Got a Quick Question for a Car Dealer?

isellhondas

Nobody here can answer that since it will vary by the state and county you live in.

Some states have no sales tax and others like Washington have a whopping 9.8% sales tax on cars. Licence fees can vary by a lot too.

Why not just ask the store where you plan to buy the car?

bvdj84

Ok, Here we go. I have a question for a dealer.

I have a GM car. An 08 G6 4cyl, Red,Sedan, black leather, roof, spoiler, loaded except for the V6 and fog lights. Miles: 35,543

It is a lease. 39mth, 12k a year. Lease signed: 04/26/08 Expires: 07/2011

Obviously, I am over my miles for where I should be at this time. Meaning, no way will I be in good shape for the expiration date. If I wait. My pay off would be okay, but my miles would starting adding back into that. But, there has to be a happy medium to where I trade in when miles are close, but the trade in is decent.

I did get an estimate in the spring, and it wasn't too bad. I might have to go in again and see what I can do.

I will have to start looking heavily into my options! I did look up my trade in value, and its a bit under $10,000.

I am nervous that this could turn into a huge a problem!! Would you please list all of my options. I am sure that I am not the only one to go over, but going over miles on a GM car and a G6 which is no longer made is going to hurt.

When do you think I should trade, that is the bottom line. Wanting to trade for either a Honda or VW.

Thank you so much! I appreciate it.

tjc78

What is your buyout right now? That will tell you everything you need to know. If it is anywhere close to what the car is worth you may be able to trade out of it.

If you keep it to the end you will be around 15K over the mileage allocation. At .20 a mile that is a whopping $3000.

So if it was me I would trade out now even with some negative equity as you are going to get nailed if you turn it in that far over miles.

bodi

I know the sales tax rate.

My question was for the cost of registration and license.
The state is Florida, Putnam county.(32189)
Thanks.

Kirstie_H

Google helped me with this one:

http://www.flhsmv.gov/dmv/faqmotor.html#5

bvdj84

Say I get a $3,000 in overage fees.......Would that be something the new dealer, say at a NON GM dealer would roll into the new deal or does GM require that to be paid directly? I am sure it can probably be rolled into the new deal?? I have thought about doing that, but I have heard GM can have some real difficult leases to get out of without some damage.

Say I go to Honda, and want an Accord, can Honda just have that fee rolled into the deal?

tjc78

Not sure about getting the overage fees rolled into your new car payment. I suppose it could be done (dealer would cut a check after the fact), however, I would have to tell you that wouldn't be the best choice throwing all that (in effect) negative equity into a new loan.

You can buy a lease out at any time. GMAC should have a payoff figure available to buy it outright. If that # is close to what you can get for the car in a trade in you can make a deal at any time.

What I would do is call GMAC get the payoff # and shop around to see what the actual trade in value would be. I would assume you are upside down, but maybe not $3000?

Another option would be to just buy the car at the end of the lease. That way you wouldn't be responsible for the overage. All in all that is most likely the cheapest way out.

bvdj84

Either way, I do realize that I am going to be negative. But, which options result in a lower negative way is the key? If I choose to wait it out, let it expire, take mileage hit, and possibly roll in the fees to a new deal then that could work. If I choose to trade now, than I am still working with a negative number because of my pay off. But, the issue is, that am I in that point in the lease where its best to get out before I get into deep? Bottom line. Which option would have the lowest negative number?

I could call GMAC, but it never works as their amount will differ in the dealer pay off. It could help me estimate, but the dealer would be slightly lower. I found it much better, much much better to work with my dealer in getting the raw facts about my numbers. They even printed off a sheet with all the info and said that I could just use that in a new deal anywhere. Of course that was in the Spring. I have not been back to re-estimate. It didn't matter where I went. That would be the number GMAC would want to satisfy me. Trade in value would be up to the dealer and market.

I don't really want to buy out the car. Because, it would then be mine. Too much hassle for me. Maybe as long as I trade before my expiration date and before 39,000 miles, then I will not be forced the mileage fees, rather being faced with being upside down more! Leaving me only about 4mths left to trade! AHHH!!!
I drive about 1,000miles a month!! :surprise:

So you are thinking to trade soon? Bite the bullet and try to get out!

jipster

A two year old Honda, especially a Civic can and will sell for nearly as much as a new one. Some people think saving 1000.00 by buying a used one is a good deal

Maybe 10 years ago, but hardly a good deal these days., The competition ( Ford, Nissan, Kia... namely Hyundai) has not only closed in and met Honda and Toyota quality and reliability, but surpassed it in many cases as well. Fewer and fewer people paying those high margins I believe.

tjc78

Maybe as long as I trade before my expiration date and before 39,000 miles

You can trade out after 39K (but before exp date). GMAC doesn't car how many miles are on the car if they aren't getting it back.

