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Brief history:
JAN 1999 - 47000 - New Transmission (warranty)
MAY 1999 - 52000 - New Transmission (warranty)
MAY 1999 - 52000 - New Head Gaskets (warranty)
MAY 1999 - 52025 - New Motor (warranty)
JUL 1999 - 53000 - Replace O2 Sensors (warranty - $50)
OCT 1999 - 56000 - New Transmission (warranty)
JAN 2000 - 59600 - New Blower Motor (et al - only $400!) - Extended Warranty is about to expire...
FEB 2000 - 61000 - New Front Brakes & Rotors ($225)
APR 2000 - 63000 - New Inner Tie Rods ($300)
At EVERY oil change from this point forward, I indicated to the service rep that we were constantly smelling coolant....
Luck Me! What now! We are at 75000 and guess what?! We need another engine again! Oh yeah! You'll even give me a rental car? Why? It is going to take 10 days to get another engine! Wait a minute... Isn't there a buy back program? That program for 95WS ended in October.
I cannot believe this... I'll keep you posted...
2004 Honda Accord EX-L Graphite Pearl
2007 Honda Civic EX - Atomic Blue
2013 Honda Civic LX - Crimson Pearl
I am amazed at the number of transmission problems on this model.
Our WS 98 has 56K.
Here's its dirty laundry list:
1. The Tracking bar has been replaced at 25K - Warranty.
2. The Windshield developed a growing crack for an unknown reason - replaced windshield via insurance, beyond 36K warranty.
3. Door Handle on sliding door coming loose. I have to push in on the handle to get it to work. Dealer estimated $250 to fix. - beyond 36K warranty.
4. Right passenger side mirror coming loose at base that attaches to door ( not the glass itself ). Dealer estimated $250 to fix. - beyond 36K warranty.
5. 12V DC power socket on center console blew a fuse. Replaced fuse and it worked. 3 months later the same socket stopped working again. It might be a blown fuse. I haven't bothered checking it since I've become accustomed to things breaking in this car and really wish it would go away. If it is a blown fuse again, might this indicate an electrical short somewhere that could cause a fire?
6. After a wheel rotation, the car started pulling right. I have to turn the steering wheel 5 degrees left of center to keep the car going straight. The pulling seems worse when accelerating or when the engine is pulling at a high torque.
First Try: Dealer rotated tires ( back to the original position ), checked alignment to be good. They must not have test driven it because the car was still pulling.
Second Try: Dealer rotated tires, adjusted alignment with a greater attention to detail. I was told that it was test driven, and I believe them, as I requested the dealer to pick up and drop off the car at our house. The pulling was less severe, but it was still there. Service manager said it was "radial pull" ( tires ) or shocks. Using the old fashion "bounce" test, the shocks did not appear to be a factor.
7. The rim covers keep coming off. I replaced missing covers twice( at $50 - $75 each ). I made sure the metal tabs were bent out enough to grip the rim to the point it was difficult to get the cover on. Regardless, I am down to one rim and don't plan on replacing any more. Oddly, that last rim is holding tight.
8. The last straw. The transmission made a grinding noise that grew Louder over a week, and was most prominent when accelerating. Finally, while driving it the day before I was to take it to the shop the transmission seized up on a hill. If this happens to you, - get behind the wheel, shift it to Neutral and have some one else rock it. Eventually it will break loose and roll back down the hill, so be ready to move out of the way.
I've owned 4 different cars over the past 18 years, each from different manufactures. A couple I have kept over 5 years/100,000 miles. Personally, I have never seen a car develop so many problems inside of 3 years and under 56K miles. 3 years ago this was a $29,000 car and I was expecting $29,000 worth of quality.
Does anyone remember when Ford's motto was "Quality Is Job #1" ?
Is it a coincidence that they don't advertise that any more?
Instead, "Built Ford Tough" implies "Tough" to maintain one.
As far as the lemon law, you need a total of 30 out of service days, or the same problem 4 times--I'm I'am the process of this. The attorney I talked to said the dealer will always make an offer that looks good to the person, but generly with an attorney they won't mess around.
