Mako, if my memory serves me, that's a picture of a '55 Roadmaster. My Dad owned a '56 Roadmaster convertible - white with red leather interior. It still is one of the most beautiful convertibles Buick ever produced.
Nope, that's a 1953 Buick Skylark. Beautiful cars!
I think Acura made a huge marketing mistake when they dropped the "Legend" name.
Yes, dropping the Legend name was just a poor decision.
We used to call RL's "Renamed Legends"
When the beaks first came out I was working the floor in the Honda section and Acura was right next to us. I head nothing but negative comments from the crowd.
Isel, it has always seemed to me that there was a little friction or competition between Honda and Acura. Maybe as if the Honda people resented Acura in some way. Would like to have your thoughts on this.
"Isel, it has always seemed to me that there was a little friction or competition between Honda and Acura. Maybe as if the Honda people resented Acura in some way. Would like to have your thoughts on this"
I know you asked for Isell's opinion on this, but for what it's worth, I have a few comments about Acura and Honda as someone who was in the car business for over 10 years.
From my experiences, the two brands are very differently perceived by buyers. Honda buyers tend to be in the market for a reasonably priced economical car that will last 5+ years with little or no major mechanical problems.
Acura buyers tend to be in the market for a mid-sized luxury car that is sporty, practical and reliable. They are willing to pay several thousand dollars more for those features Honda buyers tend to reject.
I've known many salesmen who worked at both Honda and Acura dealerships. They always felt that their products were above reproach, but would have no difficulty referring their customers to Honda (if Acura salesmen) or Acura (if Honda Salesmen).
They all seemed to feel that Acura customers were more upscale and Honda customers more middle of the road. Acura customers, in general, would not consider a Honda purchase. Honda customers, in general, would consider an Acura purchase.
The salesmen I knew who sold both lines had no negative feelings toward one or the other brand. Each brand serves a slightly different clientele.
@explorerx4 said:
oldfarmer Have build a Mustang on the Ford site? The optional rear axles are only available with the performance pkg. 3.55 for Ecoboost perf pkg and 3.73 for GT perf pkg.
Yeah, you're right. I didn't see that because I was configuring for auto and the performance package is only available with manual.
Bummer, no Brembos, no killer rear end, no fun unless you want to pay an extra $2500 and shift for yourself. Probably kill the gas milage anyway.
A back up camera comes standard though.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
@oldfarmer Sometimes those performance oriented packages are great for the track, but don't work so well on an every day basis. I doubt you will disappointed with a Mustang GT, no matter what the configuration. Are you still leaning towards yellow?
2024 Ford F-150 STX, 2023 Ford Explorer ST, 91 Mustang GT vert
Until you get the finances figured out, why not take a test drive when the dealer has one for you to "experience". It's fun and free and may help you settle on options.
"Isel, it has always seemed to me that there was a little friction or competition between Honda and Acura. Maybe as if the Honda people resented Acura in some way. Would like to have your thoughts on this"
Thanks for your insights Mike. Your opinions, especially with your background, are always welcome. My question was probably not very clear, but what I meant was if there was any friction at the corporate level.
oldfarmer, I don't keep a log of MPG, but in general the V6 got 28 MPG and the GT gets 24 MPG. I could do better If I tried, but what's the point of getting 420HP then being a lightfoot. Besides I live in the mountains so I only use gas going uphill.
"Isel, it has always seemed to me that there was a little friction or competition between Honda and Acura. Maybe as if the Honda people resented Acura in some way. Would like to have your thoughts on this"
I know you asked for Isell's opinion on this, but for what it's worth, I have a few comments about Acura and Honda as someone who was in the car business for over 10 years.
From my experiences, the two brands are very differently perceived by buyers. Honda buyers tend to be in the market for a reasonably priced economical car that will last 5+ years with little or no major mechanical problems.
Acura buyers tend to be in the market for a mid-sized luxury car that is sporty, practical and reliable. They are willing to pay several thousand dollars more for those features Honda buyers tend to reject.
I've known many salesmen who worked at both Honda and Acura dealerships. They always felt that their products were above reproach, but would have no difficulty referring their customers to Honda (if Acura salesmen) or Acura (if Honda Salesmen).
They all seemed to feel that Acura customers were more upscale and Honda customers more middle of the road. Acura customers, in general, would not consider a Honda purchase. Honda customers, in general, would consider an Acura purchase.
The salesmen I knew who sold both lines had no negative feelings toward one or the other brand. Each brand serves a slightly different clientele.
You summed it up pretty well for Houdini and I agree with what you said.
Oh, sometimes we might refer to an Acura TL as a "glorified V-6 Accord" or we would call an MDX a "glorified Pilot" And they were for the most part.
Nicer? Of course! Worth the difference in price? Up to the individual buyer.
"Thanks for your insights Mike. Your opinions, especially with your background, are always welcome. My question was probably not very clear, but what I meant was if there was any friction at the corporate level."
Sorry, must have missed your intent there.
Interesting question though.
I remember back in 2006 when Nissan Motors was trying to determine where to place their GT-R (Skyline in Japan with the body of an Infiniti G Coupe, but the power of a rocket). There was quite a bit of infighting among the Infiniti and Nissan corporate execs as well as dealership principals. Infiniti felt that they could market the GT-R better in it's upscale dealerships (considering the pricing of the GT-R in the $90,000-$100,000 range).
When the decision came down to market the sports car as a Nissan in Nissan dealerships, a serious rift developed between the two divisions. I still think the GT-R would sell much better with an Infiniti logo, especially considering the current pricing of $110,000+++. Who goes to a Nissan dealership to spend $110,000?
I guess the same people who buy Corvettes at Chevy dealers costing $80,000. But Corvette has always been a Chevrolet while the GT-R was new to the American market from Japan.
The rift continues as a sore spot at the corporate level.
