Oldsmobile Intrigue

dindak

I walked to my car at lunch and saw no less than 4 other Intrigues in the parking lot (with about 60-70 cars total). It's too bad the car didn't catch on everywhere like it did here. It's strange too because Oakville is home to Ford Canada. Go figure..

oldtimer4

Hey, thanks for your input. I can't disagree that a replacement new Intrigue would be preferred, but the reality is it would be difficult to pull off since the engine is being replaced under warranty, making it ineligible for the NYS lemon law to be enforced.

But I have updated my file with the Olds Customer Assistance Office, including the ridiculous offer made to take another $7,500 out of my pocket and deny me the available $3,500 rebate/bonus for a new '01 Intrigue. Perhaps GM/Olds will respond with something more than an apology. BTW, my last 5 cars were Camrys & Fords which collectively didn't give me as much of a problem.

And I'm not familiar with the places the engine number would be on record or if I should follow up with an attempt to have it updated. Could you enlighten me?

Thanks again.

b4z

My point was that i can buy a new 25.5K intrigue for 20K. A new TL at 29K can be bought for 27K, maybe more considering what most people are paying for them. 27K minus 20K equals 7K difference.

I am using the words honda and acura interchangeably in case you haven't figured that out.

An Acura is a Honda in Europe.

winter9

How are things going for you? I hope well. Reading a few of the recent topics here, I thought it might be best to go right to the source for some answers. Are you aware of any widespread issue with the alternator that comes with the 3.5 motor? A few people have had lights that flicker or go out due to an alternator problem. Also, there are (were?) rumors of the 3.5's output possibly being bumped up 10 HP to 225. Any truth to that for '02 or sometime? Any updates for the '02 Intrigue other than what you have already told us? As always, your inputs are appreciated.

etharmon

Sorry fellow Intrigue owners, but Jgriff has won me over. No Midnight Blue or Bronzemist GLS for me. No 3.5 liter DOHC V6 or PCS. It's Honda for me baby!! Forget that Intrigue and the $1500 loyalty discount, I'm going to get a Honda because they are so so good. I want resale man, I want what everyone else is driving. Make mine a 4 cylinder LX with those 15 inch wheels with bolt on plastic covers. I'll even lower it and put those tacky fat wheels on it and put a fart pipe on the exhaust so all the world can enjoy the sound of my puny four banger. And I'll drive around town with a baseball cap on backwards with my bass thumping so loud the license plate rattles. Dindak, Ketch, dwg, and others what are we thinking, we should bow down to the holy grail that is Honda. And when I get tired of that, I'll get a Camry because they truly are "too sexy" and all the chics dig that car. THEN I WOKE UP:)

jgriff

dindak :: I'm not so sure why you think that I'm totally pro-Honda/Acura. In reality I've owned more Toyotas than Hondas. This CL, is my first Honda product ever. In the past I did not think that Honda was 100% up to par with all the hype. In fact my '98 Intrigue was my choice over the new Accord back in 1998.

IMHO Toyota is the Big Dog to watch out for. Honda simply does not have enough backing to compete on a big scale.

GM has themselves spread too thin, too many flavors of the same platforms from different divisions. NO direction, you've got each divisions doing their own thing, and then competing against themselves as well as the others.

oldtimer4

In spite of the problem engine in the process of being replaced @1500 miles on my new '00 Intrigue, I like the car. If it ends up performing anything like the '99 Intrigue loaner I'm driving w/35,000 on it, I'll be more than pleased. That baby 'screams'! I only average 12K/yr on a car anyway, and generally trade when the warranty expires because I like the comfort of a factory warranty.

I'd be far more concerned about the dealer and his service reputation, no matter what car one buys. Check him out beforehand rather than swallow his B-S. I made the mistake of not doing so, and spent a month fighting to get dsecent warranty service

There are clues during negotiations. My dealer's sales mgr. first tried to screw me royaly, followed by playing the old 'misplaced keys' trick when I tried to leave. I had to threaten to call the police before they came up with them .. right on the sales mgr's desk. Two months after I bought my car, unknown to me beforehand, my brother bought one from the same dealer. The sales magr changed his contract from 6.9 to 8.4% financing, and from 48 to 66 months without telling him. He caught it when he went to the CU to sign the papers. So he won't be going back there again either, and for sure we'll be spreading the word.

dindak

"I'm not so sure why you think that I'm totally pro-Honda"

Are you joking?????????

