Isuzu Owners Maintenance and Repair

gpm5 · July 2001

It seems one is sort of hung out to dry in terms of once the other four wear down, the spare will be a half inch larger with the steel wheel spare. Strange on Isuzu's part. If you get an unrepairable flat or bad tire you could go with a new tire and use the new spare, but that means pulling it off the steel rim and reseating it. How bad is that? Essentially, I have a similar situation right now, with one front 684 tire worse the the other, but the other front being adequate as a spare.

gpm5 · July 2001

Does anyone know the largest tire that will fit into the spare case? It is likely what is in there. I saw 255/65 Goodyear Wrangler tires on a Land Rover that look nice.

sbcooke · July 2001

I prefer the 4 tire rotation. This way if I get a non-repairable flat, and buy a replacement, I will have 2 new tires on front or rear and can take the one worn tire and use it as a new spare.

I hoping that I don't get a flat, but that is how I plan to use this tire. It is a valid concern about tire size however, someone here had a problem with the LSD and TOD with one tire being larger that the other, causing the computer to act funny.

sdc2 · July 2001

Or, you can just hope that 2WD will get you home so you don't have to use TOD with your mis-matched spare...

I bit the bullet and bought an alloy wheel for the spare...$269 (ouch!) from St. Charles Isuzu, so the 5-wheel rotation is easy.

gpm5 · July 2001

Question for anyone: With 2 new tires front of back, won't the TOD unit pick up on the difference in rotation for the front vs the back due to wear size difference or will this simply cause a little bit of difference in the 85:15 split?

paisan · July 2001

If the diameters of the tires is more than 1/4" difference in circumference, you will have problems with the TOD unit, and will eventually kill your transfer case.

-mike

sbcooke · July 2001

So if one tire gets blown out, and needs to be replaced, you have to buy 4 new ones? To be clear you are saying that if the fronts have a different 1/4" difference in diameter than the rears is messes the TOD unit up? This sounds viable, but not great. I am going to ask my dealer about this. It isn't just a left wheel vs. right wheel thing?

paisan · July 2001

1/4" circumference not diameter (1/4" diameter > 1/4" circumference)

There are sensors on each drive-shaft that measure the speed of each drive-shaft, if your front tires are smaller than the rear, the TOD system will detect the smaller front tires as slipping and put more power to the rear to try to compensate. The problem I had was that I had an-irreparable flat @ 15K miles, and replaced the destroyed tire, with a tire from my old rodeo that I had. It was a Bridgestone Dueler 684, same tread, size, etc. It also had about 20K miles on it and was bought back in '98. My TOD started to whine like crazy especially noticeable in the 30mph range. Also had problems coming out of 4wd Lo into TOD and 2wd. I thought there was a problem with the T-case, but my dealer expertly found that the tire was a different size than the other's (must have measured them all while diagnosing the problem) He put my spare tire on (which was new, the others were 15K) and the noise was gone, and has been gone for 10K miles.

You should rotate your tires every 5K-7K at most on AWD vehicles, and replace all 4 tires or 5 tires at the same time, because of manufacturing differences which is what we came up with as the problem for my 3 year old Dueller v. the newer ones that came on the trooper.

A lot of people will say "that's expensive to replace all 4 at the same time" unfortunately if you want to play, you need to pay.

(but SB knew that already

)

-mike

gpm5 · July 2001

I'm considering going with the Toyo open country AT tires--all five in the stock size.

Aggressive tread, S rated (106), white outline lettering

http://www.toyo.com/tires/tire_lines/lt_truck/opat.htmlToyo

Toyo makes and excellent tire and has really kept up on the computerized design, manufacturing etc.

A little expensive at Town Fair Tire but with free rotations and damage replacements at no cost except balancing and valves, I think its worth it.

gpm5 · July 2001

I changed the oil myself to Mobile 1 this weekend. We'll see how that does in terms of the consumption. I took off an extension (two bolts) off the front skid plate to easily get to the oil filter. It is nice to have the oil filter protected but tough to get an oil wrench in there.

gpm5 · July 2001

For Paisan's tire situation, it sounds like up to 15k miles on 3 tires and a new fourth was okay. So a flat up to 15k miles appears fine. I would think that unless there was a change in mfg of the tire a two new tires would also be okay at 15k miles, assuming rotation was done etc.

BTW, I would be careful on the Scopion tires, it seems they have changed? their plant to Brazil, and some tires are being sold off now that are made in USA. Anyways with two tire plants, they may not precisely match if they come from one or the other.

