Chrysler 300M

blonda

What's with all the contradictions on that review? First of all they said the Special should have been included in the sport sedan comparison -- why wasn't it? Then they said the regular M with the luxury package was actually more luxurious than the Special (no kidding) -- so why didn't they test that one? It seems like they are purposely putting the wrong M in the wrong category (or not at all) so they can trash the American car (as usual).

They bad mouthed the rear seat comfort and exitability, yet if you look at the final scores it rates #1 for comfort and tied for #1 on exitability. And how can they put the exterior styling second to the Passat?

They did catch all the cheapening Chrysler did. I wasn't aware that the headreasts no longer articulated. And the older models all have lining in the storage compartments, etc. (and evidently now they don't). Then the crappy 2002 stereo gets trashed (deservingly I'm sure). At least it was rated the most fun to drive.

Okay...I'm done ranting.

jgoodson

My 99 300M with 40,000 miles has a bumping noise in the front end. The dealer says it is the steering bushings and will cost $232 to replace. I was disappointed to find out that my Added Care warranty does not cover this item and also disappointed that the bushings would be so worn at only 40,000 miles. Has anyone one else had a problem with steering bushings? And how normal is it for them to go bad at 40,000 miles?

Thanks in advance.

beach15

Here's a new 2003 Brilliant Black Crystal Pearl M, for any of you that haven't seen one:

http://www.manassaschrysler.com/Chrysler/290033.html

beach15

No suprise here, I just read it all, and completely, 100% agree with everything they said. Someone here had said that it was contradictory or that the Edmunds reviewers must have been on drugs. Well, no, they just told it like it is, much like you see on certain news stations anymore (Ahem, Fox). You can't put an old 5 year old design up against mostly up to date and very sophisticated competitors and expect it to do so well. The review sounded fair and just to me, and it's all simple--the M wasn't the best of the bunch.

And yes, it does lack several luxury features. They listed them and made note of what the other cars did have in comparison. But, then again, why would I ever want to start yet another debate on this TOWNHALL board?!

Oh, and the one editor's comment: "various interior rattles, a slightly loose center console, front doors that rubbed against the firewall pads whenever they were opened or closed and misaligned exterior body panels."--that's an EXACT representation of our past 00' M.

If the car had been put up against the last "sports sedans" comparison, the outcome would have been even worse.

Finally, an article written that might give Chrysler a clue! But, then again, why would they care what actual people think of their products!

mrl859

Blonda, you're right. How much money could Chrysler have saved in removing the tilt feature of the head rests, the rubber mat in the console, the lights on the equalizer controls on the radio, and the Infinity emblems on the hight mounted door speakers. As I ranted in an earlier post, it's a shame. Having come out of an '01 to go into an '02, I was shocked to see these little inconsequential niceties missing. The worst part is that the headrest is at a fixed angle where it touches your head no matter what you do....grumble, grumble, grumble....
Oh, and the stereo sounds like....well, you know the rest of the story. I think Edmunds hit it right on the head in their analysis.

fedlawman

The 300 M Special should not have been included in the comparison.

A more appropriate choice would have been the Concorde Limited (Nee LHS).

It has the wood dash and softer ride that the segment demands, yet still offers the sportiness of the 300M.

That said, I still think it would have scored in the exact same spot (it isn't as sumptuous as the Lexus), but it would have garnered much more favourable comments.

Oh yeah, don't forget that, out the door, it costs about $6000 less than the next least expensive entry (Lexus - $32,000).

beach15

Really? I think it would have gotten pretty much the same comments AND have been chosen for the same spot. It's virtually the same car with a larger rear and minimally softer ride. It still has the same somewhat "unrefined" build quality, voluminous road noise, and noisy, slow engine. Still, just like the M, not a horrible car, but clearly not anywhere near the best.

It's basically getting old and more people are starting to realize it.

