I have 20000 miles on a 2000 LS Sport dealer advised I will need brakes in appox 3000 miles. They also want to change the rear window regulators. 2 questions; What has been normal brake life, and is the final update for the regulators out yet? I read the final replacements were to be metal. Dealer says they are still plastic.
Brake life varies all over the lot. It depends very much on the type of driving you do as well as how you drive. Some owners have over 40K miles on their front pads. Like yours, mine were shot at 24K (2000 V6 Sport). I was skeptical, so I pulled the wheels and checked myself. The dealer was right on the money. BTW, see Brian's post above re the Porterfield brakes. I replaced mine with those & I can vouch for what he says. Bonus-these produce very little dust. My back wheels with the factory pads now get dirty before the fronts!
The updated (metal) parts SHOULD be available now. If your dealer's got plastic, it's not the final fix.
Prior to the winter I was having a bad feeling about the D/S rear window. The dealer wanted to change the regulators in the late fall. I held off because I read about the the part being updated to metal. I didn't want the repair done twice. I don't need to open the rear windows in the winter. I just would like them fixed before the spring. When I checked last week they informed me the part was still plastic. I have been using the dealer since 1986 they try real hard to please the customer. If you go in informed it makes it that much easier. That is what is great about this forum.
My dealer has had the new-and-improved version since late December. IIRC the "D" shaped guide is metal instead of plastic. Mine are getting replaced as I type. Oh yea, my window failed in the "up" position
Switching to the front pads found on the non-sport LS will give you about 90% less dust than the pads that come on Sport packaged LS's. I've found zero performance difference in normal to aggressive street driving using the non-sport pads on my Sport V6 LS. However, if I planned to do any autocrossing or track event, I probably would stick with the Sport compound, as it probably has a higher heat rating than the non-sport.
Hope this isn't a duplicate post, but I was saddened to read corporate cost cutting takes precedence as of now in future Lincoln product development. I understand it, but I think Lincoln is going to remain the PAG black sheep for the time being:
Stumbled across your question as to not understanding my disappointment with the new Town Car design
1) "Do you expect Lincoln to walk away from their top selling line?" No, I just don't think it needs to look like the Marquis. The '03 lost much of its unique look from the '98 redo IMHO. (Ford capitulated to the masses on the Taurus in the same way - and it still never regained its sales leadership, right?) The TC had some cachet that I believe has been lost with the '03 freshening. 2)"Do you think you can take a family of 4 with luggage to the airport, in luxury, in anything else?" Yes, it's called an LS. Lose weight and travel lighter. 3) "As far as the Continental, why even talk about it? It's gone after the 02 MY." But it's coming back and probably needs to be a home run. That's why it needs to be talked about. Doesn't have to be a separate platform; on the other hand, think of the "parts bin" groans heard when the T-Bird used the LS dash. 4) "As far as dropping the TC in favor of a "GM Towncar", they appeal to 2 different demographics..." never said that - only said the Conti was no more impressive than a LeSabre (as far as platform)
Not to dredge up old stuff - I just want Lincoln to have a "competitive image". Hope sprang eternal in me when the LS was introduced; I just worry that Lincoln as a marque remains troubled and needs more PAG attention than what Reitzle can or is willing to give it.
Leasing: I hope the postings I've made regarding leasing have been taken in the spirit in which they were given: People who lease cars have different priorities than those who buy cars and intend to own them for a long time (why else would one buy?). Also, people who drive 15K+ per year (up to 30K in my case, some years ago) probably are better off buying. My point in commenting on those who lease is that reliability to them is an inconvenience. To those who buy, it can be an economic disaster, for cars in the LS's price class and above. I guess I'm tired of people on other boards (the 300M comes to mind) yapping about the great reliability of a car that's travelled 8000 miles and is leased. I want to hear about the ones with 150K miles. I drove a 240Z 225K miles with remarkably few "issues." Given that many of us here bought the first-year car, there's much hope that once the infant mortality issues are dealt with, the car could operate well for years and years. Time will tell.
Rear Window Regulators: My rear window (RH, as it turned out) exhibited the same failure mode as a recent poster (didn't write down the handle) who heard "odd" noises but was still able to close the window. That's exactly what happened to me, and the window stayed up with no problem (for months) until I was on a business trip and my wife tried to use it. That's when it fell down to stay, after which I learned which brands of tape worked best. Incidentally, nail polish remover takes off duct tape residue and gasoline works pretty well on clear tape (or is it the other way around?). Either way, I didn't trust the dealer to remove my tape residue and was able to do it myself in a half hour, more-or-less. I've got my new regulator now (probably the intermediate version), and once again, we'll see. What I will be trying for is the latest version on both sides before the car gets to 50K. The fact that the dealer didn't replace both regulators when I took the car in (per the Service Bulletin) may give me the ammunition I need to get them both done right later.
Well, Steve, I don't know if your LS will go 225K miles with few issues. But FWIW, JD Power named Lincoln as the most reliable American (whatever that means anymore) brand after 5 years of service.
Thanks for clarifying your position on leasers. However, there are options. There are custom-tailored leases. You can purchase additional mileage up front. It might still pay if you can deduct your car as business expense.
