Buick Rainier, Chevy TrailBlazer, GMC Envoy

previousamigo

Now that the temps are running in the 90's I have the same drip/sizzle when I run my A/C and then turn off the TB. I wonder if this will make whatever exhause piece it is hitting rust through faster? I wonder why my mother told me not to stick a hot pan in the sink under running water?

tom_s

I got a price on an ENVOY XL with leather,moonroof,side boards for 36k,35 if I finance it myself. Is this a good price?
How much would it cost me to lease for 3 years?
Thanks for any help. I dont know if I should get the envoy or the pilot
thanks
Tom

kgoward

This is my first time posting to this board. I have been actively reading all the posts and appreciate the information that I have gotten from it. I have had the license plate gasket installed thanks to this board. I have also expirenced the dead instrument gauges, but it's only happened once. But I have the TSB ready to go if I need it.
I have a question to see if anyone has had a similar sound.
After the vehicle sits for an extended period of time I hear a squeal from outside the vehicle. It seems dependent on the wheel speed and not the engine speed. Funny thing it that after the vehicle is driven about 5 mi it stops and will not start again until it sits. The noise does not start until about 25mi/hr and continues up to 50mi/hr. Havn't gone any faster to see if it's present or not.
Any information that people have would be great.

Thanks, Kennith Goward

tblazed

Re: prior posts about the slight pull to the right being "normal" and a safety issue to keep someone from drifting into oncoming traffic, below is a real good reason you would NOT want a vehicle to slowly pull to the right in the event the driver dozed off. This was probably the worst wreck I have seen. Amazing anyone lived thru it. 6 died, two survived including the driver of the Suburban who fell asleep. He was probably doing 70-80 mph when he hit. Unfortunately there was a Semi parked on the shoulder of I-20. If a pull to the right is claimed to be "normal" I would seek out another dealer ASAP!!

"Lane and Cheryle Joubert and their six children were returning to Fort Worth from a family reunion in Beaumont on June 10 when their Chevy Suburban drifted from the left lane and slammed into the rear of a flatbed 18-wheeler parked on the shoulder of Interstate 20 in Mesquite (Texas)." From Dallas Morning News

macman246

I had the same problem, except it appeared when I tried to pass someone, or I turned a corner and tried to accelerate fast. You put the peddle down and no extra power. After what seems like an extremely long time (maybe 1+ seconds), then the transmission would kick down and you would get your power. My build date was 06/01.

I had TSB #01-06-04-052 done and the problem is gone. No more downshift delays. The same TSB is also supposed to fix the roaring fan (jet engine) noise, but I only got that occasionally before the reprogram and it still happens occasionally after the reprogram.

mlauricella

I know some people are having problems with a loose front bumper cover. I just noticed on my LTZ that the bumper cover has come unattached from what ever it was attached to. What I mean is the portion of the cover that lays flat, directly below the grill has a " hill " in it. Im sure I'm the only one who notices it, but am taking it in for service Tuesday. I guess my TB has been blessed by GM's crappy glue.1100 miles, no other problems to speak of.

besos7

My Envoy also squeaks when going over bumps. What the h*ll is that???

Nicole

envoy2002

To the group. ANY vehicle will slowly drift either left or right on most US roads (I'm not going to assume anything about Canada or Mexico). Your vehicle could have the most expensive tires on the market, have equal air pressure in each tire to the 0.000001 decimal point, as well as have the most perfect wheel alignment and balance. So why do I state that vehicle would drift? Look at the road and how it is constructed. Most roads (if not all freeways) are built with a crown, meaning it is curved (has a mild hump) to allow for water drainage and runoff. Ever notice why the middle lane on a 3 lane highway is the driest? Thus, if you are in the left or right lane, no perfectly balanced vehicle will proceed straight, but rather succumb to the 2 to 3 degree (?) gradient built into the road...thus, a left or right drift. If the roadway was built pure horizontal, then for all intents and purposes, a vehicle would not drift if hands were off the steering wheel. This is not meant to excuse manufacturer or tire, or wheel alignment shops, or consumers who have unequal tire pressures, or drivers who fall asleep, but to point out the fact that road architecture does attribute to drifting (an no, I'm not referring to a "pull" left or right). My 2.25 cents worth!

