Toyota Echo

vadp

http://just-auto.com/news_detail.asp?art=23198&dm=yes

danny28

Read or write Echo reviews here :

http://www.consumerreview.com/reviews/showproduct

(type Echo in the "product search" box )

geoft

I bought my 4 door white echo in May 2000. I've got about 7900 miles on it right now. I too purchased the car for gas mileage/low expense reasons, though I also have another rather personal reason. My first car was a '76 Toyota Corolla 2 door wagon. The echo drives just like it!! Though spinning the rear wheels in a snowy parking lot is a thing of the past (alas). This brings back fond memories almost everytime I drive it. I plan on turning this car over to my kids when they reach high school (4 or so years now) and hope that they too will have fond memories of driving it.

danny28

I scanned the reviews on the above web site and found 5 gave it 5/5, one gave it a 1, and one gave it a 2.

This looks like a love/hate relationship similar to what we've seen here on this forum. Everybody loves it except for a couple that are very critical. I recall one guy here who compared it to his fathers 5000# Jeep Cherokee (the reviewers dream car) and thought it was susceptible to cross winds in comparison. Our other critic describes his driving habit as "aggressive" and aspires to own a Lexus instaed.

Anyone who wants to contribute to the above site can do it. It's really quite painless and only takes a couple of minutes using their "fill in the blank" data entry system.

kneisl1

I read the article about the French diesel ECHO...would that they could sell one here...
Also read in the Prius site that some owners are getting 52 mpg...some are even struggling with 33 mpg! Not good not good...

vadp

Diesels are big in Europe. I mean really popular.
Regarding importing it to the U.S. It's simple.
Not a chance.
Ironically, you have to blame the enviromentalists for that.
The most efficient internal combustion engine according to their doctrine is not clean enough.
The Europeans think differently. Actually you can't be succesful in that market without offering a diesel powerplant.
The European Honda Civic sales suffer right now for that exact reason - no diesel offered.

danny28

If the Prius owners are in Canada, Australia, Great Britain , or anywhere else in the British Commonwealth they're probably talking Imperial not US gallons. You have to multiply by 5/6 to convert to MPG (US). 52 MPG Imperial works out to 43 MPG US which several Echo owners have reported getting in this forum.

kneisl1

If its true a Prius only gets 43 mpg...What in blazes is the point of owning one? This is a very sad story because we really need to conserve natural resources and hopefully cars like Prius are a step in the right direction...but the car appears to be a fraud. When I'm in Boulder CO among my green friends I tell then Nuculear is GREEN...we should have built thousands of nukes and thus have elcetricty at .1 cents per kilowatt hour and all drive electric cars. This is not a popular opinion there...

tazereli

Has anyone looked into the Honda Insight? THis car realistically gets 60 to 70 mpg which is much better than the prius's 52 mpg. If anyone has tested tis car please let me know. I would be interested in hearing about it. Also does anyone know of an Insight forem?

vadp

http://www.insightman.com/

sonatafan

The only thing these two have in common is the starting idea for the drivetrain. I can't imagine anyone considering a Prius would also consider the Insight. Insight weighs less than even the Echo at 1875 pounds, only has two seats and limited cargo room and does not have a drivetrain combo as powerful as the Prius. I see the Insight mainly as Honda's attempt to be first in the American market with a mass production hybrid.

rajmoran

I agree with sonatafan. The reviews seem to say that the insight is kind of like a concept vehicle while the Prius is a "real" car.

Anyway, the ECHO more than makes up for the mileage gains of the other two by being cheaper by as much as half.

ECHO update: 33 mpg in stop-and-go commuting. No problems whatsoever. Seats are still comfy and the stereo still cranks. I absolutely LOVE this car!

sweetsol

sweetsol

I had a new ECM computer installed today under warrantee but a $900 part none-the-less. Has anyone else had to replace this?? The service manager had a service directive saying that there were some Echo's manufactured with a faulty computer module. The faulty module will cause the engine check light to come on and the cause (engine misfire) is not correct. The leather gear shift boot also was showing deterioration so I have replace that as well.

