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Corvettes and all things about them

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    bigmike5bigmike5 Member Posts: 960
    My new 04 baby needed some exercise and breathing room, so I took her down I-65 to the Corvette Museum. Just a nice 75 mile cruise, and I reluctantly kept it under 75 all the way. Early Sunday mornings with a clear blue sky is just a great time to let it go with no traffic and few big trucks. Did a little shopping in the museum gift shop, and went thru the museum again for a little while, then it was time to haul back up I-65. Averaged a little over 28 mpg on the trip. Later I was finally able to get the wife to try driving it. Her only comment was that without the HUD she wouldn't have realized how fast she was going. lol Like 70 in a 55 before I reined her in. At least now she won't feel uncomfortable if she has to drive it. She got a nice Corvette logoed golf shirt out of the deal. Happy 35th Anniversary dear, now give me back the keys.
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    starrow68starrow68 Member Posts: 1,142
    Thanks for the uplifting message. Too bad it didn't go as well for the Corvette team this weekend at Infineon, although all that about things that end well and all. The lack of real crowds at the track on Saturday was a big plus and I did get some pic's but don't know how to post and the Yahoo photo sharing isn't working right now, but hopefully I can fix later. Seeing the race on Sunday on TV with the telemetry and getting a flavor for how fast those cars go into the corners is astounding, although I was surprised that turn 11 was just about the same as for my street car, guess hair pins are like that. Turn 10 which some were slowing to 130mph takes me down to right around 80mph, scary corner.
       The Vette Corral on Saturday had in excess of 150 cars and probably many more on Sunday, great turnout.
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    c5_4func5_4fun Member Posts: 59
    What wax or polish to use on my triple black vette. I use Meguiar's show car glaze on my daily driver which is also black, but want the best shine on my corvette. Any advice on Zaino, Zymol or Griot's Garage products vs. the Meguiar's products?
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    starrow68starrow68 Member Posts: 1,142
    Try the posts from 944 to 950, some opinions!

    Here's waving at Ya!
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    ndmike88ndmike88 Member Posts: 155
    Have you tried Meguiar's NXT? Can be found in most auto parts stores as we as Target and Wally World.
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    c5_4func5_4fun Member Posts: 59
    starrow68

    Thanks for the reference; I should have done a search before I asked.
    Now I have to decide if I keep my '01 or grab a deal on an '04 (and in the process take a bath with 3,500 miles on it). I have an automatic and really want 6spd and HUD, bad! Do you think the "pre-driven" vets will regain fair value after the 2004 firesale is done?
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    starrow68starrow68 Member Posts: 1,142
    Sorry, but I really don't know, but some thoughts. I expect the C6 to sell well so no deep discounts for a couple years, which means 90% of them will be going for close to $50k and a little up from that. Only 10% in the past have gone with base no option units, but may be different, a little higher, first year. So, what gets someone to spend $50k or more to the C5 point not spend $50k? I'm guessing close to $10k will do the trick so figure C5's start at $40k with options which is what they are going for right now. Say 10% annual depreciation and I think the few year old models might hold current values for a couple years since I think you might do better than that today. There is a glut on the market right now I think that will taper off some which will also firm up the pricing some. All just conjecture and things usually have ways of doing the unexpected.
        With only 3500 miles hard to get value out of the car. How to decide what 6sp and HUD is worth, only you can judge. But, I think in the future there will be more 6sp cars on the market since it won't be an extra cost option on the C6, it will be interesting to see how that works out.
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    smokensparkssmokensparks Member Posts: 4
    Anyone know of any reoccurring problems with C5 transmissions? I really haven't been able to find much specific information on transmissions on the internet. Just researching for future purchase.
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    starrow68starrow68 Member Posts: 1,142
    On the C5 trans, auto or six speed? Most who drag the auto do some mods but for the track the 6sp seems to be just fine.