Hummm.. maybe cause you are always talking about Honda products. Maybe cause you always compare Intrigue to Honda products. HONDA RULES BABY!

ketch

"[Though GM scrapped its sinking Oldsmobile brand in December, officials view Cadillac as a division that must be saved in order to maintain the company's global reputation as a top-rank
automaker. "GM must have a premier luxury brand,"said Michael O'Malley, 49, Cadillac's general manager. "It signals to the world our capability." ]"
...as seen in the Detroit News. Note too that Caddy had 190k sales last year while Olds was down to 284k. Still sad to see Olds go, esp. when the Catera cnnot even match the Intrigue or Aurora today! One thing we do not need more of is luxu barg SUV's, but the Escalade EXT is being added anyways (Chevy Avalanche, with the caddy "Art and Science" look, and bizzar
either way). Average age for buyers at Buick is 66 (!) and at least 60 at caddy, so unlike Olds (47 way down from past years) thier buyer's are dead soon so few repeat buyers. Olds/GM could have cultivated buyers for future Olds sales, but they will now move on to likely non-GM brands. Zarrella must be related to the exonn valdez capt.

b4z

Good Luck with your situation.
Unless the 2000 that yoou own now has PCS the '99 that they give you will be quicker in acceleration due to its lower gear ratio.

slopedirk

Well, as many of you know, I stumbled into a good deal on a 2000 maxima SE 5 speed and bought it after seriouisly coming very close buying a green GLS 2001 with pcs. I got the loaded Se for $1000 cheaper than the invoiced Olds. So, we finally drive it to work in some traffic and it becomes apparent that Nissan did not do its homework on the engine mapping. If you are easing along at just barely cracked throttle and then let off totally for a second, the engine fuel cuts off totally and with the 5 speed you get air compressor like friction and decleration. Ease your foot back on the gas and it acts like you turned a button back "on" and the motor comes to life and it starts to accellerate. Its nearly impossible to keep at steady rate in low gear and low speeds. And we bought this car for commuting. Great. I get on the Max forum and find out that 2000's 5speeds all have the same problem, its a design flaw. In my copious reserach (must have been 4 months) I never saw this mentioned about maxima's, as I guess 1. there are not that many 2000+ models out yet and 2. even less fo these are 5 speeds and 3. they have their own 5-speed forum here at edmonds.

Read #3 posting, he has it figured out.

bigk200 "Maxima 5-speed Problems" Sep 15, 2000 2:42am

My check has not hit the bank yet, wondering if I can return the car ? Tx isnot a consumer friendly state... I may be screwed.

Slope
Wishing I had bought the GLS

ps otherwise the max is fine car, although the controls are a bit light on the feet.

oldtimer4

Thanks for the info. It saves me from wondering later on (if I ever get my 2000 back) why it isn't quite as quick as that 1999. You guys & gals are a wealth of knowledge.

b4z

If you are not happy with the car, take it back.
Evidently it is not fixable. And as long as you own the car, and every time you drive it, you will be reminded of it.
Things like that bother the heck out of me. My camaro, also a five speed, needs to have its idle increased at least twice a year, or else the a/c compressor will vibrate so hard at idle that i have to turn the a/c off. Try living with that for 13 years and 200,000 miles.
GM supposedly made a stronger a/c bracket that was supposed to cancel the vibrations, but i have never been able to find it.
It is especially fun when you push the clutch in while slowing for a corner and the engine dies....no power steering. If i had a dollar for every time i have shifted into second gear, and bump started it after it has died on me, i would be a rich man.
But the fact that it can lay 8 feet of rubber at 20 mph makes it okay that i take my life into my own hands everytime i start it up.

dindak

I knew about the 5-speed Maxima problem, but I thought Nissan had fixed it. Guess not. A co-worker had the same problem and exchanged it for an automatic after complaining a lot. That may be an option. She seems happy now. An automatic would be better for commuting anyway.