Decontenting- Jeez, by the time the new 300N comes out, it'll be equipped like a base Sebring. Cloth seats and a 2.7 (hope to god they aren't this stupid), with only the usual power features and a CD player! Or, maybe they're doing it for a reason, and the 300N will be packed to the gills, but I wouldn't bet on it being standard, but mainly in a "high-end" model. Can't wait for the Hemi in the car though! I just hope they don't screw things up and make it unresponsive and gruff. A nice mellow rumble and tire-melting grunt from a stop would sure be nice (oops, we already have that, just not in a Chrysler!).

ottowrkr

kosh_2258- that mod would not be that hard , you just have to find the wire that powers the high beams when the DRL's are on and change it over to the foglights.

arby500- hey Arby , how you been .We have missed you on the board. Thanks , yes one more week to go . just waiting to see who our union picks on Monday as the next company to be the strike target , GM was first they were offered 3,3 and 2 % wage increase's for the next 3 years . Hope DC will giveus the same

beach15 - that pic does not do the black justice, this is one color that has to be seen in person to get the full effect.

sdmike2

I saw a gorgeous special on the I-15 in north san diego the other night. It was either black or dark blue (my guess), and it was just stunning. It had a riverside dealer frame and no plate, so it was brand spankin new.

ruski

I guess I am judging 300M by my experience with my '99 300M which was great. I guess I was unaware of the recent decontenting.

P.S. my 2002 Acura TL-S is starting to rattle more than my '99 300M ever did. How'bout that?

jona57

I understand that the Special uses the same tranny gearing as that on the 2.7L Concorde to boost low-speed acceleration. If so, this seems like an easy mod for a DC dealer to perform- (and MUCH cheaper than the Prowler Pro gear set). Is this swap of DC gears possible & has anyone done it?

Jon

kosh_2258

I was rummaging through the 2003 information at the Chrysler website and caught this change in the description of the Premium sound: 9 Infinity (r)speakers in 9 locations... Apparently someone finally decided that the whizzer cones in the front door speakers don't fit the definition of a seperate speaker.

As for the Edmunds review, so what? Every car runs it's cycle and falls to the end of the line eventually. The M is no exception. It certainly isn't the worst (actually one of the better ones, Honda's included) car I've ever owned. That award goes to an 86 Saab 9000 I owned briefly (VERY). Now that thing was a "sob" story.

I've been reading some preliminaries on the 5.7 Hemi in the RAM p/u's and when the first N with a Hemi hits the road it will be glorious! Now if we could just get a good look at one... :b

uxca300m

Numbers are a funny things. You can play with and massage them all you want to do different things with the numbers. I took a look at the Edmunds report and decided to look at the things that made me buy my M which was basically the looks and the fun of driving it. The following are the numbers taken from the report that I felt were important to me in buying the M. I left out all the minor crap that bought the M's number down and basically looked at the ride and the joy of driving it. The price factor is added at 20 % of the ratings shown in the final ranking.
Lexus Infiniti Passat 300M Sabb
Engine 6.8 9.0 9.4 7.6 5.0
Transmission 6.8 8.2 7.8 6.6 6.6
Braking 8.2 7.4 7.0 7.8 5.8
Suspension 8.4 6.8 7.8 7.6 5.2
Tires 6.0 7.4 7.4 8.4 6.4
Steering 7.0 7.0 8.4 7.2 5.4
Fun to drive 4.8 7.2 7.6 9.2 4.6
Comfort 7.4 7.2 8.8 8.0 8.4
Pricing 18.1 19.1 16.6 20.0 15.5

Totals 73.5 79.3 80.8 82.4 62.9

And the winner is; Oh no Beach 15 .It's the 300M!!!!!!

uxca300m

On my last post it wouldn't post in columns as I had typed it. Darn
The totals are as follows
Lexus 73.5
Infiniti 79.3
Passat 80.8
300 M 82.4
Saab 62.9

The M's still wins Yeahhhh !!!!

dyadinc

No contest, not even close, if you want a solid, sure-footed ride,and like to slalom around traffic without the car pitching and yawing all over the place pay the extra money, buy the oem-php (sport suspension) strut and leave the KYB's for your Concorde or LHS

sdmike2

Those gears will fit, but there will only be a nominal difference in tranny behavior. While the prowler pro gears change the RPMs of the car over 20% (at any given speed the RPMs will be something like 25% higher), the Special gears only change the RPMs about 5%. I looked into this and decided that the cost of making the change...since I wouldn't do the labor myself...wasn't worth it.

