Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations (Archived)

driver100

.sb55 said- It was so full of air leaks that I ran a humidifier all winter.) I finally retrofitted one here (for $3000.00!), and it has helped a lot. If you use your house in the winter, I think it's necessary in a newer house.


I think it is just easier to live in Florida. Yes, you do need an air conditioner, you don't need an air exchanger, humidifier, winter clothes, turn off the water to the outside in winter, shovel snow, and...............you don't even need a closet near the front door for coats.

stickguy

One good way to know you are far enough south. The hot water heater is in the garage. When we were in NC recently and stopped to look at a new house development, I was surprised to find it in the back corner of the garage, not inside. May have helped that the garage had fully finished walls and a well sealed door, but I still though it could potentially get cold enough down there to freeze. Guess not.

ab348

stever said:

First time since the early 80s that I've owned a car without a block heater (then again, the current ride is a Yooper Caravan so maybe there's a cord hidden in the engine compartment that I haven't noticed).

(and I rather enjoy the Canadian spellings from our neighbour, but I was the kid sending away for Saskatchewan tourist brochures when I was 11).

I bought a 2002 Olds Intrigue and had it for some time before noticing one day that there was an electrical cord neatly tucked away behind a headlight, still with the factory tie-downs on it. Apparently they came with a block heater from the factory (or at least this one did). I think I used it once on a very cold night, but never really noticed much difference. It always started regardless so it wasn't like in the old days where engines wouldn't even crank over if it was too cold (as in our family's '74 Maverick, which hated cold weather).

I once visited Regina, Saskatchewan in January and it was colder than I had ever experienced before or since - -40 Celsius overnight and not much warmer during the day. Not only did many parking lots there have electrical outlets to plug in your car, but some people even used supplemental hot-air heaters under their cars in their driveways overnight. Unbelievable how cold it gets there.

stever

We're under contract to buy a house and the water heater (propane) is in the garage. More often they are in interior closets here - we do get some freezing weather and the odd brief snowfall. But this one is in an attached garage and abuts the house wall, so the space is conditioned somewhat. I'd hate for it to burst though - the garage floor has been finished with one of those shiny epoxy kind of surfaces and looks clean enough to eat off of.

Luckily the lot is big enough so that I don't actually have to park a car in it.

In my Anchorage days, I didn't have a garage. I'd plug the cars in occasionally in the cold snaps to a switched outlet. Then when I'd wake up, I'd flip the switch while I made coffee - an hour was plenty to get the oil moving. Then I got one of those interior heaters and that would go on at the same time and clear the windows.

When you went to town, you had to be a little careful walking around. Besides the icy spots, you had to negotiate lots of extension cords.

Imagine the mess if EVs took off and you could tie into parking meters everywhere.

jayrider

stever said:

We're under contract to buy a house and the water heater (propane) is in the garage.

If it doesn't have one already, you can buy a insulating cover that will offset the chill in the garage. It will pay for itself quickly.

abacomike

stever said:

"We're under contract to buy a house and the water heater (propane) is in the garage."

All you need to do is properly insulate the water pipes.  The water heater itself keeps the water temperature fairly stable within the unit.

stever

Hm, the garage may already be insulated @jayrider (more to keep the heat out than the cold, I'm guessing lol). And it has one of those little circulating pumps to move the hot water around to all the taps and that may help too. And there's a softener out there, but I don't remember any heat source for the garage. Lot to learn about the house yet.

Anyone have an epoxy garage floor and are there any tricks to keeping it looking smurfy?

driver100

In my Anchorage days, I didn't have a garage. I'd plug the cars in occasionally in the cold snaps to a switched outlet. Then when I'd wake up, I'd flip the switch while I made coffee - an hour was plenty to get the oil moving. Then I got one of those interior heaters and that would go on at the same time and clear the windows.