I have a couple of questions regarding buying a car, if I may. I didn't want to start a new thread for simple questions, so hopefully this one will be OK. First of all, do you have any hesitation in buying a 3-4 year old used car if said car was a lease return? I do, because it seems to me that people I know who lease cars do not take very good care of them, especially maintenance. I don't want engine/transmission trouble down the line, as I keep my cars for a long time. I have always bought new, but that does have a price. I would like to consider a clean 3-4 year old used car. There are so many lease returns on the used market today, but I don't want to be "penny wise and pound foolish".
Second question is regarding turbo-charged engines. I'm in my 60's, and a sizable number of people I have known over the years have had issues with turbos, especially after the warranty has run out. I have never owned a turbo-engined car for just this reason. But, there are more and more turbos coming out in the interest of gas mileage. Am I being silly not considering a turbo? I guess I could get the extended warranty if I do get a turbo, but I really hate to have maintenance issues/hassles.
Do you all have thoughts on these questions? Thanks in advance for any answers.
I remember back in 2006 when Nissan Motors was trying to determine where to place their GT-R (Skyline in Japan with the body of an Infiniti G Coupe, but the power of a rocket). There was quite a bit of infighting among the Infiniti and Nissan corporate execs as well as dealership principals. Infiniti felt that they could market the GT-R better in it's upscale dealerships (considering the pricing of the GT-R in the $90,000-$100,000 range).
Thanks again Mike. Yes, that's the type of awkwardness I was talking about between the regular divisions and the luxury divisions. I would think there would be more examples like the one you mentioned between Nissan and Infiniti. How about Toyota and Lexus? Any stories?
I hope everyone has a fun and safe 4th of July. My dad used to bring home a big water melon and fireworks every 4th of July when I was growing up and we all would have a blast (pardon the pun) !
I have kept that tradition alive and will be enjoying my water melon tomorrow and watching all the fireworks displays !
"Thanks again Mike. Yes, that's the type of awkwardness I was talking about between the regular divisions and the luxury divisions. I would think there would be more examples like the one you mentioned between Nissan and Infiniti. How about Toyota and Lexus? Any stories?"
Actually, no! When I was with Lexus, we considered Toyota as trash compared to the Lexus. We were always being reminded by Toyota that the ES Lexus was merely an agrandized Camry because they were built on the Camry chassis at the time. But in actuality, that was the only similarity in the two cars.
But at the corporate level, the two divisions were so different (Lexus/Toyota) and run independently of each other, there really was no animosity between the two corporate divisions.
Lexus was really almost run independently of the Toyota brand. Not so with Acura/Honda, Infiniti/Nissan, etc.
Does anybody have an opinion why VW's sales are plunging? Seems Audi is doing fine, but VW is in the toilet. My thesis is that Toyota clone without Toyota's reliability finally caught up with them. They have always been below average with reliability, but driving experience, edgy styling and features were offsetting it. They had a niche, but the fans were quite fanatic. Then they decided on cutting price with features (e.g. suspension, brakes on base versions are different than on upper trims) to raise sales. The styling also went generic. Worked initially, but now it seems you simply cannot outcamry Toyota. Others tried it before and failed as well. Seems VW had to find it out on their own.
"Does anybody have an opinion why VW's sales are plunging?"
My opinion has more to do with the stagnant designs on the VW's. They are long overdue for some major redesign on the Passat. Additionally, the 2.0T engine needs a boost in power.
Couple the above with stiff competition and outstanding styling from Hyundai and Kia as well as from GM, Ford and Chrysler, you end up with sales falling behind the major competitors.
VW has expanded its manufacturing in Brazil and Mexico which is also a possible reason for US sales drooping. I would bet that if they built more of their cars and SUV's here in the US, sales would rise.
One of my friends works at the highest volume VW dealership in the US here in south Florida. He said they get most of their competition from Kia (Optima) and Hyundai (Sonata) down here. From his perspective, sales have increased over last year at his dealership, however sales of vehicles in south Florida are not representative of the rest of the country.
My opinion is that VW doesn't really understand the US market. They need more models, faster turn-around and faster innovation. They just don't understand their competition.
@thebean said:
I have a couple of questions regarding buying a car, if I may. I didn't want to start a new thread for simple questions, so hopefully this one will be OK. First of all, do you have any hesitation in buying a 3-4 year old used car if said car was a lease return? I do, because it seems to me that people I know who lease cars do not take very good care of them, especially maintenance. I don't want engine/transmission trouble down the line, as I keep my cars for a long time. I have always bought new, but that does have a price. I would like to consider a clean 3-4 year old used car. There are so many lease returns on the used market today, but I don't want to be "penny wise and pound foolish".
Second question is regarding turbo-charged engines. I'm in my 60's, and a sizable number of people I have known over the years have had issues with turbos, especially after the warranty has run out. I have never owned a turbo-engined car for just this reason. But, there are more and more turbos coming out in the interest of gas mileage. Am I being silly not considering a turbo? I guess I could get the extended warranty if I do get a turbo, but I really hate to have maintenance issues/hassles.
Do you all have thoughts on these questions? Thanks in advance for any answers.
Larry C
I suppose SOME people who lease cars skimp on maintenance but I think that most people are pretty good about oil changes etc. I know I wouldn't be afraid myself.
I'm not a big fan of turbos. I'm sure they have improved but why have one when modern four cylinder engines can be more than adequate.
thebean, I can offer only one opinion. Others here may disagree.
I too am skeptical of turbos. They run at very high speeds and require the best in lubrication and maintenance which may not always happen with a rental/lease vehicle.
I had a friend with a 79 Mustang 4 cyl turbo who had his turbo get fried just past the warranty and he was extra careful with maintenance. That was 79 and this is 2014, but I still don't like the idea of a turbo. Naturally aspirated and free flow exhaust only for me. Dave
I have owned three turbocharged cars(1984 Thunderbird Turbo Coupe, 1991 Volvo 744T, 2007 Mazdaspeed 3) and I have only replaced one turbo. Some early Mazdaspeed turbos would smoke at idle and my car was one such example. It was replaced under warranty at 26kmiles. The replacement has been on the car for over 113k miles with no issues whatsoever.
