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Lexus LS 400/LS 430



  • flint350flint350 Posts: 250
    I used to be in aviation and have experience with the Bose noise cancelling headsets - however - they were the aviation varietal (cost about $950). I don't know the diffs and haven't tried the $300 set for consumers. But, the aircraft version worked very well. In fact, on initial use, they were unsettling at times, making the aircraft sound eerily quiet, to the point of a brief thought about "engine out" possibilities. What I fear may happen in the cheaper airline seat version is that they will handily cancel out the low freq droning common to commercial airline environments from the engines and systems running - but that might just accentuate the noisy child or seatmate's conversation, which they will definitely not affect. Depends on what you need them for, I guess.
  • ljflxljflx Posts: 4,690
    Basically it seems like you are getting a decent and maybe a great deal. The car comes in several luxury groupings. There's the premium edition which is around 58k and has the moonroof, heated seats and Lexus link. The next one usually incorporates the above plus the nav/ml and is the famous 61,230 car +/- $100 depending on price changes to date and whether or not you go Euro suspension or not. Than there is the 65-70k custom and ultra lux editions. For the most part this seems to be how Lexus sends them over though you can custom order and leave out or add certain things to those packages. I remember a few people passing up Lexus link though I like its security and wouldn't pass on it. If you are getting a 54k price on a 61k car you are getting a great deal and the car must have both ml & nav.

    As for my technology comment it is just that the rash of things I've bought in the past year have been so enjoyable and were such big improvements over the old guard. Satellite TV provides so much a better picture than cable in the first place and when further combined with a digital or hdtv the television viewing is almost lifelike particularly in sdtv and without question in hdtv. When I am watching ordinary tv people think I have dvd's playing. So what I meant was the enjoyment brought by that leap in quality lived up to its expectations and then some. I don't see any other products on the near-term horizon to rival it. How can you possibly get a better picture than hdtv. The mini dvd is wonderful and the new graphics card on 1+ gig pc's are amazing. The digicam is about the last thing I want and completes the technology items I have a deep interest in. Pricewise I would have spent more on an MB S-500 lease in 3 years than all these purchases combined by several thousand dollars and I almost made that foolish decision. So in a way this stuff is - as we say in the financial world - "gravy".
  • about the car circulating air when the cabin is hot, audi offers a solar sun roof that circulates air with fans, using solar energy. it's an option on the A8 and was an option on the A6, though only on the allroad for 2001. i hear that it permits a buyer to realistically get a dark colored interior in the sunbelt states, so it is effective.
  • brewer10brewer10 Posts: 6
    I've read this board with interest for several months and thought I'd share my experience, since I am picking up my new LS430 tonight. In December, I took delivery of a 2001 740i Sport. Biggest mistake I ever made. In the 6 months I owned the car, I've replaced the tires, the radio, the power seat & steering wheel controls, and the differential (to try and correct a persistent squeak). Worse, many of these issues took multiple visits and I had to endure the arrogant attitude and total lack of customer service. I reached my limit, and stopped in to see my local Lexus dealer. What a world of difference! He worked with me to get out of the BMW (despite some serious negative equity) and tonight I take delivery of my new car. I will never return to BMW again. Just thought all of you would be interested in the story of a newly converted Lexus owner. I'm looking forward to a great experience.
  • jgwaltneyjgwaltney Posts: 39
    ljflx and nealm1:

    thx to both for excellent "real-world" advice - guess it's tough to "find it all" in one car, but you're'll always have a few times when you long for another car for specific traits - but unless you're able to afford them all, your choice should be based on the majority of your opverall driving desires and needs taking everything into consideration - your experience speaks volumes about the comparitive differences, and what will likely be most important 2 yrs after you choose betw a pre-owned e320, 528 or ls 400 - esp if you keep a car 5+ yrs as i do

    when it's all said and done, sounds like the ls 400 is the way to go for now, them maybe add a sports car down the road to satisfy those "weekend desires to escape" - thanks again for you comments - any thoughts on the price of the ls 400? (asking approx $40,900 on certified sticker, bottom $ is $35K) - again, '99 ls 400 w/ 40,000 mi 1-owner leased fr dealer - certifed w/new brakes, tires - fully loaded (nakam, hid lights, etc - all except nav) - had been thinking about black ext. color (this one is white ext.) as it always looks luxerious/classic - not sure about white but guess i'd get used to it

