Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations (Archived)

abacomike

tyguy said:

Speaking of bad dealer experiences, Audi has done it one more time. Tomorrow morning I was scheduled to have the aux coolant pump replaced, the one that can catch fire. I just received a call from the dealer telling me I'm not allowed to have a pump for at least a "couple of months" because there are people that didn't opt for the intermediate fix and those people get priority. Nice. So I still have a car that "probably" doesn't need the pump for cooling purposes. I've been holding off selling the car until the pump was replaced, but I can't wait another couple of months. Not a big fan of Audi right now.

Driver had problems with his Audi - clutch I believe - burned out after only 12,000 miles or so.

driver100

dino001 said:

abacomike said:

driver100 said:

abacomike
I just got a call from the service manager at Mercedes. They received the seal for the glass this morning and when they replaced the seal on the glass and tested the operation of the sunroof,

Like you said Mike, these things happen and you just have to go with the flow. They are probably working their butts off trying to get this repaired.......it isn't something Mercedes would be proud of. The cost must be in the $1000s by now trying to get this repaired. The poor mechanic, he will probably only get a repair like this once in his lifetime.

I don't know why these things happen to you Mike....I hope you don't bother buying lottery tickets.

Never buy them!

I think you should. Perhaps Lady Luck is waiting to compensate you, but you win’t give her a chance

.

Good point. Mike is overdo for a win...he should buy a lottery ticket.

Mr_Shiftright

jmonroe1 said:

Mr_Shiftright said:

I think that's really how it's going to look. Yeah, I know. Shoot me now. Somebody needs to warn them.

I recall a great quote about car design---something like "It takes two people to design a car properly. One to sketch the design, and a second standing behind him with a baseball bat".

That's a pretty sexist "quote". Wouldn't be tolerated today.

jmonroe

Context. It was a quote from a time when sexism had not only not been identified, but was considered normal.

driver100

abacomike said:

tyguy said:

Speaking of bad dealer experiences, Audi has done it one more time. Tomorrow morning I was scheduled to have the aux coolant pump replaced, the one that can catch fire. I just received a call from the dealer telling me I'm not allowed to have a pump for at least a "couple of months" because there are people that didn't opt for the intermediate fix and those people get priority. Nice. So I still have a car that "probably" doesn't need the pump for cooling purposes. I've been holding off selling the car until the pump was replaced, but I can't wait another couple of months. Not a big fan of Audi right now.

Driver had problems with his Audi - clutch I believe - burned out after only 12,000 miles or so.

Yes, clutch burned out just after the 20000 mile limit, but before the 3 years limit. Not fond of Audi but I would buy another one if I liked it the best of the cars I was considering.

I don't trust too many car makers but, I think the one I would trust the most would be Lexus. I have a neighbour whose instrument panel split from the sunlight I guess. The car was way out of warranty but Lexus replaced the instrument panel....no problem.

In the last few days we have a problem with Mercedes - kind of a flukey thing, an over engineered sunroof that came off the rails, and probably isn't easy for the service department to fix.

A Suburu with a dying battery, that is only one year old. It can happen - maybe faulty, maybe left not charging for a long enough time.

An Audi which they are slow to do warranty work on.

All these things are a pain, but, they are normal problems that can happen. Maybe we get spoiled since we don't have too many problems these days.

oldfarmer50

stickguy said:

my guess is that whatever broke on the moonroof is a really rare occurrence (Mike beating the odds!) The problem with that is, the service people have no idea what to do to fix it (not having experience) and parts will never be in stock. So, they are figuring it out as they go, which can be rough sometimes. Sucks to be the Guinea pig of course.

at least they have him in a nice new loaner car. cheap brands don't always do that for you.

When I had to get the rear seatbelt mount fixed on wife’s PT under warranty they gave me a loaner for a week until the part came in. Of course it was a rental car Sebring so I can’t brag too much.