As for lease returns? I have yet to have a bad experience. Depreciation is my friend; I've purchased several off-lease CPO BMWs for the price of a new mid-range Escape or Camry. No regrets.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
@thebean said First of all, do you have any hesitation in buying a 3-4 year old used car if said car was a lease return?
Short answer. I took as good care for my leased cars as my owned ones. I kept them in good shape because I may want to buy it back at the end of the lease. Also, the company I worked for paid for any maintenance or repairs, so sometimes work got done better than if it was privately owned. I wouldn't hesitate to buy a leased used car, from a reputable dealer. Also, I think if you take some care and pride in your car, it doesn't matter if it is owned or leased.
I love turbo engines. One of the great things to enjoy in driving today is the added boost of power a turbo gives....and I think it adds to your safety, for example coming onto a freeway.
There is some risk, as turbos work hard, but, I personally would risk it. I think I would seriously want at least a 2 year extended warranty on most used cars.....one electronic repair can cost $1000s, turbo or not.
@thebean said:
First of all, do you have any hesitation in buying a 3-4 year old used car if said car was a lease return? I do, because it seems to me that people I know who lease cars do not take very good care of them, especially maintenance.
I would say you are better off with the 3-4 year lease than one that was a one or two year lease. The ones I knew that didn't take very good care of their cars were the ones that knew they were not going to have them very long. That being said there is not much maintenance required for a car in that first 48K miles other than oil changes and some inspections.
Second question is regarding turbo-charged engines.
As for the turbos, if you are light footed and only need the extra power that the turbo provides once in a great while then go for it. If your driving style or power needs from the engine require a lot of work from the turbo forget it. My understanding is that the turbo needs time between bursts to cool down and if you are engaging the turbo at each stop light you will burn it out.
Many 4 cylinder cars now have more than adequate power for most any real world driving. The wife's Sonata has more than enough power for merging or passing. So unless you want high performance I would stay away from turbos.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
@explorerx4 said:
oldfarmer Sometimes those performance oriented packages are great for the track, but don't work so well on an every day basis. I doubt you will disappointed with a Mustang GT, no matter what the configuration. Are you still leaning towards yellow?
Yes and no. I first saw the tricolor yellow in a Ford magazine a Ford nut at work slipped me and it looked nice:
@jayrider said:
Until you get the finances figured out, why not take a test drive when the dealer has one for you to "experience". It's fun and free and may help you settle on options.
Might do that even though I hate to be a "stroke" who wastes a salespersons time months before I plan to buy.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
"Second question is regarding turbo-charged engines."
Your first question about buying a previously leased vehicle is always a consideration. However, there really is very little difference between buying a used "owned" vehicle and a used "leased" vehicle. Most people take care of their cars (not all), but most. Leased vehicles are put on used car lots of dealerships only after inspections, service histories, CARFAXES, are reviewed. Otherwise they would be wholesaled.
The worst leased cars are those that have short-term leases. Stay away from those.
As for TURBOS, I really think it depends on the manufacturer of the engine and turbo. This is my first "twin turbo" engine in quite some time. I had a 2008 BMW 535i and it did not perform as quickly off the line as I would have liked.
I only use the turbos on my CLS 550 when entering a turnpike or interstate. Otherwise, I don't use them at all.
If you are buying a turbo, have your own mechanic check it over and drive it. He would be the one to notice undue hesitation and/or wear. Today, many cars have turbos - just be careful and make sure you buy an extended warranty.
thebean echoes my exact concerns about buying off lease cars. I would think the first thing to do is ask for service records to assure yourself that the previous owner at least did basic maintenance. There's always the fear in the back of your mind that he beat it like a rental car for three years. But that's true of any car.
As to turbos I'm sure they build them better these days but why risk have an expensive part blow up when a non-turbo can do the job.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
"If you are buying a turbo, have your own mechanic check it over and drive it. He would be the one to notice undue hesitation and/or wear. Today, many cars have turbos - just be careful and make sure you buy an extended warranty."
I would recommend that a mechanic check out ANY 3 year old car, not just turbos. After all you could be spending $15, $20k or more depending on the brand so it's essential. I like the extended warranty idea too. What's $1000 now to save many thousands later.
Way back in 87 I bought an off lease 84 Chevy. Had my mechanic check it out and found several oil leaks which were repaired by the dealer as part of the negotiation. Turned down the extended warranty which was $300 IIRC. About a week after the 30 day warranty expired it blew the AC compressor (like all GMs) and cost me the same $300. Hate to think what I would have done with a turbo that blew.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
I have never, never had an AC compressor fail on my GM cars.
Never.
If you had seen the compressors from all the other companies
taken apart and laid out side-by-side, you would wonder how
the others even make it off the dealership lots before dying.
In fact, for a time some other companies were using GM's compressors.
@imidazol97 said:
In fact, for a time some other companies were using GM's compressors.
Yes, imid, GM AC compressors have been used in many makes and models of cars throughout the years. At one time, Mercedes used only "Fridgidaire" compressors (1992-1999). That was as a result of horrible compressors being used in their cars. I had 4 or 5 Mercedes Benz cars during the 80's and 90's, and all of them took for ever to cool the car down. Arguably, I lived in the California Desert Area for most of the 90's, and most compressors struggle in that kind of heat in the summertime. But in the Benz, it was awful. Now, the air-conditioning in their cars is outstanding. Even better than BMW - from my experiences with both brands.
That Rolls Royce Wraith I posted about last week (brown/beige two-tone) sold on the third day it was wheeled into the Boca Town Center Mall, according to the sales rep who replaced it with a white Wraith this morning. It sold for MSRP (of course). He said the Wraith is new for 2014, and built on the Ghost platform. 660 hp out of a 12 cylinder twin turbo engine. Even with the Wraith weighing in at about 5000+ pounds, 660 hp should move that rascal around quite well, I would think.