Anybody have any thoughts on the white lettering on current model troopers. I haven't seen any like that, but why not go for a new mod!

paisan · July 2001

Well I won't be getting new tires til before moab next spring, so hopefully they'll be on one plant by then.

-mike

raydahs · July 2001

I've seen them on late model Troopers, they look good depending on what color truck it is. I find it interesting that a manufacturer will give the option of advertising for them for FREE (RWL) or not (BWL) just my $.02

gpm5 · July 2001

Since I've been looking under my '99 trooper a bit with the utility light, I've noticed that my TOD unit gasket is leaking very slightly at the bottom. A drop of fluid had built up and it is obvious that it has been going on with some of the greasy build-up there. This should be covered under the 3 yr b to b or the power train, I would assume. It looks like the whole unit needs to be taken apart split (in half) to replace it, and the U-bolts need removed. Anyone else see any greasy film on the TOD unit?

paisan · July 2001

Right now, my whole undercarriage is pretty dirty. I need to put the sprinkler under the trooper for an hour tonight to get the stuff off it from Uwharrie.

Side note, while out there, we went over a lot of hills where the bellie of the trooper was smack against the rock or dirt. A few times I had to muscle my way over them due to my OEM tires. The skid plate is scraped on the TOD unit, but it isn't dented at all. I also have some scrapes on the cross members and a piece of the exhaust pipe as well, but no vital organs were ever in danger of being damaged! Gotta love the troopers.

-mike

twnisbett · July 2001

lanishaw - I have a '92 Trooper V6 DOC with 139K miles on it, and it drives like a champ! I have only owned the truck for 1 1/2 years, but I have had no major problems - I have changed tires, belts, oil; all regular maintenance. I do have some noise on the radio (especially AM) that is tied to PM, but the radio is not the original, so it may have been installed improperly. I also own a '96 Aura SEX with 63K miles. IMHO, you shouldn't have any trouble with long-term reliability.

Travis

central · July 2001

No leaks here. I am not sure what I would do had I found something. Granted the warranty should cover this. However I wonder if the dealer wouldn't just over-tighten the gasket in place and hope I would go away till the warranty expires. On the other hand I also wonder if I would really trust them to pull all that stuff out of there and put it back correctly.

I think I would have at least checked the bolt tightness myself. Granted, over tightening the gasket would be a mistake but if I found a couple of somewhat loose bolts I could solve the problem myself in a few minutes. I would also clean everything off very well and check it in a month. If that works I saved a trip to the dealer and a likely argument about a couple of drips being "normal". If it didn't work I would at least be in a very good position to explain how I know that gasket has to be replaced as it is properly torqued and continues to drip.

paisan · July 2001

I'm with you. I was sooooooo happy, although I didn't believe him at first, when he said that my 1/2" shorter tire was the reason that my TOD was whining. I was glad they didn't have to rip it apart cause they could never put it back together as well as the factory that built it. I too would wipe it, and keep an eye on it.

-mike

sdc2 · July 2001

It would be nice to think that the service places (dealer or otherwise) are both competent and reliable...but even with the best intentions they are human and make mistakes. Here at work we have a fleet of vehicles. Just had our 95 Bronco in, one of the things they did was replace the rear axle seals which were leaking. Unfortunately, they FORGOT TO REFILL THE DIFFERENTIAL! So of course that got toasted, now we have new diff gears courtesy of the shop that screwed up. At least they stepped up to the plate and made it right, which is the main thing I ask of a service place...

gpm5 · July 2001

Well, this service manager says he has replaced the seal on a couple. He says he needs to loosen the U-bolt to get it on, and from what it sounded like, it doesn't need totally ripped apart. I'm not sure how that could be unless the gasket has a break in the circle (maybe). He says he wants to also check if its leaking from a vent from above, so he is being careful about it. He said its only an hour or so job to replace. I feel I can talk to this guy and that he is knowledgable about the vehicle. I also want him to level the two sides of the truck which he said is no problem. I'm sure small leaks like this can be 'normal' and probably could go on for years before needing a fix, but since it will eventually need a fix, and I plan on keeping this truck for a long time, I'm going to get it fixed sooner than later.

I also wonder are there any filters in this unit that would require seal replacement if replaced as standard maintenance?

I hesitate to tighten anything--without a manual on the torque on those bolts. When I was a teenager I replaced valve cover gaskets once and sheared off a bolt head on a V8 engine and learned a lesson there.

gpm5 · July 2001

My trooper alignment is excellent, no pulling etc. My question is, on getting new tires, would you guys trust a tire shop (this would be Town Fare Tire) to do an alignment properly? Some say the alignement should be checked each year no matter. thanks.

central · July 2001

In that you seem to have a good service guy I would ask him about an alignment. Specifically does it need one after the leveling work? I think it might depending on how much the torsion bars have to be cranked to level it out. In which case they should pick up the tab. Also, have them "read" the current tires and tell you if it needs an alignment in any event. Just because it doesn't pull to one side doesn't mean it doesn't need an alignment. I think the key is how even the tires are wearing.

