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Comments
The drain plug appears to be a 24mm unit. It's "hollow" in that there's a small round/cylindrical magnet in the center, with the threads around the outside of the bolt. While trying to tighten the plug last night, it broke off. Approximately the top half of the threads are stuck in the hole and the rest of the threads are still on the bolt/drain plug.
The drain hole is 99% open (the drain plug head did NOT break off in the hole), so the fluid drained out.
I'm out of town now (Grand Rapids, Mich.) and only local Isuzu dealer is closed today. I want to acquire the part ASAP even though I cannot pursue a repair until tomorrow at the earliest.
I'm hoping that the broken-off threads can be removed from the hole (by some "tapping" procedure my dad described) and that the entire rear differential housing/drain pan/whatever the thing is called that the drain and fill plugs thread into does not need to be replaced.
Your help advice is appreciated. Please, hold the wise cracks until AFTER I get this problem resolved!
Most any garage has the tools necessary to remedy the situation. Depending on the exact nature of the break they may drill a hole in the center of the remaining bolt and tap in a tool called an easyout which will grip the remaining bolt. They then spin the easyout and the remaining bolt out. Sometimes even just drilling the center out causes the remaining threads to unlock. A good shop will also have a thread chaser that they will then run in the plug hole to make sure the threads are like new. Worst case scenario is like noted above they will just drill it all out and retap with a larger plug or install a new thread insert. While these can be relatively simple processes, if done incorrectly you can easily go from bad to much worse. So given your present situation, and run of bad luck, leave it to some pros who have done this numerous times before.
My advice is to first call a local auto parts store to find one that has a magnetized plug in the correct size. If you cannot find a magnetized one buy a regular plug now and order a magnetized one next week from St. Charles. While you are talking to the parts store ask them for some shop names. Unless you want the "this guy is desperate rates" try to act as calm as possible when talking to the shops and focus on how good they are at solving such problems without resorting to retapping the threads.
Finally, if you have any doubts that maybe the recovery process left any loose metal particles in the diff, or if you cannot find a magnetized plug, my suggestion is that you have the shop refill with regular gear oil. Then a few days later drain and refill with your chosen synthetic. FWIW I always put a layer of teflon tape on my drain plug threads just so that I don't have any stuck plugs. I also don't tighten them to the 800 pound gorilla setting. Instead just a little past snug has always worked for me, especially in combination with the teflon tape.
Good luck.
On Sat. I ordered a new drain plug from St. Charles (local dealers were all closed). It will be here on Tuesday. I forgot to ask whether it's a magnetized plug like the original one, but I assume it is since it's an Isuzu part from the Isuzu dealer. I can't imagine Isuzu would sell one that is different (not as good) from the original plug.
In the Maintenance/Repair site, Mr_Shiftright (the host) also recommended an easy out as the best solution. So my main goal is to get this thing fixed without needing the plug housing to be "tapped?"
Thanks again for your help.
The 2 pieces fit together to make basically the whole bolt, so if there is any metal debris still in the housing I doubt there is very much.
The replacement bolt I receive tomorrow from St. Charles Isuzu should have the same magnet on the bottom as the original one, so that should help to collect any metal debris that is in there.
One question: what's the best way to ensure that any metal particles are removed from the housing? I plan to fill the rear differential with fluid and drain it, then refill with the final fluid I plan to keep in there for 30k miles or so. Once I fill with the first round of fluid, should I drive the truck around or just drain it out as soon as I fill it? I know driving it when metal debris is in there would be a bad idea, but I don't know if driving it will help to circulate the fluid and catch the metal debris. Again, I don't think there is much, if any, metal debris still in the housing but it's hard for me to be sure.
Are there any other ways to remove any metal debris?
Thanks for your continued assistance.
Given the cost of gear lube I think I would pump in a quart or two of regular oil with the drain plug out to try and hose down and rinse out any shavings. If I really thought there still might be some big bits of metal in there I would fill with regular oil, jack up the rear and spin the rear tires by hand for a few minutes. Hopefully that would loosen up any remaining bits without doing any damage. I would then drain that and put in the regular gear lube. I would then take a short trip before draining that.
I think breakor is giving you good advice. Here is my 2 cents:
Try to resist the temptation to crank the bleep out of bolts and such when tightening. You may be suprised how easy it is to overtighten. In fact, you should invest in a good torque wrench and use that to tighten the plug. I think there is a spec in the owners manual for torque on that plug. Once you do that a few times you will get a feel for how many "grunts" you need to properly tighten the bolt or plug you are working on.
Stupidly enough, I DO have a torque wrench but I wasn't using it on the rear diffy. I didn't know what the torque specs were, and I was being lazy and just used a regular ratchet. I'll doublecheck my owners manual. The thing is, I've tightened several other bolts to spec on the Trooper and my other vehicle, so I know basically what 40 ft-lbs or 70 ft-lbs feels like. I didn't think I overtightened, but I sure might have.
Any problems with pouring 5W30 or 10W30 motor oil through the rear diffy? There would probably be a LITTLE bit of leftover oil that wouldn't fully drain out, but I guess it probably wouldn't be a big problem. Definitely better than not pouring anything through and possibly leaving metal in there.
Sorry I couldn't resist again. I wish you all could see how hard I was laughing at his last few posts! Seriously though sorry to hear you are having troubles and I wish you good fortune in the future!
I was in civil engineering school, til I hit Mechanics of Materials!
Just busting his nutz, it's all in good fun!
