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Perhaps a higher intesity halogen blue light "kit" would be a less costly and risky choice -- true not as good a light, but still better than factory. Do you plan to keep this car until the wheels turn square? It seems so expensive a route to go, even for a super nice A8, as it is, after all a 1997.
markcincinnat (on vacation as #3)
#1 New Yokohoma AVS db 255 x 40 x 17 tires
#2 All-wheel alignment
#3 New front brake rotors
All work done at the dealer.
Drove the car 30 miles the first day -- first impression: These tires are incredible. I notice no difference in ride quality, high speed (85mph+) stability or ability to perform well (I took it on my favorite twisty road and there was no squirm, squeal or other issue (and the ESP light did not come on). I hit the twisty road after 25 miles only on the tires -- I assume they improve after 150 miles or so.
These tires are virtually silent! The factory Pirelli P6000's (same size) roared like snow tires. Speaking of snow, these tires are classified as All-Season Ultra High Performance (Z rated). I will assume some improvement during the Cincinnati winters (which are generally fairly mild, snow/ice/slush-wise). Can't really comment this time of year. And, I will also assume that some loss of performance must be there (compared to Summer only tires). As I do not "race" this car, I assume that I will notice virtually no difference between these tires and my "faves" -- the Dunlop SP9000's (which came on my 2000 A6 4.2 non-sport package).
Now, on to the brakes -- much better, but still just passable.
Audi has been criticized -- in Autoweek Magazine, or example -- for having great brakes (short and controlled stopping distance) that warp easily.
I'll say.
Saturday morning (about 30+ miles on new brakes), I left Cincinnati for Pittsburgh via the interstates (I-71, I-70). Medium traffic, "ambient speeds" of 60 - 80 mph. Heading toward Columbus, Ohio, set cruise at 75mph -- didn't need to touch the brakes much. Perhaps 55 miles into the trip, someone passes on the right, zips in front of me and finds that the reason I was not going any faster was that the traffic ahead was congested and of course slams on his brakes causing me to "poke" my brakes for about 2 or 3 seconds -- not a panic stop in any way.
The brakes purred -- a very light shudder.
I thought "already?"
Theses new rotors are better, but still not good.
I now have 300 miles on the cars new rotors and I am not too pleased.
It's amazing how many people don't know about this great car. The A6 looks and drives great, but everyone I know has problems with it...don't regret my decision a bit!
I have seen a relatively few "horror stories" pertaining to Audis on the three or four message boards I either monitor or contribute to.
Everything mechanical breaks -- and although I have read the endless posts regarding reliability of Hondas and Toyotas, I find them unrewarding to drive (please no arguments, I know this is 100% personal and I do understand that there are people who cannot find any European car "worth it.")
The Audis, BMWs, Mercedes, Saabs, Volvos and VWs whatever their reputed "horror story" quotient may be are far far more engaging to drive (than Hondas and Toyotas no matter how upmarket they push them) -- and as the Saab is in this "European" class of cars, I accept hockeyguy1's decision to purchase a Saab (at least compared to the Honda or Toyota). However, with no disparaging of the current crop of Saabs intended, I do think that both Saabs and Audis are overall in the top quartile of reliability and in the top tenth of "engaging and fun" to drive category.
The Saab would have more appeal -- to me -- if they would start down the path of All Wheel Drive instead of sticking with Front Wheel Drive (in the same sense that BMW now has dipped its tires into this area and to a greater extent so have Volvo and VW.) The "Audi Advantage" is more than a warranty program, today -- at least until the other European cars get some all-wheel-drive experience under their tires -- it is Audi Advantage = quattro.
Has anyone else experienced this? Or, do I just need to get adjusted to driving a car a little lower/quicker than my prior car, a Mercedes S310.
that the rear/side view mirrors don't cover the
same area as other cars I've driven (Taurus &
Lincoln LS) - day or night.... I've always looked
over my shoulder rather than completely depend on
the mirrors. I find it especially necessary with
the A6.
The concerns of all citizens regarding police violence and so-called profiling should be addressed. But the real problem regarding this incident seems to be the tradgedy that those who actually live in the affected area of the city are not -- for the most part -- the ones who participated in the trashing of their businesses and residences.
