Buick Rainier, Chevy TrailBlazer, GMC Envoy

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Comments

  • scottc454scottc454 Member Posts: 356
    For most of us, the fan issue is just a minor annoyance. I wouldn't worry about it if I were you. I think I'm just seeing a different side of it, being in Denver and travelling in the mountains fairly often. As annoying as it is for those 2 blocks for you, try and imagine what it's like heading through the mountains and having that fan come on at 60+ mph.


    I must point out that on the times when the fan doesn't come on, that engine does an awesome job of pulling through the mountains.


    I looked up this fan thing at http://www.nhsta.gov and found that it is TSB 300801. One of these days I'll get to the dealer and have them check it out. I'll report back on my experiences.

  • mfullmermfullmer Member Posts: 773
    The "round speaker thing" is NOT a microphone for Onstar. It is the mic for the auto-volume control on the stereo. You will see these on just about every Chevy made since '99 that has the auto volume control standard.

    It should not buzz though. You might be hearing some feedback from the amp if it has short circuited (like mine did and was replaced.)
  • mfullmermfullmer Member Posts: 773
    Was that scarry, or what? Pretty bold of him to suggest that it could be given a "clean" title (instead of a salvage one) after being rebuilt!!! Any car that has had a "salvage" title will be tracable as having one unless someone does some illegal wrangling.

    And excuse me but how on earth could you ever get a 2WD SLE up to "nearly $40k"!!!!!!

    I find it funny that he mentions it has lots of options...like the floor shifter. Those are so rare!!! AS IF!!!!
  • tcd2tcd2 Member Posts: 16
    I have a TB LT 2002 that I bought in Dec. 2001. The door sticker says it was made in Nov.2001. I have never seen the fan when it was NOT running. When I checked it out at the dealer when I bought it, the fan was on and the few times I have checked the oil etc. it is on. Even from the first morning start up it is running. I just thought it was normal and maybe they had returned to that style like yrs ago when the fan ran constantly. Should I get this checked?
  • gmdoctorgmdoctor Member Posts: 1
    The small speaker looking device by your left ear is actually an inside air temperature sensor for the HVAC system on auto climate controlled vehicles. The location of it seems to contribute to the irregular operation (hot/cold. If a window is down, or sunroof open, sudden burst of cooler or warmer air can reek havoc on this system.
  • scottc454scottc454 Member Posts: 356
    Naw dude, believe it or not, that thing's actually a camera. It's hooked up to the Onstar system and they're watching you! I'd be seriously concerned if it's buzzing.

    Seriously, I wish they'd explain what this stuff is in the manual. Maybe they do. That manual's huge and I've never had the time to go completely through it.
    We have at least 3 explanations of what that thing is.
    I don't buy that it's a mic for the auto volume system. How would it know what is noise and what is coming from the radio?
  • noller2gnoller2g Member Posts: 60
    The fan is always running, but it should not always be locked. This means that there will always be some movement to the fan, but it should not lock into engine rpm, but sort of free wheel most of the time, until it gets "hot." The big difference is the noise and power consumption.

    When the fan is locked, it really screams, and using engine power to turn the fan drains power available for driving.

    My Bravada fan locked up one day and stayed on for several days, then unlocked. I took it in and they did something to the computer, now it kicks on at each startup, but spins down after just a short minute or two.

    On the aerodynamics of the roof rack, you can't compare it to an airplane wing, as the function is different. An airplane wing is not designed to reduce drag, but to provide lift. If it were designed to reduce drag, it would be turned around exactly 180 degrees so the taperd trailing edge would be the leading edge to slice through the air.

    True, an airplane wing must have the least drag possible while still producing lift, but you could make it a much more aerodynamic and eliminate drag, but it wouldn't have any lift.

    The shape of the roof rack is probably pure cosmetic, and has nothing to do with drag.

    Greg
    Wichita
    Air Capitol of the world.
  • dielectric7bbdielectric7bb Member Posts: 324
    If it were a speaker, it could easily discern radio noise through some basic 'Fourier' transform circuits. I’m not saying what the thing is though.

    Reduced drag…I don’t know about turning the ‘airplane’ wing around. One of the most aerodynamic shapes (at least at the speeds were talking about in air) is the tear drop shape. That’s why rain drops look the way they do. Nice and round on the front, but with a long tail.
  • scottc454scottc454 Member Posts: 356
    An airplane wing is most certainly designed to reduce drag and the shape of the roofrack is not a cosmetic issue. You'd see this quickly in a wind tunnel. It's not just a question of frontal surface area and "slicing through the air", it's a question of how to create the least disturbance in the airflow. By having a somewhat blunt front part that tapers off, you allow the deflected airstreams to gently come together, decreasing drag.

