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Pontiac Bonneville



  • tpkentpken Posts: 1,108
    Haven't been looking at much else on line this week except the tragic scenes in NY and DC. I hope and pray that all of you and your loved ones are ok. The magnitude of this heinous act gaurantees that many of us will have connections to those lost, helping dig out or some that could have been there but weren't. Thousands have met their maker prematurely this week - a sobering thought for sure. Our prayers go out to those impacted in so many ways including the rescue crews.

  • mfahey1mfahey1 Posts: 419
    I hear what everyone is saying about horsepower, seat of the pants, rpm ranges and so on. Those of us with 2000 SSEis also suffer from the final drive ratios of these cars. While the L67 has more than ample low end torque, in some cases too much since I get a little tired of inadvertently chirping the tires, even with the extra boost from the smaller pulley, the mid-range acceleration lags due in large part because of the gear ratio and where the engine is operating in its rpm range. This is where the 5 speed automatic would be of great use, to let the engine operate where it is most effective.
    Not to belabor the point about torque but the SHO I had had nearly the same HP at 220 but couldn't accelerate out of its own way in 5th gear because it had NO torque, just an amazing ability to use what it had all the way to 7000rpm. That and the 5 speed stick gave a very impressive package as long as you weren't trying to pass someone in 4th or 5th gear and even 3rd at times. If I wanted to pass someone at 50 or less, I had to use 2nd gear.
  • stnelstnel Posts: 338
    I know you do a lot of traveling in the Northeast.

    My prayers have been with the victims and their families. Since they found those firemen today, I hope we have more miracles as well.

  • I'm sad - terribly terribly sad.
    Sorry - but it is not worth the energy to try and be more eloquent, I dont have the desire to out-desribe the media and the slew of adjectives.

    There is no distinction between being a Canadian and being an American right now. We are all brothers - and I cant express my pain.

    Our family has been destroyed - and we will try to go on.

    God Bless All - with the exception of the perpetrators and their supporters. For them, I have no mercy now - and hope I can forgive in the years to come all those that foolishly felt this was a "just" act on behalf of their beliefs.

  • tpkentpken Posts: 1,108
    I notice that the level of activity here in my TH subscriptions has fallen off drastically this week. When faced with such an enormous tragedy - it's impossible to even think about such passtimes as cars or hobbies. It's hard enough just trying to get through a day without breaking down and weeping for the thousands of kids who have lost one and in some cases both parents in this heinous attack.

    Thank you Stacy for your concern. I'm glad my biz trips are by car these days. No interest here in personally verifying the new 'safer' flying routines.

    God Bless America


    PS - Canadian commentator Gordon Sinclair has penned eloquent and much appreciated words of encouragement for us here in the US. Nice to know our Canadian friends care.
  • That Gordon Sinclair piece was written about 30 years ago but the sentiments he expressed are as valid today as they were back then. Gordon died in the mid-80's. You can read about this at the Globe and Mail.

    You'll also see in the Globe and Mail site coverage about a noon-hour memorial service which I attended here in Ottawa today. Your Ambassador to Canada and our Prime Minister led the country - and the 100,000 of us at Parliament Hill - in three minutes of silence. It was very poignant. It was also the first time in my life I have ever sung the Star Spangled Banner - I surprised myself that I knew the words. A tribute, I suppose, to the many years of following the New York Mets during the Tom Seaver days.

    BTW, GM of Canada has pulled all of their advertising and has replaced it with full page ads expressing sympathy for the US victims. Very dignified and incidentally the only auto manufacturer to do so.

    Here's the actual text of the Gordon Sinclair radio piece

  • patpat Posts: 10,421
    I've already posted this in a couple of places, but some of you may be interested in this column that appears in today's Chicago Sun-Times. I found it quite powerful: The spirit of America: bowed, but unbroken.

    Sedans Message Board
  • Powerful article. As an outsider, I can tell you that the US is responding to this adversity in a way which dignifies all of you and which completely discredits both your attackers and detractors.
  • tpkentpken Posts: 1,108
    Just read your link - a fitting tribute to the spirit we Americans feel. Life WILL go on and we will never be the same.

