Could you please let me know which insurance company offers GAP insurance? I looked online, but it shows that not all the insurance companies provide that coverage.
I am get a lease offer on 2010 Toyota RAV4 Limited 6 cyl, 4x4, with leather and everything except for Navigation. The price I am getting is initial payment of $1200 (including first month) and then $298 a month for 36 months 12k/year lease. I live in New Jersey. They are giving the one on the Showroom display. They came down from a initial price of $1500 down with $332 to the current price. Can anyone tell me if this a good deal? Thanks
First, I like to thank everyone who participates in these forums for providing helpful information, so people like me can become educated about the leasing process. If you head into a dealership without being extremely informed, they will take advantage of you.
Anyway, I just leased the Rav listed in the subject line. From what I can determine the pricing was as follows:
Manufacturer's Suggested Retail Price (MSRP) = $31,739.00 Negotiated Price (Capitalized Cost) = $30,914.50(Incl doc, acquisition) Down payment (Capitalized Cost Reduction) = $1,000.00 Toyota Incentive for recent College Grad = $1,000.00 Worth, after Depreciation (Residual Factor) = 63% Term (months) = 36 Annual Interest Rate I = 0.816% or MF.00034
Monthly Lease Payments = $264.38 Total Monthly Payment = $287.84 (8.875% added, for taxes) + DMV costs
This is how I approached my negotiations with the dealership. I first went on to Edmunds and used the TMV pricing tool to find out what I should be paying for the vehicle I was interested in. I think the biggest mistake people make when leasing a vehicle, is not realizing that they still have to negotiate the selling price.
I printed out the report and used the rates provided by Car_Man to create a spreadsheet to calculate my lease payments. I took both of these printouts with me to the dealership. I let the dealer make an offer, which of course was completely out of line with what I was expecting to pay. He was looking for $340 with $2,500.00 out of pocket or $440 with nothing down. I pulled out my paperwork and told him if he can't come down to my price I was going to go somewhere that would. He called in his manager to review my numbers. After going over the paperwork, the manager commented on how nice it was to have an educated consumer come into the dealership, yeah right!
My only regret is that I ultimately wound up negotiating based on the monthly payment, so I don't truly know what I paid for the car. However, I was able to plug the numbers I did know into my spreadsheet (i.e. MSRP, Cap Red, Dep and MF and Payment) to figure out what should be the negotiated price. I can only guess at what the Doc and Acquisition fees were.
Hey Car_Man, do you know what the Doc and Acquisition fees are for NYC?
Brandon - Can you let me know what NYC dealer you got this deal from? Also, can anyone confirm that the 2011 RAV4 will be available starting on Sept. 20?
Car_man or anyone - do you know if Toyota has any lease incentives for September on 2010 RAV4s? I need a base RAV4 4-cylinder, 4x2 or 4x4. Looking for money factor and residuals.
I'm not Car_man but let me throw in my 2 cents. The Toyota acq fee is $650. And, unless I'm mistaken, I believe that the state of NY limits the dealer doc fee to $75. If so, this means that your selling price is about $30,189.50. My guess is that you could have done better. You should check Edmund's invoice price as well as incentives offered for this vehicle. Also, check overstock at zag.com for competitive low pricing in your area.
One other comment...
Please be advised that NY taxes the sum of the taxable payments which is due at lease inception. As such, they do not tax payments and, therefore, do not collect the tax as payments are received. You didn't provide the model year. Judging by the residual factor, though, I'm guessing a 2011 model year. You should ask the dealer to itemize all charges including the doc fee and acq fee. Your lease should flow as follows...
Amounts Capitalized Dealer Doc Fee.............................. 75.00 Toyota Acq Fee............................. 650.00 NY Sales Tax @8.875%................ 1,104.45
Gross Capitalized Cost.................. 32,018.95 Cap Reduction.............................. 2,000.00 (includes college grad incentive) Adjusted Capitalized Cost............. 30,018.95
I should have been more clear, my final payment is $287.84. This figure already includes the tax. According to edmunds the TMV price should be $29,900.00. I realize I paid about $350.00 more than that, but I still think it's a good deal, especially when you consider the extra $1000.00 incentive. Also, I wasn't sure exactly what the doc fees were when I ran my numbers, so I over estimated when I presented my target price. I didnt know that NY limits it to $75. This is my first car purchase/lease, so lesson learned. I will have to get'em next time lol...
Using the tax scheme you gave me along with the doc and acquisition fee. I came up with the following breakdown. Also, just a side note this is a 2010 model...
Capitalized Cost Reduction Down Payment..........................................$1,000.00 Toyota Recent Grad Incentive......................$1,000.00 Total $2,000.00
The college grad incentive is subsidized by Toyota and has nothing to do with the sell price. Your numbers are off somewhere. Are you sure about the NY sales tax of 844.69? Here's what I have based on your revised info...
Amounts Capitalized Toyota Acq Fee............................. 650.00 NY Sales Tax @8.875%.............. 1,103.45
Gross Capitalized Cost.................. 32,007.76 Cap Reduction.............................. 2,000.00 (includes college grad incentive) Adjusted Capitalized Cost............. 30,007.76
We disagree on the bolded items. This is a fairly simple and straight-forward NY lease and I've never been off on my NY calculations. I'm certain that something is wrong and it appears to be your NY sales tax of 844.69. Where you're getting 844.69 is a mystery to me. It could be that the dealer used a sales tax rate different from 8.875%. However, I tried different tax rates and was unsuccessful in producung 844.69. So, only God knows where it came from. This, of course, will cause the monthly payment to be different.
If you're inclined, you can check out my post regarding the calculation of NY sales tax at...
Note that the 28,904.31 is the adjustable cap (i.e., 30,007.76 - 1,103.45) corresponding to the taxable payment of 264.09.
