Is it quantity or quality? I stopped by a couple of the leading forums the other day (CTS & Protege, I think) and found that most of the CTS posts were people insulting each other, and the Protege posts were people talking about their houses, prices, and interest rates. lol
so, what would I need to do to get xm? Sounds like I'd need a receiver, an antenna, and installation charge, and a monthly fee? In my case we'd probably be talking $400 plus the monthly. I can buy a LOT of CDRs for that price.
No argument here! The initial "jumping in" cost is high, around $400.00 is right on. The payoff is not having to find all that music and then spend the time burning all those CD-R's. Then again with XM, you don't have immediate access to exactly what you want to hear either. Even with 100+ channels, it's not like you can go directly to your favorite songs. Ultimately, having both options is the way to go, and since I'm a crazed car maniac and audiophile as well (according to my wife and she's NEVER wrong!), I have both to choose from.
How about this? You DRIVE to Buffalo. Stay at our house. All the beer (Canadian or American) beer you can drink. Grilled steak. Work on the M, or not, your choice. Free Miata rides. What do you think? Russ:-)
A few weeks back I posted about a DC dealer charging $35.95 labor to replace a fuse in my wife's Caravan. (Prior post). I politely complained to the service writer, and I just received a check in the mail for $35.95. A classy decision on their part. This was not the dealer where I bought my M (I've been generally pleased with that dealer's service).
I just called Pepboys for a price on front rotors for my nonphp M---for the Raybestos brand, he quoted me $49.95---it sounds high to me---anyone know if thats about right for one rotor
www.oem-car-parts.com, who normally have very good prices, want $49.95 per rotor. The "list" price is $57.00. They seem to differentiate between ABS and non-ABS so make sure to ask. The $49.95 that you were quoted appears reasonable based on this information.
Has anyone here actually installed those "extra cushioning" thingies CC mails to you? I had heard about the "recall" on the boards months ago, but when they arrived on April 1st I really thought it was an April's Fools Joke! The letter that came with them said something like "...and they double as a handy storage area for sunglasses!" They have got to be kidding! The sharp clips look like they can tear the headliner easily.
I tossed 'em.
I figure my head is hard enough not to need any cushioning!!
is that price you got for oem parts---the one I got is for Raybestos brand---I would think pepboys should be less than dealer oem brand-
my rotors are warped on the front but not so much to make much of a braking difference except for the pulsation---my pads are still fine at 32k--this is the longest I have ever gone ---I usually need new pads at about 22k---and I still have about 10k left on the fronts and maybe 15k left on rears--
I do not plan on getting one. I get radio stations fine and with my 7 disk storage music is not a problem even for trips to LA. Plus I can't see the $400 dollar price tag that is more than I paid for my new Alpine Head unit, plus the extra useage charge. If I ever have to drive to Hawaii then I may get one glub, glub.
A while back someone mentioned they damaged their back of the front seat. Here is a website of a repair kit. I have not ever used this company, so can not say how good they are.
The site for that OBD II unit had the following information:
"NOTE: Federal law requires that all 1996 and newer cars and light trucks sold in the United States must be OBD II compliant; this includes all Domestic, Asian and European vehicles."
I checked under the hood and the information sticker at the front of the engine says the car is "OBD II compliant". It might mean that the car meets some set of minimum requirements for OBD II, but the OBD III provides much more information. Maybe otto or wire2 (or family) can chime in.
I checked the Kragen Auto web site and found the Rabestos rotors (part 76722) for $46 for the non-phg, and $43 for the PHG (76777) on the fronts. The rears (76316) don't differentiate between PHG and non-PHG, and they're $49 each. Check www.kragen.com and enter your car information.
Will allow you to change the computer to adjust for different tire sizes, gearing, and engine perameters, removing the speed limiter. So to change the computer information you need a III model to diagnostics, the II will do.
So, the OBD II will suffice for telling me why the "check engine" light went on in my wife's van the other day...or at least spit out some codes that I could then use to start tracking down the problem. Maybe it's worth $169 for that...maybe not. Maybe we should have a "San Diego Club Member OBD II" on hand for member use.
I think the III would be dangerous in most hands...especially mine. I'm sure the first time I'd plug it in and hit a couple of buttons I'd somehow render my car totally inoperable. My car computer would think it was a microwave oven or something.
I'd like to hear from the 300M Special owners if they have tried using regular or mid-grade fuel and what your results were. We're looking for a 300M with the PHP and so far are only able to find a Special. The price is workable, but I don't really need all the extras and having to use premium is a negative. Your thoughts, please?
