Edmunds Members - Cars and Conversations (Archived)

roadburner

The first CD my wife wanted ripped was from a small label and the files did not contain any album art, artist, album, or track titles. I had to take a refresher course in adding that data to the files.Other than that it was dead easy.

driver100

berri said:

I'm not happy about cd players being phased out. A vehicle will have to be very special for me to forgo that feature. I don't want to have to waste all the time transferring music.

CD players will be as rare as VHS players very soon! Do like the guys say, just put it on a stick...it shows up nicely on your media player, with a cover showing. And, you can add more songs to it if you wish.

driver100

stickguy said:

Mike had some serious medical issues, and an operation. Last report (someone is keeping in email contact) was IIRC he was moving into rehab for a few months. But, still kicking.

Richard has not been back since his accident trauma, but again someone has checked in with him from time to time.

Reminds me. Mikes operation went pretty well. Staying in rehab longer than expected, has swelling and needs antibiotics. Progressing slower than hoped for, but OK. Wants to get out of rehab, hopefully will do that soon.

berri

Good to hear Mike is making some progress, but I'm sure it is frustrating and a bit scary for him.

Commercial cd's tend to run around 40 minutes, while blank cd's allow up to 80 minutes of wav files, or much more if you are into mp3. I prefer the fidelity of wav files. As for cd's, yeah I can take some hours and transfer all the music, but I have put my music in cd specific collections or mixes, so it will be more involved than just putting all the cd's onto a flash drive. So far it seems like Ford and Chrysler are quickly phasing out cd players, but GM and Toyota not as much. I recall back when music players went from cassettes to cd's that GM and Toyota kept combo players longer than some of the others. If it is like in the past, I'm guessing pick-ups and SUV's will be the last to phase out the players.

On a similar topic, I recently read where Ford see's big opportunities in technology related sales for its vehicles down the road. I wonder if phasing things out like cd players is really more geared to getting in on the satellite or Pandora type music market segment? On Star has expanded its offerings recently. Perhaps dashboard space is a ruse?

Speaking of these new LCD screens in vehicles, I wonder how long they will last and what they will cost to repair? I've had computer monitors go a long time and others (even strong brand names) crapout in a couple of years. Technology is a two edged sword I guess.

imidazol97

I'm still lamenting the loss of cassette tapes in the "entertainment" unit. LOL

I get nostalgic when I see a car at a car show with an 8-track below the dash.

ab348

I have a CD drive in the ATS. It was an extra-cost option that was ordered by the dealer when they brought the car in for stock, and it is located in the glove box - not very convenient.

I have never used it once. My music is on my phone and I transferred the songs I wanted to a stick that lives permanently in one of the slots, hidden away.

One thing I do note is that only some of the album art transferred from iTunes, and the shuffle function using the stick (presumably a function native to Cadillac's CUE system) seems less random than that it was when I had the phone connected and iTunes was doing the shuffling.

To berri's point about the screens: mine was already replaced after about 18 months. It was made by LG and they had some quality issues with delamination that causes the screen to look cracked or shattered. So I would suggest the answer is "not real long".

Sandman6472

No cd player in my '15 Golf, also no usb port or aux input but an sd player. All this corrected for 2016 but stinks for me. Can use my ipod but prefer XM subscription. Wife's '15 A3 has the same issues as mine. Both kids have cd players and use mine when I get to use their vehicles. Looks like Android Audio and Apple Car Play are the wave of the future. Weather finally changing down here in South Florida so crank open the moonroof/sunroof and listen to my XM...all is good!

The Sandman

berri

The old 8 track, AKA the tape destroyer

Brings back things like the old reverb switch and center mounted rear speaker. I guess music is always in the moment! I think the real reason 8 tack didn't last too long though is that cassettes were more convenient and Dolby came out and minimized the hiss problem, while better speakers amplified the sound from the cassette and its thinner tape.

sda

I remember how excited dad was when he bought the '69 Olds 98 which had the factory under dash mounted 8 track player. He took us all to the mall which had a music shop and he bought 4 tapes. Herbie Mann, Peter Paul and Mary and Simon and Garfunkel. Can't remember #4. He cranked it up (hey everything is relative) smiling all the way. The 8 track player promptly ate one tape. The player had to be repaired twice, and dad finally threw in the towel and didn't fix it when it broke again.

iluvmysephia1

I like your unbridled enthusiasm for cheaper cars like that Versa, and Kias and the old Datsun you pine for.

