Order Update - Ordered my F250 4x4 SD CC on October 9, just got a call from the dealer that it arrived today, that makes it abut 10 weeks or so. It is a V10, 5spd, 3.73, long bed. I will keep you all posted on fuel mileage and any other issues that arrise.
Here it is Christman eve, we have a fresh blanket of snow in Connecticut, and my Super Duty is covered in slush and salt.... and it is still the best looking truck in town (its a small town). Anyway, the sun is setting and I just came back from the mail box and Ford sent me my 50th anniversay blanket!!! That is a nice Xmas present from them. PS... The F250 Crew Cab, 2WD, AutoT,short bed, PSD handles just fine in the snow. If I added 500 lbs to the back it would be in the "tank" category.
I agree with you, Rich, on both counts! I live in Riverside. A buddy of mine has a 99SD, crew cab, swb,4x4. And I saw one last week on the Fwy. That's it. I ordered mine last week; F250 V10, SD, SC, 4x4, AT, sof, PTO, 4.3L/S in silver with graphite int. Thanks to you guys out there I went with the 4.3. When I add the 295's It'll give me around a 4.10 --just what I was looking for! Also, phoned Gale Banks in Azuza, about an hour away, and they are just finishing up the prototype for their performance system. That's going in too! Was faxed a copy of my order, priority 10, but fleet guy says about 4mo. We'll see. And, most important, states that price increases are set for 12/28/98! So if anyone is deciding better get a call into the dealer and confirm it before it's too late. Tom
I am still learning with my first diesel.... but the last few mornings have been in 8 to 10 degree F range here in Conn. I still have not got around to running an extension cord up to the Super Duty. But it has started just fine every morning... no hesitation at all. Also, to add a little more info to the fast idle topic... it seems after about three minutes of running at 700-800 RPM the engine will speed up and stay at fast idle until you touch the brake or the gas pedal. I have seen two fast idle speeds... at the coldest temps is has run at 1200 rpm and other times it runs at 1000 rpm. There must be a computer chip that measures oil temp and decides how fast to run?
I realize I am a little late, but just want to wish all of you Happy holidays. As I have said before you guys really pull me through while I wait and wait and wait...
WOW! I finally found the end of the F-250 SD conversatiion. Sounds like every body is happy with their truck so far. I'm looking at either a 3/4 or 1 ton quad Long Bed unit with diesel power. Does anybody have any gripes yet?
Does anyone else hear a fairly loud clunk when switching to 4WD while doing 10-20 MPH? Also I just came back from a trip to RI. On the way down my truck averaged about 13.5 mpg. After getting there I checked the tire pressure and it was around 38 psi. After upping it to 48-50 psi, it got approx 15.0 mpg on the way back. Could the V10 3.73 be that sensitive to tire pressure?
Had a buddy buy a 99 E350 rv with a v10 to go motorcycle racing with. It is about 24' and the back 8' or so is a small bike shop. He picked it up and drove from wiconsin to Daytona and was in tears. It only got 7mpg. I realized for sure at that moment that my E350 box van had to go. It was a 93 351 gas and got about 5.8 mpg at 70 mph towing about 8,000 pounds. If a 99 couldn't do any better than that, then i was through with gas trucks.
I got a 99 F250 SD/PSD with a six speed man trans. The truck is x-tra cab, short bed. I need to manuever a 20 foot trailer in the pits at race tracks and the short truck will be greatly appreciated.
So far @ 1300 miles I have been getting 16.5-17 mpg mixed hwy/city, and I don't particularly try to drive in any fuel efficient manner. Man am I pleased. The truck feels very planted and firm, and I can't wait to tow with it. It will see duty on the 22nd of Jan. The brakes are impressive, and the fold down rear seat will provide a reasonably usable sleep space for a 2nd driver.
My truck does the idle-up, and here is something else of note. If you tap the gas pedal to let it idle down, and then leave it alone for a a few more minutes, it will go ahead and idle back up again. Incidentally, I live in GA, and it hasn't been that cold here. Avg 35-45 deg overnight.
This happens to be my first new vehicle ever and although that may skew my view, if nothing else, that big diesel sure masssages my ego every time I crank it up!!!
Yesterday, I took a quick trip from Connecticut up to LL Bean in Maine. On the way up I maintained 75 - 77 MPH and got 17.3 mpg according to the onboard computer. Temps were 8 to 24 degrees F. On the way home I held the speed to 60-62 mph and milage went up to 22.9 mpg. Truck was loaded on the light side. Temps on the way home were 32-36 F. Hope this is helpful for all those thinking about buying a Power Stroke Diesel. Truck is F250 with auto trans and 3.71 rear end.
yes and no - colder weather will improve the efficiency of the engine, but diesel fuel is often treated for cold weather, and its BTU reduced. Winter mix diesel-2 can easily knock a few mpg off, and in brutal cold, diesel-1 can cost as much as 5 mpg. Diesel is an oil, don't forget, and it thickens with cold air. Winter-2 and D1 are "thinned-out" versions of "regular" D2.
Well guys, it is getting close to my truck getting here. According to Ford it should be deliverd to me between jan 4 and the 11th. Did I make a mistake in paying extra to get anti locking brakes on the front. This was an extra and some have told me that I have wasted my money. Any comments on the anti locking brakes on the front. They are standard on the back. I like what I am hearing on the fuel milage of the PSD. I hope I like mine as much as eveyone else does.
lemans if you ever need the antilock in situation, you will be glad you got 'em.
Kcram what i'm talking about is, generally colder air is denser, meaning more Oxygen per given volume, so any engine gas or diesel, will run better. we don't suffer from 0° temps around here, but when a cool front pushes thru and temps go from a humid 70 to a dry 40, you can definitely tell a little more oomph in the engine. better combustion cuz there's more oxygen. i've also seen engines on a dyno improve.
i assume you are speaking of cold temps that cause fuel gel and separation?
yep cdean - we DO get the occasional zero here in NJ, and that's one thing I'm conscious of when buying fuel - I keep the tank filled regularly, from the same station whenever possible.
