Isuzu Future Models

jimmyp1

http://www.motortrend.com/news/news_f.html

Jim

paisan

-mike

jimmyp1

I guess I'm assuming that it could show some design cues for the ascendor? Maybe not. Anyway, it retains some of the Trooper looks, IMHO. I also found the 5 cylinder thing to be very interesting.

Jim

Edit: Oops, I see why you were asking. The link doesn't go directly to the GM/Isuzu article, like I had intended. Yes, see the GM/Isuzu pickup truck story.

gpm5

I've read rumor on the toyota boards that the LC will be discontinued in the US after 2002 as well.

paisan

Interesting GPM. That makes perfect sense though. The main reason the Trooper is discoed is that it doesn't have the proper crumple-zone protection required by MY2003 law. Perhaps the TLC is in the same boat both of which are made in Japan and sold world wide. There goes another great vehicle down the drain...

-mike

sbcooke

MY2003 law? You have referenced it before?

paisan

In MY2003 Fed Crash stds. increase the crumplezone rules for all passenger vehicles including SUVs. This is the main reason we are losing the Trooper because GM/Isuzu doesn't want to re-design it to comply. Outside the US you will still be able to get the current (or updated) Trooper from Japan.

-mike

paisan

Every Thursday, 7:00-8:00pmPT/10:00-11:00pm ET

Your Community Leaders are paisan and arktrooper1

-mike

sbcooke

No new Isuzu's. I was disappointed, I was hoping to see something about the Ascender. Though Isuzu was right next to Hummer section, those are cool.

I also got a chance to check out the Mercedes G500. Just another Trooper ripoff :-)

ryanendres

http://autoshow2002.carpoint.msn.com/ArticlesIsuzu.aspx

bluedevils

I'll be attending a "sneak peek" early night on Thursday. Hopefully the wife will allow me enough time to check out the Isuzus.

sbcooke

I am reading about the new ascender based on the trailblazer line, the rodeo will be replaced by a Blazer based vehicle?

Is Isuzu being ramped up to replace Oldsmobile? Isuzu, while 49% owned by GM, was still unique. The Trooper was not based on any other Vehicle here in the US, the rodeo, while had s-10 underpinnings, was very unique.

Is Isuzu going to be simply re-badging GM vehicles for the most part? Why buy an Isuzu, over GM, when there are lots more GM dealerships?

While I don't think the Axiom is the best choice for them to save their name, at least they will be continuing that line, and possibly expanding it.

paisan

The Rodeo wasn't and isn't based on the S10. The Hombre was an S10 clone.

The Axiom may help save em, hopefully. Although not likely.

Isuzu is going to probably focus on the Truck and Bus market which is really where their strengths are. The only reason I could see to get the ascender would be the 10/120 and 3/50 warranties on the Isuzu products.

-mike

Karen_S

Isuzu Axiom XSR

Isuzu Axiom XST

KarenS
Host
Owner's Clubs

sbcooke

It looks like Isuzu is not going to continue the Trooper/BigHorn/Jackaroo in other parts of the world. At least this article I found on the web says they will be moving all SUV production to North America...And thus only the new models. I am sure glad I have a Trooper. Maybe it will be a classic someday (as if it isn't already)?

http://www.auto.com/industry/iwirc13_20011213.htm

paisan

They will continue to produce it for a few more years and close the plant in 2004, but maybe they upramped production. You know what would be worse? If they were producting "classic" troopers in the Indiana plant, only for export

-mike

boxtrooper

Paison please make this happen at Isuzu:

Make Isuzu the GM MPG leader.
Use economical to own and operate theme.
Use Isuzu's are tools, not just carry tools theme.
Keep the off road capability Isuzu already has.

Subaru once tried to make non-AWD cars, big flop because their main

strength is AWD.

Isuzu's main strength is not luxery or sports vehicles, but trucks

with diesels that are economical to own and operate. Isuzu must

get back to diesels and emphasize the economical to own and operate

theme. Of course an up scale package can be offered too, but only

after Isuzu builds back its image of practicality.

Here's a quick way for Isuzu to make a lot of sales in the USA:

1.) Offer GM employee discounts on models that share a platform

with GM.