I have a 2000 red Echo purchased 8/00 and have 4500 miles on it. I think fundamentally the car is well designed and good value for the money.

I wanted to have a digital clock but it did not come with the car. A special order clock will set me back $215. Anyone know where to get a clock that might work in the slot in the dash? Also, is there a supplier for a bug deflector that will fit?

wenyue

Honda insight doesn't realistically get 60-70 mpg. It "realistically" get 50-55 mpg.

Look at the Edmunds' long term test (50.4 mpg), and Insightman's long term average (54 mpg).

So if the Insight average 50-54 being a 2 seater, and Prius average 45 mpg but is a real sedan car. Things looks pretty much in favor of the Prius.

Both Insight and Prius have trouble get their theoretical fuel economy suggested if driven in a "normal" manner. I think those numbers are under IDEAL conditions: i.e all smooth road, all green lights, warm weather, no A/C.

So far, it seems like most people get considerably less than the theoretical maximum mpg.

sonatafan

Your gearshift boot was deteriorating at 4500 miles? My 5sp has 23,500 miles in 7 months of driving and the gearshift boot still looks brand new (except for the pie crumbs and coffee spills).

I found the factory digital clock on Ebay shortly after I bought my car and won the auction for $25 +shipping. Catch? it was the *other* interior color, mine being shadow gray. I painted the housing and is undetectable from the rest of the dash.

Ebay also has sellers with factory Toyota bug deflectors for the Echo as well. Unfortunately these have been going for more than retail value there. Go to http://www.toyotaguys.com they have LOTS of Echo stuff and they will sell the factory deflector for $39.99 + shipping.

Hope this helps a little!

babyboomer

I just noticed today the difference in length of the Echo windshield wipers.
The obvious was not.

djk6157

Just got my 2001 Echo automatic coupe on Monday here in Pittsburgh. Stickered for $13,850. Paid $12,999, plus tax, etc. Thought I got a decent deal. Have driven 600 miles already. Great car so far. Excellent get-up-and-go. VERY smooth ride for a small car. HOWEVER, I just can't get comfortable. I'm only 5'11", but my legs are a bit cramped and my right knee hits the stick shift at times. Also, the seat- back doesn't seem to be real comfortable either. Is it me? Do I just need to get used to this car, and "break it in" or what? The ergonomics just don't seem right. Know what I mean? I know I'm sitting higher, but...
I was torn between the Echo and the Hyundai Accent. The Accent was much more comfortable. Was concerned about Hyundai's quality and reliability. Now, I'm second guessing myself. Your input please.

sonatafan

I'm the same height as you are and found the same thing when I bought my Echo. The way I found most comfortable was to adjust the seatback to a straighter position than in a "normal" car and then adjust the whole seat forward just enough for comfortable arm length to the steering wheel.

On long trips it does get kinda uncomfortable still because there is no real side bolster support to the seats, no armrests and no lower center console to rest your right knee against. If anyone could actually use the little ledge on the door panel as an armrest they would have to have an elbow of steel!

kaz6

I guess I'm not the only one! During the first few weeks I felt like I was sitting "on" the chair and not quite able to get comfortable. Sonatafan was correct in saying that putting the seatback in an upright position helps. Now that I have close to 3500 miles on mine, it is very comfortable. Don't know if it's getting used to it or breaking in the cushions.
As far as the other stuff; I am 5'10" and don't have a problem with the shifter hitting my leg. I did forget my car has a tilt wheel though and finally adjusted the angle of it so I didn't feel like I was reaching for it.
My Echo is a 4-door 5-spd in Electric Green with a spoiler, upgrade 1, defogger, and striping...didn't want it but got it free anyway.
Curious to know if the lighter weight of the 2-door makes it ride differently...I love mine!
No shifting problems now either...just very long throws with some slop.