Anymore news on delivery on SD 250's? I ordered two almost identical trucks on 11/10/98. One is listed as delivered to the dealer, but it is not here yet. The other is the same except for the addition of the tow package. Will this cause a delay? Paid 100.00 over invoice, I don't feel too bad.
ordered a SD250 V10 XLT CC SB 09/05/98. I don't expect it till Feb or later the way the V10 and Crew cab are still on Restricted status via www.Wheels.com industry news. Spend what little free time at nite reading these posts about you guys already driving what seems to be FORD's Best Truck in 50 Years.. Keep inputing your observations, It keep the rest of us creatures in line interested and entertained. maydaytoy
This is a re-post from the Gasoline vs Diesel thread where it seemed to have not been noticed.
I came across some info about EPA findings and engine control chips in diesels. It seems that Caterpillar, Cummins Engine, Detroit Diesel, Mack Trucks, Navistar International, Renault and Volvo were involved in a US Federal lawsuit claiming the engine makers intentionally equipped 1.3 million diesel engines with computer chips that allowed them to pass the EPA's 20-minute emissions tests.
I found this information in a Fire Engineering magazine (Dec 98) and also in a USA Today article from 23 Oct 98. I have downloaded the article from USA Today (attached below for your reading pleasure, and just to save you a dollar for the USA Today download.) I also searched the US EPA site, but all I could find was legalistic stuff that did not seem to apply directly. I've looked at the recalls for 98 pickups (http://www.alldata.tsb.com/TSB/98_mk.html) or right here on the Edmund's site and can't see anything referring to a recall of diesel engine control chips. It could be that the chips were only in the big rigs, but who can tell for sure.
Question: Has anyone heard about a recall to replace the chips on diesels?
************* USA Today Article
Emissions chip draws fine By Earle Eldridge Fri., Oct. 23, 1998 FINAL EDITION Section: MONEY Page 1B
Seven engine manufacturers must pay fines and improve pollution controls as part of a $1 billion settlement of allegations that they cheated to get diesel truck engines to pass emissions tests.
''These seven companies sold engines . . . designed to defeat federal anti-pollution controls,'' Environmental Protection Agency Administrator Carol Browner said Thursday. The agreement settles a federal lawsuit claiming the engine makers intentionally equipped 1.3 million diesel engines with computer chips that allowed them to pass the EPA's 20-minute emissions tests.
When the engines were on the highway, the chips -- which the government called ''defeat devices'' -- made the engines emit three times the limit of nitrogen oxide air pollution. Attorney General Janet Reno called the settlement, in which manufacturers denied wrongdoing, ''one of the most important environmental enforcement actions in American history.'' She said it would reduce smog-causing emissions from large trucks by one-third over the next five years. The engines were used in vehicles ranging from large pickups to tractor-trailers. The companies: Caterpillar, Cummins Engine, Detroit Diesel, Mack Trucks, Navistar International, Renault and Volvo.
The companies must pay $83.4 million in fines and $110 million on projects to reduce pollution. An additional $850 million will go toward improving emissions on new engines and removing the devices from 1.1 million trucks. Engine makers said they didn't violate any laws but agreed to the settlement to avoid costly litigation.
I ordered an F-250SD SC PSD on 26 Nov and yesterday got a VIN and build date (4 Jan). The dealer predicts delivery end Jan or so. That is only two months!!! Pretty close to his original prediction of six to eight weeks. The dealer is moderately sized in Ottawa, Ontario, and so far is doing a good job for me. More to follow when I get the truck. From the sounds of everyone else's experiences so far, I should be pleased, I think!
Well good news for SD250 SC LB 5.4 buyers, my partner ordered one the same day as me(11/10) and it was delivered today! Mine had the tow package and the delivery date is 1/9, my birthday no less! It looks like the right dealer can get trucks quickly! Does anyone know if the 4:10 limited slip axle is available with the 5.4 and 5 speed & tow package? I know a guy who ordered one and it came in with an open rearend. He was pissed.
regarding the emissions thing, Dodge ran their recall on Cummins-powered trucks already. Trucks built between November 1997 and May 1998 were brought in to have their computers recalibrated.
Wandrr...Mack's bill was 13 mil. Won't say anymore---I work for them. Re: delivery...just got a VIN # today...ordered on 12/9...del. set for 2-1-99. Would have liked 4.10 rear with the V-10 ordered...but, currently unavailable..settling with the 3.73...towing max. 7800# 5th wheel.
Down here in South East Texas cold weather isn't the issue. Hot weather is. The diesel has a BIG plus here in that you can leave the truck running at the job site with the A/C blowing full out and come back to a cool cab instead of a blazing one. The dog likes it, too. The bad thing is the job site smells like diesel all the time. The company I work for lets me drive crew cab diesel which is an XL model and doesn't have all the fancy trip computers on it and nobody ever checks the mileage on these beasts, so it's good to hear about upper teens and lower 20's. What first impressed me about the PSD's was their acceleration. I had to struggle on my Suzuki 850 motorcycle to keep up with my boss's crew cab PSD. How embarrassing!
tmd01 - your suzuki must be sick to have trouble keeping up with a psd.
Kcram - agree with you on the winterized diesel #2 and poorer fuel economy. But for short trips, I seemed to get better economy with #1 with its higher cetane rating - maybe it burned more completely over the 5 mile daily commute.
Quadrunner500 - what do you do with the quadzilla? I didn't think it was any good for racing......
markbuck, My Suzuki is eighteen years old, but still putts along pretty good. It's a touring bike, not a crotch rocket! Plus I just got surprised by the fact that a truck could actually getty-up-go like that!