When did you finalize the lease? I pray this doesn't happen, but don't be surprised if the dealer calls you claiming that they made a mistake. If so, they should eat the difference. I learned a very long time ago that if you make a mistake in business, you eat your mistake and rightly so.
The 844.69 is not accurate. It appears that it was determined as follows...
term x (payment including tax - taxable payment)
36 x (287.84 - 287.84/1.08875) = 844.56
The 0.13 difference is attributed to rounding error. Anyway, that's not the method NY uses to compute sales tax. Is this a dealership number or is this a number that you calculated? I find it hard to believe that the dealer calculated the 844.69. Also, where is the tax on the $2,000 cap reduction which amounts to 177.50? There is no way that it's included in the 844.69
Here is the issue. When I looked over my lease agreement it just listed my monthly lease payment plus the DMV and Doc fee. I tried to use the figures I did know to determine the exact selling price. After looking through my paperwork a second time, my customer disclosure does list the following tax all capped into the lease: Cashdown Tax $177.50 Upfront Tax $918.61
I will list all the numbers that I know for sure base on my paperwork and hopefully you can let me know exactly what the sell price was. I will try to do the same on my end and see if come up with the same #
Msrp $31739 Sell price?
Amounts Capitalized Toyota Acq Fee............................. 650.00 NY Sales Tax 8.875%.............. $1,096.11 Gross Capitalized Cost.................. ? Cap Reduction.............................. 2,000.00 (includes college grad incentive) Adjusted Capitalized Cost............. ?
Residual Factor........................... 61.56463%% (based on purchase opt below) Residual value............................ 19,540.00 (Purchase Option On Customer disclosure)
Apparently, 19,995.57 isn't the residual value because, if the purchase option is 19,540, then there is no way that the residual could be 19,995.57. I have a feeling that we've been doing lots of guessing. As you know, in order to get credible results, the input data must be spot-on. If you have already signed the lease agreement and have taken delivery of this vehicle, you should have a copy of the lease agreeement. By law, they must disclose the gross and adjusted cap as well as the residual value and sell price which is called the Agreed Upon Value in your lease contract.
Does Toyota charge a purchase option fee? If so, that would also be disclosed in your contract and the 19,540, in all likelihood, would reflect the residual value plus the purchase option fee. Residual factors are always whole percents (e.g., 61%, 62%, etc). When I divide 19,540 by several whole percents, I always end up with an MSRP that includes change. For example, 19,540/0.64 = 30,531.25 makes no sense because the MSRP is always a whole number. Based on the 30,531.25, I'm able to get a payment of 287.84 which corresponds to a unique sell price of 29,574.17. The problem is that the sales tax is 1,080.22 which is different than your 1,096.11. Therefore, it's unlikely that the 19,540 is the residual value. And so, we now have two unknowns: sell price and residual value.
Also, if you're telling me that your monthly payment is exactly 287.84, then your taxes must be about 1,080.20. In order to maintain a payment of 287.84 requires that the residual be increased (decreased) if the sell price is increased (decreased). This suggests that the taxable payment is about 257.46. So, it's highly unlikely that the taxes amount to 1096.11. Something obviously isn't right.
Did you have any dealer installed options because dealer installed options are usually not fully residualized. Another problem with TFS is that they don't residualize the destination charge or floor mats and so these are deducted from the MSRP. That, when added to the cost of residualized dealer installed options results in what is known as the Adjusted MSRP. This, when multiplied by the residual factor, yields the residual value.
I suggest that you check your lease contract. If you haven't taken delivery or signed your lease agreeement, I would recommend asking the dealer for their LEASE WORKSHEET. This is a computer generated document that will tell you everything and then some and will eliminate a lot of guess work.
If you have the lease contract or can secure the dealer's lease worksheet, I'll be happy to evaluate them if you like. Simply email them to me at...
Hello all, I am trying to help my parents to lease a 2010 Rav4 AWD Ltd. with evp #2.
They do not know much about the whole leasing process so am sure the dealer will have a field day if they just walk in uninformed. MSRP is $32kish for the car they saw.
What should they expect to pay? Located in NJ so 7% sales tax. They are willing to put up to $2k for all sign off fees including tax etc.
I am assuming they should be able to get under $300/month given what I have read on this forum.
Any advise or help would be greatly appreciated. thanks
I visited a dealer in New Jersey this weekend exploring my options for the RAV4 Limited edition. They used 64% to calculate the residual on a 3-year, 12000/year lease. [62% for a 3-year, 15000/year lease.] However, they calculated the residual using a value that was about $1300 less than the MSRP. I didn't notice this until I looked at the worksheet when I got home. I emailed the dealer for an explanation but haven't heard back yet. Has anyone seen this before? (According to the worksheet there are no dealer installed options.) Also, they used a .0002 as their money factor. This makes the interest costs on this lease almost irrelevant at about $9/month. And it also means that $1000 of fully-residualized options will add just over $10 a month to the lease price. So moving from the base model to the limited model should add only about $40 a month to the lease price.
I'm pretty sure that Toyota does not fully residualize the MSRP as they deduct the destination charge and the charge for floor mats. Increased residual, all else constant, means lower payments.
Here is the deal I got today. Seems to be pretty good. 2010 Rav 4 LTD V6 4x4 with val pack#2 and some other addons.
MSRP $32568 options : BC,QZ, TO, B3, CF, P7 (XM satellite radio kit )
Cap. cost $ 29945.14 aquisition fee $650 Doc $299 Taxes $852.52 All other fees(NJ reg and title) $421 Residual $19260 Money factor .00020 36 mo. / 12000 miles per year $1000 out of pocket $336 per month ( tax incl.)