Here’s a little something to distract Mike from his troubles. Skip to 5:00 for the action.

https://youtu.be/GDlazOuvRXM

28firefighter

Hey, it's been 5 months since my last issue with the Viggen and 3 days since my last issue with the Alfa. We're approaching record territory here.

dino001

I think Mike’s troubles in terms of how long the repair takes are more likely on the 100k car than on Kia. More parts, everything complicated, less availability, more chances for extended procedures, or diagnostics, etc. Comes with territory. What should not happen is wrong parts sent and poor communications about the time line. Perhaps also the expectations should be set at “it may take longer, because ...”.

jmonroe1

Mr_Shiftright said:

jmonroe1 said:

Mr_Shiftright said:

I think that's really how it's going to look. Yeah, I know. Shoot me now. Somebody needs to warn them.

I recall a great quote about car design---something like "It takes two people to design a car properly. One to sketch the design, and a second standing behind him with a baseball bat".

That's a pretty sexist "quote". Wouldn't be tolerated today.

jmonroe

Context. It was a quote from a time when sexism had not only not been identified, but was considered normal.

I agree and that's why I said, "it wouldn't be tolerated today".

jmonroe

venture

dino001 said:

venture said:

My wife came out of school earlier this evening and her Forester wouldn't start. I drove down to have a look. After she managed to turn the headlights on, I could see they were dim. The engine would barely crank.

I had the battery replaced a year ago - January of 2018.

I called my dealer and asked if they could come and pick it up. The guy said to call a tow truck and gave me the name of the one they use.

This isn't a $100k car, but that is not the way to treat a customer; especially one who has bought 6 cars from you. At the very least they should have taken the obligation of calling the tow truck for me.

I'm not very happy right now either.

Not sure how old your Forester is, but Subaru has roadside service in their warranty, 3/36. But if not covered, the dealer should still take charge of the situation and at least offer fo make arrangements, even if they’d roll them into your bill later. Like you said, seems like they don’t have a system that somehow could flash “take care of this guy”, even if they didn’t do it as their normal part of business. Maybe you talked to a newbie, or oerhaps not. Doesn’t matter. Not a big insult, just a mild neglect, disappointing.

It's a 2015. The warranty ran out 3 weeks ago (of course). I've been trying to get her to decide what she wants. If she would have made a decision she would be driving something else right now.

I agree - not an insult just way disappointing. The dealer makes the difference. <--- Words to live by.

driver100

dino001 said:

I think Mike’s troubles in terms of how long the repair takes are more likely on the 100k car than on Kia. More parts, everything complicated, less availability, more chances for extended procedures, or diagnostics, etc. Comes with territory. What should not happen is wrong parts sent and poor communications about the time line. Perhaps also the expectations should be set at “it may take longer, because ...”.

Exactly. This is the kind of repair that the mechanic will face once in his lifetime. He probably has to read instructions that are 100X more difficult to read than IKEA's instructions, probably written in German.

The more expensive the car, the more chance something can go wrong....because there is more that can go wrong. Remember when a lot of people wouldn't get air conditioning or power windows....too easy to break down. This is similar.

I am sure the dealer wants the car fixed as much as Mike, they got stuck with a real oddball kind of repair....oddball meaning car repair - not Mike!

qbrozen

I'm kind of surprised at people's reactions to the broken moonroof in such an expensive vehicle. That is exactly what I would expect, personally. The car isn't $100k+ because they made it more reliable. That money goes to making it more complex and more prone to break. Mo money, mo problems!

graphicguy

stickguy said:

the center diff is 30K interval, starting at 30k. The rear for some reason they call for at 15K, for the first change, then every 30K after that.

Which means I am almost due for a 2nd change on the rear on the RDX, since the MM is down to 30% and we recently went over 50,000 miles.

That’s exactly what my dealer told me....Acura’s first rear diff fluid change is at 15K (or in my case, 17K) Is generally a “clean out”....30K increments after that.

