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I'm sorry, but I have to take issue with your post about vw long-term reliability. Perhaps it's that I get tired of reading posts about VW bashing from people that don't have an iota of experience in VW ownership, or maybe I just feel the need to share my own experiences once in a while. I'm sorry I have to spew this out in your direction specifically, but I can't take it anymore.
Before my current Jetta, I owned an '85 Jetta turbodiesel (62 ponies). This car, to me, was the most miraculous thing on the road. I had at least 426,000 miles on it when I got rear ended by an explorer. (I say at least because the odometer cable was messed up for a while.) I drive a ton of miles, and because of it, I personally can attest to their long-term reliability and durability. I still got 47 mpg on the highway when it got smashed. 47 MPG!!! While this isn't a typical story of ownership, it is possible. For those of us who have a long-standing relationship with VW's and know the culture that loves them, we know others with similar experiences. What other automaker gives you a new car if you drive the old model enough? Did you know that there's a few Bugs that have run 1 million miles? How many 60's and 70's Beetles do you see around town? Now, how many other brands' vehicles do you see from the 60's running around town? This is what I'm talking about. My jetta compression tested within 0.2 psi of factory spec on all 4 cylinders at 250,000 miles!!!!
Did I have problems with that car at times? You bet I did! Did I perform a lot of maintainance? You bet I did! I changed more fluids than Jiffy Lube does in a year! I went through parts from time to time. But the point is the same. I know from experience that VW's are known in certain circles (though they're probably not employed by J.D. Power) to be extremely long-term durable.
It just kills me. How many people have told Teo that his Impala sucks and is a piece of junk? Many, many. Did this prove to Teo that his car is indeed inferior and in fact he should sell it now, and buy something else? Of course not. Nor should it. Most of the people bashing it have probably never even been in it, just as same as most of the people bashing VW have never driven one long enough to love it as some of us have.
People who have never owned a car longer than 5 years have no business telling others about the merits of certain brands' durability. Maybe 100k is long-term for some auto manufacturers and that's your reference. In my experience, not for VW.
BTW, I do own a VW Jetta.
We all need to remember that we ALL are entitled to our own opinions, and that each of our individual experiences do not a reputation make.
I can like the color yellow and someone else here can detest it.
Neither of us is right, and neither of us is wrong. We are simply being human and feeling and expressing our own preferences.
There is nothing wrong with that as long as we realize that our own preferences are just that - our OWN - and we do not expect everyone else in the world to feel the same way that we do.
Can we just chill here please?
Pat
Host
Sedans Message Board
And there is no need for the folks who have chosen this vehicle to react so defensively to those who did not/would not make the same choice. You had your own reasons for your decision, you love your vehicle, right? Why do you feel you must justify your personal choice to others who would follow a different path? Or to those who have had a very different experience with the same vehicle?
The bottom line is that you chose what made you happy, and it seems that most of you are still happy. Isn't that enough? Can't you let go of the fact that some Jetta owners have had problems and other folks are troubled by reports of reliability issues? If your Jetta is fine and you are generally happy with your decision, why do you care that others may see the vehicle differently?
We are going to STOP the arguments here.
It is not possible for me to babysit this discussion 24/7, which is what seems to be required here. If we cannot calm down, get back on subject and stay within the parameters of the Membership Agreement, this discussion is going to be closed.
Pat
Host
Sedans Message Board
What I was responding do specifically, is the discrediting of an individual who said that VW's have been known to be durable long-term. My experience is that this is true, and I felt the need to respond to the implication that this attitute was better suited for "another planet."
You may talk about "empirical evidence" all you want but you must admit to me that data generated over the last 3 model years by JD power says absolutely nothing about long-term durability. Your hostility is misplaced when you flaunt the numbers surrounding the newest generation of Jetta. I don't recall saying anything about the reliability issues surrounding MK IV Jetta in my post. That's why I sit here and digest others' experiences in their Mk IV, and don't try to tell them that their idiots for having their opinion. I value the opinions of those fellow VW Jetta owners in this forum. That's why I'm here.
While your attempt to discredit me by making snipe remarks such as "670000 miles in rush-hour traffic, only one headlight out,etc.," may have pleased you thoroughly, it deters me very little. I clearly mentioned that I replaced a lot of parts. I did a ton of maintainance. Obviously, a person has to do a lot of highway driving to rack up that kind of mileage. And while the JD power reference may have been a bit misplaced, I share only my opinions based on my personal experience. I'm posting based on my experience, which I should hope you do too, blueguy. Ironic that I do only what you do in your own posts, yet you attack me for it. Ironic, don't you think?
I took a monster rock the other day in my rain-sensor equipped jetta. Has anyone else had to replace a windshield on a GLX? I was thinking I'd take it to PPG, but then I remembered that the sensor is mounted on it. What's it cost to replace it, and do I need the dealer to do it?
