Buick Rainier, Chevy TrailBlazer, GMC Envoy

hardhawk

Just saw the story about the Jeep Liberty recall. I'll take the niggling small issues with my Envoy over having a front wheel fall off or the suspension come apart any day! Early on the triplets had a suspension problem but it was caught before there were major problems. Jeep must have had the same parts supplier!

tblazed

Also saw on the news a few weeks ago the Dodge Durangos might be having a serious issue with upper ball joints coming apart. Wonder if they are using the same source for ball joints for the Durango and Liberty? At least, when GM was faced with a potential suspension problem with the early triplets they recalled them all immediately.

Here I am complaining about having to take in my Trailblazer for the shift lock release lever and IPC reprogram recalls. Got an "IMPORTANT" reminder notice Sat that I haven't had those done yet. Had planned to get those done if/when it needed some other warranty work. So far hasn't needed anything else done.

momstruck1

while changing the stations on the radio on Monday we put Z-100 on and when we used the radio Sunday only the Z-100 station came up on the display now on Monday it comes up with the song that the station is playing. has anyone else noticed this I found it to be a little strange and/or annoying but i have never had that happen before. i have the 2002 EXT TB LT with what i can see the standard radio RDS i believe are the letters on it . just wondering if anyone else noticed it. usually i only get the name of the radio station on RAT ROCK but this was just weird.

kram18

I haven't listened to Z-100 in atleast 7 Years, but I will have to tune in to check out the RDS service, I always thought that no stations used that service in the NY/CT metro area... Thanks for the heads up.

tblazed

I just went out and checked mine. I think the way your display is acting is all controlled by what the station is sending out. Call the station and ask to talk to an engineer. That person can probably explain why yours is showing what it does.
Mine does somethiing different on one f the 4 FM stations sending out RDS data here in D-FW, "The EDGE- KDGE" continuously switches back-and-forth every few seconds from "The Edge" to "KDGE". Pretty annoying- that display constantly switching. Fortunately I don't listen to that station. Of the other 3, only one has additional "info" that consists of the song title (usually) and I have to press the INFO button to see that. Don't see any way to turn off or change the RDS display.

ficuss

I thought that Amber Alerts and other important need to know information were the intent of the RDS display. I wonder if these radio stations are set up to change the message on a moments notice. I would like to know if I'm driving next to an abducted child rather than being told what radio station I'm listening to. This is just another intrusion and distraction into our driving time. It's no wonder there are so many accidents caused by inattentive drivers.

Frank

offroad57

is it possible for a trailblazer to have a 3.42 gear ratio although the window sticker says 3.73?the reason im asking.returning from a hunting trip on a highway with several long hills although not too steep,1 person in the group ask me to either speed up or change lanes.he was pulling a heavy trailer with camping gear and a 4 wheeler and didnt want to lose his run at the hill,he was driving an s-10 pickup i was driving a 04 tb.gas pedal on the floor and 70 mph.was all i could get up the hill.i changed lanes and he drove on pass me.any ideas why my tb.would not go any faster?drove the same trip in an 02 tb.and would cross that hill at a 100 mph.if i wanted to dealer could not duplicate driving on a stretch of level interstate highway.any ideas why the power loss?.sure would appreciate them.

dshepherd3

I don't think the gear ratio is going to make any difference if you want to do a rough check, on my 02 TB, with 3.42, 2000 rpms is 70 mph, any way I would check and see if it easy to go over 70 on a flat vs the hill, if so either way it doesn't seem possible that you were out pulled by the S 10 with a trailer, something is wrong unless you had 6 passengers and a cargo box on the roof, even then it's a stretch. It's possible the the throttle sensor ( remember no cable from pedal) is bad or out of range and doesn't sense full throttle, a full scan by the dealer has to be done.

momstruck1

first it was stuck on one song for awhile and then it just stopped Must be something with the station working on the equipment . either way it was kind of distracting and annoying if it continues or just stops i will let you guys know.

stever

I've had RDS on my van since '99 and I rarely notice the text scrolling (mine lets me flip to clock mode though). Doesn't this function tie in with the scan feature so you can just scan for Top-40 or Oldies instead of every station on the dial? It's been a long time since I've read my manual....

