Pontiac Bonneville

L8_Apex

Welcome to the continuation of the Pontiac
Bonneville topic. Those of you joining us from
that topic are welcome to continue your discussion.


If you're new to this topic, you may want to
follow the above link for additional archived
posts.

Thanks,

L8_Apex
Sedans Host

snickle

Just seeing if anyone followed teh new link. I got the platinum injector today and hooked it up. I'll let you know the results.

ezrapon

I read the web site sounds almost 2 good to be true. I expect some low 6 0-60 times from you. I live a few miles from Boeing... they build F-15's and F-18's. Trying to boost one of those nasty GE 7000 HP jet engines to mount on the trunk... still a few bugs in this plan... I'll keep you posted.

ruski

fuggetabout thoswe engines, just get yourself a JATO (jet assisted take off) engine or two.

snickle

It does sound to good to be true. But with a 120 day money back guarantee. We shall see.

ezrapon

I just read in the performance trend section of Motor Trend, that Midas has a new low restriction muffler series. They are black and look just like an SSEi muffler. H.P. gains are said to be around 10, and a nice tone is said to be present. In ST. Louis we have a lot of hoosiers. Most of them buy new Dodge or GM pick ups and immediately install loud nast sounding sounding dual exhaust. I can't believe all these guys are voiding their warranties. There must be some factory lee way here on exhaust issues.

ezrapon

we are missing a few guys here... never leave a man behind!

snickle

What issue of motor trend?

Intense and dmckeown are both mia. I'll shoot them an email and see what is up.

intense01

I'm still here. Just frustrated by working too many hours to get under the hood and play...

Let's see - I've been driving my new SSEi about four months now, and I have 23,000 miles on it. The new Michelins already have 20,000, believe it or not.

So, who's going to be the SSEi exhaust guinea pig?
I laid under the car and did the rough sketch. I was hoping someone else would have reworked his exhaust by now...

I've got an idea on Cold Air. I saw a Mustang the other day with a cold air inlet scoop tucked right in front of the front air dam. We could do something like that, starting right under the left driving light. The oval or rectanglar shaped hose could go back about a foot (maybe less, can't remember) and then take a 90 degree turn and go straight up. From there it could go through a low restriction airbox of some kind (maybe from an LS1 T/A), and then take another 90 into the Throttle Body/Mass Airflow Sensor. I think the results would be simple to construct, and produce very cold, unrestricted airflow. What do you folks think of this concept?

snickle

I had thought of the scoop underneath, but I was concerned with the extra dust that would pick up. You would have to wash the filter weekly.

Headed away for vacation in a week. Hopefully when I get back I can finish my CAI.

ezrapon

The performance trends section on page 116, has 2 or 3 viable muffler combos... the Midas struck me as the best deal for the $$$. Oct. 2000 issue.

rea98d

By law, the automaker can't void your warranty for exhaust mods unless they can prove the mods screwed something up.
"Nope, we're not replacing the alternator under warranty because this exhaust system isn't stock."

The modified exhaust system won't be under warranty, and anything (emissions control, ect,) it messes up won't be, but everything else should still be covered.

Just FYI

L8_Apex

In the winter, I had to pick the "packed" snow from my cold air intake on my '87 Mustang. This is something for those of you in Northern climates to consider...

bonnieperf

I'm new to this site so I don't know if you have talked about this before. I was on the Borla web page and I noticed they had a exhaust kit for the Grand Prix. I wonder if it would fit our Bonnevilles. Is the under body the same or similar?

didihearatap

Wife and I love this car, Yrs after 94 they changed the rear spoiler yuk,and Burns Pontiac mechanics in South NJ tried to use it as a their track car as well as their money pit but I put a stop to it by eating some minor repairs during my extnd wrrnty and not takin it in -anywhere- and what do ya know barley a problem since 1995. 72K and no alternater-transmission all the above hd-aches I've read about. Moral-Blame the five course technicians who quite frankly could care less about you coming back every 5 months before calling the car names. There Burns Pontiac Bite Me. Adam:)

tpken

Has anyone recently compared the new Bonneville SE or SLE to a new LeSabre? Both cars interest me, as a turnpike cruiser, and I wonder how the ride, comfort, sound level, power, etc compare. I own a '90 Grand Marquis and hope to trade next year - will consider both of these as well as another Gr Marquis and possibly a Maxima or ideally an I-30 (quite an assortment - can't wait to start driving them). Will probably look for a model 2000 year lease turn-in late next year.

