Honda CR-V Maintenance and Repair

acarbuyer

I'm shopping for a CR-V, LX, automatic (no side air bags).

Anybody buy an CR-V LX recently and what did you pay (including $490 destination fee?)

Read someplace that Honda never discounts but don't know if that's true. I can't find any info about Honda giving dealers money back on 2004 leftovers.

With the invoice at $18,700 + destination charge, should I expect to be less?

kathgip

I agree with all the above comments. I personally love the gear shift where it is, which gives all the room in between the seats. And the radio is placed so that I can see it without having to take my eyes off the road to change the station or CD. My Altima's radio is so low that I have to look away from the road too long to mess with it. And my new CR-V (which only has 185 miles on it so far), is the Mojave Mist, which is the most lovely shade of mocha with rose undertones. It is very elegant and I love the color. Too many red, blue, silver, white, and black cars on the road. So as the saying goes....."IT IS ALL IN THE EYE OF THE BEHOLDER". We drove all the other small SUV's and for us the Honda was on top of the list. My husband is 6'3" and it was the only one that he could sit in comfortably. And I am short and it fits me really well also......so there you have it.

edunnett

Kathgip - the cars that catch fire due to gas tank locations are usually the Fords: the Ford Pinto back in the 70's and more recently the Crown Victoria police cruisers - they didn't learn in the 70's about where a safe place is for a gas tank. If you're thinking of SUV fires there was the issue with Ford Explorer's Firestone tires exploding, or the Ford Econoline van fires or the only truck fires I recall are the Ford F-150 fires. Only the crown vics and pinto fires were related to rear impact gas tank explosions. So as for your statement that consumers forget these things and this will become a "non-issue" I could not disagree more. You couldn't pay me to drive or buy a Ford and most of the people I know remember these stories. I guess it all depends on your priorities - one of my priorities is owning and driving reliable cars that protect -not threaten- my existence. -elissa

kathgip

Hi elissa, I do appreciate your concern. But cars are a very personal thing and each person has their own experiences....good and bad. We have a Ford Ranger that we have had for 9 years and have not done a thing to it......it has the original brakes and battery, and it runs like a top and get 25mpg. So I am a Ford fan. My Dad hates Fords because he had a bad experience with one. He is a Chevy fan. But we got a new Chev several years ago and it was a dog, so you could not give me a Chev. And I agree that a lot of car techies know about all the problems and what cars they were. But I did a little survey of some of my friends and not one could name any cars that have had serious problems in the last 10 years. Everyone drives what they personally like for their own reasons. Reliablilty, economy, and comfort are key with me and most of my friends.....and how we define that is very different. I drive a CR-V, one of my friends drive a mini van, one drives a PT Cruiser, and one drives a Cadillac....all for the same reasons. It is personal.

taykinitezy

I remember seeing a post not long ago referring to the time pressure the technicians are under and that it could possibly contribute to performing a sloppy oil change. Had my 03 CR-V in today for the 3rd oil change ( Honda dealer), the tech had the vehicle for about 8 minutes for the oil change and for the air bag wire recall (which is docked at .3hrs) he spent about 7 minutes...

crawfish

My 97 CR-V's ABS light is on now. I am sure it is the ABS sensor problem because I had this problem 3 years ago, which costed me $200.

I don't need ABS function much, so can I turn the light off even though the ASB is not functioning? If yes, will my CR-V pass the inspection in NJ?

Thanks for your help.

edunnett

Crawfish, while your intentions might be pure, I for one hope there is NOT a way to turn the light off without fixing it. As a recent buyer and seller of several used cars, I would find it morally reprehensible had someone sold me an ABS-equipped car when in fact the ABS wasn't working. Now, perhaps you never plan to sell the car and would never be so dishonest... but if YOU find a way to turn the light off then others who are not so honest might also find a way. It concerns me. Please if you do turn the light off, don't sell it to someone without telling them, or having it fixed first. I consider ABS one of the best advancements in cars in the last 15-20 years (Fuel injection and Air bags being up there too) and wouldn't buy a late-model car without it.
Elissa

307web

But the airbag function is not used much either ...
Outrageous.

That's why you need to have used cars properly inspected before you buy.

stevedebi

You don't want to turn it off, you want to get it fixed. The ABS is your brakes, and a malfuction means that suddenly your brakes could either go compeletely out, or start cycling on and off.

For better or worse, the vehicle is equipped with ABS, and it is an integral part of your safety system. It is always nice to be sure the car is going to stop when you hit those brakes... and not stop when you don't.

How would you feel if one of your four wheels suddenly started cycling the brakes while you were cruising at highway speeds, while the other three wheels weren't braking?

isellhondas

ABS either works or it doesn't as I've been told by the techs.

