Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations (Archived)

imidazol97

fezo said:

Costco has it at $159. Well, if they had that size in stock they would. They did have a set of Michelin Premiers which are slowly replacing the Primacys in the lineup. $70 rebate from Michelin for buying four tires. The Mazda, being an S, has 17" wheels which kicks up the price a bit but I'm quite happy with the tires if a fair bit lighter in the wallet.

How do you describe the difference in the Premiers that you got and the Primacy tires?

My car has 18-inch wheels (235x50x18) and I see Michelin is limited on what tires it offers. Mostly the tire applications overlap with premium vehicles, CTS, etc.. So for the first time when these Goodyears wear out, I'll either have to trade the car in for new tires or I'll have to buy a brand other than Michelin. I suspect they may offer more tires in this size by then, however. I took a quick look through Tirerack and find lots of other brands at moderate pricing.

We will have a Costco in this area by then. I don't like the Sams clubs (we have two). That may make tire buying a lot easier.

When I was picking up the car there was an LT1 next to mine in the same color but with the 17-inch wheels. I told the saleslady those were the wheels and tires I wanted! She thought I was crazy, but I'd already checked to see what tires Michelin had available for replacements before picking that car.

mako1a

Most complained about cars. Hope this helps potential buyers. (I was shocked to see my fav Escape on there).

The 2014 Projected Car Complaint Index Ratings

MODEL


COMPLAINT INDEX RATIO

Nissan Pathfinder 29,527

Infiniti QX60 23,691

Hyundai Santa Fe 23,657

Ford Focus 13,179

Cadillac ATS 11,181

Hyundai Veloster 11,071

Ford C-Max 10,221

Toyota Prius 9,352

Subaru BRZ 9,304

Jeep Wrangler 9,236

Nissan Altima 9,231

Chevrolet Volt 8,868

Nissan Leaf 8,314

Dodge Journey 8,038

Ford Fiesta 7,343

Kia Sorento 6,645

Hyundai Sonata 6,593

Mazda CX-5 6,419

Ford Escape 5,975

Toyota Scion FR-S 5,829

Here's the link> http://www.lemonlaw.com/carcomplaintindex.html

imidazol97

mako1a said:

Most complained about cars. Hope this helps potential buyers. (I was shocked to see my fav Escape on there).

I was surprised to see the ATS along with the Volt on there. AND the data here should have more meaning than the typical list of hated or liked cars because the website claims that the numbers are adjusted for the sales volume and the number that are still on the road.

One of the attorneys from there did a long interview on an area car talk program last Saturday. He claimed that Mercedes, Ford, and Honda are more resistant than other brands to being wrong when a customer ends up suing them over an actual flaw. He said GM was doing much better--the recent capitulation on many big and little problems and gettin' them fixed has helped with GM's record in his mind. He makes an interesting guest on a talk show because he took calls from folks about their problems they have in their cars. He clearly says when the flaw was one of a pattern for that vehicle model or brand. I wish the show was available on podcast so I could link to it.
1-800-lemon-law is their phone and site. Cute.

qbrozen

huh. Ford is 20% of the list.

Based on my experience with an Escape rental, that one doesn't surprise me.

ab348

qbrozen said:

huh. Ford is 20% of the list.

Based on my experience with an Escape rental, that one doesn't surprise me.

Lots of Hyundai/Kia vehicles there too. Not really a surprise.

Inexcusable, though, for Cadillac to be there. Simply inexcusable.

fezo

The ATS surprised me. So did the Altima and the CX-5. More surprising is the lack of Volkswagens. Other than that a lot of the usual suspects.

The big thing they are pushing on the Premiers is a newer runner and tread design made to make it a better tire under wet conditions even after the tire wears down quite a bit. They handle pretty similar. A shame about the Pilots but I didn't want to end up renting a cheapy or overextending the donut.

driver100

I dunno if protectant on leather makes any sense. Carpet, perhaps, if it works on carpet.

I didn't get perforated leather/cooling seats this time. Only used it about 10 times in 3 years, 3X a year average.

driver100

mako1a said:

Most complained about cars. Hope this helps potential buyers. (I was shocked to see my fav Escape on there).

