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I don't really care if one drives a certain make vs. another. If one prefers a FORD, so be it, who cares? If one can afford a Royce, fine. It is your choice. I don't quite understand why people stereotype cars and their drivers. I do believe a lot of these value minded persons are the ones with a bigger bank account.
I'm beginning to see the wisdom of Mark's practice. I can also deduct my lease payments from my gross income, so a lease is something that looks attractive to me. My accountant agrees with me on this point. I have had the sad experience of keeping an old Audi for 10 years, and the uncertainties of repair and high cost of maintenance after the Audi Advantage freebies eventually got to me. I'm therefore leaning strongly towards leasing my next Audi. I've seen the light (T-I-C).
I tried to talk him into an Audi quattro. He got a Passat 4motion "wagon" (I don't think they call them avants).
He did the 0 money down, 36 months thing and says a predicable cost is "better" than taking the chance on the viscissitudes of running without a warranty.
No one, apparently, likes uncertainty. And, I keep tellin' y'all "Audis are breathtakingly expensive to repair when the money is yours" (as opposed to being baked in to the monthly lease payment as it is with new fully Audi Advantaged cars every 24 to 48 months or 50,000 miles whichever comes first.)
My receptionist "bought" a used car -- an oldsmobile something or other. She put $1000 down and makes payments that exceed the cost of leasing a new Jetta which could have been $0 down (the payment statement assumes the payment differential due to the cap cost reduction on the used car -- that is the payments on the Jetta would have been $249 and for the Olds they were factored to be about $255 a month -- but for a different term, see below.)
The first thing to go was the Power Steering -- she got that fixed (15% discount). Next the passenger side power window. She had the window raised and just keeps it up, didn't fix it. Next to go was the A/C. Since the driver's side window works she keeps it open to try to stay cool.
Then she needed a tire, which really required 2.
She was, financially speaking, paying [more than] the price of driving a very nice Jetta GL (or Honda or deal du jour) -- uh, except she had no A/C two old tires and god knows what next that would need fixing.
Plus, because she was buying the used Olds, her payments were virtually the same per month as the new Jetta would have been. Except the Jetta would have been 39 months and the Olds was 60 months.
She hates that car and really has no recourse.
If this anecdote was 1 of a total of 1, it would not bear repeating. The fact that this story is more of the rule rather than the exception makes the entire prospect of keeping my car out of warranty a rather scary thing to contemplate.
But this is ONLY one story, mine, in the naked city.
there is a nice a6 2.7t at the beverly hills audi. you might want to look at that too.
Is there a 98 A6 in my future?
I drove one yesterday... it drove great... But I have some questions....
I'll be having a mechanic look it over, but(1) the cruise control didn't seem to work, and (2) when I put the headlights on there was a "popping" sound near the light switch. Common/easily remedied? Or a deal killer?
Also it needs 4 new tires which is no biggie in the grand scheme... but if the answers to the above are favorable, I'd be interested in what the preferred tires are. (It has ContiSport (?) on it now.)
It's the A6 or a 96 Mercedes C220.
Thanks in advance.
Anyone know why Audi doesn't install daytime driving lights on any of their US spec cars?
Maybe Audi doesn't feel it is a necessary safety idea?
I love Audis, love my Audis, found each one an improvment over the last.
I have no reason to believe that a 98 A6 is an invitation for trouble.
But -- Audis (and this applies to the Mercedes too, and indeed every European car) are very expensive to maintain and repair when the money comes out of your own pocket.
Audi Assured would be more than nice -- it would be prudent.
I have no specific information concerning the issue of the popping sound when you turn on the lights. '98 was the first year of production for the current C5 platform and possibly the most problematic. Since the electronics on this car are complex, I'd probably pass unless I knew for certain that this popping sound couldn't possibly indicate a serious problem. As Mark suggested, I'd preferably want a decent warranty before buying this car. My first car was a beat-up '67 Volvo 144. I must have spent 8 times more getting the car fixed during the three years I owned it than I had buying it.
Even given all this, I think the '98 A6 is a MUCH nicer car than a '96 C220. Had a '98 A6 as a dealer loaner recently and it was still tight and drove very well without any apparent problems. So there are evidently some decent examples in the marketplace.
Tim said, "My first car was a beat-up '67 Volvo 144. I must have spent 8 times more getting the car fixed during the three years I owned it than I had buying it."
So many of the people that "buy" used cars [Audis and others] will rail on and on about how much money they spent on their used cars.
Now I don't know how much 8 times as much is -- but suffice it to say, that it is stories like these coupled with the "uncertain" opportunity cost of a used vehicle that keeps bringing me back to the "logic" of a permanent lease and always having a young car.
If our friend buys this used '98 A6 and it costs 8 times what he buys it for to keep it running, he will probably not be an Audi owner for long, let alone forever.
