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Comments
2.) destination charge. I have bought three cars in 4 years and never got them to leave off that charge.
3.) Price of $ 22,000- this seem reasonable. The price I paid for the cheaper LX was $ 19,000 in April of 2002. That included the roof rack and the CD player. Nothing else optional. But I like it plenty good and I think I use it too rough to have a leather package.
4.) Love you handle. as a parent of 2 ,the name warrior is very appropriate.
good luck shopping.
Hopefully he will log onto the boards or have someone else do it and figure out where they can meet with you to look at your car. maybe they can get Bonx KIA squared away at the same time.
KIA's quality improvement program with Dealers is called the " KIA CIRCLE OF QUALITY". In your case the circle appears to be broken into a Horseshoe.
I was told that the paint job was just a touch up, and if you know exactly where to look and the lighting is perfect you can almost see where the work was done, otherwise it is invisible.
$299 seems a bit high for dealer documentation fees...unless they rolled "advertising costs" into that. IMO, if the dealer tries to charge me advertising fees, I'll tell them (truthfully) that I had not seen any advertising for either the Sedona or the dealer. I made my decision to go with the Kia because of word of mouth and internet research, and chose the dealer because they are a mile from my house, and when I talked with them personally, they treated me with respect... unlike the Kia dealer down the street from where I work!
I showed the service manager of the dealership the printout I found on the recall, and he actually had not received it yet, but assured me if any of the vans on their lot are subject to the recall, he will take care of the recall when they do their "make ready" upon purchase. He had a positive, "can-do" attitude that impressed me.
One more question... is leasing worth it if we'd otherwise qualify for financing with a higher interest rate?? We have very little for down payment/trade in.
Leasing: Basically means paying for depreciation and wear and tear of the vehicle during the time you own it. Since the Sedona will depreciate like a rock, leasing a Sedona does not seem to be a good idea. Maybe somebody who is leasing a Sedona can provide some actual numbers ...
Edit: Plus, with leasing you will NEVER OWN the vehicle. It is just like paying rent on your apartment - Money down the drain, I say!
Like any business transaction a lease is built to maximize the dealers profit, the only way you can win is if the resale is higher than they figure.
Moreover, those same drivers that don't consider them should understand that during an emergency manuever involving panic brake pedal pressure, vehicle control is completely lost.
Non-ABS vehicles will continue in a straight line no matter how the steering wheel is manipulated until pedal pressure is released and traction between the tires and the road is physic(s)-ally re-established. As such, hitting something often happens before the brain can convince itself to release the brake pedal pressure to possibly avoid the accident.
Yet, ABS equipped vehicles remain steerable/controllable during panic stop situations.
Other than that They have not been that helpful. On the otherhand , for people that have had them fail entirely ( like my neighbor's Dodge Caravan or the numerous KIA owners ) they probably would says the heck with them . All it takes is one trip through a 4 way stop intersection to persuade you they are not worth the trouble.
I bet if we did a poll of those that had them fail they would says forget them. For people that have enjoyed the use of them and never had a failure, they would says they are great.
I like to err on simplicity.
It amazes me that these things are implemented in such a way that when the computers fail, you ALSO LOSE the POWER BRAKE FUNCTION!!
That just seems wrong , but apparently the engineers run an electric vacume pump or some thing like that , and it shuts off when the computer poops out.
Otherwise , ABS is a great technology.
Others are correct- a car that has LOW depreciation ( or a HIGH Residule value ) is cheaper to LEASE.
A car with NO RESALE value ( Like a KIA or Hyundai ) is a bad lease deal.
Until the CAR DEALERS place a higher value on used KIAS , the lease will suffer.
Right now I reccomend you consider a Home Equity LINE OF CREDIT which gives you a low interest rate of 3 or 4 % , which is TAX Deductible and also gives you a flexibler payment schedule that YOU decide how much you can afford to repay each month. Then get enough money to pay off the car and some other credit card debts.
ALSO - you will have no LEIN on the car, you will have FULL TITLE so if you need to you can sell it fast should a family crisis emergeg.
Plus the car become a full asset , and you have only ONE liability and that is the house.
Just a thought!
In my area ( Rochester NY ) the KIA dealer is offering -0- % financing.
In other problems, we got a new Kia yesterday... but see my post this morning in Kia Sedona problems for our first major headache, less than 24 hrs after taking it off the lot.
Second, it's possible, but highly unlikely, that an ABS malfunction can lead to total brake failure. These systems have been in use since before 1986 in the auto industry, developed originally for aviation use. They are well tested mechanically at this point.
Moreover, a total brake failure can occur in a car with/without ABS. I would be very interested in any evidence that total brake failures have occurred more often in ABS equipped vehicles. The IIHS should be all over any stat to that effect....