1) I am looking for a 4 cylinder Limited with Value package 1 (leather, JBL, moonroof). The MSRP is just under $29,000. Given the high residuals, low money factor and end of year pricing, should I be able to lease this vehicle for $300 per month with zero out of pocket (sign and drive) for 12,000 or 10,000 mile lease? What is the lowest true sign and drive number anyone has gotten? I am in Massachusetts.
2) Should I expect the deals to get better in October (sell price at $1K or $2K below invoice) due to oversupply? The 2011 Rav4s are now at the dealers, and there are around a 1,000 2010 Rav4s within 50 miles of Boston according to Autotrader.com.
I'm in the NYC suburbs; my lease costs $206.00/mo. with $1100 down. 36 months; 12K/yr; $15K residual on a $23K price + the 2 year's service Toyota seems to be giving with all new vehicles. Although it's just a Base model, I'm very happy with this deal.
Yes , you got a very good deal if compare with mine. I leased on September , 2 in Staten Island Toyota 2010 Rav 4 LTD V6 4x4 with val pack 1 , camera etc. Out of pocket $2184, monthly payment $345( incl tax) , residual $19184. Where did you get this deal in NJ?
Currently leasing a 2008 RAV4. Thinking of leasing a 2010 RAV4 4WD Limited V6 in Michigan. Includes backup camera, Extra Value Pkg, Tow Prep Pkg, floor mats, and 15k miles for 36 months. The price I got includes all fees and taxes. MSRP is $31,109. With $2,000 down, monthly payment would be 339.53. Residual is $18,200. Interest rate is 1.9% Is this a good deal - - can I do better? Also, the salesman said the front tires on my 2008 RAV4 look worn, so he will charge me $600 for new tires, plus $400 for incidentals bumps and scratches. What do you think?
I don't think it's a good deal. But to compare deals you should consider the taxes and fees separately. You can't really negotiate on taxes and the only fees you should agree to are the bank fee which is probably $650 and the documentation fees which vary from state to state and dealer to dealer. Check with a few dealers nearby to determine the going rate. I got quotes ranging from $75 to $349. You mention that interest rate is 1.9%. Usually with leases the interest rate is quoted as a Money Factor. 1.9% corresponds to a Money Factor of about 0.0008 which is four time higher than the money factor that toyota is offering in New York and other parts of the country. I think the money factor is the same everywhere of 0.0002. Also, ask the dealer for the cap cost used to calculate the lease. This should be close to the factory invoice price ($29118) which you can look up on Edmunds or on Truecar.com. For this car, if you ignore all taxes and fees, your monthly payment should be about $315 with no money down. You can then use the $2000 to pay taxes and fees if you want. Alternatively, you can roll the taxes and fees into your lease payment and still be paying less than the quote you received and keep the $2000.
I just got this offer from a local dealer RAV4 with nav. MSRP 30,170. I have top credit. I did not get the specific numbers from the dealer. Anyway, $419/mo for a 36 mo 12,000 lease -0- down. I live in Kentucky and we only pay sales tax on the monthly payment amount of the lease. Isn't this very high?
I agree, this is very high. Off the charts high. Almost every dealer I've been in contact with is willing to sell a 2010 Rav4 at or close to dealer invoice price. You need to confirm that you are getting a good price. (In leasing terms this is called the cap cost.) You also have to confirm that they are using the best current money factor offered by Toyota which I think is 0.0002. Don't let them roll any taxes and fees into your quote. After you get the quote for the car, get a list of taxes and fees and make sure they are comparable to other dealers. It's fine to roll them into the lease after you're sure you're getting a good deal.
This offer is absolutely high. If you just want a rough ball park figure you should be between $340-$370 a month with nothing out of pocket. for the car price you quoted. Let us know how you make out and getting the specific numbers will help ALOT.
I also received a MF of .001 on a 2011 Rav4 (limited 6-cylinder) near Portland, Oregon. I was able to get car at invoice by first using Zag pricing via the Truecar.com website. Lowest Zag price was actually $200 above invoice price but two other dealers quickly brought their price down to invoice after seeing this price. However, here's a cautionary tale about invoice pricing. The dealer I bought my car from showed me an invoice for a loaded 2011 Rav4 and put this price on the lease agreement. When I picked up my car a few days later, the car they gave me wasn't the same car as the one from the invoice. And, as you might expect, the car they delivered didn't have all the options that the one on the invoice did. So, the price on the lease agreement was about $400 more than the actual invoice price. I didn't notice the missing items until after I left the showroom. We're still working out the details to make things right.
I just saw an ad for a toyota RAV4 on tv. No $$ down, no taxes, nothing..just sign on the line and drive away. I believe it was 12K, 36 months. Any ideas on how much more it is typically to raise that to 15K?
Right now we are about to start a family and we need a bigger car. We are hoping to get some sort of crossover or small SUV for the BEST price possible. I'm not really picky about what brand/type of car- just looking for the best lease deals at 15K miles we can find. We need the payment to be under 300/month no matter what car we get and if we can put down no more that $500 total in cash that would be great.
That deal [is it for a 2010 or 2011?] may be subject to military and recent college grad $$ that, if you don't qualify for them, may cost another $500 to $1500 + up front. 15K will add maybe $20/mo. Good luck bargaining!
When I was at my local dealer this Saturday he said they were offering the '11 base 4wd for $249/month, with $500 down. I believe this was 12k/year but 15k would be about $15 more a month. That price may or may not have taxes included. Keep in mind...Toyotathon should be coming up soon so prices should be better.
