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Comments
After nearly a month of getting no response from the dealer, I decided to take matters into my own hands and opened a case with Toyota customer service. They forwarded my case to the dealer. After 4 days, I received a call from the dealer.
Their response? Yes we've seen it before. You need to get a different phone! I give up...luckily it is a company car, so I'll only have it another 9 months or so, so I guess I'll just have to live with it.
I like Avalon and just wanted to buy it, but this low rating is a strong enough reason to reconsider buying this car. I wanted to know what happened, hoping that it was just some kind of a coincidence, because other crash tests of this car were OK, so I tried to contact Toyota for an explanation.
I posted a question on Toyota web page asking to explain what happened during this particular crash test so that it turned out so poorly. I also asked whether Toyota is planning to let this car to be retested.
After waiting a week for a response, I called Toyota. I was promised a response but didn't get any. Only after a second call, two weeks after posting the original question, Toyota responded.
The response avoided answering my question about what happened during this crash test and why, it just described what the tests are about and said that Toyota meets applicable federal motor vehicle safety standards.
Then I contacted NHTSA and got the following answer:
"According to the data in the NCAP office, the 2001 Toyota Avalon scored 3 stars in the front driver because the Head Injury Criteria (HIC) and the Chest Deceleration(Chest G) were high resulting from the seatbelt and airbag not working in union during the crash test. This car scored well thoughout the test scored average to above average in all tests offered by NCAP."
This means, there was a problem with this car in this particular test, but Toyota does not want to talk about it.
Then I posted one more question to Toyota web page, requesting to explain what happened to Avalon during this crash test and asked when Toyota is going to fix this flaw. In a week I have not received any response, and when I called, the customer support representative refused to explain anything, she even didn't confirm that my question posted to Toyota web page will be responded to.
Flaws in car safety is a serious issue. Toyota's attitude refusing to respond to questions about Avalon's crash test results is worrisome. Maybe if more people start asking this kind of questions, Toyota will be compelled to respond.
Jiri Kripac
If I understood you, you believe that a customer who doesn't have to endure the hard-sell tag-team weardown sessions with four dealer managers is willing to pay a little more for a vehicle.
In my electronics manufacturing business, the lowest price goes to the customer who can take delivery of my product with the fewest gripes and the least hand-holding from my staff. I can move my circuit boards at a lower price to a "clean" customer because he frees me to focus on other (higher margin) customers who require hand-holding.
If your story is accurate, it seems to me that the retailing side of the auto industry has it backwards. The cash 'n' carry internet customer deserves your best price, not your highest one.
Thanks as always for your comments. They account for my on-going interest in this bulletin board.
As to the cash and carry threoy, that does not fly in this business. This probably does work in electronics sales but that is because you have only one profit center.
Cash customers with no trade-in give us only one opportunity to make money. We must make all the profit on the sale of the vehicle. Those who finance give us a chance to make a couple of bucks in the finance office on the loan. It is also easier to sell extended warranties to those who do the loan through the dealers. We can often "under allow" on trades and then there is the famous "rust and dust" that most Internet savvy customers don't buy. Regular walk-in customers are more likely to buy products beyond the actual car and often, a manager will take a chance on a short deal if he knows he has another chance to make it up elsewhere in the deal.
Oops. Did I just give away all the retail secrets? I guess I did. When I was a manager and was made an offer, I had to look at the whole deal. If I didn't like the price but it was border line with what was considered a reasonable deal, I would often take it if I thought we could sell them something else. Cash customers fool themselves into thinking we want simple deals.
Please don't take any of this as absolutes. We view every deal as an individual event. There are often reasons to take quick and short deals. If a customer happens to land on an aging unit (in stock for 90+ days), or one that we have many duplicate units, we'll usually be quicker. to the short deal.
The benefit to buying over the Internet is fair pricing and honest treatment. Fair and best pricing are not always the same thing. Remember what I have always said though, "the best price is not always the best deal."
