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I change our rear diff fluid in our CRV every 30K and that's probably overkill.
If you had read the fourms before you bought your Sienna, you probably wouldn't have bought it! Some V-6 Toyotas had problems with their oil sludging up and ruining the engines. The forums made it sound like EVERY Sienna was doomed to premature failure but as a percentage, very few were affected.
The people who had the problems wee the people who stretched out their oil changes too long.
I suppose if Sienna owners read these tales of sludge it may have led them to rethink their oil change schedule.
V-6 Toyota engines probably are more sensitive to lack of oil changes than some other cars and people who skimp on oil changes end up with sludged engines.
For people like you and me and most others, there would never be a problem.
I have yet to have to burnish the clutches. It is only needed when the noise is persistent. A simple fluid change is all it needs. Use Honda DPF od DPFII, there is no aftermarket alternative.
Also, if the vehicle you are looking at is automatic, change the ATF as well. Use Honda ATF Z-1 only, there is no substitute.
Brake fluid needs to be changed every 3 years, regardless of mileage. You can use Honda DOT3, or quality DOT 3 fluid. I prefer using Honda fluids in all of my Hondas.
I do all my own maintenance, it is not difficult. A couple of jackstands, an SUV jack and a set of tools is all one would need. Helm Inc publishes the official shop manual for Honda, and sells them to the public. It is great for DIYer!!!! It has all the specs and detailed diagrams.
If the CR-V you are looking at has the original Dueler H/T tires they are way past their useful life. When looking at tires, you should buy all 4 at the same time, as the AWD system is activated by the difference in rotation velocity between front and rear wheel. Different tires may or may not set it off and cause binding, overheating, and/or failure.
I am just curious what you would consider a good deal on a 2005 CR-V EX AWD (I would assume) with 29,000 miles?
Thanks!
Bob
http://www.in.honda.com/Rjanisis/pubs/SB/A07-024.PDF
Thanks!
Bob
You're assuming that oil at 7500 miles offers significantly less protection than at 4000. Why not change hte oil at 1000 then? Why is 3000 OK and 2000 too short???
The reality is 3000 miles itnervals were originally used as a standard for older cars with inferior engine seals, piston rings, incomplete combustion, among other issues. On top of that, oil quality and performance has improved dramatically.
All mfg's recommed at least 5000 and most 7500 or even 10,000 unless it's "severe" duty, where the engine spnds a lot of time idling (taxis, police cars, commercial use) or at high RPM's (towing).
I have called Am Honda Motor Co., Inc and they just repeated what the dealership told me! Can you believe this!? I even told them that my manual states that 90,000 miles or 5 years is the recommeded time for changing differential fluid and they still tell me that it should have been done at 10,000 miles!!! I am so angry that they are talking to me like this. I can't believe that they keep telling me this outright lie to my face! I am fighting a fight but who do I call now? Help - I'm pulling my hair out!:-
:mad:
I have called Am Honda Motor Co., Inc and they just repeated what the dealership told me! Can you believe this!? I even told them that my manual states that 90,000 miles or 5 years is the recommeded time for changing differential fluid and they still tell me that it should have been done at 10,000 miles!!! I am so angry that they are talking to me like this. I can't believe that they keep telling me this outright lie to my face! I am fighting a fight but who do I call now? Help - I'm pulling my hair out!:-
Call Honda corporate and explain that if they did not issue an ammended manual with the 10,000 mile intervals they are violating FTC regulations and can be subject to sanctions.
Edited to include: http://www.in.honda.com/Rjanisis/pubs/SB/A07-024.PDF
Here's the most recent Service Bulletin
t
And this isn't covered under warranty?
Honda makes great cars. I'm on my 10th one, been buying them for 30 years. But the dealers are just as sleazy as any used car dealer of any brand in the country. Such a shame.
Francis
Now at 60,000 I need it again. My present mechanic says that I need to have the differential flushed 3 times at a cost of $133 per flush. This would be a total of $400!! Have you ever heard of this? I thought he was trustworthy, but now have serious doubts. Please let me know what you think.
Now at 60,000 I need it again. My present mechanic says that I need to have the differential flushed 3 times at a cost of $133 per flush. This would be a total of $400!! Have you ever heard of this? I thought he was trustworthy, but now have serious doubts. Please let me know what you think.
There is nothing wrong with the differential. It is part of the regular maintenance to replace fluids. Rear diffeerntial fluid needs to be replaced every 30,000 miles, or figure every 3rd oil change at 10,000 mile intervals.
If the differential is making noise, it needs to be replaced 3 times with short drives in between to get 90% of the fluid out. It should not cost more than $20 in parts. It takes 1.1 qts (1 liter) and Honda sells the fluid for approximately $6/quart. You will need to buy 4 quarts, and will have some left for the next service.
At $133 per flush you may as well go to the dealer, as they will charge about $70 for all 3 flushes.
DO NOT let your mechanic put anything but HONDA DPFor DPF II in there, or you will be looking at $3000 rear differential.