    Dan - thank you for your concern and that of so many other Canadians. This attack happened on US soil - but it sent a strong message to the rest of the world that terrorists can operate anywhere they want. Civilized people everywhere must stand arm in arm against those who would rob us of our peace and security.

    I was amazed on Fri evening at 7:00 - heading home - to see car after car parked on the side of Rt 95 - the major north-south interstate - passengers standing outside their cars holding candles and observing a vigil for the victims.

    Flags are everywhere. On houses, cars, overpasses, buildings everywhere of all types. What a display of patriotism - I've never seen anything like it in my 46 years.

    God Bless America

  • I too am proud of how Canada and Canadians have responded to the situation.
    6 hour long waits outside blood banks . .
    offers of assistance - all sorts . . .

    and this from my industry . .

    I deal with 6 of our locations that are continually having "parts" flown up from US vendors for rush situations - to solve machine down and cranky customer calls.... no one wants their fridge not running
    it is routine that the day ofter they place their order with us, the customer will call and start enquiring as to what minute their part will arrive. each delay (by the hour) and they get more demanding etc etc . .

    we didnt get one call last week from a customer asking when and or if their parts from the states would arrive - not a single one.
    sounds like something minor in the scheme of things - but from the people we deal with on a daily basis - they did a 180 personality change with the realization that planes etc were not travelling , and American companies were not focusing on us, but elsewhere . . .

    just another small link in the chain that joins our two countries . .
  • stnelstnel Posts: 338
    My mother sent me this email forward on the history of the Star-Spangled Banner. I was able to pull it up but only listened to half of it then it quit on me. I got a message saying I was missing a plug-in or something like that.

    Anyway, I'm sending the address in case any of you can pull it up. I imagine it will work with either Real Player or Windows Media Player.

    I was over at my parent's house today and did listen to it on my mom's computer.

    Good luck if you can get it to work!


  • stnelstnel Posts: 338
    Please keep it in historical perspective as it was written during the War of 1812. When there was a reference made to Christian Americans, there was no intention on my part to exclude non-Christians as Americans.

    All in all, I found it to be a moving piece. While all this has been going on this past week, I got The Patriot out and rewatched it. When I saw this email, I guess it affected me more because I just watched the movie a couple of days prior to the email.

    When you read about the Revolutionary War and the War of 1812, Britain is now our greatest ally and has been for some time.
  • tpkentpken Posts: 1,108
    It's been a week now - to the hour - and I for one, having just prayed for the rescuers, the survivors and the families - am ready to move ahead. Not forgeting or diminishing the memory of what's happened - but ready to resume a life that will not be subservient to terror.

    Its time for me to talk Bonneville

    I brought mine into the dealer yesterday for last service prior to wty expiration. Mileage is 34.8K and the car is fantastic. While there it received oil and lube, brake pads up front and rotors resurfaced (under wty - thank you GM) as well as solve vibration up front that started after last rotation. New tires will be needed sometime before the end of the year.

    I also had them install (finally) the SSEi stabilizer bar that Mark gave me in May. Wow does it handle nice now. Cornering is definitely improved and the car is just as steady and smooth as a rock.

    I'm enjoying this car more now than ever.

    Thank-you Mark!

  • tpkentpken Posts: 1,108
    Mark - the Pontiac garage took 2 hours to install the sway bar and did have to drill holes. Seemed odd since we had looked underneath and found the holes that appeared to be the ones to use.

    Well anyway - it's in now and I've got an SE on rails! I've squeeled the tires a couple times trying out on ramps at decent speeds. Not that I will be driving more aggressively now - but just testing the feel - car corners with grace and stability.

    Tires will be the next thing. I'm considering the Goodyear Aquatreads that people seem to post positive comments on. Not being all that knowledgeable about tires I am open to suggestions - requirements are to be quiet and smooth riding but capable in snow and rain.

    Take care and thanks again.

  • stnelstnel Posts: 338
    My mind's been going a little haywire the past few days thinking of what may happen and when you allow yourself to do that, the terrorists have accomplished what they set out to do. So back to cars.