Steve, Host

envoyenvy

Couple of months ago, there were discussions about batteries leaking on brake lines. Just wondering if anyone had experiences with their dealer about this issue.

My 02 Envoy has same issue, complete with all of the corrosion. I called the dealer. He mentioned "we have had this problem with these batteries for years". I am under warranty, so they will replace and check for corrosion problems.

Love the truck, dissapointing that they would continue to use batteries with a known defect. Especially to use with the battery "cooling" case that hides leaks until they cause a problem.

agenteleven

Yep. My 02TBLTZ battery spilled it's juice all over my garage floor.

Took it in and the service advisor said they would replace the battery, neutralize the spillage inside the engine bay, and they would even repaint the inside of the fender!

I got it back with a new battery, but no repaint, and no neutralizer on the spillage. The service ticket said they "cleaned the battery tray."

I'm not going to mess with it anymore...

I figure it's my destiny to ride off the side of a steep mountain incline with my TB and it's failing brakes because of battery acid brake line corrosion. But it's OK, since I won't see anything because the faulty windshield wipers won't wipe the rain off the windshield, and the rear-view mirrors will have adjusted themselves to face Mecca.

tblazed

About the only thing I have found RDS is good for is the clock-setting feature. If the station is sending out clock data, wait a minute, press the two clock-set buttons together and it will update the time. Pretty cool feature, you would think would be standard on RDS radios. However, a friend that recently bought the Ultimate SUV - a Ford Excursion 6.0 Diesel, has a radio with RDS, but NO clock-set feature. Can only set the time manually.

I hope we don't get subjected to scrolling banner ads running on our radios if this RDS catches on with more broadcasters.

ficuss

Ed, don't worry. When radio stations start sending banner ads on the RDS display, we can use trusty old electrical tape to block the screen.

Frank

ross1962_99

It has never annoyed me. Then again it may be because I'm to busy watching THE ROAD!

scottc454

It has never annoyed me. Then again it may be because I'm to busy watching THE ROAD!

By that rationale, you must be too busy watching the road to pay attention to your speedometer. Do you get lots of tickets?

allenr

The first thing I would do is get some backing soda and water in a spray bottle and hit everything under the battery, rinse twice This will neutralize all the acid and leave exposed metal. You then could take some black undercoat spray and give everything a shot. Or do what I did take it back to the dealer and make them do it.

Allen

food4kp

That's cool that you can get clock data from a radio station that's sending out this information. But how do you know which stations are sending out clock data? Thanks in advance for your response.

mharry

I picked up an 03 lease return with 6k on it for 26k. It's a black LTZ without sunroof, darn, and without dvd, who cares? Absolutely beautiful vehicle in virtually every aspect, I didn't even know what I was buying when I bought it! My mom got an Envoy and after taking hers on several test drives, I had to have one. That engine has made me an addict, I can't keep my foot out of it. This one was just the lowest mileage one on the lot and 2k higher than the 02's without half of what this thing has on it.
 There's alot of whack jobs on here complaining that the sky isn't green, but I'm in love with mine. I read back to page 100, before finally posting and the only thing I worry about, because I care for all of you, is the Bose stereo upgraders.
 I was a tweeker, had 5k worth of equipment in a 87 rx-7, I won IASCA competitions, and no it didn't go BOOM! The dash speaker is obviously not a real tweeter, it is a mid tweeter, or a small mid-range. The only reason it seems to produce highs on a fairly flat drop off is through equalization. This is what Bose does on all of their stuff. So their is a massive treble boost in either the amp or the head unit, if you put in real tweeters your not only losing the mid range of the Bose speaker,your also going to have a massive high end boost. Use the driver eq 3, which is how it's supposed to sound by the way, and all the mid-range shift used in this setting will be lost. If you start getting headaches or bleeding from the ears, just kidding, don't say I didn't warn you!

sbindley

I've had great success by replacing the dash speakers with Kenwood's Excelon 4" 2-ways. The sound is much improved. See the Oct issue of Truckin's SUV for more info on this Envoy.

envoyowner

My envoy exhibits the exact behavior as described in #12432. In a nutshell: · Clunk felt from undercarriage when stopped at intersection. (i.e., felt like driver behind tapped your bumper). Thought you would be interested in the reasoning given to me just yesterday after being told the clunk "could not be reproduced".