2.) The Isuzu badged 3L 4cyl. turbo diesel Astro/Safari. Make sure

there is a bit more foot room for the front passengers and make the

middle row bench seats that look like bucket seats and fold down

40/20/40 have a headrest for the middle position. Sell it as a

high reliability towing capable 28 MPG mid size utility and

passenger van. The Astro/Safari is an old platform but with

incredible practicality. Also add yellow turn signals independent

of the brake lights so it can be sold in the rest of the world too.

This van would be very popular with fleets.

3.) Isuzu can take over the Oldsmobile minivan and put the 3L 4cyl

diesel in it for Goal 35 MPG highway and 28 MPG city.

4.) Put an Isuzu diesel 3L 4cyl. in the Ascender. It should share

parts with the Duramax for easier service. Sell as a high MPG SUV,

try for 30 MPG (15 MPG towing a trailer with two Harleys).

5.) Put an Isuzu diesel 3L 4cyl. in the new Isuzu/GM pickup. This

would be a big hit with fleets like the orkin pesticide man. Goal

32 MPG.

6.) Call these CI engines (Call them Compression Ignition engines,

avoid the "diesel" word that upsets the liberals.) need to be

environmentally friendly, Maybe even cleaner than the gasoline

versions. Adding a small amount of electrical storage of

deceleration energy in a battery and coresponding boost in

acceleration and call it a hybrid.

7.) If a power outlet can be provided to operate a portable

electric tool like a portable generator that would be great. If it

can output enough KW to fuction as an emergency generator for the

house and offer a electrical transfer box professionally installed

it would be awesome.

8.) Make room for an aftermarket belt driven accessory to be added

on its own belt. Offer generator or air compressor accesories that

work in this position. Make it easy for aftermarket folks to

create more accessories for this belt drive position. Even offer a

clutch on the engine side of this belt drive to engage and

dissengage it so the vehicle can sut off the accessory with a

switch in the dash. This would be available on all models. A

constant engine speed control (transmission in nuetral to activate)

would be a nice extra, could be done with the cruise control

equipment.

9.) A transmission PTO would be nice too, yes even with the 3L 4cyl

diesel. To make that new small pickup able to operate a dump bed

for the landscape people. It would work for a hydraulic powered

trailer too, think stump grinder or leaf mulcher pickup. Or how

about a lift or a small backhoe attachemnt for the bed of this tool

oriented small pickup?

10.) Isuzu should advertize the other places where its engines are

used. People buying a small truck or van might like to know that

Isuzu engines are so reliable they are used for life supporting

generators and vehicles in Antarctica. A farmer might like to buy

a small truck with an Isuzu engine because he is happy with farm

equipment powered by Isuzu. Same for construction workers etc...

boxtrooper

Make Isuzu the GM MPG leader.
Use economical to own and operate theme.
Use Isuzu's are tools, not just carry tools theme.
Keep the off road capability Isuzu already has.

Subaru once tried to make non-AWD cars, big flop because their main strength is AWD.

Isuzu's main strength is not luxery or sports vehicles, but trucks with diesels that are economical to own and operate. Isuzu must get back to diesels and emphasize the economical to own and operate theme. Of course an up scale package can be offered too, but only after Isuzu builds back its image of practicality.

Here's a quick way for Isuzu to make a lot of sales in the USA:

1.) Offer GM employee discounts on models that share a platform with GM.

2.) The Isuzu badged 3L 4cyl. turbo diesel Astro/Safari. Make sure there is a bit more foot room for the front passengers and make the middle row bench seats that look like bucket seats and fold down 40/20/40 have a headrest for the middle position. Sell it as a high reliability towing capable 28 MPG mid size utility and passenger van. The Astro/Safari is an old platform but with incredible practicality. Also add yellow turn signals independent of the brake lights so it can be sold in the rest of the world too. This van would be very popular with fleets.

3.) Isuzu can take over the Oldsmobile minivan and put the 3L 4cyl diesel in it for Goal 35 MPG highway and 28 MPG city.

4.) Put an Isuzu diesel 3L 4cyl. in the Ascender. It should share parts with the Duramax for easier service. Sell as a high MPG SUV, try for 30 MPG (15 MPG towing a trailer with two Harleys).

5.) Put an Isuzu diesel 3L 4cyl. in the new Isuzu/GM pickup. This would be a big hit with fleets like the orkin pesticide man. Goal 32 MPG.

