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Subaru Crew Problems & Solutions

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    hammersleyhammersley Member Posts: 684
    Even *I* haven't ever driven the tiller, except on an antique (1921) ladder truck we used to take to parades. That was always interesting, considering there was about a half-turn of free play in the wheel! Parade speed was easy... driving back & forth (especially after the St. Patrick's day parade) was more of a challenge!

    We don't have an aerial with a tiller on my department - the latest, greatest truck we have is a 105-foot ladder/pumper combination with all-wheel steering controlled from the cab.

    On topic - they're the same color as my Subaru. :)

    Cheers!
    Paul
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    mrfixit3mrfixit3 Member Posts: 6
    Folks-
    My first time to the site! Have been looking at some of the posts and liked what I saw. I felt this was the right place to make my inquiry. I'm actually on this crusade for my Mom...she has a 96 Legacy (2.2 of course) with 35,000m on it. It developed an oil leak coming down from behind the timing belt cover and was getting worse. I recommended she make the trip to the dealer thinking this has to be a problem they know about and that they would cover, I mean, come on,only 35,000 miles and the seals going??? Well $450 later...replaced front engine seal, oil pump seal/ORing, replaced the timing belt since they had it opened up (I was ok with that part). From what I am seeing of some older postings here, this seems like a known problem with seals/gaskets on several model years. Agree? Yet Subaru customer service says there is no recall on it. Has anyone been in this same boat? Has anyone had a dealer replace the seals for free (under some special extended warranty or the infamous "silent recall" perhaps)? I'm very surprised at the number of hits I found in numerous places..even the NHTSA had a TSB on an oil pump leak but specific to 95 model year.This seems like a known problem and I was very surprised that SOA doesn't seemed to have addressed it. I thought they were doing a good job in the past with stepping up to other recalls...but perhaps its the old story of only addressing problems that are safety concerns as some other manufacturers seem to do. Thanks for any input...appreciate it.
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    locke2clocke2c Member Posts: 5,038
    There isn't a recall on it. They would gladly repair yours if it were still under warranty, but since it isn't you have to pay for it.

    Think mine's leaking too. ('99 2.5L impreza, 41k miles)

    But how is this a safety concern?

    -Colin
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    bluesubiebluesubie Member Posts: 3,497
    Yes, a recall is issued if there is a safety problem. Did you try to work out a deal with the dealer? Maybe ask them to pay for parts? Especially since it was so close to the Powertrain Warranty expiration.

    -Dennis
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    ffsteveffsteve Member Posts: 243
    francophile, like your idea of a broom stick. On one old car of mine, I could pull the transmission input shaft out and use it as the alignment tool. This was a feature on all cars of that model, but I don't know if this is a common "feature" on all cars. But it meant I didn't have to worry about finding the right tool!

    Steve
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    paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    Older subies are known for bad seals on the engine. But your mom's car is 8 years old! You can't expect them to cover an 8 year old car do you? Even though it is low milage the rubber in the seal breaks down over time. I had a similar problem with my '88 XT6 @ 52K miles 2 years ago. Nothing I could do about it really except suck it up and live with it or repair it.

    -mike
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I think what he was trying to say was that a slow oil leak does not fall under a "safety" issue. It is a powertrain issue, but that expired after 5 years or 60k miles.

    If your seatbelt failed, or the airbag light went on, that's a different story.

    -juice
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    paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    What do you think the chances are that I can get the belt fixed in my XT6? It stopped retracting the other day on the passenger side. Actually it is in the back position, and won't go forward and backward. Think there is any chance of getting it fixed as a safety issue for free or reduced cost? Maybe I'll just leave it since it is in the back position which is where it needs to be when the door is closed.

    -mike
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    I'm not sure, but it might be covered since seatbelts are required by law.

    -juice
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    locke2clocke2c Member Posts: 5,038
    2002-1996 = 6, which is just outside of the 5yr/60k mi powertrain warranty. in fact if the car was bought new later than today's date in 1996, it actually should have still been covered.

    -Colin
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    paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    IIRC 96 did not have 5/60k warranty. Back then it was 3/36 or 3/50K at best.

    -mike
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    cptpltcptplt Member Posts: 1,075
    my 92 Legacies had a 5/60 powertrain warranty, it was one reason I got it back then rather than another Audi on which I had been burned big time twice before (ok so I'm a little slow at learning sometimes!)
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Wow, way back in 1992? I didn't know that. Toyota just matched Subaru last year, and Honda still doesn't (3/36 only). Nissan also just matched Subaru recently.

