Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations (Archived)

abacomike

oldfarmer50 said:

This picture popped up on my Facebook news feed this AM.  A woman I went to high school with commented on it.  I think we are all in agreement that no 16 year old needs nor deserves a brand new $45K Infiniti right after passing his driving test.  What you do with your money is your business though.  Putting the pictures up of the kid on Facebook with the car while still at the dealership is just a whole different kind of wrong.

Judge Judy often is wrong in her interpretation of evidence, especially of a scientific nature, but she is right about boys not being "cooked" as far as sound decision making until they're 24 or some age like that. The bragging about a new car at the day of getting a license is really bad for the kid's understanding of life. My son drove an 11-year old leSabre to the school for the first year. Other kids could hit it all they wanted. Then we picked up a car for him for his senior year, but it was a pedantic vehicle, not high-powered show off car. I wonder if it's the parents that wanted to show off or if that's the kid's real value system. Would he have been happy with a 4-year old vehicle that wasn't of a premium name tag?

Bought my mother's 7 yo Lasabre for my son 10 years ago and he's still driving it. Shows no interest in cars other than for transportation. Where did I go wrong? Wait, he did buy the Corvette that I inherited so I guess he's not a total loss.

In general, according to more recent data collected in the past 2-3 years, millennials tend to be less interested in the styling, power/performance, branding, luxury, etc., of automobiles and SUV's and more tuned into technology, safety, fuel economy and cost of ownership.  They (millennials) tend  not to worship or idolize or salivate over vehicles like the baby-boomers did/do.

Even my son, who is 44 years old, sees autos and SUV's as a means of getting from one place to another - nothing more.  That is why I believe car manufacturers like Hyundai, Kia, VW, Toyota, Nissan, Ford, GM's Chevy Division, etc., are successful because they appeal more to the millennials and their "wants" when it comes to basic transportation.  

Retired folks also tend to buy cars for basic transportation and at lower costs of ownership.  

These, of course, are generalizations extracted from reports of surveys compiled by car research companies like Maritz, JD Power, etc.

But there sure are enough of us still alive who shudder at the sight of a Corvette Stingray, Porsche, Mazzeratti, Mercedes-Benz, Rolls, Bentley, Ferrari, etc.  I sure don't buy cars for basic transportation - where's the fun in that?  

stickguy

I have an about to turn 20 YO and a 24 YO. I assume they are both "millennials"? But they must be outliers, because they are both into cars, love to drive, and really interested in the look, make, style, and dynamics (son has gone totally German or bust for now, lusting over Audis). And the princess was very concerned with the style factor, and how it drove.,

abacomike

stickguy said:

I have an about to turn 20 YO and a 24 YO. I assume they are both "millennials"? But they must be outliers, because they are both into cars, love to drive, and really interested in the look, make, style, and dynamics (son has gone totally German or bust for now, lusting over Audis). And the princess was very concerned with the style factor, and how it drove.,

In my family, my love of cars did not "imprint' on both kids.  I was all alone in showrooms buying cars - even my wife didn't care what she drove as long as it got her to where she was going and home again.

Boy, I forgot how lonely it was when I bought a car - no one in my family cared!  Where did I go wrong?  

stickguy

my daughter liked to go out looking just for fun. My baby.

PF_Flyer

Taught both of my daughters to drive on manual transmission. I think it really helped them become better drivers because you HAVE to pay attention to what the vehicle is doing. Funny that both of them didn't like the engine getting to higher revs when they first started. They thought they were going too fast... in almost every lower gear. In PA, you have to have a parent keep a ride-a-long log for 50 hours noting things that they've learned/experienced. I thought that was really helpful as well, though I imagine that some parents just fill it out without really tracking what's going on.
I knew I was doing a good job fairly early in daughter #1's training when we were coming to a light that changed on her at the last minute, and she managed to do a semi-panic stop, downshifting along the way and stopped without any locking up of wheels (no ABS on the vehicle)
She was a bit rattled, but our next stop was the Dairy Queen as a reward for that STOP

iluvmysephia1

You should have reported him to Marshal Dillon. He would have sent Chester out to handle that old dude !