Again, go for the new or the Audi assured -- after all we buy "insrance" not because we plan to have a claim, but IN CASE we have a claim.
Audi's are nice, I love the looks of them, but will never have the nerve to own one. I think these cars are for leasing, as Mark rightfully suggested. To own an used Audi is like asking for troubles (unless you are a mechanic and have all the right tools). If you have the means to lease, go for it, if not, go for something that you know will start every time you turn that key and will never keep you stranded on the side of the road - not a very good feeling and situation for most folks.
I have the means to lease a new one, I cannot afford a used one, however. So if you have the means to buy a used one, it must be for "love" because, broadly speaking (which is not the same as literally speaking) if you can make the payments + repairs and maint on a used one, you will have exceeded the cost of leasing a new one!
It takes a rich man to buy one and a richer man to maintain it.
1999 A6 Quattro 2.8, 52,000 miles, with a 7 yr/100K miles transferrable warranty for $18K. Thanks for the advice.
I drive 20K to 24K miles per year so leasing is not an option for me. By the time you add the extra mileage cost to the lease...might as well buy it. I purchased a 2000 2.7T Certified with 38.9K miles on it. Got an incredible deal, 3.9% financing through Audi and still have original factory warranty left for a couple of months..then the Audi Assured kicks in. I have no worries about this car, it is in impeccable shape, has been properly maintained, and looks and drives new. The only type of used car I'd buy, especially German, is a certified car. Have the dealership pull the service records, that will easily show if the proper maintainence has been perfomed and give the service history of the car. My 2 cents worth.
Quick question I have been wondering about. Any quick rules of thumb about how much the lease typically goes up if you go from 10K to 12K to 15K miles on the lease? On mine it is 10K and I pay $0.25/mile over. I considered moving to 12K but never did it. Now I am trying to figure out where the break even might be when the $/mile exceeds the increase in the lease payment.
When I was working on the lease for my current A6, I asked the price for both 12k/yr and 15k/year. The monthly difference was roughly $30. Which works out to roughly 16 cents per mile? Couple factors will determine whether its cheaper to get the extra miles put into the lease or pay the extra miles in the end. The money factor and the residual value.
Which would be better as a daily driver?
I just started following this discussion since I took delivery of my 2003 A6Q 3.0 two weeks ago. I thought I would jump in with my 2 cents on the leasing-vs-buying discussion.
I have owned several Audis (4000, Cabriolet and now the A6) as well as several Mercedes-Benz cars and other European cars. I wholeheartedly agree with the comments on getting a warranty with your used car - or just buy a new one.
Speaking from personal experience, I will NEVER buy a used European car without some sort of factory warranty. My 96 E320 I just sold had 4-years of MBZ "Starmark" warranty that really paid off for me. If I had not had that warranty I would have shelled out several thousand dollars for repairs. When I had my Audi 4000 back in 1987 (it was a 1985 model - 2 years old at the time) I was paying on average of $200 additional per month for repairs. (Yes, I am sure quality and reliability are MUCH better today than they were back then.)
One last thing on the leasing aspect: I was able to get a new-off-the-truck A6Q loaded (17" wheel option, zenons, all the extras you would expect) on this $399/month lease deal Audi is running. (At least my dealer is running it.) Yes, it required some money down, but I got a new-no-miles A6 on a 4-year lease that beats most other deals I have seen.
And I get the assurance of Audi standing behind it for 4 years while I have it.
So like Mark mentioned in his earlier posts, it probably is cheaper to buy new than used. In my case I am convinced of it!
I am enjoying the discussion and look forward to being a part of it!
I just went through this exact same exercise when I leased my A6 2 weeks ago. I test drove the FX35 several times and really liked it. As a daily driver it would have met my expectations and needs most likely.
OK, so why didn't I go with the FX then? My reasons:
* Concern over dealer service quality. I had purchased a couple of Infinitis from this same dealer in the past and I had declining-quality experiences with them. They assured me that things are "much better now."
* Financial: (This was the real deal-killer for me.) I was able to lease a fully loaded A6Q 3.0 for $399/mo. With relatively the same money down the FX was coming in at something like $525 - $575 (I can't remember the exact amount) per month. At one point they were well into the $650 range on a lease. They were not willing to deal even though their lot was overflowing with FX inventory. (They had about 35 or more in stock.) Not exactly the kind of inventory that qualified for "hard to get, command a premium" financing. If you are paying cash or financing, these points are moot.
* Aesthetics / Functionality: Love the interior looks, but I have 2 kids and one on the way. My wife and I were concerned about fitting 3 kid/booster seats in, although I am sure it would have worked. Also, after trying to get in and out of the back seat a few times, I thought that the door configuration caused an awkward ingress/egress situation. (At least for me.)