2002slt

Just after 4 months and 4000mi, I have my first problem. My windshield washers stopped working. The wipers sweep one time, but no spray. The tank was over half way full, but I filled it up anyway without any change. The other nozzles work - headlights and rear. The fuse is good, but no power is getting to the relay. I even swapped relays just for fun.
I hate bringing it to the dealer, but I have no choice. Oh well, at least it isn't anything major.
Am I the first one with this problem?

ficuss

cmack4: I hope the dealer didn't epoxy the grill insert piece in place. I am refering to the center part of the grill with the emblem on it. It is necessary to remove this piece to replace the headlights on the TB. I quess we could weld doors shut if they become loose but then they wouldn't be doors. You will have to remove the front facia at some time. How will the dealer do it when it is epoxied in place?

Frank

rj123456

I got the top-of-the line 1SK package (DVD and all toys, minus the air suspension as these were on hold during April/May, and with the CD+Casette, a roughly $250 downgrade from the 6CD changer) for just under $35K after factoring in a $1,000 rebate in May. I believe the rebate is now either $1,500 or $1,750.

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ENVOY PRICE by tom_s Jun 19, 2002 (11:30 am)
I got a price on an ENVOY XL with leather,moonroof,side boards for 36k,35 if I finance it myself. Is this a good price?
How much would it cost me to lease for 3 years?
Thanks for any help. I dont know if I should get the envoy or the pilot
thanks
Tom

labrecque

Funny you should mention that,my Envoy just started doing the same thing. Starts around 35 mph and goes all the way to 65 mph and maybe higher. After about 5 miles it also goes away. going to the garage tomorrow. Will let you know what I find.

tbcreative

For many reasons, too numerous to list, I'm SERIOUSLY considering the all-new, more powerful and roomy '03 4Runner coming in September, instead of a Trailblazer or Envoy. I have a '98 Jimmy SLS 4x4, and am fed up with things going wrong. Fortunately, 90% of them were covered under warranty, but I've had it with GM.

My dad loves his new Envoy SLT, but he's had some strange electrical things going on, like all the instruments lighting up for no reason, then shutting off. My uncle has a Trailblazer LT he really likes, but has also had strange electrical things, like everything going dead. He told me about a business associate who had the same thing, while she was turning a corner and her truck shut down completely! I'm sorry, that's just a little too scary for me.

It's too bad, because I was really looking forward to owning a Trailblazer or Envoy, especially after I drove one over a year ago at the GM Truck Show in Motion. After much study and deliberation, I realized that without adding an expensive lift, I wouldn't take either of them on the off-road trails I take my Jimmy on. I wanted MORE ground clearance, not LESS (I'm mainly talking about the rocker panels). Between that and the electrical issues, I've become fed up with GM, especially when the next gen. 4Runner will have the new height-adjustable suspension (in addition to it's already great ground clearance), more powerful V6 and V8 options, GPS & DVD systems, and a slew of other great features that rival the GM siblings, all with the dependability and quality of Toyota. Not to mention, it will have MUCH COOLER factory wheels than any of the GMT 360 SUVs. That's always been a beef of mine with GM: HORRIBLE-looking wheels on their trucks. Ford and Dodge have had them licked for years. Now all the imports are beating them in wheel design as well.

I know GM just made #3 in quality, but there's a reason Toyota is still #1, and that's coming from a GM loyalist who has grown up with and always owned GM vehicles. I'm counting the days, and hoping my Jimmy holds out until September when the new 4Runner sets the new standard...

johntr

The squeal may be due to the front axle seal R/L/Both. Mine started after about 2500 miles, took to dealer, they replaced as needed (part had to be ordered.) I believe there might be a TSB, but not sure. My TB LT turned 1 year old in May, 22,500 miles and still going strong. I had some issues that were taken care of and after that, nothing else :-).