The 2014 Projected Car Complaint Index Ratings

MODEL


COMPLAINT INDEX RATIO

Nissan Pathfinder 29,527

Infiniti QX60 23,691

Hyundai Santa Fe 23,657

Ford Focus 13,179

Cadillac ATS 11,181

Hyundai Veloster 11,071

Ford C-Max 10,221

Toyota Prius 9,352

Subaru BRZ 9,304

Jeep Wrangler 9,236

Nissan Altima 9,231

Chevrolet Volt 8,868

Nissan Leaf 8,314

Dodge Journey 8,038

Ford Fiesta 7,343

Kia Sorento 6,645

Hyundai Sonata 6,593

Mazda CX-5 6,419

Ford Escape 5,975

Toyota Scion FR-S 5,829

Here's the link> http://www.lemonlaw.com/carcomplaintindex.html

Hmmmm....No Mercedes ...bmw....or Audi's.....or even Land Rovers!

Mr_Shiftright

I don't really know what to make of that list...I mean, are the complaints 'weighted' on severity? Are they only about the car, or does that include "I had to go back 5 times to the dealer!!" How do demographics fit into this---are more affluent buyers less likely to take to the internet to air their grievances?

mako1a

This is an amazing, quick guide to car values listing wholesale and retail on 1983-2013 cars plus classics and exotics. Site is quick, no nonsense and covers most makes and years and provides (FV) future values.
http://www.vmrintl.com/makes.htm

driver100

This video shows how they make Teslas. Notice how the robots do so much of the work, and notice how clean the place looks (5 minutes but it flies by)

https://youtube.com/embed/8_lfxPI5ObM?rel=0

I think we lost the ability to write in our own words!

driver100

Very good quick guide....easy to use.

driver100

Mr_Shiftright said:

I don't really know what to make of that list...I mean, are the complaints 'weighted' on severity? Are they only about the car, or does that include "I had to go back 5 times to the dealer!!" How do demographics fit into this---are more affluent buyers less likely to take to the internet to air their grievances?

I agree, not too sure what the list really means. Did they use the 20 cars with most problems, did they select only certain makes, how does this weighting system really work?

Not sure how useful that chart really is.

driver100

Question. Anyone know much about an air exchanger. Like, how important is it.

Ours stopped working and it would cost about $400 for a new motor and $100 for labor.

It hasn't worked for a few months now I presume, we just had our bi-yearly check up and they found that it wasn't working, and, I am not sure we noticed any difference.

Not sure how necessary it is.

robr2

driver100 said:

Question. Anyone know much about an air exchanger. Like, how important is it.

Ours stopped working and it would cost about $400 for a new motor and $100 for labor.

It hasn't worked for a few months now I presume, we just had our bi-yearly check up and they found that it wasn't working, and, I am not sure we noticed any difference.

Not sure how necessary it is.

I presume this is in Canada? In very tight, energy efficient homes, the air exchanger brings in fresh air to replace the stale air in the winter and to help evacuate humid air in the summer.

Mr_Shiftright

I've used this site before--it's quite good. They even get most of the Porsche prices right, which none of the other guides do. Very impressive design and programming--very user friendly.

roadburner

Mr_Shiftright said:

I don't really know what to make of that list...I mean, are the complaints 'weighted' on severity? Are they only about the car, or does that include "I had to go back 5 times to the dealer!!" How do demographics fit into this---are more affluent buyers less likely to take to the internet to air their grievances?

And are the complaints about component failures or vehicle design? We've had more than one doofus on here buy a Wrangler and then complain because it was noisy and had a stiff ride. One poor fool complained that the Jeep's convertible top was hard to put down. Who would have thought?

And I know BMW gets complaints about their how much the brakes dust on their vehicles- from the "It's better to look cool than stop quickly." crowd I'll assume.

qbrozen

ab348 said:

qbrozen said:

huh. Ford is 20% of the list.

Based on my experience with an Escape rental, that one doesn't surprise me.

Lots of Hyundai/Kia vehicles there too. Not really a surprise.

Inexcusable, though, for Cadillac to be there. Simply inexcusable.

True. If you group them, Hyunkia got 20%, as did Infinissan.

But, no, I don't know what it means either.

driver100

I presume this is in Canada? In very tight, energy efficient homes, the air exchanger brings in fresh air to replace the stale air in the winter and to help evacuate humid air in the summer.

Yes, this air exchanger is in the home in Canada. The home is pretty well insulated. But, doesn't air transfer whenever you open a door etc.? Do you really need constant air transfer, inside to out etc.?

Mr_Shiftright

Jeep tops are diabolical. I thought everybody knew that by now.

I pay little attention to these vague lists. I prefer sites like:

http://www.carcomplaints.com

At least they give you the "top 5 problems reported", how many times each problem was reported, and a detailed account of the failure. If 50 people who own your car tell you that the power steering pump caught fire, you'd best pay attention.

roadburner said:

Mr_Shiftright said:

I don't really know what to make of that list...I mean, are the complaints 'weighted' on severity? Are they only about the car, or does that include "I had to go back 5 times to the dealer!!" How do demographics fit into this---are more affluent buyers less likely to take to the internet to air their grievances?