* Looks: Its a love-it-or-hate-it proposition. I like the looks a lot, but still think it would still be a little too in-your-face for my line of work (sales).
The FX is an incredible machine and I am sure I would have been happy with it. I just think the Audi is a classy car, great looks and exudes the quiet sense of class and elegance that fits me. (I hope that didn't sound too fruity...) Plus 4 years of paid maintenance was a nice bonus.
OK, I will back off of the long disertations unless someone has a question!
Good luck on your decision!
Given your situation and the deal you got, there is little doubt that you made the right decision. Hope you enjoy your new car.
If you "significantly" drive more than the Magic 16,666 miles per year -- leasing probably doesn't make much sense. However, my buddy prepaid milage on a new leased Caddy to allow him to drive 20K per year -- got a 24 month lease with 23 payments (owner loyalty, bla bla bla).
Any more than this, the leasing equation is pretty expensive and the argument, IMHO works in favor of buying -- hopefully this many miels have a hefty component of biz use and can either be charged to the company or to the IRS.
Moreover, very very old cars can be much less money, too. The issues, in my opinion are the 2 to 4 year old cars -- NEVER get one without an aftermarket PROTECTION plan of some kind -- lease or buy.
We are in a temporary situation where often the deals on new cars discounts plus interest rates (or money factors) makes it hard to justify a used car which has neither.
I was shopping at my local Audi dealer this weekend for a new A4, and quickly realized that the back seat could not accommodate two baby/child seats. The dealer recommended their certified loaner program to me-- specifically pointing out a couple of beautiful 2001 A6's with 2.8 and quattro, in the $30,000 range, as well as offering an extended 7 yr, 100k warranty.
Buying preowned is new to me, specifically how much room i have to negotiate down from that 30k price.
So, my question(s) to the board: 1)does anyone have some real strong feelings toward/against the 2001 a6? (please share any wonder success stories and/or nightmares) and 2) what would be a fair $$ offer on the following: 2001 A6, 2.8, Quattro, 17,000 miles?
Any guidance would be greatly appreciated.
The 2001 A6 is/was a good year. The 2.8 engine is a bit underwhelming, but it is a good performer and is fine for high speed cruising. Just don't expect to accelerate quickly, though.
With the warranty and extended service, you should be fine, too.
Price is anyone's guess. My dealer swears he can't "give used Audis away" because the lease deals on 2003's make them more attractive than used ones.
However, if you are paying cash, you can't beat it. Or if the interest rate you can get is "stimulative" (equal to or less than inflation) -- well that might be something to consider too.
We have just had a long and lively discussion of leasing versus buying over on the A4 board, so I'll just reiterate that the 01 A6, all things being equal, was a good year for Audis. If you could find a used 02, you would LOVE the engine, though.
Thanks for the input Mark. Test drove an '02 A6 3.0 this afternoon. You were right-- I loved it. 7,500 miles, CVT, Certified for $32,500-- also offering financing @ 3.9%.
I am new to the Pre-Owned buying experience, does $32.5 k seem reasonable for this car? It is in perfect condition. Any feedback would be appreciated, as i am thinking about pulling the trigger on this as early as tomorrow...
Edmunds says -
Nope, no quattro. I love the ride with the quattro, but I live in NC, so i don't realy "need it". Or, at least, that's how i am justifying it in my mind.
With all the options, Edmunds TMV has it at about 34,500-- so I guess that $32.5 price is fair.
Any idea how much "wiggle" room there may be in a typical dealer's preowned price?
Car sales have slumped since the Iraq thing started and actually had slumped somewhat over the past weeks. You should have, therefore some wiggle room.
Offer a price to start with that you would pay if they say yes and work up from there. It sounds like a pretty nice deal and with the 3.0 anc CVT, which I have driven, you will enjoy the ride.
I won't give you too much grief for not getting a quattro -- I have had a couple non quattro Audi's myself, and although I like the quattros better, I certainly think you will enjoy your new/used ride.
The 3.0 engine is a horse(power) of a different color, eh?
Forest Lakes, AZ
that we're coming up on the end of a quarter. I've had the opportunity to do some pretty good deals as April Fools Day approached.
There are monthly, quarterly and annual quotas that most dealers are trying to meet. They try much harder toward the end.
I own an Audi A6, 2,5 Ltr Turbo diesel. I have the navigation plus system in it, including television tuner.
Unfortunately, the television switches off while driving at aspeed higher then approx. 3 Mph.
1) Does anybody know how to disable this feature?
2) I want to connect a DVD player to it. Does anybody know if this switches off as well while driving?
Thanks for your feedback. Preferably to
Henk, it seems most posters here are in the U.S., and none of the options you describe are available here. I'm sorry not to have any answer to your question, but wanted you to be aware that none of the options in question are offered via AoA.
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