Pretty good....you were the guy who invented the firsrt remote car starter.

stever

The little car heater worked okay, although you always wondered if you were going to catch the seats or dash on fire. Switched outdoor outlets were pretty common up there. Down "south" they're installed for Christmas lights I guess.

oldfarmer50

Was watching MotorWeek on PBS this morning. They has a piece on the Camaro Z28. $75,000 and not even an air conditioner. 505hp.

Twice the price of a Mustang GT for just 90 more hp? Yes, it was track ready but how much time do you spend on the track?

fezo

Propane water heater, huh? Best of luck. Before they ran the gas lines here we had propane for furnace, hot water and stove. It took forever to boil water.

driver100

Anyone have an epoxy garage floor and are there any tricks to keeping it looking smurfy?

ote>

That floor looks like you could skate on it....don't slip and fall.

Our floor in Florida is kind of similar. My B-I-L painted it royal blue with gold specs in it. Looks really nice, doesn't seem to need any additional work.

driver100

oldfarmer50 said:

Was watching MotorWeek on PBS this morning. They has a piece on the Camaro Z28. $75,000 and not even an air conditioner. 505hp.

Twice the price of a Mustang GT for just 90 more hp? Yes, it was track ready but how much time do you spend on the track?

I think you are talking yourself into that new Mustang.........seems like a bargain for half the price.

robr2

oldfarmer50 said:

Was watching MotorWeek on PBS this morning. They has a piece on the Camaro Z28. $75,000 and not even an air conditioner. 505hp.

Twice the price of a Mustang GT for just 90 more hp? Yes, it was track ready but how much time do you spend on the track?

But the Z28 doesn't compete against the GT. The Boss 302 is what it targets which has only 450 HP. Both are track ready cars that can be driven on the street. The big difference is the handling packages and the weight reduction.

The Camaro SS is the vehicle to compare to the Mustang GT.

stever

@fezo, our friends in Taos are on propane and it seems ok (they are ~3,000 feet higher too). We boil a lot of water but mostly in the electric kettle. But NG is better and it seems to be not that far away so maybe that'll be an option one day (I really prefer an all electric home).

And yeah @driver100, the garage floor does look like it could be slippery. Good thing the average annual rainfall is ~9 inches.

The house is on a quarter mile gravel road with an arroyo that'll get rough. Not a good Miata neighborhood.

oldfarmer50

robr2 said:

oldfarmer50 said:

Was watching MotorWeek on PBS this morning. They has a piece on the Camaro Z28. $75,000 and not even an air conditioner. 505hp.

Twice the price of a Mustang GT for just 90 more hp? Yes, it was track ready but how much time do you spend on the track?

But the Z28 doesn't compete against the GT. The Boss 302 is what it targets which has only 450 HP. Both are track ready cars that can be driven on the street. The big difference is the handling packages and the weight reduction.

The Camaro SS is the vehicle to compare to the Mustang GT.

But Ford discontinued the Boss, right ?

stickguy

they have an assortment of hot rod version still. Shelby always seems to pop up. If they are not there right away, expect them soon enough.

imidazol97

stever said:

Anyone have an epoxy garage floor and are there any tricks to keeping it looking smurfy?

Are those the materials where the warm tires leave prints on them from sitting? Do you need to put
tiles between the tires and floor?

robr2

oldfarmer50 said:

But Ford discontinued the Boss, right ?

The rumor mill says it's coming back for 2015.

stever

imidazol97 said:

Are those the materials where the warm tires leave prints on them from sitting? Do you need to put tiles between the tires and floor?

Good question - didn't I read somewhere that just turning your tires can rub the paint off?

jayrider

stever said:

imidazol97 said:

Are those the materials where the warm tires leave prints on them from sitting? Do you need to put tiles between the tires and floor?

Good question - didn't I read somewhere that just turning your tires can rub the paint off?

You know your life is under control, when you have time to be concerned about your garage floor. I'm happy to say that I treat my garage floor like a garage floor --- it gets swept from time to time and that's all. Gives me more time to fret about my golf game .

stever

First world problems are such a bear.