The dealer (Rolls/Bentley of Palm Beach) also shows up with Phantoms every so often. That Phantom is so wide and long, it would never fit well into my parking space. So I guess I'll pass on buying one for that very reason!!!
Thanks for sharing. Linda Ronstadt is one of my favorite female signers, too bad Parkinson's disease has destroyed her body. If you like jazz you will love her rendition of "what's new."
I'm not a big fan of turbos. I'm sure they have improved but why have one when modern four cylinder engines can be more than adequate.
Just my opinion, but I don't think anyone who is satisfied with "adequate" would be a possible candidate for a car with a turbocharged engine.
I have owned two cars that came equipped with turbocharged 4 cylinder engines, a 1985 Dodge and a 2008 Passat (still own that one). I have had no negative experiences with the engines, but I bought both of them new and took very good care of them - Frequent oil changes, always used synthetic oil, etc.
I would be somewhat hesitant to buy a used car with a turbo. I would want to know that it was adult owned, and properly maintained. (I would buy a used turbo from myself, in other words! (smile) )
I would be leary of buying any high performance car used. Something with a big torquey V-8 (Mustang GT, Camaro SS) would worry me a good deal less than a high revving turbocharged 4 cylinder.
Leaving aside the turbo question, if I were in your position I would much prefer an off-lease car to a rental unit. I think the rental cars are the ones that get abused horrifically.
My understanding is that the turbo needs time between bursts to cool down and if you are engaging the turbo at each stop light you will burn it out.
That was never really true. What was true, many years ago before the widespread use of synthetic oil, was that you needed to allow the turbo time to cool down before stopping the engine. These days, just use a high quality synthetic oil, and it is not a problem.
I remember Brock Yates writing that in less than 25 years Mercedes was transformed from a brand that was sold at Studebaker dealers and beloved of eccentric college professors into one of the most respected/aspirational automobiles in the US and the world. BLW followed a similar trajectory from 1955 to 1980, leaving behind the Baroque Angels and Isettas and becoming the marque that was known for building iconic sports coupes and sedans. Of course Munich is now squandering that brand image by trying to be all things to all people, but I digress...
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Sons Jetta has a turbo. I doubt any normal driver could tell as it is transparent. But quite quick, and an easy 37-38 highway, good around town, all out of 1.8l on RUG.
@imidazol97 said:
In fact, for a time some other companies were using GM's compressors.
That's interesting. I've had nothing but bad luck. The aforementioned Chevy, 82 Olds, 91 Olds, 84 Corvette and just recently my son's 98 Buick. The only one still plugging along is the other son's 93 Caddy. I've had Ford and Chryslers stop cooling but a can of 134 made them work again. The GMs all blew compressors.
Maybe I just have a GM jinx.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
I have a 2005 Passat 1.8T with 115K miles and not one turbo issue.
It it under powered with the AC on around town but once the turbo hits and get it into the power band, it does fine. 30 mpg on the highway with premium.
stickguy - tell your son to use premium as recommended - using regular in the 1.8T is a false economy.
Turbos are the "substitute for cubic inches" that you keep hearing about that have no substitute
So yeah, a 1.6 or 1.8L engine pushing 3,000+ pounds needs a turbo, but a 2 or 3 liter engine probably doesn't. It's really up to you to decide if the car you are considering really has the "grunt" (torque) to get you away nicely on freeway ramps and up long steep inclines. Nobody wants to be stuck in an underpowered car with passengers screaming up a hill in 3rd gear.
Modern turbos are efficient and long-lived, and aren't really all that expensive to replace at the end of their service life.
So if you need a dinky car engine to go faster, or you need a high performance car to go scary-fast, or you have a diesel-powered car or truck, then you need a turbo; otherwise, I don't see why you do.
So if you need a dinky car engine to go faster, or you need a high performance car to go scary-fast, or you have a diesel-powered car or truck, then you need a turbo; otherwise, I don't see why you do.
Everything in life is a trade off, isn't it? Back in 2008, I could get a Passat with a 4 cylinder and turbo, or a Camry with the V6. Both were fast, and fun to drive. But the Passat was more fun, and about the same money, so ...
If I had bought the Camry, it would have cost a bit less for routine maintenance over the 103k miles I have owned the car, and it would have a higher resale value now. But the difference is not that much, and I have enjoyed the Passat. So like the man said,
I was pretty amazed that a small, insignificant Low Pressure Area off the coast of St.Augustine, FL, could develop in just 3 days from a "nothing" into a hurricane. Usually these storms organize in the Gulf of Mexico this time of year and later in the hurricane season, off the coast of Africa as they travel across the mid Atlantic toward the East and West Indies.
It's very ominous for a Category 2 hurricane to form so close to the mainland U.S. I understand that the Gulf Stream influenced this fast organization. I thought the El Nino in the Southeast Pacific was going to inhibit hurricane development this year. Guess the meteorologists got that one wrong.
I honestly don't understand why Mercedes put twin turbos in the base CLS 550. I can understand it in the AMG models, but why the base CLS 550? A 4.7 litre V8 should have more than enough torque and hp without the use of turbos. Accelerating from 35 mph on the highway to 70 mph can give you whiplash in my car. Without twin turbos, how much "thrust" would I lose?
It's very ominous for a Category 2 hurricane to form so close to the mainland U.S. I understand that the Gulf Stream influenced this fast organization. I thought the El Nino in the Southeast Pacific was going to inhibit hurricane development this year. Guess the meteorologists got that one wrong.
It's pretty normal I think. Not sure I would call it ominous. The hype up here has been unreal of course. The media really needs to throttle back the fear-mongering. This thing is now going to mostly miss us and bring a bit of wind tomorrow but that's about all. Nevertheless they are telling people to fill their bathtubs, buy bottled water and canned food, etc. Ridiculous. I imagine we will be playing golf here around suppertime.