gunrunner

My wife drags home this bronze-mist 99 GL, almost totally loaded, one owner, 17K miles, Boze, sunroof, leather, spoiler, classy wheels, etc, etc. Biting my tongue to hide my excitement, I agree to let her swap-in her 95 LaSabre(138K miles). I took the obligatory test drive, staying off the Interstate. Next day it's ours. First nice day, I go over it with a fine tooth comb, reseating the above window door trim, topping off the fluids, Installing a new Deutsch oil filter cart and Pennzoil 10w30, fresh serpentine belt, trunking the used one for a spare. Bring the tires to an exact pressure all around,(including bringing the tiny spare up to 60psi, from a miserable 20psi!) Then it's off down the interstate with ZERO traffic (middle Tennessee, Sunday AM), and she cannot believe we're slipping along at 110MPH (electronic limiter set at 112).
Need I say more ... This is as sweet and solid a car as ever made, and as soon as I can convince the dealer to set the limiter higher, and match it with some new EAGLES, I'll let it stretch it's legs again! Oh yes, I love changing that oil filter .. it really makes sense. You owe it to yourself to read about this engine on the GM powertrain website!

etharmon

Gald you like the Intrigue. Happy Intrigue owner(leasee) in East TN right here:)

Slopedirk, man sorry that your not as happy with the new car. You think maybe there is an adjustment or something that can be done? You would think that Nissan would do better than this. Espcially since they are one of the few automakers to offer a 5 speed with a V6 in a midsize sedan and pride themselves on it.

BTW guys, the latest issue of Motor Trend has this year's OSV Intrigue with the Northstar V8. The article said it was the Cadillac 4.6 liter version, but the picture showed the Aurora V8 in the Intrigue's engine bay. They said it was a very easy fit and had production potential. Hmmm. Too late now I guess. While I love a V8, I do wonder if the heavier V8 would have hurt the car's balance and made it more front heavy. I was always partial to the supercharged 3.5 liter V6 in last year's OSV show car.

legcne

Knowing that I wanted to buy a new car, when I am on business trips, I rent various cars - to test them out. I drove the Intrigue for a week. Very nice driving car, lots of features, good power. But those seats? After ten minutes my thighs were hurting. To Euro for my taste. Kind of like leather covered concrete. I was glad to give the car back.

I compared several imports; Camry, Accord, 626, Maxima, etc.. In the under $30K range, I really didn't like any of them. I tried the Chevy Impala and the Buick Regal LS, similarly equipped. The Chevy had my vote. It was very nice but the roll around the seat up near my shoulders hurt my back, in just a few minutes. I found the Buick to be quite good. But not impressive.

Next we took 4 people up an 8% grade. The Impala really had a lot of engine growl. Forget about exceleration. The Buick Regal LS also had a lot of engine growl and a lot of muffler noise. Similar performance. I felt like I was lucky to get up the hill.

Then..... We took 4 people up the same grade in a Regal GS. Wow!!! This one has a supercharger, 270 ft. lbs. of torque. Very little noise and I could out excelerate any car that could make the grade. I could go from 25 mph to 50 mph about as easily as I could on the straight and narrow. I would judge that this car can out excelerate any car in its price range, hill or not.

OHC engines are good but this push rod, supercharged engine is hard to beat for the price. And, I get a little over 25 mpg in stop and go freeway driving (36 mile commute. I haven't had an opportunity to take it on a trip as yet. The salesman told me he had driven from Orange Co., CA to Las Vegas (about 800 miles round trip) and got around 29 MPH. Who am I to argue?

yurakm

Congratulations with your new Regal GS!

You wrote: this car can out excelerate any car in its price range, hill or not.

Well, this is wrong. Camaro Z28 / TransAm cost about the same, and can out accelerate GS as easily, as GS out accelerates a base Camaro or Firebird. On the other hand, no family sedan in the price range currently have more power than Regal GS and Grand Prix GTP.

Intrigue is very close in the respect, though, especially at the highway speeds. I saw how they are accelerating uphill on step incline: this is very impressive.

Be careful when you are passing other cars. If starting the maneuver at 70mph, when you finish with it and glance at speedometer, GS will accelerate to about 96 mph - even uphill. It takes about 2 seconds; too easy to get a ticket...

legcne

I stand corrected.