One reason the Versa is cheap is that it isn't made in a location with first world costs, I think. I think the whole run is built in Mexico now.

fintail - yep, I get kind of excited over things that a lot of people...let's say...wouldn't. I love small cars, and I like some unconventional designs. I love the Kia's, a few Hyundai's, several old Scion designs like the xA and tC, I also like the Nissan cube. I may be the only member on here that does.

Oh, the 2017 Nissan Versa S sedan does have a CD player. I too copy my CD's on a flashdrive. I'm still on my first thumbdrive and have about 10 CD's ripped on to it. I would think the Versa S sedan would have a USB port - it's pretty standard stuff these days and I will use that, if I buy one of those, but I like that it has an "old-school" CD player as well.

imidazol97

@Sandman says, "Weather finally changing down here in South Florida so crank open the moonroof/sunroof..."

Ahhhh. The Florida folks are reminding us now they're getting the mild weather we've enjoyed here in Midwest for an extra 6 weeks or so. Makes me want to move south for the winter like @Driver100

henryn

sandman_6472 said:

No cd player in my '15 Golf, also no usb port or aux input but an sd player. All this corrected for 2016 but stinks for me. Can use my ipod but prefer XM subscription. Wife's '15 A3 has the same issues as mine. Both kids have cd players and use mine when I get to use their vehicles. Looks like Android Audio and Apple Car Play are the wave of the future. Weather finally changing down here in South Florida so crank open the moonroof/sunroof and listen to my XM...all is good!

The Sandman

Sandman, SD == flash drive. You can buy a tiny adapter for like $2 which will allow you to plug an SD card into your computer USB port, and it will behave and act exactly like a flash drive. This is a very minor annoyance on my Passat (SD instead of flash), but that annoyance is partly offset by how the SD card disappears completely into the head unit, not sticking out to be possibly broken off like a flash drive.

henryn

berri said:

Commercial cd's tend to run around 40 minutes, while blank cd's allow up to 80 minutes of wav files, or much more if you are into mp3. I prefer the fidelity of wav files. As for cd's, yeah I can take some hours and transfer all the music, but I have put my music in cd specific collections or mixes, so it will be more involved than just putting all the cd's onto a flash drive.

Have you heard of playlists? Very very handy, and really easy to do once you understand them.

On the subject of "fidelity of wav files" -- very few people can reliably tell the difference between a high quality mp3 and the original wav file. But if you can, or if you just want the full fidelity whether you can actually hear it or not, you should look into "flac", Free Lossless Audio Codec. Half the size of the wav file, and exactly the same sound. Not all car stereos can playback flac files, but many of the newer ones can. You will need to do a little research on that before you jump into it.

And it's probably a good idea to see what your car stereo expects when it comes to playlists (also known as m3u files). Most car stereos can work with the Apple methodology, but "most" does not equate to "all".

All of this has been a learning curve for the car manufacturers. I remember when I had a truck that would play mp3 files, but not if they were encoded using VBR (variable bit rate).

thebean

sda said:

I remember how excited dad was when he bought the '69 Olds 98 which had the factory under dash mounted 8 track player. He took us all to the mall which had a music shop and he bought 4 tapes. Herbie Mann, Peter Paul and Mary and Simon and Garfunkel. Can't remember #4. He cranked it up (hey everything is relative) smiling all the way. The 8 track player promptly ate one tape. The player had to be repaired twice, and dad finally threw in the towel and didn't fix it when it broke again.

My guess is that #4 was Herb Alpert and the Tijuana Brass.    Actually I feel bad for your dad, since he looked forward to it so much and it didn't work out.  

berri

Say Bean, from a few of your posts it sounds like you are into old rock music. If you haven't read it, there is a good book called "The Wrecking Crew" that details the Hollywood music studios of that era and some of the players. It is very interesting and more than a few recording artists got their start as a Wrecking crew member.

berri

I hear you henryn. I'll readily admit that I'm probably still traumatized from all the time it took to convert LP's to cassettes and then cassettes to cd's. But I think it will still take 5 hours or so out of my life to set up and transfer the files. I like the easy way of just shoving a cd in there and hitting the play button. Messing with these lcd screens wastes time, not to mention the worry of when the screen or its underlying Chinese manufactured system crapsout. Life starts to get short you know. And I believe you are a Ford man, so dealing with early Synch probably has inoculated you to it all already

jmonroe

berri said:

I'm not happy about cd players being phased out. A vehicle will have to be very special for me to forgo that feature. I don't want to have to waste all the time transferring music.