You don't have to use Premium fuel. The Special has the same engine and basic tuning as the normal M, it's just rated at 5 horsepower more when Premium is used, much like many Hondas. You can use Regular and shouldn't notice any degradation in performance. We had a regular 00' M and used both Premium once or twice in the beginning and then went to nothing but 87 and noticed very little, if any difference.
If the price on a Special is workable, go for it!! Why have the "normal" (though still very special!) 300M when you can have the Euro-tuner like version? What color is it?
Our church is M-central. There used to be our 00' Slate/Agate with chromes, there's a 99' Candy Apple Red/Camel with chromes, a 00' Silver/Agate with chromes, a 01' Inferno Red/Sandstone with silver wheels, a 01' Deep Sapphire/Sandstone with silver wheels, a 99' Slate/Agate with chromes, gold emblems, and the Medallions on the wheels. And, there's also our neighbor's immaculate 00' Lt. Cypress/Peal Beige with chromes.
And then today, an older couple pulled in in their new 02' Onyx Green/Lt. Taupe with chromes, Lux. Grp., sunroof, big stereo, and full spare. I know this because it's from the dealer that we used to take our M to and I looked at it before. Boy, does the Onyx Green with Taupe look nice!!
If only the Avalanche wasn't so silky smooth, silent, rattle-free, and roomy...
beach15 - The Special we looked at is silver with slate gray interior. I asked about the possible difference in engines because the order code for engine in the Special is EGK and in the others the code is EGG. The brochure lists the engines separately, making a point of saying the Special is rated using premium fuel, and doesn't say the Special will run satisfactory on regular or mid-grade. The other engine entry says "will run safely and satisfactorily on regular unleaded fuel".
Are the increases of 5 HP and 7 lb/ft of torque in the Special due to the use of premium fuel? Does the Special have different chip software?
Just like you said, the normal 300M says this: Horsepower 250@6,400* Torque 250@3,900* *When using Midgrade fuel. This engine will operate safely and satisfactorily on regular unleaded.
For the 300M Special: Horsepower 255@6,500* Torque 257@3,900* *When using premium fuel.
So, knowing that regular is 87, midgrade is 89, and premium is 92/93, I take it to mean that while the normal M will run its best with midgrade, it will run just fine on regular. As for the Special, using the same logic, it will run its best on premium but will run just fine on midgrade. As for using regular, there are no differences in the engine (chip, compression ratio, etc.) that would mean regular wouldn't work well in the Special. In truth, the only differences between a regular M and a Special are that the Special has different transmission gears (from the 2.7 V6).
The extra 5 horses and 7lb-ft of torque are mainly from using Premium in the engine.
Nice car! Have you drive it yet? Love the exhaust and cool look? __________________________________________________ Hey guys, you with Specials, what do you use as far as gas?
I'm skeptical that any change in octane can really increase HP to any noticeable extent...
But then I really don't think any of the things we do, i.e. spark plugs, intake mods, chips, etc. have that much of an effect. Maybe the dual exhaust mod. *Maybe*
I'd like to see actual dyno tests. I just don't think end user mods can make that much of an difference with today's engines. Just my 2 cents,
Keep checking back. There are two people who post on this board that actually work in the factory where the car is built, and they can provide insight into the engine differences. There are also several Special owners that use this board frequently.
In my *unprofessional* opinion, it's unlikely that you'll get 5 hp and 7 lb/ft of torque out of just using premium gas. The octane of gas controls the point at which the air/gas mixture combusts. The higher the octane, the later the combustion. That's why increasing the octane of the gas you use can help control knocking, also called "pre-ignition" in cars. So, my *guess* is that the Special's engine is tuned so that the optimal combustion point is attained using premium gas, and using a lesser grade will result in a less-than-optimal combustion given the engine settings. It's these settings, along with the computer, that can eek out an extra couple of HP and lb/ft of torque. The engine control compters are flexible enough to adjust the spark to compensate for almost any kind of gas you put in a car (unless you put stresses on it like running a sea level car at altitude where the air is thin), so the car will likely run ok on lower grades of gas. However, my guess is that the motor and computer has been tuned for the higher grade, and that using something lower will result in a small performance degradation. Will it be noticable? Probably not.
Toms99 - I agree for the most part. Used to be you could take a small block engine and squeeze 25% more ponies out of it. Today's engines are so computerized and efficient that it's hard to make much difference. However, I can tell you that with all of my mods combined (intake, duals, plugs) my car is noticably faster than stock. A lot faster? no. But did I have fun doing it? yep!
Mike, I don't know your age, but I am 47. As a High School and College kid I had the following cars:
67 Firebird Convertible (400 cubic inches, Hurst shifter, 4:11 gears, L-60 tires in the back, mags, etc......Oh yeah...I also added an after market 8-track player!)