    -juice
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    kate5000kate5000 Member Posts: 1,271
    my old Loyale'92 had 5/60 powertrain wrty, and also a very long rustproof warranty (don't remember now, was it lifetime or 10 yrs) which was quite unusual back then.
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    mrk610mrk610 Member Posts: 378
    I had a 96 honda accord and it only had 3/36 warranty to . Glad I got extended on it because it was used alot .

    mikek
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    mrfixit3mrfixit3 Member Posts: 6
    Thanks all for the feedback.
    I'm posting my reply for the second time as I lost the server connection just as I hit the post button, so if this posts twice please disregard the additional post.
    I had called Subaru and basically was told there is no recall on the issue. However they did open a case for me and are sending it to the dealer and are suppose to contact me within 24-36 hrs.
    I will post/share the outcome with everyone for reference.
    p.s. sorry there was confusion over me mentioning the safety thing..I was basically being sarcastic..it really fustrates me when there is no recall done on what sure seems like a problem they need to address. Manufacturers only seem to do recalls when its related to safety (aka possible lawsuits from it).
    As far as some of the other responses, I still feel that a 6 yr old car with 35k on it should not have front engine seal leaks. The car is well maintained and kept (never overfilled with oil to build pressure to make a seal leak, never overheated, etc etc)
    I have been working around cars for 26 yrs now and have rebuilt engines and sold some that went 100k+ without front seal problems! I've owned Toyota's and Mazda's up to 155k without main seal problems.
    Lessoned learned, I should have just worked on this one myself but told Mom to take it to the dealer because I was so sure that they would have made good, especially since I saw so many posts/hits out there with people having the same problem at various years and mileage. Thanks again all.
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    jimmyp1jimmyp1 Member Posts: 640
    You know my story on the seatbelt. I called SOA, got a case # started, was told to take my car to the dealer for an inspection of "what was really wrong", did that, waited a while, waited some more, called SOA back, who then called the dealer to see what they had found, which really jump-started things, and, a couple weeks later, my parts were in. All free to me. They actually tried a cheap fix/shortcut the first time, and ended up having to replace everything on the second go-around a couple weeks later. But, it's done. I think the key is "arming" yourself with an SOA case # so that the dealer doesn't try to blow you off.

    Jim
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Honda still only offers 3/36. I'm surprised they didn't match Toyota's move to 5/60.

    Good to know the system worked for you, Jim.

    -juice
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    theobtheob Member Posts: 148
    Not too long ago, one of the members posted links to pictures and tips on changing the cabin air filters on 00 and 01 OB. I thought these were really useful looking, and would now like to make use of them. Anyone remember who that was and have an URL?
    Thanks in advance,
    Theo in Colo.
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    paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    Well as Colin said, Paul Eckland of Primative Racing pulled through for me. Here are my choices of clutches:

    1)std clutch plate, slightly upgraded from stock
    2) $60 additional 6-puck copper
    3) $40 un-sprung plate

    The rest of the kit includes the Throwout bearing, pilot bearing, pressure plate, alignment tool and clutch for $299 + $18 shipping

    What is your vote, knowing it will be used exclusively for Auto-x and/or Track events. He said the 6-puck would be a bit rough in stop and go traffic, but that won't be an issue for this car.

    -mike
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    locke2clocke2c Member Posts: 5,038
    unsprung hub? bad idea IMO if the car is *ever* driven on public streets. won't be too forgiving on the gearbox either, even if you only have 150 HP or whatnot.

    can't he get you the 6 puck ClutchNet with 3 copper pucks and 3 kevlar. that's what I've got... of course I haven't installed it yet. ;-)

    -Colin
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    paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    Is the 3 copper 3 kvlar better or worse than the 6 copper? I have zero knowledge of MTs so I'm counting on yous. I pretty much ruled out the un-sprung, cause he said it's mostly for dragging, which I never will be doing with this car.

    -mike
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    locke2clocke2c Member Posts: 5,038
    the 3 copper, 3 kevlar is a little less grabby since kevlar has some give. may take a slightly stouter pressure plate than just copper.