For anyone interested:
http://auto.howstuffworks.com/anti-lock-brake.htm
As for the four way stop - I almost went sailing through a 4 way stop once in heavy rain and low vis at 40 mph - cars were entering and turning in front of me. In a non-ABS car, I would have sailed right through. Instead I made a right 90 degree turn and extended the roll out into the break down lane - an impossible manuever without ABS...or professional training AND pre-planning (like for a movie).
The police officer I would have broad-sided made his left turn and continued on his way even though I ran the stop during the turn.
As for the point on simplicity, I prefer more options. No ABS, no steer, no option. We can agree to disagree on that point, imho.
In doing more research, steering is a liability. This is indicative of the sorry state of driver training in this country. I am keenly aware of the accident Friday on I-68, having driven through those same conditions twice the weekend before where the clueless sped along at 75 in 30 foot visibility.
40,000 lives every year are lost while driving, a number that is rising, many for lack of training. That's almost as many in one year as the US lost in the entire Vietnam War - rather appropriate time to think about that, as it turns out.
Soapbox off.
The van was still under warranty and went right back to the dealer who kept it a couple of days but said he could not find a problem! Never happened again in the two following years I had the van, but I was always afraid of those brakes.
I've only had one real emergency stop with the Sedona and I feel the Dodge would not have handled the emergency as well as the Kia!
I think the Sephia complaints are easily solved by those customers putting on new aftermarket pads and rotors at 20,000 miles. However , they probably expect the dealers to give them brakes for life. The Sedona issue is a listed recall , but many dealers just do not assign someone to call customers and let them know about these things.
When ABS first came out it was an add-on to the existing hydraulic system. Generaly there was a conventional power brake booster driven by engine vacume.
In time some of my electrical engineer genuis commrades decided that an electric vacume pump driven by the battery and linked to the ABS computer would be sufficent. The large , round metal drum that used to mounted on the firewall above the brake pedal could be eliminated. the space could be saved for other things. Under the crapped hood of a Dodge Caravan this seemed to be the case.
My neighbor had has electric brake pump fail, and lost all the power brake function. It was in some way tied into the ABS.
Since the front drive cars, with disk brakes , have pretty hard brake pads, trying to stop such a car with foot pressure is tough. When the brake rotors and pads are already worn down it is impossible.
So from that I concluded that ABS ( the way it is installed by the vendors ) has some problems.
However , if the ABS system had a manual backup from the engine vacume like power brakes normally are supplied, I think I would be less afraid of them.
Also , as a former user of them , I know that when they work , they work great.
Thanks for your comments too.
The best we can do is learn from each other and then try to make the best choics we can with that additional information.
that looks like a great deal.
you have to drive to a dealer that will supply that price, but hey for $ 1500-$ 2000 savings it would be worth it.
!!
My philosphy is to avoid braking at all costs.
We now have around 22K miles on the van and nothing to complain about. It's been all positive so far and I am confident that it will remain that way. This trip was the test for me and the Sedona passed with an A+. Almost forgot, the mileage we got on the van while fully packed and towing with a/c cranked was 19.5 . This is very good mileage considering what the van was subjected to. My Ram on the other hand was getting 8-9 mpg but I was towing a wind deflector
For us, leasing is the way to go - although it isn't for everyone. Our kids are growing and our needs change with them. Vehicles are depreciable assets, they'll never "make" you money. One advantage to the Kia is the longer warranty makes leasing for a longer period more attractive too. I just completed a 3 year lease on a Ford Expedition - I put only 27000 miles on it in 3 years for mileage isn't an issue for me. For people with long commutes or jobs that involve driving, leasing won't work. GOod luck!
First, total leasing cost is 269*36 + 2000 down = $11,684.
$2K down Scenario
Payment $327.90
36 months cost $13,804.4
Loan remain $7,797.42
Sell price $9,744
After loan payoff $1,946.58
Total Cost $11,857.81
Leasing wins by $173.82
Nothing down Monthly Payment $362.86
36 months cost $13,062.96
Loan remaining $8,538.85
Sell price $9,744
After loan payoff + $1,205.15
Total Cost 36 months - post sale = $11,857.81
Interest on $2K @ 2.15% for 36 mos. $133.13
Total Cost $11,724.68
Leasing wins by $40.68
So, looking at it that way, you do better by leasing by $41, except... you still have $2K in the bank, or a hot tub (which will affect the interest calculation....)
Of course, there are a boatload of assumptions, not the least of which is the sales price, a risk the financing company is accepting in the leasing scenario.
It's not cold water, just an analysis. Being that it's math, I hope somebody checks my numbers....
regards,, sean
<vbg>.
I would say you are very lucky to pack 8 people and that much gear and get 24 miles per gallon. I have yet to see any numbers much above 20.