Well, it is now after 3:30PM and I was supposed to hear from them by 3:00PM. I have called the 1800 number again. Another rep (LeRoy) is taking all the information (again). It is just amazing to me that that all I seem to do is repeat the story - over and over - the reps do all they can to keep you from getting upset. Which is probably good. THey have all the history of calls that I have made. Funny, I asked them to send a copy of that infomration to me, however, they wont send anything?! They say that their "system" cannot do it...
Nonetheless, FORD has dished out a LOT of money to keep this car running. WHY? I have asked, once again, to get the same offer that was made under program M010. While he has not stated so,
I am under the impression that this program is over. I still can't get confirmation on that. It is now 4:10PM and I have been on the phone since 3:40PM.
At 4:10PM the Service Manager FINALLY joined the phone conversation. His name is JEFF. Turns out, he knows NOTHING about this! It appears that TERRY, the Parts Manager, was the person who spoke with the the Ford contact yesterday! This is absolutely screwed! Jeff has claimed complete ignorance to this issue. I have asked that Jeff talk with Terry and the Regional Rep to review the situation. Jeff stated that he will call tonight. I'll believe it when that happens...
More to come...
2004 Honda Accord EX-L Graphite Pearl
2007 Honda Civic EX - Atomic Blue
2013 Honda Civic LX - Crimson Pearl
Whatever the case, I did find out one VERY interesting thing... The first motor replacement (in June 1999) did NOT include the re designed head gasket - as I was told...
Soooooo, tomorrow I get a rental and wait for a motor to be installed. I can't wait for the Customer Satisfaction Survey on this one...
2004 Honda Accord EX-L Graphite Pearl
2007 Honda Civic EX - Atomic Blue
2013 Honda Civic LX - Crimson Pearl
Also, how is everyone's MPG? We do a lot of local driving and get 13 MPG. (What's the criteria for the gas guzzler tax?)
It would not take long to read just the past two weeks worth of posts on this town hall to see that the WS 95 and 98, at least, are plagued with problems.
My own list is under #355. I had a grinding noise around 25K that was determined to be the tie rods ends on the tracking bar that were worn. Too bad you are beyond warranty, although it could be worse. You could have the typical transmission failure outside of the warranty that happens between 50K and 60K as is my case at the present.
If you find any information about aftermarket sources, please keep us informed.
#363 crkeehn. It may be true that on most vans any open door will cause the door chime to sound but on mine (1998) I verified that only the drivers door chimes. Like I said my van was possessed. I tried cleaning the sliding door contacts and spraying the tail gate latches like you said but the problem appeared to be in the drivers door. Thanks for the help. LOVE my new Durango.
As for the new Windstars. I had a rental in Philly this week. Only 11 miles on it and I was wondering if it would make it back to the airport. The van could not make up its mind which gear it wanted to be in. It took forever for it to decide to shift out of first and then would constantly shift between third and fourth. The seats were very uncomfortable and the leg room was much less than in my 97. The check engine came on at 20 miles and would not go off. The O/D off light never did go off, although the overdrive was working. When I applied the brakes, it gave a terrible surge. If I had not seen the same problem posted here a couple of weeks ago, I would have probably hit someone. I had been starting to look at replacements for my 97 and driving this one made my choices a little easier. There will not be another Ford in my garage.
I got mine late March last year. I never saw anything less than 23 mpg the first 2 1/2 tank fulls. THEN THE BATTERY STARTED GOING DEAD. Going down the highway the MS was reading 14!! Each time the dealer would re program the PCM it would improve for a couple of days then the battery would go dead again or it would drop for no reason at all. I finally took it to a different dealer because my transmission started acting up too--he CLEARED out the PCM and reset it (even though it was already set to the latest) and it took care of the tranny and finally am getting decent highway readings, but the city kills anything that the highway gains. The miles to empty used to read 525 miles right after filling up. Mine was reading 420 miles, so I tried disconnecting the battery and restting the tranny and filled up. It read 480 miles and as I drove it combined went up to 505 miles. I did drive a new one. Although that one didn't read under 18 mpg in the city, I filled the tank up and it read only 436 miles to empty. Ancious for warmer weather, a friend who has a 2000 SE says he can go 520 miles before filling up. Leaving on a long trip so I'll see if warmer weather will help. Meanwhile, anyone with a SEL with electriacal problems, EMAIL ME-- the5fours@juno.com
Drew
Host
Vans, SUVs, and Aftermarket and Accessories message boards
I hope this info will be of some help to other Windstar owners:
My vehicle has a 3.8 engine with 72,000 miles.