    -Colin
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    paisanpaisan Member Posts: 21,181
    Ok, wel I don't mind it being grabby, perhaps he can't get the pressure plate for the XT6 and thats why he didn't offer it. Heck I was just happy he KNEW WHAT AN XT6 WAS! Very helpful guy via e-mail.

    -mike
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    LOL paisan. I guess now there are 6 of us that know about it! ;-)

    -juice
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    kenskens Member Posts: 5,869
    Colin, you still haven't installed that thing?

    Ken
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    locke2clocke2c Member Posts: 5,038
    Nope! hehe

    -Colin
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    esb5esb5 Member Posts: 1
    I recently moved to Boston area with my 2000 Outback Wagon. It's due for the 15000 mile maintenance. There's only one dealer within about 30 miles and they say it'll cost $250...Edmunds says it should be $93!! Should I go to the dealer or should I look for a cheaper alternative (ie gas station??)
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    c_hunterc_hunter Member Posts: 4,487
    The dealer's version of the 15K maintenance probably included uneccessary stuff that goes beyond what's in the owner's manual. They always pad it to make a buck. If you can, look at the 15K maintenance and then order the same services piecemeal from the dealer. At my 15K maintenance, I can only remember needing an oil change and balance/rotation of the tires. Even at the dealer, that should nto cost more than $70-80.

    Craig
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Ask around and find a good indepenedent shop that specializes on imports. Gas stations can be on the "fly by night" side of the equation, while dealers can be pricey. There is a comfortable middle ground.

    -juice
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    ramonramon Member Posts: 825
    hello,
    recently i checked that my coolant is on the low side. Does anyone know the mixture for the coolant to add? We have to stick to the same brand right? But no idea what does our Suby comes with. It's green. =)
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Use 50/50 water and coolant. Don't use pure coolant because it's actually more effective when mixed with water.

    It's the green stuff so regular Prestone, Peak, even the generic stuff will work.

    -juice
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    bluesubiebluesubie Member Posts: 3,497
    My wife took her OB in for the oil pump/camshaft reseal (or whatever it's called :-) ). It was covered under warranty so she got a new cam belt for about $80.

    She also got new front brake pads and rotors. The car has 55K and hasn't had any brake work done yet. I'm glad my dealer recommended changing the rotors, instead of schlocking them up like Meineke did to mine.

    She is now ready for her daily autocrossing on Rt. 22. (For those not familiar, imagine NJ drivers where the posted speed limit is around 50, there are business on both sides of the highway as well as in the median).

    -Dennis
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    mrdetailermrdetailer Member Posts: 1,118
    My subie mechanic says that this is a common problem particularly with the 2.2 engine. He's seen no change yet, but doesn't work on the newest cars of course.

    I would consider using Valvoline Maxlife or Quaker State Higher Mileage Engine Oil. These oils have special seal conditioners and are good for using even in low mileage cars. Considering the weakness of the seal it might help to use the best version of oil to protect the seals. Has many characteristics of synthetic too at a cheaper price.
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    miksmimiksmi Member Posts: 1,246
    Re: theob Jan 31, 2002 10:09am

    Hi Theo,

    I may have already posted this for you but here are the instructions with diagrams. I searched but couldn't find photos of the installation. http://www.scoobymods.com is usually a good resource.

    http://www.subaru-parts.com/_instructions/LegacyAirFilter.pdf

    Try a search on http://www.i-club.com , perhaps in the Legacy forum. Please post what you find here.

    Also, if you have it, please post a link to luck11's original post. I might be able to track down the image based on info in the original post.

    HTH.

    ..Mike

    ..Mike

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    cptpltcptplt Member Posts: 1,075
    the problem is apparently the material the gasket is made of and is not specific to any engine type so much as when it was made (or when the last seal was replaced), Subaru changed it in the last year or two so it shouldn't happen as often with newer cars but with the old material, age primarily causes it to distort and then during high speed runs you start leaking.
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    ramonramon Member Posts: 825
    ok this is really sad. I am confused now. Do i top the coolant via the radiator or the from the spill over tank? I'm getting differing views.
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    ramonramon Member Posts: 825
    ok this is really sad. I am confused now. Do i top the coolant via the radiator or the from the spill over tank? Need to make sure that I don't want to get any bubble in it. I'm getting differing views.
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    miksmimiksmi Member Posts: 1,246
    As long as the tube in the expansion (overflow) reservoir is covered (meaning no air in the tube), fill the reservoir with 50% water/50% antifreeze. If the tube isn't covered, fill the radiator and follow the instructions below about purging (bleeding) air in the cooling system.

    http://www.learn2.com/07/0714/0714.asp
    http://www.beststuff.com/articles/915/
    http://www.autoshop-online.com/auto101/cooling1.html

    Depending on the age of the coolant, you might wish to flush the cooling system; see your owner's manual for the schedule. Drain the coolant into a container and recycle it. Don't drain it on the ground, it's toxic to pets, children, and wildlife.