Thank you for bringing to our attention the poor crash test rating of the 2001 Toyota Avalon.
I forwarded your letter (msg #854) to Steve T., my salesman and friend, at Team Toyota in Langhorne, PA. Recently, I ordered the 2001 Avalon XLS and it is to be delivered this month. Lets see how Toyota responds to the dealer's inquiry about the test. It makes sense to put on hold any 2001 Avalon purchase until a satisfactory solution to this very important issue is found by the manufacturer.
Joe K.
The NHTSA responded "... seat belt and air bag not working in union ...", so there may be something wrong Toyota does not want to talk about.
Would there be any way how to inform a broader car-loving community about Toyota's attitude?
Get over it guys. If safety is the ONLY criteria you have, buy a Volvo. If safety is high on the list, but not the only thing on it, the Avalon is a worthy contender for your money.
My problem is that after reading the messages on this site, I am worried that the Avalon will bring me problems. There doesn't seem to be many happy Avalon owners vs. the happy people at the Bonneville and Regal sites. I'm coming off of a lease on a BMW, and have had 0 problems with it, so I am a liitle spoiled. Although the BMW has been a great car, I just don't think I can go through another Chicago winter without FWD, and I also miss a car that is a little roomier. In addition, I just can't afford another BMW right now!
So what I am looking for is some honest advice and thoughts regarding the Avalon. If you had to do it all over again, would you still choose the Avalon? Should I keep looking? I'm very particular and although I know there are never any guarantees, I'm going to have to live with this car for 3 years and I want to be happy. I love new cars, and I'm hoping my next decision will be a good one. Thanks in advance for your help!!
The Avalon XLS is priced as a "near luxury" sedan, but don't let the price fool you. This is a genuine luxury car.
If you want a spacious interior, premium sound system, wiper quiet engine , a superior ride, and "trouble-free" driving, then the XLS is the car for you.
On the down side, the exterior styling is a bit staid compared to the 300M or Aura 3.2TL.
Every one who has ever sat in my Avalon XLS has nothing but positive and glowing comments.
And no, I am not a Toyota salesman, and this the first Toyota I have ever owned.
I hope this helps with your purchase decision.
Hope this helps.....
I'm 6 foot 4, 230 lbs and drive in total comfort. Great headroom and seats are supportive. Gas mileage is very good for car this size(28 mpg highway. Extremely quiet on inside also.
I was at gas station on Saturday (5/5/01) and a guy stops me and asks if my car is one if those new Infinitis (hope he meant a Q45!). I said - No - It's a Toyota Avalon. He was surprised and gave the vehicle the once over and couldn't believe all the amenities. He raved about the 'look' of the vehicle and said it appears even more expensive than the price paid. (The guy drove a 99 Maxima).
Seems the Avalon gets a lot of flack on the town hall at Edmunds. It also seems to get compared to cars costing as much or more, which is a good situation to be in.
I'd recommend the car , especially over a Bonneville/Regal (post #869) I drove the Bonne and it was plastic city, dash controls seemed flimsy and cheesy, not worth the cost(especially sunroof switch). Check put how lousy the headliner is attached around the sunroof in the Bonne. No real finish around it, you can basically pull it down quite easily.
Choose the vehicle you like, but consider spending time in the Avalon, you may be end up liking it the best.
This is my first Toyota. I have owned 6 Cadillacs and 2 Lincolns. My daughter has had a Toyota pickup for several years and she told me I should test drive a Toyota before buying another car. I thought I would "one up" her and go for a Lexus. I tried the 300 and the ride was so bumpy I tried the Avalon XLS. The ride was far superior. I liked every other thing about it, too. So I bought it.
It is far superior to any Cad or Lincoln I have owned. In fact, I have never "loved" a car before but I have fallen in love with this car.
I can drive it 70 mph all day (500 miles) and never have to stop for gas!
To the present time, 15,000 miles later, I only went to a dealer once. I had a vibration. The dealer found a weight had fallen off of a wheel.