As a self-employed real estate broker who puts on about 15,000 miles a year, Ford's Red Carpet 3 year lease is perfect for me. I can't imagine someone with a "real job" using a lease. As self-employed, I write off 80% of my approximately $475 monthly lease payment which includes ESP maintainence. That the IRS actually subsidizes my LS insanity is like a great dream, which are regretably dry at my age. I have few complaints at 19 months and 23k. Both window mechanisms failed early in the game. No hint of failure on the "intermediate" replacements. I use the rears daily. I can rip a door panel off in moments and put a cotter pin in faster than I can call my dealer. Duct tape is too ugly for me. I only have two nagging problems for which I may not bother my dealer about. Recently, the airbag light started staying on. A trip to the dealer resulted in a new wiring harness but no fix. I keep telling them that I have overstressed the "G-Sensors" but they fail to believe me. The dealer is not too competent at dignosing the problem, and he's the biggest dealer in Calif. The second problem has been there since birth. The radio unit has a loud alternator whine just in cassette mode. It would be nice if he called the local Visteon fixer here in town and did an R&R while in the dealer for servce for something else, but they lack the imagination. Besides, I think this whine has something to do with the battery in the trunk. I think a new unit would probably do the same. Brakes are still good at 23k. I think manuals are easier on brakes and autos are inherently brake killers. My Manual Cressida got 80,000 or so on the original pads. My wife's 965 Volvo gets 20k on a set max. Tomorrow is Mania prep day. Mobil One change and new fluid in the Getrag. This time the 100% Redline MTL is going to be replaced by MTL/Syn Auto D 50-50 for faster shifts. The new 2002 air box that's been sitting on my workbench for a month will also be put in (yes, guys, where are my priorities?). Actually, I was almost going to be a no show at 3. On the 4th, I came down with pnemonia. At the same time, I had conjunctivitis in both eyes, my bowels dumped everything and it's seemed like I was falling apart. I started two antibiotics last Wednesday and I'm gaining strength fast. I don't know if the Coneinator will be 100% but I'm killing my 80 hour weeks in real estate to get some rest. I need some fun! I'll be ok as long as I don't have to drive an automatic with traction control. I must be feeling good because I had a little race down a long on ramp with a MR2 Spyder and I was on his [non-permissible content removed] the whole way. His 7.3 0-60 was way off or mine sure wasn't 7.9 per C&D. Even with the old air box. See you guys Thursday.
What's special about it? With 350 horsepower and 350 pound-feet of torque emanating from its supercharged V8, this is one serious LS. A revised engine computer and a performance intake system help the blown V8 achieve its lofty horsepower numbers without an increase to its 3.9-liter displacement.
The car sits slightly lower than stock and features Bilstein shocks and upgraded antiroll bars for better control. Aluminum alloy 19-inch wheels wrapped in Z-rated high-performance tires further contribute to the custom look of this hot rod Lincoln.
Why should you care? In its current guise, the standard LS is nothing more than a boulevard cruiser with nice wheels and a smooth, but not overly powerful, V8. This version shows that the LS can be a real high-performance machine, given the right parts. With a facelift due next year, we can only hope that future "sport" models will look as good and have as much horsepower as this show version. — Ed Hellwig
Obviously Ed Hellwig hasn't driven the car. I don't notice their vaunted 540 sport with a blown 350/350 motor. Why are American marques held to a MUCH higher standard than the Germans? Example, HP, 525-184, 530-225, LS V6-220. The 530 wins by just 5HP and the torque battle by 4#ft, 214 vs. 210. In V8 form the BMW has 290HP & 324#ft, the LS, 252HP and 261#ft (info from Edmunds). The 540 wins with a half liter more displacement and a TMV difference of 16k large. For that $16k I can bolt on stuff to the LS that would make a 540 hide from embarassment! It's funny how the "B" is the (self described) Ultimate (high priced, expensive to keep, don't EVEN want to have without a warranty) Driving Machine, best driving car ever, blah, blah, blah, yet the LS is a "boulevard cruiser"? I'll stack my non-sport V6 LS against a non-sport 528/530 anyday! I think Edmunds should either return the checks (from BMW), disclose their relationship, or stop rating BMW's.
Mine crashed last fall and I thought it was dumb that they wouldn't do both but guess I understand. Also had Radio/CD issues which are gone since they replaced it. I had trouble with the transmission and they reprogrammed it. I have 11,500 miles on my 2000 LS8 and do enjoy it
Yet another benefit of LLSOC membership is the access to the full description of TSB's. It specifically says to replace BOTH regulators to prevent a return visit for the other one. I took this info to my dealer and they replaced both with no problem. I even gave them the part numbers.
I am seriously considering the purchase a 2002 Lincoln LS V6 or V8 for long term ownership. After reading a couple hundred messages on the board, I am reconsidering. Please provide any advice you can. I am looking for quality of long term ownership. Hot performance is not a major issue with me. I have been an older Mercedes owner for 10 years. I could look at a CPO BMW 5 series or a 4-6 year old Mercedes. I am trying to make this an unemotional decision. Any advice would be appreciated. Thanks!