Bingo, Houdini! We were like, huh? Should we duck? We got in our '11 Kia Soul and skiddadled up the bumpy dirt driveway outta there!

stever-kudos to ya on the house there in LC. Man, the Mrs. and I may very well be back in NM come retirement time. Our fave TV series is Longmire, which is filmed in northern NM but it's supposed ta be Wyoming. Love the open land and mountains everywhere. And the Organ Mt.'s are gorgeous! Congrats to y'all!

explorerx4

Personally, I don't think people change too much. Most millenials would love to own a nice vehicle.
It's a matter of finances and priorities.
They both drive my wife's 'hand me down' Escapes, 09 and 04.
The older one paid off her student loans in less than 4 years, but is now paying for grad school.
My younger graduated a couple of years ago and one is still paying off her loans.
They took the government loans and we paid the rest.
My older one wants a BMW, she did marketing for them.
The younger one wants a Wrangler.

suydam

Two of mine live in large cities and don't need cars. They don't really think about them. My oldest like stick shift sporty cars when he was in college but that was then, as they say. My middle child likes big American cars that he can drive forever. Last year finally ditched his '98 LeSabre for an Impala, which he will probably drive for another 15 years.

stever

iluvmysephia1 said:

Man, the Mrs. and I may very well be back in NM come retirement time.

Y'all were supposed to stop by for coffee before you bugged out for Washington. I didn't even get a chance to eyeball your Soul.

abacomike

stever said:

Man, the Mrs. and I may very well be back in NM come retirement time.

Y'all were supposed to stop by for coffee before you bugged out for Washington. I didn't even get a chance to eyeball your Soul.

Stever, I have heard that New Mexico was founded by Spaniards in search of "El Diablo" which I never believed, personally.  But your comment about "souls" has drastically changed my mind.  NM is El Diablo!  

venture

oldfarmer50 said:

suydam said:

My middle son totaled his car within 3 weeks of getting his license. Good thing it was an old Dodge beater. He had paid half for it though so it was all the money in the world to him. Hasn't had an accident since. Anyone buying a new car for a new licensee is a fool. I wonder if the post is a fake? A lot of those going around FB.

I've trained 4 kids to drive. The two who were the most responsible have had multiple accidents. The two flakey ones none. I don't know what to make of that.

On the other hand...

I bought my daughter a 4 or 5 year old car when she was starting college. I figured I knew what to expect. A few weeks after she got it she ran into a curb. I had to buy a wheel and tire. A few months after that she came home with the right front fender bent. She took it on vacation to the shore and one of her friends smashed into the back of a pickup (no injuries, but I told her not to let anyone else drive it.)

When my son was starting college I bought him a new Nissan Sentra. I figured I knew what to expect. He drove it all through 5 years of college and never put a mark on it. We put tires on it once. He traded it in on his BMW after he graduated.

I guess if you know your kids buying them a new car when they are a new licensee doesn't make everyone a fool...to be kind.

nyccarguy

I'm not against buying your kid a new car, there's just No reason it needs to be a $45K Infiniti.  I'm still unsure of the plan for my kids.  I've still got a while until my oldest is ready to learn to drive.  He just turned 9 in September. Time does fly by when you are having fun.  I like @roadburner's idea of having the kid drive something not so sporty for a year along with some BMWCCA street survival courses for 12 full months.  I think the Legacy would fit the bill if I can hold on to it that long.  I think a BRZ/FRS would be a cool 1st car.  Maybe I could lease it for 3 years, drive it myself, then pass it off to the kid.  Problem is, what do I do for son #2 who is 2 1/2 years younger, the my daughter who is about 2 years & 8 months younger than son #2.  I'm sure I'm going to have to replace the Pilot at SOME point too.

suydam

A Nissan Sentra and an Infinity are worlds apart. For my part I expected each kid to pay for part of their car, so that meant used.

venture

suydam said:

A Nissan Sentra and an Infinity are worlds apart. For my part I expected each kid to pay for part of their car, so that meant used.