I could call GMAC, but it never works as their amount will differ in the dealer pay off

I don't understand that one. The payoff should be the payoff. It can vary by a few bucks depending on what time of the month and the last payment made was.

So you are thinking to trade soon? Bite the bullet and try to get out!

How negative were you when you tried in the spring? It probably isn't much better now with the 2011s on the horizon. The G6 was dumped into fleets and resale most likely isn't that great. If you are $3K or more negative now I wouldn't even try. OTOH if you can get a trade in that is relatively close to the payoff it may pay to do it now. Only thing you can do is shop around and try to make it work.

Is there a family member who drives less you can switch cars with or anything you can do to lessen the overage charges if you keep it until the end? You said you drive 1000 miles a month. If that is the case why are you over?

bvdj84

That is true I could trade out after 39k. They wouldn't be getting it back anyway. The new dealer would. They would then be compensated by the new lease company.

Dealers have a cheaper buyout price in which is not disclosed to the consumer unless, I got to my dealer like I did and see what the pay off would be. They have a different number presented to me.

I am not sure right off hand how upside down I was, but to trade my car for a 25k Jetta lease it was putting my payment in the lower to mid 500's. I would be willing to trade for a cheaper car, to get out, but I want to lease the car I want this time. Not too bad in my opinion. Never would take the deal itself, but better than I thought.

I am over my miles because I have taken it on numerous trips out of town and life in general got extremely busy. I should have rented a car. My fault.

qbrozen

My calculations are a bit different. Looks to me like you will be more like 11k miles over (a bit less), and I'd be surprised if the overage charge on a 12k/yr Pontiac is 20 cents. How bout 18? So you'd be looking at just under $2k.

My guess is you are more upside down than that. And, if the lease was heavily subsidized, you may be more upside down than that for the entire lease, leaving you no choice but to pay the overage.

Alternatively, when you hit 39k, you could pay the remaining lease payments and turn it back in early. Of course, you should carefully consider what that is truly costing you, though. If, for example, that's 5 mos early and you are paying $300/mo, you are paying $1500 to get out of it and then taking on a payment for a replacement car. Would probably be cheaper to pay for the miles.

tjc78

I hear you on going over, its one of the risks you take with leasing. I am on my fourth lease in a row. Although I never go over miles I have an older S10 that I could always fall back on just in case.

As for the Jetta, you must have been very upside down. Just to put it in perspective my 35K+ car leased out at 465 (36m/12K lease with around $1000 down inc taxes).

It sounds as if you are definately in a bind with this car. If you can't get out now, my best suggestion to you is to start trying to save up to pay for the overage fees (and keep mileage at minimum) so that when the lease goes back you can come away clean.

One more note, if you are leasing again be sure to get 15K a year. It usually only reduces the residual by 1 or 2% which doesn't kill you in payments.

tjc78

Looks to me like you will be more like 11k miles over (a bit less),

He mentioned 1000 miles a month in a later post, so, yes that seems more accurate.

I like your idea about evaluating it at 39K. If the payments are low enough it just might work, or at worst case be even and get him into a new vehicle sooner.

bvdj84

It sounds like worst case scenario is that if I wait until next July, I will still have to roll in those fees into a new deal or pay for it. Even my dealer hinted at that too, that it would be so bad if I waited until then. A few thousand negative for miles- when being compared to trading early and having the pay off being the culprit. 2 big smacks in the face..lol.

Now way am I going to walk away clean. Not expecting that, but closer to it would be nice. Normally trade value wouldn't be an issue, but since I know that I am over miles. that is what's killing it all.

I will try to do some research and investigating. I will go to my dealer and get another pay off amount. See what they could possibly do. At this point, they might be willing to assist more in me getting me out. They know I want out, but now its becoming more of a real issue. I don't want to wait until the last minute and scramble around. Worst possible way to do a deal. I do have a little bit of time. Not a lot though!

Thank you all for your help...anymore thoughts, keep them coming. I am taking it all in thought.

isellhondas

No good solution here.

You have a car no honda or Toyota dealer is going to want.

It's a Pontiac, not a popular car at all and it a 4 cyl which few people want.