From the service manager: "The a/c compressor can cause the idle to go up and cause the car to lurch forward, as if you had your foot on the brake and pressed the accelerator. Does not happen all the time as the compressor does not run continuously." To which I said, "so you're telling me this is expected behavior" and he said, "uhm, yes".

Let the comments begin........ :-)

tblazed

Best as I can tell, if you find a station that displays their ID with RDS and the "INFO" lights up, wait a minute or so, then press those two buttons together and it should say "Updated" if they are sending the clock data. Otherwise it will say "No Update".

Of the 4 stations here sending RDS ID data, only one seems to send the clock data so it is not consistant.

Also, regarding comments of the usefulness of RDS to scan for station types, that would be nice, but more than 4 stations out of 25-30 in the area need to send RDS data for that to work effectively. Seems like RDS isn't exactly catching on with the broadcasters. One station here used to send RDS ID data and they turned it off over a year ago. Of the 4 left doing it, only one is a commercial station, the other 3 are down below 92 mHz in the nonprofit-public broadcasting part of the FM band. 3 religious stations and one heavy-metal commercial station here use RDS.

kenym

I honestly hope you don't become new King of the whack.... After reading your post I thought to myself why would somebody trade a loaded 03 TB with 6k on it? OR better yet with all the reported problems the TB has had, why would somebody actually want to take a chance and spend 26k on a used vehicle with 6k ( that may or may not have had problems ).

With all the rebates, year end sales and low interest rates you could pick up a NEW one for a few bucks more.

~Ken

tblazed

Never feel a stutter or clunk in my Trailblazer, regardless whether the A/C on or off. The PCM should control and keep the idle speed constant if the compressor is cycling on-off, or the trans is in N or D. Mine stays at a constant 600 RPM no matter what. So they all DON'T do that.

When was the last time you had any PCM-BCM reprogramming done? There were a couple of programming updates issued addressing unstable idle in August '03.

ross1962_99

"By that rationale, you must be too busy watching the road to pay attention to your speedometer. Do you get lots of tickets?"

No. If you drive fast enough, you see the cops before they see you!

ficuss

"There's alot of whack jobs on here complaining that the sky isn't green, but I'm in love with mine."
 So tell us, is the sky really green in your mind? And if it is, are you really in love with your sky?
 Since you just bought your new love, I would refer to your feeling as infatuation rather than love. Wait till the tweeters lose their clarity, the midrange bulges and the bass rubs the ground, then see if you still call it love.

BTW I bought a new 2002 in 2001 with a sunroof for $29K.

Frank

mharry

Just don't think I'm in a position to look for things to pick apart, I like the package as a whole. Some posts really sound as if there is an underlying anger about something. It's a Chevrolet after all and I rather like it compared to everything else I drove. By the way it was a 1 yr lease return.
 2 ways oughta be fine in the dash, just not a single tweeter. Did you guys RTA that setup, it ought to be awfully bright.

cwhawk

Can anyone explain how to adjust the headlights on an 02 TB?

My left headlight is pointing too high. Do you need to pull the battery out? The dealer said they adjusted it, but everyone flashes their lights at me so I believe it is still wrong.

iexplore2000

Ironically enough, my Envoy went into the service department yesterday for a "squealing fan belt," to which I also brought up this studder/clunk issue with the service advisor.