So what? It was still a new car. He could have had whatever he wanted. He chose the Sentra. Not me.

stickguy

My kids are 4.5 years (5 grades) apart, so never had to worry about car overlap. By the time #2 could drive, #1 had his HS car (the old TL) with him at college. We got lucky with that one. Great car, but old and well worn body. Perfect, until the senior year when it had some issues.

Daughter did fine for 3 years with the Volvo. Only issue year was how long a drive it was to school, otherwise would probably still have it.

new vs. used is not that big a deal IMO, if you are getting something recent. can be a cost difference of course, but you can get that with different new cars. So basically it is not a new vs. used issue, it is nice vs. beater!

I recommend something solid and sound but not necessarily pretty for HS/new driver duty (HSs are notoriously bad for parking lots!). Once you get through that phase, the kids should have a more established track record, and the best option IMO is based on your family financials, how trustrworthy the kid is, the college (distance and parking situation) etc. Like for my son. 4 hour drive, but he lived in a dump for 3 years, with a lousy driveway and terrible parking spot. Not a chance in the world I was paying for a nice car to go there.

my daughter though parks in a nice lot. basically like an apartment building, so not too worried about the parking situation for a newer car.

robr2

When my son started driving, he got the oldest car in the fleet - a 2000 Honda Odyssey. He's off at school now and can't have a car and really doesn't need one. My daughter gets her permit Thursday. In 6 months she too will be the proud operator of a 2000 Honda Odyssey.

Michaell

My sister will soon be facing this dilemma. Her oldest is 18 and drives the hand me down 330i ZHP. Middle child turned 15 today and will get his permit in 6 months. 

Her plan - at the moment - is to give him the navigator when he gets his license and my sister will lease an Altima(!). My BIL would then drive the G coupe. 

Her ear youngest turns 16 in 4 years. 

stickguy

odd sighting today. partly the car (a screaming red Chevy HHR SS). Certainly uncommon. But the real old part was the driver (we parked next to each other at the election place).

a guy that had to be at least 75, hobbling along with a cane, and looking kind of ratty. Probably not the usual driver for one of those oddball "hotrods"!

abacomike

According to Fox News Channel:

VW announced that it found an "internal problem" affecting 800,000 additional vehicles for excess carbon dioxide emissions but did not indicate which vehicles were affected.  I would think these vehicles are gasoline powered since it is CO2 emissions that are involved.

Further, VW stated it would cost 2 billion dollars to correct the problem.  I am starting to wonder what the next surprise announcement is going to involve.  Not good for VW - it keeps getting worse!  

nyccarguy

Oldest car in the fleet will be the prelude by default

roadburner

Two of my friends are also dyed-in-the-wool car guys. One of them picked up a new Porsche Cayman and asked his 18 year old son if he wanted to drive it- the kid said no. The other guy is incredibly involved with BMW CCA driving events of all kinds; he can't convince his 19 year old son to get a drivers license...
Meanwhile, my son constantly sends me pictures of cool cars he has seen- and constsntly hints that a Porsche Macan S would make a great graduation present.
I think not...

stickguy

I f I let me son drive my new porsche, i doubt I would see him or the car again.

my son does the same thing. Texts or sends pictures of something he likes. Few weeks ago, out of the blue, he just texts "maybe my next car will be a Mustang GT instead". And his lease does not even run out until 2/2017!

roadburner

imidazol97 said:

Cool. Car. AND the dinner bell. It's been a long time since I saw one. When growing up, many
of the farms of our friends and neighbors had them from the days when they were rung
to call the farmers from the fields to the house for dinner and then for supper.

That bell was originally at the house we lived in until we moved to the farm in 1974. That house was located on the main street of our town and the volunteer fire department had a bell instead of a siren. When I was a kid I liked to ring the bell and watch the cars on the main drag pull over. Drove my mom nuts; Dad thought it was funny...

driver100

abacomike said:

According to Fox News Channel:

VW announced that it found an "internal problem" affecting 800,000 additional vehicles for excess carbon dioxide emissions but did not indicate which vehicles were affected.  I would think these vehicles are gasoline powered since it is CO2 emissions that are involved.

