High Performance Luxury Sedans

sam775

Looks like a good comparison. If you had the cash
(sure wish I did) which would you buy and why?
Thoughts...

woochow

I just placed an order for the M5. The E 55 was wonderful also, but available only as an automatic, and Mercedes automatic transmission is a little slow to respond.
I think the Benz may be more reliable than the M5,
but I will probably sell it before the warantee is up. The Jag although it has a wonderful engine, just seemed too soft and I really don't like the styling.

merc1

This is a tough comparison, being a Benz fan. I do think the M5 is the better all-out sports sedan. However I think the Benz will do all of the "normal" car things better. Things like durability, safety, comfort, reliability and resale will all be in favor of the Benz. I just don't think that those things can erase the 400HP and better handling of the BEEMER.

M

jesseliu

Well,

I love my E55 and it handles very well. I can't imagine pushing it to the point where the M5 would easily out handle me. It goes almost way too fast as is. I personally like the auto because I don't want to be driving a manual all over the place. This is an everyday car and it makes a big difference. I would love to get a M5 for the weekends.
In terms of the tranny, the AMG version of the V12 tranny in the E55 responds much better than a normal mercedes tranny.

merc1

Did you have an E500 before or is this your first Benz? The E55 is the type of car I hope to someday own. If you had a E500/500E before how does the E55 compare. The old E500/500E and the current SL Roadster are at the top of the "lust object" list for me. Not that other Benzes aren't one the list, they just don't rank as high.

M

jesseliu

no I never owned a E500/500E.(sigh) I have owned numerous Mercedes in the past. 300D '78, S500 '97 (Coupe), E320 '96, C280 '96, CLK430 '99, CLK430 '99 (number2), ML430 '99. You might want to take a look at Mercedesshop.com. There are quite a few E500 or 500E owners on that board. I believe that the normal concensus is that the E55 is much better. Of course there will be some hardcore E500 owners that disagree. : )
This is nothing against the E500. Its just that in terms of technological advances and all ... the E55 has superior technology.

merc1

I'll look there, thanks Why 2 CLK430's?

M

chavis10

This is a superhightech version of Cadillac's STS. Don't laugh at it because it's a Caddy and because it's front wheel drive. This car the most technologically enhanced vehicle on the road (exept for maybe the S-Class). I do like the M5, but in terms of innovative material it is no match the STSi. The STSi has:

*320-horsepower Northstar
*Enhanced StabiliTrak 2.0 chassis control system specially adapted for the high-speed, all-weather conditions
*High Intensity Discharge (HID) headlights
*Night Vision technology
*Performance seating with improved lateral support and Cervigard anti-whiplash head restraint and seat system
*18-inch open-spoke, cast aluminum wheels mated to Goodyear Eagle F1 GS Z-rated P275/40ZR-18 tires
*Larger brakes with oversized rotors, pistons and calipers
*Larger brakes with oversized rotors, pistons and calipers

Stabilitrak 2.0 is the most advanced, sophisticated stability enhance program on the market today. Now it includes, active steering effort, side slip-rate control and an enhanced version of CVRSS which now includes ransient roll control, lateral support and stability control iteration.

Sure this high-po Caddy won't accelerate as fast or handle is well as the cars mentioned in this topic. However, it well be the only all weather performance sport sedan.

merc1

Chavis,

If this so-called hi-po Caddy won't accelerate or handle as good as the cars mentioned here, then what the hell is all that junk for then. What would be the point, Cadillac would only get humiliated trying to compete at this level. All that technology means nothing if it doesn't put the Caddy on top, it simply isn't serving its purpose. The goal of this elite group of cars is first and foremost performance. In fairness I would like to see Cadillac build a car like you've mentioned, only to see the look on the faces of Lexus, Infiniti and Acura.

M

chavis10

Infiniti and Acura, what cars do they build that are better than the STS? Please tell me because I don't know any that exist.

C

jesseliu

Reason why 2 CLK430's was because of transmission problems and others too numerous to mention. Obviously the reason why I traded up to the E55.

chavis10

I'm jealous, i wish I had as many cars as you!!! Anyway, what other cars did you consider besides all those MBs? Just curious.

merc1

Infinit and Acura cars have better build quality that Cadillac, that's it. A Caddy STS will outrun, out-handle and humiliate any Acura or Infiniti 4-door. Infiniti's Q45 looks like a future Lincoln TownCar. Infiniti is the sorryest of the 3 Japanese luxury cars. No argument there. I would have to probably choose the STS over any Acura or Infiniti 4-door. Although the RL screams quality in its body and paint.