    ..Mike

    ..Mike

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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    Wow, good resources. You got any ideas how I can pay for my kids' college tuition? ;-)

    -juice
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    miksmimiksmi Member Posts: 1,246
    http://www.google.com is my friend. :-)

    ..Mike

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    rwood1682rwood1682 Member Posts: 3
    Took a look underneath my new '02 Forester yesterday to get an idea of how much room I'd have for working on oil changes etc. and I did not see any grease fittings anywhere on the suspension (at least within easy view from the front of the car).

    Are there joints etc. on the suspension requiring lubrication? I haven't seen anything about chassis lubrication mentioned in my owners manual.

    Lastly, if there are grease fittings, will my good old US grease gun fit them or are they a different size?
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    ateixeiraateixeira Member Posts: 72,587
    It's a unibody, so I don't think that's necessary.

    I spray some white lithium grease on the sway bar bushings each time I rotate the tires. That and the doors is about all I've greased on mine.

    -juice
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    ramonramon Member Posts: 825
    those are some great sites! Ok my next coolant question is, does anyone know how many litres of coolant our EJ25 holds? I like know so that the container i use will not be too small! Also anyone know where the drain plug thingy is on our EJ25s?
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    hammersleyhammersley Member Posts: 684
    Juice: Spray lithium grease? As in aerosol? I'd never thought of that... what a great idea, especially for the sway bar bushings. I'll put it on my checklist for tire changeover.

    Guess that justifies another trip to NAPA.. or maybe Schucks, since Castrol's on sale for .79/qt.

    Cheers!
    Paul
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    mortpeaberrymortpeaberry Member Posts: 69
    I might be seeing the light about synthetic oil (maybe) Q:how often do you change synthetic oil, what about filter?
    Q: Can you use it in a LSD, Does the viscous coupling get new oil, if so what about that?
    Q: And what about front diff/tran?
    just doing my research through the we educated and sometimes biased (towards subies) info boards.
    steve-V
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    hypovhypov Member Posts: 3,068
    Ramon-
    The manual has it as
    6.2 US qt
    5.8 litre
    5.2 Imp qt

    Drain Plug? Love the manual's diagram. It's better I not say what I see.

    -Dave
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    1subydown1togo1subydown1togo Member Posts: 348
    Kfira now has 2500 miles, the time for her first oil change is getting near and I have been
    thinking about putting in synthetic...what are your thoughts re: advantages/disadvantages, and brand.
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    locke2clocke2c Member Posts: 5,038
    Honestly, I am beginning to wonder if synthetic oil is a factor in these common front oil seal leaks.

    Of course I don't have any data on that except my own. I was just wondering it, given the problem and Subaru's lack of endorsement for synthetic. Then again they also don't warn you that it could cause specific problems, they just say they haven't tested it and as such recommend mineral oil.

    -Colin
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    bluesubiebluesubie Member Posts: 3,497
    Good point, Colin.
    I seem to recall Patti mentioning that FHI hasn't endorsed synthetics because they found some of them leaked.

    I first noticed the leak in my wife's OB when I tried Mobil1. At the time, I thought oil was seeping from around the oil pan seal (because of what I read about synthetics cleaning away conv. oil sludge). I switched to Castrol Syntec and the leaking stopped for a while, but returned again within a year or so. Found out recently that the leak was from the oil pump/crankshaft seal. My dealer didn't ask if I've used synthetics and they were familiar with the seal leak problem. I've also previously spoken to the shop foreman about synthetics and he didn't say anything negative about them and said they have several customers that supply their own.

    I doubt that everyone that's had the same leak used synthetics though. Maybe everyone will post again if they did.

    Serge - IMO, I would compare the thickness of synthetics at operating temp., and go with the thicker one (from the Manufacturers product data sheets on-line or by mail).
    I wouldn't go with anything lighter that a 10W30 in FL either.

    -Dennis
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