Me too.

My '15 Genny can only handle one CD but my '09 could take six. I wasn't going to let that stop from buying the '15 but I don't like that idea at all. When I mention this to my Son's they can't believe I'm so set in my ways and have told me that the hard drive in the '15 can handle more music than I could ever want to listen to.

I know it can and some day before I dump it I'll have to use at least some of that capacity but between the ease of listening to XM and ejecting the CD that is installed and plucking in a different one from my stock in the console, I'm not sure when that will be.

jmonroe

graphicguy

Some of us are holding onto the CD format (as in, me). I do, mainly because I'm not replacing everything I have with yet another format. The other part is, CDs are permanent and I have no risk of losing my music in the cloud or on a flimsy memory stick, block, thimble, whatever. In addition, I have a fairly decent collection of DVD-A, SACD, CD Gold Pressings, etc that reproduces music as well, usually better, than any previous CD, tape, or vinyl format that came before it. Lastly, I have what will probably be the last (and best) disk player on the market....OPPO that I still enjoy immensely.

I do play the iPhone in the CTS. Sounds good with a hard wire connection....not so much with bluetooth. In the Cobra, it has a cassette player (and a CD player). Nowhere near as good as the CTS, but not bad given the tech at the time. BTW....found some old cassettes that I've been playing in it. As always, just a matter of time before they stretch and snap. Right now, there's a mix tape of ELP, Primal Scream, Love and Rockets. Good to drag that stuff out again.

Seperate subject, kind of tempted to get an LG OLED TV. No doubt, best pic quality I've ever seen. And, I'm becoming more smitten with the 4K programs I'm seeing on Netflix and Amazon Prime. They're even offering some new movies on Blu Ray mastered in 4K. Still, the least expensive one (65") is $3K.

Didn't think about the inability for any gov't entity not being able to tax me in international waters. I assume there are no reporting requirements for international gambling winnings or losses?

Good to hear about Mike's progress, BTW.

Just realized, I've had the CTS for 13 months with only an oil change and tire rotation as the only trip to the dealer. That's an amazing turn of events.

All over the map with the last few posts. Kind of winding down the year work-wise. Been a good one financially. Personal stuff? Not so good, but survived and no worse for the wear (well....mostly).

fintail

About 70 and sunny in Daytona Beach today. Not saying this is perfect, but it just might be perfect.

imidazol97 said:

@Sandman says, "Weather finally changing down here in South Florida so crank open the moonroof/sunroof..."

Ahhhh. The Florida folks are reminding us now they're getting the mild weather we've enjoyed here in Midwest for an extra 6 weeks or so. Makes me want to move south for the winter like @Driver100

snakeweasel

graphicguy said:

Separate subject, and a question for snakeweasle. I won some money in the casino on my last cruise a month ago. Are my tax liabilities the same, even though I was in international waters when I won the money?

Yes your tax liabilities are the same. As a U.S. Citizen you pay taxes on everything regardless of where you earned (or won) it.

Now did you get a W2-G or give them any tax information about yourself?

fintail

I respect the Cube for being unconventional, as I don't think it is ugly. Nissan hits and misses when it tries to be original, like the Frog err Juke.

I suspect you can get at least 512GB thumb drives now, I even have a 256GB micro SD card in my dashcam (which doesn't like it, but it usually works). 32GB and below are almost free today. I haven't bought a CD in at least 10 years.

iluvmysephia1 said:

fintail - yep, I get kind of excited over things that a lot of people...let's say...wouldn't. I love small cars, and I like some unconventional designs. I love the Kia's, a few Hyundai's, several old Scion designs like the xA and tC, I also like the Nissan cube. I may be the only member on here that does.

Oh, the 2017 Nissan Versa S sedan does have a CD player. I too copy my CD's on a flashdrive. I'm still on my first thumbdrive and have about 10 CD's ripped on to it. I would think the Versa S sedan would have a USB port - it's pretty standard stuff these days and I will use that, if I buy one of those, but I like that it has an "old-school" CD player as well.

snakeweasel

berri said:

I'm not happy about cd players being phased out. A vehicle will have to be very special for me to forgo that feature. I don't want to have to waste all the time transferring music.