Acura is pretty staunch in not supporting any “frivolous” services and sticks to the service minder as the ultimate guide for service. At this rate, and the strong possibility that an Acura TLX Type-S is on the horizon in the next 12-18 months, the only thing I should have to do to my current TLX is oil changes and tire rotations.

On a sadder, and angrier note, I received a letter yesterday informing me I received an affidavit issued to me for speeding.

HUH?

I guess someone, somewhere clocked me doing 65 MPH in a 50 MPH zone and took a picture of my license plate. Apparently it’s a Civil matter and no points assessed on my license. But, they want $95 paid to the city I was speeding. Don’t remember me being in the area they stated I was observed to be speeding. But, I do regularly speed if the road is open and dry.

My issue, while this was not in the OHIO area where the municipality had to return $3M in fines for using speeding cameras, this wasn’t all that far away from there. When did it become legal to use speeding cameras again? I thought all of this was decided to be unconstitutional?

Trying to decide whether to take this to court. There’s an officer’s digital sig on the “ticket, which they’re calling the PHOTO ENFORCEMENT PROGRAM NOTICE OF LIABILITY.

Pretty angered right now.

abacomike

driver100 said:

I think Mike’s troubles in terms of how long the repair takes are more likely on the 100k car than on Kia. More parts, everything complicated, less availability, more chances for extended procedures, or diagnostics, etc. Comes with territory. What should not happen is wrong parts sent and poor communications about the time line. Perhaps also the expectations should be set at “it may take longer, because ...”.

Exactly. This is the kind of repair that the mechanic will face once in his lifetime. He probably has to read instructions that are 100X more difficult to read than IKEA's instructions, probably written in German. The more expensive the car, the more chance something can go wrong....because there is more that can go wrong. Remember when a lot of people wouldn't get air conditioning or power windows....too easy to break down. This is similar. I am sure the dealer wants the car fixed as much as Mike, they got stuck with a real oddball kind of repair....oddball meaning car repair - not Mike!

You can include Mike in your oddball analogy, driver.  After all, I am “Murphy’s Law” incarnate!  “If some thing can go wrong, it will go wrong when I am involved.”  My middle name is “Murphy” after all! 

dino001

venture said:

It's a 2015. The warranty ran out 3 weeks ago (of course). I've been trying to get her to decide what she wants. If she would have made a decision she would be driving something else right now.

I agree - not an insult just way disappointing. The dealer makes the difference. <--- Words to live by.</p>

3 weeks... That's just "cross-eyed" luck. Feels like if you actually called Subaru national roadside service number, they may pick up the cost as "goodwill". But the dealer should do that, too. If I were you, I'd probably state your general disappointment with handling you at the first contact to the manager. Not necessarily screaming your head off (sometimes necessary, not here), but in a respectful manner tell them how they can improve (don't they want to know?) their first contact with all their customers, but especially those multi-repeats.

dino001

Well, happiness and disappointment are function of expectations. Expect nothing and you shall mostly receive just that and anything above becomes nirvana. Expect the world and you'll always be disappointed. Proper positioning on that spectrum can get you proper balance between received service and internal happiness.

abacomike

dino001 said:

Well, happiness and disappointment are function of expectations. Expect nothing and you shall mostly receive just that and anything above becomes nirvana. Expect the world and you'll always be disappointed. Proper positioning on that spectrum can get you proper balance between received service and internal happiness.