And are the complaints about component failures or vehicle design? We've had more than one doofus on here buy a Wrangler and then complain because it was noisy and had a stiff ride. One poor fool complained that the Jeep's convertible top was hard to put down. Who would have thought?

And I know BMW gets complaints about their how much the brakes dust on their vehicles- from the "It's better to look cool than stop quickly." crowd I'll assume.

imidazol97

roadburner said:

I don't really know what to make of that list...I mean, are the complaints 'weighted' on severity? Are they only about the car, or does that include "I had to go back 5 times to the dealer!!" How do demographics fit into this---are more affluent buyers less likely to take to the internet to air their grievances?

I suspect certain vehicle owners of some brands or folks who are older don't think of making complaints on the internet about their car problems. Younger folks are probably just too darned busy to make complaints.

And I surmise that some vehicle owners would never admit to their vehicle brand/model having some problems and they would never publicly make a complaint to help maintain their brand's image.

roadburner said:

And are the complaints about component failures or vehicle design? We've had more than one doofus on here buy a Wrangler and then complain because it was noisy and had a stiff ride. One poor fool complained that the Jeep's convertible top was hard to put down. Who would have thought?
And I know BMW gets complaints about their how much the brakes dust on their vehicles- from the "It's better to look cool than stop quickly." crowd I'll assume.

I did some quick read and looks at ATS comments last evening. The data is cumulative over the years. So a car brand with a bad reputation for a while will likely show problems for a lot of years later. When I zoomed in on a brand, there were bar graphs showing the number of complaints by year. A good thing, but not indicated in the general number in their headline.

They take some data from the NHSTA.

isellhondas

driver100 said:

This video shows how they make Teslas. Notice how the robots do so much of the work, and notice how clean the place looks (5 minutes but it flies by)

https://youtube.com/embed/8_lfxPI5ObM?rel=0

I think we lost the ability to write in our own words!

Very interesting video!

We live in what has got to be the Tesla capital of the U.S.! A day doesn't go by when I don't see at least two on the road. Sometimes as many as six!

Mr_Shiftright

Yes, quite a bit of data from NHTSA at carcomplaints.com---and they have a boatload of complaints on the ATS for engine stalling. So something's up with the car.

imidazol97

Mr_Shiftright said:

Yes, quite a bit of data from NHTSA at carcomplaints.com---and they have a boatload of complaints on the ATS for engine stalling. So something's up with the car.

I see the stalling comments. What's odd is it doesn't sound like stalling where the engine tries to keep going when it's deficient in spark or fuel. On the other hand, it's like stop-start and the engine just quietly shuts down while AT IDLE. Attn: Mary Barra. Get on this problem stat.

stickguy

Driver, the tighter your house is, the more you need an air exchanger. Like someone noted, it takes the stale air out and brings fresh air in.

stickguy

very easy to use interface. I assume that they just base on a mid point condition? since it does not take into account clean/rough/excellent.

but based on this, my car for sale is not too out of line. Maybe $500 high, so a decent place to start. If I get no buzz will just renew the add add $7,495

driver100

stickguy said:

Driver, the tighter your house is, the more you need an air exchanger. Like someone noted, it takes the stale air out and brings fresh air in.

Thanks for the explanation. In that case might get it done.....when we get back from Florida!

oldfarmer50

driver100 said:

Question. Anyone know much about an air exchanger. Like, how important is it.

Ours stopped working and it would cost about $400 for a new motor and $100 for labor.

It hasn't worked for a few months now I presume, we just had our bi-yearly check up and they found that it wasn't working, and, I am not sure we noticed any difference.

Not sure how necessary it is.

As someone stated it's important to bring fresh air into a tight house but just as importantly it does so without excessive energy loss.

abacomike

@imidazol97‌

"And I surmise that some vehicle owners would never admit to their vehicle brand/model having some problems and they would never publicly make a complaint to help maintain their brand's image."

I would agree that older folks are somewhat less inclined to air complaints about their pride and joy (car) in public.  They have a sense of loyalty toward their brand.

I am not like that - I feel that if a car is not performing as it should, it should be aired. I don't know if you remember the problems I had with my white 2013 E350.  I posted quite a bit about the constant stalling caused by by faulty injectors on that car and the problems I had getting it identified.  I sure didn't hold back any punches!  Same with my 2008 BMW's.

abacomike

@driver100 said:

"I didn't get perforated leather/cooling seats this time. Only used it about 10 times in 3 years, 3X a year average."