    If you put the sharp part first, the airstreams will be diverted more and come together harshly creating a low pressure area behind them. This low pressure area tends to pull back on the crossbar, causing drag. What happens to the air behind the crossbar is at least, if not more important than what happens in front of it.

    Now, an airplane wing has a curved side and a flat side to help generate lift, but to say that drag is not a factor is not true. Overcoming drag is a huge factor in making wings as efficient as possible.

    Also, look at what Yakima sells for their roofracks - a wind deflector that is shaped just like these here crossbars. There is much to be learned from the raindrop.
  • cmack4cmack4 Member Posts: 302
    I took my Bravada AWD to the beach this weekend and had some fun in the sand. I just thought I'd let you all know that the Bravada's Smarttrak system handles sand amazingly well! Even in the loose stuff, it doesn't dig itself in. You could feel the torque shift from rear to front and back again as it traveled over different inclines/declines. Just make sure you let some of the air out of the tires first to maximize traction... besides, it gives you an excuse to use the compressor when you're done!
  • dshepherd3dshepherd3 Member Posts: 194
    As a former Olds service mgr. I saw my share of burnt up tranfer cases on Bravada's with the viscous awd unit, from getting stuck in the sand, be careful those units are really not designed for the loads that situation can demand.
  • giddens_johngiddens_john Member Posts: 77
    Thanks for the raindrop analogy folks, that's what was flailing it's arms up to be noticed in the back of my brain, but at 12:23 A.M. the airplane wing was what moseyed on up to the front of the class. So just to make things crystal clear, the blunt edge of the roof rack slat should be facing forward, correct?
    All this of course doesn't explain why tsprouse experienced a reduction in wind noise by putting them on backwards unless there was an imperfection in the molding of his roof rack slats causing air disturbance. Just to clarify I'm not trying to start a problem, I'm just curious. Hey here's a thought, keeping in mind just food for thought, but maybe GM decided to cut cost down by going with a manufacture for the roof rack slats that, unknowingly to them, didn't keep the molds to spec like the whole suspension part recall fiasco and slight imperfections in the roof rack slats are causing so many cases of excessive wind noise. The last bit was for humor, but hey, you never know.
  • jaguar0027jaguar0027 Member Posts: 387
    Im looking at getting a Trailblazer LT. Can I hear some pros/cons of buying this SUV vs getting an Explorer or Pathfinder.

    Thanks!
  • cmack4cmack4 Member Posts: 302
    Actually the burnt up transfer cases are now a thing of the past... The new (post 1999) Smarttrak doesn't use a viscous awd unit. I actually was under the impression that it was viscous as well, but talked to a mechanic today... Instead it uses a fully electronic transfer case that tells the clutch when to engage based on sensors at each wheel. This speeds up the entire process (.25 sec) versus the viscous clutch (approx 1-2 sec) and causes a lot less friction in the event of wheel spinning! The auto-trac system still uses a viscous coupling when in auto mode. The only real negative of smarttrak is that it doesn't have a lo range... but lo range is counterproductive in sand anyway!
  • mraumrau Member Posts: 50
    If you think you are getting noise from your roof rack, you can always remove them. If the noise is gone, it was the rack. If it is still there, then it is something else.

    Also, each rack is stamped on the bottom side the word "Front" with an arrow. This is the same direction as the arrow on the rack ends as seen in the photo. I got to believe GM meant "Front of the car".

    --Mike
  • bricklayertxbricklayertx Member Posts: 20
    Bought a new LS TB Friday. In checking several Houston dealers, I asked about the dreaded engine failures. Only one confessed---they have had two total failures with complete replacements, and one of those two was still in the shop. Still went ahead and bought the TB. I did opt for the most recent build date (2/02).