I have friends that have the Camaro SS and the Z28, the Pontiac Firebird and the Trans Am. Who knows what they paid for them? In any case, since I can't get into any of them, comparison never entered my mind. More like sadine cans. Yes, they can go.

Now back to mid size, 4 door sedans... The Regal GS isn't necessarily fast off the line, probably isn't a good dragster but on the freeway over 30 mph, it goes pretty good. Don't know if I'll ever need to go over 70 mph though. I don't think my tires have a high temperature rating anyway.

Now if you want to compare sedans to sardine cans, a friend of mine has a Brabus modified E500 MBZ. Of course, I think ir is a lot above the price range we were originally talking about. It has 740 ft. lbs of torque and goes pretty good.

This week end is the Winter Nationals in Pomona. I suppose you can guess that I prefer straight line racing. May the Force be with you.

slopedirk

A copy of my post from Nissan Maxima board FYI -

Thanks for comments. Not a perfect car, but few are

GUNRUNNER - nice find! wish my wife would drag home a car like that, but she does like the max just fine.

S

--------------------

Ok, I was at work freaking out reading all about the engine management problems of the 5speed
cars. I drove home from work with zero problems. I ended up stopping on my street and going
very slowly in 1st gear and yes, trying to go super slow in 1st gear is tough, but I doubt I'll have
a problem with it. As one guy had said, it might be that people are not used to drivnig a car with
that much motor in it with a 5 speed. I know my old car only had about 165 horses max, and at
low speed w/o turbo it was pretty mello. The maxima has some torque and compression, so
that getting into and out of the the throttle with the fuel cutoff at low speed is more rough than I
am used to, but I think its manageable.

Sorry for the false alarm. I also did not notice the engine running up between shifts like some
indicated. Maybe that is a user error?

dindak

I was going through the 2001 car selection in a magazine last night (Carguide), and when looking at midsize sedans there were only 3 cars that attracted me. The Intrigue, Maxima and Mazda Mellenia (sp?). The Mazda is too expensive for what it is however so again, I come back to the Maxima and the Intrigue. Intrigue will be gone in a year or two so unless GM comes up with another good performance sedan.. I will be looking at a Maxima next time around. Perhaps GM will smarten up and refine the Grand Prix. If they do I would buy one.

teo

I have read in other sources that the Grand Prix is scheduled to be redesigned for the 2003 model year and the Regal for the 2004 model year...so hold your breath until GM gives better details as to what to expect on the next generation of these cars. The Impala/Montecarlo await redesign until 2005.

jg28

I've searched through the posts and cannot find what Harlanc said was in store for the 2002 Intrigue. Maybe now that's all moot but I'd like to know at least what he teased us with? Can someone recap or at least tell me what the post numbers were? Thanks. With all the rebates, incentives, etc, what can one get an Aurora 3.5 for?

b4z

I seem to remember that harlan said that it was mostly tied to making the GLS stand a part from the GX and GL. The sunroof was going to be standard. The interior would be different, something about more wood.
I was hoping there would be exterior changes, like a new front bumper design etc.
I will search too and see if i can find it. I believe it was posted after the announcement in the middle of december. He said that it was too late for the changes not to take effect.
He also posted something last summer about taking a drive in a 2002 prototype.

b4z

The olds death announcement came on Dec. 13. Harlanc posted #476 that day. Edmunds switched over to a new format a couple of days later and a bunch of posts were lost permanently.
The post that you and I both remember was probably lost that day. Sorry.

etharmon

That special new model for 2002 was an OSV Intrigue that just somehow slipped past the GM brass? Am I the only one that thinks the 3.5 sure would feel at home with a 5 speed manual?

redly_one

I recently looked at a co-workers Motor Trend (I believe it was a new issue. And, oop, to my suprise somewhere in the middle of the mag was and article about an LT1 AWD Grand Prix (pretty bad), a 300HP 3800 Regal, and a delicious Northstar Intrigue.

The article also stated that the Intrigue OSV "HAD" the greatest chance of being realized. (keyword HAD) But since the scrapping of Olds, it wouldn't be realized.