The point of my hyperbole regarding the 670k Jetta with only one busted light wasn't to say that your car wasn't exceptionally reliable, only to make a point that people with odd anecdotes always pop out of the woodwork, relaying personal outlandish (probably truthful) experiences with a car as if that personal anecdote refutes statistical data. I did not in my last post in any fashion relate a personal experience with my Jetta. Even if my Jetta has been mechanically sound, that's not proof that the design is somehow good. The stats prove otherwise. I may have a good Jetta (based on major mechanical malfunctions), but that does not carry over for the model as a whole.
BTW, nothing I've written to you about the Jetta contains personal opinions. I've written figures JD Power generated after doing research and conducting surveys. The auto industry trusts JD Power and cites them whenever Power's stats make a model look good, such as the Jetta's being ranking one of the most desired compact sedans.
If I may be so bold, I would say that very few of new models/designs on the market will be as reliable long-term as their predecessors. It seems to me that the auto industry as a whole has become too reliant upon complex and rarely-fixable computer processes. Not a defense of the current Jetta issues, just my observations of the auto industry as a whole.
What did grandpa say, more parts means more things to go wrong?
Back to the Jetta...
I like the looks of them in dark blue with beige leather ; )
Yesterday, I test drove the following vehicles and had mixed feelings from all. Here are the results:-
2002 Acura RSX -> Not the Type-S because it was too much money for a car that looks like that
I was really disappointed with the handling and performance of the premium package one that I drove. Also, the internal compartment seemed a bit small and tight.
2002 Pontiac Grand Prix GT -> The buttons and gadgets was very similar to the older models, which was a huge turn off (was a previous owner of a '92 model). The ride was not too bad, but the weight of the car is very noticable. Was not able to test out the handling on it too well.
2002 Jetta GLS 1.8T -> LOVED IT. I have never drove a car like this before. I loved the maximum torque at low RPM output. The cars performance was immediate and very responsive. There is so much to say about this car, but I will go on and on and take up too much space, like I am already.
All in all, the other cars did very little for me, but when I walked away from driving the 1.8T, I was all smiles.
My choice should be very obvious right now, so all I need now is some advice on if I should lease or finace the 1.8T. Thinking about leasing because I have been reading up on the postings in this board and noticed that there are quite a bit of problems by car owners. One being the rattles, etc. Another reason is that I have been told that repairs, parts and maintenance are very high on Volkswagon vehicles.
Please advise. Open to opinions and if you can, please try to convince me more to buy it
Consider the great finance rates available and the fact that when you finance, every payment goes toward the principal. With leasing every payment barely drops the buyout price. I bought my Jetta 1.8T WE in June for about 19.5k and I've made 9 payments on the car thus far. You know what my buyout is...$18,745.70. How the blazes that works out is beyond my ken. Regardless, selling the car before the end of my lease will cost me several thousand dollars at this point as my Jetta can't possibly be worth more than 15-16k right now. Unless you get a tax write-off, or the car has an amazing lease deal, go with financing. But that's just my opinion.
if the grey is going to be discontinued, will there be a different color to replace it? i will not get a black interior, so is beige my only option?
also, if the monsoon sound system is not a stand alone option anymore, what option package will it be part of? it will be available still in the gls trim?
On another note, has anyone here bought the VW Jetta floor mats? The nice ones they sell in their catelog and you can get from the dealer? How much nicer are they than the ones that come stock? I want to replace ours, they are kind of chinchy, and was looking for some nice heavy ones like came in my Honda.
Blueguy, I too was looking for a blue 1.8T w/leather and sport package, and was unable to find it in manual transmission. Argh! I ended up with a fully loaded green one, and now it's growing on me.
As far as JD Power - why do the masses tend to believe what others say? Statistical information is somehow better than personal information? I simply cannot grasp that concept. Never could. I trust myself far more than some group of other people.
I am tinting the windows on my silver Jetta once I get my taxes back!! YAY! Just in time for summer. Hopefully, the leather will cool down just a bit with the tint.
for sure, C&D gets monthly checks from Honda and BMW. no doubt at all in my mind. none.
when i see a "new" jetta on the road, am i going to know it? does it look different than my 2002 at all?
Funny that you'd trust three Jetta owners talking about their cars over thousands of owners. Obviously your sampling is far from representative.
There was someone in the Protege chat room a couple of weeks ago (a dealer) who said CR bought a Protege to test, and they didn't know until the end of the buying process.
I am thinking about getting the little "Wolfsburg" badges for under the fender turn signal lights for my car. I like they way they look on the WE. I don't know though. I did order a different badge for the back of it though. I am taking off the 1.8T badge and putting on one that says "20V" with the "V" in red (from the Bora). Also, getting "TURBO" in little letters to fit under the "20V". Saw it on vwvortex.com and thought it looked really neat. I am thinking about tints too, but not sure yet.