My wife is going tonight to pick up her new 2002 Jeep Wrangler & I'm going to purchase the extended warranty for my TB (same dealer). With all the functions controlled by computers & such, I don't want to take any chances of anything blowing after the 3/30000 warranty expires. My mother-in-law has a 98 Monte Carlo which has a moon roof. Roof would not close, took to dealer to fix. Fix required new control module which was $1200, labor was $120 total.

John

paisan

It is necessary to remove this piece to replace the headlights on the TB
You are kidding right? That doesn't seem like a very good design if you need to remove the grille to replace a headlight bulb?

-mike

paisan

Is on a dark rainy night on the side of the Interstate I wouldn't want to start disassembling my vehicle to put in a new bulb. That could be pretty dangerous! I guess if it's relatively easy that's not so bad, why can't manufacturers make things easy? (and GM isn't the only one with weird convoluted ways of doing simple maintenance items)

-mike

tblazed

Maybe that's a feature they designed in so the condensation water will evaporate before it hits the ground so as not to leave a puddle, thereby eliminating the possibility of someone thinking there is a leak. Yeah, right. Anyway, as I recall the exhaust pieces btwn the muffler and engine are supposed to be stainless steel. I might get under mine and look to see if there's a simple way to redirect the water off the exhaust.

I think the pull to the right problem was in reference to a pull regardless of the crown in the road. Mine had a slight pull even on surfaces that were level or that sloped off slightly to the left, until I tweaked the R-front tire pressure up 1 lb. Got that idea watching NASCAR racing on TV, noticing how the drivers would add a lb or 1/2 lb or whatever to a tire to effect the handling.

scottc454

Been driving for over 15 years and I think I've only
ever changed a headlight once. I don't see a big problem there. You won't need to be changing headlights on the side of the road - just flip on the fog lights. If both headlights happen to burn out at the same time, you're one unlucky sap.

paisan

But when I'm on backroads or dark wet interstates, fogs + headlights are pretty much a requirement. If one of the headlights is out my chance of hitting wildlife is increased. They should be able to be changed out quickly and easily it's part of the safety system as far as I'm concerned.

-mike

scottc454

I reiterate, it's not about where I drive but more about how rare it is for a headlight to go out. I was hoping I didn't need to spell it out like this.

How many people carry extra headlight bulbs anyway?
Here's a thought - turn on your bright lights.
That said, I do think you should be able to change bulbs without taking the grille off. So I guess we're agreeing after all.

paisan

I carry an extra bulb(damn boy scouts as a youth), but you do make a good point about the highbeams. DOH!

-mike

dshepherd3

Maybe I am missing something here, but all the headlamp bulbs on my TB are accessible from the rear of the lamp, just remove the round rubber cap on the housing and the bulb is accessible, tight squeeze though.

scottc454

Well, you're no fun at all.

I didn't really believe that you need to remove the grill but I wasn't going to say it.
Maybe you need to remove the grill to remove the whole headlight assembly, which you'd only do if it got cracked by a rock or something.

king36

Has this happened to anyone else? At around 3000 miles, I'm drving around 65 and all of a sudden I hear a soft pounding on the roof. I couldn't imagine what it was, except for a bird caught in the rack, maybe. I pulled over asap, and saw that the strip that goes along the top of the windshield was half off and had been wacking the top of the car in the wind. The dealer later glued it in, said that they don't come glued from the factory (4/01 build Bravada). Anyway, I always carry duct tape in the truck now.

choots

I know there has been a lot of posts on this subject but until now I did not have this problem with my Envoy SLT. Now that I need the TSB fix, I can not find it. I found post #5068 that gave the GM site but, it now requires a password. Can anyone help me out here?? I am sure my dealer will not have a clue as to what is going on unless I can come up with a TSB number.
Thank you very much for any help you can give me.
Carl

tlauro

Well, I didn't think I would have to either, but I couldn't get my hand/fingers in there....very tight and even if I did, I wouldn't have been able to twist the bulb in/out. Especially putting the new one in. It was really tight due to the rubber seal on them. There was also a risk at damaging the wires. I just plain didnt' want to risk breaking the bulb since the aftermarket ones I used weren't cheap.