beach15

Just saw a brand new 03' Special in Graphite Metallic coming home from a conference. Very, very nice! It's a great color for the Special's "tuner-like" appearance. It was at a 5* in Milford, DE, actually the first place we went to buy a 00' White over Pearl PHP M, but it didn't happen.

fastdriver

fedlawman-

I think that no matter what model they tested, the results would have been the same.

ruski-

Beginning to sound like you have the Honda Christine model!! Have you seen this- http://www.detnews.com/2002/autosinsider/0209/21/autos-593168.htm

fastdriver

300mva

Hello - I have a 2001 300m that has been mostly problem free until yesterday, when I pulled the emergency brake release and it just kept coming (the whole release broke off). It did release the break, so I figured I'd just bring the car in this week to get it fixed... but today when I got in I accidentally brushed the emergency brake and it engaged. I tried pulling on the wires that were left in there but can't get it to release. I tried driving about 50 feet to see how engaged the break was and think I smelled burning, so I can't drive it anywhere. Does anyone know how to release the brake any other way? I've tried everything I can think of with what I can feel down there, with no luck (I am completely unmechanical!) At this point I'm going to have to have it flatbedded to a dealer and have no car for a couple days unless I can find a way to release the break. If you know of any way I can release this, please let me know!!

Thanks in advance - Brian

dustyrds

Just had a good laugh at the Edmunds Entry Level Luxury sedan comparison test in which the 300M placed 4 out of 5. Which is not so bad considering that even the boobs at Edmunds realized this was not the proper class or category for this car. Over 2 and 1/2 years ago I read every conceivable post on Edmunds related to the 300M to justify I was making the right purchase. Now 58,000 miles later my white 2000 still gets compliments and puts a smile on my face. I'm sure the other cars in the comparison are all great vehicles, but what the 300 has always had that that none of the others do is class with an attitude. (So does a Porsche but not at this price). I'll hang on to my 300 thank you and can't wait until the N series debuts.
PS: I wonder if Edmunds ever tested the cargo capabilities, the 300M can accomodate 8 foot pieces of lumber within the interior with the windows and trunk closed. Look at the additional savings by not having to buy a pickup.

fastdriver

300mva-

Doesn't Chrysler have their "roadside service" toll-free number anymore? Maybe they can help. Otherwise, looks like you're stopped dead in your tracks.

fastdriver

no1trust

Apparently customers can be reimbursed by Honda for money spent on their transmission woes. The article also mentioned how customers bombarded NHTSA w/complaints. IMHO the 300M seat movement complaints, as well as the speed sensor problems are a lot less troublesome than transmission problems (but there is that perceived Japanese reliability).

mrl859

300mva:You could call roadside assistance. I know they will tow it. I don't know if they will be of assistance in releasing the brake however. Not being mechanically inclined at this instant is not a good thing. The release cable hooks up to an arm on the park brake assembly. It may require some partial trim disassembly, but if you can find the piece that the release cable catches and pull on it, it will release. BE CAREFUL! Hold one hand on the park brake pedal to slow it's release and keep it from flying up and pinching your fingers/smacking you in the chin.

ottowrkr

Sounds like the cable on the P/brake has come lose from the back of the plastic release handle. If you remove the drivers side I.P fuse panel cover you will see two screws that hold the lower panel on. Remove these two screws ,now you can just pull down that panel. In behind you will see the back of the release handle .The cable will most likely not be attached . Look for a short ,black cable with a silver metal end on it . Take a pair of pliers and just pull that metal end .This will release the P/brake.Or you could just call "roadside assistance" But if you want to drive your car till you can get it into the dealer try my idea. Its pretty easy to do. You only need a star end(phillips) screwdriver and a a pair of pliers

ottowrkr

Just finished reading 2002 Entry-Level Luxury Sedan Comparison Test , when I read the Editors' Evaluations I had to laugh. In the fun to drive score the Special got a 9.2 out of 10 , the rest scored 7's and 4's .Yet it finished scond last in total ? If a car scores 9 out of 10 in fun to drive .Its number ONE in my books, thats all I need to know before I buy it.