    This article is not on the Vette but makes nice mention of it, so FWIW:
    http://www.detnews.com/2004/autosconsumer/0407/28/g03-224855.htm

    Enjoying driving the C5 for daily driver the C4 should go away this weekend
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    r22549r22549 Member Posts: 42
    I was considering buying an 04 Vette...When I check the NHTSA site I can't find any crash tests..Do they test them..?...Thanx for any help here...
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    avolvofanavolvofan Member Posts: 358
    Haven't heard of any crash tests of a Corvette. Personally, if you are looking at a high performance car, crash test results aren't one of your decision points. I doubt if you will find crash test results for Porsche Turbo Carrera, or Ferrari 360, or Dodge Viper or other cars in the segment.
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    starrow68starrow68 Member Posts: 1,142
    The Corvette is amazing for power and fuel economy, has basic front air bags and most important stability control which is very likely to keep you out of an accident all together. Crash tests don't seem to be part of the agenda for performance cars.
       Good luck in your search for info and let us know if you find any more data.
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    Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    I'm like you guys. When it comes to a performance car, gas mileage, 0-60 times and safety ratings do not interest me. I either like the way it drives, sounds and looks or I don't. It's like when I buy clothes. I feel 'em, try 'em on, look 'em over. But I'm not interested in the "durability wear factor index" from a research lab in Switzerland. When I'm buying a tent or hiking boots, I might be.
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    ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    Not to be contrary, but all those things enter into it for me. Sort of a whole bunch of little benchmarks that remind me they might have down some things right! An example: One spin off from so called "safety" ratings was the cost to insure a 2001 Z06 was 52% cheaper than the dollar equivalent 2001 BMW M-3. While at this level it is far from a financial concern, the savings in insurance between the two, alone (2001-2004) can buy enough gas to fuel a 15,600 mile road trip! :)

    I am also pushing 66,000 miles and the only unscheduled maintenance item, as been (fairly common to the breed) leaking differential seals, covered under warranty. I also do 15,000 mile oil and filter intervals since a 1600 mile new car engine break in. The car has literally been flawless, sans the earlier item. (in this paragraph)
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    graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 13,669
    When it comes to safety rankings, MPG or maintenance, I don't even consider them when it comes to sports cars. For all practical purposes, today's cars are so full of safety equipment, they are bound to be more safe than the cars of even 5 years ago.

    MPG? If that's at the top of your list of "desires", you're probably looking at the wrong breed of car. I'm not expecting Prius MPG numbers, nor will I be disappointed if any sports car doesn't meet EPA specs.

    -Do I like the way the "performance car", performs?
    -Do I like the way it feels?
    -Do I like the way it looks?

    Those are my main priorities.
    2023 Honda Accord Hybrid Touring
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    bigmike5bigmike5 Member Posts: 960
    I am having my neighbor, a Ziebart guy, put on front and rear splash guards on my 04 Vette. He thinks that at least the rear wheels will have to come off for the installation. I read the owner's manual and didn't like the write-up or drawings/pics of where to jack and what to use. He has never done a Vette before in his shop. Is this rocket science or will it be easier than it reads--"cross two support members," etc. I'd normally have the dealer do it, but since it is not a GM accessory I am not sure they would do it. Is this a big deal?
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    ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    Because this is a Corvette thread and I am specifically talking of the C-5 series, perhaps it is you that is looking at the wrong breed of car!?

    I am perfectly aware that the Corvettes are fully capable of 17 mpg and below.:) However it is neat to go 530 miles to Las Vegas 104 degrees from the San Jose area in less than 6 hrs (fuel and nature breaks) 5.3-5.5 hrs actual drive time with two folks, AC roaring and luggage for two weeks, and still get 26.5 mpg!
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    ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    It is only a bid deal if he causes damage. Since there are multiple ways to jack the vehicle,

    1. the best is a 4 point lift with correct rubber adapters or round type puck inserts (you should be carrying at least 1 to 2 of these in case you have a flat on the road.) If the guy really knows what he is doing (which you indicate he does not), dunnage is commonly used. The lift points are very small and hard to get to, so if it were mine I'd buy the puck adapters, but if not the idea is not to put stress on the underbody STP pieces.

    2. next is the front and rear cross member jack points and jack stands under the small triangular parts. I personally use a special cut plywood to circumvent the posibility of metal deformation that spans the cross member pieces

    3. using the puck like lift adapter, you can also just jack the front, one side at a time and since you indicate he will go under the vehicle, put jackstands under either the crossmember pieces and or the triangular shaped area.

