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Comments
1. "There's nothing we can do about the rattles, the warranty on that stuff ran out at 1 year/12K miles which you're already over. You should bring it back to the first dealership that looked at it because they'd know better than us what they did before." If that makes any sense....
2. Squeaky shocks: "Everything looks fine." So I asked "Didn't you hear it" and they replied: "Oh, we'll take it out for a ride". I would've thought they'd done that a before trying to fix them.
If I get this car back with a squeaky front end and a dashboard that sounds worse than my 83 Toyota Pick-Up did (which it looks like is going to happen), where do I go next? It makes me sick to my stomach to make these giant car payments every month to drive a car where I literally cringe going over the slightest bump in the road. Do I fight with VW of A? The BBB? Ugh... I'll noise through VW.COM for an address or something...
I have been through this already, and they are going to tell you that the rattles do not affect the performace of the car though. I went all the way to the top (attorney and everything). Trust me on this.
Basically, put up with the noise or sell the car are your choices. I know it's not fair, but manufacturers aren't made to do anything by the above listed sources unless it affects the safety and/or performance of the car.
With the shocks, go on a ride with the service person. If they don't hear it then, try another dealer. I played that game too, and finally found someone with brains to help me.
Also, the Jetta didn't qualify anyway. With pricing, they only go by MSRP and the base GL 5-speed Jetta MSRPs for $16,850, too high.
car and driver: So, what were the cars (1-5)?
payments and fixing problems: I'd send a partial payment and a second check for the rest with VOID written in large letters on it. When they call to ask why, tell them you will continue to do this until you get full warranty coverage.
2. Hyundai Elantra (bit of a shocker, very unrefined engine and interior, but great warranty, price and decent handling)
3. Toyota Corolla (does everything well, but terrible handling/feel)
4. ???
5. Honda Civic (big surprise, should be 10/10)
Payments: interesting idea. You obviously live in a perfect world. Doing that would just start recovery/claims against you for incomplete payment of debt. Especially if you haven't financed through VW credit. I'd love to see the expression on the face of whoever reads the two cheques, and your enclosed explanation
(Of course, being a payment check on a car, I'd hope you'd have some legal recourse to back you up. If nothing else, make them come and take the car!)
VOCUS: I don't think the price of the Jetta 2.0 should of been a factor in excluding it in the comparo. It was only about $500.00 more than the most expensive car in the test. You are right though, it probably would of been at the bottom of the pack for 0-60 and handleing. Though the saftey features and fit and finish (minus rattles and noises) would be positive points.
I am brining my car in Monday for a 5K service. I am thinking about having them look into the rattles in my speakers in the rear doors and the ones in my dash. My dash rattles are seeming to be worse that ever. Going home yesterday and this morning they were wearing me down. What causes rattles anyway?
???
VW thinks they have an expensive car, so they have to compare with other expensive cars (and stand a good chance of losing to them). It is a difficult position to be in.
I was really surprised to read that the Honda had the worst fit/finish of the 10 cars in the test. That is a big shocker. How the mighty have fallen...
Also, the Protege LX tested was ~$16,800 or something. That's alot for a Protege, when you can get a Jetta for the same price or cheaper, with just about the same equipment, power, and more safety. The Protege has better handling in stock form, and more interior room. I guess shopping in this segment is all about compromises...
That's sticker price. Nobody pays sticker for a Protege, at least I hope not. For comparison, I paid $15,300 for my 5sp *ES* (not LX) and got 0% financing for 48 months. You can't get a Jetta for anywhere near that and if you could it wouldn't have the equipment that I wanted. It would be a base model stripper. So...C&D's price comparisons are kinda unfair because they don't mention anything about what a person would actually pay. ie) You are probably going to get a better deal on the Protege than you would with a Corolla or Civic.
With the 2003 GL models, they have all the power stuff standard, so they are no longer strippers. And I frequently see GL models for $15,000 on sale at local dealerships. So you would pay about the same for the Jetta vs. the Protege.