Just mine I guess. If you can remove yours without removing the grill and what not that's great.

tim

"I didn't really believe that you need to remove the grill but I wasn't going to say it."

ficuss

paisan; dshepard3: I studied the headlight out problem for quite a while before I decided to try to remove the center of the grill. Once I removed the grill, changing the headlight was so easy, I changed the other one too. This way both lamps were of the same brand. It was nearly impossible to remove the lamps without removing the grill. That said, it is not such a big chore to change the lamps. It requires no tools and gives you a chance to clean any debris from the front of the radiator. I have been very critical of some of the design elements of the triplets. This is not one of them. I should say though, the grill seems very easy to steal. The only secure connection to the body is under the front lip of the hood.

Frank

dshepherd3

I don't know guys, but I took both side h'lite bulbs out in 3 min. without the grill removal

dragonhead08

me too. only thing is I had to remove the big plastic panel over the fan shroud but that only took 5 mins.

tjcishere1

well 2nd time in 2 days truck only having 630 miles on it. driving along tach was jumping all over the place lost the compass on the mirror no cold air from a/c. and no directional signals. it was the # 22 10 amp fuse next to the battery. dealer said they had a fix. GM told dealer to look at the ignition wire, the wire is purple under the steering wheel above the brake pedal. they have had many problems with this wire rubbing and shorting out which caused the # 22 fuse to blow and in turn u go to start the car and u get nothing i hope this helps anyone who might run into this problem

kenym

"Is on a dark rainy night on the side of the Interstate I wouldn't want to start disassembling my vehicle to put in a new bulb."

Where would you get the bulb???? On the dark rainy night...On the side of the Interstate....So you could start disassembling your vehicle to put in the new bulb....

WHY would you want to do that anyway???????????

~Ken

paisan

I carry all kinds of stuff in my car, mostly stuff that is important for safety (first aid kit, bulbs, tow ropes, etc) so if my headlight blew out I'd just install one of my spares.

-mike

okay1

Now that I have had my TB for a year, and have put about 21,000 ,miles on it, I felt a review would be nice for potential buyers. My car is not unique in that I have experienced many of the little problems that have filled this room. My car would shift on its own from 2-wheel drive to 4-wheel drive without rhyme or reason, and a new switch cured this problem. I had/have the loud obnoxious fan noise, and a re-calibration of something has reduced its occurance to about once a month, so I guess I have to live with this.... it usually last about 30 seconds so its not a big deal. My front bumper seems to display all of the bumps and warpage many have complained about, but this I will live with. The Indigo Blue paint job has excessive "orange peal" (another thing I will live with). I agree with another posting that Chevrolet can NOT design wheels. My LS wheels are among the ugliest things on the road, and the wheels on the LT and LTZ are also pretty damn ugly. My 1977 Camaro had better looking wheels. When I need new tires in another year or so, I will consider changing over to some nice 18" after-markets.
All of this aside, the car is a pleasure to drive. It has more than ample power (although a cold air induction kit and less restrictive exhaust would be a welcome addition). As for comfort, my TB is as comfortable as any car I have owned, and is a real pleasure on long trips. The auto 4 wheel drive has worked flawlessly in ice storms, and the brakes are among the best I have experienced. The steering and tracking are also great, even if a little over assisted. Other than the wheels, the design of the car is attractive and modern even if a bit conservative. I have installed some nice kick-[non-permissible content removed] Westin chrome step bars which look great but make the wheels look even duller. Come on Chevy, try a little chrome. When the car is clean, it is quite an eye catcher.
So all in all, I would have to give this car a A- for its first year grade. I am certainly happy enough with it that I would buy another. I will be anxious to see how I feel about this car after it is out of warantee. At this point I would certainly recommend this vehicle to any potential buyer.