Sounds like many a sermon I sat through in churches and synagogues throughout my life.  Words, when put together in thought provoking sequence, can soothe the soul and prepare how one perceives and reacts to the actions of others.  Well said Dino!

coldinohio

tyguy said:

Speaking of bad dealer experiences, Audi has done it one more time. Tomorrow morning I was scheduled to have the aux coolant pump replaced, the one that can catch fire. I just received a call from the dealer telling me I'm not allowed to have a pump for at least a "couple of months" because there are people that didn't opt for the intermediate fix and those people get priority. Nice. So I still have a car that "probably" doesn't need the pump for cooling purposes. I've been holding off selling the car until the pump was replaced, but I can't wait another couple of months. Not a big fan of Audi right now.

that is horrible

driver100

abacomike said:

dino001 said:

Well, happiness and disappointment are function of expectations. Expect nothing and you shall mostly receive just that and anything above becomes nirvana. Expect the world and you'll always be disappointed. Proper positioning on that spectrum can get you proper balance between received service and internal happiness.

Sounds like many a sermon I sat through in churches and synagogues throughout my life.  Words, when put together in thought provoking sequence, can soothe the soul and prepare how one perceives and reacts to the actions of others.  Well said Din

o!

+1
That is a great philosophy to live by. We all know people who complain about everything....what a way to go through life!

But, poor GG, I don't blame you for complaining about that ticket, that is outrageous, but, my guess is it is legal.

cdnpinhead

Happiness = reality - expectations. First heard this 15-20 years ago on Car Talk (Tom Magliozzi, in particular) and have been quoting it ever since.

ab348

Sunroofs are always difficult to fix. Keep in mind that they arrive in the assembly plant as a completed subassembly from an outside manufacturer and then are just bolted in and connected to the wiring loom. Taking one apart and repairing it is a big job, usually requiring removal of the headlining and and associated lights/hardware, plus now side curtain airbags, even before you get to the sunroof assembly. Then you are dealing with a third-party piece whose documentation and repair instructions may not be up to the usual M-B standards.

All that said, it does not sound like the dealer handled this very well.

berri

After the BMW and MB, Aba - you may want to look at Asian lux next time. Hope it works out though because it sounded like you enjoyed the MB until now.

stickguy

Mike I think is one of the few people that have problems with a Lexus. Or was that just someone else?

imidazol97

graphicguy said:

stickguy said:

the center diff is 30K interval, starting at 30k. The rear for some reason they call for at 15K, for the first change, then every 30K after that.

Which means I am almost due for a 2nd change on the rear on the RDX, since the MM is down to 30% and we recently went over 50,000 miles.

That’s exactly what my dealer told me....Acura’s first rear diff fluid change is at 15K (or in my case, 17K) Is generally a “clean out”....30K increments after that.

Acura is pretty staunch in not supporting any “frivolous” services and sticks to the service minder as the ultimate guide for service. At this rate, and the strong possibility that an Acura TLX Type-S is on the horizon in the next 12-18 months, the only thing I should have to do to my current TLX is oil changes and tire rotations.

On a sadder, and angrier note, I received a letter yesterday informing me I received an affidavit issued to me for speeding.

HUH?

I guess someone, somewhere clocked me doing 65 MPH in a 50 MPH zone and took a picture of my license plate. Apparently it’s a Civil matter and no points assessed on my license. But, they want $95 paid to the city I was speeding. Don’t remember me being in the area they stated I was observed to be speeding. But, I do regularly speed if the road is open and dry.

My issue, while this was not in the OHIO area where the municipality had to return $3M in fines for using speeding cameras, this wasn’t all that far away from there. When did it become legal to use speeding cameras again? I thought all of this was decided to be unconstitutional?

Trying to decide whether to take this to court. There’s an officer’s digital sig on the “ticket, which they’re calling the PHOTO ENFORCEMENT PROGRAM NOTICE OF LIABILITY.

Pretty angered right now.

or

It's convoluted, but I believe the ban was overturned by the supreme court for red light cameras but the municipalities involved figured out that since it said an office had to be present to witness the speeding in the way the laws were written, they just have an office use a new device that the red light/speed camera companies just happened to figure out how to make, and they have an officer take you photo and register the speed with a hand held camera.