Further, VW stated it would cost 2 billion dollars to correct the problem.  I am starting to wonder what the next surprise announcement is going to involve.  Not good for VW - it keeps getting worse!  

This is hitting closer to home, so I checked and the Passat has a 2.5 litre engine. The 1.4 l is in very small models;

Tuesday’s findings over carbon dioxide emissions, and petrol-fuelled cars, are understood to involve smaller 1.4-litre engines, mostly in the VW Polo and Golf, as well some Seat and Skoda cars, and the Audi A1 and A3.

A change in the CO2 emissions of the vehicles would also affect their fuel economy, VW admitted. "It was established that the CO2 levels and thus the fuel consumption figures for some models were set too low during the CO2 certification process," the company said.

The company said it would “endeavour to clarify the further course of action as quickly as possible and ensure the correct CO2 classification for the vehicles affected” with the responsible authorities.

And, of course, the usuall blah blah blah,

“The board of management of Volkswagen deeply regrets this situation and wishes to underscore its determination to systematically continue along the present path of clarification and transparency,” it added.

Why don't they just say we got caught cheating our customers!

houdini1

venture said:

oldfarmer50 said:

suydam said:

My middle son totaled his car within 3 weeks of getting his license. Good thing it was an old Dodge beater. He had paid half for it though so it was all the money in the world to him. Hasn't had an accident since. Anyone buying a new car for a new licensee is a fool. I wonder if the post is a fake? A lot of those going around FB.

I've trained 4 kids to drive. The two who were the most responsible have had multiple accidents. The two flakey ones none. I don't know what to make of that.

On the other hand...

I bought my daughter a 4 or 5 year old car when she was starting college. I figured I knew what to expect. A few weeks after she got it she ran into a curb. I had to buy a wheel and tire. A few months after that she came home with the right front fender bent. She took it on vacation to the shore and one of her friends smashed into the back of a pickup (no injuries, but I told her not to let anyone else drive it.)

When my son was starting college I bought him a new Nissan Sentra. I figured I knew what to expect. He drove it all through 5 years of college and never put a mark on it. We put tires on it once. He traded it in on his BMW after he graduated.

I guess if you know your kids buying them a new car when they are a new licensee doesn't make everyone a fool...to be kind.

Same car I bought my son in his second year of college. Same result too. He sold it when he graduated and got his first job and company car.

nyccarguy

I don't think it is foolish at all to buy your kid a brand new car when they get their license.  I just don't think it is necessary to buy them a $45K Infiniti Q50.

Michaell

nyccarguy said:

I don't think it is foolish at all to buy your kid a brand new car when they get their license.  I just don't think it is necessary to buy them a $45K Infiniti Q50.

We did that for my step-daughter when she went away to college .. unfortunately, it was an '06 ION that was part of the massive ignition recall.

The car is still in the family, being driven by her brother. Probably at 130,000 miles and still going.

Mr_Shiftright

I don't think it's a good idea. The newbie needs at least 6 months under their belt. That's when they are most vulnerable to accidents. If they smash up a brand new car, that doubles-down on the depreciation. On a brand new $45K car, a serious but repairable fender-bender will turn that $45K car into a $30K car. Not a great lesson in financial responsibility for a young person.

suydam

It depends on whether you expect them to contribute. It was important for my kids to feel they had a stake in the game. And a couple benefitted from cars in the family passed down.

driver100

I wanted to see the world's largest miniature railway when we were in Germany....but Hamburg would have been a long ways from Stuttgart. Maybe another time...........

https://youtu.be/ACkmg3Y64_s

henryn

Speaking of old Honda Preludes, I actually saw one yesterday, which is rather unusual. I was stuck in traffic next to one, so obviously I noticed it and checked it out. Back window was aftermarket tinted, the kind with about 10,000 bubbles in it. And when I finally pulled even, I noticed there was a “necker’s knob” on the steering wheel? When’s the last time you saw one of those?

isellhondas

snakeweasel said:

isellhondas said:

Question for the baseball experts.

Has any team ever lost three in a row and been able to win the Worlds Series?

Yes, the Twins did it in 1987 and in 1991 and the diamondbacks did it in 2001. In all three cases the winning team had home field advantage and won the first two games at home then lost three in a row away then won the last two at home.