M

jesseliu

I was thinking M5, Jag XKR, Porsche 996, Porsche '96 turbo (USED), Lotus Esprit, Ferrari 355 (USED), S500 '00. M5 and Jag lost because they weren't out yet. Porsche 996 lost because its slower and when I went to test drive it it had numerous rattles and creaks. Porsche '96 turbo lost because too expensive. Lotus Esprit lost because Wife wanted E55 instead, said that Esprit wasn't practical. Ferrari 355 Lost because same reason as Esprit(Not to mention a bit expensive).
S500 lost because its just looks like it built for OLD people. And, I don't think I'm that old yet.

benzo1

Can you tell me how the E55 and the M5 ride on the rough roads .Because were we live the roads are really rough in certain areas.

jesseliu

Can't comment on the M5 but the E55 still has a very smooth ride. Its amazing considering the rims and tires and stiffened suspension. My mother has a 96 E320 and it rides almost the same.

fastek

Seriously considering an E55. Has anyone checked availablity on the 2000 models yet? Thanks...Rick

ljohnson9

Has anyone found a reasonable way to buy the E55? The system seems to too demand driven to get a good deal. Maybe a lease or a trip to Germany is the only way to do it. Thanks... LJ

jesseliu

Only reasonable way is to order one and wait. Either that or pay a premium to get one now.

Of course you could buy a used one ... I've seen a couple.

ljohnson9

Even the used ones are 10k over MSRP... like $79k for a 99 with 4kmiles... hardly a bargain. Maybe if the stock market crashes, the greed factor will disappear for hot E55's
LJ

ljohnson9

Honest, I am not trying to crash the market just to get a discounted E55....

sergeym

I am in NYC and Yesterday I ordered E55 for February delivery and it was the best the dealer could do. He also mentioned that I could have one immediately for 5K over MSRP. I ordered black car and did not really want a black interior but it seems that E55 comes only with black/black or black/white leather the latter I saw on C43 and did not like. Do you guys know where can I find more information about ext/int color combinations available for E55?

Thanks.

jesseliu

Go to mercedes web site. You should be able to build one there. By the way, the interior colors for a 2000 E55 are different now. The SILVER/Black combination is gone.

ljohnson9

Did the dealer give you MSRP for the February order? If so , that's well worth the wait.

shawnx

Does anyone when the M5 will become available?

rollie

Regarding post #24:

shawnx, I stopped by Herb Chambers BMW in Boston 2 days ago to ask this question and was told, "Spring if you order now".

-rdo
russell.ollie@ibm.net

kp11

bottom line with cadillac is that its american... no way can an american car face up to the european and japanese cars... can u seriously say that the cadillac can face up to the ls400... i don't think so.... it can't even stand up to the gs400

anyway getting back to teh subject, i would eliminate the xjr just because its not as sporty and refined as the other two... the other 2 are very close... depends on what u want... the m5 is more aggressive and u have the fun of a stick shift, but if you want a car thats almost as good as the m5 but in my opinion a bit more comfortable, i'd opt for the e55... just my opinion...

kp11

audi is coming out with its s8 which is supposedly a more aggressive and sportier a8... however does anyone know anything about htis car, as if it is as good as the m5 or the e55...

jesseliu

The S8 goes against the S55 more. The car from Audi that fits in this grouping would be the S6 not the S8.

scarconk

How would the E55 perform in a New England winter? At a minimum I would think the performance tires would need to come off, but what would be the cost in terms of handling? Would I be better off just putting the car away for a few months each year?

droeber

Shawnx, the boat with the first M5s for the East was due in port on Sept 19 and the dealer should get the first one on the 28th. As you might imagine the buyer has had his order in for two years and the dealer has ten orders for a projected six deliveries. I am waiting on a list with about 20 others for a call to look at it before it goes out the door. Chances of getting one this model year are almost impossible.

jesseliu

Considering the tire size you might be best to get a set of snow tires. Of course with smaller tires handling will be affected but I don't think your going to be doing double the speed limit with snow on the ground.

kp11

the s55 would be much higher in price, also the a8 is in the same class as the jag which is competing against the e55

jesseliu

regardless of price those are the correct cars to compete against each other.