-mike
Jim
P.S. the wheelbarrow is a perfect example of me doing things that were more stupid.
mark pearson
I poured about 1/4 qt. of leftover Valvoline Durablend 5W30 engine oil through the fill plug, with the drain plug removed. After that drained out, I installed drain plug to 45 ft-lbs and added 3 quarts of 80W90 Valvoline petrol-based gear lubricant. Today (Weds.) I will drain the Valvoline and add 3 qts. Mobil1 synthetic gear lube and one bottle (4 fl. oz.) of GM/Isuzu limited slip additive.
I didn't see any specs in the owners manual on the proper torque for any fasteners on the Trooper, including the rear diffy drain/fill plugs. My Trooper Chilton's manual (up to '96 Troopers) said 40 ft-lbs so I figured my 98 Trooper wouldn't be far off from that. 40 ft-lbs just doesn't feel that tight, so I did 45 instead. I think this is MUCH less torque than I had been applying last week.
jimmyp, I appreciate you sticking up for me. For the most part, I don't mind the ribbing that I got. A couple of the posts were a little annoying, because I didn't think they were that funny any more. But overall it didn't bother me much.
I'm glad I was able to provide some humor for you folks. I wish it hadn't cost me approximately $100 worth of fluids to do that, though.
6'3"
265
31 yrs old
and I've got you in every category tough guy!!!
Bring it on!!!
-mike
Breakor, thanks for the info. I will tighten to 58 ft-lbs tonight.
At 6' plus, have any of you had the seat rails adjusted to move back further? I sat in a Vehicross at my Isuzu/Subaru dealer the other day, the seat goes much further back than the Trooper.
Compared with other forums and other sites, the discussion here is WAY more civil and polite. Some of the crap you see around other places is just ridiculous.
One bonus is that people who have other SUVs don't come to the Trooper forums and bother us because the Trooper is such a limited-quantity vehicle in the U.S. That helps.
So far, I've had my Trooper in their shop four times and I would rate their service as excellent, to this point.
What they've done so far is -
#1 - Lube/oil/filter @ 5500 mi. and fixed a small part on the hinge of one of the rear doors that was pushed off when ice formed last winter and expanded. Cost for this was approx. $25.00.
#2 - Service at 16.5K mi. Lube, oil, filter. Rotate and balance (4) tires in "X" pattern. Front end alignment. Front/rear differential fluid flush/replacement. Reprogram of engine control computer (warranty - error code #29).
Total cost for non-warranty work $162.00.
#3 - Replace rear cupholder for one with stronger magnet. They took me as a "walk-in" and had me out in 20 min! (I wouldn't expect this on a regular basis.) It had been ordered at the previous service.
#4 - Finally had my recalls (00V376 & 00V253) done! Lube, oil, filter. Also my CD changer malfunctioned and they replaced that as well. I was particularly impressed in that I had called them the previous Friday, described the problem and the error code I was getting (#3) and they ordered one that same day! It arrived on Tuesday just as Isuzu America had told me and was exchanged for the old one! Non-warranty charge for this visit $27.00.
I did have the oil and filter changed at 11K but couldn't get into the dealer for that and had it changed at a quick-lube place. I used an Isuzu filter, of course. I will NEVER do that again! They overcharged me on oil and the guy working on my Trooper seemed as if he had possibly never seen a car before, let alone a Trooper...LOL!
Once again, I can't say how pleased I've been with my Trooper and with Isuzu America and Superior Isuzu on the (very) few issues I have had.
Happy Trooping!!!!
- Dave (arktrooper1)
BTW, I was serious about the seats, not tough talk. I like the wide flat seats, very comfortable over the long haul, but they don't go back far enough.
People have posted here that armorall dries out rubber and then needs continual maintenance...not a bad marketing strategy. The most recent posts have stated that silicone based products work better on rubber?
I am going to try the meguiars next time. I use their wax/cleaner and been happy with it.
KarenS
Host
Owner's Clubs
Just apply it once a year (I usually do it before summer) on the vinyl or leather, that will breath all year around! I've never had any cracks even on the dash boards.
After applying it'll be greasy; but don't worry, it'll be dry after few days.
Does it make any sense that the fuel economy would be worse with the Techron? Could the truck have been running less efficiently due to the various deposits being removed by the Techron? Where do these deposits end up, once they are shaken loose by the Techron?
Don't apply it on hard plastic. I don't think any thing can protect hard plastic from cracking.
FAQ: http://www.chevron.ca/FAQs/FAQsFuelAdditives.htm
Most of the major oil refiners use "cleansing agent" additives to reduce deposits & keep injectors, etc., from fouling. As long as you use a good grade of gas from a major brand (not necessarily from their own refinery), you shouldn't have to add an over the counter cleaner to your tank on a regular basis......but it's your $$$'s being burned
Deposits are dissolved by the fuel cleaning agents & exhausted - some of which could find their way into the oil sump through the normal combustion process - including any additive residue / particulate.
If you use these additives, I would run a full tank through before the oil change.
Bill H.
Also, Purolator Pure One oil filters are "on sale" for $4.94. This is only a nickel better than Meijer's regular price, but Advance Auto had the PL24458 which is the larger version of the Trooper-specific filter, and Meijer usually does not carry this one. I bought a couple and will use them as soon as my 2 Isuzu filters and 2 smaller Pure One filters are used up.
Rick
Your CE light is likely:
1) Gas cap is faulty or wasn't tightened properly the last fill up
2) EGR Valve
3) TPS sensor adjustment
4) ECU Re-programming needed.
I had an intermittent CE light on my 2000, turned out to need an EGR Valve, a TPS adjustment and the ECU re-program. Dealer had it diagnosed and fixed in about 1hr.
-mike