Buick Rainier, Chevy TrailBlazer, GMC Envoy

mfullmer

I hear ya. I think I posted earlier about my hit-and-run accident with a garbage truck on the freeway in '02 Bravada.

Am I the first Bravada to need body work in GA? It's been three weeks since the body shop ordered the parts and they are promising they will be in today. The worst thing about driving it (I haven't been driving it much but there are times when I need to) is I've cut my hand pretty bad both times I've had to get gas since the accident. The garbage truck ripped the gas door off but left the frame. It's all bent but I keep it kind of pushed in so it's not sticking out all the time. (I've hit it a few times while walking through the garage - that hurts.)

Anyway, I'm taking some pictures of it this evening so I'll post them. I know it's somewhere but would someone mind refreshing my memory about how to post a link and/or pictures in a post? Thanks!

stever

Pic posting info is in the Town Hall help linked on the upper left. Something about an img scr tag :-)

Steve
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paisan

< img src = " http://yadda.com/trailblazer.jpg width=400 >

leave out the spaces in the above before the img and after the width=400

-mike

stever

Article here.

Talk about it here.

Steve
Host
SUVs, Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards

kraemerdude

My brand new 2002 Trailblazer has an obvious computer problem that my dealer says can't be fixed. When dead cold, the vehicle sometimes starts with the cooling fan roaring and the engine revving. It will go into gear but almost seems like the transmission is slipping and shifts very late. After about 3-5 minutes it will resume normal operations. This is scaring my wife --- she's afraid to drive it.
The service manager at the dealership says he "called the TAN and found fan clutch engaged causing engine to rev up --- normal condition as per GM". I do not consider this "normal". There were two other new Trailblazer owners, besides me, in for service with the same problem the same day that didn't think it was "normal" either. Anybody have answers?

scottc454

Refer to post #6658 and you'll find your answers.

Annoying, but nothing to be afraid of.

mfullmer

Ok, here's a link to the pictures of my damaged Bravada.

http://www.michael.fullmer.com/Bravada

momstruck1

Well you think I would learn after a chevy venture with major problems I went and got a trailblazer . So now we just dropped it off and it scares me to say I have a problem that is common on this board the revving high at the start after it sits. I am suppose to drive this car to south Carolina and on to Florida from new York city and now all I do is worry are we going to make it there. I sent it in today I will tell you all what the dealer says when we get it back . Hopeful that it is nothing major our trip is set for Aug.9th.

ficuss

momstruck1: the high fan noise is probably the least significant problem there has been so far. It really isn't even a problem, just a fly in the ointment. Go on your trip and enjoy the car. The fan noise quiets after a few minutes anyway. Besides, I would worry more about going to South Carolina and Florida.

Frank

momstruck1

With three kids and a really bad chevy venture it was hard to see it go in to the shop this early. The venture was a pretty good car but it had a new tranny at less then 1,000 miles and two paint jobs due to peeling paint. Non the less that was just in the first year. I am hopeful that the trailblazer fairs better and that I am just jumping the gun and being pissed off at chevy . I will enjoy my trip if all goes well with the car. It went in for 3 other things the drivers side door lock keeps jamming and the air is making a noise when it runs.the front drivers side is rattling . So lets see what the service guys say

tblazer503

I have found that the high revving occasionally happens on my truck after a new tank of gas. It seemed to stop after I reset the ECU by unplugging the battery, not sure if this is the reason, but about a month and a half and I havent had a problem. To be honest, the tranny on the Trailblazer scares me, I have heard many good things about the 4L60-E tranny, but none that I have seen shift as softly as this one(probably for comfort) which is why I want to order the shift kit for the Trailblazer, at the very least, it should prolong the life of the torque converter.

