By accessing this website, you acknowledge that Edmunds and its third party business partners may use cookies, pixels, and similar technologies to collect information about you and your interactions with the website as described in our
Privacy Statement, and you agree that your use of the website is subject to our
Visitor Agreement.
Comments
My 2000 LS8 (build date 10/99) is up to 113K....still runs great if I can ignore all the little things that have gone wrong with it.
My 2001 Getrag LS has about 78,000 on it now. I've spent almost nothing on it for repairs, except for tires and just a couple months ago brakes for the first time. If only they could (would) fix the HVAC, I'd be about 100% satisfied. (Oh, make that 95% - I'd also like a blower or something to get more HP out of the V6). Else, happy as a clam.
And I'm blessed to have the first (2000 V6 w/ 128+K miles) and the last (2006 w/~9K miles) LS.
I guess I figured that since the home page hadn't changed for months (at least on the address I'd bookmarked), that might be an indicator of something. Now I see there have been things going on, just invisible to me until now (or, more properly, the 11th).
Hope those two LS's hold up well for you.
In the old days, they determined what was wrong(no charge), then charged you parts and labor. That was it. These days, You are charged $50-$80 (or whatever they feel like) for diagnostics in addition to parts, labor, and shop material. These days service departments are business centers to rib you off coming and going. I think all are that way. There is no way of knowing if their service technicians are competent or whether they made a mistake and they expect you to pay for multiple repairs.
The seat sliding back and forth with key removal is a stupid idea. It puts way too much stress on power seat motor ( that sounds noisy right now compared to passenger side) and wears out the eletrical connections.
Using hydraulics for cooling fan is another unusual idea, and from what I have seen from other owners, that will fail pretty soon too.
LS is a very beautiful car but very expensive to fix. In 9 years of owning a 96 Toyota Camry XLE V-6, I spent only $150 to have the timing belt replaced. My E430 has been decent so far also.
The recent repairs reinforce the notion that the American cars not only have poor resale value, but they also drain you with poor down the road reliability. If the car is relible at least I don't have to deal with greedy dealers.
Joe
78k and still running although rather expensively.
Do we have to always buy brand new cars with 3/36 warranty to feel good about what we drive?
Joe
A year ago when I was looking for something for my daughter to drive for a year or two, I looked at a used Lexus with about 135000 on it. The thing would've cost at least $1000 to fix the stuff that was wrong with it.
And how do you know how it's been treated? You cant and you dont unless you were the original owner.
Why did you buy it? Did you get a good price?
Of course I bought it because I got it at a good price. What is wrong with that?
I buy good used cars as a hobby, drive them for a few years, do regular maintenace on them, try to figure out how they are put together,and then sell them and buy something else. I paid $17K for a 2001 E430 about eight months ago at a local MB dealer with 73K miles. They wanted $23K. that was when gas was $3 a gallon. I guess people were scared of V8 cars. The Mercedes V8 gets better gas mileage than LS's V-6. The best was 28.8 mpg at 70mph. The MB gets 26-27 on my highway commute to work. I paid $8500 for the LS with 96K miles.
I think I can tell how a used car is treated by spending about 30 minutes with the car. If one does not have the skill then I don't expect one to understand this. Let me know if you would like to know a few things about checking out a used car.
On the service part of the LS, I called the Lincoln service manager and said what if you charge me $100 for part and labor(instead of $300) to fix the pigtail under driver seat that is causing the air bag light to come on. they had already charged some $340 for supposedly bad clock spring. After some discussion, he agreed to $120.
The LS is a very good looking car, hopefully I am done spending money on it for several months.
Joe
There were a few posts back in November about the infamous lug nuts, and there have been 218 posts in the last year. Plus which, the problems & solutions micro boards have had the occasional post, with the always-helpful reply from Akirby.
My '00 manual now has 106K on it and continues to do yoeman service as my daily driver; I try to get it out at least once a year on a real road trip (2-4K miles+), and am always pleased with its performance on the open, often twisty & hilly, road.
Enjoy your LS's, and let us know what you get as a replacement, when it's time to get a new car.
I have really wanted to replace my LS for a long time but Ford offers nothing that appeals to me. If not for my stupid loyalty, I would probably be driving an STS, DTS, or maybe even a 300C.
I thought perhaps the new Volvo S80 would be a good replacement but after looking them over, they just strike me as overpriced. I have driven XJ8s a couple of times but the styling is stale, the J-gate shifter is stupid, and the price high.
At this point, I am waiting for the MKS and the Jag XF to be introduced. Looks like I will be keeping my trusty LS for at least another year.
I am really looking forward to more information on the production XF.
I would like to thank everyone here for their help over the years in figuring out some of my 2000 LS V8 problems.
The repairs have just gone past the point of reasonability (the car still needs AC fixed as it only throws cold on one side, heated seats don't function, there is $2k rattle). Through the years I replaced the following: heater motor ($725), 4 coils, all valve gaskets ($850), 2 window motors (yes motors just not regulators $450) and some other stuff too much to mention. I loved it when it was clean and ran right.
Ther are a few extra parts left over that I want to get rid of at a reduced cost (Air cabin filter (FP-25)& 3 Air filters, 1 of which is OEM and 2 are Purolator premium plus. If interested give me an email before they go on ebay.
Again thx to everyone for their help. It was a good run when it ran right (sounds like one of my old XKE stories).
As for 2 specific problems:
The heated seats were failing right and left in 2000 and 2001. That's the reason that heated seats were the only option I left off my V6 when I ordered it.
As to the AC blowing cold on one side - fuggettaboutit. My experience teaches that that is within spec according to Ford engineers. At least when the car is under warranty.
Any idea what you'll replace your LS with?
It will be replaced by a loaded Toyota Camry or a Nissan Altima 3.5. Something very highly rated in terms of minimal repairs. The Lincoln people treated me so poorly, after owning Lincolns for 15 years, that I would never go back. Such is the demise of American automakers.
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=6865776
Or this:
http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2007/01/toyota_sludge_settlement.html
I know about the rattle too. It's actually just the sway bar bushings (usually) that cause the rattle. $30 parts that wear prematurely. However Ford will NOT sell the bushings anymore. Instead they force the owner to replace the badly designed sway bar and bushings with a new design for about $800 and up. The up is if you also need the sway bar mounts, knuckles etc. What a RIP. They design it bad but force us to pay for their mistake. Mine (at80K) needs this work too but somehow my mechanic got hold of the old bushings (at least he thinks he did) and I'll be putting them in one of these days.
And as far as how they treat folks like you and I, it's a GD shame that they treat their customers like disposable idiots, but they do. I finally had it with my local dealer repair (North Bay Ford Lincoln Mercury in Santa Cruz Cal) recently and went off on them and the owner and my saleswoman in no uncertain terms. They dont care though. They have no desire to cater to customers who actually expect proper treatment. They just want dummies who'll take their cr_p and be quiet about it.
You are right, such is the demise of American companies in general. They care only about the bottom line this quarter. Everything else is ignored. Well their chickens are coming home to roost. Like you, I've had 3 Lincolns in the past 9 years. I haven't totally given up on them I guess cause I haven't had the reliability issues you have. But my advice to anyone considering a Ford product would be in part to avoid automatic transmissions and avoid auto HVAC systems. Ford's are trouble prone and they will not fix them. In my experience anyway.
Good luck with the Camry. I might avoid the Altima if I were you. My brother has one and it is not a well-made car. I dont think he's had a lot of reliability issues, but it is a rattletrap and it's only like an 02 or 03.
I began to look at the articles you posted and was surprised that the first one was from *NPR* !!?? and supposedly has positive things to say about American car companies!!?? Not usually their MO. Usually they are clueless PC robots.
Course, this sentence in the first paragraph does little to lift my expectations of them:
"The new Saturn Aurora ... "
Too bad there arent more LS owners around who might sue Ford for the sway bar and lug nut situation on the LS. Maybe we could get some help from Ford after all? Yeah, right. I was a member of a class action suit a few years ago. We won. I have yet to cash my settlement check. I'm going to frame it instead. It is for 67 cents. Meanwhile the lawyers have new vacation homes in Tahoe.
I wonder if your cooling problem is the heater valve. Mine was blowing hot from the passenger side and cool from the drivers. I replaced the valve and all is well.
How come we don't hear from you at the other site??
That may have been true for the overall company strategy, but as for the individual dealerships, my experiences couldn't be more different. Here, I won't buy from the local Acura or Lexus dealers (one each) - I don't enjoy being treated like it's my privilege to shop there and I should be thankful they've let me in the door. That is, if you can get any attention at all. Ditto the nearest Honda and Toyota dealerships.
My shopping experience at the domestic dealerships was almost pleasant, and my buying and service experience at the nearest Lincoln dealership couldn't have been better.
You just never. . .
Yeah, I've heard just how hard it is to replace the whole sway bar. Not sure I'd attempt that myself. Bushings are doable though.
As for the HVAC problem I have, it seems to be a blend door issue where too much AC air is added to the peripheral vents so they blow at about 60 degrees while center stack is about 110 degrees. Both sides are appx same. And Ford says that's "within spec". Not just the dealer, but the division rep and the company engineers themselves. But dnt ask to see the spec. While a fairly minor issue all things considered, it is the treatment I received on this issue alone that pushed me over the top.
I'd love to get back on the other site, but I just cant see paying for it. Yeah I know it costs $$$s to run, but there are other ways around that than charging the users.
What does that mean? Care to paraphrase your letter here?
It also states that the "shop supply" is to be a maximum amount (read the very fine print). At Osman LM (Melbourne, FL) the cost was a max of $15., which has now been raised to $20. My charges were always over the $15. max.
Every month that passes (with the LS long since paid for) is another month that I'm not spending money on whatever comes next. I'm a bit "thrifty," so this is a good thing.
Yesterday I was driving home from work at a fairly sporting speed for rush hour (70+), listening to the tunes, enjoying the otherwise quiet & considering whether I really "need" a different vehicle anytime soon. It inhales my mountain bike without a problem, with the rear seats down, and life is good.
My trip to the middle of Texas in October gave me yet another opportunity to enjoy the LS on the road -- 80+ mph on the Interstate & plenty of twisties in the hill country and Big Bend to exercise the suspension. I could be driving this thing for a long time.
Or not -- generally it's a single episode that drives me to the next vehicle. . .because I'm "cocked" to move on. When I first bought my LS I assumed the next one would be to a manual V8 LS, with all the improvements that ten years of development would have produced.
Whoops, sorry, I'm on the wrong board. People who think like this aren't welcome at Lincoln/Ford. They run BMW.
Well said. You and me both. Knock wood. I think one of the smarter things we did was buy the manual tranny model with the V6. The Ford Duratech seems to have been a lot more reliable than the Jag V8 and auto trannies by their very nature (and IME Ford's in particular) are much more trouble prone than a stick shift.
Have you had ANY trouble with the tranny or clutch? I haven't.
Last time I took my LS and cruised at over 80mph to LA, the CHP didn't like it. That's the most expensive problem I've had yet in my LS.
About eight months ago, my clutch began to not disengage completely. I wrote it off to a bad master cylinder & bought some fluid to top off the system. No joy. I went from the first symptom to no clutch whatsever in a few hours on a Saturday. Having driven a (class 8) truck for awhile, I've learned how to shift without the clutch, so was able to get the car home & on to the dealer by starting in first gear at red lights (when they turned green) & shifting clutchless from then until I got to the next red light.
Turned out to be the slave cylinder, which in this car (along with several others, I've learned) is INSIDE the bell housing -- the transmission needs to be taken out to do the replacement.
Imagine my surprise. Anyway, given that there's so much labour involved in getting at the damn slave cylinder, I went ahead & replaced the clutch & throwout bearing. All of this, BTW, cost a lot less than the automatic transmission work I've had done in the past on other cars.
So far, so good.
Oh, by the way, on the way back from Texas I was cruising down a traffic-free state highway that parallels I10 in southern New Mexico, where the speed limit had been 65 for about 70 miles -- I'd set the cruise to 69, and all I saw in the way of traffic was Border Patrol. As soon as I turned north to rejoin I10 (where the speed limit was reduced to 55 for some reason), I came over a rise and met one of New Mexico's finest, who zapped me with the latest in what used to be called VASCAR. First ticket I've had in years, but it was worth it. Really fine day, otherwise.
My son is trying to buy one but has not priced them on the lot in either state. He's military and just returned from the mideast...and got to have that newer car.
Thanks, Jim.
aiuto@att.net
The original tires on this car were the Michelin Pilot HX MXM4's. I was very happy with these tires. I never had Michelin tires before and I liked the ride. Getting used to the car as a whole package, I noticed some slight sway on turns but I didn't care. I was (and still am) very happy with my choice of vehicle after an extensive search.
I frequented Edmunds and this forum before and after my purchase. I read some postings of owners with older models who talked about replacing the MXM4's with I believe the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S's and they couldn't belive how much better the ride was.
Well, it was time to replace the MXM4's so I went to tirerack.com to view my options. I was surprised at the poor ratings given to the MXM4's so I looked for tires that were considered better. At this point I enjoy more the smooth ride of a luxury car like the LS, especially since my prior vehicle was a Camaro with a very jarring ride. I ened up finding that there were these Bridgestone Potenza AS Pole Position tires where reviewers gave it the highest grades (about 9 out of 10) for ride comfort so I decided to buy them. Note: reviewers gave the MXM4's about a 6 on ride comfort. Ratings for Pilot Sports were slightly lower than these Bridgestones.
I called my local tire dealer (Big O Tires) and they had them in their warehouse so I ordered them and had them installed. So, here I am expecting a smoother ride than the MXM4's but was very disppointed. These new tires ride very hard. The ride was almost as bad as my Camaro. I called the tire store and asked about tire pressure. The installers had followed Mfgr recommendations and put in 35 PSI ( I also went with nirtogen fill)but the LSE recommendation is 30 to 32. They said to bring it back and they adjusted the pressure to 30 PSI. To me it didn't help that much. So I went back in again and actually had a service guy go for a ride. He thought they were fine and actually the ride seemed smoother than the AM (nitrogen fill is not supposed to change with temperature). I decided to try for a couple more days but I asked about my options. He said I had 30-days to return if i don't like them and I'd get a pro-rated allowance towarsd replacements. I do find that the handling is much better with these tires so the give on turns is likely attributed to the MXM4's and not the car.
So here I am with about a week to go, have decided I don't like these Bridgestones and need to decide on replacements. I'm favoring going back to the MXM4's as I don't understand the comments and ratings by other owners. I thought I'd post here though since it's likely others have gone thru what I'm going thru. Since my biggest want is a smooth ride, I think I should go with a touring tire vs a High Performance Tire despite the favorable comments about the Pilot Sports (which are Hi-perfomance and Z-rated)
Any input and feedback would be greatly appreciated.