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2009 Toyota Corolla

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    kdhspyderkdhspyder Member Posts: 7,160

    I got a warm and fuzzy feeling with the S model. The cheap plastic doesn't look as cheap as it did in the LE. Could be because it's a charcoal/black color and doesn't show. The seats were also very nice as was the moonroof, spoiler, and alloy wheels. It also has the audio controls on the mini leather covered steering wheel. I did have to look twice at the price. $20,974.00. Funny thing was after I walked away our VP of sales happened to be walking back to his office and stopped to look at the car. I walked over and said "be careful when you look at the sticker, it might make you jump." He looked at me and said "Are you serious? $20,974.00 for a Corolla?" "yep, you get the moonroof, alloys and wheels, but the car just behind it is $1000 more." he looks back and there's an Camry LE which stickers for $21,934.00 and says "You're going to have a hard time selling this one."


    This one was a shocker to me too.... but ya know what's even more shocking? This new non-discounted price of ~$20700+ is almost exactly the same as the non-discounted price of the outgoing 08 model.,,, when you equalize the equipment as much as possible. We had our last 08 next to the first 09 S model.
    Here are the numbers:
    2008 Base + FE, CK, SR, BE. AB, VS, AL, CF = $20854 MSRP as per Edmunds
    2009 Base + Package C ( FE, CK, SR, SX, VS, CF ) = $20595 MSRP as per Toyota's site

    Obviously there are discounts and rebates on the outgoing 08.
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    backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    Well, I suppose some people will look at the S and say, "Oh, only $21k, pretty nice car for only $21k." And others (like me) will say, "Holy @#%&, $21k for a Corolla?!? There's lots of really good cars out there for less than that--I'd better go take a long look at them before plunking down over $20k on a Corolla!"

    But as noted, few people will actually pay $21k for an S. I noticed that Fitzmall already has the 2009 Corollas priced at invoice before they even arrive at the dealerships. In a few months, who knows what kind of deals will be available?
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    alpha01alpha01 Member Posts: 4,747
    Mack - at $21K it seems like the Corolla S you drove also would have included VSC and JBL/Bluetooth (in addition to moonroof, alloys, and rear spoiler), which might be signficant for some buyers.

    Just a thought, though I'm still not sold on the redesign. Happy to hear the ride is as quiet as Toyota is touting, and glad acceleration is as good or better than before from the seat of the pants perspective.
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    mcdawggmcdawgg Member Posts: 1,722
    "With massive quality complaints abound, especially a whipping by Consumer Reports for shady quality"

    The V6 Camry and the 4WD Tundra I believe were the reasons that Consumer's gave Toyota a "whipping". If you notice, just about all other Toyota models are rated high for reliability.

    All companies, including Honda (transmission and A/C, to name a few) have had some serious problems. Honda seems to have them resolved, and I am sure Toyota will too. Toyota has publicly admitted to the problems and have said that they will get them corrected. With their piles of cash and know-how, you can bet they will.
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    kasper06kasper06 Member Posts: 30
    I live in the SF Bay Area and nearly all the dealers that I've contacted are selling the new '09 Corolla at MSRP. I came across one dealer in Sacramento that took $400 off MSRP. By the way, the quotes I received were from the dealerships internet dept. I'm looking to buy the Corolla Standard (base model) w/auto trans in silver. I'm not interested in cruise control as I never use it or floor mats ($199 xtra). I can buy my own floor mats for a lot less. I'm not into any frills whatsoever in my cars. The more electronics in your car is just more things to go wrong and those items are expensive to repair or replace.
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    mackabeemackabee Member Posts: 4,709
    It did not have the bluetooth upgrade JBL system but it did have the VS.
    And I drove the LE not the S and the base Matrix. The S just came in so it was not inspected or PDI'D so I didn't take it on the road. I will this friday.
    Mack
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    backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    Well, CA is Toyota Country so I can understand that at least some dealers there are trying to get MSRP for the new Corolla. But some dealers such as Fitzmall are offering big discounts already. YMMV.
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    kasper06kasper06 Member Posts: 30
    You are correct. It seems like everyone here either drives a Toyota or a Honda vehicle. Hopefully in a few months deals can be made once dealers are fully stocked with '09 Corolla's.
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    nippononlynippononly Member Posts: 12,555
    I think it will be more like 6 weeks until those big big discounts will appear on the '09 Corolla (and Matrix) at large dealers, even here in California. But don't expect the manufacturer cash rebate to reappear that is currently running on the '08s!