    Checked the cargo tie downs----both were on backward. If you take them off you can look on the bottom of the 'bar' where the word 'front' (with an arrow) is printed.
  • jadavisncjadavisnc Member Posts: 8
    Have any of you Bravada owners installed the Envoy side steps? Do they fit? GM apparently only makes the part for the TB and Envoy - the steps on the Bravada in the brochure are not available through GM. I've checked the aftermarket suppliers but haven't found a set I've liked yet. I like the looks of the Envoy steps but there are slight differences in the fender and rocker flares which may not allow the fit.
  • giddens_johngiddens_john Member Posts: 77
    jadavisnc,
    Are you aware that GM makes side steps specific to the Bravada, or do you not like the Bravada side steps? I like the option of having clear anodized aluminum myself. In case you were not aware of them here's the part numbers.
    12497680 clear anodized Side Steps
    12497681 black anodized Side Steps
    There's a picture of the clear anodized steps on a black Bravada if you click on the Spin Around Town: 2002 Oldsmobile Bravada link on the top left of this web page.
  • jadavisncjadavisnc Member Posts: 8
    giddens_john,
    Thanks for the info and part numbers. gmpartsdirect said GM wasn't making those steps for the Bravada - all they showed were the TB and Envoy. The part numbers certainly show otherwise so I'll get back with them.
    The steps shown in the photo are what I'm looking for - same as brochure.
  • malibu99malibu99 Member Posts: 305
    I know that maybe somehow it has been mentioned but because Edmunds has no search feature I want to ask. Last night out of curiosity I looked at my roof racks and found taht they are indeed backwards, however, How do you remove them? I lifted the tabs on each side but this only helps them slide back and forth. How do I remove them to switch them over?

    Thanks in advance!
  • cmack4cmack4 Member Posts: 302
    Take off the covers at the front of each rail using a flat head screwdriver on the inner notch. Be careful not to snap any of the notches (3 in all I think). Once they are off you can undo the latches on the rails, and they will slide all of the way off. Turn them around, and put them back on. Shouldn't take more than 15 mins.
  • archdukerizzoarchdukerizzo Member Posts: 35
    I ordered my Bravada side steps from gmpartsdirect.com (12497680 clear anodized Side Steps).
    They came in 5 days. I haven't put them on yet though.

    Another note, I FINALLY received a pinout/wiring diagram for the Bose 6 disc in dash head unit. There are AUX R/L pins, so it does look like it can be rigged to accept a line input signal (for mp3 players).
  • 2002slt2002slt Member Posts: 228
    I picked up my Envoy 2 weeks ago. It has a build date of 1/02. According to what I've been reading here, my roof rails are reversed. There are no arrows stating which direction they're supposed to point. The manufacturer must have removed them, probably to stop this confusion. There must be some reason GM decided to install them this way. I stopped by the dealer and noticed that all were installed like mine. Since they don't make any noise, I'll leave them alone.
  • cmack4cmack4 Member Posts: 302
    All the TB's at the Chevy/Old's dealer I went to yesterday had them on backwards, but what was even stranger... The Bravada's were all on the right way! I asked about it, but their response... "They came that way from GM!"
  • malibu99malibu99 Member Posts: 305
    Thanks so much!

    My roof rails have an arrow that says "FRONT" so I know mine are backwards and that is why I have wind noise issues. I will fix it tonite and test it.
  • dshepherd3dshepherd3 Member Posts: 194
    don't forget to move the front rail about 1/2 back on the rack to minimize interference with air coming up and over the w/s.
  • kudronkudron Member Posts: 32
    Could you please send the source for the pinout/wiring diagram for the Bose 6 disc CD changer? Thanks
  • garykinggaryking Member Posts: 47
    I don't know if it is the fix people have been looking for, but I was just browsing the GM Service website, http://service.gm.com/techlink/html_en/index.html

    and I saw this service bulletin:


    01-06-04-052: OBD System Improvements (Reprogram PCM) - SES Light On, DTC P0014, P0116, or P1683 Set, Delayed Transmission Downshift and/or Excessive Fan Noise: 2002 Chevrolet and GMC S/T Utility, Oldsmobile Bravada


    Lots of good info on the website, if you dig around long enough.

  • scottc454scottc454 Member Posts: 356
    There is an interesting article in the October 2001 bulletin about how the oil life monitoring system works.
  • pepper50pepper50 Member Posts: 195
    Most of the Trailblazers LS in this area that come with either the options 2 or 3 packages have the 3.73 axle ratio. Occasionally I see one with 3.41, but this is rare, and usually on the bare-bones TB. I'm having difficulty finding an option 2 or 3 that has a 3.41. It can be ordered that way, but I'm not sure why the dealers are mostly getting 3.73. I almost never tow and would not do any towing beyond what I could do with a 3.41. Would I notice much difference in everyday driving with the 3.73? I presume there is some decreased mpg as well due to the higher ratio. Any comments from those of you with 3.73's will be appreciated. Thanks.
  • johntrjohntr Member Posts: 71
    In preusing through my owners manual for the TB. I found a supplimental page inserted in one of my documentation packs. The suppliment gives instructions on how to position the roof rack when not in use, so as to reduce wind noise.