The media has lost all sense of balance in reporting on weather. They could serve a valuable role by informing us of real threats when they happen. Instead they overblow every little thing whether a threat or not, and as a result the public becomes desensitized. That in turn makes fora real problem when a big threat appears and people just blow it off as another false alarm.
Of course, there is such a thing as too much power in a car with a poor chassis and brakes...I believe the term I'm groping for is "Death Trap".
As you know from your time viewing others on the track-- "If you are a lousy driver with 200HP, you're going to be REALLY bad with 400HP".
I've had a lot of turbo and SC cars--the only thing I don't like about some turbos is peakiness---a big ON/OFF switch. Nowadays, "turbo lag" is rather rare in a modern car.
@roadburner said:
In my opinion, horsepower is like some other things(that I won't mention on a family-oriented forum):
Nowadays, "turbo lag" is rather rare in a modern car.
We have a Buick Encore with a 138 hp, AWD, 4 cylinder, 6 speed transmission with turbo. Since I never had a turbo charged vehicle before I cannot tell the difference since the CUV takes 10+ seconds to 60.
Comments
Nope, that's a 1953 Buick Skylark. Beautiful cars!
Yes, dropping the Legend name was just a poor decision.
We used to call RL's "Renamed Legends"
When the beaks first came out I was working the floor in the Honda section and Acura was right next to us. I head nothing but negative comments from the crowd.
" Oh WHAT were they thinking?"
" They RUINED the looks of the front ends!"
Isel, it has always seemed to me that there was a little friction or competition between Honda and Acura. Maybe as if the Honda people resented Acura in some way. Would like to have your thoughts on this.
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
"Isel, it has always seemed to me that there was a little friction or competition between Honda and Acura. Maybe as if the Honda people resented Acura in some way. Would like to have your thoughts on this"
I know you asked for Isell's opinion on this, but for what it's worth, I have a few comments about Acura and Honda as someone who was in the car business for over 10 years.
From my experiences, the two brands are very differently perceived by buyers. Honda buyers tend to be in the market for a reasonably priced economical car that will last 5+ years with little or no major mechanical problems.
Acura buyers tend to be in the market for a mid-sized luxury car that is sporty, practical and reliable. They are willing to pay several thousand dollars more for those features Honda buyers tend to reject.
I've known many salesmen who worked at both Honda and Acura dealerships. They always felt that their products were above reproach, but would have no difficulty referring their customers to Honda (if Acura salesmen) or Acura (if Honda Salesmen).
They all seemed to feel that Acura customers were more upscale and Honda customers more middle of the road. Acura customers, in general, would not consider a Honda purchase. Honda customers, in general, would consider an Acura purchase.
The salesmen I knew who sold both lines had no negative feelings toward one or the other brand. Each brand serves a slightly different clientele.
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
Yeah, you're right. I didn't see that because I was configuring for auto and the performance package is only available with manual.
Bummer, no Brembos, no killer rear end, no fun unless you want to pay an extra $2500 and shift for yourself. Probably kill the gas milage anyway.
A back up camera comes standard though.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
@oldfarmer Sometimes those performance oriented packages are great for the track, but don't work so well on an every day basis. I doubt you will disappointed with a Mustang GT, no matter what the configuration. Are you still leaning towards yellow?
Until you get the finances figured out, why not take a test drive when the dealer has one for you to "experience". It's fun and free and may help you settle on options.
Thanks for your insights Mike. Your opinions, especially with your background, are always welcome. My question was probably not very clear, but what I meant was if there was any friction at the corporate level.
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
oldfarmer, I don't keep a log of MPG, but in general the V6 got 28 MPG and the GT gets 24 MPG. I could do better If I tried, but what's the point of getting 420HP then being a lightfoot. Besides I live in the mountains so I only use gas going uphill.
2013 Mustang GT, 2001 GMC Yukon Denali
You summed it up pretty well for Houdini and I agree with what you said.
Oh, sometimes we might refer to an Acura TL as a "glorified V-6 Accord" or we would call an MDX a "glorified Pilot" And they were for the most part.
Nicer? Of course! Worth the difference in price? Up to the individual buyer.
"Thanks for your insights Mike. Your opinions, especially with your background, are always welcome. My question was probably not very clear, but what I meant was if there was any friction at the corporate level."
Sorry, must have missed your intent there.
Interesting question though.
I remember back in 2006 when Nissan Motors was trying to determine where to place their GT-R (Skyline in Japan with the body of an Infiniti G Coupe, but the power of a rocket). There was quite a bit of infighting among the Infiniti and Nissan corporate execs as well as dealership principals. Infiniti felt that they could market the GT-R better in it's upscale dealerships (considering the pricing of the GT-R in the $90,000-$100,000 range).
When the decision came down to market the sports car as a Nissan in Nissan dealerships, a serious rift developed between the two divisions. I still think the GT-R would sell much better with an Infiniti logo, especially considering the current pricing of $110,000+++. Who goes to a Nissan dealership to spend $110,000?
I guess the same people who buy Corvettes at Chevy dealers costing $80,000. But Corvette has always been a Chevrolet while the GT-R was new to the American market from Japan.
The rift continues as a sore spot at the corporate level.
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
I have a couple of questions regarding buying a car, if I may. I didn't want to start a new thread for simple questions, so hopefully this one will be OK. First of all, do you have any hesitation in buying a 3-4 year old used car if said car was a lease return? I do, because it seems to me that people I know who lease cars do not take very good care of them, especially maintenance. I don't want engine/transmission trouble down the line, as I keep my cars for a long time. I have always bought new, but that does have a price. I would like to consider a clean 3-4 year old used car. There are so many lease returns on the used market today, but I don't want to be "penny wise and pound foolish".