I can't relate to an unemotional purchase of a car but...
I think you'll find that the 2002 model year has many, many running changes to improve the vehicle and that it will provide you years of low cost ownership compared to the vehicles you mentioned.
...and you're going to get emotionally attached to your LS.
This one goes out to the Auto-Crossers on the Forum.. What type of Helmets do you guys use/prefer? Full Face or a Regular Helmet. If you use Full Face do you use the Clear Visor I would think not. Also How strict is the SCCA about it being SNELL Approved. I Saw a Real nice Full Face for $79 dollars a VEGA (DOT Approved) but not Snell. An HRC for $139 Snell approved. The Regular Helmets (No Face Guard, Chin Guard, etc) were $45 VEGA (DOT Approved) and HRC (SNELL and DOT Aproved).
There is a Nice BELL STAR 1 Full Face SNELL Approved on the internet at $79 dollars (Solid Colors), and 97 with a design. These are at www.onoffroad.com.
MANIA 3 helmets; Brian says there'll be helmets there to use when running the course.
Confused; Who isn't? :>) I own a 2001 V6 manual. It's a fantastic car to drive. It's been practically trouble-free in the year I've owned it. Just a couple of nits is all. I leased for 2 years. If I can afford it next year, I'll either purchase it or get a 2003. If the economy still sucks, looks like I'll be drivin a Focus.
IMHO, the LS is a great car, but the size-competitive BMW and Mercedes are better re materials/fit/finish. Course they should be at appx $10,000 more, eh? My bet would be the LS will be cheaper to maintain also.
MANIA 3 again: OK, I'm about to leave for the big event. LS is packed with cameras, tripods, maps and clothes. I'm heading down Hiway 1 from Santa Cruz. Going to photograph and enjoy driving this road finally in a car that'll make it fun. I'm staying in Morro Bay tonite and Santa Barbara on Wed. C all U participants Thurs nite at the Doubletree. And, since Brian has asked me to be the 'official' photographer for the event, be sure to *smile* when you see me!
Brian turned me on to a place called www.racerwholesale.com. They carry all the Bell models, but oh baby, get ready for Bell prices! One great brand they carry is the G-Force brand helmets. I got a G-Force Open Face in White for $149.99. It's Snell SA-2000 rated, which is the latest. As Brian pointed out, Solo-2 only requires Snell 95, but that will change and instantly obsolete your investment in an old Snell rated helmet. So saving a few bucks now is real short term thinking. For those racing in Mania 3, the Solo-2 people have a "barrel" of helmets for your use. I thought I would buy one as I have the biggest head on the planet (XX-Large) and the new helmet is not even big enough. So for the last 3 weeks, my son's bowling ball has taken residence where my fat head hopefully will on Saturday. There is also a Snell "M" or "MA" 2000 rating. The price is cheaper but it's for the two-wheeled folks only.
I studied leasing pretty carefully in 1995 before I bought the car I had before the LS. For a variety of reasons (annual mileage, "gap" insurance gaps, the fact that I don't maintain my vehicles in pristine condition, etc.) I decided buying was the way to go. . .at least for me.
As far as Irvine goes. . .not this year. I'm on a business trip this week and leave on another one the 21st that will last a week and a half. Given that, I want to spend some time at home, especially since I'm going to miss Valentine's this week.
Maybe next time. Have a good one & let us know what went on.
Like any hardcore automotive board dedicated to a specific model, we are NOT reflective of the general LS audience. We are picky and specific. If its the few quality issues you are referring to when you say you are reconsidering the LS, there are few, and many are related to early models. Crashing windows wont be a concern to you, since the regulators have now been updated on any 2002 model you are considering. Slow shifting transmissions are of zero concern to you, since the software has been updated at least twice, and 2002 models will have the latest. And the shifting issues arent really a concern unless you really push the car very hard. My 2000 V6 has 48k miles, and I have had very few issues, none ever leaving me stranded. The worst was a failed coolant hose, and I was even able to limp the car into a Lincoln dealership for that one. Both the V6 and V8 engines are strong performers. Dont listen to reviewers, drive both for yourself. The V6 will surprise you in real world driving. The V8 even better. Fuel economy is a bit dissapointing (Sidenote..the new BMW 745i has somewhere around 300hp with its V8, is a heavy car, and still gets an average epa of low 20's, identical to the LSV6..go figure), but still not horrendous. Im actually quite surprised at how well the car is holding up. My 1st American car, and Im very pleased. Paint is still glossy, interior still immaculate, leather is holding up extremely well, and its still relatively rattle free. Brakes still firm, suspension still good, although I am looking forward to putting brand new O.E. shocks on all the way around at around 60k miles. Overall, both LS's have strong, reliable engines, and strong reliable transmissions. Major systems are good too. Electrical, cooling, exhaust, fit and finish. For the most part, I think most owners are satisfied across the board, with a few exceptions as always. But even most of the guys that have had lots of issues still love the general personality of the car, with extra emphasis on the appreciation of the handling.
Again, go out and drive the V6 and V8 thoroughly, then let us know what you think.