I have the XL V-8 Envoy and on several occasions, mine has done the exact same thing mentioned on this board. I can be at a complete stop and about 10 seconds later... BUMP! It's kinda of hard to describe, but I can best describe it as if something hits the underside of the vehicle. I also had a 99 Jeep Grand Cherokee V-8 Limited that did the exact same thing, except that it would force the vehicle ahead by a few feet! Talk about dangerous! As a matter of fact, this was an ongoing problem with the "Slip Yokes" and something that had to do with the Dana rear end on Jeeps new body design (1999 to present)? I can remember the Jeep dealership "lubing" the slip yoke to which the problem would disappear for a few days and then return. They also rebuilt the rear end on the vehicle in addition to several other items, to which NONE corrected the problem at hand.

Unfortunately Jeep (or Daimler-Chrysler) had a bunch of dissatisfied JGC V-8 Quadra-Drive owners and found themselves in a fairly big dilemma relating buybacks. Not only did Jeep buy back my 1999 Cherokee, but they bought back my father's 1999 JGC and my best friends 2000 JGC as well.

When my Envoy started doing this, I kinda had an idea as to what the problem could be. I ran this by my advisor yesterday and he very adamantly told me that the "clunk" issue was ONLY related to the Escalades and Denalis? So.. given that it was fairly late in the evening, I didn't push the issue.

Unfortunately, this problem is sooo sporadic that it's hard to reproduce for the service advisor? Also, it seems as if the cold weather has something to do with this? Now that it's cold here in Ohio, I can feel the "clunk/bump" at least several times a week?

If anyone else out there have any information concerning a "fix" for this, please advise..

Thanks!

IExplore2000

ylab

IExplore2000, I can almost guarantee your onto something with the cold weather. My '02 Envoy does the same thing very occasionally and I'm one of those people who hear/feel everything in my vehicle. I can tell you that the ONLY time my Envoy has done the gentle clunk/bump is while cold before the engine/tranny has a chance to warm up. I'm willing to bet this is caused by either the elevated cold idle or still thick trans fluid holding pressure high and thus keeping the low-reverse clutch engaged for a few seconds before dropping into 'neutral'.

On a side note, anybody who's had the obnoxious clacking/ticking that sounds like a bad lifter should definitely try changing oil! I've had the noise since the dealer performed my first complimentary oil change and switching to 10W30 Mobil1 only made matters worse. Switched to 5W30 semi-synthetic and the noise has all but subsided within about a week of the change. (Apparently these engines HATE 10W30 oil even in the heat of summer....I'm thinking the dealer used 10W30 and not 5W30 on my first change).

Ray

ylab

Actually if its anything like the Envoy's, they're a piece of cake to adjust. You'll see a small round/oval opening with the picture of a lamp on the top with the hood up. You simply insert either a torx or hex socket (sorry don't recall which) on an extension into the hole and turn.

But, are you sure they need adjusting? The correct alignment for the LEFT/Driver side lamp is approximately 1/2 the distance of the bright focus point higher and slightly over to the right. (They are NOT supposed to be aligned perfectly level to each other).

Ray

seiford

We had a 3-4 week vacation from the stutter/clunk/bump issue.. but now it seems to be returning. Still no obvious pattern to it.

As far as the link to the A/C compressor: My understanding is that the compressor is always running; there is no on/off cycling. There is some type of control to vary the amount of load on it.

My dealer is tired of dealing with me about this issue. Time to try another dealer.

01_hoe

I have also noticed this in my '03 Envoy I6. Intermittent, only on occasion, have not been able to "plan ahead" and duplicate on demand. As I recall, the engine was probably not too warm yet.

iexplore2000

I don't necessarily think that it's an issue with the weather, engine temp or tranny temp all the time. Every blue moon I can return home from work (all freeway driving for approximately 20 miles) and once I exit the ramp and hit a stop light... BUMP! It's a wierd issue to say the least and I am getting a "cold shoulder" feeling from my local dealer concerning this. IS this happening on the regular length models as well and the extended models? My previous 2002 Envoy SLT (regular length) didn't suffer from this bump/studder??

I may just have to push the issue a little bit more with the service department just to see if they are able to find a possible solution. Since I have had my Envoy, it has ONLY been to one servicing dealership here in town and I honestly prefer to keep it that way.

