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Ford Five Hundred/Mercury Montego



  • ls8ls8 Posts: 16
    I've read a lot on the 500 and the only real negative I read about is lack of horsepower, though sometimes it is noted that the good 6-speed tranny mitigates the problem somewhat. Any specific thoughts as to whether this is really a problem or just the critics that need something to talk about/whine about?
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Posts: 2,287
    The CVT helps a lot more than the Six Speed. And yes, a stronger engine, as an option, would have helped sales quite a bit. That all being said, I sure am enjoying the 23 plus average MPG overall that I am getting (about 21 in town, 27 on the road). And that's with the AWD!
  • nvbankernvbanker Posts: 7,285
    exactly! I Drove one. It didn't feel the least bit under powered to me.
  • some people read a little bit too into the "underpowered" comment. Most would proably says its adequate for 90% of the normal driving they do. What do most consumers do who drive five hundreds? Mostly to work and driving their kids around. theyre not taking the car off-roading so the 200HP strikes a fine balance between power and fuel economy. At least that was the thinking behind it and of course for those who need slightly more power theres the 3.5L coming out, but theyll have to be a litle more patient till then.
  • I have driven a Crown Vic (Police Interceptor model) for many years. My current one is a 2004 with lots of power.


    However, I will be retiring soon and am considering either the 500 or Montego. I took a 500 for a test drive and while it certainly does not have the acceleration of my CV, it is very adequate for regular driving. Besides, I have to learn to slow down.


    I have been considering an Accord, LaCrosse, 500 or Montego. While the Accord is still a consideration, I think I need to decide between the 500 or Montego.
  • fsvfsv Posts: 196
    If you know, what will be engine choice for the Lincoln equivalet of Montego?
  • chuck1chuck1 Posts: 1,405
    Your not going to be happy with any of those if your looking for power. I'd try to find a used Impala "SS" with that corvette motor in it. That's the only thing that will put you close to the "Interceptor!"

    Good luck in your choice!
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    "If you know, what will be engine choice for the Lincoln equivalet of Montego?"


    Not yet, that's still some time away....
  • fsvfsv Posts: 196
    I guess, I have figured out why I dislike the Montego's rear lights. They look exactly like cheapo Mitsu Lancer's. (Yes, I know, that there is also 30G Evolution. It is evolution from the basic Lancer).

    If the post 2114 was addressed to me - no, I don't care for neck-snapping acceleration in this particular vehicle. And there is plenty of choices now, I guess, I could figure out myself what car could give me this adrenaline rush... All my emotion ever expressed re. Montego - it doesn't ride, handle and accelerate to my expectations; it's disapponting comparing to cam-cord (even Tauras feels much faster); and I wanted an American car size of Montego with all that parameters. That's all.
  • One of our local dealers is advertising a 500 SEL

    with a MSRP of $24,795 but discounted to $18,771.

    One only, dealer discount $3274, RTCM $1000, RCLRCO $750, FRP $500, Military $500. Anybody know what the various initials stand for?
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Posts: 2,287
    I have no idea, but I bet almost anything that virtually NOONE qualifies for ALL of those discounts. And, there is even the possibility that that particular unit is already sold/not for sale. (Not that that is legal, but it happens).


    If the car cannot be bought at the net advertised price, I would be looking elsewhere. Would you want to deal with a dealer who dealt in that way? In sales, service or warranty?
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    Sounds like a demo vehicle, and if so, not under warranty.
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Posts: 2,287
    Demonstrators ARE covered by the factory warranty. BUT, the time and mileage limitation (and warranty) start at the time the dealer first puts the car into service:

  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    Quite a few dealer's I've visited sell demo vehicles without warranties.


    Although some have "AS IS" on the window sticker, which means whatever scraps, scratches, wear/tear are found on it, cannot be corrected. Although still covered under the manufacturer's warranty.
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Posts: 2,287
    Be sure to check local laws. In many states, it is illegal to sell a vehicle AS IS. And the manufacturer, not the dealer, warrants new vehicles. Why on earth a dealer would try to disclaim a new car factory warranty, I cannot possibly imagine. At least I can't imagine why they would properly do so.


    As always, CAVEAT EMPTOR--let the buyer beware.
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    My forte isn't dealership experience, I do nothing related with them...just go with what I have seen in other manufacturer's dealerships when someone needs my "help" on purchasing a vehicle.
  • johnclineiijohnclineii Posts: 2,287
    ANT14, you do a great job. I, among many others, am VERY glad you are here. Thanks for helping to make this forum the wonderful place that it is!


    (Now, do you think I would be COMPLETELY nuts to trade in a year old Five Hundred this fall for a Fusion? )
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    Hmmm, a tad. Not because of driving dynamics, or your likes/dislikes over the mentioned vehicles, but because a vehicle is an item that depreciates. Therefore I personally have a harder time to justify the purchase.