    4. there are actually more ways but this should work?
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    starrow68starrow68 Member Posts: 1,142
    There are jack points under the door to the front and rear, behind the front wheel and in front of the rear wheel. These are supposed to get jacking pucks placed in them before using a solid lift surface. If you don't, it 'might' be ok, but note that the puck sits into the open area and doesn't have the lift surface put pressure on the painted panel. I've seen shops use 2x4 spacers but I think you need to just look under the door to see what I'm referencing. Not rocket science but also you don't want to lift the car with pressure on the 'plastic' painted panels.

       As for mileage vs. look and feel, YMMV most Vette drivers I know couldn't guess what mileage the car gets. OTOH as ruking1 notes, getting great mileage and having the performance is a nice benefit that I for one, appreciate. Now, knowing that my last tour of 125 miles at the track used about 14 gallons is just an indicator that I'm working down the lap times. ;)
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    Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    The insurance rates for a C5 vs. a BMW M3 would be based on cost to repair collision damage I think, not safety ratings seems to me. Insurance companies want to know what it's going to cost them to put your toy back together again, since this is theoretically what they've promised you. Obvioulsy, a BMW would cost more to fix.

    Personally, while the subject is unpleasant, I'd prefer to take a big hit in a BMW if I had a choice. But this would not deter me from a C5 if that's what I wanted.

    As for fuel mileage, why on earth reject a car to save 100 gallons of gas a year, or conversely, select a car one is lukewarm about to save $250?

    You gotta go with your passion, not the spec sheets. That has, in my experience, often led people to the wrong decision (for them I mean).

    Hey, I'm back in the V-8 club after all these years! Just bought a Porsche 928. Can't beat a C5 but watch out if I get that stroker kit!
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    ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    Specifically, the insurance company made it a point to tell me both record wise and safety wise the Corvette was safer. I have always understood that the cost to get the toy back to normal was a factor.

    Off topic but I am more than glad I got the Z06 vs the M3!
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    graphicguygraphicguy Member Posts: 13,669
    Ummmmmm.....I'm not sure what you're saying to me?

    All I did was agree with Mr. Shiftright and what the Corvette offers.

    The areas that it may or may not be weak are of little importance to me.
    2023 Honda Accord Hybrid Touring
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    ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    What I am saying is: the expanded parameters are pretty neat also!
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    ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    It is only a bid deal if he causes damage. Since there are multiple ways to jack the vehicle,

    1. the best is a 4 point lift with correct rubber adapters or round type puck inserts (you should be carrying at least 1 to 2 of these in case you have a flat on the road.) If the guy really knows what he is doing (which you indicate he does not), dunnage is commonly used. The lift points are very small and hard to get to, so if it were mine I'd buy the puck adapters, but if not the idea is not to put stress on the underbody STP pieces.

    2. next is the front and rear cross member jack points and jack stands under the small triangular parts. I personally use a special cut plywood to circumvent the posibility of metal deformation that spans the cross member pieces. You can put the jackstands under each of the 4 lift points or under the crossmember pieces front and/or rear or the triangular lift or support points

    3. using the puck like lift adapter, you can also just jack the front, one side at a time and since you indicate he will go under the vehicle, put jackstands under either the crossmember pieces and or the triangular shaped area. If you have a hard time accessing the front from the front (to to no extended jack length) you can access the front crossmember from behind each front wheel. The only concern is jack placement can be a tad tricky due to different lift jack footprints.

    4. there are actually more ways but this should work?
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    avolvofanavolvofan Member Posts: 358
    Well, if you were to add a stroker kit to a C5, the C5 would run away and hide from the 928. I have seen one stroker kit advertised that is CA SMOG compliant that with supercharger puts out 650 hp and 700 ft/lbs. If I were going to modify a car, I would go with the C5 - there are just too many risk areas with a 928 that could turn costly very quick. Conversely, the C5 has quite a following of tuners (such as Lingenfelter) that have already plumbed the challenge of getting 600+ hp and ft/lbs out of the LS6 engine and the rest of the C5s drivetrain - modding a C5 is a much less costly and risky endeavor.
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    ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    I take my car to a well known tuner in this neck of the woods. After getting my car on the lift, with mine in capable mechanical hands, he needed to 1. run an errand: so he combined it with a break in run of a car he was in the process of tuning and invited me to go along. I think I remember him saying it was modded to 650/700 hp and a tad more torque. All I can say is: what a BEAST!
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    Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Well the DEVEK stroker kit will give a 928 500HP and 580 lb/ft torque (at the crank) and has been tested many times over 200 mph, (with aerodynamic enhancements of course) so I think it would be a GREAT and competitive race....but not with ME driving, that's for sure!