Chances are it won't be worth anywhere near what the residual is. I'm sure GM would LOVE for you to trade it in.

You have two options. One would be for you to buy the car at the end of the lease in which case the miles won't matter or you can take your lumps and pay the excess miles charge.

isellhondas

Kia surpassed Honda and Toyota in quality? Not even close!

People just don't buy used Korean cars even though they have improved. I'll give Ford and Nissan high marks for improvement too.

As used cars, they don't sell well at all and they bomb at the auction.

Hondas and Toyotas hold their value. It's amazing!

jb_turner

"All I really want is a drive away price that includes everything."

Then shop OTD. We all pay it.

jipster

Kia surpassed Honda and Toyota in quality

Yeah... that must have been a misprint. Throw Kia out of that group.They've come a long way, still a long way to go IMO.

jwilliams2

People just don't buy used Korean cars even though they have improved.
As used cars, they don't sell well at all and they bomb at the auction.

Yes, although in quality you must admit they are a step up from Chinese built cars. :P

isellhondas

I've never seen a Chinese car but I'm sure you're right.

bvdj84

Thank you all for your help!! This definitely gives me a lot to think about.

It is true that their not likely to want my car. A Honda dealer even more so. I will say that my dealer has always given me decent quotes as they sell GM products.

With every month that goes by, my payoff gets a bit lower. I have a little less than a year. In a normal car that didn't have so many odds against it. You could most likely get out of a lease after either half way or after in the lease with lower amount of damage. But, only in the best scenario. Low miles, good condition, market conditions. Right now, the odds simply add up. This is when GM has put me in a bind with the value, but I did so too, with driving too much! If I kept it til lease end with proper mileage, than value would not matter in a lease. I just drop it off, clean and clear.

I really do not want to buy out my car. Way too much hassle. I'll just trade it. I don't want to own this GM car. It would really be the same as paying the mileage fees. Either option will have money owed involved.

The car I want: Lease-Accord EX-L V6

isellhondas

You really can't trade it in without taking the same hit!

It won't be worth the residual even if the miles were acceptable.

Since you don't want to keep it, you really need to ride out the lease and take the mileage hit. If you get rid of it now you will be responsible for the remaining lease payments and the excess miles which they would prorate.

tjc78

If you get rid of it now you will be responsible for the remaining lease payments and the excess miles which they would prorate.

Why? If he was to trade it in and the selling dealer pays off the full balance (payoff) they would own the car and GMAC shouldn't care about anything. Obviously any negative equity would need to paid or rolled into the new deal.

A few years back I had two months to go on a lease and the dealer I was buying from wanted my car to sell on their lot. They called my leasing company and bought the car from them for my payoff (saving me two payments in the process). Granted it was low miles and clean and I would assume the payoff made sense to them to be able to sell the car at a profit. It didn't impact my deal at all as my new lease was computed before the used car manager saw my car and wanted it.

If you are thinking that no dealer would want it, or its waayyyy out of equity (good possibility) then I completely agree to turn it in and pay the overage. Hopefully with the amount of miles that may be on the car bvdj84 won't have to put new tires as well.

isellhondas

Here's why...

I'm pretty sure that Pontiac is worth far less than the residual.

GM did some very dumb things when they were desperate to move some slow selling cars. They put some VERY attractive leases that had artifically low payments. They only way they can do this is to set the residuals too high and hope for the best at lease end.

Other manufactures including Honda ahve done this in the past. It's like they mortage tomorrow for a sale today.

Then they hope and pray that the lessor will buy the car at lease end.

If not, they end up taking the car back and they lose thousands of dollars at the auction.

You can certainly trade it in. The Honda dealer will call GMAC for a payoff and I'm guessing it's actual value will be several thousand dollars less than that.

Making things worse, it's a car nobody wants. GM sold tons of these to the rental companies and the market is flooded with these cars nobody wants.

It can certainly be traded in and some negative equity can be rolled into another lease but the buyer is going to have to write a big check for this to happen.

tjc78

. They only way they can do this is to set the residuals too high and hope for the best at lease end.

I certainly can understand where you are coming from. Money factors and residuals are "played" with all the time. My current car had a resonable residual, but the MF was really low. IIRC it was equal to 1.44%.

The Honda dealer will call GMAC for a payoff and I'm guessing it's actual value will be several thousand dollars less than that.

