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I hope that stops the pinging :shades:
The fix is a new complete valve cover gasket "set". This will include the round gaskets that fail around/beneath the spark plug wells. Once this is done, the spark plug well is cleaned free of residue, the boots are cleaned free of residue and silicone sprayed, you shouldn't have a miss-fire.
If you refer to "knocking" as your miss-fire issue, then you will be good to go. If you actually have a pre-ignition "Knock" or "Ping" situation, that's something all different.
BTW, while you have the valve covers off (on the V-8 only), you should check the secondary cam chain and the chain tensioner condition. Mostly, the tensioner as they are plastic on metal and the plastic cracks over time then, fails and the chain will skip a cog on the sprocket and likely the piston will hit a valve. Once this takes place, the repair bill will be huge.
The primary timing chain tensioner is buried within the front engine assembly and it is weak too. Best to replace those too however, it's costly labor charges just to get to them.
BTW, coils come with the boot and spring as an assembly from Ford. I don't know if that's the case with non-Ford parts.
I know that Lincoln stopped production 5 years ago, after a 6 year run, so there are potentially more cars out there to see, but lately I've been seeing LSs all over the place, whereas when they were still "new cars", I hardly saw any. I think that I even saw my former LS on the road a couple of weeks ago.
But, as we all know, time marches on. On one hand, I'm kind of sorry that I didn't try a little harder to find a deal on an '06 LS, and traded off my '00. But on the other hand, it would have meant that I would have had a 6 year newer "orphan"....
That's probably why I'm still not driving that LS. While it had only 60,000 miles on it, and it was still running well, I was starting to see rust in the rear quarter panels, right over the wheel wells. Once it creeps in, it's all over....
My wife and I were doing some painting last summer, and had to remove some items from our china cabinet, prior to moving it. As we were taking things out, there was the box with the LS champaigne flutes, still safely packed away. That was a classy touch! And then I sometimes go in the basement, to check something out in my "library", and there are the factory shop manuals that I bought for the car...still there.
Also in Ausie trim there are lots of engine options and and hi-po versions on the drawing board.
But is there any soul left at Lincoln?
The LS players have been re-purposed. It needs to be a viable alternative to and Audi, Lexus, BMW, Benz etc... Not just bling but the real thing.
Take the old LS and look at the god and the bad.
I like the new CTS-V coupe but I Don't like having to have 550 hp! Give me 300~350 and all the neat Recaros and all the luxo cool Lincoln comforts. Offer lots of options and engine packages...even a hybrid and clean diesel. If Lincoln is to succeed they have to come out with the guns a blazin'!
Lincoln just hired a large team of folks to help relaunch the brand (around 85 people IIRC) and about half of them came from other luxury brands like Audi, MB, etc.
People who have seen the new MKZ say it looks like an Aston Martin. The LS was a one-trick pony with a faulty business case and a non-supportive corporate structure. It appears Ford is serious about resurrecting Lincoln and they're doing it the right way from the ground up starting with the dealers and the dealer experience.
BTW - Ford wasn't forced to sell Jag/LR/Volvo/AM to raise funds. Ford sold them to focus all their efforts (and capital) on the Ford brand. It worked. I expect the same success for Lincoln but you'll have to wait a year or two to see the results.
Only time will tell what Ford can make of Lincoln and if they can come up with another car like the LS. The LS was that special Lincoln, like the 1980s Mark VII, that had people taking notice, even if for only a too brief period of time.
Too bad Ford's management let the wheels fall off the company. Ford was heavily in debt in 2009 and lost about $14.5 billion in 2008. They'd lost money in 2006 & 2007. As President and CEO Mulally stated in the 2009 annual report (eating a lot of humbe pie), "Our intense focus on improving our cost structure and strengthening our balance sheet will continue going forward. Among other actionss, we anticipate completing the sale of Volvo Cars to Zhejiang Geely Holding Group Co. Ltd in the second quarter of 2010." And as he points out, part 3 of his 4 point plan is "Finance our plan and improve our balance sheet." Jaguar, LR, AM, etc. had been offloaded earlier when Ford's financial times were even more dire. They and Volvo were sold to raise money to clean up Ford's financial mess and keep the company solvent. Today Ford is still aggressively attempting to reduce debt and save on high interest payment costs due to borrowing in the recent dark years. Unlike Ford, GM and Chrysler used bankruptcy to clean up their debts and reduce interest payments.
Right now Lincoln just doesn't have any cars that are really exciting. Lincoln has fallen way behind Cadillac in the "wow" factor and Lincoln doesn't really seem to be competing with BMW, MB, Audi, Lexus, or Infiniti. Unfortunately, Lincoln, unlike Jaguar, LR, or Volvo, is not a viable worldwide brand, focusing mainly on USA and Canada. Would take a massive long-term expenditure to make Lincoln competitive in Europe or China.