Hello group, I just found this conference and there seems to be a lot of good info here. I ordered my F250 CC 4WD V10, etc., etc. in early Nov. I have noticed from earlier posts that it is possible to contact Ford for an expected build date. Can somebody let me know how I can do this? I am not in a huge hurry to take delivery but it would be nice to to be able to get an estimate from the factory.
Does anyone know of any websites with the 99 superduties base and options prices which include the price increases effective 12-28-98? Edmunds, KBB, carpoint, still have July/August pricing. Thanks!
Hello, I could really use some help and you all seem like the people who can do it. I've been lusting over the Ford SD line. I'll be a retiree in a couple years and my wife and I plan to 5th wheel this country for 2-3 years. We're looking in the 25 ft range for 5th wheels. Naturally, it has to be pulled in style, safety, economy, and comfort. In addition it has to last for a good number of years. I'v been going crazy over the following 2 questions. Given all I've read so far, they are embarrasingly simple but could you all help me out anyway?
1. Super Duty 250 or 350? Can I get by with a 250? Is getting by going to mean I'll have problems later because I under equipped myself?
2. Gas or Diesel? What are the trade-offs? Do I have to maintain them differently?
Need help - I am interested in establishing a fair price for a F350, 4X4, SRW, LWB, Lariat - fully loaded. I am confused - Kelly Blue Book seem to show keyless entry, leather split bench and 6 way power seat as included in 618A package. Edmunds show the captain's chairs (option 4) two ways one with an invoice price of $310 and one as $621. I am interested in the captain's chairs in leather and assume the lariat package is leather. Is it leather as a standard only with the split bench and is it all leather or are back seats vinyl? Edmunds also lists a 618A pkg and a 628A pkg - what's the difference - they look identical. Edmunds notes that the keyless entry pkg 948 is required for the 6-way power seat yet I could not find this option in the lariat listing that I have indicated above. Is keyless entry and the power seat part of the 618A pkg or do you need to add these items as well as an additional power seat ($621 invoice) for the second captain's chair? Also Edmunds lists a charge for lower accent two tone paint ($162 invoice- option 954)Kelly list many two tone combinations for the Lariat pkg as NC (no charge). In the safety description, Edmunds lists antilock brakes as standard as well as airbag deactivation as standard yet in the optional section they list prices for each totally a considerable amount when added together. All these items when combined cause a price difference that is very confusing in try to determine a true invoice price which is the first step in determining a fair price. Any discussion that can clear up especially the leather aspects of the Lariat pkg and the true inclusions in this package will be appreciated.
Singer4 here...re:Decisions!! Decisions! I'll share MY opinions. Suffice to say, I enjoy your enthusiasm for wanting to 5th wheel the USA. Great Idea!! My wife and I w/be right behind you!! Quick ?'s. Have you RV'd before? If so, a 5th is a nice way to go. If not, both of you try to ensure that a 25ft is sufficient...go to dealers, shows, other people who camp, and even campgrounds. People w/help. Get advice on brand names, styles, floor plans, etc. Make sure you'll like it, for the long haul!! W/current idea of a 25ft'r, an F250 V-10(or PS V-8) should be plenty...both units are rated high for the pulling you'll need. Over 10,000#. But, do your homework!! Check all the options on both the RV & F250...even the hitch...basic 2 options...Reese Quik Slide or PullRite...one is about $500-$700, the other $2500. Re: Gas or Diesel...YOUR personal choice...knowing that "D" is about $4500 more..just remember, these are YOUR choices..not the guy down the street that's been using Diesel all his life!! Be thorough, be patient, be inquisitive, and be confident with YOUR choices!! Now, remember, these are only my opinions!! Best in the New Year, JB
I agree with singer4 on getting the most information you can on the RV of your choice. I've seen several 1/2 ton trucks pulling 25' fifth wheels easily, provided they are set up properly. An F250 would more than handle any 25' that I have seen. I currently pull a 36' Travel trailer behind a '99 F350 4x4 crew cab with the PS. with ease. If looking to resell your outfit after a couple of years, a diesel would probably get you better overall resale, initial investment considered, due to possible high mileage. A powerstroke with 80,000 miles still has 20,000 of warranty left.
Singer/TNT and all the rest of you. Thanks for your input. I'll go back to the books on the 5th wheels but my wifa and I have already gone to some shows and spend years sharing a 12x12 tent. If I can read between the lines, I think I'm hearing if we decide on a larger 5th wheel we may be better off with the 350. Did I read you right? Regarding D the extra $ is an issue but I'd rather spend it if I get to keep it running for more years. The 5th wheel will only have a 3-5 year life, I hope the truck lasts longer than that. As a measure, I currently have a '89 suburban with over 250k miles. I'm religious about oil and fluids and as a result have had 7 years of payment free cash flow. I'd like to repeat this with the new truck and I know the danger or underpowered engines towing loads. If I read between the lines here as well, I get an inclination toward a big D. Thanks again for all your help. Larry
Think twice before you buy the leather. I checked into it and the seating surfaces are the only part that is leather. The sides of the seats and the armrest on the captains chairs are vinyl. The rear seat on the extended cab is also vinyl, although the salesman tried to assure me it wasn't. Not sure about the crew cab's rear seat being leather. If you look at the 99 GM's leather packages the entire seat is leather...so is the back seat. (I'm not a GM fan but damn if their attention to detail and creature comforts inside don't blow the ford away)
The lariat only comes with the"TAN" leather/vinyl seat. The lariat pkg should give you the choice of split bench or captain chair for no add'l cost. ITS in the lariat PACKAGE along with keyless entry, the overhead console w/trip computer, driver side powered seat, cab steps and PREMIUM WHEELS. I think the deluxe wheels look more PREMIUM. The other thing that pisses me about FORD is that if you get the Lariat the only seating color is TAN...Though in the F150 model...I've seen the lariat in GREY LEATHER. Another peeve is that FORD doesnt put head rest on the rear seats of the crew cab or extended cab seats. YET another GM example of DETAIL! And then there's the 3:73 rear only being available in NON LIMITED SLIP CONFIGURATION for the 5.4 motor. Furthermore the 5.4 motor in the F150 puts out 260 hp @ 4500, and 345 torque @ 2300, while the Super Duty 5.4 only puts out 235hp @4250, and 335 torque @ 3000. I realize that there is a slight difference in RPM's here but what gives...is the SD motor detuned? I think the SD smokes the competition in regards to making a heavy duty truck, but the minor option restrictions, and detail work leave some room for improvement. Im still considering one but:
COME ON FORD...if we are putting a small mortgage on truck give us what we want
lez, There is a Ford published brochure on trailer towing and covers most Ford vehicles. Since I've had my SD F-250 for 6 months I've tossed it. As I recall there is NO DIFFERENCE in the TOWING capacity between the F-250 and F-350. The difference is how much weight the truck can hold in the bed. What you have to do is check the specification for the fully loaded 5th wheel. Two numbers are important, gross trailer weight and hitch weight. Add a fudge factor of 10% to 25% for the hitch weight. If that number is less than the capacity of your truck, you're OK.