Be aware that there are two Snell ratings, M for motorcycle, SA for special applications, which includes cars. SA has flammability standards not required for motorcycle helmets. It's my understanding that at an SCCA event where the rules are strictly observed, a motorcycle helmet would not be allowed.
Speaking of helmets, mine is right now in the trunk (safely tucked into a corner to avoid ITH damage), awaiting transport to LSM3. Just checked the weekend weather forecast for SoCal. Mid 60s in the daytime, high 40s at night. Is that normal for February? No wonder you guys think "snow banks" are where we store snow for safekeeping.:)
Scott LLSOC Member (done with the days, counting the hours now)
Are you saying that that ISN'T what a "snow bank" is? If not, just what is a "snow bank"? Where else is the snow kept for the winter?
Yea, that is our normal February weather. Those seem to be coastal temps as you'll want to add 10° for the inland high and subtract 5ish for the low. I live about 8 miles inland (on the edge of the coastal strip) and today it was about 71 and last night about 36.
See all you MANIAcs Friday! Mike LLSOC Charter Member
Tomorrow, I pick up drolds at the Phoenix airport for an early start to the weekends activities. Off to the Arizona mountains for a little more SST 2-3 and 3-2 training . . . if you know what I mean ;-)
I probably won't be at the keyboard until I get home on Sunday. Artie and I should roll into Irvine in plenty of time for happy hour (and really ready to hoist a few!)
I'll (we'll) be seein' all you Maniacs at the Doubletree or Gameworks Thursday!
Chris - LLSOC Charter Member and Mania 1, 2, and 3 veteran
I will try to give you an unbiased opinion of the 2002 LS. As LLSOC's Director of Marketing this will take a little effort.
After spending about six months researching and test driving all the near luxury sport sedans on the market, my wife and I decided to purchase a 2000 Lincoln LS. This was to be our first time purchasing such an expensive car and we intended on keeping this car for at least six years or more. We test drove the LS two times and felt the styling and interior spaciousness along with the superior handling and braking, set the LS apart from every other car we looked at and test drove.
I won't lie to you and tell you we had no problems with our LS. In fact we have had more problems then anyone else that has posted here on the Edmunds Board. Although we were the proud owners of the ultimate Lemon, we still loved our LS for the same reasons we had bought it for. Some of the issues that we had were to be expected for a first year car newly designed from the ground up, others had to do with paint problems that in retrospect I should have left be. Ultimately there came a point were Lincoln in the truest sense of customer commitment, moved us into a new 2002 LS. This is not something that’s done lightly, but the folks at Lincoln are committed to customer satisfaction. Try and find one other forum or car club that has the engineers that designed the car and the mechanics that fix them, participating and answering questions.
We have 5000 miles on our 2002 LS V8 Sport and have had no problems so far. We enjoy owning our new LS for the same reasons we enjoyed our 2000. I don't think you will be able to find a better car for anywhere near the price. The only suggestion I would make, if you decide to purchase an LS, is that you need to choose your dealer wisely. Your dealer needs to share the same commitment that Lincoln does. Bad dealers seem to be causing a lot of the frustration you may be reading about.
I picked up my new LS V8 Sport Monday so I'm in now. I tested the Jag 4.0 S-type and the LS Sport on similar roads and thought the LS handled better, if you can believe that. I talked myself out of the LS when they came out and had been sorry ever since. Now I'm not sorry. This one feels better. My only problem now is that South Florida is so flat, and the roads so straight.....
Congratulations on your LS purchase and welcome to the club. I don't believe the V8 Jag has the same 50/50 weight distribution that the V8 LS has. If it does I know Ill be corrected. Take the time and read your owners manual. Some of us are still finding facts and features that we must have glanced over long ago.
Good luck in your quest for a winding road in South Florida.
I just bought a 2000 LS V8 Sport yesterday. I love it already! But, while driving to work this morning, the radio started making a wining noise. It fluctuates with motor RPM. It sounds like engine noise coming through the amp/speakers. Has anyone had this problem? It's under warranty, but I would like to know what other LS owners have heard or experienced. Thanks in advance!!
If you have the Audiophile sound system, there has been a known issue with poor grounding of the subwoofer amplifier located in the trunk. This is usually corrected by running another ground to the amp. This seems to be only an issue with the 2000 model year. Even though there is no TSB that I could find, I would think it would be covered under the warrantee. If you don’t have the Premium system it still sounds like a ground problem to me.
My personal experience with eight month's of ownership and 12,000 miles of seat time completely echos Tom's.
First, the committment to customer satisfaction at Lincoln is unmatched. It starts with the little things like participating on this board. But easily ranges to the direct, timely contact I have had with key Lincoln corporate folks who resolved all my issues above and beyond their or Lincoln's legal requirements or responsibility. Try and talk to the head of marketing or the guy who designed he transmission at Acura, BMW, and so on. You can at Lincoln.
Second, chose a dealer wisely. My dealer is Heiser LM in Milwaukee and they have never failed to do whatever it took to make me a satisfied customer. Your dealer needs to be your advocate. Before you buy, spend ten minutes with the service manager to see what his/her perspective on service is.
For all of you enjoying Mania 3, I wish I could be there, but time conflicts prevailed.