    2014 Mini Cooper (stick shift of course), 2016 Camry hybrid, 2009 Outback Sport 5-spd (keeping the stick alive)

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    mackabeemackabee Member Posts: 4,709
    Unless the recession hits as predicted then there will be all kinds of dealer cash and customer cash on vehicles. I hope it doesn't get to that or I may have to find me another line of work.
    mACK
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    steve04074steve04074 Member Posts: 2
    Did any of you happen to notice that if you want an '09 Corolla with variable intermittent wipers, you MUST purchase the top-of-the-line $20,000 XLE version??? Incredibly cheap on Toyota's part. Variable intermittents were standard on the '03-'08 generation LE's, which you could easily get for $16K and change. What a disappointment to see this car maker going BACKWARD in the value they're providing for our hard-earned dollars. I feel like I barely recognize Toyota anymore....
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    kdhspyderkdhspyder Member Posts: 7,160
    LOLOL... If....with all the other additional features and improvements to the new vehicle you find the lack of intermittent wipers on some models the sole deficiency and for that reason think the vehicle and the manufacturer are going backward... well... oh never mind. To each their own.

    I guess you really had to search hard and ignore everything else to find this nugget of deficiency. :sick: OH..BTW welcome to the forums. :shades:

    [EDIT]

    I know that I should always check first before taking anyone else's post as being factually correct. The reality of the facts are that even the 5M base models DO have intermittent windshield wipers, but they aren't variable. It's on the window sticker.

    Is your faith in Toyota restored because of this?
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    jaxs1jaxs1 Member Posts: 2,697
    Just consider the XLE as the new LE.
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    backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    Uh... no, it's not restored. Intermittent wipers were a big deal maybe, 20 years ago. Since then, we've entered the 21st century and virtually every car sold in the U.S., even an el cheapo car like the base Accent, has variable intermittent wipers. Why? Because they are a useful feature, allowing precise control of windshield clearing action. Am I going to die if I don't have variable intermittent wipers on my car? No. But after having them for many years, I've grown accustomed to them and like them, and I want my next car to have them.

    I know Toyota is the Master of De-Contenting, but this is getting ridiculous. :sick:
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    kdhspyderkdhspyder Member Posts: 7,160
    As I noted, to each their own. To me they're meaningless one way or another. I use them but it certainly wouldn't be a big deal if they were not there. If I wanted all the other features and Toyota specifically said you can have all the rest but you can't have variable intermittent wipers ... oh wow I'd be devastated. Not.
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    backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    It's not just that. It's that Toyota is telling me:

    * Sorry, you can't have both variable intermittent wipers, a fuel-efficient 1.8L engine, and a stick shift--because the XLE comes only in an automatic.

    * Sorry, you can't get a stick shift on the LE, either.

    * Sorry, we don't think rear passengers deserve a center arm rest.

    * Sorry, if you want body side moldings (which were standard on the previous Corolla) you need to pay extra for them.

    * Sorry, we've made it really hard to get VSC in your region, especially on the less expensive trims, for which we don't include VSC in any option packs, so you'll have to special order a car if you want, say, VSC on an LE.

    * Sorry, we de contented the LE so it's really more like the old CE, and the XLE is now like the old LE. We were hoping no one would notice.

    I could go on, but you get the picture.
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    kdhspyderkdhspyder Member Posts: 7,160
    * Sorry, you can't have both variable intermittent wipers, a fuel-efficient 1.8L engine, and a stick shift--because the XLE comes only in an automatic.