Second question is regarding turbo-charged engines. I'm in my 60's, and a sizable number of people I have known over the years have had issues with turbos, especially after the warranty has run out. I have never owned a turbo-engined car for just this reason. But, there are more and more turbos coming out in the interest of gas mileage. Am I being silly not considering a turbo? I guess I could get the extended warranty if I do get a turbo, but I really hate to have maintenance issues/hassles.
Do you all have thoughts on these questions? Thanks in advance for any answers.
Larry C
Thanks again Mike. Yes, that's the type of awkwardness I was talking about between the regular divisions and the luxury divisions. I would think there would be more examples like the one you mentioned between Nissan and Infiniti. How about Toyota and Lexus? Any stories?
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
Independence Day !
I hope everyone has a fun and safe 4th of July. My dad used to bring home a big water melon and fireworks every 4th of July when I was growing up and we all would have a blast (pardon the pun) !
I have kept that tradition alive and will be enjoying my water melon tomorrow and watching all the fireworks displays !
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
"Thanks again Mike. Yes, that's the type of awkwardness I was talking about between the regular divisions and the luxury divisions. I would think there would be more examples like the one you mentioned between Nissan and Infiniti. How about Toyota and Lexus? Any stories?"
Actually, no! When I was with Lexus, we considered Toyota as trash compared to the Lexus. We were always being reminded by Toyota that the ES Lexus was merely an agrandized Camry because they were built on the Camry chassis at the time. But in actuality, that was the only similarity in the two cars.
But at the corporate level, the two divisions were so different (Lexus/Toyota) and run independently of each other, there really was no animosity between the two corporate divisions.
Lexus was really almost run independently of the Toyota brand. Not so with Acura/Honda, Infiniti/Nissan, etc.
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
Does anybody have an opinion why VW's sales are plunging? Seems Audi is doing fine, but VW is in the toilet. My thesis is that Toyota clone without Toyota's reliability finally caught up with them. They have always been below average with reliability, but driving experience, edgy styling and features were offsetting it. They had a niche, but the fans were quite fanatic. Then they decided on cutting price with features (e.g. suspension, brakes on base versions are different than on upper trims) to raise sales. The styling also went generic. Worked initially, but now it seems you simply cannot outcamry Toyota. Others tried it before and failed as well. Seems VW had to find it out on their own.
2018 430i Gran Coupe
"Does anybody have an opinion why VW's sales are plunging?"
My opinion has more to do with the stagnant designs on the VW's. They are long overdue for some major redesign on the Passat. Additionally, the 2.0T engine needs a boost in power.
Couple the above with stiff competition and outstanding styling from Hyundai and Kia as well as from GM, Ford and Chrysler, you end up with sales falling behind the major competitors.
VW has expanded its manufacturing in Brazil and Mexico which is also a possible reason for US sales drooping. I would bet that if they built more of their cars and SUV's here in the US, sales would rise.
One of my friends works at the highest volume VW dealership in the US here in south Florida. He said they get most of their competition from Kia (Optima) and Hyundai (Sonata) down here. From his perspective, sales have increased over last year at his dealership, however sales of vehicles in south Florida are not representative of the rest of the country.
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
My opinion is that VW doesn't really understand the US market. They need more models, faster turn-around and faster innovation. They just don't understand their competition.
I suppose SOME people who lease cars skimp on maintenance but I think that most people are pretty good about oil changes etc. I know I wouldn't be afraid myself.
I'm not a big fan of turbos. I'm sure they have improved but why have one when modern four cylinder engines can be more than adequate.
thebean, I can offer only one opinion. Others here may disagree.
I too am skeptical of turbos. They run at very high speeds and require the best in lubrication and maintenance which may not always happen with a rental/lease vehicle.
I had a friend with a 79 Mustang 4 cyl turbo who had his turbo get fried just past the warranty and he was extra careful with maintenance. That was 79 and this is 2014, but I still don't like the idea of a turbo. Naturally aspirated and free flow exhaust only for me. Dave
2013 Mustang GT, 2001 GMC Yukon Denali
I have owned three turbocharged cars(1984 Thunderbird Turbo Coupe, 1991 Volvo 744T, 2007 Mazdaspeed 3) and I have only replaced one turbo. Some early Mazdaspeed turbos would smoke at idle and my car was one such example. It was replaced under warranty at 26kmiles. The replacement has been on the car for over 113k miles with no issues whatsoever.
As for lease returns? I have yet to have a bad experience. Depreciation is my friend; I've purchased several off-lease CPO BMWs for the price of a new mid-range Escape or Camry. No regrets.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Short answer. I took as good care for my leased cars as my owned ones. I kept them in good shape because I may want to buy it back at the end of the lease. Also, the company I worked for paid for any maintenance or repairs, so sometimes work got done better than if it was privately owned. I wouldn't hesitate to buy a leased used car, from a reputable dealer. Also, I think if you take some care and pride in your car, it doesn't matter if it is owned or leased.
I love turbo engines. One of the great things to enjoy in driving today is the added boost of power a turbo gives....and I think it adds to your safety, for example coming onto a freeway.
There is some risk, as turbos work hard, but, I personally would risk it. I think I would seriously want at least a 2 year extended warranty on most used cars.....one electronic repair can cost $1000s, turbo or not.
2017 MB E400 , 2015 MB GLK350, 2014 MB C250
I would say you are better off with the 3-4 year lease than one that was a one or two year lease. The ones I knew that didn't take very good care of their cars were the ones that knew they were not going to have them very long. That being said there is not much maintenance required for a car in that first 48K miles other than oil changes and some inspections.
As for the turbos, if you are light footed and only need the extra power that the turbo provides once in a great while then go for it. If your driving style or power needs from the engine require a lot of work from the turbo forget it. My understanding is that the turbo needs time between bursts to cool down and if you are engaging the turbo at each stop light you will burn it out.
Many 4 cylinder cars now have more than adequate power for most any real world driving. The wife's Sonata has more than enough power for merging or passing. So unless you want high performance I would stay away from turbos.