    again, thanks for your help!
  • ljflxljflx Posts: 4,690
    I've always leased the LS400/430 new so I don't know that much about the "certified" program except that my dealer told me they (the dealers) usually only re-purchase the cream of the crop to re-sell with the certification badge. I know they re-purchased my 98 model and re-sold it within weeks for $39k (I had around a $34k buyout if I remember). So $35k on a 99 with nak and hid (i didn't have the latter) sounds like a good buy. The 40k miles is a bit high but given that it was accumulated so quickly it was most likely highway miles and I doubt they would certify a car that is less than 3 years old and had mostly city driving miles. Good luck with it if you buy - it's a great car. Just don't drive an LS430 because it raised the bar quite a bit over the previous model.

    brewer10 - Good luck to you. When you've driven the car for awhile perhaps you can post the differences you see between the LS430 and the 7. Did you go with base suspension or Euro? Your experience with BMW was foretold to me by friends who have a 7 and will never buy it again - which is why I never even considered it. The only difference is they have serious engine problems among other things and it wasn't the first BMW they had that had such problems. They also hate the dealership experience.
  • I was in a Lexus dealer for service in Atlanta, GA. I walked over to the used car lot, they were unloading used Lexus cars. I talked with the truck drive, he told me these cars came from an auction in Orlando, FL. I asked the salesman, re confirmed that they were used and from several sources.
    I was in the business at one time, just wanted to pass this on.
    I purchased a LS 430 in April, t/in 1991 LS 400, 140k, almost no service except regular oil changes, front brakes, 3 batteries, three sets of tires.
  • ikey78ikey78 Posts: 28
    Ljflx, I believe you own both an UltraLux and a base LS 430. Have you or anyone else noticed any significant difference in the ride quality between these vehicles? I realize that some of the difference may be the different wheel size and tires.

    I am also curious how people feel the air suspension compares to the standard suspension on the late model LS 400's. I no longer have my 400 but I think the ride was a lot less firm which I actually prefer.
  • wwestwwest Posts: 10,706
    My 92 LS has air suspension and I am in the market for a new LS430 with air suspension but am holding out for Black Cherry/Ivory/Maple. I have been very pleased with the 92. I understand the air suspension was improved in the 94-95 timeframe and now yet again in the LS430.

    The "air" LS430 I drove seemed much more stable handling wise than my 92 and yet had just as smooth and quiet, maybe moreso, a ride as the 92 in cruise mode.
  • ljflxljflx Posts: 4,690
    ikey78 - I don't have the air suspension as I don't have the ultra. Flint350 and some others on the board do so they can comment better than I. I test drove the ultra and thought it was a great riding car but I had the sport setting on at the time so it was firmer riding. I didn't adjust it to the softer setting to see the difference as I wasn't buying the ultra. The base suspension is noticably tighter than on the LS400 so there is more road feel but the ride is even better than before if you can believe it. It's actually a great feeling as you get more of a sport feel while at the same time an even better (and quieter) ride than on the LS400 which had a ride that I wouldn't have thought could be topped in the first place let alone with a sportier suspension. No way will you be disappointed with any of the suspensions on this car be it base, euro or the alternatives in the ultra with the air suspension. Throw in the ml, a spectacular nav and the great interior and this car is one awesome vehicle.
  • brewer10brewer10 Posts: 6
    The car I picked up had the Euro suspension and 17" wheels. Great handling and control without the punishing ride I had in the 740. Couldn't believe the delivery experience! A dozen roses and more attention tha I got from my BMW dealer in 6 months. I will certainly post again after I get some time behind the wheel and let you know how the two cars stack up. However, with just one day of driving the LS under my belt, I'm already prejudiced. What a car.

    Thanks to all for the great info which helped me with my decision.
  • wbwynnwbwynn Posts: 246
    I have found the base suspension package to be outstanding....much better road feel and handling than I expected from Lexus. Everyday behind the wheel, I appreciate more and more the balance of quiet, power, and road manners that Lexus has brought together in this luxury car.