    Although I'm in sort of a similar situation. My previous LS had over 125K miles and there was no other vehicle that grabbed my attention.... and while the LS never gave me any problems during my painful reign, I had the itch of buying something new. Obviously knowing the Mustang was around the corner, I tried to hold off a bit so I could purchase that instead. But I average 40K miles yearly, therefore I wouldn't be able to hold off that long. So I purchased another LS.


    Summer 05 I will have to reassess the situation since I'll be hitting the 70K mark at that time.


    Although what truely "sucks", is knowing WHATS in the pipeline in the future. I think,


    "Hmm I could get a Mustang, but there's ____ coming out a few months later..Oh but wait, there's _____ which will have AWD coming out a few months later after that...Hmmm no, I could wait a few months after that, when ____ comes out with a V8".... Then before you know it, your looking 2 years into the future, and still left in square one.


    I say you wait till you test drive the Fusion before pondering the thought too much. Not sure what your likes/dislikes are over a vehicle, but the Fusion will feel a bit more european in it's driving dynamics, a bit more boy-racer like, in a smaller package than the 500. Naturally, sharing many of the traits that has caught the attention of current 500 owner's.


    The Lincoln Zephyr will offer the same package, but with different driving dynamics (suspension tailored for a more sophisticated, cushiness-not boatlike in any way though).


    The Fusion is definately much more fun to toss around, from the F, M, Z trio.
  • flasvtflasvt Posts: 64
    ANT 14. I will save the 5th paragraph of the posting 2125 and start filling the blanks as the cars begin to be introduced. Thank you, it was a nice Christmas present for us car aficionados.
  • is to bring over one of the diesel engines from Fords Europe selections and have a diesel option.


    The UK Mondeo has 3 Diesel options, including

    2.0 Duratorq TDCi Diesel 96 kW (130 PS) at 3500 min-1 (rpm) 330 / 350* Nm at 1800 min-1 (rpm)


    2.2 Duratorq TDCi Diesel 114 kW (155 PS) at 3500 min-1 (rpm) 360 / 400* Nm at 1800 min-1 (rpm)


    Since these are only 2.o and 2.2L in size, getting them to fit would not be a problem (Some refitting of parts would be needed). Imagine the increased torque at low rpm would do for the performance (and even better MPG to boot!).


    Anyone able to be UK to US conversions of power and torque?
  • Please let's not get into the diesel VS gas arguement...They both have their place. Diesel got a bad rap because of smoke, but that has been remedied because of technology and improved fuel.


    Just rather have a discussion of bringing a diesel option to the 500 (I'd buy one if available).
  • fsvfsv Posts: 196
    Anyone - Mercury Meta powerplant - how far away it is?
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687


    You can do an online search for "Online Measurement conversion", and a few sites will be displayed where you can translate those numbers into HP/TQ.


    Ford has placed together a Diesel team, to analyze what applications, and possibilities are available for Diesel in the N.A. market. Meta One concept hints at what's possible, provided more refined gasoline is phased in so manufacturer's can introduce such vehicles.


    Ford of Europe's 2.7L TD V-6 would make a great engine addition for most passenger car applications in the NA market. While using the 2.0L for smaller applications.
  • mschmalmschmal Posts: 1,757
    This is a BOGUS ADD the car can not be purchased for that price because some of the listed programs are incompatable.


    RTCM is a direct mail offer

    RCL is Red carpet lease loyalty

    FRP is Ford replacement offer.

    and Military is active military only.


    RTCM, FRP, and military cannot be combined with each other. The best a customer could get is RCL and one of these three. How likely however is someone even going to be qualified for any of these let alone more than one?


  • johnclineiijohnclineii Posts: 2,287
    And dealers who run bogus ads have already proven they can't be trusted in at least one thing. Why on earth would you give them your business after they have proven how little they think of your intelligence?


    There are other dealers. I suggest you use one of them...
  • Ant,


    I will be in the market for a new car in the near future - October 2005 in my car does not pass smog (every year they make it harder to pass in California). If I pass, I have the luxury to continue driving what I have for another 2 years.


    I have been looking at the 500/freesytle for some time (I've been posting for a while, just not often). I've also been interested in the Passat (which is why I loved the design of the 500), especially the TDI passat.


    I think it would make sense for ford to bring over their diesel offerings to the US, especially after 2006 when the diesel ban is lifted in CA.


    The 500 already has some European flair (looks like the door panels were lifted from the Mondeo).


    It's just unfortunate that Americans have a hateful feeling towards diesels because of the smoke spewing beasts of the 70-80's.