--Problem of rear head rests jammed in upward position, dangerously, blocking the driver's rear view vision.
I removed the c-clip at the very top of the seat where the chrome rod of the headrests enter the top of the seat (use needle nose pliers}. I pushed the headrests down to their lowest position & reinserted the clips. O.K.
--Problem of engine light flickering/staying on.
Had an independent mechanic check the vehicle with a computer/scope.
Remedy was to change sparkplugs & sparkplug wires & gas line filter. I was shown that the wires were arcing & this would send a signal to the computer of a misfire causing the check engine light to come on.-----Parts & Labour $ 250.00
Of interest platinum spark plugs only are recommended for proper engine performance also you can check the wires for arcing, best time at night & spray a mist of water on the wires with motor running. If you wires are defective,you will easily see arcing from the wires to the motor or to other wires.
Result: engine light stayed off for 2 days then came on again.
I took the vehicle to a Ford Dealer in my area & the van was checked with a computer/scope.
Remedy was to change faulty EGR SENSOR ASSEMBLY {F4ZZ*9J460*B) & 2 EGR VAC HOSES.
-Parts & Labour $ 240.00
Result: engine light now off for
3 weeks, seems O.K.
--Problem of ABS & BRAKE Lights flickering on & off at stop light & then staying on. (the brake cylinder is known to have a sloppy float causing the light to come on when you come to a stop, fill the cylinder to the top & the light goes out.}
I had my brake wheel cylinders & brake system checked twice by my local garage & the brake system checked by my Ford Dealer & they could not find any leaks. My master cylinder would lose brake fluid slowly, about 1 inch over 30 days.
I did see about 1 tablespoon of fluid overnight appear on my driveway. I laid a large piece of cardboard under the engine overnight & was able to catch this fluid stain on the cardboard. I then took the cardboard into the dealer marking where the front tire was on the cardboard. The dealer was then able to pin point the area of the leak under my van.
The following part was leaking and replaced. {Proportionating valve}. There are 2 of these valves joining the brake lines located under the vehicle, just behind the driver's seat area. The brakes had to be bled.
FORD#BRAKE VALVE (F8Z*2B091*BA}
-Parts & Labour $185.00
--Problem of Very Strong, Burning, Chemical Smell Coming From Heater.
This solution was found by accident by my Ford Dealer while the vehicle had been in for repair. This was my 3RD repair visit to the Dealer & I had complained about this horrible smell each visit but it would not appear at that time. I had my van in to check for the brake fluid leak and asked the mechanic to check for leaks around the back of the engine in case brake fluid or oil was leaking on the exhaust.----The mechanic discovered 6 large pine cones jammed up against the engine & they were partially burned.--- A squirrel or chipmunk had started to make a nest next to my nice, warm engine & the pine cones slowly burning were causing this terrible chemical smell to be picked up by the heater intake. -Parts & Labour $00.00
Http://hometown.aol.com/lisam1120/myhomepage/news.html
Here is the latest update...
Ted Britt took my loaner away from me after they had found that I had contacted an attorney. when the general manager called to tell me he wanted his loaner back immediately, I said well.... guess now I have you for false advertising as well, on top of the original charge of Fraud and consumer Law Violations. He hung up.
However the following day called to tell me to please return to the dealership and pick up another loaner, because what he did was very wrong and he apologized with three phone calls. I lost a day of work because of that one.