Doesn't bother me at all, I never use mine. All I do is plug in my phone and play my songs that way.

fintail

It might not be accidental that financial literacy is not taught in primary school. People are more apt to be careless if they don't know. I remember a little course when I was in 8th grade about how to keep a checkbook etc, but almost nothing else. I didn't have a class about interest rates and how money works until I took actual finance classes in college. Luckily, I studied it on my own beforehand.

stickguy said:

well, i think it is shocking how large the financially illiterate population is. Really need to teach that stuff in schools.

like the man said, it is expensive to be poor! Being stupid too is a double whammy.

oldfarmer50

henryn said:

berri said:

I'm not happy about cd players being phased out. A vehicle will have to be very special for me to forgo that feature. I don't want to have to waste all the time transferring music.

But ... But ... That's not how it works.

If you go here to start your calculations, you will see that at a bit rate of 256k (which gives very good audio quality), you need 115.2 MB for one hour of audio.

http://www.audiomountain.com/tech/audio-file-size.html

A typical audio CD probably holds about 1 hour of music, some more, some less. Blank cds typically have 70 minutes available. But go with one hour as an average.

So, a 16 gigabyte flash drive, which will cost well under $10, will hold approximately 139 music CDs. Do you even own 139 music CDs? And if do own more, pay under $20 for a 32 gigabyte flash drive, which will then hold about 278 music CDs.

And you definitely don’t have to rip them, or load them, over and over. You rip them to the hard drive in your home computer. Then copy to a flash drive as needed. Pretty much any new car made in the last 2 or 3 years is going to have a USB port where you can stick that flash drive. Heck, even this slightly weird 2013 Passat has an SD card slot.

All that sounds like a foreign language to me. What is that, German?

snakeweasel

berri said:

The old 8 track, AKA the tape destroyer

Brings back things like the old reverb switch and center mounted rear speaker. I guess music is always in the moment! I think the real reason 8 tack didn't last too long though is that cassettes were more convenient and Dolby came out and minimized the hiss problem, while better speakers amplified the sound from the cassette and its thinner tape.

Not to mention that several second pause in the music as the player switched tracks.

snakeweasel

fintail said:

I respect the Cube for being unconventional, as I don't think it is ugly. Nissan hits and misses when it tries to be original, like the Frog err Juke.

A few Halloweens ago I saw a Cube being driven by a couple of people dressed as Borgs.

explorerx4

I like being able to listen to music while driving, but I'm not tied to it.
The first thing I did when I got the mustang home was put the antenna in the trunk.
It's been there for 25 years. Listened to the radio less than 1/2 a dozen times(AM only).
Mostly I listen to satellite radio, so I don't a whip antenna.
My wife and I like to listen to games when on the road, too.

oldfarmer50

snakeweasel said:

graphicguy said:

Separate subject, and a question for snakeweasle. I won some money in the casino on my last cruise a month ago. Are my tax liabilities the same, even though I was in international waters when I won the money?

Yes your tax liabilities are the same. As a U.S. Citizen you pay taxes on everything regardless of where you earned (or won) it.

Now did you get a W2-G or give them any tax information about yourself?

Speaking of money and regulations:

Woman at work had her brother die. He was basically indigent except for about $1000 in a debit a account. She had paid for his funeral and was wondering since she had his PIN number if she could take the money without getting in trouble. He had no will and no assets to probate.

I told her to just take it.

suydam

What are these CDs of which you speak? We got rid of all of ours. It does not take
hours to load them onto a flash drive. Like some others have said, I just listen to what I have on my phone if I can't find anything on Sirius.

qbrozen

I use exclusively Pandora these days. Costs me nothing and uses very little data on my plan that it does not appear to make an impact. 

Sandman6472

Unfortunately, no usb port in the '15 Golf, a problem rectified in the '16 models. I bought a connector that plugs into the iPod adapter with a micro usb connector on the other end to charge my smartphone since I blew the fuse with a regular 12 v charger. Had VW fix the fuse but will no longer use that 12v charger so bought the connector from Amazon.com for $2.31, thank you Stick. I can either use my iPod or listen to XM which I do, the price is worth it since my commute is an hour the days I do go in, either 3 or 3.5 depending on what management wants.
My next vehicle will have the Apple or Android connection depending on which phone I have at the time. Have android now but am thinking of changing once I hit the 2 year mark as I like to get something new every couple years or so. Just a treat for myself since I feel I deserve it and can afford it. Since I left retirement and went back part time, feel I deserve any little thing I want but never go crazy. Just turned 62 a couple weeks ago so planning on working another year and see where we're at with my 40 quarters since I was a civil service employee my whole government career. Was told, "you'll never get rich...but you'll make a living" the first week I started and they were definitely right!