    * Sorry, you can't get a stick shift on the LE, either.

    * Sorry, we don't think rear passengers deserve a center arm rest.

    * Sorry, if you want body side moldings (which were standard on the previous Corolla) you need to pay extra for them.

    * Sorry, we've made it really hard to get VSC in your region, especially on the less expensive trims, for which we don't include VSC in any option packs, so you'll have to special order a car if you want, say, VSC on an LE.

    * Sorry, we de contented the LE so it's really more like the old CE, and the XLE is now like the old LE. We were hoping no one would notice.

    Sorry, IMO these are nits or they are specific decisions made to satisfy the majority rather than the entirety of the buying public.

    The variable wiper issue is a nit to me.

    The question of AT or 5M is simply a question of numbers. More buyers of the XLE ( old LE ) demand AT's rather than 5M's . Discontinuing the the 5M in this trim is just sound business.

    No 5M on the LE ( old CE )...same thing, a sound business decision.

    No rear seat center armrest, a nit and a business decision ( see below ).

    No BSM's - nor are they standard on the Camry and that certainly hasn't hurt it's sales at all. That being the case this extra cost is something that doesn't have to be incurred since the buying public doesn't seem to care one iota. A nit and a sound business decision.

    VSC in Chicago region... this is a local issue which will resolve itself over time as the public speaks it's mind. If a lot of buyers ask for it and sales lag due to the lack of it then the local poobahs will add it to more option packages. This may not be the best business decision the locals ever made but it's not cast in stone. It can be changed on a month's notice and every store can change it on it's own.

    Trim name changes... It is a slick little move but so what. A nit.

    One of the key purposes of the Corolla beyond selling itself is that it has to drive buyers up into the Camry line. The Corolla supports the flank of the Camry which is still the center of everything here in NA. The Corolla can have all kinds of new upscale features for the same money or even more money than some Camry models but it should not/cannot be the equal to the Camry. It has to be a lesser equal.
    If a buyer wants more room...then the Corolla is not the right vehicle.
    If a buyer wants a smoother nicer ride...ditto
    If a buyer wants a rear center armrest...ditto

    The Yaris serves the same purpose for the Corolla.
    The Camry does the same for the Avalon/ES350.
    The RAV does the same for the Highlander.
    The Tacoma does the same for the Tundra.
    etc...
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    backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    Maybe Toyota will find out that buyers want things like a MT in a well-equipped small car that offers excellent fuel economy w/o requiring tacky plastic parts hanging off the bottom of the car, or features like variable wipers or armrests w/o having to move up-level or to the next class of car size-wise, and they'll vote with their feet. And that the things that Toyota considers nits are more than nits to people shelling out close to $20k for a car.
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    windjammerwindjammer Member Posts: 25
    backy it really doesn't make any difference what Toyota does or doesn't do. You still have that syndrome of "Beating a dead horse" You dislike Toyota's and spend a lot of time and energy trying to make your point. However it's the same rhetoric over and over. Like people have been telling you if you don't like the Toyota "BUY SOMETHING ELSE" It is really that simple.
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    kdhspyderkdhspyder Member Posts: 7,160
    It's not like Toyota along with Honda are new to this subsegment of the market. They just about invented it. I'd go with their collective market knowledge over our individual 'preferences'. This is the same discussion as the prior one about performance vs utility. In this subsegment they obviously have made the conscious decision to go after a larger part of the market that wants ATs at the expense of intentionally ignoring that smaller part that wants 5Ms.

    These types of decisions are not made in a vacuum or done by mistake "Hey where are the 5M's? Didn't anyone build any?' They're done intentionally.