Anyway this is my update, purchased our ex sedona on 3-31-02, to date 28k miles, still enjoying the vehicle despite on going nagging problems that i know can be fixed, such as a key fob that has never work correctly unless your lying on the hood, a/c that cools today, freezes up tomorrow, the rubber bumper on my car doors and gas cap door fell off, 2-tone paint, lower half peels easily
the recessed area behind the outside door handles scratch easily and looks tacky, and my air mass sensor failed last week, and it left us stranded on the road, and we got the run around on a crack dead center on the windshield that started from the bottom; and you wonder why we still like the vehicle, because the problems we encountered, i truly feel that they could have been resonably resolved quickly.
The problem is the incompetent and poor follow up of the service department of Leith KIA in Fayetteville, North Carolina.
I will give better details in the next couple of post. We feel it is a very capable vehicle, i just have not been able to find the time to travel to another kia dealership to get it repaired properly.
Check out the Store Bought Waxes Part II (No Zaino Posts) for tons of info and opinions.
Steve, Host
Steve, Host
First tank. All interstate. 21.54 mpg
Second tank. 80% interstate 20% state. 21.50 mpg
Third tank. 50% state 50% local. 17.60 mpg
Fourth tank. All interstate. 23.77 mpg
Most of the interstate miles were on cruise control at 65 to 75 mph.
Air pressure in tires 36 psi.
I made an appointment with Westerchester KIA (10 miles away) to bring my Sedona to them for a checkup and hope that they will find out what's wrong with my Sedona that only registered 10.75 local (at least for the last two tanks). I printed out what Smulvey has suggested (what might have gone wrong with my Sedona in his post #3426) and brought it to them.
A quite nice guy (compared to those in the Bronx KIA) named Jerry in the service department gave me the same answer after I told him my Sedona only registered 10.75 mpg local. He said that the milage is totally depending on how each individual is driving the car. I then told him that I have been driving for 20 odds years and I know what should be a right way to drive a car to save gas. He then told me that using a different brand of gas may help. As to the computer control thing, he said there is nothing he can do about it since the engine light didn't come up. He had no "code" to put in when he hooked up the computer with the car (something like that). He was not at all helpful, though he was quite sympathetic and was willing to listening to my complaints. I do appreciate that he didn't say something like "11 mpg was NORMAL for a Sedona". He also said that increase the tire pressure wasn't a good idea, only to increase the risk and wearing of the tire.
Again, I am stuck with a Sedona that registered less than 11 mpg local and no KIA dealership or KIA company Customer Service seem to be willing to help. Too bad for such a nice and confortable minivan that cost a lot less than others out there.
I'd like to see a service technician tell you that MPG at those levels is typical.
at least the engine control maybe ok.
but did they check you brakes for drag?
Also- this is a long shot, but take the car to an alignment shop. see if it is aligned properly.
I had 2 Ford Taurus that were welded crooked at the Ford plant. The gas milage went up after the alignemnt was checked, found to be grosly out of wack , and was repaired by remountung certain parts.
The interesting thing was the car drove really nice and was easy to handle, even with bad alignment.
Also I did send copies of your difficulty to PEter Butterfield at KIA Irvine, We will see if anyone contacts you.
My last gas milage , to Buffalo last week was about 23 MPG. I am headed to Albany Wed and will report milage when I return on Friday.
Regards, Sean
I will have to bring the car to a local garage to have them check up the drag thing you talked aobut.
However, I did remove the third row seats (took a while to figure it out how to do it). I hope it will help a little bit before my problem (11 mpg) is resolved.
The website I *love* the most is http://www.carbuyingtips.com It's a consumer education website, so hopefully, Steve will not impound the link and send me an email :-)
Steve, Host
Low base and high pitched sound doesn't sound as it supposed to.
Does anyone knows quality of original equipped speakers? If its a cheap paper version, I would definietly upgrade to something else.
rnclem,
I've been looking at the aftermarket options and most of them specify a T-one wiring harness kit ($40-$60) that is made for the Sedona. The instructions are porsted online. They state that you need only to unscrew the floor panel beneath the liftgate. You then use plug-in t-connectors to connect into the tail light wiring. (I have a similar after-market U-haul harness on my Jeep GC.) It looks like the hitch shops use a similar method.
Was there any information in your kit which explained why you needed to go all the way down to the battery for a connection?
Also, is the KIA hitch a 3-bolt connection or a 2-bolt? The five available aftermarket hitches seem to vary a lot in their connection methods, but only the Draw-tite requires that you drill a hole. On the other hand, the Drawtite has the highest capacity ratings. Three of the others don't even meet the Sedona's tow capacity.
I'm interested in a Class II/III with a 2" receiver, if anyone else has done a DIY hitch, I'd appreciate the input.
This hitch requires no drilling and attaches with 5 bolts. Four of the bolts go into existing holes that are part of the frame holding the rear bumper on. Hidden Hitch provides four new longer bolts to use. The fifth attachment is onto one of the cargo tie down loops below the van.
The install was very simple and probably took no more than 30 minutes.
You can see info on this hitch on hiddenhitch.com. I purchased it based on recommendations posted very early in this site.