    I've got 3100 miles on my car and will be getting an oil change pretty soon. Everyone talks about Mobil One so guess that's the way to go.
  • Ken: nice to hear from you again. For tires, check out - they have reviews on tires and it'll help you determine which tires will deliver the qualities you're looking for. I personally want durability, affordability, grip, comfort, and quiet. Unfortunately, nobody makes such a tire.

    Stacey: Mobile 1 is the way to go (IMHO) to cut down on engine sludge and wear on internal components but don't expect any noticeable performance improvement. For instance, my mileage has not budged since I switched to synthetic at 9000 miles. Nor is the car any more free-revving. Of course, I wasn't expecting any performance improvement.
  • tpkentpken Posts: 1,108
    I'll check out Tirerack. Others have mentioned that too as I recall in other TH Forum categories.

    Stacy - how long have you had that GP for now? Seems you don't drive as much as some of us here - those 3100 miles would take me about 5 weeks to accumulate. Hope you're as happy with your car as can be. Enjoy it and be glad for the little pleasures of life, like a new car.

  • stnelstnel Posts: 338
    I bought the car in May so that's 4 months to put on 3100 miles. I usually drive around town where the speed limit is under 40 mph but I've been driving more on the interstate the past couple of weeks and have been enjoying the pick up of a 6-cylinder car. I've driven 4 cylinder cars for 20 years and I can sure tell the difference when I get in the left lane to pass a slow car. On the 4 cylinders, I can feel the car vibrating but the GP passes smoothly. I don't even have a 3.8 L. I bet those 3.8 L engines are really nice.
  • If you drive a lot at low revs (as you would under 40 mph) with a big displacement six (as your 3.4 is - even though the 3.8 is bigger), you definitely should be using a synthetic oil. The enemy here is engine sludge.
  • stnelstnel Posts: 338
    I'll definitely use synthetic oil. About 80-90% of my driving is around town at slow speeds.

    I got my first ticket in 14 years so have pretty much been sticking to the speed limit although I may go 5 miles over. I don't want another ticket as my insurance company only insures low risk drivers.
  • mfahey1mfahey1 Posts: 419
    There was an incredible shot in the Time magazine special edition of the WTC. It was an aerial shot that really showed the total devastation there and it took that for me to realize that there is virtually no chance that anyone can now be alive in there. Let's hope the U.S. government makes the right choice for retaliation and then acts swiftly and decisively.
    Ken, maybe in my next life I should be a mechanic. How they could take two hours to install that bar with the use of a hoist and air tools is beyond me. Oh well, it's the end result that counts and I'm glad you're happy.
    As I posted in the "mod" section, I just ordered the front bar for mine from Saner. I'll probably get the bar before I get my car back as it is still stuck at the moron Pontiac dealer in Sanford.

  • tpkentpken Posts: 1,108
    Mark - If I can be of any assistance to you at all please let me know. I'm here and you're 1000+ miles away. So if you think of anything please don't hesitate. I'll be glad to give you my phone number again by email if you don't have it.

    Sorry to hear of the miserable service here. It's situations like these that give GM a bad rap (deservedly). Shouldn't happen to anyone - just plain ineptitude.

  • stnelstnel Posts: 338
    When I bought my car in May, the salesman told me that my first oil change would be free. So a couple of weeks later, I noticed that I had a coupon for some other things but it didn't include an oil change. I called and they said that if I didn't walk out with the papers saying there was a free oil change that I wouldn't get one.

    I stopped by today and they said the first oil change was free. I need to schedule an appointment so I'll just have to see if it's free or not. I'm reserving judgement.

    Granted this isn't a serious problem but it will let me know the kind of service department I'm dealing with.
  • The H-body Bonnies:

    Autowire - a review of the 2000 SSEi.Speedvision Online - a VERY positive review of a 2000 SLE. I particularly like the following passage: "I was prepared not to like the "Bonne," given my mind-set about GM products and Pontiac's tendency, in my humble opinion, to overstyle its vehicles. I was pleasantly surprised. This is a nice car." Hear hear.Weninger Motors - close-ups of a badly damaged 2000 dark bronzemist SE with airbags deployed. I wonder if the dash top separates like that for all deployment of passenger-side bags.