Michaell

Something happened yesterday I never thought I would see ... the wife and daughter talking about new cars.

We were out running errands - new dining room set and ottomans for the family room - and the girls started talking about the wife's next new car. Wife got on her phone and pulled up a picture of the Volvo V60 she would like. Daughter comments "but that's a car, and you like driving SUV's" whereby the wife switches over to a picture of the XC60 and shows it to the kid. Kid likes that much better.

It was interesting, given that we threw the ottomans into the back of the CX-7 (one in a box, one not) with only having to fold the 60% side of the rear seat down. Not sure we could have done that as easily in the V60.

Steve, I keep telling the wife your stories about living in Las Cruces - minimal snow, little rain, etc - and she seems more intruigued.

However, she just applied for a job with the state that is funded with federal money through the end of 2016. If she gets it, we're staying put until then.

abacomike

@‌jayrider said:

"Gives me more time to fret about my golf game"

 I gave up worrying about my golf game immediately following my first round of golf!  I realized quite quickly that I would have to rely on my tennis game to give my ego a boost - all playing golf did was deflate my ego.

I rationalized that hitting a 2-1/2 inch diameter ball with the hopes of getting it in a hole some 400+ yards away in 4 tries was ludicrous.  But then I realized that hitting a tennis ball over a net to an opponent who hit it back over that same net was just as ludicrous!

imidazol97

stever said:

imidazol97 said:

Are those the materials where the warm tires leave prints on them from sitting? Do you need to put tiles between the tires and floor?

Good question - didn't I read somewhere that just turning your tires can rub the paint off?

You can buy the 16x16 inch kitchen tile pieces and make sure your tires stop on those each time you put the car in the garage. If I recall the reading right, the warm tire treads affect the floor coating. Add on the weight and you get the tire marks left. Further, it's my thinking that the tire rubber itself is a chemistry that interacts with the surface of the paint. Add the warmth, and it's gonna leave it's mark. Alternative is to always cool your tires for a couple of hours before moving the van on into the garage.

That floor looks very smoothly done for a do-it-yourself job. If it was professionally done, maybe it's a better material than the home brews sold at Lowe's.

robr2

Garage floor finishes - there are paints and then there are two part epoxies. Garage floor paint or oven single stage epoxies can wear easily and pull up from hot tires or turning the wheels.

Two stage epoxies installed over a properly cleaned and etched concrete surface should not suffer those issues.

The difference of course is preparation and cost - slapping some concrete paint down will cost you $100. Doing a proper epoxy floor will cost $1000+.

imidazol97

Nice slide share to summarize the bullet points:
http://www.slideshare.net/AkisApostolopoulos/seven-reasons-why-epoxy-floors-fail

And even Jay Leno appears in a shameless add for a do-it-yourself epoxy pushing a roller.
Notice the BIG MISSING step in the ad: no grinding or shot blasting of the floor to get to a
clean concrete level. They primed over the oils and other contaminants in the surface of the
original floor. No moisture permeation test either.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rnCMjMrglII

driver100

The difference of course is preparation and cost - slapping some concrete paint down will cost you $100. Doing a proper epoxy floor will cost $1000+.

Now, I think we are getting OCD about garage floors......like who is going to notice? In 90% of homes the garage floor gets covered with worthless junk (especially in the South where they don't have basements) and the $40K car sits in the driveway.

Speaking about that, some garages these days are so narrow I don't think they were meant for cars.

About golf and tennis. I like tennis, but, am hopeless at golf. I asked a psychiatrist friend why most people are either good at golf or at tennis, not too many are good at both. He said golf is more concentration and thinking. Tennis is more instant, not too much thought. I prefer tennis, my brain gets a rest, 1 hour of tennis equals about 10 hours of golf for exercise value, you don't have to play at 6 a.m. to play, equipment and fees are a fraction of the cost. Golf, you sit around having drinks at the clubhouse after....tennis you can either go home or go for a $1 coffee after.

nyccarguy

To me, an integral part of the car sales process is following up. Some dealerships completely over do it and bombard your email with hollow, computer generated emails for eternity.