    If anyone has not seen this, request & i'll post it in detail. (My manual is in the glove box, not on my desk.)

    John
  • johntrjohntr Member Posts: 71
    I have the 3.71 on my TB LT. I'm getting 17mpg on my daily commute to work 1/2 city, 1/2 hwy. During the summer, I drive to the NJ shore, 110 miles one way, my mileage for the weekend is 19-21mpg, which is 95% hwy (cruise set at 70mph - with occasion passing when on the 2 lane roads, aka accelation to 75-80, but don't tell the state police! ;-) )
  • kismat_tradingkismat_trading Member Posts: 8
    Has anyone seen any brush-guards and/or push bars for the Envoy yet. I live in NYC, where pararell parking is quite frequent. I am nervous about others playing bumper cars with my parked vehicle.

    TIA,

    Dheeraj
  • baltychenbaltychen Member Posts: 50
    02/07/02 Got my new 2002 TB, 4X4, LS, 1SB package, 3.73 Axle Ratio, Locking Differential, Underbody Shield, Out of door: #28,000.00 + Lojack (415.00), Now, it has 1,718 miles.
    Dealer fixed one minor problem on both front fender alignments. Dealer cannot turned off the Day Time Running Lights and Automatic Headlamp System. I did try by the manual but in vain. Dealer says in 2002 TB the day time running lights are must. Very minor roller bearing noises from under the engine when in crease the speed. Normal? Anyone can help.
  • pepper50pepper50 Member Posts: 195
    Manik has several accessories for the Envoy including front bars and rear bumper bars. See photos at the link below:


    http://www.manik.com/images/2002%20GMC%20Envoy-PR.jpg

  • medolarkmedolark Member Posts: 93
    I have a 3.73 rear axle on my Envoy. I thought about mileage for about 15 seconds before I ordered that ratio instead of 3.42. I now have a total of about 1500 miles on my truck and overall have gotten 16.2mpg. About 90% of that has been in city driving.

    If you think about it the maximum effect the ratio could have would be less than 10%- ie about 1.5 mpg and that maximum assumes every rotation of the engine will consume the same quantity of fuel. I don't think the effect is quite that bad. If I travel at a fixed mph my 3.73 ratio will result in less than 10% more rpm than a 3.42 ratio would. However, it will take the same amount of horsepower to push the vehicle at 60 mph regardless of rpm. So the 3.73 ratio may result in operating at a slightly lower efficiency and whatever that loss of efficiency will translate into poorer mpg - but I don't think it is as much as 10%.

    I once drove my old truck (3 speed auto Ford) in second gear over 100 miles before I noticed it was not in drive. There was no noticeable impact on mileage.
  • mraumrau Member Posts: 50
    If you push the Dome light Override button 4 times the DRL will turn off. Push 4 times again and they will turn back on. Believe there is a chime each time you do that. It is in the manual and works fine on my Envoy. In fact, I think most GM cars are this way. If it doesn't work, something is wrong.
    However, DRL are a nice feature and may help avoid a collision. I would only shut them off in limited circumstances.

    --Mike
  • archdukerizzoarchdukerizzo Member Posts: 35
    Anyone who wants the pdf of the pinouts from the bose 6 disc changer can email me. Sorry for posting my email addy this way, but i don't need the extra spam :)

    enkrypted
    at
    hotmail
    dot
    com
  • 2002slt2002slt Member Posts: 228
    I think if the vehicle was imported from Canada, the Daytime Running Lamps cannot be turned off. They have a law that prohibits this.
  • giddens_johngiddens_john Member Posts: 77
    Well I finally got my Bravada yesterday, it's a 2/02 build date. My roof racks also came backwards if compared to mrau's posted pictures. Also I don't have the directional arrows on mine. With so many of the newer builds not having directional arrows and being installed backwards, it makes me wonder if this isn't a design change that's taken place. Obviously my roof racks are slightly different from mrau's if for nothing else the missing directional arrows, and maybe they are meant to be facing the other direction with this design change. I didn't noticed the excessive wind noise on mine that I noticed on the few I test drove in January. Has anyone turned their roof racks around that didn't have the directional arrow? If so, what did you notice? On a different subject, has anyone had a sticking door issue. On my driver's door, if I don't close the door with feeling, and I just try to close the door slowly it gets stuck before it latches as if the doors not aligned correctly. There isn't any metal contact, almost as if it's getting stuck on the weather stripping. Also on the back passenger door, it's squeaks when being opened and closed. Upon closer inspection, it's squeaking on the weather stripping. I haven't contacted the dealer because if it's an easy fix I'd rather fix it my self versus being without the truck for a few days.
  • zecgeotzzecgeotz Member Posts: 22
    To: ARCHDUKERIZZO

    I have a red Bravada and want to order the same "clear annodized" side steps that you have. What color are they? Do they have to be painted? Will they look good with the red metallic paint on the truck? Did you add the mudflaps? Which ones and are they hard to install?