69 Mustang Mach I (351 Cleveland engine)
That's how I learned about cars. Heck, I spun the timing chain of that Firebird and had to take apart the whole damn engine...(The pistons actually hit the valves!)
I really haven't done too much with any car I have purchased since 1990. (Except drive 'em!)
I think there is a whole generation that is trying to do what we did with our American made muscle cars, only they seem to specialize in putting yellow stickers on Japanese imports!
I'm only a little behind you...I'm 40. There was a ton we could do to make those big V8s more powerful and efficient, and all pretty easily relatively speaking. I think the only things you can do today to make cars perform a LOT better is make radical changes like turbocharging, nitrous, major gearing changes, and stuff like that. There is no 2002 equivalent to a 4 barrel. Then again, how many STOCK engines could produce one hp per cubic inch like our Ms do?
Oh..believe it or not, there are still some classic rock songs that when I hear them I still expect them to pause in the middle to switch tracks! )
Anyone interested in having a little meet (after we get all the salt an crap off our cars maybe June)I don't know how many members we have in the area but I would be willing to drive down maybe nothern Illinois somewhere if we have someone around there to host it.I'll throw this out here and see what happens.Not on the web much but will check back and see if there is any interest BOB
I have seen lots of photos of the "official" Mopar cellphone holder, and have always thought that it was a bit too large, a bit too out of reach, and a bit too intrusive of the front passenger area.
Back in December I bought my wife a new 2001 Concorde as a Christmas present. This was a new "leftover", the old pre-LHS style Concorde. Although a leftover, it came with every option my wife wanted, and she loves the car. But it came with "standard" steel wheels and plastic wheel-covers that I could not stand. So within a week I put on a set of 5 spoke aluminum alloy Primax wheels:
are you just clipping onto that leather case---I would think the phone would wobble and possibly fall off on rough roads---
my solution: I just removed the ashtray insert and my Ericcson internet phone fits in just fine--and as a bonus you have a charging station with the lighter being right next to it--works for me---
black (or is it steel blue) looks great --dark colors are just very hard to keep clean---get one of those california dusters and gets some Zaino! Those wheels look great and the brakes shouldnt overheat too easily with those wide open spaces between the spoke
what does it have for options-- is it the LX or LXI model---what was the bottom line $
To tell you the truth, it's been so long (December) that I can't remember too well! My wife drives it all the time so I don't recall all the options. It is an LX...my wife prefers cloth seats anyway.
I remember doing research here at Edmunds and other places for a fair price. I had a good price in mind, but let the dealer quote me his "best" price first. Turns out it was actually about $300 under mine so we signed the papers pretty quickly! I think it also had something to do with the fact that it was the same place I bought my LHS. I also got over $6K for my wife's 95 Chevy Lumina in trade.
OH! BTW...the pic may not show it but the car is not black...it is actually a deep blue.
The manual for the Special is the same as for the standard M's. DC recommends use of 89 grade fuel for best performance but use of 87 is acceptable.
The Special gets most of its extra 5hp from the lower restriction exhaust system. The better off the line performance comes from the lower final gearing in the transmission.
Will using 87 grade fuel make any noticable difference? It could depending on your driving habits since the engine computer will retard timing if excessive engine knock is detected during operation. But that would only be under extreme conditions, not normal driving.
From experience, having the Euro spec suspension and brakes on the car makes a signficant difference in the vehicle and I wouldn't trade it. Some people prefer the wood trim over the carbon fiber, but I happen to like it. It's really a matter of what you prefer.
The place I work got a low cost OBD II scan tool in and my boss offered to let me take it home and try it out.
I plugged it into both the Special and our Jeep Grand Cherokee. While it was interesting clicking through the various modes to see what was up. I found one annoying quirk: The tool would lose communications with the network on both vehicles. I'd then have to press the reconnect button to get data again. I would imagine that a more costly, or vehicle specific OBD tool wouldn't have that problem.
If you can wait until August, and drive a bit further, we are having a to-die-for meet in Detroit at Woodward Dream Cruise 2002. It will be the weekend of August 9th, followed by a tour of the 300M plant in Brampton, Ontario on Monday, August 12. Now that's a meet!
>The extra 5 horses and 7lb-ft of torque are >mainly from using Premium in the engine.
I'm told by people in the plant it's a combo of free flow intake, and, as mentioned, exhaust.
>Then again, how many STOCK engines could produce >one hp per cubic inch like our Ms do?
It's better than that. 3.5 liters is approx. 210 cu inches for 250hp. But it's not a completely valid comparison, pushrod to overhead cam technology, (like apples to oranges).