    I cannot comment on the air or Euro setups, but the base is very good.
  • flint350flint350 Posts: 250
    OK then, I'll stand up for the air! I have it and love it. Plus, I can select the "sport" mode to somewhat emulate the tighter feeling reaction on the twisties. Honestly, it's a subtle change but can be felt if pressed. Still and all, I bought the car for ultimate luxury and the air ride is just that to me - like riding on a carpet. ONe of my early passengers said that pulling away from a stop reminded him of how a train glides away from a station - all smoothness and power. Exactly!
  • ljflxljflx Posts: 4,690
    flint350 - Now you are making me wish I had taken it. When I was in the market for the car the ultra was in very limited supply and putting a child seat in the middle of the back covering up the massage and all the rear seat goodies made it unjustifiable for me as a finance person. But on my next go-round - the Ultra it will be - God willing of course.
  • bolonybolony Posts: 10
    ljfxljf LS400 as a competitor to S class is a fantasy of your mind and one look at 430 can make one puke. Drove used 1998 ls400 at HBL in Virginia, with gold????? accents, what a joke, it is hard to believe that you are talking about the same car. Drove new ls430 at Pohanka Lexus ---butt ugly and no Mark Levinson or Abraham Goldstein or anybody else can save it. Will always be poor man's Mercedes. It is interesting to see how this forum dominated by constant mentioning of MB. I guess it speaks for itself---one buy's Lexus and forever talk's about MB or BMW to make yourself feel better.....
    You will never find this kind of BS about LS430 on MB S class forum, there is just no need for it, unless MB S owner is a former Lexus LS felllow.
  • nealm1nealm1 Posts: 154
    We welcome anyone's reasoned opinion, and value educated disagreements on this board. If you think you can muster either, we would be glad to hear from you. As to your antisemitism, misogyny (seen on other boards), and 8th-grade-locker-room vocabulary, perhaps these endearing charcteristics are valued on other boards; they are not here. Kindly find another audience for that crap.
  • bitkahunabitkahuna Posts: 206
    Thank you for your input.

    You're right, you will never find this kind of 'BS' on the MB S Class forum, they're too busy reporting a large number of problems they're having and in some cases, abysmal dealer service.

    I also agree with you though that Lexus still does not have the prestige associated with the brand that Mercedes does, but I have only seen MB customers come over to Lexus, and never the other way around. That should give MB a lot to worry about.
  • ljflxljflx Posts: 4,690
    If you scroll up the S board to late last year and early this year you will find a lot of people putting down the LS430 for their defensive purposes. You'll also find a few saying you will have to load up an S-500 (to what - $90-95k?) to top it. I remember it well as I was looking seriously at the S at the time. Never said the S wasn't a great car - just said the LS430 is a better one. It's too bad positive comments on this board bother you so much. That's about all that I'll say in response to your ridiculous comments.
  • wbwynnwbwynn Posts: 246
    You seem aptly named....
  • bolonybolony Posts: 10
    nealm2000 we are talking cars here and not semites or antisemites don't change the topic, mister, or you find appropriate forum for it. One has to be a retard to draw such conclusions. You sound like one of those who looks in his bowl of shredded wheat in the morning and sees nothing but anti something, get a life. I think you are the first ever to bring out antisemitism in the defence of Lexus, you just want to do it by any means. Proof once and again----- one can't own Lexus and be happy....