    Besides I already paid for the 928. I think I could do a LOT of mods for the $50K I'd need for a C5--hahaha.

    What's a C5 weigh now? Somebody told me that a fiberglass body saves about 300 lbs.

    RE: C5 safety record. What safety record? I thought that's what we were all googling but couldn't find. What do the insurance companies know that they don't get from crash tests I wonder?

    Yeah, I wouldn't buy an M3 either. Too much money for what you get I think.
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    avolvofanavolvofan Member Posts: 358
    Shifty, the insurance companies have loss history data that they have built up over a long period of time. The actuarial decision is really not rocket science. (Especially for a car such as a Corvette where you have a large sample size.) The only time the insurance companies make a mistake is when they bet on the wrong side of an investment. Then you have an operating loss and the insurance companies increase the rates.

    A further reason to go with the C5 over the 928 is Active Handling on the later versions of the C5. The 928 never had anything like Active Handling.
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    ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    The C5 is like 3100#'s. The STP or fiberglass, I am sure, does save a certain amount of weight over like steel type bodies. Less is more in this case.

    "Besides I already paid for the 928. I think I could do a LOT of mods for the $50K I'd need for a C5--hahaha."

    You hit upon a pretty valid point! In fact you could mod say a Dodge Neon to blow the doors off any production exotic ! :(:)
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    bigmike5bigmike5 Member Posts: 960
    Just signed up to attend my first Vette event, the 4 day NCM Labor Day celebration. Perfectly timed, as the wife will be out of town that weekend, and I am only 75 miles away on Interstate 65. Hopefully, I will win one of the two Vettes being raffled--fat chance. A lot of events/tours, etc. were already "full" but I am going to attend as many seminars, contractor booths, etc. as I can during the 4 days. As a newbie I'll probably be more of a gawker than anything else. May leave my wallet and credit cards home though for obvious reasons.

    One of my DC plant friends up in Canada sent me a video off a news program of the 8 Corvettes that got stopped in unison, I think in MN, on their way to a meet somewhere. Nice quality video of all the cars and drivers [bad 15 minutes of fame] and the cops citing them for going 95 mph. Should be defensible though as I am sure the court would understand and appreciate: a. "Its hard to near impossible to keep this car below that speed, your Honor, it needs to breath."; or b. "We just came thru Canada and thought we were still running metric numbers." :) lol
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    Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    I really dislike active handling, especially in a sports car, but not because I am in any way "anti-tech", nor am I dumb enough to argue that it doesn't work.

    It really has to do with my attitude that "if you are driving, DRIVE", don't be driven by a computer. I really WANT to be totally responsible for the consequences of what I do with a car. Gee, GM finally makes a Corvette that is totally fun to drive and then they want to give the computer all the control?

    Modern cars are getting numb-er and numb-er relative to a "direct" relationship between man and machine. I feel like I'm 50 miles away from the road. I know, I know, many people don't want the noise, smell or various unpleasant sensations, but I do, so that's just me.

    Maybe my issues stem from my appraisal work, where I see so many beautiful modern sports cars smashed up by people who really don't have a clue. The active handling didn't really help them, they just went beyond it. In a way, the active handling made it worse, because when they DID lose it, they were WAY WAY beyond their ability to bring it back home.

    But I'll compromise! Active handling for all Lincoln Town Cars!!!