Down here in south Floida ventilated seats are essential to me.  It is very hott and humid from June through October.  As soon as I get in the car, I turn on the ventilated seats.  Obviously, you automatically get perforated leather seats to allow ai

If I lived up north, I would not order ventilated seats - it is hot only 2-1/2 months a year.

@ab348

Yes, if you spill anything on those seats, it soaks right into the padding.  I never eat or drink beverages in my car for that very reason.

imidazol97

abacomike said:

@imidazol97‌

" I don't know if you remember the problems I had with my white 2013 E350.  I posted quite a bit about the constant stalling caused by by faulty injectors on that car and the problems I had getting it identified.  I sure didn't hold back any punches!  Same with my 2008 BMW's.

I recall that. I thought of that when I reading the anecdotal reports that ATS's were having a strange stall only at idle.

imidazol97

abacomike said:

@driver100 said:

"I didn't get perforated leather/cooling seats this time. Only used it about 10 times in 3 years, 3X a year average."

Down here in south Floida ventilated seats are essential to me.  It is very hott and humid from June through October.  As soon as I get in the car, I turn on the ventilated seats.  Obviously, you automatically get perforated leather seats to allow ai

If I lived up north, I would not order ventilated seats - it is hot only 2-1/2 months a year.

Those of us in the north don't need ventilated seats so much. In turn, I doubt that many folks in FL are ordering engine heaters in their new vehicles.

abacomike

@imidazol97 said:

" I doubt that many folks in FL are ordering engine heaters in their new vehicles."

No, I don't believe so.  I use the heated seats 2 or 3 times a year.

I remember my grandparents' cars (they lived in Coral Gables from 1950 until they passed away) did not have heaters in them.  I remember visiting them at Christmas time many times and on cold mornings, it was brutal.  Heaters in cars were not sold down here in the 40's and 50's.  It was optional.

driver100

oldfarmer50 said:

driver100 said:

Question. Anyone know much about an air exchanger. Like, how important is it.

Ours stopped working and it would cost about $400 for a new motor and $100 for labor.

It hasn't worked for a few months now I presume, we just had our bi-yearly check up and they found that it wasn't working, and, I am not sure we noticed any difference.

Not sure how necessary it is.

As someone stated it's important to bring fresh air into a tight house but just as importantly it does so without excessive energy loss.

Thanks OF. It sounds like an air exchanger is a good thing to have, especially as the house is 8 years old and was built with lots of insulation. I thank you all for your help....and especially
imidazol who took the time to email. Very much appreciated.

driver100

abacomike said:

@imidazol97‌

"And I surmise that some vehicle owners would never admit to their vehicle brand/model having some problems and they would never publicly make a complaint to help maintain their brand's image."

I would agree that older folks are somewhat less inclined to air complaints about their pride and joy (car) in public.  They have a sense of loyalty toward their brand.

I am not like that - I feel that if a car is not performing as it should, it should be aired. I don't know if you remember the problems I had with my white 2013 E350.  I posted quite a bit about the constant stalling caused by by faulty injectors on that car and the problems I had getting it identified.  I sure didn't hold back any punches!  Same with my 2008 BMW's.

And about the Lexus too!

I don't care either, I would complain too if I had something to complain about. I really don't have a complaint about any of our last 6 or 7cars....except for I don't like the run flat tires....seem to wear fast and I don't like the fact you don't have a spare, and could get stuck in a small town, needing a set of 4 tires. Also, expensive to replace. Oh, and the 95 Volvo that stalled and it took 3 Volvo dealers to find the problem. BMWs were fine, 2 Mercedes were fine, Jeeps good.............sometimes I wonder if the driver could be the problem.

I have a sister-in-law who is always having problems with her cars....even new ones. I think she is the problem somehow.

driver100

@ab348

Yes, if you spill anything on those seats, it soaks right into the padding.  I never eat or drink beverages in my car for that very reason.

I didn't think about that. I haven't had a spill but we could be drinking coffee on the road, so that is another reason for me not getting perforated seats. That's all I need, mould growing under my butt.

abacomike

@driver100 said:

"That's all I need, mould growing under my butt."

There you go again with British spellings, i.e. mould vs. mold.

imidazol97

@Abacomike I remember my grandparents' cars (they lived in Coral Gables from 1950 until they passed away) did not have heaters in them.  I remember visiting them at Christmas time many times and on cold mornings, it was brutal.  Heaters in cars were not sold down here in the 40's and 50's.  It was optional.