The 5th wheels that I know of are in the 1000 to 1500 pound hitch weight range. My SD F-250 has a theoretical capacity of about 2200 pounds. (In reality, due to load distribution, etc. it's probably about 2000 pounds.) Any way, 1500 plus 25% is less than 1900 pounds. In my truck I would be very comfortable with a 1500 pound hitch weight.
There is one other consideration. The F-250 is going to ride much better after you arrive at your destination and unhook the 5th wheel.
No my truck is not in and still waiting, but the Tennessee Vols are National Champs. Boy if I just had my truck, life would be just about perfect. The Brown Fish Man
In your position, I would buy the f250 SD with the v10 and the 4.30 limited slip. My buddie's F350 SD V10 with 3.73 4x4 is getting 11 around town in the cold and up to 13 running 80 on the highway.
KEH4x4 - I called the dealership that I ordered from and asked for the "ITEM" number and all the salesman could give me was an order #. I called Gwen at the number you posted and she said that I needed the VIN# and that the dealer would have it if it had been assigned. I called the dealer back and he said that they don't get a VIN# until the vehicle is invoiced, and that doesn't happen until it's built. Am I doing something wrong here? It's been 9 weeks since I ordered my SD and, although I am a patient person, it would be nice to know approximately when I can plan to pick up the truck. Thanks for any more help.
As far as the detuned 5.4l in the SD goes, I wouldn't worry about it. The V10 is much more powerful, and almost a free upgrade (its the standard engine on some models). If you want the extra power (and the 5.4s are only 10lb different), why not go for the 6.8 in the first place?
The tan interior in the Lariat was an interesting choice, but its what I wanted anyway. I imagine that they went with it to save the money that additional fabrics would cost them. The entire seating surfaces of the front and rear seats are leather, with cloth for the back of the seats (facing the rear of the cab).
As an aside, I'm still getting 9.9-10 mpg in town (4X4 CC V10 DRW 4.30) and about 11.5-12 on the highway (70-75mph with cruise control and some decent hills (incl I44-MO)). Towing ~7,000 I was getting 9.5-10 highway (fairly flat, 70mph cruise control).
I was very happy with the unladen performance. The truck never once downshifted running on I44 through MO at 70-75 mph. I'd like to see how it felt towing a decent load up those hills -- from what I've seen, it'd handle it just fine.
I just received a recall notice from Ford today service #98B32 which say's "The left rear caliper and fitting on affected vehicles operating on coarse gravel roads at highway speeds have been struck by stones causing loosening of or damage to the line or fitting. Loss of brake fluid may occur leading to a soft pedal and eventually, a warning light, reducing brake effectiveness and extended stopping distances"
I went and had the fix installed and all it looks like is a brake shoe without the pads which bolts over the caliper. Hope this helps, I still have no complaints about my truck 1999 F-350 PSD crew cab Lariat 4x4. For those of you waiting just be patient as this truck is incredibly awesome.
Yes the order number should be the same as the Item number. Gwen gave me my VIN number. My dealership (Five Star Ford in Scottsdale Arizona) was absolutely worthless as far as keeping me updated on the progress of my truck. Once they had my non-refundable $500 deposit, they treated me like a [non-permissible content removed] child. They gave me NO information. NONE. They didn't even return my calls. I called one afternoon and they said that they didn't have a VIN number. The next morning I told Gwen that I couldn't get any information out of them and she looked up my item number and told me the VIN number, and said that the VIN number had been issued over a week before. A couple of weeks later, I called back and she gave me the build date week. A week after the build date week was up, I called back and a guy told me the truck had been shipped the previous day, and he gave me an ETA. The dealer called me two days after the truck arrived. (A good dealership would have called the day it arrived) If I were you, I would call the dealer again, ask for a VIN number, if you don't get one, call Gwen and tell her that your dealer isn't keeping you updated and you would appreciate it if she could give you any information. If she isn't too busy, she will probably scare up your VIN number, and maybe a build date. Good luck buddy, I know what you are going through. Ken
Thanks for the advice. I'm going to wait a few days and try calling Gwen again. I don't think the salesman I'm working with (in Oklahoma) knows much. He asked me to let him know if I could get my build date because he would like to know how to do it too.
I saw the pictures you had posted on aol a couple months ago(that was you wasn't it?). That's a nice rig - can't wait to get mine.
There were a lot of 4-wheel-disc cars that used the "shoe" cover in the past, and I'm surprised that Ford left the rear discs exposed. My dad's 88 Thunderbird Turbo had these drum-resembling covers over the rear discs, and interestingly enough, they also double as dust shields. You will find that your rear wheels will be much cleaner than the fronts.