What's the best tire dressings you guys use? I've been searching for years and still haven't gotten the results I want. Last week I even ordered a $10 bottle of Eimann Fabrik Black Opal tire dressing after it was recommended to me, and it did give a nice gloss but didn't look good up close, "slinged" back all over the place, and lasted very shortly. As such, I've just gone back to the very quick and very easy STP Son of a Gun tire foam that we've used for years, and while it doesn't last long, it gives a better look, more satin-like and clean.
I need something that lasts for a good period of time, is quick and easy, and gives a deep black, satiny finish on the tires without costing an arm and a leg. Any ideas?
Kosh_2258, beach15 and others - Thanks for your inputs on the Special. We went down and took another look at one today while the dealer was closed. We are going to go back over the figures tomorrow and see if we can make a deal.
I got your email on the possible headlight conversion to HID. I will let you know later this week after I check into it. One question though, do you want the hid for low or high beams.
I need to know what is the maximum 20" Wheel width that we can fit on our car, and if 245/45-20's will fit ok ? Anyone know ? Also out bolt pattern is 5x114.3 right ?
Comments
http://www.codereader.com
Their prices sound really reasonable.
You DRIVE to Buffalo.
Stay at our house.
All the beer (Canadian or American) beer you can drink.
Grilled steak.
Work on the M, or not, your choice.
Free Miata rides.
What do you think?
Russ:-)
M
I tossed 'em.
I figure my head is hard enough not to need any cushioning!!
my rotors are warped on the front but not so much to make much of a braking difference except for the pulsation---my pads are still fine at 32k--this is the longest I have ever gone ---I usually need new pads at about 22k---and I still have about 10k left on the fronts and maybe 15k left on rears--
http://glennbp.bizland.com/glenns300m/id1.html
They are at the bottom of the page.
http://www.leatherrepairkits.com
"NOTE: Federal law requires that all 1996 and newer cars and light trucks sold in the
United States must be OBD II compliant; this includes all Domestic, Asian and
European vehicles."
I checked under the hood and the information sticker at the front of the engine says the car is "OBD II compliant". It might mean that the car meets some set of minimum requirements for OBD II, but the OBD III provides much more information. Maybe otto or wire2 (or family) can chime in.
http://personal.atl.bellsouth.net/jax/p/s/pskirch/P1010014engine.jpg
If the price on a Special is workable, go for it!! Why have the "normal" (though still very special!) 300M when you can have the Euro-tuner like version? What color is it?
And then today, an older couple pulled in in their new 02' Onyx Green/Lt. Taupe with chromes, Lux. Grp., sunroof, big stereo, and full spare. I know this because it's from the dealer that we used to take our M to and I looked at it before. Boy, does the Onyx Green with Taupe look nice!!
If only the Avalanche wasn't so silky smooth, silent, rattle-free, and roomy...
Are the increases of 5 HP and 7 lb/ft of torque in the Special due to the use of premium fuel? Does the Special have different chip software?
Horsepower 250@6,400*
Torque 250@3,900*
*When using Midgrade fuel. This engine will operate safely and satisfactorily on regular unleaded.
For the 300M Special:
Horsepower 255@6,500*
Torque 257@3,900*
*When using premium fuel.
So, knowing that regular is 87, midgrade is 89, and premium is 92/93, I take it to mean that while the normal M will run its best with midgrade, it will run just fine on regular. As for the Special, using the same logic, it will run its best on premium but will run just fine on midgrade. As for using regular, there are no differences in the engine (chip, compression ratio, etc.) that would mean regular wouldn't work well in the Special. In truth, the only differences between a regular M and a Special are that the Special has different transmission gears (from the 2.7 V6).
The extra 5 horses and 7lb-ft of torque are mainly from using Premium in the engine.
Nice car! Have you drive it yet? Love the exhaust and cool look?
__________________________________________________
Hey guys, you with Specials, what do you use as far as gas?
But then I really don't think any of the things we do, i.e. spark plugs, intake mods, chips, etc. have that much of an effect. Maybe the dual exhaust mod. *Maybe*
I'd like to see actual dyno tests. I just don't think end user mods can make that much of an difference with today's engines. Just my 2 cents,
In my *unprofessional* opinion, it's unlikely that you'll get 5 hp and 7 lb/ft of torque out of just using premium gas. The octane of gas controls the point at which the air/gas mixture combusts. The higher the octane, the later the combustion. That's why increasing the octane of the gas you use can help control knocking, also called "pre-ignition" in cars. So, my *guess* is that the Special's engine is tuned so that the optimal combustion point is attained using premium gas, and using a lesser grade will result in a less-than-optimal combustion given the engine settings. It's these settings, along with the computer, that can eek out an extra couple of HP and lb/ft of torque. The engine control compters are flexible enough to adjust the spark to compensate for almost any kind of gas you put in a car (unless you put stresses on it like running a sea level car at altitude where the air is thin), so the car will likely run ok on lower grades of gas. However, my guess is that the motor and computer has been tuned for the higher grade, and that using something lower will result in a small performance degradation. Will it be noticable? Probably not.