6.) Call these CI engines (Call them Compression Ignition engines, avoid the "diesel" word that upsets the liberals.) need to be environmentally friendly, Maybe even cleaner than the gasoline versions. Adding a small amount of electrical storage of deceleration energy in a battery and coresponding boost in acceleration and call it a hybrid.

7.) If a power outlet can be provided to operate a portable electric tool like a portable generator that would be great. If it can output enough KW to fuction as an emergency generator for the house and offer a electrical transfer box professionally installed it would be awesome.

8.) Make room for an aftermarket belt driven accessory to be added on its own belt. Offer generator or air compressor accesories that work in this position. Make it easy for aftermarket folks to create more accessories for this belt drive position. Even offer a clutch on the engine side of this belt drive to engage and dissengage it so the vehicle can sut off the accessory with a switch in the dash. This would be available on all models. A constant engine speed control (transmission in nuetral to activate) would be a nice extra, could be done with the cruise control equipment.

9.) A transmission PTO would be nice too, yes even with the 3L 4cyl diesel. To make that new small pickup able to operate a dump bed for the landscape people. It would work for a hydraulic powered trailer too, think stump grinder or leaf mulcher pickup. Or how about a lift or a small backhoe attachemnt for the bed of this tool oriented small pickup?

10.) Isuzu should advertize the other places where its engines are used. People buying a small truck or van might like to know that Isuzu engines are so reliable they are used for life supporting generators and vehicles in Antarctica. A farmer might like to buy a small truck with an Isuzu engine because he is happy with farm equipment powered by Isuzu. Same for construction workers etc...

paisan

I wish Isuzu would turn its marketing over to it's users. Anything would be better than their advertising now. Alas I think we'll have more success trying to get Hyundai to bring over the Terracan than trying to get Isuzu to shape-up, especially with GM having 50% of the control, GM doesn't want Isuzu to succeed because that means less market share for themselves!

-mike

boxtrooper

Make Isuzu the GM MPG leader.
Use economical to own and operate theme.
Use Isuzu's are tools, not just carry tools theme.
Keep the off road capability Isuzu already has.

Subaru once tried to make non-AWD cars, big flop because their main strength is AWD.

Isuzu's main strength is not luxury or sports vehicles, but trucks with diesels that are economical to own and operate. Isuzu must get back to diesels and emphasize the economical to own and operate theme. Of course an up scale package can be offered too, but only after Isuzu builds back its image of practicality.

Here's a quick way for Isuzu to make a lot of sales in the USA:

1.) Offer GM employee discounts on models that share a platform with GM.

2.) The Isuzu badged 3L 4cyl. turbo diesel Astro/Safari. Make sure there is a bit more foot room for the front passengers and make the middle row bench seats that look like bucket seats and fold down 40/20/40 have a headrest for the middle position. Sell it as a high reliability towing capable 28 MPG mid size utility and passenger van. The Astro/Safari is an old platform but with incredible practicality. Also add yellow turn signals independent of the brake lights so it can be sold in the rest of the world too. This van would be very popular with fleets.

3.) Isuzu can take over the Oldsmobile minivan and put the 3L 4cyl diesel in it for Goal 35 MPG highway and 28 MPG city.

4.) Put an Isuzu diesel 3L 4cyl. in the Ascender. It should share parts with the Duramax for easier service. Sell as a high MPG SUV, try for 30 MPG (15 MPG towing a trailer with two Harleys).

5.) Put an Isuzu diesel 3L 4cyl. in the new Isuzu/GM pickup. This would be a big hit with fleets like the orkin pesticide man. Goal 32 MPG.

6.) Call these CI engines (Call them Compression Ignition engines, avoid the "diesel" word that upsets the liberals.) need to be environmentally friendly, Maybe even cleaner than the gasoline versions. Adding a small amount of electrical storage of deceleration energy in a battery and corresponding boost in acceleration and call it a hybrid.

7.) If a power outlet can be provided to operate a portable electric tool like a portable generator that would be great. If it can output enough KW to function as an emergency generator for the house and offer a electrical transfer box professionally installed it would be awesome.

8.) Make room for an aftermarket belt driven accessory to be added on its own belt. Offer generator or air compressor accessories that work in this position. Make it easy for aftermarket folks to create more accessories for this belt drive position. Even offer a clutch on the engine side of this belt drive to engage and disengage it so the vehicle can shut off the accessory with a switch in the dash. This would be available on all models. A constant engine speed control (transmission in neutral to activate) would be a nice extra, could be done with the cruise control equipment.