The City of Dayton, who needs money for their social programs, jumped right on it and started using the handheld cameras. Their "logic" was that it was safer for the public because the office did not have to chase down and stop the offending vehicle. Nevermind a speeding vehicle, present company excepted, might have a stolen license plate, no driver license, an impaired driver, be suspicious as to carrying contraband, etc.. The City just wanted to give out faux tickets for people to pay.

A part I don't understand is that the City started putting up relocateable speed cameras. I'm not clear on whether they were issuing tickets from those. Other cities took the covers off their (the company's) speed red light cameras, intending to have an officer present occasionally to be able to validate the tickets given.

Dayton City, from what I can figure out started using their hand held cameras from a distance with officer sitting in a "hard to see" (hidden for us normal folks) position and issuing tickets where the speeder never knows they have been clocked.

My big complaint is that most of policing is stumbling onto problems when they stop the vehicles and check license registation etc.. City of Dayton (and others) think it's okay to skip the part where they inspect the aura of the driver and vehicle. I offer my neighbor's stolen Grand Prix as san example. I doubt the drivers who had it for two weeks cared about speeding and red lights.

Brice had been at the forefront of using the officer present/ handheld cameras off overpasses as traffic moves under them on the heavily traveled street. Brice is a suburb of Columbus which has historically been a speedtrap.

@graphicguy I'm interested in knowing what municipality got you. Have they been in the news?

https://www.wkyc.com/article/traffic/new-bill-aims-to-take-money-from-ohio-cities-that-use-traffic-cameras/95-587445270

28firefighter

It has been a long time since I dealt with speed cameras and red light camera law, but I believe they have found a way (for now) for it to remain legal. They should have included a copy of the picture with the ticket - is it in fact you? I assume no one else would be taking your car?

I'm all for fighting these tickets because I think they're absolute nonsense, but for a $95 ticket with no points? I'd strongly consider not wasting my time. Of course, that mindset is exactly what they expect many people will do.

imidazol97

Re: sunroof
I'm surprised how many are lowering their expectations of a luxury car maker and their store? The mechanix should be well trained. The ordering of replacement parts should be transparent and easy to do correctly. The parts department should double check the order as the mechanic involved places it.

When people pay a premium in profit for the purchase of a luxury vehicle, they should receive good care beyond the cream cheese and bagels in the waiting room with the Keurig coffee, etc..

suydam

They use them in Maryland/DC areas on the turnpike. Don’t ask me how I know. It’s an unpleasant surprise to get that letter after a trip.

dino001

berri said:

After the BMW and MB, Aba - you may want to look at Asian lux next time. Hope it works out though because it sounded like you enjoyed the MB until now.

But Mike had that Lexus he hated so much. I think The only choices left for him are Maybach, Bentley, Rolls Royce, Kia, or Fiat (see my post on expectations).

graphicguy

@imidazol97 ...I live in the Fairfield Township/West Chester/Liberty Township area, north of Cincinnati and just south of Dayton. My zip code says I live in Hamilton, though, which is weird because I'm not in Hamilton. But, the City of Hamilton is the issuing municipality.

I shop at Bridgewater Falls a lot, as well as up around Voice of America. They say they clocked me on By Pass 4, which is near Bridgewater. While it's sketchy, just turned up research that shows Hamilton has at least one mobile truck that moves from place to place issuing tickets. I certainly don't remember seeing any "truck" or "van" with official city tags on it, as I look for those. I'll assume the camera has to be stationary, so that means the truck/van was parked somewhere. Hard to hide in the area they say they clocked me. But, they've got a picture of my tag. Not sure where the pic was taken as it's low resolution and I can't tell.

@28firefighter ...to me, it's sneaky and should be illegal. I have questions. If I go to trial, can I question the alleged officer whose name is on the ticket? Can I ask him if he recognizes my car? Me? Will he even show up? Will they provide some sort of certification that their "speed equipment" is calibrated? I'm sure they want you to just pay it out, so that's why there are no points levied. It's a money grab, in an area right outside of where I live.