sildog

When you folks are talking about "high reving" are you sure it is actually the engine reving that makes the noise? I thought mine was doing that, but then I watched the tach and found that it was not high engine RPM I was hearing-the tach needle would be at 800RPM but it sounded like it was reving hight. It turned out to be the cooling fan. There was a post earlier that linked to a GM site that described how the fan works. The fan has variable engagement, so it can provide only as much cooling as needed. The big time noise happens when the fan is fully engaged. It does describe that under certain conditions when the vehicle is shut off, then re-started later, the fan clutch will be fully engaged. This has to do with conditions when the vehicle was shut off. If it was really hot out, or if AC was on last time it was driven, the clutch remains partially engaged when shutting off. Then when restarted cold, since it is a viscous fluid coupling, it will act like it is fully engaged until it warms up a little. It takes a few minutes to shut off once you are moving. The GM document specifically states that the fan noise may be mistaken for high idle, loss of power transmission slip or delayed transmission shifting. It also shows how the mechanic can tell the fan to fully engage so they can ask the owner if that is the sound they are hearing. The link to the GM document was posted a while back on this strand.

It my case, it always stops after about a mile and I've stopped worrying about it.

Also, had my new stereo installed yesterday without the factory radio relocation and everything works great.

tblazed

That will likely be the No.1 thing I will do as soon as a valid "mod" is available. I really dislike the way the GM engineers set up the way the trans shifts. Very soft and delayed1-2 upshift up until 2500-3000 RPM in normal city traffic, delayed 2-1 downshift (and I do not have a problem with mine - I have verified that others do this too). I especially dislike the "bump" into 1st gear when I come to a slowdown almost to a stop then give it gas. The feeling of the trans in neutral in-between 1st and 2nd and bumping into 1st gear when I give it gas bothers me more than any other aspect of the way the "system" as a whole performs. I think GM should come up with an improved transmission program and make it available free to owners that find the original set-up as disconcerting as I do.

sildog

When you folks are talking about "high reving" are you sure it is actually the engine reving that makes the noise? I thought mine was doing that, but then I watched the tach and found that it was not high engine RPM I was hearing-the tach needle would be at 800RPM but it sounded like it was reving hight. It turned out to be the cooling fan. There was a post earlier that linked to a GM site that described how the fan works. The fan has variable engagement, so it can provide only as much cooling as needed. The big time noise happens when the fan is fully engaged. It does describe that under certain conditions when the vehicle is shut off, then re-started later, the fan clutch will be fully engaged. This has to do with conditions when the vehicle was shut off. If it was really hot out, or if AC was on last time it was driven, the clutch remains partially engaged when shutting off. Then when restarted cold, since it is a viscous fluid coupling, it will act like it is fully engaged until it warms up a little. It takes a few minutes to shut off once you are moving. The GM document specifically states that the fan noise may be mistaken for high idle, loss of power transmission slip or delayed transmission shifting. It also shows how the mechanic can tell the fan to fully engage so they can ask the owner if that is the sound they are hearing. The link to the GM document was posted a while back on this strand.

It my case, it always stops after about a mile and I've stopped worrying about it.

Also, had my new stereo installed yesterday without the factory radio relocation and everything works great.

momstruck1

I am really intrested in reading that link to GM. I wonder if that is the problem with my trailblazer. Thanks to anyone who can give us the link.

paisan

That bump down to 1st gear is probably similar to the 4L30 tranny bump we get on the Trooper. From what I've been told this rough downshift actually helps to improve Torque Converter life because it has less slippage. The smoother your tranny the more likely the torque converter will die. Also GM is known for good ATs I think.

-mike

mtrammell

The link to the article about the electronically controlled viscous fan clutch is:

http://service.gm.com/techlink/html_en/pdf/200207-en.pdf#dst01

iexplore2000

Well... I have to agree with tblazer503. That was one thing that reaaally bothered me was the overall shifting of the 4L30. I am a little worried about reliability of the tranny myself.

Unfortunately at least 1 or 2 days out of the week when shifting from R to D, I seem to hit the gas before the tranny engages into DRIVE mode? Does this ever happen to any of you out there? It seems as if some days are better than others but then there is always that ONE day in which this will happen and either the tires will CHIRP or I get that horrible slamming of the tranny into DRIVE. Okay.. playing devils advocate, someone might say "Are you applying the gas too soon to invoke this response?" and the answer would be NO. I will usually back up, come to a COMPLETE stop and then place the unit into Drive and then accelerate (giving it at least a 1 or 2 second delay before hitting the gas).