Now if you are asking if any team has ever won after losing the first three games then no. The only team in North America sports to win a seven game series after losing the first three were the 2004 Red Socks in the AL championship.

Yeah, that's what I was asking. Has a team ever lost the first three games and then won the World's Series by winning four in a row. Thanks for confirming that.

imidazol97

Three scandals in a row from VW:

robr2

This morning I went to an inter-faith ceremony at the Islamic center here in town. Over the weekend, it was vandalized with the word "USA" spray painted on the exterior multiple times. There were about 100 people there along with our state legislator, town officials, and leaders of every other house of worship in town. It began with opening remarks and then asking everyone to write positive messages on poster boards on the vandalized wall to show support for congregation - many of which natural born Americans just like us. All the faith leaders spoke and then all offered a closing prayer.

It was moving and every member of the center that was there took the time to shake hands with as many of us as possible. Then there was coffee, tea, and donuts and I discovered that all faiths love bonding over artery clogging pastries!!

On the wall were copies of e-mails offering support and assistance to clean up the graffiti from multiple business, social, scout, military, and religious groups from the area. It was impressive to see.

BTW, the two guys that did it were caught and have been arraigned on felony charges of malicious destruction. Alcohol was involved. Both of them graduated with my son a few months ago. I asked if he knew them. His reply was "yeah I knew who they were - not the brightest kids but I didn't think they were stupid."

driver100

henryn said:

Speaking of old Honda Preludes, I actually saw one yesterday, which is rather unusual. I was stuck in traffic next to one, so obviously I noticed it and checked it out. Back window was aftermarket tinted, the kind with about 10,000 bubbles in it. And when I finally pulled even, I noticed there was a “necker’s knob” on the steering wheel? When’s the last time you saw one of those?

It seems that 80% of Honda Preludes have dark tinted windows...........I'd like to know the reason....maybe preferred by gangsters or something

Aren't those steering wheel knobs illegal now? I never wanted one but I remember people used to use them. Probably ended when power steering came along. Not much feel of the road with a Brody Knob.

abacomike

Driver, you are coming down to Florida this weekend - be prepared for summertime weather and temperatures.  For the past two weeks, temps have been averaging 8-10 degrees above normal and the forecast is for continued above average temps.

Usually by the time we get to November, I can turn off the A/C in the evenings and open up the windows and sliding glass doors on the terrace and get some fresh air into the condo.  But not this year.  Humidities have been in the 70%-75% range and temps in the evening in the high 70's and low 80's.

The meteorologists attribute this heat wave to a huge wave of high pressure off the southeast coast of the U.S.  It is blocking cold fronts from coming south to Florida. 

isellhondas

driver100 said:

henryn said:

Speaking of old Honda Preludes, I actually saw one yesterday, which is rather unusual. I was stuck in traffic next to one, so obviously I noticed it and checked it out. Back window was aftermarket tinted, the kind with about 10,000 bubbles in it. And when I finally pulled even, I noticed there was a “necker’s knob” on the steering wheel? When’s the last time you saw one of those?

It seems that 80% of Honda Preludes have dark tinted windows...........I'd like to know the reason....maybe preferred by gangsters or something

Aren't those steering wheel knobs illegal now? I never wanted one but I remember people used to use them. Probably ended when power steering came along. Not much feel of the road with a Brody Knob.

I never heard them called Brodie knobs and I have heard them called Suicide Knobs.

If you were making a tight turn at speed sometimes the knob could get caught in your shirtsleeve or it could simply bust off.

snakeweasel

abacomike said:

In general, according to more recent data collected in the past 2-3 years, millennials tend to be less interested in the styling, power/performance, branding, luxury, etc., of automobiles and SUV's and more tuned into technology, safety, fuel economy and cost of ownership.  They (millennials) tend  not to worship or idolize or salivate over vehicles like the baby-boomers did/do.

Not only that but fewer and fewer are getting drivers licenses and many that do who live in densely populated areas with good public transportation systems opt for a car sharing program for the few times they need one.

snakeweasel

explorerx4 said:

Personally, I don't think people change too much. Most millenials would love to own a nice vehicle.
It's a matter of finances and priorities.