    Thanks.
  • archdukerizzoarchdukerizzo Member Posts: 35
    They're Silver with black ends and a black surface. Here's a URL to the bravada web site with a picture of them.

    http://www.oldsmobile.com/bravada/features/default98a3.html

    I did buy the bravada mudflaps as well, contrary to what the instructions say, YOU DO HAVE TO DRILL IN THE METAL TO MOUNT THE FRONT FLAPS. The instructions said all drilling was in the plastic, but on my Bravada (build date 11/01), where the holes mount are on the metal (and a hole needs to go in the plastic part of the inner wheel well). The rear flaps require drilling into the bumper and plastic wheel well. I did not install them yet. They look simple enough after you drill the holes, just make sure you use some kind of sealant like TUV when you put the screws in the metal.
  • iwsiws Member Posts: 12
    I don't wish to sound picky but in order to avoid any confusion I want to point out there are only 3 axle choices avialble as follows; 3:42, 3:73 and 4:10. (A 3:41 or a 3:71 would be very rare indeed.)
  • bricklayertxbricklayertx Member Posts: 20
    Any recommendations on where to buy a bug shield for a new TB??? Thanks
  • 2002slt2002slt Member Posts: 228
    John,

    I agree with you 100% on the roof rack issue. Mine are supposedly backwards, but they don't have arrows, or make noise. If it ain't broke...

    The other issue you're having with the doors may be similar to what I had. My drivers side rear door wouldn't close easily if any other door wasn't opened. I noticed this at the dealer during my final orientation. They brought over several service personnel to look at it. After about an hour of them trying to adjust the stop, they determined it was the hinge that needed adjustment. Since the hinge is welded on, they would have to break the weld. They told me to make an appointment with their bodyshop. I wasn't too fond of having this done, so I decided to live with it for a while. After driving it now for a few weeks the problem seems to have corrected itself. I think it just needed to work itself in. Hopefully that's all yours needs too.
    Good Luck!
  • giddens_johngiddens_john Member Posts: 77
    bricklayertx, you have a few options. You can go with the GM part, or you can look into the aftermarket parts. A good example of an aftermarket bug deflector can be found at http://www.autoventshade.com/ and you can even get them in matching colors to your paint.
  • cmack4cmack4 Member Posts: 302
    I just got the Bug/Stone Guard from Macneil as well as Weatherflector window visors for my Bravada. They are all very high quality and reasonably priced! The Bug/Stone Guard uses existing holes to secure it under the hood for the Bravada, not sure about the TB though.


    Here's Macneil's website, http://www.macneil.com


    Anyone buy a bull or safari bar for their triplet? I know Westin makes one for them, but I'd like to see some pics.

  • hardhawkhardhawk Member Posts: 702
    I had the three (3) control modules replaced to fix the wandering mirrors, and that worked for a week. I then took it back in and they reprogrammed the new modules, and that worked for a week. The mirrors are wandering again and I have just turned off the memory feature through the DIC and will leave it off until a final fix for the wandering problem is found. Since I am the one driving the Envoy 99% of the time, temporarily losing the memory feature by turning it off sure beats having to reset the mirrors every time I unlock the car. Overall, this still rates as a relatively minor annoyance and I still love the Envoy after 7 months and 10,000 miles.
  • bryancosbryancos Member Posts: 282
    Cmack,
    Did you ever find WESTIN PART NUMBERS for their Safari or Bull bars that fit the triplets? I've not been able to find them on their site at westinautomotive.com
  • bryancosbryancos Member Posts: 282
    I recall someone posted an issue w/ a dead battery a while ago... saw this on the
    GM service site:

    "Owners of 200-02 full size pickups and utility models may comment on an intermittent battery drain. This drain may coccur overnight. The A/C compressor relay may stick causing the battery to drain. The current recommendation is to replace the relay."

    Hmmm. Seems quality is not job one at GM... :)
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