VW also had 0.9-2.9% financing rates, don't know if they still do though. So they are about equal there as well.
to me, there is no reason to buy any of the Japanese econo cars, when you can have more power, more style, more safety, and more money saved, with the Elantra.
now, the reason the Jetta/Golf isn't included is because they are just out of that league. yes, a SMART consumer recognizes that you can pay $17k for a Civic, or pay under $15 for a VW with 8 speakers, countless airbags, ABS, etc standard. but i am SURE that the average person pays somewhere near $20k for their Jetta, so it isn't in the econo class.
but seriosly, if i had to downgrade, it would be an Elantra GT hatchback. cheap, still have leather so my clothes don't stick to the seats, and a cute shape and peppy engine. not to mention the price. if only it had silver inside door handles....
I don't care either way about leather, and the door handles???
Otherwise, a nice car at a good deal!
For most people, they would prefer that equipment over alloy wheels, 4 wheel discs, a sporty suspension, and performance oriented tires. Not me. I'd have to pay a heck of lot more than $15K to get that equipment AND the 1.8T (because I would not buy the 2.0L) for the Jetta. Because of the equipment that *I* want, the Protege is hands down a better value than the Jetta GL. IMO, the Protege is the best driver's car you can buy for less than $16K. The Jetta GL isn't a driver's car. As far as the Elantra is concerned, I think it's a good value. I'm just not comfortable with Hyundai yet and the styling is kind of a turnoff. One more thing: if you think the Protege's engine is unrefined, then you definately won't be pleased with the Elantra's engine.
"You have spent $19K on a car that will totally outperform a Protege six ways from Sunday."
Not in handling it won't. Do the same things to the Protege and it WILL handle better than a Jetta. Remember, the MSPro and MP3 are now considered to be the best handling FWD cars available. Slalom speeds are quicker than some Ferraris and the Corvette Z06. MP3s were already beating 3 series BMWs and Integra Type-Rs in showroom SCCA and this was before the turbo. All of the suspension pieces from the MP3 are available at the Mazda dealer.
"For most people, they would prefer that equipment over alloy wheels, 4 wheel discs, a sporty suspension, and performance oriented tires. Not me."
Me either. You can keep power windows and locks, ABS, speakers, airbags. I'll take the 4 disks, "sporty" suspension, and "performance" tires in the inexpensive package, thanks.
That leaves $460 for wheels. You can do alright at $100 each, and leave $60 for shipping if necessary, or for gas money!
:-)
And I will gladly pay the $4000 to be able to be safer on the road. The Protege is nowhere near as solid feeling (esp, at higher speeds) as the VW. I have had both, I know.
I consider $4000 more to be a "heck of a lot". Since you're willing to spend $4000 more to feel safer, why not get a Ford Windstar? Those are even safer than your Jetta.
(I was picturing buying performance tires for MY Jetta (195/60HR14) and some wheels to mount them on. Yet another reason for staying away from the trendy, gimmicky 17" ones.) For that matter, you could put this setup on a current VW most likely, and get better performance than stock for significantly less cash outlay.
I take it "Long Beaches" are wheels?
Nothing you say about the Protege is going to get me in one of those econoboxes. VW with it's faults is so much better than any mechanically perfect Protege.
"Have some sympathy for the Protege owners who for years have been so deluded as think Protege is as enjoyable as Jetta."
For me, my $15,300 Protege IS more enjoyable than a $15K Jetta. You're trying to tell me it's not? Funny. What is so much more "enjoyable" about a base model GL Jetta as opposed to a Protege ES? The interior? The resale value? The safety? Well, I guess there could be times when I would enjoy the safety, but not everyday.
Almost everyone in the industry benchmarks VW interior design. It's nice to drive the "original" rather than something trying to be a knockoff.
Also, a 2.0 Jetta is about on course in acceleration with a 2.0 Protege as well. I know, I have driven both of them. And the oil consumption problems have been pretty much cured. They are also being recogized by VW, and fixed properly as well.
How is that? If you're gonna buy a 2.0L Jetta and mod it, you might as well get the 1.8T. Now we're back to a $4000 difference again. As far as handling is concerned, mod for mod, the Protege will always win. Please tell me about these "simple mods".
"I still like the Jetta more than the Protege I had."
You better, you paid a lot more for it and went upside down to get it.
I'm sorry, but I'm still cracking up over that comment. That was a joke, right Paul?
Now seriously...for ALL our sakes, let's get off the comparo topic before somebody loses an eye!!