    And speaking of the Mondeo...why didn't Ford lift the dash design from the Mondeo and install in the 500? Something like this photo -

    or d5.JPG


    Would have saved some design $$ - and still given it some euro flavor.
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687


    " October 2005 in my car does not pass smog (every year they make it harder to pass in California)"


    We had that in FL for quite awhile. It was quite a joke actually which they later removed... Worker's were getting bribed (I so did I) so vehicles would pass. Not that I'm giving you any ideas here.... Just drive the vehicle hard before having it tested, and hope they don't ram that tail pipe stick too deep, and your odds are with you.


    I agree, I would like to see diesel offerings, although market perception will take awhile to alter for it to gain willing acceptance. This isn't to say it won't occur though. Also, placement of the diesel engine upon a specific vehicle is very critical.


    Example: How many who buy a Focus, be willing to pay $2-3K for a diesel variant, on what is considered an economy car? As it was, not many taker's for the AdvanceTrac stability control system.


    Ford is able to offer the Power Stroke Diesel on it's SD F-series trucks mainly because some/many customer's require the extra torque of such an engine, as well as the reliability that comes with diesels. Pricing is over $30K +, add the diesel option which is a few thousands more, and your looking at a $40K+ truck, which brings in quite a bit of profit for Ford.


    So there's a fine-line of analyzing where to place such an engine. Would the regular 500 customer be willing to up a few thousands more for diesel? Etc. that's mainly what it boils down to.


    Also, while the Ford vehicles in europe are designed to accept their line of diesel engines, we have specific vehicles in N.A. that would require different engine mounting, and modifications to allow the front sub frame/assembly that would accept the engine, while keeping the excellent crash ratings.


    Then another item to consider, the transmission to be coupled with a diesel. It'll obviously require one that can handle high torque loads, therefore... would it fit in the mentioned vehicle?


    Currently, the Focus and Fusion would be the passenger cars that could be easily altered for a diesel engine. Although, it's much easier to design a diesel for an Explorer for example, or LD F-series, since there's much more engine space available and require less modifications.


    The Meta One concept hints at what's possible. Coupling it to a "hybrid" system, would allow for a consumer to receive a gov't/tax incentive (hopefully, if it still exists at that time) therefore allowing it to be a bit more reachable for most consumers.


    "And speaking of the Mondeo...why didn't Ford lift the dash design from the Mondeo and install in the 500?"


    Totally different size in every shape and form. You can only lift/add/replace dashboards when the vehicles are similar. SportTrac/Ranger, next SportTrac/Explorer will share the same dashboard since the SportTrac will be designed onto the new Explorers platform.


    Mounting points, cowl depth, firewall, electrical, airbags, A/C ducts, steering column all need to be at an exact place to allow for such a change.


    And above all, customer needs here in the U.S. The Mondeo's radio switches (evidence by it's glossiness) aren't not up to the quality of that of the 500. Also, much emphasize is placed to design the interior dashboard to facilitate it's use for people of all ages.


    Notice the size of many of the buttons in US Ford vehicles, even a gloved hand is able to operate it if need be. Focus for example, has the trunk-door release button up high in the dashboard, rather than having someone search on the door ledge for a lever, like many other cars have.


    Upon sitting on a vehicle, you should be able to view all buttons without moving your neck much (even elders who might have limited movements) Granted, not every vehicle can be designed specifically this way (for whatever engineering reason there might be), but this is how Ford has been concentrating/improving on it's interiors.


    Here's a picture of a Third Age suit used by engineers, to help them design interiors for elderly people for example.


  • brihambriham Posts: 33
    Here is a helpful review. There are a lot of pluses to this car such as higher ride, volvo safety features and a huge amount of storage space. The negatives seem to be the engine(one choice, mediocre power) and somewhat bland styling.

  • alan_salan_s Posts: 362
    I have an Avalon and went to see the new 500. I was amazed at the apparent quality of the materials, impressed with the design inside and out and couldn't wait to test drive it. It looked like a no-brainer decision over the competition.

    What a disappointment! This car has NO power and the noisy engine and transmission are revving high just to keep this 3,700 pound car moving.

    Driving the Avalon afterward was like going from a lawnmower into a fighter-jet in comparison.

    I can't believe how dumb the Ford engineering and marketing team must be if they think this can compete with 210hp Camrys that are MUCH quicker, let alone 240hp Accords, 250hp Altima's and 265hp Maximas.

    Come on Ford, even GM now have a 240hp engine in a BUICK!!!
  • ANT14ANT14 Posts: 2,687
    "Come on Ford, even GM now have a 240hp engine in a BUICK!!!"


    Considering the aging buying demographics of Buick, do we really want them to have that much power? I predict a slight increase of store-front crashes where Buick driver's are claiming their accelerator got stuck... :-)
This discussion has been closed.