snickle

Sorry the borla exhaust won't fit. Need to do a custom job.

koolguy123

I have, I saw a Lesabre in a parking lot the other day and I think it's too round and looks like an old peoples car. The Lesabre has a boat like ride because of it's soft tuned suspension. Now the SE Bonneville, has a tighter suspension and sportier styling, better looking cloth interior,(well I think so anyways And still the same roomy interior dimensions as Lesabre. Leather is also available on the SE. If you want an SLE Bonneville, those are even nicer, they have pretty much the same interior content as the SSEI Bonneville, but are a little cheaper, $28,000 (base Price) compared to the SSEI's $32,000 (also base price). Also the seats on the SLE, are a little more cushiony than the SE's, Oh they're comfy I sat in an SLE and I noticed the difference between the two's seats immediately. Both Bonneville and Lesabre are well built, and have very low interior sound levels. Hope this helps.

koolguy123

If you'd like to know, there are 2 Lesabre trim levels, custom and Limited. Limited is available with leather and standard other goodies like the power drivers seat and such. I don't know what's standard on the Custom, perhaps a trip to Buick.com is in order

koolguy123

Has everyone gone away? Or Am I missing some big party? I Got some more information for you Tpken, load leveling is standard on both Lesabre and Bonneville. Bonneville SE standards, Foglights are standard on as well as power mirrors, door locks, and windows,cruise control,systems monitor (coolant, oil pressure, battery voltage and parking brake light) Bucket seats with rear air vents, Delco 100 series Cassette AM/FM, Cd player is optional, pollen filter optional, rear seat pass through, note, that is not available on Lesabre, and power passenger seat is standard.

koolguy123

Power DRIVER'S seat that is NOT STANDARD

tpken

I agree the Bonneville is far sexier looking than the LeSabre, and the SLE model sounds interesting if the seats are that noticeably more comfortable. Have you (or anyone) test driven the Bonne vs LeSabre? I wonder about the ride on the two - my guess is that the Bonne is smooth but more controlled feeling then the Buick. However, I've read that the LeSabre Limited with the perfomance pkg is pretty decent. I have not liked past full sized GM 'floaters' - watch one cross a bridge expansion joint and count/time the front end bounces. Pass the dramamine please!

snickle

I drive a LeSAbre with the Performance packange and did not care for it at all. Way too much body roll and still an annoyingly firm suspension.

I bought a 2000 Bonneville SSEi and love it. I touch to much body roll, but I am taking care of that.

snickle

I really need to proof my posts.

Should say "I drove a LeSabre..."

and "A touch too much body roll..."

That the english problems. Grammar?????

snickle

My wife called. UPS just delivered my Saner rear anti-sway bar and the urethane endlinks for the front. Wonder if I can get them on before this weekend. Intense, How big a job? Any suggestions?

dmckeown

Real busy at work and home so haven't posted lately ,2000 SSEi is running strong at 12k with CAI,3.25 pulley and 185 deg. therm . Just started to get a noise in the passenger door , goes away for awhile if you lift up hard on arm rest , also started to notice a slight vibration in drivers side mirror at 75 mph so I will start a list to bring car back to dealer soon .
We had some cold mournings recently here in upstate N.Y. Last week it was 42 deg. out at 6:00 am and Bon was unbelievably responsive . At a stop a new Audi A6 was a head of me and with no other car's around he really got on it . Sorta got me in the mood so I pulled out and when I saw 24 mph on the heads up I thought I was safe to floor it but she brook the tire loose big time and I had to let up a bit , it must of been heard by the guy in the Audi cause about a half mile away we entered the expressway on ramp he really took off .I was happy to see no other cars any where so I went WOT and Bon had him by the end of the ramp , three big green digits on the windshield . I let off , set the cruise and watched him keep going . I had just filled up with 100 octane the day before so it was a little skewed in my favor . Intercooler is needed here
Snickle - how is the platinum injection working ?

snickle

Not sure yet. I had a bad fitting. Just got the replacement. Will let everone know soon. I will try to run some autotaps.

smfran

I haven't been posting; just reading, because I can't make modifications to my leased SSEI. I wish I could because I would love to get the performance you guys are experiencing. I still have fond memories of my '86 Regal Turbo with intercooler. The stock 2000 Bonnie SSEI will have to be good enough for me! I now have 10,000 miles on it and besides the door rattles, same vibration in driver's mirror as dmckeown (except I get it at all speeds, even when idling), and a strange spring like noise from the steering column, I love my Bonnie. I still say the glove box and cup holders are a joke.
I rented a 2001 Grand Prix while vacationing last month and experienced the same driver's side mirror vibration and steering column noise; must be a 2000/2001 Pontiac thing. My dealer (who is very good) stated that the mirror can't be improved and they aren't going to take apart the steering column unless there is a functional problem. I've learned to live with both.

intense01

Snickle- did you go with the one inch bar?