jwinky

I, too, have had the pop-sizzle after stopping the car with the AC running, so last night I decided to trace it. When looking under my Envoy I could so AC condensate running along the frame and then dripping on the exhaust (no news there) specifically a 'bulge' in the exhaust just aft of the engine where the exhaust makes the transition from vertical to horizontal. The bulge appears to be of oil filter size and shape. I popped the hood and looked at where the codensate was coming from and there appears to be a line with heat shield coming out of the firewall from the interior where the condensate is running down on to the exhaust. From above, over the exhaust 'bulge', there appears to be some sort of shield over the bulge, that may have been there to divert any condensate. If so, it is not working.

Maybe others on the board can help with the proper terms (for the 'bulge', etc). It was said here before, and I believe that the exhaust is stainless, so it may not be an issue, especially since when the condensate hits it, it is immediately going through a phase change to steam. That being said, I know pressurized steam can be even more corrosive than just water.

What does everyone think?

JAW

cmack4

"I hope the dealer didn't epoxy the grill insert piece in place."

Frank, no you must have misunderstood. The lower fascia on the triplets is the part where the license plate would be connected, and includes the whole outer cover for the bumper. It's held in place by 9 pushpins, 2 slide brackets and 2 plastic cables. Grab anywhere below the emblem on your triplet and pull up and down. Does it wobble? Mine doesn't anymore

I can get to my headlights the same way as dragonhead 08... pull the shroud over the fan... takes five minutes and doesn't require tools (pushpins). Definitely not a difficult task!

stever

Nice review; it's great to read these when the owners have some significant miles on their rigs (21k in a year is racking them up pretty good) - thanks for posting.

Steve
Host
SUVs, Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards

tblazed

Has anyone else noticed if you put CDs in the console, if you put them in lengthwise, the way the holder slots are made, then you can't read the edge label on the CD cases! I have to put them in at an angle to see the edge of the case and title label. Had they made the holder correctly, they could have shortened the console 3/4" and eliminated the problem with the back seat bottom getting the lighter/aux power outlet on the rear of the console pressed into the seat cushion. Oh well, maybe next time.

Also in reference to the "drip-sizzle" of the AC condensation falling down on the exhaust pipe, on my TB the "downspout" where the water exits is directed over so the water misses the exhaust pipe by an inch or so. It drips down onto the frame, builds up and then overflows onto the ground. I guess that's better than an audible "drip-sizzle"!

95° yesterday, 126° interior temp when I started it up, within 3 to 4 min the AC is down to 48-49° with the blower set on "3" and in recirculate mode. Works quite well.

cmack4

Go directly to GM engineering, do not pass go, do not collect $200!... The console design on the triplets is the worst I've ever come across. It's probably the only thing I don't like about my Bravada! I had a 2002 Intrepid the other day as a rental unit on travel... and I marveled at how much more efficient the console was with less space!

scottc454

I don't mine my LTZ wheels. They're on the plain side, but I wouldn't call them ugly.

As for chrome, chrome looks great until it chips and rusts. Maybe polished aluminum would work better.

What kind of wheels do you plan on getting?
There are some good aftermarket truck wheels out there. I just hope you're not planning on getting "souped up Honda Civic" wheels.

jwinky

That is one hot interior! How did you get that value? Was that what the auto clinmate displayed on start-up?