Should you need to pay for a needed alignment I have had good work eventually done by tire shops. However I have had to watch them like a hawk as over the years they have started to set the specs to the wrong model and to a 2wd rather than a 4wd.

As to the bolt tightening I was thinking more in terms of checking the torque to make sure all the bolts were the same. If I found one or two looser than the rest I would probably have just cinched them up to the same torque as the rest. I wouldn't have just automatically tightened all of them. Granted the best way would be to have the factory specs and tighten them to that.

In any event, it sounds like your dealer is going to take care of you.

I wouldn't think there would be any internal filters as I doubt there is a pump requiring one. But you are sure right to think about anything that can be done now as opposed to after the warranty is gone.

raydahs · July 2001

For those who watch Motorweek, there's a segment called Goss' Garage, it can be very informative.

Here's an article on all sorts of alignment issues.

http://www.mpt.org/motorweek/goss/20018.shtml

raydahs · July 2001

I see alot of you are concerned with your rig not being level. Be carefull where you measure from, last night I measured from the front fender flares to the ground and got a 1/4" difference. Then I measured from the bottom of both mirrors to the ground with a 3/8" difference. Then I measured from the frame (at the front door) and got 1/16" difference. I guess what I'm trying to say is, there are more tolerance stack-ups as you add components to where your measuring to.

I think what I plan to do is cut a piece of 2x4 to the length I wish to get the height to. Mine measured 12 3/8" at the frame, I'm going to make the board 13" long and give it to the place that I plan on having the Sway-A-Way T-Bars installed to use as a gauge.

Buy the way, the alignment specifications are located in your owners manual in the back. I'm making a copy to give to the tech, just in case!

paisan · July 2001

What's the current pricing going for? Also anyone have an idea how much a shop might charge to install them?

-mike

raydahs · July 2001

Last week I got quotes of $220.00 @4Wheel Parts + $50.00 install labor + $50.00 alignment. P/N 1549 and they're available now.

gpm5 · July 2001

I've measured from different parts of the frame on each side in the front and the back as well as from the front fender flares. As you say, I get differences but always higher on the passenger side by about a half inch or more. Looking at the torsion bar bolts, I see the passenger side one has less threads exposed (i.e. the nut is not on as far) than the driver side one. Oddly the effect seems to be amplified to the rear of the truck, where the difference in ht is greater than in the front, although there presumbably is no adjustment for the two sides back there. I first really noticed this when I put on the bumper bar, which is almost an inch higher off the ground on the passenger side than on the driver side.

sdc2 · July 2001

Well, I had an alignment done after I cranked up the torsion bars, and I am still regretting it.

My purpose for doing an alignment is to address possible camber changes due to the different ride height. Other than that, my Trooper was tracking straight and true.

I had Sears do the alignment when I had the bigger tires put on, and my Trooper has been pulling to the left ever since. They have put it back on the rack and say "everything is in spec" and have basically thrown up their hands, or blame it on "radial pull", which is a cop-out dating back from when radials were a new thing.

Oh, and they didn't even have to touch the camber, said it was right on. So basically, all they did was screw up what wasn't broken.

I talked to an old-timer who said that you can't rely on a computer to tell you when alignment is good, there is alot more that goes into proper alignment.

So now I'm going to take it to a specialty alignment shop and get it done right...which is what I recommend to any of you. DON'T take it to a shop where they don't know anything more than the computer tells them.

Heck IMHO, given the modest 1" - 1.5" lift when installing OME springs, I really don't think a re-alignment is needed at all!

paisan · July 2001

I haven't gotten an alignment done after the OME and 4 turns of the T-bars up front. No poor wearing, no pulling.

-mike

gpm5 · July 2001

Thanks to central, sdc2, and paisan for your comments. I think I will have the Isuzu dealer check the alignment after the leveling of the sides and just have the tire store do the wheel balancing. You guys make some good points. GPM

breakor · July 2001

The trim height specification is not in the owner's manual. For that you have to have a shop manual (for a 1999 the figure is 129mm/5.08 inches). That is where proper alignment adjustments should start (after checking tire pressures and for any suspension damage or excess play) with setting these heights equal first. That is measured UNDER the vehicle. It is actually the difference between the two bolts on the height control arms.