While priorities and finances do play a part millenials are changing who we are. Many are moving back into cities and forgoing cars. In some circles status symbols are frowned upon. They may want a nice car but that nice car will more likely be a Ford than a Benz.

snakeweasel

roadburner said:

Two of my friends are also dyed-in-the-wool car guys. One of them picked up a new Porsche Cayman and asked his 18 year old son if he wanted to drive it- the kid said no. The other guy is incredibly involved with BMW CCA driving events of all kinds; he can't convince his 19 year old son to get a drivers license...
Meanwhile, my son constantly sends me pictures of cool cars he has seen- and constsntly hints that a Porsche Macan S would make a great graduation present.
I think not...

Tell your son that you think he is right and that you just enrolled in typing school and that you expect him to get you one when you graduate next week.

snakeweasel

driver100 said:

Aren't those steering wheel knobs illegal now? I never wanted one but I remember people used to use them. Probably ended when power steering came along. Not much feel of the road with a Brody Knob.

I think that they are legal in most states (not sure about our neighbors up north), and yes they were almost needed if you didn't have power steering and had a standard tranny.

stever

Adaptive outfits sell them for disabled drivers, but they don't call them Brodies. Don't think you need a Rx or anything. Apparently they are (mostly) legal, per this link at least.

oldfarmer50

abacomike said:

Driver, you are coming down to Florida this weekend - be prepared for summertime weather and temperatures.  For the past two weeks, temps have been averaging 8-10 degrees above normal and the forecast is for continued above average temps.

Usually by the time we get to November, I can turn off the A/C in the evenings and open up the windows and sliding glass doors on the terrace and get some fresh air into the condo.  But not this year.  Humidities have been in the 70%-75% range and temps in the evening in the high 70's and low 80's.

The meteorologists attribute this heat wave to a huge wave of high pressure off the southeast coast of the U.S.  It is blocking cold fronts from coming south to Florida. 

Been warm up here too. In the high 60s to low 70s which is near record. Lovin' it! The story we get involves El Niño. Don't care as long as it keeps the snow away.

isellhondas

snakeweasel said:

driver100 said:

Aren't those steering wheel knobs illegal now? I never wanted one but I remember people used to use them. Probably ended when power steering came along. Not much feel of the road with a Brody Knob.

I think that they are legal in most states (not sure about our neighbors up north), and yes they were almost needed if you didn't have power steering and had a standard tranny.

I heard they were illegal years ago but I suppose they could be legal in some states. I know they are used a lot on big semi trucks. They use nice metal ones with ball bearings.

Another thing that would happen if the driver let go of the knob after making a tight turn the knob would sometimes deliver a nasty rap to the wrist.

oldfarmer50

Tales from Craigslist.

Thought this car might be tempting until I asked myself "why would a car need shocks at 39,000 miles"?

http://albany.craigslist.org/cto/5300397884.html

abacomike

@oldfarmer50 said:

"Been warm up here too. In the high 60s to low 70s which is near record. Lovin' it! The story we get involves El Niño. Don't care as long as it keeps the snow away."

Keep the "snow" away?  You mean distortion on your TV because of a poor signal from you "antenna"?  Didn't know temperatures affected TV signals!  

explorerx4

@oldfarmer,
Regarding the car needing new shocks, it is a 1997 so they were supporting the suspension for a long time.
Took a half a day off from work to clean up the leaves/mow the lawn(still growing!).
I got by partially by dreaming of new cars.

snakeweasel

oldfarmer50 said:

Tales from Craigslist.

Thought this car might be tempting until I asked myself "why would a car need shocks at 39,000 miles"?

http://albany.craigslist.org/cto/5300397884.html

It's not the 39,000 miles but the fact that the car is 19 years old. Parts do wear out with time, my issue would be what other parts will fail due to being 19 years old.

suydam

And the fact that the rear seat and headliner were set on fire!!

oldfarmer50

suydam said:

And the fact that the rear seat and headliner were set on fire!!

For the right price and milage I'd drive it while they were still burning.