    But I do realize that if one were to be looking for negatives such things no BSM's and VIW's only on some models these might be found to be major catastrophes and disasters. OTOH they might also be nits that the buying public just doesn't care about in a vehicle designed for economy, durability, rock-sold reliability and not a lot of frills. For those wanting more of certain things there is the Camry.
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    kasper06kasper06 Member Posts: 30
    I'm a bit apprehensive right now about buying an all new car when it just comes out. I am fully aware of Toyota reliability particularly for the Corolla. I've always used the rule of thumb to never buy a new car the first year it comes out. Is this old thinking or is it still best to wait even for a Toyota product? I know in the recent past even Toyota and Honda have experienced some first year glitches or issues.

    Thanks in advance for any advice.
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    backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    If you want to see the same things over and over, go read some of the posts from our resident Toyota salesperson.

    Maybe our Host could rename this discussion "Positive Comments about the 2009 Corolla", then if anyone says anything about the Corolla that isn't complimentatry, voices any concern or issue, you could object on the grounds of being off-topic.

    Maybe that's one reason I haven'tt owned a Toyota in over 20 years even though my first 3 new cars were Toyotas, and I would own a Prius today if it were not for pipeline delays--I kept hearing "if you don't like it, go someplace else". So I did. Looks like I'll have to do it again when I buy a car this year. Too bad, too, because I really liked the two Corollas and Celica that I owned.
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    steve04074steve04074 Member Posts: 2
    hi-- Thanks for your response. I'm pretty sure I was clear when i typed variable intermittent...not the fixed intermittent that you refer to in your response to my 1st post. I can't tell whether you're just being sarcastic or not, but of course the lack of variable intermittent wipers would NOT be the sole reason for me to not purchase the '09 Corolla. I was making an attempt to point out that as many manufacturers add content or improve content, here is an instance where Toyota is going the other direction.
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    kdhspyderkdhspyder Member Posts: 7,160
    I understood what you said but I was highlighting how minor the annoyance it might be for some - a nit - when you imply that both the Corolla and Toyota itself is going down the tubes due to the lack of variable intermittent wipers as a decontenting when in fact as compared to the last Gen9
    it's larger
    it's more powerful
    it has far more standard and optional safety equipemnt
    it has more standard and optional amenities
    in some cases it costs less than the outgoing model ( MSRP to MSRP )

    But nevertheless because some models don't have variable intermittent wipers you state in the title of the post that the vehicle is decontented. Please.
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    mackabeemackabee Member Posts: 4,709
    You shouldn't worry about "first year" problems. In reality the 09 is a two year old design. It has been selling overseas since model year 2006. I doubt there's any bugs.
    Mack :shades:
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    mackabeemackabee Member Posts: 4,709
    Backy, sorry you won't be buying a Toyota. We're gonna miss you.
    :cry:
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    backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    I didn't say I wasn't going to buy any Toyota... but purchase of a Corolla doesn't look too promising right now, since it looks like it would take about $20k to get a car equipped like I want it, and there's other, better choices at that price IMO. I definitely have my eye on the next-gen Prius for my wife's next car, sometime in 2010-11 or whenever it's available. If it really gets 90+ mpg as rumored, I could even put up with fixed intermittent wipers. ;) But I expect that won't be an issue on that car.
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    ike3ike3 Member Posts: 81
    Any word if heated outside mirrors are standard on LE/XLE trim levels? Or at least available as a winter package on any trim level of the new Corolla?
    Soon to be current and previous generations do not/did not offer it at all. Anyone know? Someone in Toyota sales know?
    Also...is VSC a rare option to find so far? Northern US zones are more likely to feature this option than those that reside in the southern US. True?
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    raceraceracerace Member Posts: 1
    Has anyone bought one yet? I'm looking at the S model and wondering what kind of deals are available.
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    backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    Also...is VSC a rare option to find so far? Northern US zones are more likely to feature this option than those that reside in the southern US. True?

    You may not be able to count on VSC being easy to find in Northern US states, depending on which state you live in. For example, I live in MN, in the Chicago Region, and it appears for now at least that VSC is pretty hard to get, given the package offerings on that region. But that can change over time. If you aren't in the Chicago Region, you may have better luck. Also, as was noted earlier, it's possible in many states to special order a Corolla with the equipment you want, if you're willing to wait 2-3 months.