singh5

straight up, which is better, e55 or m5, and y?

kp11

personally, i prefer the e55, the new 2000 model has sportshift, which makes it as fast as the m5... maybe .1 or .2 seconds slower... luxury and comfort wise, teh e55 is better, and it is just as fast as the m5... but, if u are only buying the "super sedans" for pure performance, then teh m5 is a better choice, both of them loaded, teh m5 is about 5k less than the e55... so do u want pure performance, or do u want luxury and comfort along with performance

kp11

well would the xjr go against the s55 then? if the s8 would go against the s55 so would the xjr, but it goes against the e55... i'm just guessing here

rmwalton

I saw an article in one of the car mags (sorry, can't remember which one) at Barnes and Noble about a month ago that menioned a C55 in addition to the E55. Anybody heard more?

Also, what would be the deciding factors, other than price, between choosing a C43 or E55? What if a C55 is in the mix?

There is one C43 and one E55 on the lot here in town, so the question is not purely hypothetical. I own a C280 and really like it, but would love to have something more powerful and a bit exclusive, in an understated way.

Thanks.

rande36

Not sure about the C55, though I've heard rumors, but the C class competes with the smaller 3 series from BMW and others in that size class. Interesting though, that in virtually every comparison I've read, the C43 doesn't seem to do all that well. That's why I went with the M3 over it. It (the C43) seems to kind of be in a class of it's own. But certainly the E55, XJR and M5 are the only things in that class right now. Car magazine (British pub) did a review of the M5 a couple of months ago and had a short spread on those three. They did a nice job of comparing them. They all have their strengths (yeah, even the Jag!) and it'd be hard to go wrong with any of 'em - certainly not the E55 or M5.

merc1

AMG currently will start offering C55's later this year or at the beginning of next year.

M

merc1

In Europe that is.....

M

jesseliu

Merc1 on is correct the C55 is available in Europe. We will be getting a supercharged version of the V6 to replace the 4.3AMG engine in the current C43.

kp11

i love lexuses, if some of you havne't seen me in other rooms, but i know that people bash the gs400 for its handling, even though its near perfection in EVERY OTHER category, well has anyone seen teh gs400 L, this looks very promising, and i doubt it will by much better, but basically it combines near bmw handling with the lexus... a perfect combination at a great price

jesseliu

Not to start this war all over again, but my understanding was that the GS series didn't have the quality control or build quality that is known for Lexus. Also the GS400 doesn't fit in this category.

kp11

yes i know the gs400 doesn't fit this category, i just brought it up because someone brought up the c430

kp11

... will compete against the e55, m5 and xjr because it is a medium size car and by dimensions and engines and other factors, that is what it competes with, teh s55 is not its competitor because its a large car... also has anyone heard if bmw is coming out with its m7?

ljohnson9

The GS400 does not fit in this class, but if Lexus sneaks in the GS440 later in Y2k, then they will have entered this class..... except for price as they will be a solid 15k less. In my mind Lexus will enter the performance race as it is such a big issue with the luxury car guys.... and whatever they come out with will zap the E55 and M5 just like the initial GS400 did at the time... and on & on it goes. I can't wait to get a 52K GS440 leaving the M5 crowd to wonder what happened with their 80k rip-off.

jesseliu

I've always thought of the Audi 8 series as a competitor for the S class. my understanding was that the Audi 6 series was the direct competitor for the midsize sedan category.

ljohnson9

Keep dreaming.

kp11

if the s8 will be a competitor for the s55, the the xjr would be a competitor for teh s55, but its not, its teh competitor for the e55 and the m5... they have the same wheel bases... also about the gs430, it will be a great car for the price, and is more refined than the others, but in terms of pure perfomance, i'd get the m5 or teh e55 over the gs430... even though i'm the biggest hardcore lexus fan alive... i'd even pick the gs430 over the xjr, not sure about the s8 though

jesseliu

Actually the XJR goes against the SL AMG version. Unfortunately thats not available here. They have 2 versions : one is a 5.5 liter and the other is a 7.3 liter. BTW the GS is not more refined than a E class or 5 series. (But I do understand your bias)

kp11

then why does the xjr do poorly when compared against the e55 or m5, oh well, jags just aren't up to par with the german and japanese counterparts... (oh yes, and thanx for understanding)