    Vintage Bonnies:

    1963pontiac.htm - I like cars 5 and 25. Get a load of this interior - jpgs of ads for older Pontiacs - including Bonnevilles from '58, '60, '61, '65 and ' - some guy's two-tone green '58 Bonneville. Do yourself a favour and check out this time-lapsed shot of the interior going from light to dark - it's worth the wait to - nice ad art of a 1960 hardtop. Don't visit this one first.pontiac58 - this car is a beaut! This one became my new wallpaper - simply gorgeous! Some nice interior pix on page 2 as well.1959 red Bonneville convertible - neat pic, nothin' special that I could - small pic and brief description of a number of Bonnevilles through the ages. Has potential - not there yet.compression ratio calculator - neat. this guy also has a gallery of vintage ad art (incl. a few Bonnies a neat '73 Grand Am).

    And finally....

    Norwegian fan page - this guy loves American cars and has the best collection of US car wallpapers I've seen in a while! There's one of a '58 Impala that's to die for. This site's a gold mine.
  • evandroevandro Posts: 1,108
    Even though it wasn't a too dramatic wreck, I'm glad to see that the passenger compartment seems to be intact, protecting the occupants.

    BTW, haven't the side air-bags deployed too? Should they?
  • stnelstnel Posts: 338
    I looked up the 1963 Grand Prix and noticed the scenery more than the car! Whereabouts is that? It sure is a pretty area.

    Dan - If you come across more pictures of Grand Prix's from different years, could you post them? (Particularly from early-mid '70's) Thanks!
  • mfahey1mfahey1 Posts: 419
    I appreciate your of offer of help. The car is allegedly fixed now and I'll be driving back out in the old Caravan the first week of October to retrieve the Bonneville. It was amazing to me how quickly they did get it fixed once I pointed out to them that my car has a floor shift and that the service bulletin that they were referring to had no relevance. I guess they replaced the ignition switch(second time for the car).
    It will be good to get it back because somehow, the old Caravan doesn't quite get it after driving the Bonneville. My goal now on the Caravan is to hit 200,000 miles which it should do if the transmission(3rd one) holds up.
    I saw in the Chicago Tribune that Olds is finished in 2004 but that the Aurora V-6 is done in 2003. Hope that isn't bad news for the Bonneville, LeSabre, etc. On this last trip out to Maine, I didn't see one on the way out although it was dark for about 7 hours. I did see 3 on the way back including a maple red one about 5 miles from my house. I do like that color. I also like driving a car that you don't see everyday but I'm a bit concerned that we don't see enough of them and that their future is cloudy.

  • stnelstnel Posts: 338
    I heard that Bonneville was going to be discontinued in a few years. I think I read it on this forum but not sure.

    I'm not sure why they would discontinue the Bonneville. It's a nice looking car.
  • evandroevandro Posts: 1,108
    I want to thank all you guys for sharing your experience with your Bonnevilles with me.

    I've been shopping around and it's been really hard to find one here in truck country (FYI, Texas). I'm afraid I'll have to ask the 3 local dealers to find one elsewhere. I just hope it doesn't hurt my negotiation edge.

    Is a couple of hundreds above invoice per Edmunds fair enough or should I try to push below invoice?

    Thanks again, y'all have been awesome!
  • I always start AT invoice. YOU should at least check out Edmunds' advice on the topic of your opening price and negotiations.

    Ordering one in will cost you a few hundred extra and yes, it does hurt your ability to negotiate - unless you're not fussy about delivery time. If you give them a few weeks, they'll be lever the next request THEY receive from another dealer and just trade from inventory. That way, they can avoid having to compensate the other dealer. At least that's how it works up here.

    Or go to and search dealer inventories until you find one with YOUR car. I know that the GMCanada site works well this way - I know more about the inventory than the salesmen did. In the states, I think you have to go to GMbuypower to check out dealers' inventories. Hey, why wouldn't you?

    Anybody else out there use buypower and can help evandro?

This discussion has been closed.