    How about "Retro-Active" handling? If you do something really stupid, your C5 or Porsche goes into "Time Out Default" and you only get 100 HP for a week!
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    ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    The good thing about the Vette is that there is a button to turn it off! :)

    In practicality, I have to agree somewhat with your assessment. It stands to reason that to fully understand and effectively utilize this function, one must pratice making it come on; i.e., "advertently" triggering it. It is sort of like how do you expect folks to do 180's, 360's and 540's unless you practice it. Of course, unless you are on a track or other facility, local law enforcement and or the civilians might not take too kindly to your active handling training session. :)

    I faced this (minor) dilemma with my teenage driver and promptly after one year under her belt driving sent her to drivers school.
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    starrow68starrow68 Member Posts: 1,142
    "modding a C5 is a much less costly and risky endeavor"

       IMO, common misconception is that any thing is less costly or risky to mod. I've now seen several C5's modded until they don't run and from my daughter who dated a Mustang guy, it was even more common there. Then there are those who do part of the job and get to the track with 500+hp and then break the rear end or similar, I know one guy who's on his third Super Charger and now has complete new drive train but is still on stock size tires! Why? Engineers get paid lots to make it all work together and after market may be fun but in most cases will ignore something important, be it C5 or 928, nice looking ride BTW.
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    starrow68starrow68 Member Posts: 1,142
    "I really dislike active handling, especially in a sports car ... "

        Well, from another perspective, taking a $40k to $50k car out to Sears Point with walls at every turn when you've not done much beyond driving at the speed limit makes it look like a pretty nice crutch. Then again I have a vested interest in more than just the hardware. Seeing how many, in the past year and just less than a half, have put very nice wheels into walls or ditches and I'm glad it's there. At the SCCA tracks, Buttonwillow and Thunderhill, where there is much more run off, I will begin testing with it off since I've now taken the slip angle around a few turns in open wheel cars and have a very minimal comfort level.
        Not having it on the public highways when you just might need it in an emergency and are most likely never going to turn it on if you stay even close to posted limits makes disliking it seem just a little too quick to judge, IMO. I've had it on hundreds of times on the track and only once off the track, in a hydroplane situation. Studies now show that 30 to 35% of rollover fatalities would survive with the option. Not something to ignore, even if you think you will know what to do and have any time to do it, when the unexpected happens.
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    starrow68starrow68 Member Posts: 1,142
    Enjoy the NCM, wish I could plan that trip soon but it's just too far from the left coast for my taste. I too read a news item about a long pull over of Vettes, I'm surprised it doesn't happen more often to tell the truth.
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    starrow68starrow68 Member Posts: 1,142
    "How about "Retro-Active" handling? If you do something really stupid, your C5 or Porsche goes into "Time Out Default" and you only get 100 HP for a week!"

       Classic, watch out what you wish for! The C5 now has a recorder that can be replayed after an accident giving data leading up to the crash that has been used in court. All kinds of issues but makes me pause before doing something that just might not pass the WSJ test, how would this look on the front page in the morning? It's a road we are firmly going down as more electronics are added so wishing it wern't so will probably cause many to opt for things like; a "928". Enjoy!
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    ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    From a privacy and justice point of view, the BB issue is pretty scary. For example, if you got rear ended, and the perp was claiming it was your fault and it was not your fault you probably could not use it in this case.
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    gbjerkegbjerke Member Posts: 158
    I have active handling in my Z06, but like Shifty said, it's like a computer driving your car. It's like, "let me mash the gas, trim my nose hairs/talk on cell phone as the AH will correct my mistakes". It does all that but takes all the fun out of taking your car to the limit and YOU are in control.
    I now turn it off during driving schools. It made me feel almost invincible....get stupid and the AH will set you straight, and it really did its job. What fun is that? Someone else driving your car.
    Also, it eats brake pads in a hurry. I went thru a pair of REAR pads in one day...like 4 1/2 hour sessions. These were track pads....suspect I should not mention the name.
    When you eat rear pads long before fronts, someone else is driving. Not good!
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    cvrinccvrinc Member Posts: 16
    I am a long time reader of this thread and it has been very informative for the C5. A little over a week ago, I finally pulled the trigger on buying a new C5 and I couldn't be more happy.

    I had owned a used '68 427 Corvette when I was in college and wished I never sold it. The timing was right to finally buy a "new" Corvette and I weighed the pros and cons of the C5 vs. the new C6. In the end analysis and with the help of this thread, it only made since to buy a solid and fresh C5. For the value of the C5 and the headache of trying to buy an above MSRP first year C6 with who knows what first year problems, it became an easy choice. Especially after I drove one, it was a done deal.