When I adjusted mine on our used slightly mis-aligned Trooper I first just measured the height from the ground on the lower ball joint bolt. I then cranked the low side torsion bar to match the high side's ball joint height. The trim height then came out right on spec. The Trooper then tracked somewhat better for the few miles we drove it. We then got larger tires and had a tire shop do an alignment. Heaven only knows if they really checked the trim height. It did come back still set where I had it. We have had absolutely no problems since then. However, my wife reported that the shop tried to first do the alignment to the 2wd specs (I sent her in with the pages from the shop manual just in case). Heaven only knows what problems that would have caused had they actually done the alignment that way.

gpm5 · July 2001

I purchased my new tires today. Need to go back for a spare and for the alignemnt. I'm having my Isuzu dealer check the leveling on the two sides. I decided to have the tire place do the alignment after I have the leveling done since they have a good deal, computerized equipment, and are supposed to know what they are doing. The guy was going to start the alignment without the new tires on, which is supposedly fine, but was doing it when the receipt said to wait until next Tues after I had the leveling checked. I asked him whether he was using 4WD vs 2WD specs, and he said there is no difference. Does this sound right? He basically is relying totally on what the computer says after he typed in '99 Isuzu trooper and hooked up some equipment to the wheels. They call it a 4 wheel thrust alignment.

breakor · July 2001

It may or may not be a problem.

First I thought only 4wd Troopers were sold here in 1999. That being the case if your alignment shop only shows one setting that should be correct.

I think the problem at out shop was that their software wasn't that precise. I say that because the alignment report we got back had a heading something like "Alignment Specifications Troopers 1997-2001". So if they put in 1999 2wd their computer might take that. Again whether that would have been a problem I don't know. I only know that my wife caught that on their screen and told them to correct it.

When in doubt make them show you how their numbers equal the numbers in the back of the owners manual.

paisan · July 2001

only in 00 and 01 models

-mike

paisan · July 2001

10pm tonight Chat! Come tell us about your trucks, or if you are a potential owner, we'll be chatting up our trucks. I'll give an overview of Uwharrie!

http://www.edmunds.com/chat/isuzuchat.html

-mike

gpm5 · July 2001

Thanks for the info. Yeah the guy said 'I didn't know they made 2WD troopers' so that seems to make some sense with what he saw on the computer. I didn't know there were any specs in the owners manual. I'll need to check that.

emiura · July 2001

I came across a sketch of Trooper's dimensions. Unit is in mm (millimeter).

http://www.tochigi-isuzu.co.jp/bbs/ubs69gw.jpg

vivayo · July 2001

Do you gain access to the filter from under the truck (2001 Trooper just turned 3,400 miles) or open the hood and reach down? If from below, don't you have to remove a skid plate?
Reason I ask is that it looks like I'll be doing my own oil changes. I don't mind too much, but now I'll have the issue of finding somewhere that will accept the old oil. I had an appointment for this past Saturday morning to take it in to the local garage that does all the work on my vehicles. I dropped it off at 8:30 when they opened and was told it would be 60 to 90 minutes. I went back at 11:30 (they close at 12:00) and they hadn't started on it. The counter girl started making a bunch of excuses - which got my curiosity up. I mean, I didn't say anything and she was really laying it on thick. I waited until 11:45 and when they still hadn't even pulled it into a service bay, I told her to forget it. I took my keys and left. The sign out front says "Honesty Is Everything" but I guess that's just for show. I know the garage changed owners not too long ago, and the old owners lived the sign. Looks like the new owners are taking advantage of the garage's reputation. Well, they just lost one 15-year customer.
Sorry for the rant.
Charlie
P.S. The garage is Kimble's in Clinton, Maryland

raydahs · July 2001

Charlie, It's more of a splash plate (silver one) than a skid plate. It's (2) 12mm bolts to undo it, I do mine in 15 minutes, It's a slam dunk. However, when you do your oil change, make sure the drain pan is lifted off the ground. I took (2) 2x6 pieces of wood @ 12" long to set it on. If you don't lift it, the initial force of the oil coming out (I'm guessing, but it's probably a 12mm thread or 1/2 dia hole) will bounce off the bottom of the pan into the brake rotor. Good luck!

jimmyp1 · July 2001

always leaves oil dripping off that skid/splash plate. It was so bad once that I thought I had a leak around the filter. They won't even do me the courtesy of rinsing it off. So, that being said, I am going to look for another establishment that will take the extra 10 seconds to rinse it off, etc. I hadn't thought of any splashing into the brake rotor. Will make that part of my speech upon introducing myself to the next oil change place.