    As for heated mirrors, toyota.com says that they are available in package(s) but not standard on the LE and XLE. You'd have to check the packages available in your region to see how to get the heated mirrors.
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    jaxs1jaxs1 Member Posts: 2,697
    You cannot really "special order" them as in meaning they will make changes to build one specifically for you with the options you wanted.
    The region's option packages are changed periodically during the year, so it's possible that VSC or something else you wanted might be available in your region 3 or 6 months later even if it's not today.
    When you "special order" the only thing that's happening is that your name is put in a queue for when a car that's built with the options you wanted gets produced.
    They will not build it because of your request and you need to have alot of time on your hands to even attempt this.
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    backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    I didn't say that Toyota would make changes to build one specifically for me with the options I want, did I? I am pretty familiar with how the "special order" process works, after trying it on a 2004 Prius. It was a long queue, made a lot longer (in time) when Central Region changed their package allocations after I placed my order. So I think the post from someone earlier about 2-3 months wait time for a special order should be considered best case--it could take a lot longer.
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    mackabeemackabee Member Posts: 4,709
    Easy backy! put the whiskey down and step away from the blonde!
    :shades:
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    backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    Not blonde--too boring. Cranberry red maybe. Tan is OK for the interior though.
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    hailalmamaterhailalmamater Member Posts: 11
    Toyota is going downhill, and has been for a few years. Looking at the 2009 Corolla for the first time today at the Chicago Auto Show just confirmed it. What a joke. $21,500 for a car with worse interior materials than the prior model (whats with the hard plastic dash?), a terrible front seat and driving position, and nothing really special on the options list. What the %$#$ is Toyota thinking about. The Saturn Astra is a better car and cheaper (and I own a Nissan Murano and Toyota RAV4 before anyone makes snide comments).
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    backybacky Member Posts: 18,949
    Are you saying the driving position on the 2009 is worse than on the prior generation? Didn't the telescopic wheel help? I thought it would. The driving position was a deal-breaker for me on the prior generation Corolla.
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    lls57lls57 Member Posts: 57
    I was at a dealer today, and every car they had (six or so) had VSC. So, at least in Phoenix, it's not a rare option.
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    lls57lls57 Member Posts: 57
    I currently have an 03 Corolla, and the driving position in the new one that I was in today was much better, espectially with the telescopic wheel.
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    kasper06kasper06 Member Posts: 30
    Agree 100%!!! The driver's seating position is a VAST improvement over the 9th gen Corolla. In my opinion, the new '09 Corolla overall is a big improvement over the previous generation, i.e. comfort, refinement, quietness, quality, etc. I've now driven three of the new Corolla's and the more I drive it the more I like it. Toyota did a really outstanding job with this new Corolla. I am very much sold on this car!
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    kdhspyderkdhspyder Member Posts: 7,160
    The Astra is going to be an unmitigated flop. Try finding a cupholder. One of the big complaints on the GM boards is that they brought this over directly from Europe where they don't use cupholders. Try keeping up with the Corolla. The Astra is on the porky side and not all that quick. Try being anywhere near the Corolla in fuel economy ( see porky note above ). Try finding BlueTooth or Navi or leather in any Astra. It's a generation late.

    But you will be missed. Thanks for your comments. :shades:
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    kdhspyderkdhspyder Member Posts: 7,160
    [EDIT] OK there's ONE cupholder in the entire vehicle.

    Edmunds summary from it's first drive last Fall.

    In the meantime, the 2008 Saturn Astra is a real alternative to the popular Honda Civic, Mazda 3, Toyota Corolla and VW Rabbit. Is it perfect? Nope, it isn't even the best car in its class, but it is the best small car GM has ever sold in the United States, and it's worth a look.

