ivory Interior Surface: Leather Engine: 3.0L V6 SFI DOHC Transmission: Automatic
Options: Air Conditioning, Dual Zone Climate Control, Cruise Control, Power Steering, windows, locks, Leather Steering Wheel, Leather Shifter, Dual Power Seats, Memory Seat, Wood Trim, Clock, Tachometer, Digital Info Center, Homelink System, Tilt Steering Wheel, Sunroof, Airbags, Keyless Entry, ABS Brakes, Traction Control, Rear Defogger, Fog Lights, Intermittent Wipers, AM/FM-Cassette-CD Changer, 16 inch Alloy Wheels, Leather Interior.
Dealer Asking Price: $16,500
#2: Brand: Infiniti Model: I-35 Year: 2003 Style: Sedan Drive: FWD Mileage: 51,300 Exterior Color: Black Interior Color: Light Grey Interior Surface: Leather Engine: 3.5L V6 PFI DOHC 24V Transmission: 4-Speed Automatic.
Options: Air Conditioning, Climate Control, Cruise Control, Tinted Windows, Power Steering, Windows, Locks, Mirrors, Dual Power Seats, Memory seat, wood trim, clock, Tachometer, Tilt Steering Wheel, Steering Wheel Radio Controls, Sunroof/Moonroof, Keyless Entry, ABS Brakes, Traction Control, Rear Defogger, Fog Lights, Intermittent Wipers, AM/FM-Cassette-CD Changer, Bose Premium Sound System, 17 inch Alloy Wheels, Leather Interior, Xenons.
Dealer Asking Price: $17,000
Thanks,
Jim
It's not exactly huge $$, based on what im_brentwood is saying. And how much is a plane ticket say on Southwest anyway?
Gee, I bet it'd be fun to drive it to the bmwcca local chapter annual picnic in your area (& probably every place else you drove it). Your excuses are your own.....
The other answers are: No and No...
Don't get me started on airline prices... lol..
I was just curious.... I'm not sure I could see buying a car from that far away.. Plus, I'd have to transport it.. No way that I'm driving a 20 yr old car across country, and burning 4 vacation days along with it..
It is interesting, though, isn't it?
Thanks for everyone's input..
regards,
kyfdx
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Year/Make/Model: 2003 BMW X5 4.4i
Body Style: 4 door SUV
Engine: 4.4L V8 Auto
Driveline: AWD
Mileage: 55K
Color - Black Saphire Metallic/ Black Leather Wood Trim
Major Options - Sports Package, Premium Package, Cold Weather Package, DVD NAV, 19" Alloy, 6 Disc Changer, Park Distance Control, Logic 7 Audio, Xenon Lights, Sports seats/ steering wheel, All weather mats, pretty much every option but the adjustable suspension and heated rear seats. Extended Maintenance til 6yr/100K
Condition - Shiny Paint with a couple of small dings on left rear door. Interior in excellent condition.
Tires - about 1 yr old.
Brakes - pads and rotors replaced according to service
Maintenance - Every scheduled service was performed.
Other: Never damaged, never repainted, wind shield was replaced once. According to last inspection at 55K, front CV boot needs replacing.
Thanks in advance for your time!
Looking to trade in my 2005 Infiniti G35X. It has the premium package which includes heated, leather seats, Bose six disc, moonroof, etc. The car is in excellent condition with only 10,460 miles on it. I'm going to trade it in and lease an '08 Cadillac CTS. Anyway, Cadillac wants to give me $21,000 for it. How does this sound? I live in MA and its Platinum Graphite in color. 3.5 liter, 5 speed auto. Interior and exterior and near mint. I have all maintenance records. Thanks for any help. Also, I qualify for the GM employee program so they will not be making up any lost ground on that end.
Len
The ES300 had the 3.0l V6 that was known for having sludge problems. Some said the oil passages were too narrow, Toyota said owners neglected oil change intervals. You make the call.
The I35 is more reliable, but they had a rather unsophisticated torsion beam rear suspension, originally from the Nissan Quest minivan (last thing you want to hear is "minivan derived" when you're shopping for a luxury/sport sedan). Drive over uneven roads and you may feel some axle hop, but it's really not *that* bad.
Between the two, I think I'd take the I35, only because the Lexus didn't handle any better.
Unless the car's got Navi that's a realistic # I'd peg the car at 21 to no more than 21,500.. miles are low but graphite is a weak color on G35s.. why I have no idea because it's gorgeous.
Rule #1: The best deal is the car that you actually like better. Drive them BOTH and go from there.
$16,500 seems high for the ES but it's an asking price. Fair is in the mid 14s-low 15s. I love the options list that they posted.. Air Con is optional on a Lexus?
I35 is quite overpriced IMO.. should be buyable in the $13,500-14k range, retail.
You're in Texas, half the guys who sell cars cheap on eBay are in Texas.. I'd look there.
not that i want to question your knowledge or anything, but this fit would sticker for 15,700 new, so you are saying that this car actually appreciates in value?
I started the process today by telling the Toyota dealer I wanted $19.5k, and then let the used car guy check it out. He came back 45min later with an offer of $16k and acting like he would be doing me a favor at that price. After all "the diesel truck market is slow right now..." I told him he had 24 hrs to get another $2k on the table or I would take my business down the road. Then I left. :mad:
This deal has been too easy up until this point. Two test drives and 15 min of negotiations on a fair price on the new truck, and wait for it to show up from the port in 2 weeks.
Now it's getting painful. I'm sticking to my guns though - it's not exactly a prime sellers market on full-size V8 gasser trucks. Lots of good deals out there to be had, but I hope they can make this deal right tomorrow.
Any ideas on how to squeeze them any more? :confuse:
Thanks,
duckhunter
Thanks again!
I'm looking to trade my 2006 Saturn Vue AWD
New Hampshire
19500 miles
AWD
Red
Onstar
Sunroof.
I'd really like to have a number ready when I go to trade in. Thanks for your help!.
Ian
I was rear-ended in my Forester, which had an unpainted bumper like that, and a new bumper skin was just $150 from an on-line Subaru parts wholesaler. Pay them an hour or two of labor to mount it, and it's cheaper than the repair is.
Are VW parts *that* expensive? :confuse: