Mazda Protegé

eleets00

Ok, here we go. I own a 2000 Grand Prix GT. bought it brand new. Problem is around 30.5K miles the transmission failed. Now I'm considering trading it in for a Protégé or Protégé 5. I'm considering the trade because I no longer trust my car, due to past experience w/a 96 Ford Contour, that lost 2 transmissions in less than 8 months & was on its way to losing the 3rd when I traded it for the Grand Prix. Ford put rebuilt tranny's in my Contour. Pontiac just rebuilt the tranny in the car. Now, I am fully aware that I'm about to give up 70 horses, but I willing to go this route to be able to do more w/my money elsewhere. Are the Protégé's worth it? I don't know how to drive a 5-speed, so I'm looking at the 4-speed w/the sport shift. How is this 4-speed sport compared to the regular 4-speed auto? I'm 6ft tall & weigh 250lbs. Will I be comfortable & is getting in/out of the vehicle difficult? The Protégé is the only compact car that I like plus appears to have the most interior space. I like the look of the Protégé ES over the Protégé 5, but figured might as well have the extra cargo space just in case. Well any info you all can provide will be greatly appreciated. Also, does can anyone who drives a stick in rush hour traffic (Atlanta or Miami)tell me if it is worth learning to drive a stick to be in that mess everyday shift'g? Need to hear from the people w/automatics & sport automatics. If you replied in the Protege5 forum, thanks...

mdaffron

Thanks for the post. First of all, let me say this ... I'm 6-1 and 280 pounds, and comfort was a big issue with me when I was car shopping two years ago. My choice? A 2000 Protege ES 5-speed. I test-drove both the automatic and the 5-speed, and there was no comparison in fun factor. Even though I was leaning toward an automatic this time (and I commute 38 miles daily to the center of downton Richmond -- no Atlanta, but still some heavy traffic), I haven't regretted my choice at all in 40,000 miles of driving.

We have two Proteges in our driveway now, my 2000 ES with 40,000 miles on it and my wife's 2002 Protege5 with 8,000, and both have been extremely reliable cars. No warranty issues with either of them yet, knock on wood.

I used to own a 1992 Protege LX, which went 83,000 miles (when I traded it) without one problem. It replaced my first 1992 LX that, because of the lousy tires it was shod with, hydroplaned at 45 mph and was totaled at only 28,000 miles. But even though it had those old motorized "passive restraint" belts and no air bags, I walked out of the totaled car. I was so impressed with the way this car saved my life that I took my insurance check and bought the exact same car again.

So four Proteges in my life. I'm not a dumb person (Mama always said, "Stupid is as stupid does"), and I don't think I'd be such a repetitive customer if I wasn't as pleased as I can be with these cars. You won't find a compact with as much interior room as the Protege. And if you haven't already, sit in the back seat -- you won't believe it!

BTW, the Protege sedan has more trunk space than the Protege5 (not counting if you take the parcel shelf out of the Protege5). We learned this with our folding baby stroller -- the Protege5's trunk is about six inches shorter, front to rear, than the sedan's. Keep in mind this measurement does not take into account the fact that you can remove the parcel shelf in the Protege5 and stack taller things in it -- but I question the need. I recently got my gasoline lawn mower in the trunk of my Protege sedan with the handlebars folded and was able to SHUT the trunk! I like the extra depth the sedan's trunk affords us without having to fold the rear seats down.

Good luck; I don't think you can go wrong with a Protege! But if you get the sedan, make sure you get an ES for all the features, and if you can, get a 5-speed. You'll be missing a lot of fun if you get an automatic or that still-automatic Tiptronic.

Meade

chicagopro

Grilled ham-and-cheese sandwich.

It was yummy.

dsm6

Thanks for the info. The link to the article was especially useful. I'm thinking of synthetic RedLine MTF to smooth out those synchros when cold and better protect everything. What do you think?

What, you don't want to hear about wax some more? Much more important than protecting a cheap old tranny! ;-)

protege_fan

I thought Redline MT90 was what we're supposed to use in the Pro manual tranny...it's 75W90.

dsm6

Todd says he used Valvoline Synpower 75W90 GL-5, right?

protege_fan

For Redline products I mean. MT90 as opposed to MTL.

dsm6

Sorry. I read that post while reading something else (doing work - heh, imagine that). Yes, I believe so - Redline MT90. I'll check to make sure before I do it, of course.

silvercrown

It's interesting that someone recently asked for advice/feedback on the Protege because I have a similar question. I've been reading the posts on this board for a while and I'm always intrigued at the amount of interest that the Pro generates. It seems to have quite a loyal following and repeat buyers. You guys are really enthusiastic about this car!! And you have the most posts per day of any of the boards (probably). It's almost like a brotherhood of sorts (with a few sisters). LOL

Back to my question, I have been considering trading to a smaller, less expensive car as I adjust to a new (read: tighter) economic situation. Tops on my list of small cars are the Protege and the Civic. I think they are both very attractive cars and reliable. The Civic has better resale value but the Protege can be purchased for less (if I use the S plan) plus there's that tempting 0% financing option.