Some sales people gently follow up with either a post test drive phone call or genuine follow up email to genuinely see if there is really is ANYTHING else they can do such as: I know we were too far apart on the trade, but I spoke to my manager and we can knock $X more off the price of the new car plus offer you complimentary X. or "I can't come up to your trade price, but we have a demo or executive driven car that matches your specs exactly and the discount will make up the difference for what we can give you for the trade and what you want."

The dealerships that leave me scratching my head are the ones who don't follow-up at all. My parents are looking to trade in their 2013 X5 that's only a year old. They visited a Mercedes-Benz Dealership and a Jeep Dealership looking at an ML 350 4Matic and a Grand Cherokee Overland. Now the Jeep dealer completely low balled the trade and offered $31K for it (in his defense, he did tell them to try and sell it to the BMW dealer). The MB dealer offered i think $39K which is not that much off of what @qbrozen says the car is worth. Neither place has bothered to follow up. What gives? Are they too busy? Do they not care?

qbrozen

I'd like to epoxy my garage floor, but moving everything out at this point would be a week-long project, and I'd have to rent or buy some sort of little dollies to get the tire machine out. And then I'd need a couple of guys to get it back in (uphill). So I think I'd rather buy the snap together tiles and just tile the actual parking areas. It is way more expensive but would be so much easier for me.

robr2

driver100 said:

Now, I think we are getting OCD about garage floors......like who is going to notice? In 90% of homes the garage floor gets covered with worthless junk (especially in the South where they don't have basements) and the $40K car sits in the driveway.

Now now - some people treat their garages like shrines. Others obsess over their neighbor who cut down trees.

fezo

All electric? That's usually a pricey way to go unless you're generating your own electricity.

I'm a gas stove person. What a difference when we switched out the propane fof NG. Water boils twice as fast. Have gas wherever possible - furnace, hot water, stove and clothes dryer. The electric bill still makes the gas bill look tiny.

stickguy

I like those garage tiles. Just don't feel like spending the money it would cost. So I live with dirty concrete

Next house, that will get a fancy garage makeover!

stickguy

If I lived in the desert, or at least a heavy sun area, and could have a solar array I would go all electric. Not where I live now.

stever

I don't like combustion appliances in the house. Would really prefer that the garage be detached. We had a heat pump for air and heat in Boise in an all electric house and the bills were fine (we know how to insulate and caulk). Our realtor smelled propane in the garage when he opened this house before we got there so that's supposed to get checked out. It's a relatively small house with six smoke/CO detectors but no leak detector, like you see in RVs. Solar is on my wish list but we may be tapped out for a while.

The shiny (and clean) garage floor sure made the house look better (it was owner built in '01 and going by the condition, the owner may be a bit OCD. I'm not up on my garage floor finishes, but this one looks like it was put down or buffed out last week. Likely was a pro job. Kind of a shame to put it into my care.

@Michaell, it's only been two weeks but we're enjoying the town. Y'all have to come down and visit and check it out.

imidazol97

Gas has always worried me. I was standing in my condo kitchen back in the late 70s when a large propane tank exploded 4-5 miles away at a large supplier. I felt the earthquake. This was in 1978. They had another in 1998. The first was larger and I don't find any internet coverage other than its being alluded to in this article about the 2nd explosion of a smaller tank.

http://www.enquirer.com/editions/1998/08/08/loc_auxier08.html






Propane furnace repair this weekend knocks down chimney and moves house off foundation near Cincinnati.




http://www.700wlw.com/articles/local-news-119585/men-burned-after-furnace-explodes-12762997

imidazol97

Now I'm nervous about working on my fuel pump in my car. I need to replace the fuel sender rheostat. But all those gasoline fumes go boom if you make a spark due to static and have fumes lurking in the low spots.

stever

The "real" problem is indoor air quality; even well vented gas stoves dump some formaldehyde into the house. (link) It's especially a concern if you have kids. That's another reason not to build a house or buy new construction - better to have one that's had a year or three to outgas. As much as I love textiles, no wall to wall carpet for me thanks.