This is the first ticket I've had in 25+ years. Last one I received I fought it because the officer didn't show up at the first hearing. They continued it. The 2nd hearing, I questioned the officer whether he knew the car he had ticketed or if he remembered me. He answered "no" and the case was dismissed.

I do really want to fight it. Not sure of the laws anymore on speed cameras. I thought they were illegal.

ab348

dino001 said:

But Mike had that Lexus he hated so much. I think The only choices left for him are Maybach, Bentley, Rolls Royce, Kia, or Fiat (see my post on expectations).

I think he should buy a Giulia. That would be entertaining.

dino001

With Giulia there would be too high expectations. Only Fiat 500, or Kia Rio.

venture

dino001 said:

venture said:

It's a 2015. The warranty ran out 3 weeks ago (of course). I've been trying to get her to decide what she wants. If she would have made a decision she would be driving something else right now.

I agree - not an insult just way disappointing. The dealer makes the difference. <--- Words to live by.</p>

3 weeks... That's just "cross-eyed" luck. Feels like if you actually called Subaru national roadside service number, they may pick up the cost as "goodwill". But the dealer should do that, too. If I were you, I'd probably state your general disappointment with handling you at the first contact to the manager. Not necessarily screaming your head off (sometimes necessary, not here), but in a respectful manner tell them how they can improve (don't they want to know?) their first contact with all their customers, but especially those multi-repeats.

As it ended up the battery was bad and they replaced it. No charge.

My disappointment was in the way they handled the initial call I made to them when they said, "Call a tow truck".

I jumped it this morning and took it out to them. No yelling.

tjc78

I got a photo radar ticket in Baltimore area on 95 last year.  

No doubt it was me (photo of car ans license plate driving).  I think it was $45.00 no points.  Certainly not worth fighting.  Money grab for sure! 

tjc78

Re: Sunroofs 

My 2003 Avalon had a piece fly off while driving on a windy day.  Took it to the dealer and they put all new tracks on within a day or two and all was fine with the Sunroof

Naturally they got dirty fingerprints all off the light beige headliner.  I showed it to the manager and he promptly had the entire car detailed the next day.  He sent me home in his demo.  

tjc78

Just toured a private Catholic school for my son entering Kindergarten in Sept.  My wife and I are so undecided whether to send him to public or go the private route.  

We both did Catholic school up until about 5th grade and have no bad memories but such a tough decision.  Input appreciated 

thx 

stickguy

You already pay crazy taxes largely for schools, so might as well use them. That was my theory. We also paid more to live in our town largely for the school district.

imidazol97

Represe tative Seitz has been trying to stop this for years now. 

There are some law offices specializing in these and in drunk driving. They advertise on a car show on wtvn 610 Columbus. 

tjc78

stickguy said:

You already pay crazy taxes largely for schools, so might as well use them. That was my theory. We also paid more to live in our town largely for the school district.

Naturally that was my first thought too, but our school district while certainly not the worst isn’t what yours is.   I didn’t think of this when I bought my house in 2005 single with no kids!

We have some time as public school doesn’t require registration until sometime in April.  We are touring one more Catholic school then will go to the public school orientation / open house once that is available.  

berri

MB to Fiat, now there's a steep slope. Kind of like landing at San Diego

berri

Ima - how many years data does that JD Powers ranking cover?

stickguy

Makes sense. I never used them but get sense catholic schools have been cutting back (lots of closure) around here.

tjc78

Yes they are, I have to say I was impressed with what I saw today.  

Still paying what we pay for taxes and then adding another $5100 a year plus anothe $4000 when the younger one goes is tough to swallow 

graphicguy

I personally went to Catholic Schools for 12 years. Yes, that was a while ago, but I got into every college I applied to. I sent my son to a Jesuit Catholic School. He was accepted to every college he applied to (including Carnegie and Loyola). Hard to argue with the education both he and I received.