Yesterday late, I got a call from the Tech. working on my van. He called to tell me that the new engine was in and it was running great, and that the problem with the brakes was going to be taken care of per the General Manager. They were going to put new tires on, new pads, and new rotor's and they were going to cover the cost. I guess making a web page makes some people take care of things for fear that it will damage the customer's coming in. As I sent my page to mostly people in the Fairfax area. I have had 205 hits so far. I am assuming that he is thinking I will pull the page since he is taking care of things not covered under warranty, and believe me, I am very thankful. The problem still exsist's though... I am stuck in a loan for 6 yrs, my warranty is just one year, and with all the problems I have dealt with in just the first two weeks of ownership, I am extremely fearful of what will happen in the next 6 yrs. It shouldn't be this way when you purchase a vehicle. I am still going to continue with legal action, still keep my page up and still post on auto boards. This does not change my mind at all about the quality of this van that Ford sold me. Thanks for all your support with my page. I will keep you posted as to how the new engine is running as I am suppose to pick it up today.
Lisa
Http://hometown.aol.com/lisam1120/myhomepage/news.html
Well we picked my van up after having the second engine put in just one months time and drove it approx 7 miles. I placed the van in nuetral and ran it to 4 rpms when it started to spit and sputter again. WHY ME!!!!! There was coolant all over the place. Dont know if it was new or old, so I had the hubby rinse it off, so i could get a better look tomorrow when it is driven. Now they replaced the brakes, rotors, and tires today. But while I was at the hospital waiting for my surgery, my hubby called to tell me that the brakes are now making a very loud thumping noise when coming to a stop. So after I drive it for a little while tomorrow and I can get a feeling of what it is doing, I will place a call into the tech. and once again the General Manager. So this is just a slight update as to what the problems are now. I will keep you all posted. Oh and there is still a ticking noise...... remember the last engine did this and they told me it was the rocker arms and push rods. I wonder if they even changed out the engine????
Thanks again for all your support.
Lisa
2004 Honda Accord EX-L Graphite Pearl
2007 Honda Civic EX - Atomic Blue
2013 Honda Civic LX - Crimson Pearl
I must point out though, that even though you have no faith in the longevity of this vehicle, the tires are the only part of the vehicles which are in actual contact with the road. Since you will still be riding/driving the vehicle, you may want to avoid being too frugal for you and your family's own safety.
Good luck!
Drew
Host
Vans, SUVs and Aftermarket & Accessories message boards
For what its worth, Michelin X-Ones are what was suggested to me by "tireguy" over in "Tires, tires, tires" a while back (I have a 99 SE).
Steve
Host
Vans, SUVs, and Aftermarket & Accessories message boards
2004 Honda Accord EX-L Graphite Pearl
2007 Honda Civic EX - Atomic Blue
2013 Honda Civic LX - Crimson Pearl
ES MSRP 31,500 anyway the salesman told me the residual value, for a 15,000 mile a year vehicle for a 3 year deal is only 42% is this actual or is he low balling me?
OK, it is my family we haul around so I didn't skimp too much - OTOH, I didn't go crazy either. After talking with a couple of shops I got the impression that the cheap tires (35000 to 40000 mile tires) have softer sidewalls that would not last very long on a 4200 pound vehicle.
I went to the local Fleet Farm and picked up a set of four Duron Vertex IV. They are a 75000 mile tire made by the Dayton Tire Company. They were on sale for $49.95 each and for the month of March they had free mounting, balance, and valve stems. $212.79 later I took the tires to their Auto Service Center and they had them on the van in 45 minutes. I asked them to do an alignment as well. It turned out I didn't need one. After they put it on the rack they showed me that all four wheels were within spec. Sooooo... They charged me $6 to dispose the old tires and $10 for the alignment "check".
That is the least amount of money that I have spent on service for this van since I bought it in 1998!
2004 Honda Accord EX-L Graphite Pearl
2007 Honda Civic EX - Atomic Blue
2013 Honda Civic LX - Crimson Pearl
I got my 95WS back from the dealership at the beginning of March... That was for engine number three. Put new tires on it last weekend... Now the temperature guage is "swinging" between the O and the L in NORMAL...
This sucks... Why do I believe them?
2004 Honda Accord EX-L Graphite Pearl
2007 Honda Civic EX - Atomic Blue
2013 Honda Civic LX - Crimson Pearl
"Through our efforts and partnership with Ford Motor Company, we were able to install a new (rmp) engine at no cost to Ms. Abrahams while providing her with comparable loaner transportation at no charge. At this point in time I believe she is happy with Ted Britt Ford."