And - we could say the same thing about buying new cars.

imidazol97

stever said:

And - we could say the same thing about buying new cars.

Do you mean that nice new car smell in my '14 Malibu could be killing me?
That means folks who continually buy new cars are hurting their health by breathing
the off gasses from all the plastics, materials, and adhesives/coatings?

stever

Could be - my wife is sensitive to some of that stuff. I was getting a sheet of plywood the other day at Lowe's and she had to leave.

abacomike

@driver100‌

Was up to my dealer this morning for a car wash and the GM informed me that my car has been produced, has a VIN#, and is at the port awaiting a ship for transport to Georgia. Also found out the USAA, through Mercedes, is offering a $3500 fleet discount on the new E400. Coupled with the $500 from the Mercedes Benz Club of America, that's $4000 in discounts below the invoice, or $60,490.00 net. Add his dealer fee of $699 plus title, tags, etc., = $61,379. Since they are giving me $61,500 for my car, it becomes an even trade with no taxes due.

I got a chance to drive the Sales Manager's C400, which has the same engine and it was like driving a V8. Those twin turbos exhibit no lag, whatsoever.

He said the car should be at the Port of Jacksonville in about 2 weeks. He does not know when the car will be released to the dealer as they may put a hold on the 2015's because they have large inventories of 2014's on dealer's lots and still coming into the port. He said he would know better in a few weeks.

So I imagine your car has also been produced and is awaiting transport to Canada. I expect they will release your car well before they release my car to the dealership.

You might want to check with your dealership to see if they have info on your car.

stickguy

That sounds like so much fun, tracking your fancy new car. Makes me sad I am not doing it!

abacomike

@stickguy said:

"That sounds like so much fun, tracking your fancy new car. Makes me sad I am not doing it!"

There are many more things in life to make you sad than not tracking a new car from manufacture to delivery.  I rarely order a new car - just 2 in my lifetime.  Both because the cars were not available on dealer lots because they were new models.

This way I get to buy a new car with the exact equipment and color combinations I want .

stickguy

If I end up getting a legacy, I will just order it since the price is fixed. That way I get exact options I want, and skip some fluff all stock units seem to cone with,

Michaell

stever said:

@Michaell, it's only been two weeks but we're enjoying the town. Y'all have to come down and visit and check it out.

Perhaps I can convince the missus that a road trip is in order.

Ideally, we'd keep the house in CO and get a winter home somewhere warmer.

fezo

Steve - you said the magic words - heat pump. Makes electric work.

If it was same price either way and I was buying I'd definitely order just what I want. Didn't they stop making sticks on the Legacy? That would rule it out for me.

stickguy

No legacy sticks any more, but I would be getting an automatic anyway.

driver100

imidazol97 said:

Gas has always worried me. I was standing in my condo kitchen back in the late 70s when a large propane tank exploded 4-5 miles away

Every year a home explodes around here because of natural gas. It is relatively inexpensive and is very efficient, but when it blows up it blows up real good.

I'd go all electric if it could work at a reasonable cost.

driver100

abacomike said:

@driver100‌

Add his dealer fee of $699 plus title, tags, etc., = $61,379. Since they are giving me $61,500 for my car, it becomes an even trade with no taxes due.

I got a chance to drive the Sales Manager's C400, which has the same engine and it was like driving a V8. Those twin turbos exhibit no lag, whatsoever.

That V6 330 hp sounds great, I can't wait to give it a try.

You got a good deal, you're getting a new car and they'll be paying you something back....why don't those things ever happen to me.

qbrozen

driver100 said:

You got a good deal, you're getting a new car and they'll be paying you something back....why don't those things ever happen to me.

That's easy. Pay off your 535ix and trade it in on a 320i.