kneisl1

It seems that the steering wheel in the ECHO is a long way from the seat, and this may make for some discomfort. I put my steering wheel all the way down with the adjuster, then just rest my hands in my lap. I reach up with my right hand and just grab the bottom of the wheel between my thumb and index finger and drive it like that. I was pretty used to the armrest in my 240D, but I don't notice any discomfort driving the ECHO without one. It seems like foot room is a little lacking in the ECHO and that combined with the long reach to the steering wheel may take some adjusting to.
I would HATE to give up that nice little cubbyhole to fill it with the clock. I just put a cheap digital wristwatch in there all the way on the left. Then my security badge for work goes next to the watch. Also, there's room for my swiss army applicance.
Did a dumb thing this weekend. Drove from NJ to Albany to take my Mom to the airport. (she needs a wheel chair to get around) As I was walking out to the car at 5 this morning, I noticed the inside of the car was illuminated. Closer inspection showed that a door was ajar and the dome light on! Since 1pm the previous afternoon! But the car started! Hooray!

danny28

I've had my 2dr. for 9 mos. now. My back got a little tired on long trips when I first got it. I solved the problem by adding the SCS cruise control, so now I can shift position frequently.

I also prefer the seat back in the full forward position, but sometimes I recline it a bit from time to time on long trips just to shift my seating position. I also have a lumbar support cushion I take along to allow a "very different" seating position, but so far haven't gone on any trips long enough to need it.

janbee

As I was entering the car wash, I guess I didnt get my tires straight on the pulley and scuffed a section of my front-drivers side hubcap..is there a product that will diminish its scuff-look to almost brand new???

danny28

There is a digital clock included in the "standard equipment" AM/FM/Cassette/4speaker sound system delivered with all Canadian Echos. Don't they include this with the US models as well ?

bdoyle55

I'm considering a position that would put me on the road most days of the week as a field engineer for a fortune 100 company. Unfortunately no company car but decent compensation. Would anyone who drives an ECHO alot recommend it for my situation. Lots of freeway driving in the southeast.
Thanks

sonatafan

I'll be totally honest with you about how I feel. I'm a field service rep for Xerox (can I say that here?) and I cover around 700 - 1000 miles a week in my Echo.

I find the Echo is an excellent car for the job because it is built well and with materials that seem to wear well. Mostly hard plastics and thick cloth on the seats. Very good visibility all around. It has plenty of power for freeway negotiations (5sp anyway) and engine noise is quite limited. Tire and wind noise prevail but no more so than in any other small car. The *excellent* stereo (mine replaced long ago with a Pioneer unit) and speaker system make traveling truly enjoyable.

I have to reiterate one point brought up several times on this forum. Crosswinds can be rather troublesome. I know some people here say crosswinds are no big deal in the Echo and most small cars behave this way but, man oh man this car is a handful in strong winds or *behind* tractor trailers. Oddly enough, this car is not affected at all by passing tractor trailors even on two lane roads. Just when you get in the wind "channel" behind them. I have driven an '84 Mazda RX-7 (lighter but lower) and a '88 Mercury Tracer (slightly heavier than Echo) to name a couple and have never experienced anything quite like it.

Let me make another point about crosswinds, I don't experience this behavior everyday, only when the wind is blowing stronger than say 25 MPH. Your arms can get tired after 50 or 60 miles of making constant small adjustments to the steering wheel. Someone gave advice here a while ago stating the best way to deal with strong winds was to NOT correct the wheel, but that doesn't always work. I still don't regret purchasing this car for my job and feel it plays it's daily part well.

Oh yeah, cruise control would be a great thing to bring to the bargaining table as a dealer add on if they have the parts to install it. I wish mine had it but have been too strapped lately to spring for it.

On the maintenance side, I do my own work and can tell you this car is a breeze to change oil on and everything else is in easy reach also. I end up changing my oil about once a month.

I hope some of my opinions have helped in your decision!

majorthomecho

Someone posted that they had to have the electronic control module replaced under warranty, but it was still a $900 job. Does that mean that something in this work cost you $900 or was that the price you would have paid if it wasn't under warranty?