Oh yeah, I think there is no doubt in that. My stand was that if the negative equity was less than the potential mileage penalty at lease end it may have made sense to get out now.

bvdj84

Thanks. Very good points! I probably will trade it in. It reality I still have some time to work with. If I wait closer to the end date, then the only thing hurting me will be depreciation and pay off. Rather waiting until the date and get hit with overage fees.

I did get a killer lease deal on this car. Priced at over $25, not sure what my sale price was, but my payment matched the the price of my $21,000sale priced 06 Accord lease I had. I only pay $319 a month. $0 down. Literally a buck more than my Accord lease.

The only thing then is higher miles and value then factored into pay off.

I think now is the time for me to atleast get an estimate, that way I will know exactly where I stand. But, my Honda dealer around here is horrible! I could just try going to my dealer, which is VW. I would be willing to get a VW. I lease one already. They were more than willing to provide all the numbers for me before.

Thanks again for laying all the hard facts out there! I am armed with info now.

isellhondas

You are going to get hit for high miles too if you trade it in.

People who lease cars really need to consider everything and not just the payment. If you know you are going to drive a lot of miles you can structure the lease with that in mind.

It won't hurt to find out where you stand. Hopefully it won't be as as bad as I think it will be.

bvdj84

Yes, I didn't know that I would be driving so much more now. I definitely will get 15k mile lease. Yes either way I'll get hit for mileage, but perhaps less if I trade it before my lease end date. Who knows. I just got to try. First things first. Its all speculation of what could happen and will happen I still have time to get my ducks in a row. But, don't want to go into it all blind. I'll get that estimate, definitely share what I find out.

Lesson learned: Don't rush into a deal like I did. Take your time!

isellhondas

Well, good luck. I hope it works out.

Instead of leasing again you may look into the great financing Honda has going on right now. the best I've ever seen!

bvdj84

I have thought about owning, especially with owning a Honda. Your getting more for what you are paying. I would imagine that when the refreshed Accord arrives, deals on current models will increase.

snakeweasel

Don't knock the Chinese, they have made great strides in all types of vehicles. Did you see the new bus that the Chinese developed?

mako1a

I can't configure the 2011 Mustang in Yellow/Orange or get the Shaker 1000 in the 6 cylinder. Can anyone tell me why and if they're going to offer those choices later?

Mr_Shiftright

Looks like you can get that color in the V6 but not the audio package. That's just the way Ford options it. I suppose there is no reason you couldn't install the Shaker 1000 or better yet, upgrade to something aftermarket that is just as good.

mako1a

Or pull a Jack Nicholson and order the GT with Shaker 1000, hold the V8.

tjc78

Welcome to buying cars today. Drives me nuts that everything is in "packages" When I bought my car last year, I really wanted HID headlights.... unavailable without getting the full "tech package" which had NAV and parking sensors. I didn't want all that.

Mr_Shiftright

Well it's all carefully calculated to get you to upgrade of course, and it also streamlines their production process. So it's annoying but rational.

isellhondas

Exactly.

Years ago it was possible to special order cars with the equipment you wanted and that's why we see some oddball cars at the old car events.

Like a 1962 Chevy Biscayne Station Wagon with a 409 engine and factory air conditioning. No power steering, radio or heater.

Can you imagine if someone had ordered that car and then backed out?

It would have sat on the lot for years!

imidazol97

Or a 1980 Mustang with a 305 or 307 with a 3-speed manual on the floor AND with air conditioning, All in a Grande' package with the 1/2 vinyl roof and houndstooth checked seats.

exb0

I went to a local Toyota store with bad reputation (BBB rating is C-) to test drive a Prius. While sitting in their parking lot playing with the NAV, another customer gets into his car parked next to me. He motions to me to roll down my window and tells me that if I want a good price on the Prius I should go to another store 50 miles away. I started laughing, and the salesman, who was sitting next to me, started screaming: “Sir, that’s just wrong!” I don’t know what they did to this guy, but he was furious.

Question to a Toyota salesman:

I am in Northern VA, Midatlantic Region. I was interested in Prius III that has auto climate control, Bluetooth and upgraded sound system, all the things that I like and want. However, it doesn’t have lumbar support that I absolutely need. To get the lumbar support, I need to move up to Prius IV, which adds leather seats, and in my region, $2500 NAV package. However, it doesn’t have power seats or sunroof. The difference between Prius III and IV is $5000.

Questions: are there any regions that sell Prius IV without the NAV package? How much is there in trunk money for 2010 Prius? Dealer’s first pencil for model IV with NAV was $26300 including the junk fees, that’s $1300 under Edmunds invoice. When is 2011 coming out? Is there a chance they will change packaging in 2011?

isellhondas

I don't sell Toyotas or anything else anymore but I have worked with people who sold them.