    kahuna, thats right, people report on problems with THEIR cars that's what it's for to disscuss S class for example and not other cars.
    Drove ls400 and ls430 and simply not interested in the car or posting negative comments about them, unlike majority of the owwners on this forum post about MB.
    I personally would not consider same car as nealm3000 though pseudointellectuals like him should be riding bicycles anyways.
  • ljflxljflx Posts: 4,690
    Please act with some class. No one here seems to knock the S-class. We simply find that some of the problems posted on that board are almost comical. Many of us almost went with the S and given the problems we see we feel like someone would feel who avoided a traffic jam. As for the problems themselves it's absurd that cars costing $75k-100k+ have those types of problems and are met with such poor dealer service. By the way I am very happy and have leased Lexus LS cars since 1995. I can also spring for an S-600 but I don't like getting ripped off and I'd still prefer an LS430 anyway. It's more reliable. You need some new theories as your current ones are unsupported by facts. Lexus is selling nearly 3000 of these cars a month to pretty wealthy people including the wealthiest person on the planet.
  • coolmatt44coolmatt44 Posts: 54
    I am now on my second 7 series car. First was a 1997 740il, and now I have a 740i Sport. I have not exsperienced any of the problems, and my dealership is under wonderful ownership and any small problems I do have are delt with promptly. It is possible that you just got a lemon? BMW has wonderful cars in every end of the luxury market I wouldn't judge them as a hole from one bad exsperience. But I have to admit that the hole Lexus line (besides IS300) matches with BMW exactly, or more in every way.
  • flint350flint350 Posts: 250
    I really tried hard not to respond to "bolony", and truly believe nealm1 got it exactly right in his post - very well stated! But then MR. Bolony had to regurgitate his unseemly comments, poorly reasoned logic and plain off-topic name-calling. Do us all a favor sir and kindly keep your personal attacks and animosities to yourself. Your opinion on the cars in question is, of course, as welcome as anyone's, but is no more valid than anyone's. Either agree to disagree, in some courteous manner, or please find another outlet for your juvenile outbursts.
  • barry5barry5 Posts: 49
    I was not expecting to buy Ultra but after driving it there was no question that the air suspension was a much better ride. Discernably so.. therefore I bought the Ultra and life as the ride has been very smooth. The only other options I use besides the Nav/Lev is the Laser Cruise Control, which to me is miraculous. I cannot comment on the rear seat features or the cooler they are superflous for my use. Though I once did sit in the back seat and its exceedingly comfortable, what I did find strange was as I controlled the temperature and sound system from the back seat, it changed all the settings in the front seat. I thought it would be a separate control for both front and back. The AS 430 is a great car and value. If they only had the phone problem solved.. it would be nirvana.
  • bluebeastbluebeast Posts: 261
    Why would anyone on the Lexus LS need to "bash" Mercedes when Lexus is on top (JD Powers)? And Mercedes is, ummmm, well I can't see it on the list right now but I'm sure it's somewhere down the list.
  • flint350flint350 Posts: 250
    I agree with all of that. However, I have (finally) used the rear beverage cooler and found, miracle of miracles, that it works pretty well. On long drives, it easily keeps the sodas cold. My wife even put a little thermometer back there to check it - after we had lunch for nearly an hour on a hot day, it still held the sodas at a cool temp so that you could drink them. While actually running, it keeps them literally cold.

    And, alas, the phone problem continues with no real end in sight.

    I also agree about the rear temp settings. They should be separate, especially given that they run off of a serparate air conditioning unit (which cost me a little trunk space).
  • carnaughtcarnaught 'zonaPosts: 2,330
    Mark Levinson..."Abraham Goldstein" comment had racial overtones to it so don't blame nealm1 when you're acting like the "retard"...and no I don't want to wrassle with you over this...
  • darbhdarbh Posts: 51
    nealm1: well said.
  • brewer10brewer10 Posts: 6
    You are correct in that my 740i may have been a lemon. I could have actually dealt with that provided the dealer demonstrated some reasonable level of customer service. But at least in Wisconsin (where I live) there is no BMW dealer that even comes close to providing the attention and courtesy of the area Lexus dealer. I received more attention from Lexus in the week spent purchasing the car and the one week I've owned it than I received from BMW in the entire 7 months I struggled with their car. I would be the first to concede that bimmers are fine cars and that for a large car, they have amazing reflexes. But with one week in my new LS 430, there is really nothing that I miss so far. The feature content is equal, the very slight trade-off in raw handling(which I seldom called on) versus stability, comfort and tranquility is acceptable, and the fit and finish and overall attention to detail is phenomenal. I smile everday I get in this car, reassured in knowing that I will likely see the dealer infrequently, but when I do, that I will be treated with courtesy, respect, and a genuine interest in customer satisfaction. Just one man's opinion, but then, I'm not worried about pleasing anyone else - just myself.

    To bolony: This board is far too classy to dignify some of your remarks with a response.
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