Anyone have any ideas concerning this??

Second: I think that for the most part the tranny shifts a little rough, especially from 1st to second gear? I try to baby mine but I still notice that it shifts a little rough. My father's 02 Denali shifts smooth as silk even under pressure, but maybe that's due to his 02 tranny being into production for awhile? Maybe GM has had enough time to work out the bugs in his unit? Also, my 02 Impala LS tranny shifts like BUTTER.. I cannot seem to trick it into acting wierd at any rate.

Oh well.. just my .02 cents, not a big issue but since we're talking about it, thought that I would bring it up just to see what you all thought about it.

Thanks for listening!

IExplore2000@aol.com

tblazed

If it is supposed to do that then it would do it consistently, all the time. It has more to do with the timing of how long I wait from slowing down almost to a stop before giving it gas. If I wait about a second it won't bump down into 1st - it will already be in 1st ready to go. I don't think a driver should have to make a conscious effort to time braking and acceleration just right to make the computer-controlled transmission behave properly.

paisan

Iexplore2000 I think you got confoosed. The T-blazer/Envoy has the 4L60 and the Trooper has the 4L30

-mike

cdlt

I have a Trailblazer w/the DIC (6,700 miles). While driving to a restaurant last night I noticed all the instruments on the dashboard were dead. Other electronics (lights, radio, etc.) worked fine, the engine ran smoothly and was shifting properly, but all instruments & guages, including speedometer, the DIC and tach, were dead. I pulled over, stopped the car and restarted it, but that did not correct the problem. Then I parked the vehicle and let it sit for awhile (through dinner), and the guages all came back. However, the auto headlights/daytime running lights weren't functioning.

Has anyone had similar problems or know what's going on?

iexplore2000

While were talking 400's, has anyone seen a preview of that new Lexus SUV? I think that it's called the GX470? I ended up on the Lexus website yesterday and stumbled across their new SUV that's entering the market for 2003! IT's SHARP! Check it out.. Don't know how much it's gonna cost, but it is supposed to fit right in between the BIG-EN and the LITTL-EN.

Thanks!

IExplore2000@aol.com

ficuss

cdlt: most of the posts regarding dead instruments have also said that they were parked in the sun for a while before this happened. Is this the case with your problem. Also, did you notice if the odometer registered the mileage driven during the instrument outage?

To all who are worrying about their tranny's. The GM Major Guard extended warranty is not that expensive. It extends coverage to 5 years and 75K miles. I bought it last year after my engine crapped out at 2K miles and had to be replaced. It is also transferable in case you sell the car. This takes some of the apprehension out of owning a 2002 triplet.

Frank

daytrip

I had the dead instrument problem on my Envoy. My dealers fix for the problem was to replace the entire cluster. They said that there was a bulletin from GM on the issue for certain serial numbers. The odometer is part of the cluster, but they were able to turn the miles ahead to the old reading.

paisan

Yep it's a Toyota Prado clone that is sold overseas. It will also be cloned here as the 4-runner. Very nice vehicle. I'm looking at one to replace my Trooper in about 5 years or so.

-mike

dan165

Sorry to see what happened to your Bravada, ouch.

We have one just like it and I wash it almost every fill up to keep that colour shining.

Any damage estimate??

biggie4852

Which unit did you installed and did you add a cd changer?
Has anyone experience a loss of power and it felt as if the transmission was slipping and couple with that I had the roaring fan noise. I have had all three happen at once.

tsprouse

cdlt: Had the same problem with my Trailblazer. Loaded up the back with vacation luggage, shut the hatch and headed home. No instruments, mileage or anything for 200 miles. Stopped for gas, opened the rear hatch to retrieve something,
shut it again and everything started working. I
think my problem, might have been caused by the
hatch not being shut properly, and the DIC got confused and couldn't display the message.

el_bee

Same thing happened to my Envoy a couple of times during my last camping trip. Tried the stop/restart routine but that didn't work. Left it parked in the sun for 30 min. and everything came back ok. Maybe being parked in the shade for extended periods of time was the cause.