I do remember heaters were optional in many cars and in pickups back when I was a tyke.

But the heaters I meant were for the engine blocks. The owner plugs in the car and the oil and block are kept somewhat warmer than the ambient to give easy starting in the morning with easier cranking for the starter motor AND the coolant in the block was already lukewarm, so the heater in the car gives off heat much more quickly.

Not much need for those engine block heaters from Alabama south.

stever

First time since the early 80s that I've owned a car without a block heater (then again, the current ride is a Yooper Caravan so maybe there's a cord hidden in the engine compartment that I haven't noticed).

(and I rather enjoy the Canadian spellings from our neighbour, but I was the kid sending away for Saskatchewan tourist brochures when I was 11).

stickguy

one of my rules of thumb is to never live someplace where there are outlets to plug in your engine block heater. And you need to use them.

driver100

abacomike said:

@driver100 said:

"That's all I need, mould growing under my butt."

There you go again with British spellings, i.e. mould vs. mold.

That's the first time I used the word here I am sure...and you got me. Here is a list of most words, with British, Canadian, and U.S. spelling. Sometimes Canada goes with the British, but, sometimes the US.

www3.telus.net/linguisticsissues/BritishCanadianAmerican.htm


Whether it is mold or mould, I don't want it growing in my car seat.

driver100

(and I rather enjoy the Canadian spellings from our neighbour, but I was the kid sending away for Saskatchewan tourist brochures when I was 11).

You actually wanted to go to Saskatchewan?

Saskatchewan was kind of nowhere but lately it has started booming.....potash, and oil are making it take off.......I guess you were ahead of your time.

oldfarmer50

mako1a said:

This is an amazing, quick guide to car values listing wholesale and retail on 1983-2013 cars plus classics and exotics. Site is quick, no nonsense and covers most makes and years and provides (FV) future values.
http://www.vmrintl.com/makes.htm

I like that site. Shows my Eclipse as worth more at retail than Edmunds.

laurasdada

Re: List of car complaints. A macro-view comment: Another "bad" list that Jaguar is not on! 8000+ trouble free miles so far. Knock burled walnut.

cdnpinhead

stickguy said:

one of my rules of thumb is to never live someplace where there are outlets to plug in your engine block heater. And you need to use them.

My experience has been, having lived in areas that had block heater outlets all over the place, is that such climates keep the riff-raff out -- very few homeless shelters.

It's interesting to compare the productivity of cold countries to those "blessed" with a warm climate.

Oh my God -- did he just say that? Yes, yes he did.

stever

Anyone with ideas for this poster, please chime in. TIA.

Deal with a fraudulent dealer

abacomike

@imidazol97‌ said:

"But the heaters I meant were for the engine blocks."

Yep, I knew you were - I should have prefaced my response with something like, "...speaking of cold climates and heaters...".

I had an engine block heater for my 1987 Mercedes diesel.  Whenever the overnight temps would fall into the lower teens or single digits or below zero, I would plug it in overnight in the garage.  That way the engine would start much more quickly instead of waiting for over a minute for the glow plug to warm up sufficiently.

sb55

oldfarmer50 said:

driver100 said:

Question. Anyone know much about an air exchanger. Like, how important is it.

Ours stopped working and it would cost about $400 for a new motor and $100 for labor.

It hasn't worked for a few months now I presume, we just had our bi-yearly check up and they found that it wasn't working, and, I am not sure we noticed any difference.

Not sure how necessary it is.

As someone stated it's important to bring fresh air into a tight house but just as importantly it does so without excessive energy loss.

I built a new house 5 years ago and insulated with spray foam insulation so it is tight. Nobody recommended an air to air exchanger. I could never get the indoor humidity low enough so we had foggy windows on the coldest winter days, and almost every morning in our bedroom. (In my last house built in 1979 I could never get the humidity HIGH enough. It was so full of air leaks that I ran a humidifier all winter.) I finally retrofitted one here (for $3000.00!), and it has helped a lot. If you use your house in the winter, I think it's necessary in a newer house.

driver100

I like that site. Shows my Eclipse as worth more at retail than Edmunds.


I wish I knew about that site....my 535 is worth $2000 more at wholesale than in Canada...it should be worth that much less in US dollars.

driver100

laurasdada said:

Re: List of car complaints. A macro-view comment: Another "bad" list that Jaguar is not on! 8000+ trouble free miles so far. Knock burled walnut.

Before you get too excited laurasdada, there doesn't seem to be any European cars on the list....it looks like they didn't include them.