Before you put the new bar on, go out on an empty highway and do a few transient response tests (super quick lane changes). Note how much understeer and body roll you have. Not bad for a four-door.

Now go home and jack the rear end up plenty high, and set up a couple jack stands.

The old, small, hollow, wimpy, rubber jointed bar comes out in about five minutes.

The new large (hope you went with the 1"), solid, polygraphite jointed bar will slide in with some jiggling and wiggling.

Use pliers to compress the frame mounts together before trying to bolt them on.

I had to invert the end link bolts to get the nuts started.

The whole job will only take an hour. In my opinion, this was a GREAT INVESTMENT. Low price, easy installation, serious performance enhancement, and no side effects.

Go back out and redo the transient response tests. You won't believe the difference. Mine feels like a different car!

snickle

Yes I got the 1" bar. I thought about trying to put it on after dinner, but I only had an hour of light left. I'll do it tomorrow after work.

snickle

I also got replacement front end-links. I'll drive with just the rear-bar for a while, then put on the front links. I also have front poly frame bushings on order but Saner is having trouble finding them to fit a 30 mil bar. He said should be a week or two. Maybe they will come in before I do the front links.

koolguy123

Hi, was the car you rented an SE, GT, or GTP? did you like the dual zone manual temperature controls? (whew! That was a mouthful) How was the interior sound? Quietness that is.

mlm4

Interesting press release about a nearly stock 2000 Bonneville SSEi that reached 195 mph at Bonneville Salt Flats. Unique paint job too. http://media.gm.com/pontiac/index.html

I've had my 2000 Midnight Blue SSEi since March and love it. No real problems yet other than slight door panel squeaks that don't seem to happen in the Florida summer heat, but will probably be worse when (if it ever) gets cold. Also noticed that the side mirrors don't always return to the programmed position when unlocking with the remote of Driver 1, but will when the door switch is pressed. Still a blast to drive, although I think there is too much torque steer off the line. Can't get enough of that great Bose sound system.

harmar

Hey rich folks who drive Bonnevilles...My li'l ol' '99 Sable GS has no rear anti-roll bar. The LS comes with one, but thanks to brilliant Ford engineers, it won't fit the GS! Since I'd been unable to locate an aftermarket unit, the thought of "movin' on up" to a used '00 Bonneville pointed me toward this pew of the Edmund's church. Man! My first run-through of posts and BLAM! Saner Performance Fabrication! Thanks, guys. I'll ask if they can do anything for me. If not, I'll be back to peruse the rest of your posts re: '00 Bonnevilles! What the heck...I'll be back even if I do keep mine. I can live vicariously through reading your experiences. Thanks snickle for the post I saw containing Saner's URL. Later, gang.

bonnieperf

Where did you guys get the sway bars? I would love to do that on my Bonneville. About how much should I expect to pay? Is it a problem that I only have an SE. I know I have a front sway bar but I'm not sure of the rear. I'm only seventeen so I couldn't afford the SSEi but I can still dream.

snickle

www.sanerperfab.com or email sanerperffab@cs.com.

Sway bars for a SE should not be a problem. Still a G body. Just don't go with a 1" as with you smaller front, you would get oversteer. Unless you swap both.

You do not have a rear. Your front is 20 mill I think.

snickle

Should be www.sanerperffab.com

smfran

The Grand Prix I rented was a base SE. I did not pay too much attention to the two zone temp controls because I have them in my SSEI. The car was quiet and I enjoyed driving it.

snickle

Shoot me I am an idiot. Got the old bar off, without too much problem. The biggest problem was spreading the clamps.

The new one took some work to get in place, would be alot easier with a lift.

Got the 1st clamp on no problem, left it loose.

Manage to cross thread the clamp bolt on the other one and mess up the bolt and the socket. Tried to switch the bolts between side an force. Dumb, Dumb, Dumb!!!!!!

No both bolts and both sockets are messed up. And I do no have a tap and die set the right size. I will call the dealer tomorrow to see if the have the bolts and then try to track down a tap.

smfran

Thanks for the link to the press release.