New to leasing here. I am looking at leasing a '11 Rav4 V6 Ltd. - FULLY LOADED to the max - MSRP: $32,174. Salesman called and said $499/mo, 20,000 miles/36mos (without putting in the estimate for my trade in) with nothing down. They are using 0.0010, if I recall correctly. Now then, my trade in - '04 Pathfinder Armada LE, 95,000 miles. I owe 15,500 roughly on the Armada. Having never leased - not sure what numbers I should be looking at. Another dealer said - giving me around 14k for the Armada - on 20,000 mile/36mos lease - $529/mo, and $480/mo for a 15,000 mile/36mos lease. I have EXCELLENT credit - was ran today @ A+. Next dilemma I have, one dealer I was shopping around with, wanted the VIN on my Armada - gave it to them expecting no surprises. WRONG! I have a 'dirty carfax'. Surprisingly - Nissan denies a buyback/lemon. Got copies of the title (both from orig. state, and the state transferred to - ALL is CLEAN. But now, the dealerships want to knock down my trade-in value because of what seems to be a false carfax. ??? Any and all help, suggestions, comments welcomed. I'm going in tomorrow to try and work out a deal. Hopefully someone will be on tonight with some guidance.
Just heard from a salesman at Toyota of Waterford, in Michigan. Toyota removed the .0002 MF on the 2010's. I don't know what they are now. CarMan? MF on the 2011's was lowered from .001 to .00085. and the residual on a 2011 4x4 4cyl limited 15/yr is 61.2%. There is also a new $500 rebate on the '11's but can't use for lease. I think I will wait a couple of weeks.
I have an offer for a RAV4 4WD, 4 cylinder, with 35 payments of $286/month. This is the payment amount including all fees and taxes. I'm just trying to determine if this is a fair deal. I think it is. Thanks.
Sounds a little high - but close - depends on what fees are included and tax. We just bought a Camry but here is the toyota factory deal on a RAV4 base - dealer fees, tax, DMV etc are not included - bargain these down. and moving from 12k to 15k miles should be about $19 a month
Lease a new 2011 RAV4 for $0 Due at Signing! $259.00 per month for 36 months $0 due at signing
Offer Ends 11/30/2010 Lease a new 2011 Rav4 for $259 a month for 36 months with $0 due at signing, which includes $0 down, $0 first month's payment and $0 security deposit. Example based on model #4432. Base MSRP excluding freight is $24,255. Monthly payments of $259 for 35 months total $9,065. Capitalized cost of $24,150 based on down payment and dealer participation which may vary by dealer. Lease-end purchase option is $16,061. Lease does not include taxes, license, title fees, acquisition fee, insurance, regionally required equipment and other dealers’ charges are extra and not included in the amounts shown. Closed-end lease. Payment may vary depending upon final transaction price. Customer responsible for maintenance, excess wear and tear and $0.15 per mile over 12,000 miles per year. To qualified Tier I+ customers through Toyota Financial Services. Must take retail delivery by 11/30/10.
The lease deal at a Mass. dealership is RAV4 AWD MSRP $24,643
$289 month (and only $289 a month, nothing else) 45,000 miles No money down Monthly payment includes all title, dealer and registration fees, and all taxes. (btw sales tax in Mas is 6.25%).
sounds good to me - 259 + fees is that factory deal fees should be around 720 for example that converts to $20 more a month - straight math another $18 a month for upgrade from 12k to 15k miles and tax too
take it if you like the vehicle and tell us your happiness with a new RAV4
CarMan and Kyfdx, Any idea what the new December money factor and residuals are on a '11 4x4 4cyl rav4 ltd, 15k/year lease. In Michigan. Any info would be appreciated. Thanks.
Can someone help me and tell me if I am getting a god deal or not for a 36 month lease in NJ. Thanks in advance.
2011 RAV4 Sticker price is $26,518 Cap Cost (negotiated) is $24,314.31 Residual after 36 months is $16,786.00 Money Factor Tier 1 being used is 0.00095 My state tax is 7% 0 cap cost reduction 0 security deposit 0 disposition fee
Monthly quote is $280.00 a month with tax included and $1200.00 due at signing to cover $650 aquisition fee, $239.00 DOC fee, and $280.00 1st months payment. I can add GAP insurance for $15 extra a month for a monthly payment at $295 is GAP really necessary or a scam to spend more money?
I also got my hands on the dealer invoice which is $24,681.08
1. - TFS is charging me only $5.13/mo for the GAP insurance, and, yes, you need it in case you total the car before the lease ends and your insurance, for book value, is insufficient.
2. - GM, Honda, Ford all include the GAP insurance in the monthly lease payment; only Toyota, in my experience makes it an extra.
3. Those two fees of $650 and $289 are questionable, but, in my experience, unavoidable. It's still a decent deal.
Here is what I got at Germain Toyota in Columbus, OH. I live in Detroit but the zag.com price was worth the trip. 2011 Rav4 Ltd 4wd 4cyl Black Forest Pearl (awesome looking color) ash leather interior with backup camera, mudguards and floormats no gap ins. or extended warranty. 3yrs, 15k miles/year MSRP: $29,368 Zag Price: $26,420 Acquisition fee: 650 Doc fee: 250 title, reg, lic: 15 Total capitalized: 27,335 Money factor: .00085 Residual: @62% or $17,810 Down: $321.13 per month $321.13
2011 Rav4 MSRP: 24255 CAP COST: 23860 $1,999 due at signing ($1,800 down, $199 first month's payment and $0 security deposit.) Monthly payments of $199 Residual is $16,061. Taxes (8%): $573 Registration,Title,Inspection: 272.50 Lease Acquisition Fee: $650 Adding that to the due at signing ($1999): $3495
That is a complete rip off. They are giving you $395 off of the sticker price. Never negotiate from sticker price down, always invoice up. Ask them to show you the invoice, if they don't then get up and leave. If they won't show you the invoice you are in a bad dealership who is trying to hide every negotiating tactic they have, and they will scam you left and right. Invoice is what they purchased the car for. Anything over invoice is pure profit. Never put money down to reduce the monthly payments, if the car is wrecked you will never see that money again. Around $240 a month with tax included, with zero cap cost reduction, and if you get them lower on those tag/registration/doc fees, then you are in the ball park of a decent deal.