I drive a midsize car now (a Camry) and I'm wondering about the adjustment as far as ride and comfort. I have read that the Pro has a very "firm" ride. My question is: how firm is firm? Is it really harsh or just stiffer because of its handling characteristics? I live in Metro Detroit and most of the roads range from bad to terrible, so a smooth ride (in spite of the bad roads) is a preference for me.

However, I really like the way the Pro looks and my one major gripe with my current car is that it doesn't handle as tightly as I would like, it's not very confidence inspiring on sharp turns, etc. And I admit to a yearning for a bit more ... "pizzazz" stylewise. But I do appreciate the smooth, quiet ride. I know if I trade to a smaller vehicle to cut my expenses, I'll have to make some sacrifices. I'm hoping to buy a vehicle that would require the least amount of sacrifice or just on minor things.

Now that you know a bit about my story, what do you guys think?

TIA
SilverCrown

mdaffron

There's no way we can answer your question about how firm is firm. I can speak for myself; the car is very comfortable for me and I'm 6-1 and 280 pounds. I would suggest test-driving one and getting a direct answer from your own senses! Good luck; it's a great car that (in many opinions) handles extremely well!

Meade

protege_fan

Here's something interesting I read in another board about resale values.
People were bashing a certain car about having poor resale value. He said, make that work for you by buying a slightly used one. That way, the original buyer takes the depreciation hit and you get away with a mostly brand new car.

Anyway, I for one, don't care about resale value. I'm keeping my Pro for a long, long time.

I find the ride in the Protege to be good. It's definitely not mushy, and you will have a lot of road feeling transmitted into the cabin. But I find that an acceptable trade-off, especially with the handling you get in return.

I've test-driven the Civic a few times. Can't say I like the a) styling, and b) road-handling. Very boring IMO.

mdaffron

the low-slung driving position in the Civic and the lack of interior room, especially in the back seat.

Go drive a Protege Renee!

Meade

dsm6

I second Meade's motion for a test drive. In fact, if you have narrowed it down to one of these two vehicles, I would test drive both back to back - on right after the other. Factors like ride comfort, road feel, brake feel, etc., are very much relative to your most recent driving experience. Driving them back to back will give a more clear comparison of the traits of each relative to one another and relative to your Camry, which presumably you'd drive in between in going from one dealer to another.

I don't think you can go wrong with either - it's a matter of priorities as to which one you choose, I suppose. I personally prefer the better handling and improved road feel of the Pro's suspension and steering to its softer, gentler, more "main-stream" competition.

protege_fan

Do this....find a Honda and a Mazda dealer close by each other. Take one for a test drive by yourself. Take that car to the other dealership. Then compare the 2 on the spot.

I know which one I'd pick, but I think I may be a little biased in this

dsm6

Speaking of the Pro's handling, the wife turns to me the other day says that riding in the Pro reminds her of riding in a roller coaster. She says it is as if the car is riding on rails - it has such good grip it just zips around corners and goes where you point it.

Smart gal. She's been driving that overweight Grand Prix too much.

Thank you for riding at Cedar Point.

the_big_h

now that I'm expecting ALL cars to have the fun handling characteristic that the Proteges exhibit. I'm thinking the next time I drive a different car I'll be like, "what's wrong with this car! it's all over the place!!!"

or something to that extent

protege_fan

I agree...I drove my gf's '91 Jetta...SCARY!!!! I was making the tires wail like banshees going around corners the Pro would yawn at.

BTW, I AM making a direct comparison here. YES, it's not fair, but I don't care!!

mdaffron

From time to time I have worried that I might have "forced" her into a Protege5 in January (since I drive a Protege myself).

But those worries are unfounded, I learned this past weekend, when we were out running errands and she said, "I LOVE my car!!!" completely out of the blue.

There, Renee, there's a "non-guy's" point of view on the car for you. And her most recent car before her Protege5 was a mushy, boring 1995 Cavalier.

Meade

protege_fan

Aww....where's your affectionate term for the Cavalier?

dsm6

Oh, speaking of which. I might have lost a BMW salesperson a sale (no, not really):

I drove the other day behind a BMW 325 out on a test drive. The dealer always takes test drives on the same curvy stretch of road that I often drive myself - fun road. Anyway, the salesperson (or so I assume - a guy in the back who looked like a BMW salesperson) kept looking back at me wondering how I could manage to keep up (they were obviously pushing the car - not alot, but a good bit). I bet the salesperson was egging the test driver (a young man) on, talking about how well the car handles.

When we got through the stretch, the BMW pulled off to the side of the road to let traffic clear, ready to run the stretch again. I quickly pulled in front and when traffic cleared went on ahead of them - leaving them way (oh so far away) behind. At the next stop light, driver and rear seat passenger were staring at my Pro.

Of course, I know the limits of my car; the person test driving the BMW doesn't know the limits of his, so he isn't going to push it as hard. But still - BMW verve for half the price! Of course, its sans BMW brand cachet (oh, and rear wheel drive, and ride comfort, and NVH, and BMW service, etc.), but I can't afford to care about such things. ;-)

maltb

that's not fair....A Kia Rio feels good after a '95 Cavalier.

mdaffron

There's my affectionate term, Mike! Sorry I left it out of the other post!

Meade

protege_fan

Thanks! I always get a chuckle whenever I hear that term! Hehe!!

vocus

When I had my sunroof installed in the 1999 Protege, I had a rental 2000 Toyota Camry. The ride in the Camry is a little softer than the Protege's, but the Protege doesn't put you to sleep behind the wheel like the Camry does.

silvercrown

Many thanks for all of the prompt responses to my question. I knew I could count on this group for honest, straightforward feedback.

Excellent idea, protege_fan, about finding Mazda and Honda dealers in the same area for a test drive. That may be a challenge though. I don't think there are many Mazda dealers around here and most have a poor reputation for customer service. I, myself, had a poor experience with the one closest to me when I test drove a Millenia a while back. I posted my experience on the Millenia and Mazda 6 boards. That was when I was dreaming of more luxury before reality set in. LOL

This is still all very preliminary, but I will post my impressions whenever I do decide to do a test drive (unless I decide to just keep my car and maybe refi it or something). I do admit, I am intrigued by the idea of attending the next annual meeting in Chicago (CAPP) if I bought one ......

Keep the comments/advice coming!

chicagopro

Regarding CAPP: actually, they're not annual...we've had three in the last few months, and are tossing around the idea of having another one in September. We'll keep you posted. Although I know for a fact that there are a couple of MI folks who are at this very minute trying to get the Protege owners in that state a little more organized.

Regarding test drives: I test drove three cars in one day (Corolla, Protege, Elantra). I agree, back-to-back--or as close to back-to-back as you can get--is definitely the way to do it.

And if you have a memory like a seive, as do I (NO comments from the rest of you, please), here's a helpful hint:

Take somebody along with you on all the drives (aside from the goofy salesperson). If you notice something--anything--about the car while you're driving (good or bad), mention this out loud and have your friend take notes.

That way at the end of the day you won't find yourself struggling to remember which car had more leg room, made the weird noise in reverse, etc. Maybe this isn't a problem when you're comparing only two cars, but it's just a thought.

Good luck!

--Dale

silvercrown

I'm actually envious of all you Protege owners getting together and visiting each other, etc. I can feel the love, even under all the good natured ribbing. LOL

Taking a friend is a good idea. Two heads are better than one.

And I guess I'm looking for an excuse to drive to Chicago .....

silvercrown

Is there any major differences between the LX and the ES trim levels? Besides equipment, features, etc. It almost sounds like the ES may have a different suspension, perhaps a tighter "sport" suspension. I haven't been able to tell for sure in my research thus far. If this is the case, is the difference between the 2 for ride and handling noticeable? I know this is another subjective question, but I had to throw it out there. :-)

eleets00

Darren, thanks for the response. Good to know that another big guy like myself can fit comfortably into the Pro.
Real good to know about the truck space too! Plan on putting 1- 10 inch L7 Solo Baric in there. Not trying to entertain the neighbors, just myself.
I plan on going to test drive possibly this weekend.
I really like the look of the sedan over the Pro5. I know I can put the Pro5 front end on the sedan later. Do you or anyone else know if you can upgrade the sedan to the leather seats as well? Does waiting til the end of the month to buy a car really work? I've had a salesman tell me their managers make some really stupid deals at the end of the month, especially on the 30th & 31st. Is this really true?
Again, thank you to everyone for your input. It's really helpful...

vocus

I know the ES has 4-wheel disc brakes (alot better brake pedal feel, and shorter stopping distances as well), and I believe thicker stabilizer bars. I know it definitely has larger tires with better grip around corners. The ES model is also the only one available with the Sport automatic transmission, the silver interior trim on the dash, and white-faced gauges (which look really cool!).

protege_fan

In the US, I think the price difference b/n the LX and ES is fairly negligible. If that's the case get the ES if you want the alloys, etc.