The Sandman

iluvmysephia1

I'm thinking of the cube someone Dip-painted mustard yellow and then did a black racing stripe down two times or was it just once? Don't remember - but the honeybee look actually fit the rolling toaster from Nissan pretty well.

Michaell

Speaking of financial illiteracy, I had the following happen to me a number of times when I was delivering pizza.

Mom and dad order pizza, pay with a card (debit or credit), then go out and leave the kid(s) home.

We bring a blank CC receipt with us - similar to what you see at the restaurant, it has a line for the tip and another for the grand total.

Kid fills out the tip portion with $5.00, totals the receipt, then hands me a $5 bill.

Thanks, you just tipped me $10!

Not my job to teach them how to do this correctly. Once or twice, they would ask how to do it - I'd tell them that if they are giving me a cash tip, leave the tip line on the receipt blank. But, if they didn't ask, I didn't tell.

Of course, the number of times that happened was far outweighed by the times I got stiffed by the kids.

driver100

imidazol97 said:

@Sandman says, "Weather finally changing down here in South Florida so crank open the moonroof/sunroof..."

Ahhhh. The Florida folks are reminding us now they're getting the mild weather we've enjoyed here in Midwest for an extra 6 weeks or so. Makes me want to move south for the winter like @Driver100

It has been in the mid 80s every day since we have been here......Since Oct 30th. But, today they announced a cold front was moving in, and temperatures will dip into the high 70s for a few days. People are panicking!

driver100

Michaell said:

Speaking of financial illiteracy, I had the following happen to me a number of times when I was delivering pizza.

Mom and dad order pizza, pay with a card (debit or credit), then go out and leave the kid(s) home.

Of course, the number of times that happened was far outweighed by the times I got stiffed by the kids.

Especially if the parents left the $5 cash with the kids so they could give you a tip.

driver100

8 tracks and cassette players! I wish I could have the time back that I spent rewinding those things............

berri

Charge card for a Pizza Hut pie - now there is a way to run up some debt. All those little things can add up because without cash it is hard to keep track of what you are spending on them in a month. I'm amazed at how many people use charge cards at fast food or for really small purchases. If you can't pay it all at the end of the month, the interest rate is ugly and unpaid debt compounds quickly.

berri

Driver, funny, but the DVD was a definite quality improvement over VHS. Not sure the same can be said for some of the new music trends. Just a way to make consumers pony up more dough.

Michaell

driver100 said:

Michaell said:

Speaking of financial illiteracy, I had the following happen to me a number of times when I was delivering pizza.

Mom and dad order pizza, pay with a card (debit or credit), then go out and leave the kid(s) home.

Of course, the number of times that happened was far outweighed by the times I got stiffed by the kids.

Especially if the parents left the $5 cash with the kids so they could give you a tip.

Oh, they did. The kids didn't understand that the $5 on the slip was different than the $5 cash they gave me.

Michaell

berri said:

Charge card for a Pizza Hut pie - now there is a way to run up some debt. All those little things can add up because without cash it is hard to keep track of what you are spending on them in a month. I'm amazed at how many people use charge cards at fast food or for really small purchases. If you can't pay it all at the end of the month, the interest rate is ugly and unpaid debt compounds quickly.

I've seen folks buy pizza with an American Express card - I guess that's slightly better as the entire balance is due each month.

stickguy

I have 3-4 good sized plastic boxes downstairs of CDs. not sure how many, but probably nearing 1,000+. and man, are those boxes heavy. I spent a while at one point copying many into iTunes, but at the moment, that file is on an external hard drive only. I haven't used an ipod in many years, and only have a small number of songs on my new phone. I just never use it in the car, getting by fine with XM. One day I will get ambitious and load my full itunes on my new phone. Maybe.

I also haven't bought new music (CD or download) in ages. At least on XM, I get to keep up with the newest music out there!

Michaell

stickguy said:

I have 3-4 good sized plastic boxes downstairs of CDs. not sure how many, but probably nearing 1,000+. and man, are those boxes heavy. I spent a while at one point copying many into iTunes, but at the moment, that file is on an external hard drive only. I haven't used an ipod in many years, and only have a small number of songs on my new phone. I just never use it in the car, getting by fine with XM. One day I will get ambitious and load my full itunes on my new phone. Maybe.