Anyway, this is an Audi Message board -- we still have a thriving city with lots of places to drive.
I have to adjust them downwards just to avoid the problem. Glare is reduced from the rearview, simply by keeping the rear window sun screen deployed. Has anybody ever heard of of getting
the auto dimming mirrors installed, post-factory?
My local dealer did not seem to think it possible, but I would suspect that the wiring is probably in place. Any thoughts appreciated.
Regarding DueDilliegence' point, I doubt you need to change out the side mirrors, if you want just to disable the dimming feature. Probably all that is needed to do is open the mirror housing, and diconnect the leads that are attached to the back of each mirror. However it might be done, it should be a relatively easy task.
Can someone tell me what a good monthly lease payment for a 2.7T fairly well equiped (in the $45,000 retail range.) I'm pen for 36, 39 or 48 month lease and can put zero or up to $3,000.00 down.
Thanks in advance for any help!
Jim in Michigan
1) Don't put anything down on a lease if you can - this is a false economy if you have any other debts. The lease interest rate is probably about 7-8%, so if you put that $3000 towards more costly credit cards, you will save a LOT on interest during the time of the lease (if you don't charge up the cards again!)
2) Don't pay Acquisition or Disposition fees - These are just bank and dealer ways to gouge a few hundred more dollars out of you. If they won't drop them willingly, walk. They will find "approval" to drop them quick enough.
3) Settle on a price for the car before you tell them if you are leasing or buying to be sure you get a fair quote. After you have arrived at the price, tell them they have a deal IF they will "Throw In" a few little add-ons - Gold package, mats, mudguards, nose mask, etc. All these little things are very high markup items for the dealer, and don't cost them much.
4) Don't let them put your DMV fees, etc. into the CAP COST of the car - otherwise you pay interest on these yearly charges for the life of the lease.
5) Be sure to check the actual "Money Factor" for the lease. This is the interest rate you are paying. Multiply the MF x 1200 to get the equivalent interest rate. I have seen dealers give a great price quote, and then charge a huge interest to make up the profit on financing. If the interest rate is higher than 7-8% and you have good credit, ask them why. My last dealer actually let me look at his computer to see that I was getting the lowest MF possible.
Good Luck!
The following comments are not -- unless noted -- a comparison to the factory Pirelli P6000's they are a comparison to the Yokohama tires with no miles on them and 1000 miles.
Handling has improved -- I have a "test corner" on a generally deserted road in suburban Cincinati -- it says "15 MPH" -- Ever since I had my A8 modified with an S8 suspension, I have used 45 MPH as my "test speed." With about 30 miles on the AVS tires, I could detect some understeer as I "plowed" through the turn. Now with 1,000 miles on the tires no understeer, no plowing and I can "power out of the corner" in second gear with no squirm no scuff and no problem.
Noise has actually decreased a bit -- very very quiet tires. The Pirelli's were very noisy and were no better in my "test corner."
Air pressure -- has held "perfectly."
It has rained a lot here in SW Ohio but I really had no complaints in this regard with the Pirellis -- the Yokohama AVS db in spite of their classification of All Season Ultra High Performance don't seem better or worse on a wet interstate highway. But boy is my car quiet now.
The tread life rating of the Pirellis was 180 and the Yokohamas rating is 320 -- I assume the Yokohama's will last longer, as this has been my previous experience. Generally I multiply the rating by 100 and that has usually turned out to be the life of the tread before the tread wear indicators are seen and heard (i.e., 180 would translate to 18,000 miles tire life). If this is true with the Yokohama's. . . hmmm, I am 7 lease payments into a 30 month lease, with 8,000 on the odometer (approaching 9,000 after this weekend). . .well the AVS's might "go the distance."
Remember, I had a four wheel alignment (Audi Advantage) at the same time the tires were mounted and balanced at the Audi Dealer. I am expecting the maximum available out of these tires in performance, handling, milage and noise -- will keep y'all posted.
On a related topic:
It seems to me that with Computerized Production Software (that Audi MUST use) they could allow customers and/or dealers to order a car and specify the tires (from their vendors) and wheels, not just the wheels.