bluesky999

Unlike some who feel that the Edmund's testers are sub-par, I feel they usually do a very good job. But, I find it rather puzzling that they put the 'M in the luxury car test, and then state that it doesn't belong there and probably would have done well in the sport category--duh! No kidding! Anyway, my comments are as follows:

The W8 and Lexus are much more expensive than the 'M, especially considering that many of us took advantage of rebates or low financing. In the real world those 2, the top 2 finishers, are around 10K more than the 'M. So of course they'll be a bit more luxurious. Then, if you take the Infiniti, which tied for 2nd, and is priced closer to the 'M, you get a car with Japanese derivative looks on the outside (it's like a contest to see who can be the most boring) and the inside doesn't even have any wood up high where the passenger or driver can even see it. Wham, bam, no thank you, ma'am!

Echoing posters before me, the M's combination of exterior looks, style, brakes, handling, interior ambience, value, and interior/trunk space give it a unique niche in the market that other entries don't match. Now, if Chrysler can just get a great looking body on the upcoming 'N, we'll be in good shape for a long time!

300michael

I had a great time in San Diego. The family didn't like the ride as much (due to the lowering) scraped bottom a couple of times, but still have my air dam, ha ha.
I went to Lakeside, that place must be the 300M capital of the world. For a town with only 2 main streets and to have 6 M's, I couldn't believe it. Sorry I didn't get to see any of you. Maybe next time.
There was a section of Interstate 8 a couple of miles into the AZ border, that is great to drive fast. We (a yellow Vette) were doing 85 on a 45mph section of down hill curves (I love that section). No tire squeel or anything. I think it kind of surprized him a little to see an (old mans car) staying with him. Driving under 80 should be a crime in this car. It really reaches it's own going up steep grades

ezaircon4jc

You guys aren't the only victims of the German/Japanese loving Edmunds crowd. It took them over a year to "discover" that the battery was located in the trunk of the LS and they complained for a year that the transmission didn't shift right. After pointing out to them the TSB that corrected this issue (which had been out for ~10 months), they got the trans reflashed. A simple trip to their dealer would have saved MONTHS of unnecesary complaining. They constantly compare the LS to a 3-series and complain that the LS is too bulky and heavy. Of course it is. The exterior is the size of a 5-series, while the interior (although, probably not as big as yours) is the size of a 7. The only thing that the LS and 3-series have in common is a >$30K price tag!

You guys have a really nice looking car. Don't let reviewers (most with an agenda) tarnish your enjoyment of your car.

fastdriver

no1trust-

So far, I'm loving every mile- 19,010, of my "perceived Japanese reliability"!!

Wonder why DC came out with 7/70,000? Must be only to reassure all those minivan drivers!

fastdriver

sdmike2

1-800-521-2779

sdmike2

I've enjoyed chatting with most of you over the last year. Thanks for the time and fellowship.

Beach - Get some help. You always thought the emergency brakes were flimsy? That's probably the ONLY thing we didn't listen to you complain about over the last 6 months. I'm sure when someone comes out and says "the farnugger on my 300M failed", you'll be the first to say "Boy! I always THOUGHT that farnugger should have been made better!!" I've tried to avoid your posts, but like watching a train wreck I can't manage to NOT read them. Why don't you make one final post that says "boy, I love the look of the 300M but hate everything else about it".

Fastdriver - 7/70 is all about marketing and risk/benefit, and nothing about reliability. How many more people will buy the car because of it versus how much more it will cost DC for the people that use the service. Just like rebates on software. The revenues it generates is huge, and less than half submit the rebate. Same idea.

ottowrkr

are you leaving us??

fastdriver

sdmike2-

"7/70 is all about marketing and risk/benefit"

Mmmm... pretty big risk for them to take in their financial condition?

"Just like rebates on software. The revenues it generates is huge, and less than half submit the rebate."

WOW!! That's the ONLY reason that I buy it in the first place- the REBATE! ;-)) Am I the ONLY one who saves sales slips/warranties and "call" the company on it if their product fails before then? No wonder my friends call me Ralph Nader.