Same applies to the automatic transmission, the fluid should be changed around 30,000 miles, and if shifts are hard or notchy, the fluid should be replaced 3 times with short drives in between.
Under no circumstances should a Honda be connected to a FLUID FLUSH machine. Might as well just burn it then.
Good luck.
He informed me that it was a rear differential issue to which I asked what is a rear differential. He walked me through it all and told me to get into Honda because it was also leaking, needed to be addressed soon and that this may be under warranty. He further stated that this did not just happen overnight either, that the seal deterioration was going on for some time.
I made the appointment for the following morning. Our local dealership looked at it and told me yes, it was the rear differential and it was leaking. (Which they stated they were surprised with because "they never see this happen"). They further stated that to replace the two axle seals and change out the differential fluid would cost $578. I asked them about warranty coverage and after some poking and prodding they said they would call corporate but that I was out of warranty and the fluid is a maintenance issue. I told them I had never even heard of rear differential prior to the day before and always refer to my Honda Service History booklet when scheduling mileage or year maintenance, and if I was supposed to get the fluid changed out I certainly would have.
The local dealer tried their best to pin this all on the fact that I do not use them for my regular maintenance which is complete garbage. Last I checked this is America and I can take my car where ever I get good service. For me, that is my local Goodyear around the corner from our house. As it turns out they didn't have the parts anyway and I would have to come back. Meanwhile I was to expect a call when they heard back from Honda Corporate.
They did call later that day and informed me that out of the kindness of their heart, Corporate was only going to charge me for half the price of the seals which would total $71. They also stated that because the fluid is a maintenance issue I would be charged the full $158 for that. I told them to get the parts and scheduled an appointment for today. I also told them that we had done some research and found Honda Corp. is aware of the issue (bulletins) and that many owners are having the same problem. Further - I told her my Honda Service History booklet does not recommend replacing the rear differential fluid until 90,000 miles or five years. Boy did she try and argue that - with no leg to stand on. Her favorite excuse was that "in your manual it states that in extreme driving conditions (Florida) the rear differential fluid should be checked every 20,000 miles". Well guess what - no where in my manual does it read that. It was something she found and printed from online.
So long story short we got taken. Taken by our local dealership, taken by Honda Corporate. I'm a sole-proprietor and I lost three days worth of work just to get taken. Total bill $253.45. Total hassle - more than Honda has. Won't be buying a Honda again.
Since the rear differential fluid needs changing regularly I'd say this should be highlighted in the owner's manual. I've only had the car serviced at dealers, and no one mentioned this. The owner has to know where to look and what to look for to find it in the manual. Granted, the car was just coming up on 30K and hadn't begun making any noise until a week previous to bringing it in. And at first the noise is hardly noticeable.
Some owners have asked about tires. My Goodrich OEs were ok at first but at 20K were so noisy my missus avoided the car and didn't want to hear that they had a year's worth of tread left. (According to Tire Rack this is par for the course with this tire.) So I switched to Goodyear ComforTreads, and it's like a different car -- much quiter on the highway, much less bangy on bumps.
1) Your car is still in warranty at 63,000 miles, since 2006 came with 5 year/60,000 mile powertrain warranty. Differential is part of the power train. Because Honda has settled a law suit and agreed to 5% odomter error, 63,000 is exactly within the warranty limitation.
2) The OWNER's MANUAL lists 2 schedules, Normal and Severe. lPage 185lists the definition of Severe Service, and FL would be under it for the heat.
Page 188 indeed tells you to check all the fluid levels and condition at 20,000 miles, or every year. And absolutely recommends replacing the fluid at 60,000 mile intervals.
Just because you did not know, or Goodyear did not know the vehicle had a rear differential (how do you suppose the power gets to the rear wheels from the engine upfront???) does not mean it should not be serviced. Besides, I HIGHLY doubt that Goodyear would go out of their way and buy Dual Pump Fluid from Honda to put in there. Maybe it is a godsend that they are clueless and did not know about the rear differential. Any other fluid would have destroyed it, and you would have been stuck with a $3000 repair tab.
While, I agree that this is America, and you are free to take your vehicle anywhere to be serviced. You should also mind that you are driving a Honda, not a GM/Ford/Toyota....product.
Honda uses unique components and designs that a chain like Goodyear would have knowledge about. Best is to go to an independant garage specializing in Hondas. Or service it your self. The TSB's are avaialbe for anyone, who wants to, to view.
Does anyone use BG oil additive?
The dealer I bought the car from recommends this additive, saying since the car isn't used every day, it could be helpful at start up, especially in the winter.
The dealer closest to me said Honda doesn't recommend any additive, winter or not, used daily or not.
I'm impressed with someone who stands to make a buck, but will tell the customer a product might not hurt but isn't needed. Any other .02?
Does anyone use BG oil additive?
The dealer I bought the car from recommends this additive, saying since the car isn't used every day, it could be helpful at start up, especially in the winter.
The dealer closest to me said Honda doesn't recommend any additive, winter or not, used daily or not.
I'm impressed with someone who stands to make a buck, but will tell the customer a product might not hurt but isn't needed. Any other .02?
The seocnd dealer is right. the OWNERs MANUAL specifically states not to use additives. Bring the OWNER's MANUAL to the first dealer, and make them eat it.
http://www.in.honda.com/Rjanisis/pubs/SB/A07-024.PDF
I believe the scheduled differential fluid interval for 2007 an dup CR-V is 15,000 miles. Even if the poster has to change it every 20,000 miles, he/she is getting more out of the fluid than intended.
Honda's Real-Time AWD is different from Subaru's, and comparing the fluid intervals on the Subaru (which is just a differential, not an AWD integral part) with CR-V, is like complaining that apples taste like oranges, when they are indeed oranges.
It would be more benefitial to the owners of the respective vehicles to understand what each system is, how it works, and what the differences are before making categorical statements and comparing the two. Just my 2 cents.
Honda's AWD system is integrated in the rear differential, while Subaru's AWD system is in the central differential.
Honda uses wet clutches and two pumps to create the pressure to activate the rear wheels. When both front and rear wheels are turning at the same speed, the pressure between the pumps is neutral. Once either of the wheels are turning faster, it creates pressure differential between the pumps and activates the clutch pack.
The benefit is the lighter weight, and lower rolling resitance, which results in higher fuel efficiency.
The system is proven bullet proof with regular maintenance. It was originally installed on the mid-80's Civic Wagon 4WD vehicles, and has been continually improved, but essentially is a dual pump system.
While Subaru's system is always on. It is simpler, but takes a hit in the fuel economy department.
thanks for the info on this tsb for the 07 crv. my aunt has a noise coming from the rear diff and when she was at the dealer, they were trying to charge her for the fluid change and inspection fee. Good thing I found this thread and mentioned to the service advisor about the tsb.... well, let's just say that they suddenly remembered that a tsb exists for this noise.
thanks,
tony
Unfortunately, your car is 10 years old. Still, the rear differential should last longer than 73k miles if properly maintained. I'd make that point strongly, but politely, to the dealer, or Honda directly if they don't cooperate, and ask for a reduced price. Honda has a "good will" program that discounts prices (often 50%) for components that have had a history of problems, such as air conditioners and differentials. Because of the car's age they may not go 50%, but they should do something for you, especially if you've had your serviced regularly by a dealer.
Also, I'd have the car checked out by an independent garage that specializes in Japanese cars. You need to get another price.
I say they are lying through their teeth.
Failed differential does not make your car sluggish, however, a failing transmission (if automatic) may. But, chances are it will be fine too.
One thing to remember with any car is that just regular oil change is not maintenance.
You need to change the transmission fluid at least every 30,000 miles with Honda ATF Z-1 for automatic, or Honda MTF for manual.
Rear differential fluid needs to be changed at 30,000 miles as well, using HONDA DPF I or DPF II ONLY!!!
Power steeering fluid needs to be changed every 3 years with HONDA PSF ONLY!!!
Brake fluid needs to be changed every 3 years, you can use generic, but Honda one is not much more.
Coolant needs to be changed every 5 years if factory fluid, or 3 years if replacement. Use Honda Type 2 coolant ONLY!
Cabin filter needs to be replaced at least once a year.
Air filter needs to be replaced every 4 oil changes, or so
If you take care fo your Honda, she will take care of you. Neglect her, she will be mercyless. There are no substitutes for Honda fluids, no matter what they claim!
See postings around 228 and on. Dig up the Service Bulletin. This is a Honda defect/problem, not yours! :lemon:
Before you go on and replace the differential, replace the fluid 3 times with short drives in between with Honda DPF II and see if it fixes the problem. You have nothing to lose, but stand a chance to fix the problem your negligence has caused.
Also, the 2005 and on differentials are different from the previous years. They may physically fit, but the reaciton time is a lot shorter on 2005 and up differentials.
The differential fluid needs to be replaced every 30,000 miles with Honda DPF or DPF II, only.
Automatic transmission fluid needs to be replaced at same intervals with Honda ATF Z-1, only.
Power steering fluid needs to be replaced with Honda PSF, only.
Brake fluid needs to be replaced every 3 years regardless of mileage. You can use generic, but Honda DOT 3 fluid is preferred.
Good luck with the vehicle.
Keep up with the maintenance, and your chances of total failure are remote..
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So, unless your vehicle exhibits a warrantied problem, Honda isn't going to pay for it..
I put 106K on a CR-V, and never had a problem with the rear diff-- Just did regularly scheduled dealer maintenance.
In general, the CR-V has proven to be a very reliable vehicle.. Your chances of getting a problematic one are remote.
regards,
kyfdx
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I just bought a 2010 CR-V LX 4WD in NJ. I had no trouble getting the car. As a matter of fact, I had my choice of colors and was able to get exactly what I wanted. Perhaps you can check out other dealers in the middle and western parts of the state. I definitely wanted a 4WD because of the snow etc..
I had a first generation CR-V years ago and had no trouble with the rear differential. I am hoping that the 2010 model will be as reliable.