I am sure a large Lexus is just as great--maybe even greater--but I can't own a rear wheel drive car. My drive way is too steep. That is why I owned Cad Sevilles and Lincoln Continentals.
I've always used 91 octane gas in my XLS because I thought that my 2000 owner's manual said to. Am I wrong?
Otherwise, have had my car for over one month and love it. Beware of hidden dealer costs - Perma Coat at mandatory $279. Would NOT recommend the central Phoenix dealer I went to.
optional Glass Breakage Sensor system. I
tried to check it out using the instructions that
was included but the alarm did not sound.
I tapped on the window using the key, but
nothing happened. Could it be that it has a
bad sensor installed. Cliffy1 do you have any
suggestions Thanks
please give me the details before I go out and buy one. I understand that when you purchase one from Toyotas parts department, they have instructions packaged inside. What exactly should
I expect. I'm not completely inept, so is it rather straight forward with the usual tools? As for that ever present little jiggle behind the dash, we have it, any hints to try to work on that?
- Have you considered resale value? Especially if you own the car only 3 years, the Avalon would probably save you considerable money compared with any GM car. An old Kelley Blue Book I have shows 3-year old Avalons ("retail good") bringing about 72% of new sticker, and it shows Bonnevilles bringing about 60%.
- Have you considered the LeSabre? It's basically the same car as the Bonneville (but with no supercharger option), and the Regal is quite a bit smaller inside.
Good luck!
Thanks
Try it
P.S. pd about 800 over invoice
We are extremely pleased with everything else regarding this vehicle, but very, very, disappointed in the ride! Our concern is whether or not this is a problem commmon to 2000 Avalon XL's or if it is only our vehicle in particular.
Help!! We are ready to sell it and get an Infiniti or Mercedes Benz.
-The engine is very smooth and very quiet, which I like.
-What is not smooth is the exhaust. It is quiet enough, but there seems to be vibration when taking off on light throttle and when driving at a steady 30-35 in overdrive. On my old car (1998 Chevy Venture) the exhaust was completely silent and vibration-free. The Avalon is a very refined car, but this vibration is the fly in the ointment.
-Compared to General Motors transmissions, I find Toyotas to be rather primitive. While both are smooth shifting, Toyotas is only 4 speed, while GMs is actually 5 speed. My Avalon will sometimes go into overdrive at just 30 mph and grunt after that. GMs would never go into overdrive until at least 45, so there was no grunting. The good thing is that the Avalon can go up the hills on the Interstates without downshifting. Also, the Avalon seems reluctant to downshift when some more power is needed at mid-speeds. GMs downshifted more readily. I think Toyota needs to study GMs transmissions more closely.
-The engine idles fast in the morning. (1400 rpm. in Park) Not since my old cars without fuel injection have I had a car that idles this fast in the morning. I dont know if this is normal or not.
-My biggest problem is excessive road noise on coarse roads. It seems quiet on smooth roads but not on coarse roads. The car tracks good on calm days, but not on windy days. It blows around the road some, but it doesnt require as much steering correction as other vehicles I have driven. This car has wimpy tires. (General XP400--P205/65R15) I do not know if a better set of tires would help the noise problem or not. I am looking into the possibility of getting new tires. I have experienced some truck tires that do not seem to emit more noise on coarse roads than smooth roads.
-There is an occasional, slight kerplunk sound in the front left strut, but it is hardly bad enough to take it back to the dealer for strut replacement. Overall, the suspension is very tight and rattle-free.
-There is a lot of debate about what kind of gas to burn in an Avalon. I have been switching between regular and premium. There really isn't much difference. To tell the difference in acceleration, I think could only be done with a stopwatch. Presently, I've gone back to regular.
-I would say Toyota doesn't quite have their act together with the Avalon. But do I want to go back to General Motors? --No way! I test-drove a Buick LeSabre right after test-driving the Avalon. It didn't measure up at all to the Avalon.