That $199 deal is to get you in the door. On a 36 month lease for every $1000 down reduces the monthly fee to $27.78. So if you take $27.78 X 2 = $55.56 + $199 = $254.56 monthly payment before tax.
Can you please provide the December MF and Residual for a 2011 RAV4 Limited 2WD for 36 months? We're considering both the 4-cylinder and the V6, if that makes a difference. And we're also considering 12k miles/yr and 15k miles/yr.
What is the acquisition fee for Toyota? I've read $650 and $895. And is the disposition fee $350? (I'm in NC, part of SET, if that makes a difference.)
And does Toyota offer a Multiple Security Deposit option? If so, what is the max number of deposits, and how much does each reduce the MF?
I am hoping you can help me out (because I don't really have a clue what I'm doing). I want to lease the new RAV4 2011. I'm considering the Sports edition and the Limited edition with Nav. Here are the figures the dealer has given me:
Hi there. I am looking for:New Rav 4 - 2011Limited, 3.5 V6, 2x4, Navigation Value Package, Color: Blizzard Pearl, Interior: Ash Leather trim,Navigation Package in San Rafael area. So far I got from salesperson from Marin Toyota:
"For 2011 Toyota RAV4 2WD Ltd in Blizzard Pearl , your Direct Sales price is $27,030 Lease with $2,499Drive Off Your Monthly is $353.43 Special Lease (expire 01/03/11)."
By reading above posts I realized it's way too high!!! Let's communicate about changes on price! From what I know usually it will be a slow time for dealers on Jan-Feb, so they should be happy about us going in!!!
Please help evaluate this lease. I think it's a pretty good deal: 2011 Rav4 FWD, 4cyl, Silver with Charcoal interior Base model with Extra Value Package, Tonneau Cover, and Premium Carpet Mat Set add-ons 3yrs, 12K miles/yr MSRP: $23209 Invoice Price: $22434 Sales Price: $22284 Capped Fees: $650..... (?) Total Taxes: $780 Lic/Reg Upfront: $40 Upfront Fees: $173.50.......(?) Amount Due at Signing: $484.95 Base Monthly Rental: $250 Total Monthly Payment: $270
Comments
Could you please let me know which insurance company offers GAP insurance? I looked online, but it shows that not all the insurance companies provide that coverage.
You need to ask them the following questions:
What is the residual (they will give you a % or a dollar amount)
The Money Factor (usually .000xxx)
Actual selling price of the vehicle
then google a lease calculator to make sure all adds up
First, I like to thank everyone who participates in these forums for providing helpful information, so people like me can become educated about the leasing process. If you head into a dealership without being extremely informed, they will take advantage of you.
Anyway, I just leased the Rav listed in the subject line. From what I can determine the pricing was as follows:
Manufacturer's Suggested Retail Price (MSRP) = $31,739.00
Negotiated Price (Capitalized Cost) = $30,914.50(Incl doc, acquisition)
Down payment (Capitalized Cost Reduction) = $1,000.00
Toyota Incentive for recent College Grad = $1,000.00
Worth, after Depreciation (Residual Factor) = 63%
Term (months) = 36
Annual Interest Rate I = 0.816% or MF.00034
Monthly Lease Payments = $264.38
Total Monthly Payment = $287.84 (8.875% added, for taxes) + DMV costs
This is how I approached my negotiations with the dealership. I first went on to Edmunds and used the TMV pricing tool to find out what I should be paying for the vehicle I was interested in. I think the biggest mistake people make when leasing a vehicle, is not realizing that they still have to negotiate the selling price.
I printed out the report and used the rates provided by Car_Man to create a spreadsheet to calculate my lease payments. I took both of these printouts with me to the dealership. I let the dealer make an offer, which of course was completely out of line with what I was expecting to pay. He was looking for $340 with $2,500.00 out of pocket or $440 with nothing down. I pulled out my paperwork and told him if he can't come down to my price I was going to go somewhere that would. He called in his manager to review my numbers. After going over the paperwork, the manager commented on how nice it was to have an educated consumer come into the dealership, yeah right!
My only regret is that I ultimately wound up negotiating based on the monthly payment, so I don't truly know what I paid for the car. However, I was able to plug the numbers I did know into my spreadsheet (i.e. MSRP, Cap Red, Dep and MF and Payment) to figure out what should be the negotiated price. I can only guess at what the Doc and Acquisition fees were.
Hey Car_Man, do you know what the Doc and Acquisition fees are for NYC?
Hope this helps others...
Thanks
Brandon
Thanks!
I'm not Car_man but let me throw in my 2 cents. The Toyota acq fee is $650. And, unless I'm mistaken, I believe that the state of NY limits the dealer doc fee to $75. If so, this means that your selling price is about $30,189.50. My guess is that you could have done better. You should check Edmund's invoice price as well as incentives offered for this vehicle. Also, check overstock at zag.com for competitive low pricing in your area.
One other comment...
Please be advised that NY taxes the sum of the taxable payments which is due at lease inception. As such, they do not tax payments and, therefore, do not collect the tax as payments are received. You didn't provide the model year. Judging by the residual factor, though, I'm guessing a 2011 model year. You should ask the dealer to itemize all charges including the doc fee and acq fee. Your lease should flow as follows...
Adjusted MSRP.............................. 31,739.00
Sell Price....................................... 30,189.50
Amounts Capitalized
Dealer Doc Fee.............................. 75.00
Toyota Acq Fee............................. 650.00
NY Sales Tax @8.875%................ 1,104.45
Gross Capitalized Cost.................. 32,018.95
Cap Reduction.............................. 2,000.00 (includes college grad incentive)
Adjusted Capitalized Cost............. 30,018.95
Residual Factor........................... 63%
Residual Value............................ 19,995.57
Money Factor............................. 0.00034
Term......................................... 36
Taxable Monthly Payment........... 264.38
Monthly Payment...................... 295.43
Upfront Lease Charges (itemize!)