I tell you guys, no one could have been more excited than me to see that black beauty, then I about cried when they reminded me how GM is a big glutonous pig that destroys all that is good...well, maybe I'm overreacting. Anyway, it's great that Olds is getting all kinds of strange advertising like this, in rememberance.

timmyv

I bought my 99 Intrigue a little over a year ago. The night driving it home from the dealer I noticed the headlights flickering. It has now been 38K miles and 14 months and still no fix. I keep being promised a re designed alternator - but it is continually not available. Another individual with an Intrigue at the dealer I go to got a re designed at in Dec-00 and it froze on him a few miles down the road.

Has anyone else experienced the new alt? Does it actually fix the flickering?

Lately I've also experienced very slow starts. I live in MN so at first I thought I had a little gas line freeze issue. So, I've been putting HEAT in at every fill-up. Still, I'm experiencing the slow start problem every now and then. Doesn't matter if it is my first start in 5 days or if it has been sitting for only an hour... Any ideas?

white6

Check the battery. There were a lot of defective batteries (mine was one; 99 GL 3.5). It starts leaking from the positive terminal. It's pretty easy to see, since the positive terminal is the one closest to the front of the car. Mine was actually dribbling down into the tray. The dealer replaced the battery, the insulating "sock" around the battery and the tray. This could cause a "slow start" problem, since the leak could create extra resistance for the battery to overcome, thus not as much power for the highest amperage requirement... the starter.

winter9

jg28: I happened to save the last 2 posts of harlanc's. bz4 is correct that these posts were deleted when Edmunds switched over to the new format, so I'm glad I kept an off-line copy. Here are his last 2 posts verbatim:

"#503 of 569: I am still listening (harlanc) Wed 13 Dec '00 (10:08 AM)
For what its worth, I have been reading every posting and I have also been working on the 2002 Intrigue interior upgrades. The announcement yesterday was a shock to me and was not expected. I am gratified that many of you on this forum do appreciate the Intrigue - the best mid-size car GM has ever built.

#604 of 621: Thanks for the kind words (harlanc) Fri 15 Dec '00 (06:51 AM)
I would like to thank those who posted kind words about the Intrigue and our team. I was working on the OSV enhanced performance but that is now gone. The 2002 changes will come out as they are too far along to stop which are mostly interior changes which separate the GLS from the GL, new colors, and home link, driver power lumbar, and sunroof standard for he GLS."

Happy Intrigueing to all ... winter9

jkkinnova1

I got a used '99 GLS about two weeks ago. Love it, but I've noticed one thing about the steering - sometimes when turning I notice a shimmy (or shaking) in the steering wheel. Anyone else experience this or is this a known issue?

This board is a great source of info - I wish I knew more about cars so I could add some intelligent comments. But I still enjoy lurking here.

mcap42

This is my first post. I've been an Olds owner for 9 years and bought (no, invested) a 2001 Intrigue GL two weeks ago. I absolutely love this car. When I tell people what I bought, they keep saying: "Why did you buy an Olds? Aren't they going out?" I hate that. So, I tell them I got it for the cash back and the warranty incentive, but I think from now on I'll tell them it's the best mid-sized sedan in America.

mavis1

This is my first post. The other day, while driving my 2001 Intrigue GL,I decided I wanted some fresh air in the car, so instead of lowering the front window,I lowered the passenger rear. As I was lowering it I began noticing a shuddering and vibration. I experimented with both rear windows and of course it grew worse. The noise it made was UNBEARABLE. I called the dealer and of course he said he has not heard of this problem and to bring it in. Has anyone else experienced this problem??

dindak

mavis1 : Sounds like something in the window is loose. Don't panic, bring the car in. It doesn't sound serious and the dealer should be able to fix it in a few hours.

mcap42 : Welcome and congrats on the Intrigue. I'm not sure Intrigue is the best midsize in America, but it's definitely top three and the best made by any of the three "American" companies.

jg28

for the posts. It'll be exciting to see what happens I suppose. Anyone sited any of the 2002 Bravadas yet? They sure look sweet on paper.

j_coleman

mavis1: Try cracking the front windows if you are riding with the rear ones down. Also crack the sunroof open if you have one.

slopedirk

Are you hearing buffeting? I would guess that's what it is. Many cars when rear windows are down get wind buffeting, or 'vibratation' like sensation due to wind filling the interior, pressurizing it, then it depressuring, all very quickly. This can be quite loud and annoying. I'd keep rear windows up on most cars, as aerodynamically they are designed to have windows up.