2011 Hyundai Sonata, 2014 BMW 428i convertible, 2015 Honda CTX700D
Yes and no. I first saw the tricolor yellow in a Ford magazine a Ford nut at work slipped me and it looked nice:
http://carsconcept001.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/04/2015-ford-mustang-review.jpg
Then I saw that color on the Ford site and it looked more Mustard color:
http://images.thecarconnection.com/lrg/2015-ford-mustang_100452467_l.jpg
So I guess I'll have to see it in person. There's always my fall-back color--dark red.
https://farm8.staticflickr.com/7459/13518382813_5044f8de14_o.jpg
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
Might do that even though I hate to be a "stroke" who wastes a salespersons time months before I plan to buy.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
"Second question is regarding turbo-charged engines."
Your first question about buying a previously leased vehicle is always a consideration. However, there really is very little difference between buying a used "owned" vehicle and a used "leased" vehicle. Most people take care of their cars (not all), but most. Leased vehicles are put on used car lots of dealerships only after inspections, service histories, CARFAXES, are reviewed. Otherwise they would be wholesaled.
The worst leased cars are those that have short-term leases. Stay away from those.
As for TURBOS, I really think it depends on the manufacturer of the engine and turbo. This is my first "twin turbo" engine in quite some time. I had a 2008 BMW 535i and it did not perform as quickly off the line as I would have liked.
I only use the turbos on my CLS 550 when entering a turnpike or interstate. Otherwise, I don't use them at all.
If you are buying a turbo, have your own mechanic check it over and drive it. He would be the one to notice undue hesitation and/or wear. Today, many cars have turbos - just be careful and make sure you buy an extended warranty.
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
thebean echoes my exact concerns about buying off lease cars. I would think the first thing to do is ask for service records to assure yourself that the previous owner at least did basic maintenance. There's always the fear in the back of your mind that he beat it like a rental car for three years. But that's true of any car.
As to turbos I'm sure they build them better these days but why risk have an expensive part blow up when a non-turbo can do the job.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
Excellent advice mike.
"If you are buying a turbo, have your own mechanic check it over and drive it. He would be the one to notice undue hesitation and/or wear. Today, many cars have turbos - just be careful and make sure you buy an extended warranty."
I would recommend that a mechanic check out ANY 3 year old car, not just turbos. After all you could be spending $15, $20k or more depending on the brand so it's essential. I like the extended warranty idea too. What's $1000 now to save many thousands later.
Way back in 87 I bought an off lease 84 Chevy. Had my mechanic check it out and found several oil leaks which were repaired by the dealer as part of the negotiation. Turned down the extended warranty which was $300 IIRC. About a week after the 30 day warranty expired it blew the AC compressor (like all GMs) and cost me the same $300. Hate to think what I would have done with a turbo that blew.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
it blew the AC compressor (like all GMs)
I have never, never had an AC compressor fail on my GM cars.
Never.
If you had seen the compressors from all the other companies
taken apart and laid out side-by-side, you would wonder how
the others even make it off the dealership lots before dying.
In fact, for a time some other companies were using GM's compressors.
2014 Malibu 2LT, 2015 Cruze 2LT,
I've owned(and will own) only one GM car, and the AC compressor never had an issue. Ditto for the three Caprices my father owned.
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Happy 4th of July!!!
Kick back and watch/listen!
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Yes, imid, GM AC compressors have been used in many makes and models of cars throughout the years. At one time, Mercedes used only "Fridgidaire" compressors (1992-1999). That was as a result of horrible compressors being used in their cars. I had 4 or 5 Mercedes Benz cars during the 80's and 90's, and all of them took for ever to cool the car down. Arguably, I lived in the California Desert Area for most of the 90's, and most compressors struggle in that kind of heat in the summertime. But in the Benz, it was awful. Now, the air-conditioning in their cars is outstanding. Even better than BMW - from my experiences with both brands.
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
ROLLS ROYCE WRAITH SOLD ON THE THIRD DAY
That Rolls Royce Wraith I posted about last week (brown/beige two-tone) sold on the third day it was wheeled into the Boca Town Center Mall, according to the sales rep who replaced it with a white Wraith this morning. It sold for MSRP (of course). He said the Wraith is new for 2014, and built on the Ghost platform. 660 hp out of a 12 cylinder twin turbo engine. Even with the Wraith weighing in at about 5000+ pounds, 660 hp should move that rascal around quite well, I would think.
The dealer (Rolls/Bentley of Palm Beach) also shows up with Phantoms every so often. That Phantom is so wide and long, it would never fit well into my parking space. So I guess I'll pass on buying one for that very reason!!!
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
Thanks for sharing. Linda Ronstadt is one of my favorite female signers, too bad Parkinson's disease has destroyed her body. If you like jazz you will love her rendition of "what's new."
Just my opinion, but I don't think anyone who is satisfied with "adequate" would be a possible candidate for a car with a turbocharged engine.
I have owned two cars that came equipped with turbocharged 4 cylinder engines, a 1985 Dodge and a 2008 Passat (still own that one). I have had no negative experiences with the engines, but I bought both of them new and took very good care of them - Frequent oil changes, always used synthetic oil, etc.
I would be somewhat hesitant to buy a used car with a turbo. I would want to know that it was adult owned, and properly maintained. (I would buy a used turbo from myself, in other words! (smile) )
I would be leary of buying any high performance car used. Something with a big torquey V-8 (Mustang GT, Camaro SS) would worry me a good deal less than a high revving turbocharged 4 cylinder.
Leaving aside the turbo question, if I were in your position I would much prefer an off-lease car to a rental unit. I think the rental cars are the ones that get abused horrifically.
That was never really true. What was true, many years ago before the widespread use of synthetic oil, was that you needed to allow the turbo time to cool down before stopping the engine. These days, just use a high quality synthetic oil, and it is not a problem.
