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Comments
Why do I bother looking at this board?? -- Because I like the car, and may recommend one to someone in my family.
As for the Acura TL, what is wrong with being able to always know that when you will step on the gas, it will go? OK, so it's boring for your tastes, but it seems like a great choice for a lot of people.
Carguy, you don't need to be so hostile!
Is Goaugie a "jerk" just because he is trying to maximize his time and money with his car buying process?
Your type of remark is what fuels that feeling people have the VW owners are snobby and feel like they are better than other.
The market is currently loaded with great autos, and not all of them from VW. It is hard to argue with someone's decision to buy the TL. You get a whole lot of car for your money. It may be boring to some people, but it is a great deal.
Let's save the flame for the person who writes in asking if he should buy a Focus over a Passat GLX because the price is lower and the warranty longer. Those are the ones that deserve our verbal assaults!
Guess what, they are people too. Treat them with respect and humility and you will get the same in return. I have bought and sold more vehicles in the past fifteen years then most neighborhoods will in a lifetime and have made FAR more deals with my positive relationship skills than my acute ability to piss someone off.
Prehaps it is why I tend to be a bit more sharp than most when I see an amateur trying to play in the big leagues.
A great deal of things have changes since you were just a green pea working his way through college.
Yes, it is true that if everyone got a great deal on their new car, then the dealers would go out of business. For the same reason that they(the dealers) have to try and sell you the car for full price, you the consumer have to arm yourself with every available means of attaining your best deal.
I'm sure that people that send in E-mails or faxes are considered "mooches" by some dealers, but others welcome the chance to get the business. If this were not true, than dealers would not be employing full time staff to service this side of the "sales process".
As far as the "amateur trying to play in the big leagues" conclusion of your last post...just remember that the average car salesperson cannot afford the car that they are trying to sell you.
I am glad that you had such a positive experience selling cars...too bad your experience has not helped you communicate better with us "bandits".
Besides the body style, what really are the key differences between the 97 and 98 Passats? (I'm looking at GLXes, and possibly a GLS for the 98).
What does it mean exactly that the 98 version uses "components from Audi"? What's the difference in terms of performance, reliability etc. vs. sheer looks. I'm pondering the choice between a 97 GLX at around $14.5 and a 98 GLX at around $18.5k. Wondering if the $4k difference is really worth it (obviously personal, but..). Thanks for your thoughts.
The '97's were an evolution of the old Quantum which was built off an enlarged Jetta platform originally. The '98+ cars are built off the same platform as the Audi A4 and A6 and share a great many of thier major and minor componants with those cars.
If you look in Consumer Reports, the difference in "quality" and "reliabilty" from the old styule to the new ones is also night and day.
I absolutely fail to see the logic in that statement. Who cares if the person who sold me my last vehicle couldn't afford it. Does it give me the rite to rub his or her face in it? Am I any better than them because I worked hard and caught a few lucky breaks. I really do not think so. And guess what...using my way to purchase, every time I walk into the dealership to drop any of our vehicles off for service, there is a warm greeting and a loaner car there waiting for me. And btw, I got my wifes car for $37 over invoice and mine for $500 over invoice, to draw the conclusion that I bought this service is a mistake as well.
As far as things changing in the business, actually I am as involved in the industry as I have ever been, and have regular contact with many dealers. Granted, information is far more readily available than it was just a few years ago, but most do not have a clue how to use it effectively.
97 and 98 are both great. Test drive both.
I fully understand your point regarding dealing with a salesperson face-to-face. I have tried both face-to-face deals and researching the deals via email. Personally, I like to email a dealer and find out who the people are who respond to a consumer and those that just blow me off. I have found that most VW dealers in CA do, in fact, take time to respond with meaningful information. But the sales process is inevitable and, in my opinion, painful. Salesmen often times believe they know more than you about almost everything. They know how to sell and that's their game. I know how to figure out a fraud and someone who is not telling the whole truth. So I go into the sales process with the idea that I'm being lied to about most everything here. I protect myself and do not let some fly-by-night salesperson rip me off. Use of product information is and should be used on a case-by-case basis. I think the cynicism for the buying process is partly derived from consumers believing they will get screwed by the car dealer. In fact, it's not always the salesperson but finance that screws you. They are the ones who wiggle extra costs into the deal.
Now, to chastise another for his opinions is your perogative. Choosing the TL over the Passat is a personal preference. The TL has a 3.2 / 225 HP engine that runs as smooth as butter. It isn't too shabby in the acceleration either. Being someone who has driven a BMW, Volvo, and Hondas before, I'll tell you that the TL is backed by quality. If one needs the power of a BMW, they should opt for the TLS. But that's just my preference.
Mlrtyme - Be careful with that buyback. The Lemon Law was enacted to protect consumers' interests in the carbuying process. Think of it as a short-form warranty on the car. It protects against seemingly unrepairable problems with a relatively new car, which is out of service for a set period of time. If the problem can't be fixed in three chances, what makes you think that the fourth time is the charm? Better to walk away from the deal and pay more for a new one.
Ours warms up to 190 degrees rapidly and stays there as a normal operating temprature pretty much regardlesss of the driving conditions.