If the glass is rattling around, that's a separate issue.

Good luck,

Slope

j_coleman

slopedirk: The Intrigue definitely exhibits this. I find that cracking the front windows usually helps to equalize the pressure.

lee18

If the noise you are referring to is a low frequency pulsation that occurs only when you are moving, it is probably the resonance effect of air blowing by openings in the passenger compartment (e.g. open windows). This is especially common in larger 4 door cars. This can usually be eliminated by opening windows asymetrically, for example, opening one front window (left or right) and one rear window (left or right) at the same time. Usually opening both rear windows the same amount makes it worse.

Bjor

Read somewhere that the features that were supposed to be offered in the next generation Intrigue that we will never see will be incorporated in the next generation Buick Regal. I'm not sure how that's going to work. Buick is supposedly coming out with a new version of the GNX with 270hp (!) that will be as fast or faster than the 1986 version. Maybe the Regal LS will get the 3.5 engine. Who knows?

dindak

If the tighten up the suspension and put the 3.5L in the the next Regal.. I would buy it.

DO IT BUICK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

racer_x_9

Could be an intermediate steering shaft problem. Check previous posts for symptoms.

Good luck

etharmon

Congratulations on the new car. Nevermind what the naysayers tell you. It is too bad that Olds is being phased out. A co-worker of mine purchased a new leftover 2000 GLS at the first of January he has already put nealy 1500 miles on the car and enjoys it alot. A nosy guy that works with us(who has a Camry) has already made the remark "you know they are going to quit making Oldsmobiles soon" and the comeback he had was good as he told the guy "well they still make them now and the Intrigue is a damn good car." Camry guy already knows that I'm seriously considering another Intrigue when my lease is up this summer, but he knows better than to make his smart remarks to me. Enjoy the car!

Got my "official" certificate from GM in the mail Saturday. It is basically a formal letter with a small attached certificate or coupon that you tear off and keep. It is good until 12/31/05 and it good on a new and unused 2000 or newer Oldsmobile, Chevrolet, Pontiac, Buick, GMC truck, Cadillac, Saturn, or Saab. $1500 off if you get an Olds and $1000 off on everything else. Other national and regional incentives do apply as well and the certificate can be transferred to anyone else living at the same address.

mavis1, sounds like turbulence. What speed were you driving at? What I've noticed on mine is that if I open the rear windows more than an inch or so and drive at speeds over 35 mph or so, I get turbulence. Cracking open the front passenger side window usually resolves it. For quiet flow through ventilation on warm days(or when I have Italian take home food in the car) I'll just crack open one of the rear windows. Haven't gotten any turbulence that way.

teo

Is he coming back in February?

j_coleman

teo: just what we need in this forum, more depression...

ketch

Remember too, as I have stated many times, my Brother has been in the upper echelon of the car biz for 40+ years, at VW, Sterling and of recent at a major auto consulting co. for all major makers. He has most experience with german makes, but hs lots of real world experience with many types and makes of cars over that time. He is very picky (almost too much so, but then again owns a Porsche Carrera 4 among others) as to cars and indicated the Intrigue (and passat) to be best in class, and to certainly be the best of GM. In fact he prefferred the Intrigue regardless of price. Assuming you will hold onto it for awhile, and resale is of no concern, know you got a car that is unique in its combination of BALANCED perfromance, room, looks and low cost of ownership (see C&D's magazine long term test). Enjoy, and oh, make sure to floor it to the redline cutoff once and awhile and savor the sounds!

tensor

Well after 2 years of disappointments with my '98 Intrigue, I finally bit the bullet and traded it in. I seriously considered a '00 Intrigue GLS leftover which would have been by far the best deal on paper, but after my experience and problems I could not justify doing it again when it came down to it. It sounds like from the posts of more recent owners that the problems are hopefully fixed, but no one I have seen has high miles yet on the '00 or '01, and I was not willing to take another chance. Also, except for the new wheels, the car still looks identical to the '98. The 3.8L engine was excellent and was the high point of the car along with the styling and interior layout. I also looked at the Aurora 3.5L, but it still was a lot of $ for something being discontinued. Although the styling and interior layout were very nice, the test car had rattles already which just turned me off.