2k_impala_ls

I just signed the contract on a 02 trailblazer LS, prefered equipment group 3, WOL tires & cd/cassete. I paid $250 over invoice, took the $2500 rebate, and had $1200 on my gm card. My total with tax was $26,400. I think I did pretty good. Anyway, I have untill I pick up the truck to get a 6yr/ 50,000 mile Majorgard warranty for $850 extra. Do I need it. It seems like cheap peace of mind for a 1st year model. Thanks.
p.s. I also have a 2000 Impala LS, hence the name from posting on thier page.

tlauro

IMO, the warranty bump to 6yr, 50k is a good idea if you are going to own it.

Not many things can have the warranty extended like that for a little over 3% of price paid. Certainly not in the computer world that I work in now Heck even an $85 power tool I just purchased cost $13 (12%) to upgrade to a 3yr walk in no questions asked warranty at Sears.

Again, that $850 will be priceless when needed. Just read over the contract and investigate the underwriter to insure what is and isn't covered. Also find out where you have to get it serviced, what the proceedure is and where it's good at in case you move or sell the vehicle. Don't listen to the rep/find it in WRITING.

tim

sildog

I put in a Sony and I did add a CD changer in the rear under deck compartment. I have Infinity 2 way component speakers in front doors. Installed the tweeters on the surface of the door panels that are just inside the mirrors. The rear doors got Sony co-axial two ways. I had a small sub in the rear before it was stolen, which gave the system a very rich sound. I will be getting a new sub, but I am going to shop around for a less invasive setup instead of the box.

Regarding the Sony, I originally bought it for a different GM car that had steering wheel controls. Sony is the only one that can be adapted to use the steering wheel controls. My TB doesn't have steering wheel controls, so it could have been any brand. The Pioneer that is made to fit the whole dash opening might be a good coice too.

Speaking of steering wheel controls, if anyone is installing a Sony in a GM with steering wheel controls, I have the Soundgate adapter to make them work.

Regarding the fan noise, trans slip, etc, refer to my prior post # 6688 and post #6693 for GM info on Fan Noise.

gator36

My advise... Having bought 3 GMPP warranties in the past....

Shop around for the warranty. I am not sure that the one quoted is the best you can get. You may want to explore other options. 6 year 50,000 Major Guard is not much warranty. That is only 3 years and 24,000 miles above the factory warranty. To come close to the 50,000 within 6 years of purchase you would have to drive less than 8,400 miles a year.

You can purchase a GMPP Major Guard warranty ANYTIME before the original factory warranty expires. Remember that an extended warranty from GM is marked up just like any other Item they would sell. The Extended warranty has alot of markup from dealer cost.
You have time to purchase the warranty, don't let the dealer pressure you into buying it now.
Figure out how many miles a year you drive and figure out how long you plan to own the vehicle and buy enough warranty to cover that with the deductible you are comfortable with.

As far as the GM Protection Plan warranties. I consider them one of the best in the business. Other off name warranties can take time to pay up on a claim and you are either stuck with the bill and or your vehicle is stuck in the shop until they decide to pay up. My last GMPP warranty paid for itself in spades. I had two transmissions fail, rear differential rebuilt, two AC control heads ($600.00), starter and an alternator all paid for by the GMPP warranty. All done with no hassles.

Walter

ficuss

2k impala ls: I recently purchased the 5 yr. 75 K mile G M Major Guard warranty for about $1200.00. It is also transferable. I just found out some of G M warranties are and some aren't transferable. Looking forward, I believe selling a car with a transferable warranty will be easier. I agree with the posters who have said the peace of mind is also worth the price. Replacing any of the computers or drive components or electronics of the triplets will not be cheap. Call your dealer and ask how much it would cost to replace the DIC or instrument cluster display or the engine, tranny or transfer case. Then bump that price up over the next 5 years. Suddenly, $1200.00 doesn't sound like much. The triplets are among the most technically advanced autos out there. They will need repair. Besides,IMHO, I think the warranties are a good way to get back at G M for rushing a product out the door.