I also haven't bought new music (CD or download) in ages. At least on XM, I get to keep up with the newest music out there!

I've got a bunch of CDs stored away, as well. Loaded pretty much all of them onto iTunes on my laptop, and from there onto my iPod classic (the 160GB version). That, however, is in a drawer in my office. I do have a couple hundred songs on my iPhone, which I'll play in the Jetta just for a bit of variation.

Mostly listen to XM, however.

jmonroe

berri said:

Charge card for a Pizza Hut pie - now there is a way to run up some debt. All those little things can add up because without cash it is hard to keep track of what you are spending on them in a month. I'm amazed at how many people use charge cards at fast food or for really small purchases. If you can't pay it all at the end of the month, the interest rate is ugly and unpaid debt compounds quickly.

Happy to say I have not had a balance on a CC since the mid '80's and I don't think it was more than $300 when I had a balance. We use the hell out of the one we have now and the monthly bill is usually just a little over $2400 (everything possible goes on that card except utilities) and it's paid on time every time.

Who in their right mind can afford an interest rate of 20% or more? If I did something like that I never would have been able to retire.

It's been so long since we have had a balance that I'm beginning to think CC means "Convenience Card".

jmonroe

dino001

I'm getting growingly disapointed with my local BMW dealer's marketing department. I've received now multiple "you are so special to us, this js superunique offer" letters. Digging into those super specials, I see small discount on the sticker (say $1000) and (sic) marked up APR from that avertized on the media. They also throw in a sight unseen trade in value for my wagon that is barely OK.

I'm a big boy, I can take inadequate offers when I'm shopping, but this is waste of time, theirs and mine, also paper and electricity.

I wonder if I should feel insulted. Marked up interest? Really? $1000 off not that great, either. How can you even send s..t like that and claim with a straight face, it's so great, I should run into the store and jump from happiness.

stickguy

same here JM. I think I paid interest 2 or 3 times, years ago. either as a 1 month cash flow issue (once). the other couple because my wife forgot to pay the bill on time!

explorerx4

@Michaell,
That pizza might be 3% back on my credit card!

cdnpinhead

Did anyone besides me keep a Bic ballpoint pen in the car for the sole purpose of rewinding and/or untangling cassette reels? It fit perfectly. It didn't take long to determine when you'd rewound far enough to get past the "bad" spot that caused problems -- the resistance got much lower.

Good times. . .

driver100

Michaell said:

driver100 said:

Michaell said:

Speaking of financial illiteracy, I had the following happen to me a number of times when I was delivering pizza.

Mom and dad order pizza, pay with a card (debit or credit), then go out and leave the kid(s) home.

Of course, the number of times that happened was far outweighed by the times I got stiffed by the kids.

Especially if the parents left the $5 cash with the kids so they could give you a tip.

Oh, they did. The kids didn't understand that the $5 on the slip was different than the $5 cash they gave me.

What about the kids who were given $5 for the tip...but didn't pass it on? I wonder how many of those there were.

driver100

berri said:

Driver, funny, but the DVD was a definite quality improvement over VHS. Not sure the same can be said for some of the new music trends. Just a way to make consumers pony up more dough.

We were just watching a British TV show series on DVD. They get 4, 45 minute shows on one DVD, you can have closed captioning, you can see the scenes and get background information, you can find your place you left off immediately, 8 DVDs fit in one tiny box a little larger than a paperback.....we live in a wonderful world.

I got this from an article I read today....really makes you think;

The world is transforming around us. The old institutions are not up to the task of managing a world awash in massive and ever faster technological and social changes that are not leaving us enough time to adjust. We went from a world where 50% of us worked on family farms to where less than 2% do today, but that took 8-10 generations. What are we going to do when the multiple millions who make their living in the transportation industry, whether in trucking or as taxi drivers, see their jobs evaporate in just half a generation? This same employment paradigm shift is going to happen in dozens of industries, and seemingly all at once. At least that’s what it will feel like to the workers who are bounced from their jobs

berri

George Orwell was just a bit early. I have some concern that those who are not proficient enough in technology and math will become a permanent underclass. Long term I'm not sure that is good for holding together a democracy. Orwell could descend into Lord of the Flies.