I looked at the GP, but it actually seemed decontented since I owned my '97. No climate control anymore, cloth material did not seem as nice, definitely cheaper feeling switches and controls than the Intrigue. Also, the leather was definitely not as nice as my Intrigue's, and I would have preferred the GP's cloth over it. Plus, everything else was the same - you'd think in 5 model years that some changes would be made like a new dash or new tail lights. Something other than wheels. I also looked at the Regal, but it has a funny interior, and one on the showroom floor had a fake convertable top on it. Why does GM allow this to happen? It really turned me off. But frankly, I really felt the Intrigue spoiled me for the other W cars. Also, Regal and GP only have $1000 rebates right now and compared to the competition, I think they need to be higher. The $1000 loyalty coupon did not sway me either.

I also looked at the Acura TL (too Accord looking from the side and front) and the ES300 (too Camry looking). The Lincoln LS is really nice, but RWD is just not practical for me with all my driving plus the interior has too little storage.

I ended up with a Volvo S60 2.4T which picks up in pricing where the Intrigue ends and was on the higher side of what I wanted to spend. But I loved the looks as soon as I saw it at our local auto show this fall, and I have not met anyone who has a recent model and does not like it. I have only had it a short time, but I really love it so far. Plus, unlike the TL and ES300 which look like dressed up versions of less expensive cars, it looks like a smaller version of the more expensive S80 which was a plus to me.

I am really worried for GM. At 36 and as a 4 time new GM car repeat buyer ('88 Corsica, '91 and '97 GP (totalled), '98 Intrigue), I cannot believe they lost me. I was really excited getting each one of these, and I never thought I'd buy an import. But after a disappointing experience with the Intrigue and with older midsize designs right now, I just could not get excited about another GM at this time.

oldtimer4

Guys & gals, the new engine has arrived for my '00 GX (with 1550 miles on it), and I'm considering doing my own oil changes w/ Mobil '1' and the best filters I can find.

Can anyone tell me where to get the special tool required to remove the oil filter, and roughly what they cost?

I'm sure I'm not the 1st to go this route, so hopefully someone out there must know & will share their experience. Thanks in advance.

slopedirk

Congrats on new car! I agree on your findings, I wanted to buy a GM. After leaving the fold for a Dodge, and getting great basic transport (with some qualifications), after doing research Dodge was near bottom in terms of quality although on paper the intrepid is an acctractive package with side bags, bigger wheels, more HP (supposedly), manual/auto type automatic, good styling, etc. Not being totally happy with Dodge and liking my old GM's well enough, I also checked out all the above. Pontiac was just too cheap looking, no folding seats, climate, no 3.5, etc. If the Olds was more price competitive normally the rebate would have really inspired some selling. As it was, eve with the rebate I got a better deal on a leftover 2000 Maxima SE 5 speed, which we actually liked a little better in terms of driving than the olds. Comfort wise, the olds was the choice. But the extra $ and previously noted (on board) quality issues, future resale was the deciding factor.

I didn't look at the Volvo very seriously, as my self-imposed price limit was on the other end of the spectrum. But as I said before, I still sometimes wish I was driving the Olds with that smooth 3.5/auto combo. I'm going to look keep an eye open for a used one and let my wife drive the max.

A GP with the 3.5 and some interior refinement would have had a buyer with me.

What my dad and I can't belive, is why Gm is having trouble with something as simple as an alternator???? My 88 shadow has never had any alternator problems, neither did my 70 Nova, 65 chevy II, or our 65 LeMans, our 80 citation (it had other problems), etc. Makes you want to have a shop fab a bracket for a old model self regulated alternator, doesn't it?

Slope

dindak

tensor : Volvo S60 is a nice car, but Volvos are far from trouble free. I do hope you have better luck than with your Intrigue. It's unfortunate you bought a 98, because I think if you had a 2000 like I do, you would probably be a happy camper. Totally understand your decision and I'm sorry to see you leave the fold. Enjoy the new car.

slope : How is the 5-speed in the Max? Did you get it fixed yet??

oldtimer : Let us know how the transplant goes.