My 2000 SSEI is also Midnight Blue (with dual thin gray pinstripes). I also have the door panel squeaks and the same occasional non return of the driver's mirror. You are right that it will return with a touch of the switch on the door. It is a blast to drive but does have torque steer off the line (lots of power for stock front wheel drive). I agree, The Bose sound system is awesome!

ezrapon

I had an after market system in my previous car. Sony head, rockford fosgate amps and speakers, sounded outstanding! I was rather disappointed with the bose sound. The only highs are from the small upper door panel tweeters. The 6x9's in the back are woofers only no tweeters. I feel a little high end reflected off the rear window would be nice. I wanted to put my old stuff back in but nothing was compatible. The bose is a weird 1 ohm system. You can not even add a cd changer. I added the 6x9's sub woofers and amps thus making it a 8 ohm system the only draw back was 500 watts of door and key chimes and a lot of hiss. went back to the old bose... left the subs in, they round it out a bit on the low end, but I miss the highs and the cd changer. Compass laid an egg, passenger door panel rattles most of the time and the power window lights stay on sometimes... go figure. It is black and beautiful.

smfran

"Compass laid an egg"?
Since I was so disappointed in the Bose system (no upper door panel tweeters) in my '97 SSE, my standards were low. Compared to that system, this one is fantastic.

snickle

Early results - Two tanks of gas.

Approx 10% improvement in case mileage.

Autotap readings are suggest improvement in KR, but hard to tell for sure without back to back testing.

I'll keep the unit for a while and let you know.

snickle

I have been driving around for a day and a half with no rear sway bar. The car handles lousy (actually I have driven worse, but).

Hopefully I can get the new bar on this afternoon.

I got new bolts, and a tap.

snickle

Got the 1" sway bar on. The car handles great. Should hove done this sooner. LIke right after I found the guy who makes them. I am looking forward to the long road trip tomorrow.

When I get back I will put on the new front end-links.

Doug - You need to replace your rear sway bar. You will love it.

snickle

I really think you should replace your air filter with a drop-in K&N (No lease issues).

And...

Got to a 3.5 pulley. They will never know. If you are really conserned, swap it back before you return it.


You would love the increased performance.

intense01

Snickle - I can't believe whatever that gizmo is really helped your gas mileage by 10%, and seems to have helped your K.R. too.

Why don't you do a couple 'logged' runs with the Autotap, and see if you can do better than the previous numbers you submitted for horsepower and torque. I think that will be a truer test...

harmar

Just received an e-mail from Saner saying they'd look into making a rear stabilizer for my '99 Sable GS. Their reply came within several days of my request, and they'll have an answer next week. Gawd! Where have these people been all my life? Someone who gives good service. In the year 2000. Amazing. Thanks again for the posts pointing me Saner's way.

dmckeown

Snickle , what advice on install can you tell us to avoid the problems you had . Also , the price foe sway bar and bushings .Who did you talk to at Sanar .
CD player in my 93 SLE finally died . Called the used parts places and they didn't have a CD deck . Called United Radio and they would replace it with rebuilt unit for $195 ,one year war. and 48 hour turn around . Went to take it out and the thought hit me to disconnect the battery to reset codes. Sure enough that fixed , at least so far . Always try the easist thing first . Trouble with CD deck started after I had to jump start car , and got worse as time went on .I wish I had tryed this earlier

snickle

The rear bar with bushings and endlinks as well as the fron end links was about 250 including shipping. I am on vacation so don't know the exact price.

As far as tips go: Intense's were pretty good. Mods I would make are as follows:

Put the rear up on jack stands.

Pull the current bar.

Put a jack under the driver side rear wheel and compress the suspension. Insert the new bar.

Attach the frame clamps Finger start the bolts.

Attach the endlinks, but don't tighten.

Lower the car anbd tighten the endlinks

snickle

LIke I said that was intial review only. I will be running some detailed test when I get back from vacation.

A little more detail water injection would definetly help KR. Well proven technology.

Platinum vapor is definately a little questionable, but the basic chemistry/physics is sound. A catalytic convertor is basically a platinum coated muffler. Platinum does affect cumbustion. The big drawback to this system (assuming it does anything) is it relys on vacum from the TB to draw the vapor. Not a real consistent volume.

It seems to me that when I drive gently my mpg does increase beyond normal for the change, lots of throttle does not show the same improvement, but power seems better.

I will try to get real number, but it is not an easy change to test before and after, without showing lingering effects.