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Besides, the Cimarron, like, say, the Aztek, is one of GM's big blunders. That makes it attractive in a weird sort of way, to use your words. The Catera, by contrast, kind of slid by rather annonomously. It's unremembered and unlamented. Sort of like that (Chrysler) Maserati TC or late '80s/early '90s Imperial.
I believe I only saw ONE Cimarron during my summer where I viewed thousands of older cars at car shows and cruise-ins. I don't remember seeing any in the couple of previous summers where I saw almost as many cars each summer.
I don't think the car deserves the ridicule heaped on it perpetually by some just like the Aztek doesn't deserve all, some but not all, ridicule. It was NOT a wunderauto but was a sincere attempt to come up with a smaller car to increase Cadillac's market. Admittedly it was not a stellar attempt but was more of an early experiement to see if an upgraded J-body would serve Cadillac.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
They were phased out in 93 and the LH platform was a giant leap forward.
2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Ram 1500 Bighorn, Built to Serve
2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Ram 1500 Bighorn, Built to Serve
Well, I can't disagree with your second paragraph. However, Cadillac's biggest mistake wasn't to use the J-body for an entry level model, but, rather, to not differentiate the Cimarron more from the Js in GM's lower level divisions. For example, if the Cimarron had had more differentiated styling, with more Cadillac cues, a plusher interior and a more powerful engine from the get go it could have justified its higher price. In other words, the problem wasn't in the concept, it was in the execution.
I guess in the 80s it might have been hard to redo all of the body panels and the dashboard as they were cookie cutter square.
These days you can add or remove a few different swoops from the body and the car will look totally different. I mean look at the Lexus ES series and the Camry. Both identical cars under the skin but they look different enough that people are willing to pay a 25-30% premium for the Lexus badge.
EDIT: Just saw hpmctorque's post about the styling, I wrote mine before I read his, exactly my point.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
My '89 GT had nice seating, I always thought. It was a very light beige ribbed corduroy. First car I owned with a split folding rear-seat back, and it actually had a center armrest in the back, although the rear seat was kids-only IMHO.
I liked the rear end styling of the Beretta, if you didn't get a spoiler. Still, it was the smallest car I'd owned up 'til that time and really, for me, too small to be an only car.
I think people felt insulted that Cadillac would think them so naive.
Their 3-Series has dominated the category to this day.
2001 BMW 330ci/E46, 2008 BMW 335i conv/E93
The Seville had changes to the track, suspension, and other things IIRC over the Chevy upon which it was based. The problem with the Cimarron was that there were not many changes to actually make it a better performing car than the other J-cars.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I've read that the Acura folks have decided to give the ILX a power boost, even though the ILX's standard 2.0 engine is more powerful than the Civic's 1.8.
Same for the Buick Verano versus the Cruze.
At least back in the old days, an Integra looked like a more substantial, upscale car compared to a Civic. The distinction did start to blur with the RSX though.
Meanwhile the Elantra Limited shows up and embarrasses the Civic. Whoops.
There was a base level ILX at the DC auto show. Sitting in it, my first thought was, why the hell is this cloth? My second thought was, why the hell is this the same cheap-looking stuff that they'd use in a base-level pickup truck?
And in the meantime, it looks like they really put some effort into sprucing up the 2013 Civic. They had a 2012 hybrid model there, and the 2013's made its interior look like crap.
Interior completely different, even the body panels are all different. Classic platform engineering, and upcontented.
now, whether it is good enough to be a "luxury" car is another story, but it is not a re-badged civic.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
Much better than the 2 generations of the Canada only Acura EL/Acura CSX it replaced that were identical to the Civic except for slightly different wheels, headlights, and a few more options like leather interior which wasn't available here in the Civic until last couple of years.
2016 Audi A7 3.0T S Line, 2021 Subaru WRX
What did you think of the 2013 refresh of the Civic? I thought it was pretty nice.
IMO. they tried to trim costs to compete with the Corolla and Koreans on price.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
GM built 6303 of them in '94, 21434 in '95, and 41,941 of the final '96 model. So, even if there's a big demand for them, there will always be a healthy supply.
I think they'll end up in the same sort of league as the 80's Monte Carlo SS, or the Buick Regal T-type and Grand National. Not the GNX though, as GM only made 547 of those in 1987, and they had performance that was good even by today's standards. In contrast, I don't think a stock '94-96 Impala SS is much quicker than my Park Ave or Ram, or my buddy's Xterra.