Have a Duracraft 18" oscillating stand fan that came with a 20 year warranty. It only lasted 8 years before the plastic fittings cracked and won't hold the fan up. Called the company. Getting a new fan now with a 3 year warranty! LOL....

These long warranties won't last. DC had them before and I'm sure it cost them a fortune which is why they disappeared in the first place. If they were cost efficient, they would have still been in effect all these years.

fastdriver

no1trust

I wonder why Honda came out w/their extended warranty on their perceived reliable transmissions; the less-flattering USAToday article this last Friday mentioned the many complaints to NHTSA, and people demanding a recall (but read the article for yourself and come to your own conclusion). I'm not arguing w/you about perceived reliability; I KNOW you had a rough time w/Christine. I'm glad your current ride has so few service complaints. I wish I could say the same for our perceived reliable Lexus ES300. We've had ours in the shop FAR more times than your Acura, most 300M posters here, or our Korean Festiva in spite of Lexus' perceived reliabiliy... the big difference though is the excellent SERVICE Lexus has way over DC and Honda. BTW, some posters at the G35 forum recently complained about seat movement. I hope your Acura continues to be trouble free. Compared to others' tranny problems, the 300M's problems seem to be mostly nuisance, but the powertrain is VERY reliable IMHO. IMHO DC is very smart in offering the extended powertrain warranty since they are unlikely to incur little cost on their tried and true powertrain.

fastdriver

no1trust-

Maybe all those DC minivan owners and others with failing transmissions should do the same and start DEMANDING for a change, instead of just sitting back and paying for their replacement transmissions. If NHTSA can help Honda owners, I'm sure they can do the same for DC owners.

BTW- in 18 months and 19,000 miles, my only "complaint" so far was a few weeks ago- the passenger door radio speaker material was wet. Brought it in with no appointment to have them check it. They looked at it and said that they would need it for a day or so to check it out and that they would give me a new TL to drive. Haven't had a chance to get back to them yet. Also, I did NOT buy the car from this dealer and don't know anyone who works there. How many new car buyers have had this experience in the first 18 months?

With Christine, I bought her on a Wed. and was back at the dealer Fri. and the following Mon. for the left 'drift" and the static in the radio. That wasn't even 48 hours, never mind 18 months!

Like I've said before, to each his own.

fastdriver

300mva

Ottowrkr - thank you VERY much!! I followed your directions. I did finally get the brake to release, although when I pulled on the cable with the pliers the whole long (well 8 inches maybe) cable came off in my hand. This left a silver "wrapped" cable dangling about 3 inches, and when I pulled on that the brake popped off. I'm sure I left some damage for the dealership to fix (and unfortunately I'm 2000 miles past the bumper to bumper!), but I think nothing that wasn't going to have to be replaced anyway. And now I can go to work tomorrow and schedule the repair when convenient. Again, thanks so much!! :-)

ottowrkr

Just dont touch that P/brake when your out and about . Hey glad to hear you are back mobile.Maybe I should get a 5 star service award from DC- LOL

farwest99

Have 99 300M, 46,000 miles. Been trouble free, but
recently the right hand electric radiator fan has developed a wobble in the plastic ring type blade. Makes a loud grinding noise when it periodically touches the radiator fins. Have not pulled the fan off yet as it looks to be quite a job.
Has anybody else had this problem?
Is there a fix without replacing the whole assembly?
Understand from my mechanic the fan is quite expensive. If need to buy one, what is the least expensive source?

ceikost

on this board. I've been off since Aug. 6 when my mother passed away. My wife and eldest son drove the "m" to Wichita, Ks. rather than fly as my wife and I would have a lot of running around to do cleaning up mom's business. Son flew home on the 12th to go back to work.

Carol (my wife) and I started back on the 15th. She drove to Kansas city where we changed seats. This was only the second time she had driven the m and the first on the highway. She said "I looked down and I was doing 90 and didn't even know it." Drove on to St. Louis and spent the night there as Carol had not been feeling well since leaving Chicago. The next day she drove a little over 100 miles. She was getting into this m thing. I told her it is a fun car to drive.

Will Sunday morning the 18th I got up, fed the the dog and went to wake Carol up but alas Carol was no longer with us. So I had lost my mother and my wife in 12 days. Needless to say I have been busy lately. Aug. was not a good month.