Crawfish may not care if his CRV has ABS or not. for a whole lot of people especially those who live in mild climates, ABS isn't a big deal at all. A lot of happy people running around in LX CRV's that don't have ABS and the owners couldn't care less.

Still, it can't be assumed it's a sensor simply because that was the problem three years ago. It could be a loose wire or something much more expensive than a 200.00 sensor.

If it were my car I would definatly get it fixed and not try to ignore the problem by unhooking the warning light!

And, by all means, if you do do this, MAKE SURE you inform the new owner! Of course, at that point, they probably would pass on the car and for good reason!

kyfdx

The ABS system is designed to either work, or not work, and if not working will not affect the normal operation of the brakes.

HOWEVER, this needs to be fixed. You can drive without ABS, as cavemen have done for thousands of years, but disconnecting the light is just wrong.

regards,
kyfdx

stevedebi

I agree that it is designed to either work or not work, but if the sensors are bad, the system could kick in without warning. I stand by my previous post. The sensors are used to cycle the brakes. Everyone is assuming they only kick in to turn the brakes off, but I'm not privy to exactly how Honda implemented the system. However I know Honda didn't intend the system to be run with a fault light illuminated. I'm not a mechanic, and I haven't seen the vehicle, but I never take chances with any safety system...

Are the ABS sensors used in the EBD system?

crawfish

Hi everyone, thanks very much for your advice. I happen to be very honest person so you don't have to worry about "cheating" -- otherwise I would not post it here at all.

I am fed up with Honda's ABS quality. I know the fix could cost way upto $1200 for this ABS system if it is not just the sensor.

I just did a tune up and my 97' V with only 37k miles runs like cream. I fully intend to keep my car for a considerable long time. However, driving only 2 miles a day still rewarded me with this annoying ABS problem --- it just drives me nuts.

ABS is not a vital part of the car. I want to live without it like many people out there. However my V's inspection is due in August. That's the only concern I have. I think I am entitled to drive legally without ABS -- am I right?

I would be really happy if someone with DMV connection can tell me that my V will pass the inspection with this ABS light on...;-(

good42n

Bought mine last month, LX, auto, 2wd, no side airbags--$18,000 (including dest. charge) + tax & license. I'm in So. Cal, so depending on where you are, your best price may beat that. Use the Edmunds car pricing guides and get quotes several dealers.

splitor

Well, too soon to tell. My 2003 EX CRV was trashed by the fire (claimed total loss by the insurance company) after the first 3000mi oil change. My advise is when you go for your first or there after oil change be sure to remind the mechanic if the oil filter gasket is removed along with the oil filter. If not that would creat a "double gasket" and this is what caused the fire to start.
Just want to share my unfortunate experience with others here. My post here about the fire was back on Jan 07, 2004. If you are interested.
good luck.

#1422 of 1452 Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha by edgeta Jul 21, 2004 (3:56 pm)
I get it ..."fan the flames"...
I pick up my new CRV today. Told the manager if it catches on fire, he has to rewax it.

307web

If having the ABS light on is a reason to fail inspection and you turn it off just so you can pass the inspection without getting the problem fixed, you are "cheating."
If you turn the light off and plan to keep the car for a "considerable long time" it will be very easy to "forget" that you disconnected the ABS light in several years from now when the car is going to a new owner.
You should have the car checked to see what the problem is instead of guessing that it would cost $1200 to fix.
If the diagnosis shows that the brakes will work perfectly other than not having ABS ability, then they should be able to give you that in writing in case the inspectors want to know why the light is on.

crawfish

Thank you. As the manual says...your brake will function as normal without ABS...I am just saying if I can disable a non-critical part of the car like a radio or something, so I am not "cheating" in any way.

Somehow you guys get an impression that I am going to cheat the next owner... that's a funny story. My intention is not to turn off the light, but to use the car without the ABS. Think what if my CRV doesn't have ABS...

I of course will get the car checked.

Please no more discussion on this issue. To be frank, I feel offended. Once again, I would not post this here if I have some immoral thoughts in my mind -- if that would be true, I would have got under the car and cut the light's wire without letting anybody (including people here) know.

I appreciate your guys' advices. But as Bible says "don't judge people because you will be judged"

isellhondas

Since we have no such thing I know little about them. Probably not a bad idea.

But, I see no reason why in the world a non functioning ABS system would cause a car to fail inspection.

A whole lot of cars have no ABS and they pass. same difference isn't it?

kyfdx

I agree... The ABS not functioning should not cause you to fail the inspection. And, driving with it inoperable should not harm normal braking.

That said, none of us are ASE certified mechanics. A couple of phone calls to reputable service departments should give you a positive answer. I'm not sure if I would pay $1200 either, if I was only driving 2 miles per day.

regards,
kyfdx

P.S.: Don't ever feel offense at anything you read on this forum.... That is what the scroll button is for. If it is particularly egregious, the hosts will take care of it.

isellhondas

Anybody meant to offend anyone. some folks tand to go a bit overboard sometimes, that's all.