1st Month's Payment................. 295.43
DMV Fees............................... 250.00 (Guess)
Other Fees.............................. ???
John
Leased @ Queensboro Toyota
I should have been more clear, my final payment is $287.84. This figure already includes the tax. According to edmunds the TMV price should be $29,900.00. I realize I paid about $350.00 more than that, but I still think it's a good deal, especially when you consider the extra $1000.00 incentive. Also, I wasn't sure exactly what the doc fees were when I ran my numbers, so I over estimated when I presented my target price. I didnt know that NY limits it to $75. This is my first car purchase/lease, so lesson learned. I will have to get'em next time lol...
Using the tax scheme you gave me along with the doc and acquisition fee. I came up with the following breakdown. Also, just a side note this is a 2010 model...
MSRP....................................................$31,739.00
Capitalized Cost
Negotiated Price......................................$30,254.31
Acquisition Fee............................................$650.00
Taxes..........................................................$844.69
Total........................................................$31,749.00
Capitalized Cost Reduction
Down Payment..........................................$1,000.00
Toyota Recent Grad Incentive......................$1,000.00
Total $2,000.00
Residual 63%
Residual value..........................................$19,995.57
Mileage..........................................................12,000
Money Factor...............................................0.00034
Term....................................................................36
Total Monthly Payment $287.84
Upfront Lease Charges
License Fee...............................$195.00
State Inspection...........................$10.00
NYC Use Tax...............................$12.50
Doc Fee.......................................$75.00
First Month Payment...................$287.84
Total...........................................$580.34
The college grad incentive is subsidized by Toyota and has nothing to do with the sell price. Your numbers are off somewhere. Are you sure about the NY sales tax of 844.69? Here's what I have based on your revised info...
Adjusted MSRP.............................. 31,739.00
Sell Price....................................... 30,254.31
Amounts Capitalized
Toyota Acq Fee............................. 650.00
NY Sales Tax @8.875%.............. 1,103.45
Gross Capitalized Cost.................. 32,007.76
Cap Reduction.............................. 2,000.00 (includes college grad incentive)
Adjusted Capitalized Cost............. 30,007.76
Residual Factor........................... 63%
Residual Value............................ 19,995.57
Money Factor............................. 0.00034
Term......................................... 36
Taxable Monthly Payment........... 264.09
Monthly Payment...................... 295.12
Upfront Lease Charges (itemize!)
License Fee............................... 195.00
State Inspection........................... 10.00
NYC Use Tax............................... 12.50
Doc Fee....................................... 75.00
First Month Payment................... 295.12
TOTAL.........................................587.62
We disagree on the bolded items. This is a fairly simple and straight-forward NY lease and I've never been off on my NY calculations. I'm certain that something is wrong and it appears to be your NY sales tax of 844.69. Where you're getting 844.69 is a mystery to me. It could be that the dealer used a sales tax rate different from 8.875%. However, I tried different tax rates and was unsuccessful in producung 844.69. So, only God knows where it came from. This, of course, will cause the monthly payment to be different.
If you're inclined, you can check out my post regarding the calculation of NY sales tax at...
http://townhall-talk.edmunds.com/direct/view/.ef35de2/982#MSG981
In your case, the sales tax is computed as follows...
Tax on Cap reduction = 0.08875 x 2,000.00 ........................ 177.50
Sales Tax on the sum of the taxable payments @8.875%...... 925.95
TOTAL Sales Tax............................................................... 1,103.45
The taxable payment is computed as follows...
0.00034 x (28,904.31 + 19,995.57) + (28,904.31 + 19,995.57) / 36 = 264.09
And so, the NY payment Sales Tax is....
(0.08875/(1-0.08875)) x 36 x 264.09 = 925.95
Note that the 28,904.31 is the adjustable cap (i.e., 30,007.76 - 1,103.45) corresponding to the taxable payment of 264.09.
When did you finalize the lease? I pray this doesn't happen, but don't be surprised if the dealer calls you claiming that they made a mistake. If so, they should eat the difference. I learned a very long time ago that if you make a mistake in business, you eat your mistake and rightly so.
John
The 844.69 is not accurate. It appears that it was determined as follows...
term x (payment including tax - taxable payment)
36 x (287.84 - 287.84/1.08875) = 844.56
The 0.13 difference is attributed to rounding error. Anyway, that's not the method NY uses to compute sales tax. Is this a dealership number or is this a number that you calculated? I find it hard to believe that the dealer calculated the 844.69. Also, where is the tax on the $2,000 cap reduction which amounts to 177.50? There is no way that it's included in the 844.69
John
Here is the issue. When I looked over my lease agreement it just listed my monthly lease payment plus the DMV and Doc fee. I tried to use the figures I did know to determine the exact selling price. After looking through my paperwork a second time, my customer disclosure does list the following tax all capped into the lease:
Cashdown Tax $177.50
Upfront Tax $918.61
I will list all the numbers that I know for sure base on my paperwork and hopefully you can let me know exactly what the sell price was. I will try to do the same on my end and see if come up with the same #
Msrp $31739
Sell price?
Amounts Capitalized
Toyota Acq Fee............................. 650.00
NY Sales Tax 8.875%.............. $1,096.11
Gross Capitalized Cost.................. ?
Cap Reduction.............................. 2,000.00 (includes college grad incentive)
Adjusted Capitalized Cost............. ?