Happy New Year everyone. Picked up my F250 SD 4X4 SB in dark Hunter green with Lt. tan bottom Lariat 1/2/99, just in time for Chicago's storm (22 inches of snow). Besides being dirty, it is by far the best truck I've ever owned. Handles and rides like a dream, plenty of power, easy to get into, than you settle into the big leather seats. Just want all you guys and gals who are still waiting for your new truck to arrive to know that the wait is really worth it. Hope all of you get your trucks real soon. Whatever happened to the idea of a SD club?
Thank you cr 295 response #88 and Stanford #93 for information on the Lariat pricing. I called Schwister Ford (Milwaukee Metro Area dealer) today. The salesperson told me that the bench or captain’s chair (leather) are both standard (NC) on the Lariat package. It is a choice. He said the powerseat is standard (NC) on the driver’s side. He also said that the passenger air bag deactivation option 552 ( page 8 Edmunds) is standard (NC) on Lariat pkg. He said that a late notice lists the 4 wheel antilock brakes option 67B (page 9 Edmunds) as now standard (NC) to his understanding. However he did insist that leather meant leather - no vinyl. He also said that the two tone paint option 954 (page 9 Edmunds $162 invoice - $190 retail) had a charge – Kelly Blue Book (page 7) lists NC for many 2 tone combinations example JM/UD red/black Lariat. So confusion exists. Does anyone know? Is two tone paint a standard (NC) item in the Lariat pkg. ? Are rear tow hooks (in addition to front tow hooks) standard in the Lariat pkg. They are listed on page 6 Edmunds for Lariat 2WD and 4 WD regular cab/supercab ? Is there a picture somewhere of the cab steps in the Lariat pkg. and are these as durable as an aftermarket chrome or black pipe type step up ? What would be the cost of an extra power outlet ? What would be the cost of a spare tire lock ? Where can aftermarket safety approved rear seat head rests be found for the supercab ? I was told that this vehicle with a V10 engine F350 SD SRW 4X4 LWB supercab would get about 9 miles to a gallon overall mileage, is this correct ? Are four wheel antilock brakes now standard (NC) for this vehicle?
Thank for any help that you can offer on my questions - this site continues to be very informative. Tom 18
lez - regarding the suggestion. I am an 'anal retentive' MechEng that follows the severe maintenance schedule on whatever I own. Change oil every 2,500 to 3,000 miles, bleed and replace brake fluid every two years,..... While my ford diesel was 'simpler' in terms of things that could go wrong, when specific parts failed they were way more expensive to replace (injection pump). Plus all of the ford diesel's will eventually fail from cylinder wall cavitation even if you use the FW-16 treatment. A replacement rebuilt ford motor is at least twice as expensive as a gas. My buddie's v10 is a wonderful motor which should serve him well for 200,000 miles (as most gas motors should go) before any major fixes. Most of this info is available on the diesel vs gas post. If I were buying diesel, I would go with cummins.
As far as mileage goes, you're a bit low. Mine is a CC DRW 4X4 V10 AUTO with the 4.30 gears and I can get ~10mpg city (60 miles every day) and ~11.5mpg highway empty (over a 2500 mile trip). Towing ~7000 lbs I was getting 9.5mpg highway at 70 (600-800 miles). Folk with the 3.73 gears are reporting 1-2mpg better than that.
The cab steps aren't that pretty, but work fine and are sturdy. 4 wheel ABS is standard on anything over 10,000lb GVWR (ie: duallys) and optional on the lighter ones -- at least, that's the way it was when I ordered mine. I don't have heavy duty rear tow hooks, just the loops for the towing package.
Personally, if you're not doing extensive OTR trips in the 1000 mile range, I'd go with the V10 in the Ford. I never thought I'd say that (my 93 was diesel and I loved it) but the gas can be a lot more convenient, and is certainly a lot cheaper. In the Dodge, I'd still go with Cummins -- its a great engine and I don't like the Dodge V10 very much.
I've never driven the V10 with the 3.73s, but its probably the way to go -- I can start my truck off in 2nd (have, accidentally) and not really notice much of a power loss (this was empty, of course). For a daily driver with occasional towing/hauling, that would be my recommendation. You'd get better highway cruising and a more realistic 3rd gear ratio too... there are several times when I'd like to downshift but 3rd/4.30 is a bit highreving.
That's a heck of a statement about the cavitation issue we discussed here back in April and May. Why the heck should they even manufacture the engines if you can't put 200,000 plus miles on them with proper maintenance? Is Navistar that ignorant or that foolish?
No disrespect to you or your knowledge but why are you so sure about the inevitable failure of the PS engine? How many miles would you expect to get out of this same engine with proper maintenance?
Hey I'm not saying your not right but I hope your not. I would not be surprised one bit if you were right, I have certainly lost faith in the work ethic and engineering design of corporate America especially Ford in recent months!
Comments
Anyway, the sun is setting and I just came back from the mail box and Ford sent me my 50th anniversay blanket!!! That is a nice Xmas present from them.
PS... The F250 Crew Cab, 2WD, AutoT,short bed, PSD handles just fine in the snow. If I added 500 lbs to the back it would be in the "tank" category.
The Los Angeles area is a big big bunch of little towns; but I don't think that I've seen 30 SDs on the road yet.
Rich
Also, to add a little more info to the fast idle topic... it seems after about three minutes of running at 700-800 RPM the engine will speed up and stay at fast idle until you touch the brake or the gas pedal.
I have seen two fast idle speeds... at the coldest temps is has run at 1200 rpm and other times it runs at 1000 rpm. There must be a computer chip that measures oil temp and decides how fast to run?
Thanks to all.
I got a 99 F250 SD/PSD with a six speed man trans. The truck is x-tra cab, short bed. I need to manuever a 20 foot trailer in the pits at race tracks and the short truck will be greatly appreciated.