Fortunatly, I do like these guys/gals that work in the service department. There seems to be a genuine interest in getting the job done right and making sure that you are 100% satisfied. Also, I think that it does some good in terms of keeping a good/consistent paper-trail? For example, my friend has an 02 Envoy and the dealers give him the run around concerning some of his issues by saying, "Dealer X worked on a similar issue prior to your visit, therefore you need to take your vehicle back over there for them to resolve the issue or else GM won't pay us." Unfortunately, It's kind of sad, but true.. he has been taking his vehicle back and forth between two dealers for the past month! Now he's to the point where he has to get the regional representative involved, especially with 37K on the odometer!

Anyhow, I may check with the dealership again should the problem continue to get worse over time. Just curious to see who else has experienced this and if there is some type of fix out there?

Thanks!

IExplore2000

envoyowner

2002 Envoy SLT.
Like others, the studder/clunk/surge happens infrequently, so I wasn't surprised to hear from the service advisor that it couldn't be duplicated. Not sure that there's a tie into cold weather; but am sure that when it's happened, it's been within the first 5 or so minutes of driving the car; idling at a stoplight - "boom" and a quick look to see if I've just been hit.

tblazed

Sounds like to me with just 6,000 miles, the original owner got into a lease and couldn't make the payments, or the vehicle didn't serve their particular purpose so they parted ways. I think you got a good deal anyway. Also, you can't fairly compare what someone paid in early '01 for a triplet because there has been about a 10% increase in the MSRP since then to compensate for the incentives and rebates. Pricing my '02 out now with a similar equipped '04, the sticker price would be right at $3,000 higher.

Congratulations on your "new baby"!

hardhawk

2002 Envoy bought in 7/01. 30,000 miles. Studder/Clunk just started in August. It is worse as temps get lower. Is worse when car is warming up. Taking it into the dealer soon for this an a list of other naggling items as warranty end is nearing. Will post what my dealer says about it.

axsysman

In case people are sick of hearing complaints here's some positive news. I have had over 71000 trouble free (highway) miles on my 2002 Envoy that I purchased in March of 2001. I went through the lower control arm recall and a few other problems that were all corrected. I will probably keep the truck another year at least.

Replaced Michelins at 65000 miles, they still had tread but were getting slippery in the rain.

I would say it is slightly above average in wear and tear, by which I mean it is holding together above average. Never burns oil. I got lifetime free oil changes so I have been changing oil every 3000 to 4000 miles at same dealer where I purchased it. Truck has always been a little noisy when first started in the mornings, but GMC sent me the 100k warranty on the engine.

cincyman

I have been reading all the posts here with much interest. I have an '02 TB LT that I bought new. Other than the windshield wiper problem, it has been trouble free. Love this car. My wife and I decided we liked it so much we wanted a twin, the Envoy. We bought an '02 Envoy SLT last month with 22,000 miles. Person had traded it in on an Escalade. Loaded vehicle and we knew what to expect, the big reason we bought it.

The studder/clunk didn't take long to develop. It does exactly what everyone here has posted. It's been to the dealer and guess what, can't reproduce. Our TB does not do this so I am puzzled. Wandering mirrors...got those too. Reprogrammed and the issue still exists. I am at a loss as to why GM has not found a fix for these problems.

2k_impala_ls

I found that my front hood rubber bumper stops were out of adjustment and they were making the hood bounce up and down and making alot of my front end noise. Just push down on your hood in the front, if it goes down at all it is out of adjustment. To fix it just unscrew the rubber bumper stops (one on each side)out until the hood is tight. I also put a little gease on them between the hood and the stops.

my old post

#13218 of 13315 Front end noise again by 2k_impala_ls Nov 03, 2003 (8:53 pm)
I had the swaybar links replaced about 1500 miles ago but the noise started soon after the fix. I think it was there before. Every bump I hit I fell a clunk. It even happens after you start going from a stop and dont hit any bumps it will clunk. Seems like a tierod or steering end linkage to me. Guess I have to bring it in again. I checked it out when I rotated my tires and the ball joints and bearings felt tight.

medolark

I've experienced a very mild form of this on occaision. Only when vehicle is cold. I have a suspicion it is related to locking rear differential. Does anyone have this issue and NOT have locking rear axle?

tblazed

"As far as the link to the A/C compressor: My understanding is that the compressor is always running; there is no on/off cycling. There is some type of control to vary the amount of load on it."