Time to replace the brake fluid on my 2000 V8. Can someone with the shop manual tell me if there are any special requirements or techniques? I've heard that newer ABS systems must be depressurized before bleeding and that the order may be different than it used to be. I'll be using a Mityvac bleeding gun with a fresh bottle of proper fluid. Just need the sequence of steps and any special instructions or cautions. Thanks. Allen
The information after my Blip is from the San Francisco SCCA Club. www.sfrscca.com
To me it appears M helmets are allright and would be good for more than the Life of the Helmet since you are really supposed to change helmets every 5 years. I think at least M Helmets with SNELL M2000 would be good at least for SOLO II. I am sure the more competitive and dangerous racing events would require the SA.
Houston SCCA also Listed up to SNELL 90, But did not specify whether it had to be M or SA. I wonder what the SCCA HQ stance on this is? Anybody has an Official SCCA Handbook? Brian?
Regards, Airwolf
What kind of helmet do I need? For Solo II, SCCA and most autocrossing organizations require any helmet with a Snell M or SA sticker from the current, and two immediately preceding standards. In 2002, that would be Snell 2000, Snell 1995, or Snell 1990. The helmet can be full face, open face, or open with a chin guard. M = Motorcycle. These are more commonly available and less expensive. Purported to be designed for one big hit. May have more padding on top, I don't know. You can buy an open-face in the USA for as little as $75. Not required by governments as a standard.
SA = Special Applications. A different, ostensibly more severe, standard than M. The helmet is supposed to be rated for multiple impacts and also must have a fireproof liner. Rumor has it that many manufacturer's helmets differ between M and SA only by having the fireproof liner, for which the price goes up at least $100. Since motorcyclists and snowmobilers are unlikely to purchase these things, they are made in smaller numbers, not as commonly available and much less likely to be seen in local shops at low prices.
The USA Department of Transportation has their own, less severe, standard called, not surprisingly, DOT. I think the standard is called Z.90.1.B. SCCA Solo II does not permit helmets with only the government standard Z.90.1.B. Snell tests for the effects of non-standard coatings like stickers and new paint on the helmet material, but the Z.91.B standard does not include these tests.
Pay special attention to fit. The helmet should not be so tight it brings on headache, but it should not rattle, either. Put it on and shake your head. Your skin should travel with the helmet. The idea is that your head does not get a running start before hitting the padding.
The short answer to your question is to use the traditional RR,LR,RF,LF sequence. I did this on my LS using one of the vacuum bleeders, and it worked out fine. IIRC, the manual has some other info, but it relates to using the "tech tool" in the process. If my feeble, old memory can function when I get home from work today, I'll look in my shop manual for any additional info.
Thanks. One thing that occured to me is that the brake plumbing has to be independent to each wheel to support advance trak (right??). I would think that would make the order irrelevant but I would rather be safe than sorry. I'm most interested in whether or not the system must be depressurized and how.
I have only heard a whine under two conditions--with a cassette playing OR when under a low roof such as in a parking garage. I have been totally unsuccessful in getting the cassette whine fixed. I was given a new radio with some improvement, but it returned. On some cassettes it is much worse than on others. I have given up and intend to just live with it. Frankly, it is most annoying and is one reason I might just trade it in for the new Lexus SC 430 (although the flip top is the main reason). It boggles my mind that they can't get to the bottom of these seemingly unrelated electrical problems--the whine, the failure of the seat and steering wheel to return to their prior position when the key is put in the ignition, the phantom warning beeps, and others I don't remember now. It says to me that they aren't real careful about details. Details which might become important to me as an owner.
The San Diego SCCA Solo-2 Chapter requires a Snell 1990 or newer to run. No mention of MA or SA grades. Eventually, they will move up the standards and other locations may have different requirements. If you buy a SA-2000 rated helmet, you should be OK for a few years. If you make it to Mania 3, I can show you my virgin G-Force 750 w bowling ball break-in for the foam insert.
Tom Thanks for the help. The ground wire makes sense and I have an appointment with the dealership this afternoon. They said they will take care of it. Thanks again!
Have you played some of the most offending tapes in a non vehicle system lately? My LS doesn't have a cassette, so I don't have the problem, but maybe something in the playback process, storage, time is degrading the tapes themselves. It may be an enlightening experiment to play an offending tape in a decent home system to compare. Just a thought. BTW, haven't had a mystery beep for at least a month and a half!
Tom Thanks for the help. The ground wire makes sense and I have an appointment with the dealership this afternoon. They said they will take care of it. Thanks again!
AJ- Tom is right about the ground wire. I had the same problem with mine 2000 when I first bought it. The dealer added a second ground wire and it's been working ever since.
A friend of mine has a 2000 S-Type 3.0. I drove my LS-8 (non sport) over around a 10 mile loop of back roads. Then I drove my friend's Jag over the exact same route. The Jag is elegant and refined, the V6 has very adequate power and handles the bumps much better than the LS. However the Jag feels like an elderly gentleman's car, very nice but no excitement. It feels like it want's to be driven leisurely. On the other hand my LS just shouts "GO FASTER, CORNER HARDER, STOMP ON THE GAS". I'll take my LS any day over the Jag.