So far @ 1300 miles I have been getting 16.5-17 mpg mixed hwy/city, and I don't particularly try to drive in any fuel efficient manner. Man am I pleased. The truck feels very planted and firm, and I can't wait to tow with it. It will see duty on the 22nd of Jan. The brakes are impressive, and the fold down rear seat will provide a reasonably usable sleep space for a 2nd driver.
My truck does the idle-up, and here is something else of note. If you tap the gas pedal to let it idle down, and then leave it alone for a a few more minutes, it will go ahead and idle back up again. Incidentally, I live in GA, and it hasn't been that cold here. Avg 35-45 deg overnight.
This happens to be my first new vehicle ever and although that may skew my view, if nothing else, that big diesel sure masssages my ego every time I crank it up!!!
Hope this is helpful for all those thinking about buying a Power Stroke Diesel. Truck is F250 with auto trans and 3.71 rear end.
22.9 mpg!!! was this on your trip meter, or did you actually fill it up?
colder weather does give diesels more power and better mileage.
yes and no - colder weather will improve the efficiency of the engine, but diesel fuel is often treated for cold weather, and its BTU reduced. Winter mix diesel-2 can easily knock a few mpg off, and in brutal cold, diesel-1 can cost as much as 5 mpg. Diesel is an oil, don't forget, and it thickens with cold air. Winter-2 and D1 are "thinned-out" versions of "regular" D2.
Did I make a mistake in paying extra to get anti locking brakes on the front. This was an extra and some have told me that I have wasted my money. Any comments on the anti locking brakes on the front. They are standard on the back.
I like what I am hearing on the fuel milage of the PSD. I hope I like mine as much as eveyone else does.
if you ever need the antilock in situation, you will be glad you got 'em.
Kcram
what i'm talking about is, generally colder air is denser, meaning more Oxygen per given volume, so any engine gas or diesel, will run better. we don't suffer from 0° temps around here, but when a cool front pushes thru and temps go from a humid 70 to a dry 40, you can definitely tell a little more oomph in the engine. better combustion cuz there's more oxygen. i've also seen engines on a dyno improve.
i assume you are speaking of cold temps that cause fuel gel and separation?
I ordered two almost identical trucks on 11/10/98.
One is listed as delivered to the dealer, but it is not here yet. The other is the same except for the addition of the tow package. Will this cause a delay? Paid 100.00 over invoice, I don't feel too bad.
maydaytoy
I came across some info about EPA findings and engine control chips in diesels. It seems that Caterpillar, Cummins Engine, Detroit Diesel, Mack Trucks, Navistar International, Renault and Volvo were involved in a US Federal lawsuit claiming the engine makers intentionally equipped 1.3 million diesel engines with computer chips that allowed them to pass the EPA's 20-minute emissions tests.
I found this information in a Fire Engineering magazine (Dec 98) and also in a USA Today article from 23 Oct 98. I have downloaded the article from USA Today (attached below for your reading pleasure, and just to save you a dollar for the USA Today download.) I also searched the US EPA site, but all I could find was legalistic stuff that did not seem to apply directly. I've looked at the recalls for 98 pickups (http://www.alldata.tsb.com/TSB/98_mk.html) or right here on the Edmund's site and can't see anything referring to a recall of diesel engine control chips. It could be that the chips were only in the big rigs, but who can tell for sure.
Question: Has anyone heard about a recall to replace the chips on diesels?
*************
USA Today Article
Emissions chip draws fine
By Earle Eldridge
Fri., Oct. 23, 1998
FINAL EDITION
Section: MONEY
Page 1B
Seven engine manufacturers must pay fines and improve pollution controls as part of a $1 billion settlement of allegations that they cheated to get diesel truck engines to pass emissions tests.
''These seven companies sold engines . . . designed to defeat federal anti-pollution controls,'' Environmental Protection Agency Administrator Carol Browner said Thursday. The agreement settles a federal lawsuit claiming the engine makers intentionally equipped 1.3 million diesel engines with computer chips that allowed them to pass the EPA's 20-minute emissions tests.
When the engines were on the highway, the chips -- which the government called ''defeat devices'' -- made the engines emit three times the limit of nitrogen oxide air pollution. Attorney General Janet Reno called the settlement, in which manufacturers denied wrongdoing, ''one of the most important environmental enforcement actions in American history.'' She said it would reduce smog-causing emissions from large trucks by one-third over the next five years. The engines were used in vehicles ranging from large pickups to tractor-trailers. The companies: Caterpillar, Cummins Engine, Detroit Diesel, Mack Trucks, Navistar International, Renault and Volvo.
The companies must pay $83.4 million in fines and $110 million on projects to reduce pollution. An additional $850 million will go toward improving emissions on new engines and removing the devices from 1.1 million trucks. Engine makers said they didn't violate any laws but agreed to the settlement to avoid costly litigation.
Canardly wait!!
It looks like the right dealer can get trucks quickly! Does anyone know if the 4:10 limited slip axle is available with the 5.4 and 5 speed & tow package?
I know a guy who ordered one and it came in with an open rearend. He was pissed.
regarding the emissions thing, Dodge ran their recall on Cummins-powered trucks already. Trucks built between November 1997 and May 1998 were brought in to have their computers recalibrated.
Kcram - agree with you on the winterized diesel #2 and poorer fuel economy. But for short trips, I seemed to get better economy with #1 with its higher cetane rating - maybe it burned more completely over the 5 mile daily commute.
Quadrunner500 - what do you do with the quadzilla? I didn't think it was any good for racing......
My Suzuki is eighteen years old, but still putts along pretty good. It's a touring bike, not a crotch rocket! Plus I just got surprised by the fact that a truck could actually getty-up-go like that!
Thanks and happy new year to all!!
Mike
Edmunds, KBB, carpoint, still have July/August pricing. Thanks!