307web

The original post clearly says they want to turn the ABS light off.
This hides the fact that there is some problem with the ABS.
The whole scenario certainly sounds like they are trying to hide the problem from the upcoming state inspection.
It easy to see this by just reading the previous posts. Who knows if malfunctioning ABS is worse than no ABS at all.
Anyway, there is nothing to debate either way. They are going to do what they are going to do. So, future used car buyers, beware.

andrelaplume

Did you take a loss on the 2003 V or did they cover it under warranty.

mauto

Isellhondas, you said "A lot of happy people running around in LX CRV's that don't have ABS and the owners couldn't care less". I disagree. A lot of people would love to have ABS in their LX, but guess what? None is offered in that model. So if you want this vital safety feature, you must also have the other features that come with the EX. Shame on Honda for not offering ABS as a stand alone option. But then that's the "Honda way" - take it or leave it. This is the same problem with the Civic LX - no ABS. At least some sense is appearing to show up in Honda marketing: All Accords have ABS.

icvci

My 2003 EX CRV was trashed by the fire (claimed total loss by the insurance company) after the first 3000mi oil change.

FYI the first oil change is not to be done before 7000 miles per your owners manual.

kyfdx

The first oil change is at 10K miles.. 5K for severe service schedule.

isellhondas

Actually, you might be surprised. I'm in the business and deal with buyers everyday. What is important to you (ABS) may be of little importance to others and ABS is a good example of that.

It's hard to be all things to all people.

I wouldn't be surprised to see ABS become standard on everything at some point down the road.

icvci

Yeah, what you said. : )

stevedebi

The ABS light does not indicate that the ABS system is inoperative. It indicates that something is wrong with the ABS. Big difference.

Everyone is assuming that the ABS is simply shut off when the light is active, but remember it is an assumption. If it is a faulty sensor, it could malfunction. Not likely, but possible. Obviously, it's up to the owner to take their chances, or not.

I was harboring no ill thoughts about disabling the light (re:future owners). I'm just concerned about braking systems showing fault lights and not repairing them... especially since i'm not sure if the ABS sensors are used in the EBD.

andrelaplume

Trashed I understand but did you suffer a loss. Lets say you bought the V for $20K and cracked it up after 5K miles. The insurance company likely would have depreciate dthe car a bit...perhaps you would only recoup say $18,700.

In your case the fire (IMO) is a Honda issue that should be covered under warranty. This is Sabrina's point as well. They should have fixed your V, given you a comparable V or a new one. So I ask again, if I may be so bold...did you suffer a loss.

kyfdx

If you use a car for six months, then they give you X amount of dollars less than what you paid for it, that doesn't equate to a loss.. Whether involuntary or not, there is a value to the mileage and time you use the vehicle.

sabrina9

If your tranny went at 35,999 miles (under 36K warranty), would you expect them to repair or replace at no charge to you or would expect them to depreciate the transmission and have it cost you 500 dollars or something. I think you would expect a new or remanufactured tranny at ZERO cost.

I don;t speak for splitor, but as for me, I expected a new or comparable vehicle at ZERO cost. The warranty is repair or replace, not take whatever I get from insurance company and shut up. Remmber, Honda gave me ZERO. I got NOTHING more than what my insurance company reimbursed me (not even personal property lost). Therefore, no warranty was used. That is my point. I might as well not had any warranty.

kyfdx

Well.... you have a disagreement with Honda on whether it was a warranty issue or not.. Obviously, they don't consider it that way. And, many people have had their transmissions go out AFTER the warranty period, and Honda has replaced them gratis, AND extended the warranty to 100K miles. So, they do have some history of standing behind their product.

I understand you have had a traumatic experience, and it may still turn out to be Honda's fault. But, your financial loss is nearly zero. You got the use of a brand new CR-V for six months for around $2K. If it turns out that it is their fault, you may have other claims (emotional distress?), but in actual property loss, it is minimal.

Please understand, I'm not trying to say who was at fault, or to minimize your experience. Just looking at it from a financial perspective.

regards,
kyfdx

sabrina9

Why don't you spend 2k on a brand new car every six months? Me, I think Honda is getting what they deserve...and I do not believe it is over yet

varmint

You could always buy a VUE...

http://www.detnews.com/2004/autosinsider/0407/27/d02-223482.htm

Seriously, it's true that a warranty claim should include repairs or replacement at zero cost to the buyer. But there's nothing in the warranty to suggest that technician error is covered. So the warranty doesn't apply to those fire cases where stacked or pinched gaskets are found.

sabrina9

Not sure about pinched gaskets (since not sure why they are pinching on CRVs more than others), but in agreement on the doubles. (leave negiligent design issue to others for now). It is possible we may never know exactly what caused the filters to leak (a few leaked months later).