I took time Sat. to install the Joshua Tree wood trim kit. Carol did say that you need a spoiler to see where the rear end is so I'm ordering it this week.

fastdriver

ceikost-

I am so sorry to hear this. My thoughts and prayers are with you. I thought you were going to say that your wife was out driving the M.

fastdriver

saturnfan13185

ceikost--I'm new to this forum and have been reading it over the last few days. I'm very sorry to hear about your wife. My thoughts and prayers, as well as condolences, go to you and your family in this difficult time.

Regarding the 7/70,000 warranty on the new Chrysler products' powertrain, it used to be 7/100,000 on the powertrain. I don't think the trouble is with the engine, I think it's with the transmissions. The 41TE/42LE is notoriously unreliable. I own a 1994 Dodge Intrepid and I bought it with 84,000 miles on it. So far I haven't had to replace the transmission, but I'm thinking that it's coming soon. It slips regularly on the 2-3 and 3-4 shifts, and has terrible "bump-shift" as it coasts down to stop. The torque converter is also having problems. The car now has 128,000 miles on it. My car has the 3.5L 24 valve V6, which is an earlier version of the 300M's engine, according to my dealer. The 300M uses the 42LE, they haven't changed it very much since '94.

I've had a lot of trouble with the car otherwise--I've had to put in two new steering racks, three sets of inner tie-rod bushings, a new a/c evaporator core (which Dodge paid for), a new paint job (Dodge paid for part of it), new automatic climate control head unit, new stereo head unit, new ABS cab module, and various other things. I think I just got a lemon, though, because the other Chrysler products in my family just have transmission trouble, but everything else is solid.

Just my take on the warranty--the transmissions cost them the most, not the engines. They make a darn good V6. If they could just drop in a few Hydra-Matics, maybe that would help.

Ed

ottowrkr

ceikost- very sorry to hear of your losses. Take care.

saturnfan13185 - sorry to hear of your problems with your 94. I also have a 94 and its been a great car. No trans problems . Only problem I have had , is the A/C. Yup I also have had the evaporator changed . The paint on my car shines like the day it rolled off the line (but with a few stone chips) .Other than that I cant complain, its starts everyday and for a car almost 10 years old it still looks good .

Hey you guys wanna see my ride?

http://public.fotki.com/lhbuilder/my_ride/

mikeyjohn

Ceicost, sorry to hear about your loss, my condolences go out to you and your family!!!!!

Auto, I also had a 94 Intrepid ES in Fire Red, and my M is also Inferno Red. My cars in between were a Status (Grey) and a Cirrus (Gold) and the latter is my wifes current car. I'm also glad to see that good old Buzz has signed off on a contract with GM and it looks like DC may be next. I wish you guys well, but I will say that Buzz is not my kind of people. Good luck, and thanks for all your timely input on our site over the last year or so.

300michael

My, condolences to you and your family.

300michael

Sorry otto, you and wire do not qualify for the five star award. Chrysler would have to come out with a ten star or platiumn star program for you to qualify. Five star would not cut it.
thanks to both of you.

uxca300m

Looks great. You can see pride of ownership all over it.

Mike

ottowrkr

mikeyjohn- Buzz picked Ford ,guess he wants to get things started with them. I think they will strike Ford just to show top brass that they are not happy with the Oakvile plant being shut and sending the work to the US. I guess we will just have to wait and see what happens before next Tues at 11:59 pm.

300michael -Thanks, I just want to see happy LH owners .

mrl859

I posted this previously with no response: The 2003 Special has a N/C option for the 18" wheels which is part of an "Ul;timate Performance Group" which includes a High Performance computer. Does this mean the '03 Specials with 17" chrome CLAD wheels do not get the hi-po computer?

sdmike2

I'm so sorry to hear of your losses. My prayers go out to you. As much as we love our Ms, it's times like this that make us realize how unimportant material things are. Hang in there...

ottowrkr

I am going to look into this when we go back to work , but I think the 17 inch wheeled Specials still get the same non-speed limiter computer. The regular 300 with PHP and 17's has no speed limiter so I cant see why the Special would be an different.