That's enough from me on leasing.
A curb jumped out and bit my rim yesterday...it's a bit scraped up now. I was looking on the vortex for recommendations for places that can fix that. Does anyone know of a place in LA that can fix it, or has anyone sent their rims away for fixing?? I'm mad at myself--it's my first real boo-boo on my car.
Leasing is like a revolving credit card account...you never ever finish paying off the balance, you never build up equity, you never own anything and instead you are saddled with never ending payments and higher insurance premiums.
I have leased once before and it was a pleasant experience at the end. I only drive less than 10K miles a year and keep my cars in pristine condition, yet I haven't had the desire to lease ever again.
I finance my cars for no longer than 36 months, usually paid them off in half the time and still get to enjoy a *fresh* and free and clear car until the end of the warranty period, or if I like it a lot I pay up for an extended warranty.
Even after 5 or 6 years of use, I'll have some equity in my old car, enough to put 5% or 15% on a new one.
In the mean time, for the years I don't make monthly payments, I make those payments to myself and put the money into an interest bearing savings account or other investments. When the time comes to replace my old car, I'll have enough to either pay for the new car in cash or at least give 50% down of the value on the new one.
I think this is the cheapest way to car ownership.
I have nothing against leasing per se, but leasing has been used as a trap by the car industry to get people into a new car more often and in the process bury them into never ending debt.
Leasing is great for businesses and other very special circumstances. Leasing is not for everyone and if often is more expensive than buying a car outright and keeping it for 4 or 5 years.
To me ownership is far more pleasurable than making fantastic $300 per month payments on a rented BMW 3 series, that doesn't belong to me.
Cars depreciate no matter what. Cars are no investments. Buy it new or used, you will always lose money. So then why waste more money by leasing?
Just my opinion.
The days of subsidized luxury car leases with no money down and $300 per month for 36 months are long gone!
Actually my 2 nearby BMW dealers in my area ask for $4-5K down to lease a new 325i for 39 months. Payment? around $350 plus tax per month. Not my cup of tea.
I figure is cheaper to buy it outright.
Leasing: Only a better deal if you swap cars frequently and are concerned about a car's reliability. Everything is as negotiable in a lease as in a buy. Can psychologically feel like you're always driving a rental, though : (
Buying: Great if you keep a car a long, long time and want to make modifications. Also great if you're buying something that's reliable. Pay cash unless interest rates are below what the S&P is returning.
To me, the best scenario is buying a new or used (3 years or older) car with cash and keeping it until the wheels fall off.
Yes, I'm fiscally conservative ; )
car manufacturers and dealers love leasing because they can move product at a faster pace and at the turn around the corner, people will be coming back to buy more. If the manufacturers and dealers love something, you as a consumer, should be wary of it.
I still prefer ownership, keep a car for 4 to 6 years, enjoy it and then justify its depreciation by the use and service provided by it, then enjoy my next new car as an outright purchase.
Different strokes for different folks.
Truthfully, I wouldn't keep a car that long, but my mother drove it till she got a 1997 Grand Caravan (and you wouldn't believe how many times she complains about the uncomfortable seats [compared to her Cressida], the inadequate radio [compared to her Cressida], you get the picture), and then it suffered through my sister and myself learning how to drive (she's 20, I'll be 17 in June).
Personally, I CAN'T WAIT for that 1999-2000 VW Passat GLS 1.8t with a stickshift that I'm gonna get in a couple of months.....but hey.....that Toyota's lasted the test of time. I've considered chipping the Passat (I'm fairly close to APR in Auburn, AL), but the longevity concerns me.....the Toyota's on her original engine and transmission, of course, and has never had anything really major fail. I definately wouldn't want to be a year or two out of college and have to replace the turbo.
But hey.....buy a 3 year old car, keep it 3 years, then sell. Works for me!
I was thinking about getting my windows tinted too, to keep the interior cool this summer. I also want tinted taillamps too, but not sure yet. I do wanna get the scrape on my wheel fixed, and maybe buy an alloy wheel for my spare tire (instead of steel). Not sure yet though.
I gave them the item # 1JO 857 465 3PT.
Is it possible to purchase a similar item somewhere else?
Thanks
http://forums.vwvortex.com/zerothread?id=252464
Don't know if you guys are interested. The prices are decent though not earth shaking.
Help
I think you'll be happy with a 28mm. It doesn't cure the floaty springs, but it sure makes corners a lot nicer.
First the sway, then the Eibach lowering kit and finally an APR chip. figure for a touch over a grand maybe I can make the car as much fun as I want.