A reporter is trying to find consumers who've traded up from mass-market brands (e.g. Toyota, Chevy, Ford, etc.) to luxury nameplates. He says, "I'm not looking for lottery winners, just regular folks who wanted more car." If you have a story to share, please send it to me at jfallon@edmunds.com. It is helpful for you to include your e-mail, phone number and city/state of residence when you respond. Deadline for submission to this one is March 6. Thanks as always for your input!
My 2000 LS with standard stereo with glove box CD changer has had alternator whine in cassette mode only since new. Has anyone added a ground wire with success? Thanks, Stan
Comments
The updated (metal) parts SHOULD be available now. If your dealer's got plastic, it's not the final fix.
Artie
Charter Member, LLSOC
3 days and counting.
What are these pads like in the dust department? If they are any better I would like to know who sells them and how much do they cost. Thanks.
It's working......... :^(
http://www.detnews.com/2002/autosinsider/0202/11/a01-412668.htm
1) "Do you expect Lincoln to walk away from their top selling line?" No, I just don't think it needs to look like the Marquis. The '03 lost much of its unique look from the '98 redo IMHO. (Ford capitulated to the masses on the Taurus in the same way - and it still never regained its sales leadership, right?) The TC had some cachet that I believe has been lost with the '03 freshening.
2)"Do you think you can take a family of 4 with luggage to the airport, in luxury, in anything else?" Yes, it's called an LS. Lose weight and travel lighter.
3) "As far as the Continental, why even talk about it? It's gone after the 02 MY." But it's coming back and probably needs to be a home run. That's why it needs to be talked about. Doesn't have to be a separate platform; on the other hand, think of the "parts bin" groans heard when the T-Bird used the LS dash.
4) "As far as dropping the TC in favor of a "GM Towncar", they appeal to 2 different demographics..." never said that - only said the Conti was no more impressive than a LeSabre (as far as platform)
Not to dredge up old stuff - I just want Lincoln to have a "competitive image". Hope sprang eternal in me when the LS was introduced; I just worry that Lincoln as a marque remains troubled and needs more PAG attention than what Reitzle can or is willing to give it.
Rear Window Regulators: My rear window (RH, as it turned out) exhibited the same failure mode as a recent poster (didn't write down the handle) who heard "odd" noises but was still able to close the window. That's exactly what happened to me, and the window stayed up with no problem (for months) until I was on a business trip and my wife tried to use it. That's when it fell down to stay, after which I learned which brands of tape worked best. Incidentally, nail polish remover takes off duct tape residue and gasoline works pretty well on clear tape (or is it the other way around?). Either way, I didn't trust the dealer to remove my tape residue and was able to do it myself in a half hour, more-or-less. I've got my new regulator now (probably the intermediate version), and once again, we'll see. What I will be trying for is the latest version on both sides before the car gets to 50K. The fact that the dealer didn't replace both regulators when I took the car in (per the Service Bulletin) may give me the ammunition I need to get them both done right later.
Stay tuned.
Thanks for clarifying your position on leasers. However, there are options. There are custom-tailored leases. You can purchase additional mileage up front. It might still pay if you can deduct your car as business expense.
Are you coming to Irvine again?
Artie
I have few complaints at 19 months and 23k. Both window mechanisms failed early in the game. No hint of failure on the "intermediate" replacements. I use the rears daily. I can rip a door panel off in moments and put a cotter pin in faster than I can call my dealer. Duct tape is too ugly for me.
I only have two nagging problems for which I may not bother my dealer about. Recently, the airbag light started staying on. A trip to the dealer resulted in a new wiring harness but no fix. I keep telling them that I have overstressed the "G-Sensors" but they fail to believe me. The dealer is not too competent at dignosing the problem, and he's the biggest dealer in Calif.
The second problem has been there since birth. The radio unit has a loud alternator whine just in cassette mode. It would be nice if he called the local Visteon fixer here in town and did an R&R while in the dealer for servce for something else, but they lack the imagination. Besides, I think this whine has something to do with the battery in the trunk. I think a new unit would probably do the same.
Brakes are still good at 23k. I think manuals are easier on brakes and autos are inherently brake killers. My Manual Cressida got 80,000 or so on the original pads. My wife's 965 Volvo gets 20k on a set max.
Tomorrow is Mania prep day. Mobil One change and new fluid in the Getrag. This time the 100% Redline MTL is going to be replaced by MTL/Syn Auto D 50-50 for faster shifts. The new 2002 air box that's been sitting on my workbench for a month will also be put in (yes, guys, where are my priorities?).
Actually, I was almost going to be a no show at 3. On the 4th, I came down with pnemonia. At the same time, I had conjunctivitis in both eyes, my bowels dumped everything and it's seemed like I was falling apart. I started two antibiotics last Wednesday and I'm gaining strength fast. I don't know if the Coneinator will be 100% but I'm killing my 80 hour weeks in real estate to get some rest. I need some fun! I'll be ok as long as I don't have to drive an automatic with traction control. I must be feeling good because I had a little race down a long on ramp with a MR2 Spyder and I was on his [non-permissible content removed] the whole way. His 7.3 0-60 was way off or mine sure wasn't 7.9 per C&D. Even with the old air box. See you guys Thursday.