I drove my LS over 100,000 miles while waiting for Lincoln (or Ford) to build something else I could get excited about. My LS was pretty problem free until the 100k mark. At that point, some of the usual suspects arrived - failed ignition coils and heated seat elements.
Lincoln needs more compelling (and more excitingly designed) product for sure but their current image may be an even more difficult problem to solve. They have their work cut out for them to turn that ship around.
Frankly, I am surprised and disappointed that the MKS ecoboost has not been more successful. It is a better car than most people give it credit for. Aside from the Lincoln image, I think a big problem with it is that it was a compromise thrown together by previous management. The older pure luxury buyers think the ride is too firm and they don't the limited trunk access and the rear seat room. Younger sports sedan buyers think it is too soft and ponderous to drive. I like the way it looks and get tons of compliments on mine but most people seem to just yawn at the styling. I have never heard any complaints about the ecoboost engine, though - it flat-assed rocks.
I would like to see the MKS go more distinctly to the soft luxury side - put it on the longer MKT wheelbase, lengthen out the trunk a bit and reduce the front overhang. A driver-adjustable suspension with settings a bit softer and a bit firmer than the current car would be good. Of course, I would also like to see Lincoln introduce a proper RWD sedan with a more sporting flavor.
The next 2-3 years will be interesting now that there is a real effort to bring Lincoln back to relevance.
I can remember the excitement back in 1999 and 2000. Just re-read the old Edmunds, MT, C&D, & R&T comparison. The early LS gave you a 5 Series car at a 3 Series price! It was a Jaguar sibling. (And you could get a manual transmission.) This was something exciting. That was why so many of us were so passionate about it. The only other Fords in the 20 years before that which had excited me were the Merkur XR4ti, Lincoln Mark VII LSC, and the hot rod V8 LTD (not the Crown Vic) sport model (forget what this 1-year model was labelled: LX?).
The LS held its head high proudly in a competitive market. It could compete. On performance. Looks. Equipment/options. Price.
Anyone remember the Cadillac Catera? A gussied up Opel! Wasn't it the Caddy that zigged? Something about a duck in its ads? The LS walked all over it! But Cadillac learned, created the CTS, and look who is being walked all over now? Lincoln!
See in today's Wall Street Journal an article on Jaguar/Land Rover and Volvo. Jag made $443 million for Tata in 4th Qtr of 2010 on the basis of all the time and money Ford sank into it before selling it off. JagLR's worldwide sales up 19%.
Love the car overall still. Handling is wonderful even though this year model lacks a little power compared to the 2005 engines.
I attended the LS Mania in Irvine for those who were there and/or heard about it. Came in second place behind Brain Beckman. Lincoln was happening in those days all due to Jim Rogers, head of Lincoln.
My wife and I truly enjoyed our LS, but 9 northeastern winters were starting to show their wear on the car. I was starting to see rust in the rear quarters, where the inner fenderwells and outer panels meet. Once it gets in there, you've got issues. Secondly, although we had put only 60,000 miles on the car, some of the wear items like shocks, were needing replacement, some of the heater/AC control lights were shot, and one of the door lock modules had quit working. Parts were never plentiful or inexpensive, even when Lincoln was making the car, so I was looking at the handwriting on the wall, and it didn't look good, so I sent it down the road 2 years ago.
Ironically, although I thought I had "resigned" from the "other place" when I sold the LS, I got a renewal e-mail from them a couple of days ago. They said if I didn't send my dues, I'd be dropped....I thought they did that last year! It's good to see that some of the old gang is still around, and doing reasonably well.
Cheers!!
2) Does noise change when cornering? (Even on X-Way you may find a difference)
3) If you've mis-spelled the issue, and it should be "whining" check trunk for presence of ex wife.
#'s 1 & 2 are serious.
I'd offer to sell you my shop manuals, since I no longer need them, but this forum doesn't allow that kind of communication....
B1869 Lamp Airbag Warning Circuit Warning Indicator Circuit Open
B1932 Driver Airbag Resistance High
P1575 Seed Control Command Switch Out of Range
P1788 High Pressure Control Solenoid B Open Circuit
So far I changed the Driver Wheel airbag and Airbag clockspring. My horn and steering wheel controls are working fine but I still get the Traction Control Light and the airbag chimes. I am also still getting the B1869 and B1932 codes.
Any idea on these codes? And the traction control?
Ford may have revised your model year regulators so, it's a good idea to be sure you are getting a late or FRESH part and not something that has been sitting around.
My thinking on them is, find a good parts house and just get the better of the after market brand since Ford doesn't bother to require quality parts in this area as they break all the time. Cheap is cheap so, pay cheap and get the same junk Ford pushes. These regulators are failing way too soon and to often.