If I’m remembering correctly, the Jesuit School cost me $13K/year, without the other peripheral costs associated with computers, extra-curricular activities (which Catholic Schools encourage), etc. But, that was a dozen plus years ago. I’m sure it’s more expensive currently.

Catholic schools can be hard to get into, also. If you have children with solid academics, it’s a bit easier.

Now? I think you have to take a look at each individual school and see how they rank (both parochial and public). As we’ve seen recently, some Catholic schools are less desireable than others.

Mr_Shiftright

qbrozen said:

I'm kind of surprised at people's reactions to the broken moonroof in such an expensive vehicle. That is exactly what I would expect, personally. The car isn't $100k+ because they made it more reliable. That money goes to making it more complex and more prone to break. Mo money, mo problems!

Cars in that price range aren't built for longevity. They are built to pamper you in luxury and tech and then get traded in in 3 years.

dino001

venture said:

As it ended up the battery was bad and they replaced it. No charge.
My disappointment was in the way they handled the initial call I made to them when they said, "Call a tow truck".
I jumped it this morning and took it out to them. No yelling.

Yelling unnecessary, but expression of slight dissatisfaction was in order.

dino001

berri said:

Ima - how many years data does that JD Powers ranking cover?

Isn't that ranking renewed every year for 3-year old cars? I don't think they have some kind of moving average.

imidazol97

berri said:

Ima - how many years data does that JD Powers ranking cover?

I can't find the first year in a chart from JD Powers like this is. It is a 3 year study of 2015 models.

That's already been bashed in the earlier discussion about the other survey, and I'm not going there: no minds aer changing.

I had to leave for ChickFilA, so the post was unfinished. But my point in posting that in its bar chart format was because of the numerical relative number of problems data. A Lexus by the self-reported info via a random survey was 1 problem per 100 vehicles; while a Mercedes was 1.5 problems. I don't know if that's cumulatively an extra 1/2 problem per car or it's per year without reading lots more into the data.

But my point was does it make a difference? If @Abacomike wants an S450 instead of a L 457.5 L, the difference is going to be in the dealer, the shopping treatment, and the perceived future handling of problems, IF ANY.

For those still reading, if any, JD Powers has a new format for reporting that uses Mechanical, Features and Controls, and Exterior and Interior, which are then mashed into an Overall ratings column.

https://www.jdpower.com/Cars/Ratings/Quality/2018/Compact-SUV

Interesting. Gives more information about strengths and weaknesses.

But with things like the bar chart, does the difference between vehicles matter? IT's the dealership and the corporation that matter more.

dino001

Haven't heard from our Sephia friend. Did he buy his Sentra yet? I guess no.

imidazol97

I just found the first year Initial Quality Study by accident in bar graph format:

Mr_Shiftright

tjc78 said:

Just toured a private Catholic school for my son entering Kindergarten in Sept.  My wife and I are so undecided whether to send him to public or go the private route.  

We both did Catholic school up until about 5th grade and have no bad memories but such a tough decision.  Input appreciated 

thx 

Depends on how good the public schools are in your area. It's always good for a child to be exposed to a diversity of opinions, backgrounds and beliefs. Then when they are old enough, they can make up their own minds.

pensfan83

Both my sister and myself went to a Catholic school until Grade 5 before our parents elected to put us in public school. My parents felt that beyond the elementary level the school we were in simply couldn't compete with opportunities available in the public district, which was and is consistently ranked very high in the state. It's hard to argue because my sister and myself both went to top universities and are successful professionally. For reasons I have never asked my parents my younger brother went to public school from K-12 and he'll graduate this spring with honors after also balancing collegiate lacrosse for 4 years.

When we purchased our house we did so with an eye on the quality of the public school district as we never really considered sending our kids to Catholic school. There's only a handful of Catholic schools in the entire diocese we would consider sending our kids to and none are in areas we wanted to live or could afford at that time. I think if you're considering which route to take you need to stack rank the schools (public and private) and determine what works best for you.