Here in Canada, the price diff b/n the LX and ES are fairly noticeable, and if you want the ES-GT (equiv of the US ES) then it's a huge (IMO)price difference.

In terms of suspension, there's no difference. ES has 4 wheel discs whereas the LX has 2 discs and 2 drums, but I say that point is moot as in many cases 90% of the stopping power is accomplished by the front brakes.

But same 2.0L engine, same tranny, same body, etc.

protege_fan

That the ES has thicker stabilizer bars.

silvercrown

What are stabilizer bars and what function do they serve? I have some idea, but I'm not sure. Does this relate to better handling?

Thanks.

vocus

I said I BELIEVE it does, I was not sure. Don't kill the messenger.

vocus

The bars hold the car more stable when cornering, for a flatter feel.

vocus

I drove a 2002 Protege DX with front disc/rear drum brakes, and (of course) my 2001 ES with 4-wheel disc brakes. There is a marked difference in pedal feel between the 2 braking systems, to me anyway. And the ES stopped quicker as well.

maltb

All I can do is give you the part numbers. Take them to your local dealer and ask to see the parts.

B30P-34-151 STABILIZER,FRONT - ES
BL2J-34-151 STABILIZER,FRONT - DX, LX

B30H-28-151 STABILIZER,RR - DX, LX
BL2J-28-151 STABILIZER,RR - ES

I don't have the specs, but they are different.

bluong1

on the Protege5: front 22mm, rear 17mm.

Bruno

protege_fan

Thanks....I don't think I'll actually go there and ask that, but it's nice to know that somebody has some proof indicating that they are different. I haven't been able to find any sort of documentation that they are officially different.

pjd58

That's your opinion Paul, I'd rather not have them. IMO, Plood(Plastic wood), CHEAP silver trim and white gauges cheapen the look of any car. Don't get me wrong, the ES is worth the few extra greenbacks for the larger wheels and 4 disc brakes. My front disc and rear drum do the job very well. Although, when I purchased my 01 LX 2.0 last Sept, I got a free moonroof, free alloys and 0% for 48 all for $100+ invoice.

I prefer the my 2.0LX's interior over the ES. I hate the black cloth, it shows lint and absorbs heat.

I just couldn't spend the next four years looking at that silver and white.

Pjd58(pete)

silvercrown

Just out of curiosity, I got a rough insurance quote from my new auto insurance carrier for a 2002 Protege ES. I was shocked that it was about $200 more per year than my Camry. I know that my car is a few years older, but since it cost quite bit more and has the V6 engine, I thought that the premium for a smaller, 4 cylinder car would cost a little less to insure (even though it's new). Do you guys find that the Protege is more expensive to insure than other cars in its class? If so, any ideas why this is?

Thanks to everyone for being so patient with me and my many questions. :-)

sandman46

will be post #15000? Maybe someone from the state of Virginia? Guess we'll all see in the morning!

The Sandman :-)

chicagopro

Not the insurance question.

So many factors involved: age of driver, where you live, how far you drive each day, safety features of the car, personal driving history, etc. etc. etc.

I pay a bundle to insure my Protege, others here pay much less. You might ask a couple of insurance companies for quotes on a couple of different cars (including the Protege and your current car), factoring in your info, and see what you come up with.

chicagopro

sieve

chicagopro

Anybody else get a recall notice regarding the ignition coil?

For some 99's and 00's.

vocus

I had a loaner 2002 Protege DX, and hated the dash the way it was colored. With the colored panels next to the radio, it looked boring to me. I liked the silver in my ES when I had it, it looked totally cool.

vocus

My rate was high (almost $200 a month) because of the fact that I am under 25, live in a major city, and have one point on my license. When I lived in the county with my DX, the rate was like $145 a month or so. There are other cars out there that cost more to insure (my VW Jetta is $244 a month to insure). It doesn't help that my company (State Farm) lost money and raised everyone's rate to compensate for it.

vocus

I know there was a recall for some 2000 and 2001 models with bad rear brake hoses. My 2001 was not part of this allotment though. There is also a recall for 1999 Proteges for stereo wires or something. Check out http://www.nhtsa.dot.gov and access their recall database for more information.

vocus

You just never know who is going to make 15,000 do you?

You were not too far off geographically though, because someone from Maryland did. About 150 miles from that other guy.

chicagopro

Yeah, it was four in a row, but all were responses to earlier questions/comments. And good Protege content in there, too.

Happy 15,000!



--Dale