But the Q is this...
It has been almost 3 weeks since the Post broke the story, almost 4 weeks since NHTSA closed their investigation, almost 18 motnhs since the first reported oil leak (february 03), 17 months since the fist fire (March 03), and 10 months since my fire. Forget about fault for a minute.

HAS ANYONE ON THIS FORUM SEEN ANYTHING FROM HONDA WARNING THEIR TECHS ON THIS ISSUE

A failure to warn is an actionable cause and I would not eb surprised to see the class action people use it. Honda's delays only hurts more.

icvci

Saw the article in the Detroit News from February stating that Honda had issued notices to their mechanics.

varmint

Actually, Honda's decision to warn both their Technicians and those at oil-change retailers was their initiative. They were not forced to make that move. They opted to take action.

So, a lack of notification is not "actionable" as I would interpret the word.

I do agree that that it would be reckless had they not taken that action, or if they promised to contact everyone and then failed to carry out the plan. But that does not appear to be the case

sabrina9

I too have seen things that said Honda was warning their dealers, etc. but has anyone actually SEEN the notice. Because, certainly if they warned their techs in February of this year, and it was the techs fault as Honda says, then no more oil fires/leaks would have occurred, or at least they would have slowed down. Which does not appear to be the case, considering the 15 04 fires that are on the NHTSA. If that were true, does Honda think ANOTHER warning would work?

I'll let the lawyers decide whether the failure to warn occured. I doubt it matters whether a warning was forced or not. I think more of a concern would be WHEN the warning occured. Voluntary warning could certainly be a defense, but not sure if it would excuse. That a q for the judge.

I am not convinced they have carried out any plan. I have not seen anyone say they saw anything on Honda stationery.

varmint

"I have not seen anyone say they saw anything on Honda stationery."

Who have you asked?

The warning would most likely be registered as a TSB. See if your lawyers can dig those up.

sabrina9

It isn't on NHTSA's website. Something tells me if there was one, the person from Jiffy Lube and others would have mentioned it. But I'll keep searching

edunnett

There are no bulletins or recalls for this problem on either model year at www.mycarstats.com. AllData has nothing either http://www.alldata.com/TSB/67/036716AX.html
-elissa

sabrina9

drive62

Dealers get additional information besides TSBs. They get a newsletter of sorts that has information. They may have included this issue in that correspondence.

The fact that they didn't issue a TSB is a little strange though.

varmint

True, there are other forms of communication, but I agree that it's odd for there to be no TSB on this.

Also, they were supposed to be contacting Jiffy Lubes, Grease Monkeys, and other retailers. I doubt they receive dealer newsletters.

edunnett

The fact that they didn't issue a TSB is a little strange though.

Yes, especially if Honda were concerned about PR, litigation, public perception, or (low and behold) about NON-Honda shops doing the job correctly and limiting vehicle destruction. A TSB is more public and accessible.

eastbay

Doing research leading up to buying a CR-V LX two weeks ago in Charleston, SC, I questioned several salesman + service managers from two different dealers about the engine fire incidents. Both said that earlier that week (2nd week in July)a Honda rep had visited their dealerships to discuss the issue and caution them on the right way to change the CR-V oil filters. Salesmen and service managers alike seemed convinced the the problem centered on improper method of draining the old oil as well as improper replacement (gaskets, etc.) of the filter. When I asked about the possibility of a recall, they were unanimous in saying it wouldn't happen. However, they wouldn't put that assurance in writing!!

307web

How could the salesman put a guarantee that Honda will never recall the car in the future in writing?
Suppose they do recall it for a fix? How is that a bigger problem?

eastbay

I was referring specifically to a recall involving the engine fire problem. While it's impossible to know whether or not a vehicle will ever be recalled in the future, I wanted to see if the dealership had anything written from the manufacturer that they would share about the engine fires...not likely, but...there was no harm in asking.

sabrina9

Something tells me the demo (considering it was going over something they already do) was forgotten about 5 minutes afyter the demo.

Also, Hope my oil doesn't get changed by the guy who was out sick that day.

Did the Honda rep mention the "modified" o/c only applied to 03/04 vehicles and ONLY to CRVs, not civics, accords, elements. It may apply to 05's but we don't know that yet, but definitely not to 02 and not 97-01 and that it only applied for the first oil change, unless of course they get back to them if there are fires on 2nd and 3rd o/cs, in which case it would apply, but definitely not to 02's, which may look identical, but clearly is not since there are no fires on that.

Did he remember all that? Would have preferred some paper, thanks

icvci

"modified" o/c

Sabrina, they don't have to modify the oil change routine, they simply need to do it as they learned in Auto Shop 101. Or, even just read the instructions on the side of the filter.