9.) A transmission PTO would be nice too, yes even with the 3L 4cyl diesel. To make that new small pickup able to operate a dump bed for the landscape people. It would work for a hydraulic powered trailer too, think stump grinder or leaf muleteer pickup. Or how about a lift or a small backhoe attachment for the bed of this tool oriented small pickup?

10.) Isuzu should advertise the other places where its engines are used. People buying a small truck or van might like to know that Isuzu engines are so reliable they are used for life supporting generators and vehicles in Antarctica. A farmer might like to buy a small truck with an Isuzu engine because he is happy with farm equipment powered by Isuzu. Same for construction workers etc...

boxtrooper

Paison,

GM should be using Isuzu for products that complement its other lines. Try out new features etc..

I noticed the Honda ModelX, Is that what happenned to the GBX?

Thank You
Robert

sbcooke

made the current trooper get a "G" in the IIHS crash tests, people would have flocked to them. I think safety, that whole rollover/CR thing really hurt them. Obviously we didn't buy into the CR reports, but a lot of people did. Whether real world or not, adding good scores in those crash tests, I think that would have turned it around.

boxtrooper

http://www.overlandvans.com/AWDgallery.html

ogo1

Check out the Chicago 2002 auto show on your favorite web site.Kia is showing a 2003 model called the Sorento. It is a full frame vehicle with a 3.5 v6 and Borg Warner TOD system. This is the same drive train used on Hyundai's Terracan vehicle sold in austrailia..

paisan

Cool beans. I love the Terracan. What's the pricing and warranty situation with the Sorento?

-mike

ogo1

I am a lurker from way back, I have a 99 trooper s and a 92 rodeo 2wd. I have been VERY bummed out about the phase out of the trooper. If people only educated themselves about isuzu when comparing manufactures they would be sold on isuzu.I am somewhat of a car nut and I am interested in anything automotive. I found the Chicago auto show on the cars.com site and was surprised when I found the sorento.There is not much info on the vehicle yet,but i will be interested to find out more.Paisan I know that you are an ecb reseller I know that they make a full size safari style roof rack made from aluminum, do you know anything about it.

paisan

They are made from the same material as the nudge bars which is very strong. Also they have a 7mm mesh basket material. You can see some pics at http://ecb.com.au I have yet to see one in the flesh but hopefully will get one for my truck soon. I'll probably get a Big-Tube Bar for the front before I get the rack though. E-mail me if you want more details mike@iace.com

-mike

bluedevils

I saw a release dated Feb. 7 at a Kia dealer with info on the Sorento. I just checked kia.com and I see a new link for Sorento. It says "coming summer 2002."

Pretty sure it will have same 3.5L V6 as in Kia's Sedona minivan. That would be a very good thing-- at moderate throttle, this engine moves the 4700lb. Sedona around much quicker than the 3.5L in our 98 Trooper, and I always thought the Trooper was pretty peppy. Sorento probably will have the same 5-speed automatic as Sedona but I'm only guessing.

I think we may be picking up our new Sedona tonight.

paisan

I don't think it weighs 4700lbs. Thats more than a trooper and the sedona is only FWD, and uni-body. Maybe the sedona GVWR is 4700lbs. Also the engine is probably different unless the sorento is going to be FWD based. Same goes for the transmission. That 3.5L IIRC is a shootoof of the Ford engine, which wouldn't get me excited at all.

-mike

bluedevils

It's hard to believe, but the brochure says "Curb weight 4,709 lbs." I don't understand how a minivan could be so heavy, but it seems to be true. Folks on the Edmunds Sedona topic have discussed the 4700-pound weight of the vehicle at length too. The brochure could be wrong but I doubt it. I also think I've seen the 4700-pound weight mentioned on some professional reviews.

As for the 3.5L V6, I've heard that it's based on, and/or borrowed from, the Mitsubishi 3.5L V6 (found in Montero). I don't think Ford has a 3.5L V6. They have a 24-valve DOHC 3.0L V6 and a 3.8L 6-cylinder that doesn't have DOHC & 24 valves. So I don't think the Kia motor has anything to do with Ford.

gpm5

That's right on the ford engines. That's an interesting engine, and now I see how they can offfer the powertrain warranty. What is its horsepower?

bluedevils

from brochure: 195hp @ 5500rpm
218 lb-ft. torque @ 3500 rpm.