Lincoln LS "Sport Edition"
What's special about it?
With 350 horsepower and 350 pound-feet of torque emanating from its supercharged V8, this is one serious LS. A revised engine computer and a performance intake system help the blown V8 achieve its lofty horsepower numbers without an increase to its 3.9-liter displacement.
The car sits slightly lower than stock and features Bilstein shocks and upgraded antiroll bars for better control. Aluminum alloy 19-inch wheels wrapped in Z-rated high-performance tires further contribute to the custom look of this hot rod Lincoln.
Why should you care?
In its current guise, the standard LS is nothing more than a boulevard cruiser with nice wheels and a smooth, but not overly powerful, V8. This version shows that the LS can be a real high-performance machine, given the right parts. With a facelift due next year, we can only hope that future "sport" models will look as good and have as much horsepower as this show version. — Ed Hellwig
[img]http://www.edmunds.com/news/autoshows/articles/48020/page014.html[/img]
I think you'll find that the 2002 model year has many, many running changes to improve the vehicle and that it will provide you years of low cost ownership compared to the vehicles you mentioned.
...and you're going to get emotionally attached to your LS.
There is a Nice BELL STAR 1 Full Face SNELL Approved on the internet at $79 dollars (Solid Colors), and 97 with a design. These are at www.onoffroad.com.
Let me know.
Regards,
V.
Brian says there'll be helmets there to use when running the course.
Confused;
Who isn't? :>) I own a 2001 V6 manual. It's a fantastic car to drive. It's been practically trouble-free in the year I've owned it. Just a couple of nits is all. I leased for 2 years. If I can afford it next year, I'll either purchase it or get a 2003. If the economy still sucks, looks like I'll be drivin a Focus.
IMHO, the LS is a great car, but the size-competitive BMW and Mercedes are better re materials/fit/finish. Course they should be at appx $10,000 more, eh? My bet would be the LS will be cheaper to maintain also.
MANIA 3 again:
OK, I'm about to leave for the big event. LS is packed with cameras, tripods, maps and clothes. I'm heading down Hiway 1 from Santa Cruz. Going to photograph and enjoy driving this road finally in a car that'll make it fun. I'm staying in Morro Bay tonite and Santa Barbara on Wed. C all U participants Thurs nite at the Doubletree. And, since Brian has asked me to be the 'official' photographer for the event, be sure to *smile* when you see me!
George
For those racing in Mania 3, the Solo-2 people have a "barrel" of helmets for your use. I thought I would buy one as I have the biggest head on the planet (XX-Large) and the new helmet is not even big enough. So for the last 3 weeks, my son's bowling ball has taken residence where my fat head hopefully will on Saturday.
There is also a Snell "M" or "MA" 2000 rating. The price is cheaper but it's for the two-wheeled folks only.
As far as Irvine goes. . .not this year. I'm on a business trip this week and leave on another one the 21st that will last a week and a half. Given that, I want to spend some time at home, especially since I'm going to miss Valentine's this week.
Maybe next time. Have a good one & let us know what went on.
Again, go out and drive the V6 and V8 thoroughly, then let us know what you think.
Regards,
Airwolf1000
See y'all at Mania III
Speaking of helmets, mine is right now in the trunk (safely tucked into a corner to avoid ITH damage), awaiting transport to LSM3. Just checked the weekend weather forecast for SoCal. Mid 60s in the daytime, high 40s at night. Is that normal for February? No wonder you guys think "snow banks" are where we store snow for safekeeping.:)
Scott
LLSOC Member (done with the days, counting the hours now)
Yea, that is our normal February weather. Those seem to be coastal temps as you'll want to add 10° for the inland high and subtract 5ish for the low. I live about 8 miles inland (on the edge of the coastal strip) and today it was about 71 and last night about 36.
See all you MANIAcs Friday!
Mike
LLSOC Charter Member
I probably won't be at the keyboard until I get home on Sunday. Artie and I should roll into Irvine in plenty of time for happy hour (and really ready to hoist a few!)
I'll (we'll) be seein' all you Maniacs at the Doubletree or Gameworks Thursday!
Chris - LLSOC Charter Member and Mania 1, 2, and 3 veteran
After spending about six months researching and test driving all the near luxury sport sedans on the market, my wife and I decided to purchase a 2000 Lincoln LS. This was to be our first time purchasing such an expensive car and we intended on keeping this car for at least six years or more. We test drove the LS two times and felt the styling and interior spaciousness along with the superior handling and braking, set the LS apart from every other car we looked at and test drove.
I won't lie to you and tell you we had no problems with our LS. In fact we have had more problems then anyone else that has posted here on the Edmunds Board. Although we were the proud owners of the ultimate Lemon, we still loved our LS for the same reasons we had bought it for. Some of the issues that we had were to be expected for a first year car newly designed from the ground up, others had to do with paint problems that in retrospect I should have left be. Ultimately there came a point were Lincoln in the truest sense of customer commitment, moved us into a new 2002 LS. This is not something that’s done lightly, but the folks at Lincoln are committed to customer satisfaction. Try and find one other forum or car club that has the engineers that designed the car and the mechanics that fix them, participating and answering questions.