Frank

tblazed

Does anyone have any experience with "United American Warranty" underwritten by Great American Insurance Company?

They sent me an offer that to me is of interest because it does not have a time limit. "Up to 100,000 miles with NO TIME LIMITS" they proclaim on the brochure. Reason I would be interested is because I do not drive more than 8,000 miles a year typically and all the other warranties including GM's is time limited. I will likely have less than 24K mi. on my TB when the 36 month factory warranty runs out. I would not get my moneys worth out of the typical extended warranty.

Having been in the consumer electronics repair biz for 25 years I can testify that most of the time the extended warranty company pays out on maybe 10% of the policies they write. They are in that business to make money. I normally never recommend buying an extended warranty unless it is on a super expensive hi-tech item like a HD projection TV (or maybe a Chevy TrailBlazer?)

gator36

I have a friend who is the assistant service manager for a Cadillac dealer here on the west coast. I asked him if he had ever heard of the company you mentiond. He has never heard of them. He cautions about these no name warranty companies. Many times he has had customers cars sitting because the warranty company is either slow to pay the claim or does not pay it at all. Imagine you Vehicle is fixed and ready to go but the ins company won't pay, is slow to pay and now you have to pay out of your pocket to drive your vehicle. Then you need to go after the warranty company.

You might call your local service writer and see if they have had any experience with this company.

Walter

mdey

I had the dead gauge problem about two weeks ago. Drove the car 100-plus miles and no mileage registered. No other issues with the performance of the car.

The dealer reprogrammed the computer. No issues since, but it has only been two weeks.

The gauges went out after an extended run on the freeway. I stopped for gas. They came back on when I pulled in the garage at home. I shut the car off and restarted it and on the came the gauges. I don't know if this is related, but it is dark enough in my garage to turn the automatic headlights on. If it happens to you, try putting a magazine or map over the headlight sensor on the dash. It could work, and if it does, I bet everyone here would like to know about it.

previousamigo

Has anyone put fog lights in the bumper of the TrailBlazer LS yet? If so, what fog lights did you use and was it tough to cut out the grills where the lights go for the LT and LTZ? Where did you run the wiring for you switch to the inside?

stever

This message may be of interest (and the rest of the discussion as well):

PAman "Used Car Warranties" Jun 25, 2002 8:52am

Steve
Host
SUVs, Vans and Aftermarket & Accessories Message Boards

mfullmer

$1,981.00 with Allstates 10% labor discount. The worst part has been getting the parts from Olds. There's nothing worse than driving such a beautiful vehicle and having smashed. Fortunately, I only need to drive it a couple of times a week.

medolark

I just returned from a 5400 mi trip in the Envoy. I am really pleased with the road performance.
I could pass anything I wanted going uphill or down under just about any conditions.
Here are the details:
Truck: 2002 Envoy, 12/01 build date, 3.73 locking rear axle, 4wd
Conditions: Lots of mountains- California to Montana, HVAC on auto, 87 octane at all times
Speed: typically 70 to 80mph, but varied up to 95.
Overall mileage: 19.6 based on hand calculations.
Best one tank mileage: 23.5 on flat road driving under 65mph.
I checked the DIC average mileage over the last 1200 miles and it agreed to the nearest 0.1 mpg with hand calculations even though the average fluctuated up and down over the course of the trip. It may be a fluke, but I&#146;m through doing hand calculations.
When I started this trip I only had about 3500 miles on the truck. I felt a noticeable improvement in performance and, I think, mileage over the course of the trip. I don&#146;t think it was even broke in when we started. No problems whatsoever!

biggie4852

I live in Southern California and it's hard to justify the purchase of a 50,000 mile or five year first warranty. If you use you car to commute as I do you can easily put 50,000 miles on it in three years or less. I have had great luck with my four new car purchase form GM and any problem encounter were handle under warranty. I question the logic of spending a thousand dollar on warranty on new car. I find with proper maintaince ie. oil, tire, filter change most of my car give me very little problems.

tblazed

Man that's great! Thanks for the info! That'll give me good info to study before I plop down my money!