The max torque available at a relatively low 3500 rpm seems to explain the vehicle's peppiness.

I think the 3.5L V6 in the Montero is rated 200 hp, and, IIRC, also 200 lb-ft. torque. So it might be the Mitsu engine, tweaked slightly.

paisan

the small kia is a ford festiva, the Kia sportage also uses a ford engine.

It could be a kia engine, but I'm pretty sure that Kia doesn't have anything in common with Mitsu.

Mitsu and hyundai did do business back in the 90s and 80s.

-mike

bluedevils

Kia is now owned by Hyundai. I'm pretty sure the Sedona's 3.5L V6 is the same as, or very similar to, the 3.5L V6 in the Hyundai XG350 sedan. Last year, this sedan had a 3.0L V6.

I still think the Kia engine could be a Mitsu variant. I'll check more on the web later.

paisan

Or it could be the 3.5 out of the terracan if they are owned by hyundai.

-mike

paisan

I just checked it out. Definitely a cool vehicle, but more along the size of a Rodeo rather than a Trooper. The Terracan is more Trooper sized/shaped etc. But if priced correctly the Sorento may be a great vehicle.
Especially with TOD.

-mike

sdc2

Just went and looked at the Terracan on some Aussie website, it looks very nice... unfortunately every spec was metric. I don't have the energy to translate "petrol" mileage of 9.5 liters/100 kilometers into ye olde english units...

paisan

I actually sat down one night and crunched the #s. Basically the terracan is about 1"-1.5" wider and about 6" longer than the trooper. Ground clearance, angles of approach/departure are all the same. Interior cargo is about 10cubic feet more. The only downside is that it has about 15hp less, but towing is 300lbs more!

-mike

sdc2

I like those numbers! What about headroom, my main problem with any vehicle?

paisan

But it looks to be boxy and high-topped like the trooper.

-mike

gpm5

That 4WD switch that I saw on the web site looked a little cheap--plastic knob. Other than that it looked pretty good. It does have the under mounted spare that might need a plate for heavy duty offroad use. Does it have a full frame or is it unibody. From the tow spec, it seems quite sturdy.

paisan

Full Frame. The switch is just a switch, couldn't tell how sturdy the switch was from the pic though. Yeah a rear skid plate or tire carrier would be good. But it's a full box frame just like the trooper!

-mike

sdc2

Well it's fun to keep an eye out for candidates for my next vehicle, but I probably won't be buying anything for a looooong time...my Trooper should go for another 8 years easy, probably more.

gpm5

My '99 should be around for a long time too. My boy said he would like a trooper when he started driving. Well, in another 6-7 years he might be driving one.

bluedevils

how sure are we that 2002 is Trooper's last model year?

This might be nothing more than their interpretation, but in the April 2002 issue of Automobile Magazine (an "SUV special" issue; not that exciting, BTW) the Ascender is mentioned as the replacement for the Rodeo and is expected in October 2002. We've all been saying the Ascender is replacing the Trooper. Is there still hope that Trooper will live on?

paisan

Isuzu has a press release saying that the Trooper is gone. Also the plant in Japan that makes the Trooper will be closed after MY03, when they will stop making the Big Horn and Jackaroo. Wish it wasn't true but it is.

-mike

paisan

http://planetisuzoo.com/articles.html/58

Looks like a rodeo.

-mike

gtroop

Mike, did you notice the V8 badge behind the front wheel well?

Looks like a GMC Envoy with the Rodeo's nose. Not very impressed. I was disappointed with the looks of the extended Envoy even though I like the regular wheel base model. I had hoped for a look that would set it apart for the GM clones but...

Disappointing pretty much sums it up.

paisan

yeah it will probably get an optional V8 4.6 lathargic engine that is the base of the Yukon.

Take a look at all the reliability issues here on edmunds of the Trailblazer/Envoy twins...

Also points to note:

1) No stock skid plates
2) Worst angles of approach and departure of the industry
3) Cheesy GM buttons etc.

Very disappointing to say the least.

-mike

keepontroopin

Holy crap it has a roof rack! Doesn't Isuzu (GM) realize Americans think isuzu's with roof racks will flip over like trailers in a tornado.

)