My 2001 LS manual has 135000 miles on it. I've never done anything under the hood cept change oil and filters. It has developed a very slight miss, with no engine light. Otherwise runs like new. I bought 6 plugs but got a big surprise when I looked at replacing them. This ain't my Dad's (or even my) 390 where I could pull and replace 8 plugs in about 15 minutes. Course that 390 couldn't go 135000 before it's first tuneup eh?
So, it appears I need to pull off 2 intake plenums (or manifolds?) and move associated hosing etc b4 I can get to all the plugs, which are then hidden by the individual coils on each plug.
I'll be also replacing the PCV valve and will look closely at connecting hoses etc for cracks or leaks.
My questions are 2:
1) Since the COPS (coil-on-plugs) are anywhere from $54 to $120 (thus $324 to $720 a set), I'd like to NOT replace any of them. But since I would need to pull the plenums again and replace the gaskets again (appx $50-100 a set plus time etc) if one fails soon, this might be good insurance. Opinions?
2) Looking for other opinions, I tried to rejoin the 'Other' site. However, though it is there, I get no response to emails or the application form. Wondering if anyone here knows if it is dead or alive?
Thanks
When these engines misfire, 99% of the time it is the spark plug well gasket which is round and a gasket all of it's own for each spark plug port so there's a total of 8 of them plus the actual valve cover gaskets. You have to order the "gasket set" to get the spark plug gaskets. Also, once you are doing this, it's a good practice to replace the spark plug/coil boot or at least clean them, they are silicone based so they will clean easy.
Another item to consider on the V-8 at this time is, once you have the valve covers off for the above job, be sure to check the secondary timing chain and sliders. The sliders are nylon plastic and will prematurely fail which causes too much chain slack and/or pieces of the slider or tensioner gets wedged between the chain and sprocket which can cause a slipped sprocket issue and cause the valves to hit the pistons.
The primary timing chains and tensioners on the front of the engine are also prone to this same premature wear however, they are located on the front of the engine block and are a completely different process to change. Valve covers are not easy to remove, especially the drivers side and the front timing chain job requires major disassembly of the front components to access them.
Hard to believe this crap is still ongoing with late model engines. It makes you think the engineers almost design these flaws to occur to keep all the mechanics and dealerships employed.
If you're taking off the manifold to replace plugs, I'd at least change the four coils that are buried under there so you don't have to remove it again.
One clarification - I don't have the V8, I have the V6 with manual tranny
So it sounds like I'm on the right track? I have not been able to determine if there's any oil leaking around the plugs. Will know soon enuf. I do plan to replace the plugs with motorcraft (already purchased); the valve cover gaskets with Felpro (local quote for gasket set is $52.25) and of course the plenum or manifold or whatever gaskets (local quote for set is $50.82). Do these sound like reasonable numbers? I want to try to avoid having to leave the job in the middle and drive 30 mins to parts store for stuff that I still need and find that they need a few days to get em. (OK, I'll call first!)
Am also going to replace the PCV valve and I guess I should bite the bullet and replace the 3 coils that are inaccessible unless I remove the plenums or manifolds or whatever. (Wish I had a service manual.) Coils are $53.81 locally. All these parts are supposed to be NAPA brands and not 'Chinese' brands. Oh, also will clean or replace the coil boots.
Thanks and post more info if I'm off track.
But when I saw the Lincoln LS I FELL IN LOVE and now I REALLY want one!
anyway I need a new engine in the P.O.S I have now and have decided to use the $1200 cash I have saved for that as a Down payment instead. SO
I have been car shopping since February & have found a Black (the color I WANT!) 02 LS with 100522 miles on it for $9000.00(witch is kind of alot of $MONEY$ 2 me cuz I aint RICH)
BUT I need a GOOD, Reliable car and I am willing to forgo MY WANTS for MY NEEDS, and I really dont want to just take the "sales guys" WORD for it, and I've read some really GOOD reviews and some NOT SO GOOD reviews but they all gave the car 4 out of 5 to, 5 out of 5 marks witch is kinda of confusing, so any first hand/hands on INFO on this issue would be MUCH APPRECIATED!
Thank You,
150,000 mile on it for $4000 straight up, the car-fax is clean, and runs good, so I'm just gonna go ahead and buy it, if My mechanic don't kill my buzz( :lemon:) so thanks for or Your Time & Advice.
Then I pulld the third one. Oh well, 2 out of 3 aint bad. THe coil boot was covered with oil and the plug recess is full of it. I thought for a few minutes I was one of the lucky ones who would not have to replace valve cover gaskets. Fat chance, huh? SO I'm off to the parts store. Hope I can finish this today, else the wife has to take my Navigator tomorrow.
Hey George.....
And to all and Mike -
briefreport on my 'tuneup' exploits.I got er done, though it took a week. Glad we have 2 vehicles. It took so long because: 1)I'm not the world's best mechanic; 2)I didn't have a shop manual when I started and consequently broke something I may not have broken had I the manual. I did purchase a 30 day access to a shop manual at helminc for $20 after that. Glad I did. 3) The thing I broke took a while to come in at local Ford dealer (no local Lincoln dealer anymore.) 4) Job was a bit harder than I anticipated. 5) Had to buy or borrow a couple of tools. Deep sockets mainly.
So what I broke was a little bitty hose nipple which comes out of the upper radiator hose and goes to the throttle body. Course there's no way to fix a broken nipple so I had to buy - the whole GD upper radiator hose assembly!!! :mad: It included no fewer than 5 hoses and connections as well as a new thermostat. $301.00 plus tax. Ugh. I also had to buy a new PCV valve hose assembly as the little plastic feet broke off when removing from the valve covers. $25.00
Anyway, I replaced the plugs. The two rear wells had oil in em. I did not replace any coils, but I did replace all the coil boots. I replaced the valve cover gaskets and I replaced the PCV valve. Which caused me some more headaches cause I had to remove the lower manifold to get to it. Arghh. So then I replaced the lower and upper manifold gaskets. I would have been done then were it not for the broken nipple. So then I set about replacing the upper radiator hose assembly. And I figured since I had real easy access at this point, I also replaced the serpentine belt. That was far easier than expected. I thought about replacing the lower radiator hose as well for preventive maintenance but that's as far as I got with that.
So I got her all back together and fired it up. Took 3 tries before it caught and she ran smooth as a top. Really running great. But I did and maybe still do have a slight issue - it overheated first time I took it out on a hot day. Interestingly it overheated right in the driveway of speedie oil change. (I was too all-in to jack it up and change the oil :sick: So while they were changing the oil, their mechanic came over cause he liked the car-especially the manual tranny
OK, TMI perhaps but there it is. I still need to take the 'new' t'stat to Ford and see what they'll do for me if anything.
Summary - was worth it cause car runs like new again. Was not fun though and cost about $600 with half of that being the darn hose.
Wish me luck on the overheating issue and talk soon all.
G
First, I just advise anyone except really experienced mechanics to get the shop manual or something equiv. I only got a 30 day subscription at Helm. I need to buy the real thng next time.
Anyway, I finally solved the little issue that came up after I did the tune up and replaced the upper radiator hose assembly and more. As I mentioned, it overheated on me first time I drove it hard afterward. This was first ever overheat. I dont know the cause for sure, but I put the old thermostat back in and re-bled the system and it hasn't overheated since. I sort-of bench tested the new thermostat which came with the hose assembly and it seems OK to me. So I must assume that I did not bleed it correctly the first time. At least I now have a spare T-stat!
In any case, after all this, the car would lose some coolant from the degas bottle area after a hard drive and shutdown. Not much, but had to be solved. The heat and pressure from the overheat must have opened something up. I could not see the cause until I finally tore into the thing to get the degas bottle out which required removal of wipers and cowl and cross-member and finally the engine end of the degas bottom hose. The leak was around that bottom hose at the bottle. I suspect that replacing the factory spring-type hose clamp with a screw-tight type clamp would have solved the problem. However I could see that some corrosion inside the bottle had eaten away at the interior hose and metal stuff - there were actually bits of metal stuck in the small overflow pipe at the top - plus it looked like a crack might be forming - anyway, I replaced the bottle ($100 !!!) and the hose and she's tight as a drum now. Bottle came with a new cap which seems a lot surer than the old one. WTH, it was 10 years old after all. We plan to keep this car another 10 years, knock wood, my wife and I love it.
So yesterday I measured mpg on a 300 mile trip at 75-80 mph on the highway, and it was 85% highway and the number is just shy of 25mpg, which I feel is pretty darn good. And the thing really kicks it too. Winding it up over 5 grand in first and second is great fun in this manual tranny relic of a Lincoln.
Later.
I had all that work done before my daughter inherited my 2000 V6. It now has over 175K miles and is running strong. I have to replace the compressor as she didn't run it and the seal dried out and leaked out all the R-134a. We actually have 3 LSes. My wife and I each have a 2006 and, like I said, my daughter has my old 2000. The '06s are everything the LS should be. They are excellent handlers (like you didn't already know....) and the V8 is something to be experienced! It is so much quicker than the V6 and doesn't run out of steam as soon. We just took a trip to Oregon and the computer says I averaged 22.1mpg over the ~2800 miles. Not bad for a V8 with the trunk loaded and my driving style. Weird, but nothing else floats my boat for a replacement. My LS has ~80K miles and my wife's about 56K. At this rate we'll be driving the LSes for quite some time!
This board is deader than Elvis -- 60 posts all year so far. A fair number of the old timers chime in from time to time though.