Here in southern Ohio, an Ultra High Performance Tire (such as the Yoko AVS dbs) that is also All Season should be an option as should a Summer only tire for those who will have an extra set of wheels/tires for the winter.
Audi usually puts All Season tires on their cars IF the customer does not order the sport package. This seems presumptious as most of the people I know do not change their tires and wheels for Southern Ohio Winters -- and most people here in Southern Ohio who order quattros might argue that a Summer Ultra or Maximum Performance tire would be just fine. Yet some people, like my wife, would rather have the highest performance all season tire available -- funny, she has Dunlop SP9000s on her 2001 225HP TT coupe and I have the Yokohama's. This time we're backwards. I'm sure I'll hear about this winter.
The New Brakes are still a bit of a let down, they purr a little above 65 MPH -- and this is for routine application of the brake pedal. My wife's TT brakes are phenomenal, so I know that Audi can put good stoppers on their cars -- dealer tells me this is a common problem with 2.7T's, S4's and 4.2's (both A6 and A8) -- says the S8 brakes, however are awesome -- where do I sign up for them?
Be sure to negotiate the price of the car before you work the lease option details. From this forum and from my experience I think it is safe to say that you should expect to pay $1500-$2000 over invoice. You can get invoice details from the Edmunds site. And don't lease for a longer period than the life of the warranty.
By the way, the A6 is in a different category than the I30. And I can't think of any car that is in the same class as the A6 2.7T when quality, performance, price and service are mixed into the equation. All it takes is a test drive!
Good luck!
And being the owner of both an A4 and an I30, there is no way the I30 is in the same league as the A6. But it shouldn't be - it costs $12-15k less.
Jim in Michigan
jpscatena@t-one.net home
jpscatena@floracraft.com office
Jim in Michigan
Just leased an A6 2.7T. Audi is running a deal (I first saw the ad in Florida, but bought my car in Philly) on the 2.7T - $1500 down ($1000 plus first payment) and $499/mo. The deal is good through June 6. I got mine with Lux package (leather, sunroof, electric seats, etc), 17" wheels, heated seats and Bose Premium stereo. I chose the six speed, but they seemed to have more to choose from with the tiptronic. The deal is for 10,000 miles a year but I got them to up it to 12,000. Sticker was $45,600. I worked them down to $1150 total down (including first month payment) and the payments work out to $575/mo due to PA taxes and the addition of the bigger rims. I think this is a screaming deal for this great car. The money factor is really low, and the interest worked out to less than 4%. I had been shopping around a while, and hadn't found anything close for that much car.
Regarding the A6 vs. the I30 and ES300, the base price for the A6 2.8Q isn't that much over the I30. With the new I35 and new ES300 due out this fall, the difference in price may be even smaller. I'm waiting for these redesigns before deciding. The I30 and ES300 seem to be the reliability winners but the A6 has a soul. Looks like the old head-vs-heart dilemma...
ES300, consider the 2002 A6 with a 220hp 3.0L V6.
Just that much more soul....
I ordered the tires on-line @ www.tirerack.com for $144.00 for one tire x four plus a few bucks for shipping -- the amount on my credit card was about $600.00 for the tires total. Dismounting, remounting and balancing at the dealer was another $100+. The 4 wheel alignment and new brakes were Audi Advantage.
The tires are 255 x 40 x 17 -- exact size replacements for the tires that came on the A6 w/the sport package option. No plus zero or anything, stock size all the way.
Again sorry for any confusion or misrepresentation -- no magic, just the Internet.
I just bought an A6 in Pgh at Sewickly Motors. 2 friends of mine also just bought there. They have a pretty good rep for car knowledge & service.
I visited the 2 other area dealers (Day in the east and another south I forgot the name of). Sewickly beat both on service and price.
I would avoid Day...heard bad stories of price & service. The one in the South Hills I have not heard much about, just visited. They seemed pretty knowledgeable about the cars, but I did not get a feel for their service.
Where did you get your A8 suspension upgrade. I've been looking at 2Bennett Audimotive ($2,195 for shocks, springs and bars) and Autobahn-perfomance ($2,150 for "S8 Sport Kit").