Toms99 - I agree for the most part. Used to be you could take a small block engine and squeeze 25% more ponies out of it. Today's engines are so computerized and efficient that it's hard to make much difference. However, I can tell you that with all of my mods combined (intake, duals, plugs) my car is noticably faster than stock. A lot faster? no. But did I have fun doing it? yep!
67 Firebird Convertible (400 cubic inches, Hurst shifter, 4:11 gears, L-60 tires in the back, mags, etc......Oh yeah...I also added an after market 8-track player!)
69 Mustang Mach I (351 Cleveland engine)
That's how I learned about cars. Heck, I spun the timing chain of that Firebird and had to take apart the whole damn engine...(The pistons actually hit the valves!)
I really haven't done too much with any car I have purchased since 1990. (Except drive 'em!)
I think there is a whole generation that is trying to do what we did with our American made muscle cars, only they seem to specialize in putting yellow stickers on Japanese imports!
Oh..believe it or not, there are still some classic rock songs that when I hear them I still expect them to pause in the middle to switch tracks!
BOB
Here's a pic of my solution:
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/tsokol5/images/cellphone.jpg
OK...now here's the "hi-tech" solution revealed:
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/tsokol5/images/cellholder.jpg
Yep....a bent paper clip!
(damn fussy server!)
http://mywebpages.comcast.net/tsokol5/images/Concorde01.JPG
What do you all think?
Toms99
99LHS
01Concorde
ALL MOPAR!
my solution: I just removed the ashtray insert and my Ericcson internet phone fits in just fine--and as a bonus you have a charging station with the lighter being right next to it--works for me---
what does it have for options-- is it the LX or LXI model---what was the bottom line $
To tell you the truth, it's been so long (December) that I can't remember too well! My wife drives it all the time so I don't recall all the options. It is an LX...my wife prefers cloth seats anyway.
I remember doing research here at Edmunds and other places for a fair price. I had a good price in mind, but let the dealer quote me his "best" price first. Turns out it was actually about $300 under mine so we signed the papers pretty quickly! I think it also had something to do with the fact that it was the same place I bought my LHS. I also got over $6K for my wife's 95 Chevy Lumina in trade.
OH! BTW...the pic may not show it but the car is not black...it is actually a deep blue.
Toms99
The Special gets most of its extra 5hp from the lower restriction exhaust system. The better off the line performance comes from the lower final gearing in the transmission.
Will using 87 grade fuel make any noticable difference? It could depending on your driving habits since the engine computer will retard timing if excessive engine knock is detected during operation. But that would only be under extreme conditions, not normal driving.
From experience, having the Euro spec suspension and brakes on the car makes a signficant difference in the vehicle and I wouldn't trade it. Some people prefer the wood trim over the carbon fiber, but I happen to like it. It's really a matter of what you prefer.
I bought a set of Konig Tantrum 17 x 8 wheels for my 300M. I also much prefer painted or natural aluminum wheels rather than chrome.
Here's a link to the wheels I bought.
http://www.discounttire.com/dtc/findWheelSizesByBrand.do?step=sizes&index=16
I plugged it into both the Special and our Jeep Grand Cherokee. While it was interesting clicking through the various modes to see what was up. I found one annoying quirk: The tool would lose communications with the network on both vehicles. I'd then have to press the reconnect button to get data again. I would imagine that a more costly, or vehicle specific OBD tool wouldn't have that problem.
It will be the weekend of August 9th, followed by a tour of the 300M plant in Brampton, Ontario on Monday, August 12.
Now that's a meet!
you California folks might find interesting.
http://www.asashop.org/autoinc/may/obd_iii_new.cfm
I'm told by people in the plant it's a combo of free flow intake, and, as mentioned, exhaust.
>Then again, how many STOCK engines could produce >one hp per cubic inch like our Ms do?
It's better than that. 3.5 liters is approx. 210 cu inches for 250hp. But it's not a completely valid comparison, pushrod to overhead cam technology, (like apples to oranges).
I need something that lasts for a good period of time, is quick and easy, and gives a deep black, satiny finish on the tires without costing an arm and a leg. Any ideas?
Thanks guys !