Jim

paisan · July 2001

Not sure what my places do. I've brought it to 2 different places, both times no mess, no extra skid plate charge, so I'm assuming they took the filter out from the top.

-mike

gpm5 · July 2001

I took the extension off the skid plate when I changed to Mobile 1 the other weekend. You can get to the filter without taking it off from the bottom, but it would be tougher IMO. There are only two bolts holding that plate on and its relatively more efficient to take it off rather than wiping the plate afterwards. I put some lubricant on those bolts, so that they remove smoothly next time.

arktrooper1 · July 2001

I got milk spilled on my cargo area carpet (about a quart) which I didnt notice 'til the next day when the weather had been really hot and I was about knocked out by the odor when I got in my Trooper. I've tried Meguiar's "Car Odor Eliminator" which is advertised (on the bottle) as being "instant and permanent" and in reality is worthless, at least for milk. It didn't work at all. I also tried Scotchguard which usually kills odors pretty well (didn't do much better than the Meguiar's) and Prestone Interior Cleaner. The Prestone actually does the best but when it gets really hot it still smells. I even took the carpet out of the Trooper to clean it, checked in every nook and cranny that the carpet covered and took off the carpet covering the wheel wells to no avail. I visited several websites using a browser to check out odor eliminators and found that most of them dealt with pet urine, etc. Surely SOMEONE has spilled milk or had someone puke in their vehicle before (puke is what it most closely resembles in smell) but none of the odor eliminators deal with this particular problem. If anyone has any ideas or can help me with this problem I'd sure appreciate it. I hate to have to buy new carpeting for the cargo area as well as for the rear wheel wells. Thanks in advance for any info that anyone can provide on this subject:) - Dave (arktrooper1)

gpm5 · July 2001

If the rug is out, try wiping it down with ammonia water, let it dry, and follow that by fabreeze. This seemed to work for us fairly well.

raydahs · July 2001

Dang, I feel for ya bro, just the thought of that smell makes me want to hurl. Not knowing what's underneath the carpet, first thing I would try is Simple Green on the surface of the floor. I'm visualizing that thin film of dried milk on the glass shelves in the fridge, that could be most of your problem. As for the carpet, I use Resolve to clean-up after the Cat lays out a furball on the carpet. Spray both sides, let it dry then vaccuum.

keepontroopin · July 2001

I would imagine that you would be able to get the smell out of the carpet with a little hard work, but does Isuzu still have that foam pad underneath the cargo area carpet? If your vehicle has the foam pad then I would recommend you rip it out and throw it away. You'll never get the smell out of it. Trust me I tried before. In my case it was PUKE. Go to Home depot or a carpet store and ask for a pad remnant. They probably will give you one for free. Cut it to size and put it in. Make sure you wipe down all the metal under the carpet with amonia and water too!

mhiggins2000 · July 2001

I once had something similar, it turns out the milk had spilled into the storage compartment under the rear seats. Once I cleaned that out, the odor was gone (mostly).

cwmoser · July 2001

I emphasize with you about the milk. A few years ago my cat pissed on the passenger-side carpet and what a smell!! Someone told me to use vineager on it - it got the cat urine smell out but my car smelled like a pickle factory for 6 months. Your milk smell will eventually go away. I would leave the carpet out for a while, clean it the best you can, and let it naturally fade away. If cat urine will go away, milk will go away a lot sooner.

arktrooper1 · July 2001

gpm5 - i did forget to mention i bought fabreeze but im going to try the ammonia treatement followed by fabreeze tomorrow - if that doesnt work nothing will - i might replace the underpad if i have to but would rather avoid it cause im so anal about things like that id have to buy the isuzu factory replacement and that cant be cheap! - i did wipe out every nook and cranny when it first happened but im going to wipe again with ammonia water as well - thanks for the advice everyone!

arktrooper1 · July 2001

i take my '00 trooper S TOD in for service monday - in addition to the standard chassis lube, oil/filter change, rotate/balance/front wheel alignment i am going to have the dealer change the transfer case oil as well - the strange thing is although the isuzu manual recommends changing the transfer case oil, the dealership doesnt (in their "service menu") - what they do recommend, however is something called "hub service"(packing the hubs?) @ $45.00, a fuel filter @ $37.86, and "throttle body service" (what?) at $22.50 as well as a valve adjustment which has got to be for 4cyl engines because the 3.5L engine doesnt require valve adjustments, does it? - these last four things i do not plan on having done since the isuzu manual does not require or recommend them - any thoughts on all this from anyone? thanks! - dave (arktrooper1)

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