    I have to say that I will never buy a car by visiting the lot and getting into the box with the salesman. I used GM Buypower and did all my shopping on the internet. I found the 3 cars that were exactly what I wanted (color and options) at 3 different dealerships and let the bidding begin. I settled on a good deal, the car listed at $47,540 and with the rebate I got the car at $38,921. It is an incredible value when you compare it to other cars and it is truly the best bang for the buck. The other good thing is it is a fresh car, built on 6-29-04. It still had the plastic on the seats when I arrived at the dealer. The deal was already done and I just had to check the car out and sign off.

    I am really impressed with this car and loving it. I have found nothing wrong with the car and I am in the process of doing a polish and wax job, which is really nice as I am tired of laying under them and fixing something.

    So I just wanted to let all of you know that I appreciate all the good information and look forward to more great experiences with the new Corvette.
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    dorflivesdorflives Member Posts: 5
    Unlike yourself (cvrinc) this is my first time reading this thread. I've finally gotten to a point in my life where I can afford a Corvette if I can find one at a good price. It looks like you found one for a great price, would you mind telling me where you ended up buying it.
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    Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    Yep, that's more what I was driving at. If I do a good lap time with the active handling switched on, who's good lap is it exactly? I think it is the computer's.

    I know an EVEN BETTER device for preventing accidents. It is called the human brain. It comes in various sizes and yes, you can switch it off when you need to--LOL!
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    avolvofanavolvofan Member Posts: 358
    Ruking1, in California at least, there is a very high presumption in favor of the car that has been rear-ended. Absent video recorder evidence of the car in front backing into you, about the only way you could make a claim that the accident was the driver in front's fault would be if there was a data recorder in their car that showed the brakes were not engaged and the car was in reverse and was traveling at a speed of X miles/hour immediately before the accident.
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    avolvofanavolvofan Member Posts: 358
    Shifty, while I understand your desire to apply your skill at driving, there are instances where all the skill in the world will not help. The particular instance I am thinking of is a spin (from say, either hydroplaning or ice). In those circumstnaces, you need to be able to apply braking to two brakes at once, not all four. In the world that exists beyond the track, one does not know with certainty what they will be encountering when they drive.

    I had an experience driving on U.S. 101 just north of San Francisco International where I hit a patch of water at night in a rain storm. The car immediately hydroplaned and I was doing 360 degree turns until the car came to a stop after punching headfirst into a re-inforced concrete divider between the north and south lanes. Needless to say, the car was totaled. Just before the spin started, I was doing maybe 40 - 45 mph in deference to the rain, so, it was not as if I was pushing the envelope.

    Five years later, DSTC became available and I wanted to see how it worked and I tested a Volvo that had DSTC (Volvo's version of Active Handling) in a large empty parking lot by driving into standing water during a rainstorm and the instant the car started to loose control, the engine management system cut the power and the brakes started selective application to stop the spin within less than a car length of when the spin started.

    That made a believer out of me. I will take every bit of help and not argue about whether it was me or the computer that did the driving. How does the saying go???: A liberal on health care is a conservative that got mugged by a catastrophic family illness.... Well, a corollary could be that a liberal on automotive safety systems is a conservative that got mugged by an epiphany of a car crash.
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    Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    My feeling is, and I say this with no judgment intended, or to imply any greater skill on my part (hardly!) that every solo accident is the driver's fault and the driver should not be prevented from experiencing the consequence of his decisions, even if it is a real bummer.

    This is doubly true in my mind in the case of 400-500HP cars like the C5 or Viper or Porsche. If you can't handle it you shouldn't be driving it. Bada-bing, bada-boom! I'm sure a computer could be built to allow a 10 year old to drive an 18-wheeler or even fly a 747, but......

    I treat cars like a C5 with a tremendous amount of respect for its capabilities. I can drive a Porsche pretty fast (I know them better than C5s). Why? Because I learned some things with a rear engine high powered car: You brake in a straight line, you turn in slowly, and you let the car set out of the turn before you punch it. Now how am I ever going to learn that with Active Handling unless I shut it down?