I've been lusting over the Ford SD line. I'll be a retiree in a couple years and my wife and I plan to 5th wheel this country for 2-3 years. We're looking in the 25 ft range for 5th wheels. Naturally, it has to be pulled in style, safety, economy, and comfort. In addition it has to last for a good number of years.
I'v been going crazy over the following 2 questions. Given all I've read so far, they are embarrasingly simple but could you all help me out anyway?
1. Super Duty 250 or 350? Can I get by with a 250? Is getting by going to mean I'll have problems later because I under equipped myself?
2. Gas or Diesel? What are the trade-offs? Do I have to maintain them differently?
Larry
I'll share MY opinions. Suffice to say, I enjoy your enthusiasm for wanting to 5th wheel the USA.
Great Idea!! My wife and I w/be right behind you!!
Quick ?'s. Have you RV'd before? If so, a 5th is a nice way to go. If not, both of you try to ensure that a 25ft is sufficient...go to dealers, shows, other people who camp, and even campgrounds. People w/help. Get advice on brand names, styles, floor plans, etc. Make sure you'll like it, for the long haul!! W/current idea of a 25ft'r, an F250 V-10(or PS V-8) should be plenty...both units are rated high for the pulling you'll need. Over 10,000#. But, do your homework!! Check all the options on both the RV &
F250...even the hitch...basic 2 options...Reese Quik Slide or PullRite...one is about $500-$700, the other $2500. Re: Gas or Diesel...YOUR personal choice...knowing that "D" is about $4500
more..just remember, these are YOUR choices..not the guy down the street that's been using Diesel all his life!! Be thorough, be patient, be inquisitive, and be confident with YOUR choices!!
Now, remember, these are only my opinions!!
Best in the New Year,
JB
If I can read between the lines, I think I'm hearing if we decide on a larger 5th wheel we may be better off with the 350. Did I read you right?
Regarding D the extra $ is an issue but I'd rather spend it if I get to keep it running for more years. The 5th wheel will only have a 3-5 year life, I hope the truck lasts longer than that.
As a measure, I currently have a '89 suburban with over 250k miles. I'm religious about oil and fluids and as a result have had 7 years of payment free cash flow. I'd like to repeat this with the new truck and I know the danger or underpowered engines towing loads. If I read between the lines here as well, I get an inclination toward a big D.
Thanks again for all your help.
Larry
Think twice before you buy the leather. I checked into it and the seating surfaces are the only part that is leather. The sides of the seats and the armrest on the captains chairs are vinyl. The rear seat on the extended cab is also vinyl, although the salesman tried to assure me it wasn't. Not sure about the crew cab's rear seat being leather. If you look at the 99 GM's leather packages the entire seat is leather...so is the back seat. (I'm not a GM fan but damn if their attention to detail and creature comforts inside don't blow the ford away)
The lariat only comes with the"TAN" leather/vinyl seat. The lariat pkg should give you the choice of split bench or captain chair for no add'l cost. ITS in the lariat PACKAGE along with keyless entry, the overhead console w/trip computer, driver side powered seat, cab steps and PREMIUM WHEELS. I think the deluxe wheels look more PREMIUM. The other thing that pisses me about FORD is that if you get the Lariat the only seating color is TAN...Though in the F150 model...I've seen the lariat in GREY LEATHER. Another peeve is that FORD doesnt put head rest on the rear seats of the crew cab or extended cab seats. YET another GM example of DETAIL! And then there's the 3:73 rear only being available in NON LIMITED SLIP CONFIGURATION for the 5.4 motor. Furthermore the 5.4 motor in the F150 puts out 260 hp @ 4500, and 345 torque @ 2300, while the Super Duty 5.4 only puts out 235hp @4250, and 335 torque @ 3000. I realize that there is a slight difference in RPM's here but what gives...is the SD motor detuned? I think the SD smokes the competition in regards to making a heavy duty truck, but the minor option restrictions, and detail work leave some room for improvement. Im still considering one but:
COME ON FORD...if we are putting a small mortgage on truck give us what we want
There is a Ford published brochure on trailer towing and covers most Ford vehicles. Since I've had my SD F-250 for 6 months I've tossed it. As I recall there is NO DIFFERENCE in the TOWING capacity between the F-250 and F-350. The difference is how much weight the truck can hold in the bed. What you have to do is check the specification for the fully loaded 5th wheel. Two numbers are important, gross trailer weight and hitch weight. Add a fudge factor of 10% to 25% for the hitch weight. If that number is less than the capacity of your truck, you're OK.
The 5th wheels that I know of are in the 1000 to 1500 pound hitch weight range. My SD F-250 has a theoretical capacity of about 2200 pounds. (In reality, due to load distribution, etc. it's probably about 2000 pounds.) Any way, 1500 plus 25% is less than 1900 pounds. In my truck I would be very comfortable with a 1500 pound hitch weight.
There is one other consideration. The F-250 is going to ride much better after you arrive at your destination and unhook the 5th wheel.
Rich
Tennessee Vols are National Champs. Boy if I just
had my truck, life would be just about perfect.
The Brown Fish Man
In your position, I would buy the f250 SD with the v10 and the 4.30 limited slip. My buddie's F350 SD V10 with 3.73 4x4 is getting 11 around town in the cold and up to 13 running 80 on the highway.
I called the dealership that I ordered from and asked for the "ITEM" number and all the salesman could give me was an order #. I called Gwen at the number you posted and she said that I needed the VIN# and that the dealer would have it if it had been assigned. I called the dealer back and he said that they don't get a VIN# until the vehicle is invoiced, and that doesn't happen until it's built. Am I doing something wrong here? It's been 9 weeks since I ordered my SD and, although I am a patient person, it would be nice to know approximately when I can plan to pick up the truck. Thanks for any more help.
Mike
As far as the detuned 5.4l in the SD goes, I wouldn't worry about it. The V10 is much more powerful, and almost a free upgrade (its the standard engine on some models). If you want the extra power (and the 5.4s are only 10lb different), why not go for the 6.8 in the first place?