Residual Factor........................... 61.56463%% (based on purchase opt below)
Residual value............................ 19,540.00 (Purchase Option On Customer disclosure)
Money Factor............................. 0.00034
Term......................................... 36
Taxable Monthly Payment........... ?
Monthly Payment...................... 287.84
Upfront Lease Charges (itemize!)
License Fee............................... 195.00
State Inspection........................... 10.00
NYC Use Tax............................... 12.50
Doc Fee....................................... 75.00
First Month Payment................... 287.84
TOTAL.........................................580.34
Apparently, 19,995.57 isn't the residual value because, if the purchase option is 19,540, then there is no way that the residual could be 19,995.57. I have a feeling that we've been doing lots of guessing. As you know, in order to get credible results, the input data must be spot-on. If you have already signed the lease agreement and have taken delivery of this vehicle, you should have a copy of the lease agreeement. By law, they must disclose the gross and adjusted cap as well as the residual value and sell price which is called the Agreed Upon Value in your lease contract.
Does Toyota charge a purchase option fee? If so, that would also be disclosed in your contract and the 19,540, in all likelihood, would reflect the residual value plus the purchase option fee. Residual factors are always whole percents (e.g., 61%, 62%, etc). When I divide 19,540 by several whole percents, I always end up with an MSRP that includes change. For example, 19,540/0.64 = 30,531.25 makes no sense because the MSRP is always a whole number. Based on the 30,531.25, I'm able to get a payment of 287.84 which corresponds to a unique sell price of 29,574.17. The problem is that the sales tax is 1,080.22 which is different than your 1,096.11. Therefore, it's unlikely that the 19,540 is the residual value. And so, we now have two unknowns: sell price and residual value.
Also, if you're telling me that your monthly payment is exactly 287.84, then your taxes must be about 1,080.20. In order to maintain a payment of 287.84 requires that the residual be increased (decreased) if the sell price is increased (decreased). This suggests that the taxable payment is about 257.46. So, it's highly unlikely that the taxes amount to 1096.11. Something obviously isn't right.
Did you have any dealer installed options because dealer installed options are usually not fully residualized. Another problem with TFS is that they don't residualize the destination charge or floor mats and so these are deducted from the MSRP. That, when added to the cost of residualized dealer installed options results in what is known as the Adjusted MSRP. This, when multiplied by the residual factor, yields the residual value.
I suggest that you check your lease contract. If you haven't taken delivery or signed your lease agreeement, I would recommend asking the dealer for their LEASE WORKSHEET. This is a computer generated document that will tell you everything and then some and will eliminate a lot of guess work.
If you have the lease contract or can secure the dealer's lease worksheet, I'll be happy to evaluate them if you like. Simply email them to me at...
diffeq@zoominternet.net
John
I am trying to help my parents to lease a 2010 Rav4 AWD Ltd. with evp #2.
They do not know much about the whole leasing process so am sure the dealer will have a field day if they just walk in uninformed.
MSRP is $32kish for the car they saw.
What should they expect to pay?
Located in NJ so 7% sales tax.
They are willing to put up to $2k for all sign off fees including tax etc.
I am assuming they should be able to get under $300/month given what I have read on this forum.
Any advise or help would be greatly appreciated.
thanks
I'm pretty sure that Toyota does not fully residualize the MSRP as they deduct the destination charge and the charge for floor mats. Increased residual, all else constant, means lower payments.
John
2010 Rav 4 LTD V6 4x4 with val pack#2 and some other addons.
MSRP $32568
options : BC,QZ, TO, B3, CF, P7 (XM satellite radio kit )
Cap. cost $ 29945.14
aquisition fee $650
Doc $299
Taxes $852.52
All other fees(NJ reg and title) $421
Residual $19260
Money factor .00020
36 mo. / 12000 miles per year
$1000 out of pocket $336 per month ( tax incl.)
what do you guys think?
2) Should I expect the deals to get better in October (sell price at $1K or $2K below invoice) due to oversupply? The 2011 Rav4s are now at the dealers, and there are around a 1,000 2010 Rav4s within 50 miles of Boston according to Autotrader.com.
I leased on September , 2 in Staten Island Toyota 2010 Rav 4 LTD V6 4x4 with val pack 1 , camera etc.
Out of pocket $2184, monthly payment $345( incl tax) , residual $19184.
Where did you get this deal in NJ?
You mention that interest rate is 1.9%. Usually with leases the interest rate is quoted as a Money Factor. 1.9% corresponds to a Money Factor of about 0.0008 which is four time higher than the money factor that toyota is offering in New York and other parts of the country. I think the money factor is the same everywhere of 0.0002.
Also, ask the dealer for the cap cost used to calculate the lease. This should be close to the factory invoice price ($29118) which you can look up on Edmunds or on Truecar.com. For this car, if you ignore all taxes and fees, your monthly payment should be about $315 with no money down. You can then use the $2000 to pay taxes and fees if you want. Alternatively, you can roll the taxes and fees into your lease payment and still be paying less than the quote you received and keep the $2000.
I got my Rav4 Sport 4 cylinder in April with 0 down and my payment is $270 a month.
Right now we are about to start a family and we need a bigger car. We are hoping to get some sort of crossover or small SUV for the BEST price possible. I'm not really picky about what brand/type of car- just looking for the best lease deals at 15K miles we can find. We need the payment to be under 300/month no matter what car we get and if we can put down no more that $500 total in cash that would be great.
Keep in mind...Toyotathon should be coming up soon so prices should be better.
Thanks. (great forum, btw)
Toyota removed the .0002 MF on the 2010's. I don't know what they are now. CarMan?
MF on the 2011's was lowered from .001 to .00085.
and the residual on a 2011 4x4 4cyl limited 15/yr is 61.2%.
There is also a new $500 rebate on the '11's but can't use for lease.
I think I will wait a couple of weeks.