I got my first ding (or rather a chip). There is a chip in the paint (down to the bare metal) on the leading edge of the back passenger side door. I have no idea how it got there. I was pretty sickened when I saw it the first time.

I do not know, but I would be careful in the placement of your hands when driving the Echo. It does have an air bag after all. It would seem that having them at the bottom of the steering wheel rather than the sides would result in a possible broken wrist or arms.

1700 on the odometer and still having fun.

yue

hello, all--
I am thinking of buying a 1991 camry LE(101k, all power), the guy asked for $3000. i tried it and it ran very well. but my friend found one problem: when i stopped the car on a slope with "Drive" on, it went back slowly itself. my friend told me that there must be sth wrong with the gear in the transmission. My question is: is that a big problem with the transmission? and if it is, how much does it cost to get it fixed?
Thank you very much! I appreciate your advice.

Thanks

Bryan

sonatafan

Are you lost? This forum is for the 2000 - on Toyota ECHO.

Just to give you info, it all depends on how steep the slope was. All automatics will slip backwards on grades to some degree, it depends on how much of a grade if there is a problem at all. There are other signs to look for that denote tranny problems that are far more prominant than that.

Try checking the transmission fluid and make sure it's still red, dark brown with a burnt smell is a bad sign. Check for slippage during shifting or jerkiness when cruising at a constant speed.

Enough of wasting this boards time with this, any other questions, yue, I would suggest going to the Maintenance/Repair or Camry boards!

djk6157

I took a trip yesterday from Pittsburgh to Conneaut Lake, PA and back. Total miles = 235. I'm in shock. With an automatic, I got 41.1 MPG. More than I ever expected. As for my previous post on driver comfort, it is slowly getting better. By the way, did anybody consider a Hyundai Accent before buying your Echo? Any thoughts on Hyundai?

danny28

I too have measured over 40 MPG (US gal.) with the automatic. Since the auto has a lock up torque converter (no slip on the highway ) I see no reason why the auto's highway mileage should be any different from the manual's.

For city driving there may be a slight difference, but the automatic upshifts so aggressively that I think it will take a highly skilled 5 speed operator to show the difference.

kneisl1

I looked at the Rio and the Hyundai before buying my ECHO. Compared to Echo, they were hard to get into and very cramped inside. I never really seriously considered buying one of these cars: who knows if the manufactures will be around in five years. But I checked them out. The Yugo also offered an impressive warranty to make up for reports of problems. What good is a warranty if the dealer can't get parts or you're without a car while its fixed?

8k8mica

Here in sunny Singapore car's are expensive, a rio cost 65 000 an accent cost 58 000 and the echo cost 72k , which of these do you think i picked? Silly question. I bought the echo but am waiting for it to get prep-up and shiny from the dealers, should be getting it by saturday. Can't wait, mine is a 2001 blue sedan , however i think the hatch looks better, i needed the boot space.

djk6157

SCS Cruise Control? Is this a Toyota item or after-market? Who installed it for you? Where is it mounted? Does it work well? Thanks, Darrell

pika

Had a hard time finding an Echo through Southeast Toyota dealers that had pkg. #1, but not a bunch of the useless accessories. Finally found one. I pick it up this Sat. Am excited! They are installing cruise control for $381.00 versus the $249.00 it costs if put on at port of entry. Oh well. I really use it a lot on the open highway.

harlek

How do you remove the Radio/CD unit from an Echo. I am considering a sound system upgrade, even though the stock system is quite good. Also, has anyone installed a subwoofer to the stock Sound system. If so, tell me about your experience, what you installed and your results

remmy6

Except for trade-in, I think power steering might not be needed on the Echo. Do any of you have no power steering on your car and can you give your opinions? I am looking at buying a 2Dr, 5 spd, with A/C. I am looking at getting MAXIMUM miles per gallon out of this little puppy.