I assume you had dealer install the kit. How was the ride? I don't want too harsh a ride as I'm always hauling customers around. I'm also trying to get a reasonable price on the 18" Avus wheels ($475 is best so far), but as I had a set of 18" Speedlines on my last A8 and A6 and they really firmed the ride up, I'm worried that the tire & suspension package will be too harsh.
Thanks....Randy
llinn78:
How much over invoice did you pay from Sewickly Motors? Have you been happy with service? Do they give you a loaner? Funny you should give Day a thumbs down, as I had a bad feeling when I went out there. The sales guy had only been there a week and it looked like they put more emphasis on selling VW. Sewickly, selling Bimmers and Porsches, has a higher quality standard I bet. I'm heading out there next week to test drive an A6. Besides, Sewickly is much closer to Wexford than Monroeville, anyway. Is there a salesperson that you would recommend?
www.hoppenmotorsport.com
Lease Rate - For a least of $46,000 list, $44,000 Cap cost, 0 down, 60% residual (may be too low), MF of 0032, I get a lease rate of $748, incl. tax & lic fees, so you are in the ballpark.
I also put a "high performance" air filter on this 1997 A8 and truth be told, the only real difference I could tell there was the "honking" sound got more noticable under full throttle -- which was a good thing, but I couldn't really vouch for any dramatic performance improvement.
The suspension+new tires really made a difference though. When I got rid of the A8 (at 47,000 miles) I frankly decided an A8 was too big and I wanted an S6, instead I have the closest thing, IMO, avail here in the US of A -- an A6 4.2 w/sport package. I have no delusions that it IS an S6, and am optimistic that since there will be no new S4 model for probably almost 2 years that Audi of America will import a true S6, so that Audi can have at least 2 S variants in the US (as I am assuming the S8 will soldier on).
I wish someone, who really knew the straight poop would tell "the world" why Audi of America would bring an S4 and an S8 (which has to have a very very limited market) to the US but no S6? I have been unable to come up with any model that really makes sense -- were
THAT many customers clammoring for an $80,000 big Audi car? The market would seem to support a greater quantity of cars in the S6 price bracket ($60,000?) than in the S8 price range.
And why bring a new A4 to market without an Avant or an S4 is also beyond my comprehension.
Premium, Sport, Lux, Bose, 17in rims
Can I do Better?
Claimed it seemed to be a good deal, but to watch the gotcha's on the milage -- must not be Audi Financial or it must be a highly restricted milage offereing or there is a "big" penalty for exceeding the milage.
See if you can get the same deal (or close) @ 12K miles per year -- anyway my dealer says it seems like a good deal.
You know how they are -- one guy always thinks he can beat the other someway.
I paid $1700 over invoice. Didn't haggle all that much...you might be able to do better.
All the salespeople there seem pretty good, try Ron Kean or Chris Armstrong.
I Don't know first hand on the service -- just got my car 2 days ago. Friends who have bought cars there for years say it is 1st class though.
Make sure you keep the June 6th date in mind if you're going to lease. . .a pretty good deal from Audi Financial.
2.7T with cold weather pkg., Bose premium system, Premium Pkg., Preferred luxury pkg. = $45,175
39 month lease, 15,000 miles, 0 (zero) down $599/month. Offer good thru 6/6
Sound good?
That sounds like a MF of around .00226-227. You might get a better MF from an independent source, but Audi leases have a higher residual value which may offset the monthly payment. None of the independent leases I checked could do better than 55% residual. However, if you plan to keep the car after the lease expires (and with an extended warranty) shopping around for a better MF may actually pay for that extended warranty with money left over. Extended warranties to 100,000 miles are running anywhere from $1700-$2000 now from Audi dealers - who knows what they will be in 4 years?
39 mo
$560/mo (includes tax - 512 w/o tax)
Down - 2k (includes all fees, licensing, and first months pymt).
Money Factor - 0.00155
Capital Cost - 43,100
Residual - around 26k
The money factor was amazing - lowest I've ever seen, so i took it. Plus i got a decent reduction in the Capitol Cost - from 46k down to 43k.
Thanks,
allart@vanholten.com