The tan interior in the Lariat was an interesting choice, but its what I wanted anyway. I imagine that they went with it to save the money that additional fabrics would cost them. The entire seating surfaces of the front and rear seats are leather, with cloth for the back of the seats (facing the rear of the cab).
As an aside, I'm still getting 9.9-10 mpg in town (4X4 CC V10 DRW 4.30) and about 11.5-12 on the highway (70-75mph with cruise control and some decent hills (incl I44-MO)). Towing ~7,000 I was getting 9.5-10 highway (fairly flat, 70mph cruise control).
I was very happy with the unladen performance. The truck never once downshifted running on I44 through MO at 70-75 mph. I'd like to see how it felt towing a decent load up those hills -- from what I've seen, it'd handle it just fine.
I just received a recall notice from Ford today service #98B32 which say's "The left rear
caliper and fitting on affected vehicles operating on coarse gravel roads at highway speeds
have been struck by stones causing loosening of or damage to the line or fitting. Loss of brake fluid may occur leading to a soft pedal and eventually, a warning light, reducing brake effectiveness and extended stopping distances"
I went and had the fix installed and all it looks like is a brake shoe without the pads which bolts over the caliper. Hope this helps, I still have no complaints about my truck 1999 F-350 PSD crew cab Lariat 4x4. For those of you waiting just be patient as this truck is incredibly awesome.
Fred.
If I were you, I would call the dealer again, ask for a VIN number, if you don't get one, call Gwen and tell her that your dealer isn't keeping you updated and you would appreciate it if she could give you any information. If she isn't too busy, she will probably scare up your VIN number, and maybe a build date.
Good luck buddy, I know what you are going through.
Ken
Thanks for the advice. I'm going to wait a few days and try calling Gwen again. I don't think the salesman I'm working with (in Oklahoma) knows
much. He asked me to let him know if I could get my build date because he would like to know how to do it too.
I saw the pictures you had posted on aol a couple months ago(that was you wasn't it?). That's a nice rig - can't wait to get mine.
Thanks again.
Mike.
There were a lot of 4-wheel-disc cars that used the "shoe" cover in the past, and I'm surprised that Ford left the rear discs exposed. My dad's 88 Thunderbird Turbo had these drum-resembling covers over the rear discs, and interestingly enough, they also double as dust shields. You will find that your rear wheels will be much cleaner than the fronts.
Larry
However he did insist that leather meant leather - no vinyl. He also said that the two tone paint option 954 (page 9 Edmunds $162 invoice - $190 retail) had a charge – Kelly Blue Book (page 7) lists NC for many 2 tone combinations example JM/UD red/black Lariat.
So confusion exists.
Does anyone know?
Is two tone paint a standard (NC) item in the Lariat pkg. ?
Are rear tow hooks (in addition to front tow hooks) standard in the Lariat pkg. They are listed on page 6 Edmunds for Lariat 2WD and 4 WD regular cab/supercab ?
Is there a picture somewhere of the cab steps in the Lariat pkg. and are these as durable as an aftermarket chrome or black pipe type step up ?
What would be the cost of an extra power outlet ?
What would be the cost of a spare tire lock ?
Where can aftermarket safety approved rear seat head rests be found for the supercab ?
I was told that this vehicle with a V10 engine F350 SD SRW 4X4 LWB supercab would get about 9 miles to a gallon overall mileage, is this correct ?
Are four wheel antilock brakes now standard (NC) for this vehicle?
Thank for any help that you can offer on my questions - this site continues to be very informative.
Tom 18
I am an 'anal retentive' MechEng that follows the severe maintenance schedule on whatever I own. Change oil every 2,500 to 3,000 miles, bleed and replace brake fluid every two years,.....
While my ford diesel was 'simpler' in terms of things that could go wrong, when specific parts failed they were way more expensive to replace (injection pump). Plus all of the ford diesel's will eventually fail from cylinder wall cavitation even if you use the FW-16 treatment. A replacement rebuilt ford motor is at least twice as expensive as a gas. My buddie's v10 is a wonderful motor which should serve him well for 200,000 miles (as most gas motors should go) before any major fixes.
Most of this info is available on the diesel vs gas post.
If I were buying diesel, I would go with cummins.
The cab steps aren't that pretty, but work fine and are sturdy. 4 wheel ABS is standard on anything over 10,000lb GVWR (ie: duallys) and optional on the lighter ones -- at least, that's the way it was when I ordered mine. I don't have heavy duty rear tow hooks, just the loops for the towing package.
Personally, if you're not doing extensive OTR trips in the 1000 mile range, I'd go with the V10 in the Ford. I never thought I'd say that (my 93 was diesel and I loved it) but the gas can be a lot more convenient, and is certainly a lot cheaper. In the Dodge, I'd still go with Cummins -- its a great engine and I don't like the Dodge V10 very much.
I've never driven the V10 with the 3.73s, but its probably the way to go -- I can start my truck off in 2nd (have, accidentally) and not really notice much of a power loss (this was empty, of course). For a daily driver with occasional towing/hauling, that would be my recommendation. You'd get better highway cruising and a more realistic 3rd gear ratio too... there are several times when I'd like to downshift but 3rd/4.30 is a bit highreving.
That's a heck of a statement about the cavitation issue we discussed here back in April and May. Why the heck should they even manufacture the engines if you can't put 200,000 plus miles on them with proper maintenance? Is Navistar that ignorant or that foolish?
No disrespect to you or your knowledge but why are you so sure about the inevitable failure of the PS engine? How many miles would you expect to get out of this same engine with proper maintenance?
Hey I'm not saying your not right but I hope your not. I would not be surprised one bit if you were right, I have certainly lost faith in the work ethic and engineering design of corporate America especially Ford in recent months!
Your thoughts.
Mroffshore