Jbalser...thanks for the helpful tips, I will keep those in mind when posting again. The TL is a fine car, I guess my point was our friend was comparing the "deal" he got on an outgoing model with a model that was just introduced in the marketplace. I agree, to each his own, but the TL is just a typical blend-into-the-surroundings Honda. And there are plenty of buyers that do not have a problem with that.
This German car is smooth and confident. MSRP was $25,625. Quick quote for drive out $23,995. Any good or can I do better? Not crazy about the tiny radio buttons. Typical German. The turbo is great with 170 HP now.
INKY
I did, however, find that the louder you play the system, the better it sounds. But, quite frankly, the days of entertaining the neighborhood with my car audio system are behind me.
As far as the CD, buy it aftermarket, it is a Panasonic unit that you can get from a car audio store for about $300.
PassatALL
Keep in mind that dark colors are harder to keep clean and show little scratches more than lighter colors. Can you live that? Silver is nice but there are a lot of them out there. Do you want to have the same color car as everyone else?
Some things to think about.
For example purposes, let's say you spend $100 a month at $2.30/gallon. That gives you about 43.5 gallons. Now take $2.15 for 87 octain (15¢ difference) times that 43.5 gallons and you'll spend $93.50. Is that $6.50 you'll save REALLY worth possibly damaging your engine?
It's up to you but I wouldn't risk it.
I believe the engines have a protection that just lowers timing and stuff. Might get less power or lower MPG's though....but no damage.
Also, after selecting all the options, (including destination charges and sales tax), my final cost came upto $28,000 on road. Is this a fair figure, or is my estimate way off ?
I am not clear on the 6 CD changer..Is it preferable to get a 6 CD changer in a auto shop instead of the dealer ?
I appreciate you guys helping me out...I stay in Chicago, IL if anyone wanted to know the location.
inky/vwpassat 2001: If you have the money, it is worth getting the monsoon. We have a 2000 GLS with the standard sound system, and frankly I'm disappointed in it. As mentioned by someone else, it has very low power at low volume levels (although the sound is great when you are jamming out). I know three other couples who own Passats with the monsoon (1 GLS, 2 GLX) and they don't complain about the sound. I've tried out one of them and found the sound much better at normal volume levels. I think monsoon means bigger amps and better speakers.
Our car has the factory 6 CD changer, which was only a $250 option when we bought the car in Dec. 1999. If you can figure out which model it is you might buy it cheaper elsewhere. I don't know what they charge for it now.
As for the "small buttons" on the radio: I guess you can complain about that if you want, along with the cup holder. I like the "European" styling of the whole interior, and have found the radio head unit to be very user friendly. Our other vehicle is my Ford Ranger pick-up. It has a double-din head unit with radio preset buttons so big you can change stations with the palm of your hand. However, the buttons I tend to use most (FM/AM/CD and the CD track selection) are no bigger than those on the Passat head unit.
I guess when you own a car as good as the Passat, the little things are all you have to complain about.
I want to read CD test. Any good? I am not sold on the color. I like Silver-blue.
INKY
Uhhhh...wrong-a-rama...can you say carbon build up from pre-ignition? Yes, it CAN be proven. To anyone who would consider putting [non-permissible content removed] gas into the 1.8 turbo...that is really short sighted, don't you think?
You signed up for the car with these fuel requirements, therefore you must adhere to them for proper performance. And that does not mean running the engine at its limits. Believe you me, the same peopple who are complaining about the gas and choose to use lesser grades will be on this board in two years saying "my Passat is a lemon, I was told it needs a new motor"
The consensious seems to be that premium will give slightly better gas milage.I believe this.Cadillac states that regular just lowers performance,nothing more dire than that.But the Catera is already pretty slow,so forget that.VW also states,more vaguely,that a slight loss of performance would be the only drawback.Still,I'm sticking to premium(for now).
But I do think it is a valid question.
I agree with Sporin on the gas issue, I consistently get around 25 MPG in everyday driving in my 1.8t 5 speed (per the computer) why on earth would someone skimp on regular gas for degraded performance and gas mileage to suposedly save a few bucks - False economy in my book.
Just my opinion.
This is a 15,000 ft. overview of the process. Again, don't rely on the warranty to bail you out of making the wrong decision at the pumps.
Merckx- "disengenious"-nice one! Prehaps you should be a little more thrifty with your vocabulary, and not your fuel budget!
1.Is there a large difference in the resale value of the Maunual Gear Passat Vs. the Automatic Gear one..
2.Also, I wanted to be absolutely sure before buying. Does any VW Passat owner have any major problems with hid Passat ?
3. Can anyone tell me how much he paid for his/her VW passat ? (including luxury package + Monsoon sound system)
CD player. Who makes suitable single CD unit for this car? HOw much?
INKY
It really adds to enjoyment;and the clutch I find more forgiving than many.
-Michael
New tires at 27,000 miles.
Power steering pump failure at 28,000 miles - $300, no warranty.
Water pump failure at 30,000 miles, argued 4 days before I got warranty. Consumer cost $750.00, warranty bill $560.00.
Brakes at 35,000, rotors worn out (no metal to metal contact) still had 15% pads according to WV. They admitted that it was funny, but no warranty, Cost $520.
I wish I had my Ford SO back at 65,000 miles it was still trouble free, ran the brakes to 45,000, turned the rotors, tires to 52,000, so much for the great German engineering.
Glad to be out of the car!!!!