Lease a new 2011 RAV4 for $0 Due at Signing!
$259.00 per month for 36 months
$0 due at signing
Offer Ends 11/30/2010
Lease a new 2011 Rav4 for $259 a month for 36 months with $0 due at signing, which includes $0 down, $0 first month's payment and $0 security deposit. Example based on model #4432. Base MSRP excluding freight is $24,255. Monthly payments of $259 for 35 months total $9,065. Capitalized cost of $24,150 based on down payment and dealer participation which may vary by dealer. Lease-end purchase option is $16,061. Lease does not include taxes, license, title fees, acquisition fee, insurance, regionally required equipment and other dealers’ charges are extra and not included in the amounts shown. Closed-end lease. Payment may vary depending upon final transaction price. Customer responsible for maintenance, excess wear and tear and $0.15 per mile over 12,000 miles per year. To qualified Tier I+ customers through Toyota Financial Services. Must take retail delivery by 11/30/10.
$289 month (and only $289 a month, nothing else)
45,000 miles
No money down
Monthly payment includes all title, dealer and registration fees, and all taxes.
(btw sales tax in Mas is 6.25%).
Does this sound good?
259 + fees is that factory deal
fees should be around 720 for example
that converts to $20 more a month - straight math
another $18 a month for upgrade from 12k to 15k miles
and tax too
take it if you like the vehicle and tell us your happiness with a new RAV4
Any idea what the new December money factor and residuals are on a '11 4x4 4cyl rav4 ltd, 15k/year lease.
In Michigan.
Any info would be appreciated.
Thanks.
2011 RAV4
Sticker price is $26,518
Cap Cost (negotiated) is $24,314.31
Residual after 36 months is $16,786.00
Money Factor Tier 1 being used is 0.00095
My state tax is 7%
0 cap cost reduction
0 security deposit
0 disposition fee
Monthly quote is $280.00 a month with tax included
and $1200.00 due at signing to cover $650 aquisition fee, $239.00 DOC fee, and $280.00 1st months payment.
I can add GAP insurance for $15 extra a month for a monthly payment at $295
is GAP really necessary or a scam to spend more money?
I also got my hands on the dealer invoice which is $24,681.08
2. - GM, Honda, Ford all include the GAP insurance in the monthly lease payment; only Toyota, in my experience makes it an extra.
3. Those two fees of $650 and $289 are questionable, but, in my experience, unavoidable. It's still a decent deal.
2011 Rav4 Ltd 4wd 4cyl Black Forest Pearl (awesome looking color) ash leather interior with backup camera, mudguards and floormats
no gap ins. or extended warranty.
3yrs, 15k miles/year
MSRP: $29,368
Zag Price: $26,420
Acquisition fee: 650
Doc fee: 250
title, reg, lic: 15
Total capitalized: 27,335
Money factor: .00085
Residual: @62% or $17,810
Down: $321.13
per month $321.13
2011 Rav4 MSRP: 24255
CAP COST: 23860
$1,999 due at signing ($1,800 down, $199 first month's payment and $0 security deposit.)
Monthly payments of $199
Residual is $16,061.
Taxes (8%): $573
Registration,Title,Inspection: 272.50
Lease Acquisition Fee: $650
Adding that to the due at signing ($1999): $3495
or
$267/month including all taxes, fees.
Thoughts?
That $199 deal is to get you in the door. On a 36 month lease for every $1000 down reduces the monthly fee to $27.78. So if you take $27.78 X 2 = $55.56 + $199 = $254.56 monthly payment before tax.
Can you please provide the December MF and Residual for a 2011 RAV4 Limited 2WD for 36 months? We're considering both the 4-cylinder and the V6, if that makes a difference. And we're also considering 12k miles/yr and 15k miles/yr.
What is the acquisition fee for Toyota? I've read $650 and $895. And is the disposition fee $350? (I'm in NC, part of SET, if that makes a difference.)
And does Toyota offer a Multiple Security Deposit option? If so, what is the max number of deposits, and how much does each reduce the MF?
Thanks!
I am hoping you can help me out (because I don't really have a clue what I'm doing). I want to lease the new RAV4 2011. I'm considering the Sports edition and the Limited edition with Nav. Here are the figures the dealer has given me:
SPORT
MSRP: 25,880
Invoice: 24,471
Selling Price: 24,671
Residual: 15,820 ( 3yrs, 36 months)
Acquisition: 650
Money factor: .00165
Doc Fees: 55
Tax: 9.5% (San Francisco)
Limited Edition
MSRP: $28,509
Invoice:$ 26,977
Selling Price: 27,277
Residual: 16,921- (3yrs, 36 months)
Acquisition: 650
Money factor: .00165
Doc Fees: 55
Tax: 9.5% (San Francisco)
"For 2011 Toyota RAV4 2WD Ltd in Blizzard Pearl , your Direct Sales price is $27,030 Lease with $2,499Drive Off Your Monthly is $353.43 Special Lease
(expire 01/03/11)."
By reading above posts I realized it's way too high!!! Let's communicate about changes on price! From what I know usually it will be a slow time for dealers on Jan-Feb, so they should be happy about us going in!!!
2011 Rav4 FWD, 4cyl, Silver with Charcoal interior
Base model with Extra Value Package, Tonneau Cover, and Premium Carpet Mat Set add-ons
3yrs, 12K miles/yr
MSRP: $23209
Invoice Price: $22434
Sales Price: $22284
Capped Fees: $650..... (?)
Total Taxes: $780
Lic/Reg Upfront: $40
Upfront Fees: $173.50.......(?)
Amount Due at Signing: $484.95
Base Monthly Rental: $250
Total Monthly Payment: $270
I actually decided against the RAV4 and instead am leasing a Hyundai Santa Fe.
Good luck!
Cayden