    Why do you think AC Cobra replicas are so incredibly popular? It's the rawness. Even young guys jumping out of modern expensive cars CRAVE IT.
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    bigmike5bigmike5 Member Posts: 960
    If you want to get a starting point to figure out what kind of deals are out there, check out the CorvetteKing; Corvetteconti; and Kerbeck. All are big dealers on the net and you can get a good idea of what the market is like. For a good ballpark, figure $9-10K off the sticker on a coupe and maybe up to $11-12 on a vert. Maybe a little less on a Z06 and maybe $5-6 on a Commemorative edition. GM has had big rebates $4-5K and some depended on loyalty buyers, and I think I read a week or two ago that 0/60 was back. Good hunting, but any dealer should be able to go to the GM computer system they have and find you what you want if it is still out there. My dealer had me the exact car I wanted, found in Ohio about 300 miles away, in less than an hour. Did a dealer trade for some new model Chevy SUV and I had it in no time for $10K off the $49K sticker [that included $1K from the GM credit card]. If you are near L-ville let me know and I will give you my salesman's name and number.
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    ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    "My feeling is, and I say this with no judgment intended, or to imply any greater skill on my part (hardly!) that every solo accident is the driver's fault and the driver should not be prevented from experiencing the consequence of his decisions, even if it is a real bummer."

    So while I agree there can be a lack of respect for these very powerful and sometimes not so powerful machines, using my rear ender example; the actual policy and execution (practical reality) does not make this happen.

    So add to that; say I am DUI,

    (why DUI? 40% of all yearly fatalities are in some way shape or form have alcohol related fault)

    and rear end you with such force that you and I wind up in high probability of injury. I being DUI (and the cause of the accident) will in all likelihood by the force of me hitting you will almost assuridly deploy my airbag cushioning me from injury and all I have to do in the future is to make sure I chose an air bag equipt vehicle so I dont get hurt when I get DUI !!!??? You? well your airbag was not designed to function in a rear ender?... Why do I use rear ending as an example? Because it is probably the most common accident type.
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    Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    My Dream Corvette was a car I saw in Santa Cruz. It was a '58 body grafted to a C4 chassis with C5 power. I thought it was brilliant and so well done (the guy who built it designs and builds amusement park rides, so he knows what he is doing). He combined timeless design with an old-fashioned but workable chassis with no computer gee-gaws and the best Corvette engine ever. I had no problem with the power steering and disc brakes either! Heck of a big job, however, not your backyard stuff by any means.
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    ruking1ruking1 Member Posts: 19,826
    I take it he was using a LS1 engine? I also take it to mean you have no intellectual and or practical concerns with using new high tech power steering and disc brakes, etc?

    It would be interesting to find out why he used a C-4 vs say a C5 chassis? Of what I have read about the C-5 chassis, it is theoretically and practically a 400 # wonderkin. This is not to say the C4 chassis is not a stellar performer.
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    Mr_ShiftrightMr_Shiftright Member Posts: 64,481
    I think the C4 chassis was more feasible for the conversion. I'm not sure you could cut a C5 chassis very easily. Using power steering and disc brakes just makes sense. Since the car is already totally re-engineered and not "stock", why start compromising? There are times when being a "purist" gets pretty silly.
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    starrow68starrow68 Member Posts: 1,142
    I've heard about those using up rear brake pads with AH, just not what happened in my case. I swapped out the stock pads after 6 track days and the fronts were at 50% and the backs at 60%. FWIW I didn't just start driving on track, I took a couple classes and that probably helped in technique. In one of those classes I had 3 days in Z06's and let me assure anyone, AH does not result in good lap times. Learning to drive just below the limits and not engage the system will give you a great advantage in going faster. It's all a matter of approach, mine works for me and I expect it might not be as good for someone else, that doesn't mean I recommend it for everyone. It will be interesting to see if at some point I go faster with it off, then again, the objective is to so fast, safely, at least in my car!
       About letting people experience the results of bad judgement, not very far sighted, IMO. We are all out there on the roads together and saving me and mine from mistakes by others that don't have to be fatal seems like just the slightest bit enlightened. Look up I680 SB at Treat in Walnut Creek about 10 days ago, 4 teens dead and one went to Hosp. critical. Spin which ended under a parked semi rearend. Too bad they didn't have stability control, the computer might have done the driving, to some extent.
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