2k_impala_ls

I plan on getting the GM running boards and splash guards for the rear. I was also thinking about the fog lights. I am pretty sure all of the trailblazers have the same wiring harness and if that is the case, the wires should already be in place for the lights. When I get mine I will check it out. I have the part #'s for the GM running boards #12497681 list is $429 but you should be able to get them for 25% off. splash guards for the front are #12497726 (with flares),
#12497608 (without flares) and rear are #12497609.
They list for $29. Your dealer should give you a break on them.

dshepherd3

There is no harness in place on th LS, I put Piaa oval lites in after carefully cutting and fitting the grill openings in the ft bumper, no matter what, they do not fit all the way back in because the lite bkts interfere with the rear reinforcement, but by taking your time and trimming the grilles a little at a time with a rotozip tool it can be done pretty neatly, the the issue of getting the harness thru the firewall, drilled a small hole near the steering column grommet, mounted the switch in the headlite control panel, this can tricky, an amateur may need help here.

paulpro

Tim Lauro, and all
When I bought my Envoy, I opted for the SLE version, since I wanted cloth interior. But GM's infinite wisdom to not offer options to the cars but packages kept me from getting certain features I wanted. One of those was the dimming exterior mirror. When I drive at night, the reflection of headlights in the side mirror are annoying to me.

No biggy, if you pay attention to eBay, the upgraded mirrors are readily available for around $150. I bought a set and bolted them on. The turn signal feature worked immediately but the chromic mirror feature didn't work.

After an afternoons worth of wire tracing, I learned the wiring harness was complete for this option, all thru the body, it is the internal door harness that keeps it from working. A little ingenuity, a little speaker wire and I was able to connect the body harness to the mirror harness.

Wa La! my dimming exterior mirror is now functional.

Tim, if you'd like some of the wiring details for your website, I'd be happy to write a short article.

Now, if anyone knows how to get the trip computer feature to function.

Paul P
proefrock@heartlandgroup.com

tblazer503

Personally, I didn't pick up the extended warranty on my Trailblazer b/c hopefully I will trade it in @ 2-2.5years; hopefully by then, the mileage will be much more consistent, probably will have more HP, and if not, my current mods will probably just bolt in to the new one, but the main reason is because I want a LTZ w/o Onstar... (couldn't afford it on this run) If you plan to keep the truck, though, I would definitely get the extended warranty; parts for this truck are not cheap, and everything is electronically controlled on this truck (tranny, spark plugs, throttle body, etc, etc.

kimodo

Hi sildog,
Did you install any of those components yourself? I recall one of your posts about having some place install your deck. If you did install any component by yourself, would you be so kind as to explain to the rest of us who are looking to upgrade their stereos the steps which you took to install whichever component you might have installed. Thanks in advance

tblazed

Maybe you know about something I could not get... OnStar deleted from a LT or LTZ? That's why I wound up with an LS. I refused to pay out $1000 for the unwanted OnStar mandatory "option" (I have a cell phone and am a ham radio operator with a radio located in the TB where the OnStar stuff would go, so I have no trouble communicating). I was told that it could not be deleted on special order. I would have spent more $$$ on the vehicle and got more features if I could have deleted the OnStar. Why does GM "assume" 100% of all buyers of the upscale models want OnStar??

What would get me out of my current TB and trade up to a newer one? The ability to delete the OnStar on the more upscale models, and making the 5.3 V8 available across the board on all the triplets. In the mean-time I will continue to enjoy what I have (hello GM) .

2k_impala_ls

and I was surprised to find 350 miles on it. They swapped with a local dealer but come to find out that that dealer swapped one for mine. How much mileage does it take to qualify it as a demo?
What is usally done during the prep of the truck before delivery? Mine looked like it was washed half-assed and not waxed. it took me 1 & 1/2 hrs to get the bugs off the front and wax just the nose. Do I have a right to complain. I cooled down but I am ready to call and complain Monday. Maybe I can get them to throw in the rear flaps for free. yea right.