First of all... I am not even close to happy, Second, They did'nt do this out of the goodness of they're heart like he is making it sound. They have to replace the engine, and they have to provide me with a loaner, Its there policy. Remember they took that loaner away from me at one point because I made them really mad with my homepage and contacting an Attorney. And i'm happy???? I don't think so. Now there is some other leak, and just yesterday I did my own little test for the van missing and it's not a pretty thing. Place a glass of water on the top of the dash, put the car in park, nuetral and drive and watch the water in the glass, if it jumps around like a dancing bean then you got problems. Mine was doing flips in the air...lol I have to make funny on this at times, otherwise i'll drive myself insane.
Oh and I wanted everyone to know that I ordered two bushels of lemons and when I picket the dealership in April, the lemons will be handed out to passer by's with the dealers name on them. Maybe this will show just how happy I really am.
Thanks for all the support!!!!
Lisa
Ford has no idea how well and far your message is being delivered. On my way home from work last night I was behind a 2000 Ford Taurus with a license plate bracket from, you guessed it, Ted Britt Ford. I immediately thought of your story. I also noticed the passengers in the car next to me pointing at the bracket and heard them talking about the dealership and how they had a reputation for being deceptive. And I'm down here in southeastern Virginia. Keep up the fight.
I have been getting educated from this site, and I think it's my turn to return the favor. Today I bought a new SEL with side airbags, family security group and entertainment center. I would like to point out two things here.
1. I was eligible for so-called X plan (a discount plan for employees of Ford partner companies). However, it couldn't save me much money. I should say I could have lost a lot of bucks just because of that. What an irony... I was supposed to get a predetermined price, which is Ford employee price (so-called A plan) plus 4% extra. Anyway, I ended up not using it, because I could get even more discount and $400 college grad rebate (which I could not get with X plan). So, those who try to use this, please think twice. You could save a lot if you are willing to spend a little more time on dealing.
2. The price info on SEL page is not correct. The invoice and MSRP should be 28066 and 30805, respectively. At least they are the numbers on the paper I got from the dealer. Hope knowing this info could save you $200 more bucks.
I managed to get a good deal (at least to me) - $701 under invoice (excluding rebates). I am living in Boston area and let me know if you want more info on my deal.
Thanks.
Cheers,
Hank
Anyway, I spent a bunch of time reading all of the posts here, and laughed out loud when I read a very early one about the disappointment with the floor mats...I Agree!! The '95 had plush mats, covered the whole van, even had the word "Windstar" on them... the new mats (in a van with quite a few upgraded features as well) are el cheapo, and don't even begin to cover the actual floor space in the van. So I stole the cargo mat from the '95, was glad we still had the van!
I agree with the 'sharpness' of the latch for the rear door... My husband thought I was crazy to moan about the floor mats and that latch, glad someone else feels the same way :-)
Am not sure that I like where some of the controls are now located, for example the rear window control (why only on the driver side? I liked it better in the center!) or the rear wiper control... Plus, my field of vision is much less due to the high headrests; does anyone know if they are removeable?
But so many new fun things! Like that the radio stays on after the engine is turned off, great when waiting to pick up kids from their events :-) Or the remote keyless entry so I can never lock the keys in again :-) Or being able to adjust which interior lights turn on when the key comes out of the ignition...
Don't know if we *really* needed a new van right now, but that $4K coupon was about to expire... !
Plus, supposedly, they also don't have any mats available for separate purchase that would be more 'custom-fit' to the 2nd and 3rd rows... as opposed to just the mats that came with the van...
I know that one of the reasons that the '95 WS we still have looks so good inside is because the floor mats basically covered every inch of the inside... never had to worry about whether a spill was on the mat or not...!
If anyone finds out that better 2001 custom mats do indeed exist, please post, thanks!!
Sharon
Please, Please, Please... let this be the last time I see the service department for a while...
Hope yours treats you better than mine does!
2004 Honda Accord EX-L Graphite Pearl
2007 Honda Civic EX - Atomic Blue
2013 Honda Civic LX - Crimson Pearl