    This vehicle is going to displace the Corolla?? NOT!!
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    jaxs1jaxs1 Member Posts: 2,697
    Does anyone know if you can make outgoing calls using voicetags and/or speaking the phone number digits?
    Can you import your contacts from your mobile phone (address book transfer)?
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    mackabeemackabee Member Posts: 4,709
    You can make phone calls using voicetags or speaking the phone number digits. Go to www.toyota.com/bluetooth and there is a list of phones which will allow you to download your phone contacts. Check to see if yours does otherwise you have to program them manually.
    Mack
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    jaxs1jaxs1 Member Posts: 2,697
    That web page doesn't work
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    alpha01alpha01 Member Posts: 4,747
    a Corolla Standard this weekend while a buddy was test-driving a 4Runner. Overall, the materials quality was fine, in my opinion, and the fits seemed very good. I'm not a fan of the mechanical feeling of the airflow direction knob, I prefer the electronic feeling of the similar knobs in other Toyotas. I still think the features pacakging on this generation is odd, as this $16,509 Corolla Standard 5M had manual windows, but heated power and foldable side mirrors. (I'm glad foldable is back, this is a boon in cities with tight streets). One thing I hadn't previously realized as well is that the 1.8L 5M is rated 26/35 while the 1.8L 4A is rated 27/35. Interesting.

    A while back I remember a question about the remote keyless entry integrated key, and whether or not it had a trunk release. According to the 2009 sales brochure, there is indeed a trunk relase on the remote key/keyfob.
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    lls57lls57 Member Posts: 57
    I am the proud owner of an 09 LE. We thought we wanted an XLE, but went down to the dealer to check out the LE that he had, as no XLEs had come in yet. The car had a fair number of options: keyless entry, the all weather package (including heated side mirrors, a definite "who cares" in Phoenix), floor mats, cruise control, AM/FM/ in-dash 6 CD changer, moonroof, and VSC. All in all, MSRP was $19,534, a rather hefty price for a Corolla, but definitely one with a lot of comfort and safety features.

    So far, I have driven it a grand total of about 25 miles. My first, very brief impressions: The car is much quieter than the previous generation. That was my one pet peeve of my 03; it was very noisy on the highway. This one is surprisingly quiet, even though I had been reading for a while about how much quieter it is.

    It doesn't seem quite as quick to accelerate, but I'm not sure if I'm just being influence by all that I've read about it's quickness. It still is quite satisfactory, and if I were really worried about quickness, I wouldn't be buying a 1.8l 4 cyl car.

    The comfort behind the steering wheel is quite noticeable. It's a big improvement over the 03 I had. You also can notice the extra width, it doesn't feel near as cramped inside.

    Fit and finish looks pretty good. Quality of materials, not so great. I'd like it better, but that seems to be the way most cars are going. The instrument panel is much better (I never did get where I liked the green on white on the 03). The amber is much easier on the eyes. I like the multi-information display, although I have to agree with what someone else said, it would have been better if they had left the clock on the radio, instead of making it just one of the choices on the display.

    Overall, it's a definite upgrade from Gen 9. Hopefully it will be just as troublefree for the next 100,000 miles as my 03 was for the last 100,000 miles(well, 93k actually, but 100k sounds better)
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    jaxs1jaxs1 Member Posts: 2,697
    Have you taken it up to full highway speeds of at least 70 mph? Is it still quiet at those speeds (tire, road and engine noise)?
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    kasper06kasper06 Member Posts: 30
    Congratulations on your purchase! You must be pretty excited! Did you end up paying full MSRP? Were you able to even negotiate the price? Once again, congrats and enjoy your new Corolla. :)
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    lls57lls57 Member Posts: 57
    Yes, I have taken it up to 70. That's the first thing I did on the test drive. The dealer is right on I-10. And once I bought it, I had to drive about 15 miles on another freeway to get home. The difference between my 03 and this one is night and day as far as how quiet it is. Compared to other cars, my experience is more limited, but compared to it's old self, it's a vast improvement.

    Lester
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    mackabeemackabee Member Posts: 4,709
    Sorry about that. This is the correct link: link title
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