These definitely cycle the compressor. That's what the low-side cycling switch on the dryer-accumulator does: regulates the low side pressure by cycling the compressor. Almost hard to detect the a/c compressor cycling on-off due to the nature of the scroll-type compressor design used.
If the vehicle computer is trying to compensate for the load changing from the compressor cycling, maybe the throttle motor isn't responding to the small position change like it should (or used to when newer) and the RPM drops, causing a loss in torque through the trans, also a temporary loss in trans oil pressure. My theory anyway. Doesn't do that on mine so far.

My TB did develop a little stutter-drop to 500-550 rpm then back to 600 while idling at a light, very intertmittent condition, a few months ago. A bottle of STP Concentrated fuel injector cleaner, and changing to Shell gas with their "substancially more detergent and additive than required" as they claim has corrected that problem. Solid, stable idle at 600 rpm once again. Even got me a Shell card now to get the 5% rebate on their gas, so that it's within a couple of cents of the cheaper brands like Sam's, Quiktrip, Racetrak, and the other discounters. My 5¢ worth. (inflation)

mickeynut

I see the Envoy Tranny or where ever it's coming from hiccup/shudder is still around. I had mine in for tons of other stuff including this. Specifically 3 times and 3rd time I'm told it's "normal" and nothing wrong with the truck and dealer won't look at it again but still happens every morning and night until warm. GM wouldn't fix so I went to BBB where GM sent several lawyers vs me. Arbitrator was a real estate lawyer who ultimately refused to buyback or replace. Any one have a plan of attack that worked for them? NYS says 4 trips for the same problem - I've got 3 for tranny and 15 others for all kinds of different electrical problems and this is 'normal' for a 36K 18 month old car. Any help is greatly appreciated. This is an awesome car if it wasn't always broken.

momstruck1

i must say it really wasn't that bad. I was on the highway and got a flat . pulled off and called the roadside assistance number . The call was all basic info and they sent the truck within the hour . it was actually a little shorter then an hour . The only problem was the tow truck driver had never changed a tire on the trailblazer before and had a little bit of a herd time getting the spare off. for anyone who has to do this it is NOT EASY as he had a hard time i can not imagine a woman doing it . Everyone was very nice and helpful and it cost nothing to have him do it. Just to let you all know that I do not have the on-star any more because i didn't want to pay the extra and my cell phone worked just fine in this case.

jac27

Looks like Tim took his pictures of the CAI mod off his site. Did anyone make a copy that could be posted?

rctennis3811

just wondering, why does the 4.2L DOHC V6 24V in the Envoy make 270HP and the 3.5L DOHC V6 24V in the MDX make 270HP too, only using less displacement??

mharry

Was starting to wonder if I was at the wrong place. There weren't any comparable new ones to buy. The dealer had the service guy pull it's records. It had 2 oil changes, lr brake light replaced and campaign 03025 done on it.
 I read about 400 pages of this site before my purchase, so I knew what the issues were. I just didn't care for anything else in this class.

quickdtoo

The MDX engine requires premium fuel which alone indicates higher performance, albeit at a cost$$.

tblazed

Mine has the locking diff and doe not do it. Don't see how the locking diff could cause that anyway. It behaves just like a normal open diff until there is enough speed difference (about 200 rpm) between the two rear wheels to engage the locking mechanism, and if you are going over 20 mph it won't engage anyway.

I wonder if this "stutter-clunk" happens mostly with 4WD, 2WD or a mix of both.

tblazed

I was going to ask if they had pulled the service history info for you before you bought it, but didn't want to bring that up after the fact. Good to hear they did that. 2 oil changes in 6,000 miles and one minor repair and a recall campaign seems very good to me.

Still very satisfied with my '02 TB after almost two years.