The different packages they offer are nuts according to them and very confusing to say the least.

Too bad Mackabee isn't with us anymore. He would have had a good answer for you.

jayrider

Great story. In the midwest there are plenty of prius IV's without nav. Check truecar to find a dealer near you but you may have a problem if they all order them with nav. Prius IV msrp 27300 sells for about 25000 in the st. louis area. Add 750 for .9% financing--60 months.

bronsonb

I remember in the early 80s, GM had the four door Malibu/Regal/Cutlass variety that I think made up a lot of company car fleets. These cars were decent, but I recall that although they were four doors, the back door windows did not roll down. The only way you could roll down windows was to get the option for power windows in the back. My dad's company was so cheap they had optioned a Malibu four door with regular "manual" windows in the front and power windows in the back. I can't believe how silly that looked, and it must have saved them all of $200 or so to go that route.

For the life of me, I can't recall how or if the driver had a "master" control for those two windows on the driver's door or not. But 'twas strange.

As for the Biscayne wagon without the heater, that's just strange. I mean, I thought heaters were pretty standard since that's one thing an engine seems to generate without much fuss...heat (unless it's an old VW bug).

mako1a

Not so much a question as a response.
I just came from a Ford Dealer in Christiansburg, Va. I said I want a Base 6 cyl Mustang with A/T with the Shaker 1000. I like cloth seats and don't want color speedo.
Fine, but we can't get the Shaker 1000 in a 6 cyl. No problem, it lists as a $1295 option. Get me one and install it and I'll pay for it plus labor. No dice. Dealer can't get or install.

Before you think I'm too picky, I've had some nice stereos in my day. Levinson, Nakamechi, Hi end Bose, and none of them sound as good to my ear as a factory installed Ford hi end stereo. I had a Mach 460 in a Mustang and a JBL in an Explorer Limited. Both were excellent to my ears. Far above any other factory or aftermarket system.

Mr Mullaly, are you listening? Most of your 6 cyl Mustangs are going to sell to the boomer crowd that have waited 45 years for a decent HP rating in a Mustang and we know "exactly" what we want and have the do-re-mi to back up our desires.

Mr_Shiftright

Gee I can't imagine a factory system competing with a $2000 aftermarket setup. The factory uses pretty mediocre speakers as a rule, and generally puts all the sound in the midrange. They might be LOUD but you are losing a lot of sound range, especially on the high end.

tjc78

had a Mach 460 in a Mustang and a JBL in an Explorer Limited. Both were excellent to my ears. Far above any other factory or aftermarket system.

Mako,

I am a pretty avid audio enthusiast in addition to being a car lover. A well planned and properly installed aftermarket system can and will outperform just about anything installed by the factory despite the brand name. I have had JBL systems in Fords, Lincolns and Toyotas in addition to the Lexicon system I have in my Genesis. All have been excellent, but could not compare with the aftermarket systems I have installed.

If you are serious about a V6 Stang I would get a hold of a good car audio installer in your area (Not Best Buy) and ask them what they would recommend for a new Mustang. I would think for a little more than Ford's $1295 you could get one heck of a system. Today, they can even make your steering wheel controls work with aftermarket gear. If you want to go fancier you could even incorporate an in-dash GPS unit.

exb0

After 50 all you can hear is midrange, so what's the problem?

exb0

Thank you for your reply. It seems like closest states that sell Prius IV without NAV are Ohio and New York.

A co-worker of mine suggested to buy a pillow type lumbar support from the healthyback,com. I might do just that and rent a Prius for few days and see how it feels.

Mr_Shiftright

You talkin' to me?

Yeah, you're right but I was directing those comments to the young 'uns who haven't yet sustained irreversible rock concert ear damage. :P

mako1a

Gee I can't imagine a factory system competing with a $2000 aftermarket setup.

My Z28 has aftermarket. Kenwood Amp, Alpine deck, Fosgate speakers. Huge red wires from the battery. Best part is the USB port (I like that) About $1200 installed.
He had Polk, Punch, Boston Acoustics and Rockford Fosgate and said Fosgate was the best. I think he was wrong (or he could hear something I couldn't).
Sorry, still like the Mach 460 better. It had a driver that vibrated the whole interior.

C'mon, Ford. You're the big Kahuna of the Detroit Three. Just give me what I want.