0-60 in 7.1 seconds.... so a stock 07+ Camry V6 will blow it away. I still say it's a cool car and I would own one. It is also a great base to start with as you can stuff just about anything under the hood.
Speaking of "sport barges" I also like the 03-04 Mercury Marauder as well. It's performance was actually a bit slower than the SS, but IMHO a better looking car. I was thinking about getting one at one time, but it just never fell into place.
2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Ram 1500 Bighorn, Built to Serve
The old tech/unremarkable performance is a factor too. They do have a look to them though, pretty cool for a boat.
Very low mileage, ultra clean ones can pull $15,000 or so.
Yeah, same here. Although I'd be just as happy with an LT1 Caprice, Roadmaster, or Fleetwood.
I also like the 03-04 Mercury Marauder as well. It's performance was actually a bit slower than the SS, but IMHO a better looking car. I was thinking about getting one at one time, but it just never fell into place.
Yeah, the Panthers in general just seemed like better proportioned cars than those bloated aero GM cars. I think one reason the Impala SS was held in higher regard is mythology. While there are a lot of mainstream cars today that can do 0-60 in 7.1 seconds or less, back in 1994-96 there weren't.
But, in just a few years, all that changed. When Nissan stuck a 3.5 in the redesigned '02 Altima, I think that's what really opened up the horsepower wars in mainstream cars. And by the time the Marauder hit the streets, a V-6 Altima would probably blow it away, possibly the Accord as well. And even the Camry, which held off for a bit, probably wasn't too much slower.
I guess with all the Hemi Chargers and 300Cs out there, none of them will really become collectible, either? What about the ones with the extra-big Hemis? I think they're up to a 6.4/392 CID now in stuff like the SRT-8?
I checked Ebay and you can get an 08 SRTV8 Charger with low miles for mid 20s pricing. That is a lot of performance for the money.
2023 Mercedes EQE 350 4Matic / 2022 Ram 1500 Bighorn, Built to Serve
Well, okay, it's a leftover 2012, but it's not used!
That's more than I'd ever want to pay for a car, unless I was filthy rich (and even then, I think it would take me awhile to acclimate to spending that type of money). But still, for the amount of car you get, that doesn't seem all that expensive to me.
Wasn't black the only color you could get them in for 1994-95? In 1996, I know they had sort of a lichen-green color, and I think a burgundy as well. There was a lady who worked at the parts counter at a local Yates Auto parts who owned one. Dunno if they're still around or not, but this one closed up awhile ago.
Sharp looking car. If I were to get one, I'd go for that green. Even if it's not as desireable as the black.
Which is one reason I'm not in the market for one! :P
BTW, I wonder how much my 2012 Ram is going to lose, after 3-4 years? I've thought about trying to get out of my habit of buying a vehicle and driving it until it drops dead or gets totaled, just to get a little more variety. Plus, I'm starting to get fascinated by the idea of trading before it gets to the age that the maintenance and repair bills start mounting.
Even by the age of 5, this truck probably won't have 35,000 miles on it. Had it 5 months, and it only has about 1600 miles! It's a Hemi, but I'm sure its regular cab, long bed configuration is going to hurt it come trade-in time. To me, that's the configuration a truck "should" be, but these days it seems to be a rarity.
Well, I didn't really care for the 300/Magnum/Charger when they first came out, because the interiors seemed a big step down compared to the old Intrepid/Concorde/300M. I would've considered a used one at the right price, though. I would've avoided the 2.7 like the plague. It was enough engine for my old Intrepid, but in the RWD LX cars, they really needed to make the 3.5 standard. The 2.7 is also a VERY expensive engine to repair/replace when it does fail.
I really like what they did with the 2011 restyle, though on the 300 and Charger, with my preference leaning toward the Charger. In fact, if I had to replace my Park Ave, I think I'd go with a Charger. Honestly though, the 3.6 V-6 is probably more than enough for me. I think it's still good for 0-60 in the 7 second range, and runs fine on 87 octane.
A 4-cyl intermediate, like an Accord, Altima, Fusion, or Mazda6, is probably all the car I need. But a Charger is the kind of car I want! :shades: