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Comments
Thanks for this very impotent news! :P
I'm in the market for a car for my son (actually a third car for us that he will occassionally drive is how I'm presenting this) and spent the better part of the day shopping. For the heck of it I stopped at a BMW dealer and drove and priced the 3 and 7. Loved the 3, absolutely hated the 7. I can see how the 7 may stir some passions but as a lux car it doesn't cut it for me. I'm pure MB or Lex and forget anything else in that category. I wish I could get my LS460L for 250 more than the 7 was quoted at but I can't even get near that price.
But the long and short of it was that a $37K 3 series leased out at the same price as a $30K Rav 4. Incredible. The lux brand is much cheaper per dollar of MSRP than the everyday car. Yet based on Edmunds TMV prices the Toyota is discounted and the BMW shows full price being paid. I asked about a price on purchase and the salesmen said leasing is the way to go with BMW. After this experience I concluded BMW is betting the ranch on never losing a customer.
I also stopped at Infiniti and they are also really dealing with incredible leases on the FX and the G. I found the G to be right there with the 3 series. Finally I called my Lexus guy and was just curious abot the IS 250AWD. I'll go see that car sometime next week but forget it as the lease price is far and away higher than the G or 3.
The sports car stuff was fun but the likely third car for me, which again will serve as the vehicle for my son is the Rav 4. I really want the F-cruiser but my wife threatened my life after she drove that thing. He wants the G though. I did love the G also. That and the 3 are a toss-up in the fun dept but I prefer the styling of the G. Infiniti is also really dealing the M if anyone is shopping.
Hey Howard and Tagman,
the above description is for the 320d. But its amazing if you look at how improved diesels have become since only ten years ago.
Great article about the kinds of BMW Diesels we can expect here in North America:
POTENTIAL 2008 NORTH AMERICAN BMW DIESEL OFFERINGS
I know both of you are interested in a BMW 335i coupe/cabrio. But why not wait until a BMW 335d arrives?
Would I trade in my BMW 335i for a 335d?
No! I think I'll wait a few more years after 2008 to see what BMW has to offer in terms of hybrid diesels. I am in no rush I still have only 6K miles on my 335i and I intend to drive it another 100k miles.
Betting the ranch? Well in that case I cant think of a better bet.
Based on the latest Annual Reports BMW leasing is profitable and their returns on capital is improving. For more riveting details refer to my post HELC Post #24334. Or even better go to the BMW site and look up their 2006 Annual Return.
1) High resale values
2) Able to earn good margins even with deals/incentives
3) BMW's access to low financig costs for its leasing
programme( primarily due to their pristine balance sheet)
Also regarding those wonderful Infiniti G and M lease deals? Despite these deals the Infiniti G and M are very likely to be the most profitable Nissan models.
Incentives/Deals does not necessarily mean betting the ranch. That is what Chrysler, Ford and GM have done. But in the case of Infinitis and BMWs a good lease deal does not mean these two companies are losing their shirts. In fact they end up wearing better shirts.
Obviously the BMW 7 is at the tail end of its product cycle while the Lexus LS is at the front end of the product cycle.
What is a better comparison? How about the MB S versus the Lexus LS?
Based on the stats below you can understand why the head of Lexus admits that the LS does not have the cachet of a Benz or a BMW (at least one that is at the front end of its product cycle). I remember reading somewhere (correct me if I am wrong) that a majority of LS models are LWB. If that is the case then those Lexus figures below are even less impressive.
The 3-Series lease is a "no-brainer" for the customer if there ever was one. How could anyone possibly turn it down?
Terrific car made affordable with minimum cash flow.
Your son is a lucky guy!!! And you must know you are blessed to have him, or you wouldn't be getting him a Bimmer!!
TagMan
Whoever says diesel engines are tied to the lower-middle class hasn't been doing their recent homework.
These diesel engines have made great BMW vehicles, incomparable. They burn clean and improve mileage significantly. They are nothing like the diesels of the best-forgotten past.
Reviews of BMW diesels across the pond have been unanimously ecstatic.
The only way I look at the unimpressive X5 again is if it comes here with a diesel alternative by summer of 2008.
The future looks very exciting, indeed!
Where have I been?
Good thing I...uh...read it here first!
Uh oh! I knew there was a catch. The dreaded BMW unreliability. Those cars must fall apart as soon as they leave the showroom!
Rats!!!
Well, thankfully, there's always those fine Japanese alternatives. :shades:
The prices are the prices. I just reported what I found in a day of shopping. Personally as far as I'm concerned the highest residuals are a joke because they represent what the manufacturers are buying the car back for at lease end not what folks are really paying for them. The biggest buyers of used cars that this data is reported on are the manufacturers who created the residual in the first place. In my book that's called a circ error. You must not be thinking clearly if you buy a used BMW because a new one with 4 years of free service is a lot cheaper. Same with Infiniti. It is what it is.
I drove both the M35 and M45 and they both seemed very heavy despite okay steering and good cornering. Very noisy engine. Poor gas mileage. Brakes were fantastic. Better than BMW. Good trunk space.
Overall, the 5 series handled a bit better, felt lighter and more agile, and didn't have the M's annoying lane-drifting warning noise that can be turned off, but is annoyingly set as default, meaning every time you start the car you must manually turn it off.
As for me, Dewey, I am laughing all the way to the bank at renting one of the world's greatest vehicles from BMWFS at only 2.4% interest. :shades:
Exactly... and now it's quite possibly ljflx's turn to get a terrific BMW for his son... with a lease deal that can hardly be refused.
If my wife gives the green light on that 335i convertible, I imagine that particular car will be hard to deal on, but I'm hoping the lease deal will be good. And then BMW can add yet another satisfied customer to that long growing list.
TagMan
For starters, ljflx addressed his post directly to brightness... so I think it is only natural to wait for bightness's reply.
Beyond that, I'm pretty sure I read all the HELC discussions, and I don't ever remember ljflx mentioning that he was looking at a 3-series car for his son before. If he did, I missed it.
Why jump all over me like that? My post has nothing to do with your perpetual lease debate between you and brightness.
I think it's cool that lj is quite possibly going to lease a BMW for his son, and I was being supportive. Lj brought it up, and I don't believe there was a problem with his post either.
Heck, you sound a bit angry, Dewey, and for what reason? I would think that, as a BMW fan and owner, you would relish these recent posts that are obviously quite favorable and supportive of BMW and the terrific BMW lease deals.
TagMan
BMW makes it so easy to take a 3 series that I would take it if it was just a car for me. Personally I think the prices they offer are going to hurt their lux name in the long run. With the prices they quoted yesterday I left the place with less respect then I entered for their pricing/lux name but with great respect for the driving attributes of the 3. I do think the G is a much better looking car though and it's also a hell of a value.
I have no worries whatsoever about that, and here's why. The "lux name" isn't the primary focus, as it is with Lexus, for example. When it comes to BMW, I think of a driving machine first, then I think of style second, then I think of lux, in that order.
The 3-series is a huge seller, and it fits the 1,2,3 priority I just mentioned like a glove. In fact, as it turns out, you re-shuffled your perspective of the 3-series as you explained it in your post. You went in thinking of luxury, but you left realizing that it was the drive that impressed you most.
If the upper series were to be treated like bargain cars, then your concern would be more realistic, IMO. And, as it already is, the upper series needs some improvement in the lux department anyway.
BMW is doing the right thing with the 3-series, IMO.
TagMan
No I wasn't angry. I was just being myself. No anger intended especially to you. In fact that post has been put out of its misery and is erased from history hence it will never be seen again by a new pair of eyes.
would think that, as a BMW fan and owner, you would relish these recent posts that are obviously quite favorable and supportive of BMW and the terrific BMW lease deals.
Nope I really dont care. I am car fan before a brand fan. What triggered my posts were the words "BMW is betting the ranch". BMW's ranch is not even mortgaged (BMW is basically a debt-free company)? BMW's ranch is generating oodles of cash . So it makes me wonder why anybody would say that BMW is betting the ranch.
Which brings me to my next post.
Whoever said residuals should equal actual resale values for any marques (Lexus or BMW) ? In fact residuals are used merely to price a lease and are not suppose to be a carved in stone reality figure. Despite inflated residuals BMWs are among the autos with the highest resale values in the industry. And those BMW resale values are not pie in the sky figures but real figures that are paid by real people.
ou must not be thinking clearly if you buy a used BMW because a new one with 4 years of free service is a lot cheaper. Same with Infiniti. It is what it is.
A used BMW costs more than a spanking new BMW? Certainly not here in Canada. In fact if what you are saying is true BMW would have the lowest resale values in the industry. I am not following how you can even reach such a conclusion? I am assuming you mean residuals (which as you know are not actual resale values). But even if you are talking about residuals I would like you to show me proof of what you are saying and I will immigrate immediately to America (the Land of Milk, Honey and Great BMW Lease Deals) . :shades:
a 535d will likely be my next car. My tall 8 year old daughter is already a bit cramped behind my 335i. Fortunately she's comfortable in my wife's 530i touring so at least I can keep my 3 series for a bit longer.
BMW is a financial house of cards built with Enron foundations.
Underpowered and slow BMWs
Crooked BMW Accountants
BMW cannot make a profit especially with those inflated residuals.
Yes Howard I think I heard those words before.
And yes I agree thank goodness there is an anti-BMW power called Lexus or the whole world would be doomed.
I find it totally hilarious, especially after all the BMW bashing you and I had to endure!
I am still reeling from the effects of post-traumatic BMW-bashing syndrome. As a result, my doctor insists I operate the 545 no faster than 111mph. :surprise:
I will be grinding some special reserve Kona beans to celebrate this historic occasion.
How sweet it is!
From the totally unrelated topic department:
Go Gators for 2 in a row!! :shades:
Yeah, and the Oakland Raiders were supposed to win the 2006 Super Bowl! :P
Absolutely hysterical! Where do they come up with this stuff?
LMAO!!!
Just read today where Toyota is down playing diesels in the U.S. for 2008 and 2009. Probably no cars and maybe some trucks and or large SUVS. They think their gas/electric hybrids do enough for fuel savings. You may convert me to BMW yet.
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
The May C&D issue has a long-awaited comparo of $50k luxury SUV's. The finishing order was:
1. Acura MDX Sport
2. Cadillac SRX AWD V8
3. BMW X5 3.0 si
4. Mercedes Benz ML 350
5. Lexus GX 470
6. Volvo XC90 Sport
7. Volkswagen Tourag V-6
8. Land Rover LR3 HSE
There very well could be an MDX Sport in my future, summer of 2008. I will be driving one at this time, next year.
Enjoy the Masters. Let me know if anyone in your group decides to cancel!
I stopped by to see the convertible today for the first time. It's a sharp looking car and I'm guessing it will be in demand. They had two 328s but no 335s.
BTW my wife now has a thing for the 650 convertible because she says it's the only convertible that doesn't muss her hair, partially due to that big automatic windstop. Of course this is in addition to it being another good-driving BMW. I was quick to remind her that it is useless with regard to utility and rear passengers. Heck, the 530 is almost like a wagon with the fold-down rear seats. She was so impressed with the 650 that she is willing to forget how ugly it is.
That's funny. The drawback to the 3-series is the rear passenger room... man, it's tight back there. In my case, it's going to be the deal-killer, I can predict it now. Your wife's preference for the larger model will also be appreciated by rear passengers.
It's not THAT ugly. It's a BMW.
TagMan
It's not THAT ugly. It's a BMW.
You don't want to get me started on that. I've been silent on the subject for quite some time now.
;-)
houdini,
When those revised 2008 EPA ratings come out, Toyota hybrids are going to get clobbered, and diesels are going to be the big benefactors. It will be interesting. And it's getting closer to reality every day. Personally, I'm as anxious as I've ever been regarding this diesel thing. I think it is going to be awesome. I just read that the brand new C-Class Mercedes diesel doesn't need the urea additive, and it may get 43 MPG!
Let the war hybrid vs. diesel war begin!
TagMan
Oh, no... say it isn't so!
"It's not THAT ugly. It's a BMW."
You don't want to get me started on that. I've been silent on the subject for quite some time now.
LOL!
TagMan
TagMan
That's quite a swing. No matter though, there are lots to choose from. These should be the worst decisions we have to face.
;-)
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
Anyway we took the G35 today and I just pulled it into the garage after dinner at the Outback. I would have flipped a coin between the 3 and G and both were just about the same price. Both cars are fabulous. But my wife and son preferred the G, particularly the styling of it and they loved the Infiniti grill design and the Infiniti interior. Great deals available on both cars. The garage looks a little funny tonight with 3 cars inside and all my pool stuff (I put in a natural pool last summer) straightened up.
Took some pix and maybe I'll figure out how to upload them later or tomorrow.
Houdini,
The brand new 2008 C-Class actually looks to be much roomier than a 3-series could ever hope to be, especially in the rear passenger area. The latest pics and videos suggest a nice little daily driver with lots of amenities... and if the diesel version comes our way and delivers 43 mpg... well then, it will be a smash hit.
Also, the new C-Class will offer a choice of "sport" model or "lux" model, with unique grills as well. The sport model will have an SL type front grill, while the lux model will have a downsized S-Class look.
To be honest, I'd rather see my wife in a new C-Class than that Vanden Plas. That Jag is too big for my tastes, but this particular decision is not mine to make... it's the wife's, and rightly so. I've got the Carrera S Cab, and I dare not push my luck, if you know what I mean.
TagMan
Congratulations on the G35. A friend of mine has one, and absolutely loves it. Infiniti does interiors well for the money, IMO. Certainly, if the interior was a big part of the decision, then Infiniti is nicer than the Bimmer. I'm surprised that you didn't find the BMW driving dynamics the deal clincher, but if the car is for your son, than maybe you don't want him racing around too much.
You did a fair test and made your choice. I hope the car works out well for you and your family! Did you say what color combination you came home with?
TagMan
We recently picked up an FJ to take the team gear to the Little League games (I'm team manager), and also haul our bicycles around, when we want to ride once in a while. It makes a good utility vehicle, IMO.
It's got serious rear and right rear-quarter visibility issues that take some getting used to. Other than that, it seems to have some sort of serious cool factor, because it frequently draws a lot of attention and questions from folks wherever we go. That is surprising to me.
It's the first Toyota I ever purchased in my life!!... and I feel as though I have committed a crime to have done so.
TagMan
Well for someone who has been driving around in a lot of sports cars, you should be used to that by now.
;-)
Loved the 3 but this is a 3rd car that my son will really drive longer term. For me it was 51-49 in favor of BMW to be honest. But I absolutely love the G. Can't go wrong with either car and the G has a more lux feel to me but these cars are about luxury second.
I took G35AWD in graphite gray with a stone interior, the premium packag, SAT radio and some dealer installed goodies. MSRP is 37,750.
I haven't shopped at this level in a while so prices really surprised me as they were lower than I thought. Didn't look at the IS but just called to reference a price for comparison. I'm surprised Lexus is selling the IS so well as the IS250AWD was a lot more expensive on lease.
BTW - in both cases - 3 and G, it's better financially to lease and buy at lease end rather than buy up front based on the figures I got on both cars.
Dman - took the AWD sedan. The coupe gets redone next year. I didn't realize Infiniti stopped making the Q. It comes back next year sometime.
The car really sounds nice, and so much equipment for about $37+K. I have always thought the interior of the Infiniti is an obvious steal compared to almost any other brand at the same price point. I posted such a remark in the HELC forum after my visit to the International Auto Show last Thanksgiving.
But, your statement that I re-quoted you above, well... that's a real surprise. I would not have ever expected that to be the case. Usually, it becomes more expensive to own the car after having leased it, as compared to having purchased it to begin with. The nice thing here, if I understand you correctly, is that it seems that you can have your cake and eat it too... A great lease, and a great option to purchase, if you want to keep the car!! Is this the situation?
TagMan
link title
Watch all 3.
TagMan
And I thought MY better half was being a bit crazy about her next car. She drives the RX, but is yearning for an S550 4Matic first and foremost. I drove that baby last week... boy, was I impressed. The only drawback is the price tag. $100,000 is just very hard to swallow. Maybe I can work out a nice lease?
:confuse:
If not... does anyone know whether or not the S450 is coming to the US? I've read on a few occasions that it is, but I can't be sure. That would be more reasonable than the 550, as she's not the kind of gal that speeds in any open highway.
'06 Audi A3 2.0T DSG • '05 Audi S4 Cabriolet • '04 Lexus RX330
Gear shifting toilet plunger
Story posted on: March 29, 2007
link title
Heck, this toilet plunger has even more speeds than my car. Boasting a six-speed shifter at the top, you will be able to remove virtually any item clogging up the toilet while imaging yourself speeding down the highway with wind blowing through your hair and a beautiful blonde sitting beside. Of course, once you get the offending bits out, reality beckons and all you're faced with is no Ferrari but a porcelain throne and some brown floating bits. Those interested in the chrome-plated plunger will be able to acquire one by forking out $32.
Dman - thanks for the nice words. I meant to say that last night.
How many years is the lease? So, you indicate that will likely buy the G35, but the next few years are going to bring all of us some very innovative and cool cars... at lease end, you may be enticed by one of them. And with your business having grown so much by then, who knows? Could be that you say godbye to the G35 at lease end, and scoop up something even better, AND that SL for you as well!
Regarding the R8... the intro price seems to be a bargain, but I'd wait for the convertible version that will likely come out after a while. The LF-A (also no convertible?) has no scheduled production yet, does it?
TagMan
TagMan
I'll try a link for a pix. Not sure which, if either will work though.
http://i14.tinypic.com/4867n06.jpg
[IMG]http://i14.tinypic.com/4867n06.jpg[/IMG]
http://i12.tinypic.com/44gtvh1.jpg
http://i7.tinypic.com/3534dwm.jpg
http://i3.tinypic.com/2ikfe6o.jpg
http://i11.tinypic.com/35iyrgo.jpg