I hadn't really thought about being able to shorten the console, but did think it was odd that you couldn't read the labels on the jewel cases. Some engineer probably thought that having the console designed with jewel case labels readable the console height would have been too high for comfort (failing to think that is a situation that can be remedied by adjusting seat height). Although, would a 1/2 inch make that much of a perceptible difference in comfort? Or maybe they though that we should keep our eyes on the road and not worry about CD's while driving . While not using my degree, I have a mech. eng. degree, therefore I take pride in making fun of the sometimes illogical choices we make.

I may try my own fix on the AC. Is your downspout an inch toward the outside of your TB or an inch toward the centerline of the vehicle? I may bring this up with the dealer, just to make them aware.

JAW

tom_s

Dude,
That was the funniest thing I've heard in days
Do you think he carry's an extra tank of air
if his spare blows. Doesn't everyone drive around
with extra headlights with them. You never
know when you're on the dark highway in a storm
and your headlight goes.
Thanks for the laugh
-Tom

paisan

I travel long distances and always carry stuff. You'd be scared if I gave you my WHOLE list of equipment I carry in my truck. Also when I am offroading 25-50 miles from a road, you generally want to be as self-sufficient as possible, I keep that stuff in the car 24x7.

-mike

paisan

As for air, yep, I carry a compressor, and am looking into a CO2 tank, CO2 fills much faster than a compressor.

-mike

tblazed

Hey! I could use some outside consulting work!!

I have a little Taylor digital thermometer (reads -40° to +450°) I keep stuck in the center air register. 126°- that's the temp it was testerday, and my TB is WHITE! And I had a sun shield behind the windshield to keep the direct sun off the dash. I have the simple old fashioned manual air conditioner controls. (I subscribe to the KISS principal.)

The condensate downspout angles over to the passenger side so the water does not drip onto the exhaust pipe. I did not do that- that's the way it came.

scottc454

The console problem is caused by a compromise - the thing can hold cassettes and/or CD's. Trying to be everything to everybody is the error here. If it didn't need to store cassettes in the bottom, it could be made to hold CD's label side up without being too high.

Anyway, I don't care about the console. A while back I threw out all my jewel cases and put my CD's into those notebook type things. I highly recommend it - much less clutter. I don't miss those cases at all.

funits

My Envoy just back from the dealer -- the AC condensation dripping on the exhaust is NORMAL, working the way it is suppose to (I have it in writing on my work order slip). If there is any problems in the future, I will whip out that piece of paper. I am wondering if there is a slight design difference between TBs and Envoys . . . it seems all the TB owners AC condensation water misses the exhaust systems.

Rear end chatter -- after providing the service dept. with the TSB on the subject, they changed the rear end differential oil under warranty (synthetic gear oil and $67.20 according to the WARRANTY work order slip). I have not driven the truck enough to see if the chatter in the rear end is still there . . .

cmack4

I still carry my version of a survival kit, even though I've seldom ever needed it, it saves your butt the times you do! Even I don't have spare headlights though... =p

I do have a 5lb air tank without the compressor on it that is really lightweight (got it for a roof nailer) that I carry with and air up with the built-in compressor on my Bravada. It gives great pressure, and I've found it really handy! You can use it to power an air wrench long enough to undue all of the wheel lugs and put them back on!

paisan

I have extra headlight bulbs cause I upgraded my headlights and kept the originals so I keep one in the truck as a backup. I do carry extra 130w bulbs for my Hella 4000 Driving lamps. If one of those goes out you notice it very easily on the backroads.

-mike

jwinky

Funits,

Thanks for the info. That was my thought, to mention it to the dealer, have them tell me, in writing, that it is normal, then file that paperwork for future reference, if need be.

JAW

dane_1

Within the last month we have experienced that the turn signals (right and left) suddenly stops during activation. We can't really find a system in this periodical fault, the workshop have not been able to repeat the signal fault and the fuses have been checked. Strangely enough the light on the front corners of the vehicle that turns on with the (left and right) turn signals seems to work every time. Has anyone experienced the same problem with their Bravada/Trailblazer/Envoy?