I remember Brock Yates writing that in less than 25 years Mercedes was transformed from a brand that was sold at Studebaker dealers and beloved of eccentric college professors into one of the most respected/aspirational automobiles in the US and the world. BLW followed a similar trajectory from 1955 to 1980, leaving behind the Baroque Angels and Isettas and becoming the marque that was known for building iconic sports coupes and sedans. Of course Munich is now squandering that brand image by trying to be all things to all people, but I digress...
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
Sons Jetta has a turbo. I doubt any normal driver could tell as it is transparent. But quite quick, and an easy 37-38 highway, good around town, all out of 1.8l on RUG.
2020 Acura RDX tech SH-AWD, 2023 Maverick hybrid Lariat luxury package.
That's interesting. I've had nothing but bad luck. The aforementioned Chevy, 82 Olds, 91 Olds, 84 Corvette and just recently my son's 98 Buick. The only one still plugging along is the other son's 93 Caddy. I've had Ford and Chryslers stop cooling but a can of 134 made them work again. The GMs all blew compressors.
Maybe I just have a GM jinx.
2019 Kia Soul+, 2015 Mustang GT, 2013 Ford F-150, 2000 Chrysler Sebring convertible
I have a 2005 Passat 1.8T with 115K miles and not one turbo issue.
It it under powered with the AC on around town but once the turbo hits and get it into the power band, it does fine. 30 mpg on the highway with premium.
stickguy - tell your son to use premium as recommended - using regular in the 1.8T is a false economy.
Turbos are the "substitute for cubic inches" that you keep hearing about that have no substitute
So yeah, a 1.6 or 1.8L engine pushing 3,000+ pounds needs a turbo, but a 2 or 3 liter engine probably doesn't. It's really up to you to decide if the car you are considering really has the "grunt" (torque) to get you away nicely on freeway ramps and up long steep inclines. Nobody wants to be stuck in an underpowered car with passengers screaming up a hill in 3rd gear.
Modern turbos are efficient and long-lived, and aren't really all that expensive to replace at the end of their service life.
So if you need a dinky car engine to go faster, or you need a high performance car to go scary-fast, or you have a diesel-powered car or truck, then you need a turbo; otherwise, I don't see why you do.
Everything in life is a trade off, isn't it? Back in 2008, I could get a Passat with a 4 cylinder and turbo, or a Camry with the V6. Both were fast, and fun to drive. But the Passat was more fun, and about the same money, so ...
If I had bought the Camry, it would have cost a bit less for routine maintenance over the 103k miles I have owned the car, and it would have a higher resale value now. But the difference is not that much, and I have enjoyed the Passat. So like the man said,
SPEAKING OF HURRICANES
I was pretty amazed that a small, insignificant Low Pressure Area off the coast of St.Augustine, FL, could develop in just 3 days from a "nothing" into a hurricane. Usually these storms organize in the Gulf of Mexico this time of year and later in the hurricane season, off the coast of Africa as they travel across the mid Atlantic toward the East and West Indies.
It's very ominous for a Category 2 hurricane to form so close to the mainland U.S. I understand that the Gulf Stream influenced this fast organization. I thought the El Nino in the Southeast Pacific was going to inhibit hurricane development this year. Guess the meteorologists got that one wrong.
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
...AND WHILE WE'RE ON THE SUBJECT OF TURBOS
I honestly don't understand why Mercedes put twin turbos in the base CLS 550. I can understand it in the AMG models, but why the base CLS 550? A 4.7 litre V8 should have more than enough torque and hp without the use of turbos. Accelerating from 35 mph on the highway to 70 mph can give you whiplash in my car. Without twin turbos, how much "thrust" would I lose?
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
In my opinion, horsepower is like some other things(that I won't mention on a family-oriented forum):
SOME is good.
MORE is better.
TOO MUCH is just enough...
Mine: 1995 318ti Club Sport-2020 C43-1996 Speed Triple Challenge Cup Replica
Wife's: 2021 Sahara 4xe
Son's: 2018 330i xDrive
We were?
It's pretty normal I think. Not sure I would call it ominous. The hype up here has been unreal of course. The media really needs to throttle back the fear-mongering. This thing is now going to mostly miss us and bring a bit of wind tomorrow but that's about all. Nevertheless they are telling people to fill their bathtubs, buy bottled water and canned food, etc. Ridiculous. I imagine we will be playing golf here around suppertime.
The media has lost all sense of balance in reporting on weather. They could serve a valuable role by informing us of real threats when they happen. Instead they overblow every little thing whether a threat or not, and as a result the public becomes desensitized. That in turn makes fora real problem when a big threat appears and people just blow it off as another false alarm.
2017 Cadillac ATS Performance Premium 3.6
Amen to that !
2013 LX 570 2016 LS 460
"The media has lost all sense of balance in reporting on weather. "
The media has lost all sense of balance in reporting EVERYTHING!
Just think back a few months when Malaysian Air's Boeing 777 disappeared. Without that, CNN would have no news to broadcast.
2024 Genesis G90 Super-Charger
Heading to the Outer Banks at the end of next week. Hopefully, hurricane season isn't starting early this year.
MAN NEVER SATISFIED....it's true what you say.
Of course, there is such a thing as too much power in a car with a poor chassis and brakes...I believe the term I'm groping for is "Death Trap".
As you know from your time viewing others on the track-- "If you are a lousy driver with 200HP, you're going to be REALLY bad with 400HP".
I've had a lot of turbo and SC cars--the only thing I don't like about some turbos is peakiness---a big ON/OFF switch. Nowadays, "turbo lag" is rather rare in a modern car.
Nowadays, "turbo lag" is rather rare in a modern car.
We have a Buick Encore with a 138 hp, AWD, 4 cylinder, 6 speed transmission with turbo. Since I never had a turbo charged vehicle before I cannot tell the difference since the CUV takes 10+ seconds to 60.