We have 5000 miles on our 2002 LS V8 Sport and have had no problems so far. We enjoy owning our new LS for the same reasons we enjoyed our 2000. I don't think you will be able to find a better car for anywhere near the price. The only suggestion I would make, if you decide to purchase an LS, is that you need to choose your dealer wisely. Your dealer needs to share the same commitment that Lincoln does. Bad dealers seem to be causing a lot of the frustration you may be reading about.
That’s as unbiased as I can be.
Tom
Member LLSOC
Chuck
Whose LLSOC check is in the mail
Congratulations on your LS purchase and welcome to the club. I don't believe the V8 Jag has the same 50/50 weight distribution that the V8 LS has. If it does I know Ill be corrected. Take the time and read your owners manual. Some of us are still finding facts and features that we must have glanced over long ago.
Good luck in your quest for a winding road in South Florida.
Tom
Member LLSOC
AJ
Congratulations on your LS purchase also.
If you have the Audiophile sound system, there has been a known issue with poor grounding of the subwoofer amplifier located in the trunk. This is usually corrected by running another ground to the amp. This seems to be only an issue with the 2000 model year. Even though there is no TSB that I could find, I would think it would be covered under the warrantee. If you don’t have the Premium system it still sounds like a ground problem to me.
Tom
First, the committment to customer satisfaction at Lincoln is unmatched. It starts with the little things like participating on this board. But easily ranges to the direct, timely contact I have had with key Lincoln corporate folks who resolved all my issues above and beyond their or Lincoln's legal requirements or responsibility. Try and talk to the head of marketing or the guy who designed he transmission at Acura, BMW, and so on. You can at Lincoln.
Second, chose a dealer wisely. My dealer is Heiser LM in Milwaukee and they have never failed to do whatever it took to make me a satisfied customer. Your dealer needs to be your advocate. Before you buy, spend ten minutes with the service manager to see what his/her perspective on service is.
For all of you enjoying Mania 3, I wish I could be there, but time conflicts prevailed.
Jim
LLSOC member
Allen
To me it appears M helmets are allright and would be good for more than the Life of the Helmet since you are really supposed to change helmets every 5 years. I think at least M Helmets with SNELL M2000 would be good at least for SOLO II. I am sure the more competitive and dangerous racing events would require the SA.
Houston SCCA also Listed up to SNELL 90, But did not specify whether it had to be M or SA. I wonder what the SCCA HQ stance on this is? Anybody has an Official SCCA Handbook? Brian?
Regards,
Airwolf
What kind of helmet do I need?
For Solo II, SCCA and most autocrossing organizations require any helmet with a Snell M or SA sticker from the current, and two immediately preceding standards. In 2002, that would be Snell 2000, Snell 1995, or Snell 1990. The helmet can be full face, open face, or open with a chin guard.
M = Motorcycle. These are more commonly available and less expensive. Purported to be designed for one big hit. May have more padding on top, I don't know. You can buy an open-face in the USA for as little as $75. Not required by governments as a standard.
SA = Special Applications. A different, ostensibly more severe, standard than M. The helmet is supposed to be rated for multiple impacts and also must have a fireproof liner. Rumor has it that many manufacturer's helmets differ between M and SA only by having the fireproof liner, for which the price goes up at least $100. Since motorcyclists and snowmobilers are unlikely to purchase these things, they are made in smaller numbers, not as commonly available and much less likely to be seen in local shops at low prices.
The USA Department of Transportation has their own, less severe, standard called, not surprisingly, DOT. I think the standard is called Z.90.1.B. SCCA Solo II does not permit helmets with only the government standard Z.90.1.B. Snell tests for the effects of non-standard coatings like stickers and new paint on the helmet material, but the Z.91.B standard does not include these tests.
Pay special attention to fit. The helmet should not be so tight it brings on headache, but it should not rattle, either. Put it on and shake your head. Your skin should travel with the helmet. The idea is that your head does not get a running start before hitting the padding.
IIRC, the manual has some other info, but it relates to using the "tech tool" in the process. If my feeble, old memory can function when I get home from work today, I'll look in my shop manual for any additional info.
Thanks for the help. The ground wire makes sense and I have an appointment with the dealership this afternoon. They said they will take care of it. Thanks again!
AJ
Thanks for the help. The ground wire makes sense and I have an appointment with the dealership this afternoon. They said they will take care of it. Thanks again!
AJ
Tom is right about the ground wire. I had the same problem with mine 2000 when I first bought it. The dealer added a second ground wire and it's been working ever since.
A reporter is trying to find consumers who've traded up from mass-market brands (e.g. Toyota, Chevy, Ford, etc.) to luxury nameplates. He says, "I'm not looking for lottery winners, just regular folks who wanted more car." If you have a story to share, please send it to me at jfallon@edmunds.com. It is helpful for you to include your e-mail, phone number and city/state of residence when you respond. Deadline for submission to this one is March 6. Thanks as always for your input!
Very best,
Jeannine Fallon
PR Director
Edmunds.com
http://dw-world.de/english/0,3367,1439_A_418718_1_A,00.html