kneisl1

I agree that power steering is probably not necessary on the ECHO. However, you may have a hard time finding a car without it. I wanted a base ECHO, but the dealer told me there were none availible and the least ammount of options I could get one with was 3 in 1, ac, ps, split seats, heavy duty battery, etc. If you find a base ECHO, please let me know. If anyone out there bought a base ECHO, or has seen one for sale, or has heard of one for sale, please let me know.

danny28

Yes, the SCS unit is an aftermarket unit made by "Specific Cruise Systems" in CA. I think it may be listed as a 2000 Tercel unit, based on previous discussions we've had on this forum. I told the SCS dealer that the "Echo was the car that replaced the Tercel" so he may have stocked it under either name. (Somebody had trouble finding an Echo version of the unit).

Anyway, my unit looks and works great. I'm very happy with it. I paid $370 + taxes Canadian, or about $250 US installed.

See more details about this on post#94 of this forum (Toyota Echo7).

danny28

My unit is about as stripped down as anyone else has described on this forum, and it has power steering even though I didn't want or ask for it. As I recall, power steering is standard equipment on all Canadian Echos. For the life of me, I don't know why. We get little enough exercise as it is, without having to have "power assistance" to steer a 2000# vehicle. I've owned many bigger vehicles than this with no power steering, and I always managed to drive them without hurting myself!

I think that this is one item that really goes against the spirit of an ecologically friendly vehicle. We should protest en masse !

danny28

Are you still out there Hans ?

What is the technical explanation from Toyota for the need for power steering on a little Echo ?

bdoyle55

Your position and job requirements are VERY similar to what I'm looking at. The 700 to a 1000 miles is almost a quote! The company I would be working for is not to far removed from yours on the big board at the exchange. I really appreciate your comments about the cross winds. The weather in Georgia is mild (except for the furnace like heat in the summer.. April-October:) I think I could handle the wind. Only occasionally does it get to the +25mph range. Thunderstorms are a fact of life and I frequently just pull off and get a cup of Joe when it gets bad anyway, and that's in a T100.
Someone else mentioned that cruise was available as a third party option and it seemed to be OK.
I am also an ex RX-7 owner so your comments are very illuminating. I'm giving the car a serious look, the low cost, high mpg and reportedly Camry like crash safety (Toyota --- Insurance Institute in March) are appealing.
Thanks

dgecho

FOR DANNY 28- I agree with your observations regarding the gas mileage on the auto vs. the manual. I have the manual but have driven the auto, and it shifts very quick as you said. And at sustained highway cruising, it is hard to imagine there would be any difference at all.
Don

dsgecho

My ECHO is a base model exc. for the heavy duty weather package and floor mats, it is entirely base to include no power steering.May think about adding a/c this summer- has anyone done this at the dealer and how much did it cost?
Thanks,
Don

tmcc1

Just a warning on the removal and installing of a radio or anything else. In the Vancouver area some one was installing a radio or booster and hooked something up to the wrong thing and blew the air bag. Very expensive to fix.

tmcc1

The base model is available in the Vancouver B.. area. The dealer had two on the lot when I bought mine in Jan. The power steering is standard equipment as far as I know.

babyboomer

Reference Car and Driver magazine, March 2001 issue, page 69.

The article is about the Prius but there is one comment about the Echo.
"Toyota's own five-speed Echo pulled a lofty 33 mpg on the same drive
(900 miles commuting) while offering nearly identical
interior space, a 0 to 60 mph time 4.2 seconds quicker, and an as-tested a
price $6591 lower." The article is asking why someone would buy a Prius when the Echo
is available. Their Prius had only 35 mpg on the same drive but winter weather was a major
factor.

remmy6

Thought I would post a note - there's an Echo for bid on Ebay, Link as follows for those interested:

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=556441402

Enjoy...

8k8mica

after two months i finally got the car, however i feel the second gear needs more omph! umph! other than that i am pretty happy at how the car handles and the lokk of the car. The seating took me abt two hours to get used to.

danny28

Where the heck is SGP ?