Mazda6 Sedan

tiredofmanual

Will be based off this platform, or at least that was my understanding.

ghulet, I think the basics are:
-outstanding handling
-good weight - will weigh in right around 3000 pounds
-I saw it at the car show and you're right - it is smaller than the Camry and Accord, I would venture to say that it might be slightly smaller than the new Altima as well.
-It goes into production pretty soon and will show up in dealerships in the fall (sedan only - hatchback and wagon are spring/summer of next year)
-Interior is very nice
-I think that the price will top out in the mid $20Ks
-Is getting very good reviews over in Europe, where it will be on sale very shortly (the Japan factory has been online for a couple of months now).

What did I miss?

audia8q

Mazda6 will have a Mazda built and designed platform...that will eventually be shared with other Ford Divisions..

I believe the 6 will be launched to the public this month in Japan.

Rich

kenoka

You are a cruel, cruel person. After exhaustive research taking at least twenty minutes, I have answered my own question. For anyone who's interested, I found this at the Ford South Africa site. Using the 2.0 liter 143hp enginein the Ford Mondeo, they state overall fuel economy at 8 liters/100 kilometers. 8 liters = 2.1134 US Gallons. 100 kilometers = 62.1371 statute miles. Therefore 29.4018 miles/gallon. I'm not sure how they arrive at the one number, but my assumption would be a city/hwy split of around 23/35 or so. Anyone have better estimates?

audia8q

Isnt the US version going to use the 2.3l 4 cyl?

kenoka

Hey, I did the best I could, so get off my back about it! I'm totally kidding, although I had to do metric conversions and everything. I couldn't find a Mondeo with a 2.3 liter engine. They have a 2.0 4 cylinder and a 2.5 liter 6 cylinder listed. It's kind of an exercise in futility anyway, since the 2.3 liter is brand spanking new, but it's all in good fun, right? :P
Anyone have fuel economy figures for the Duratec v6, since that's at least a current engine? I know it will have Mazda's S-VT system and be tuned differently, but I just want a ballpark estimate to see how it compares to others in the market.

tiredofmanual

it was posted on another board that the 2.3 duratec is going to appear in the Focus in a year or two and will provide 20-30 additional HP and have the same mileage as the current Zetec. If that is the case, then...

I currently average about 29 mpg in my Zetec Focus in 55-60% city driving. That would mean that assuming gearing, drag, and weight were the same, the Mazda6 with the 2.3 duratec would get about the same mileage. But we know that the 6 will weigh about 400 pounds more than the Focus, though with all that extra power it could be geared to cruise at a lower RPM, thereby making up for the weight penalty. So what will that give us? I would guess an average of between 25 and 30 mpg for mixed driving.

audia8q

nice article on the Mazda6 in the June issue of Car and Driver.

Rich

kenoka

The 2.3liter 4 is not a Ford engine. This is a brand new Mazda engine that will be introduced with the 6. The 3.0 liter 6 has a Duratec block with the addition of Mazda's S-VT.
That being said though, I would be very happy to see those types of numbers out of the 4 cylinder.

kstu

Car & Driver lists the estimated mpg as 20-26 city and 26-32 hwy. Presumably that means the V-6 auto gets 20/26 and the I-4 manual gets 26/32. That's pretty typical for a mid-size sedan.

vcjumper

Another preview article..

World of Wheels

stickguy

should be the first model over. I still miss the utility of my '01 626 5-door, especially every time I need to move something bulky and have to borrow my wifes minivan. Also the best car I ever had. Should have kept it, but those motorized seatbelts really drove me nuts.

I looked at a Pro5 to replace my maxima, but it was just a bit cramped. The Matrix had great utility, but was just too odd. The 5 hatch looks just right.

ickes_mobile

I am cruel. That is why I left all that research to you, especially the metric/english conversitions!

ateixeira

You mean '91, not '01, right?

I had motorized mice on a car, too, and they drove me nuts as well.

Check out a Legacy GT if you want a bigger wagon now, or wait for the 6.

-juice

ickes_mobile

the first offical sales day for the Mazda6 in Japan!

tomcat630

Are they still making 626's in Flat Rock MI?

Soon, they should start retooling for the new 6's.

kenoka

I read that they were planning on beginning the retooling of the MI plant in July.
Juice - I had motorized seatbelts on my old '91 Honda Accord, and believe it or not I actually liked them, other than the first month or so, when they maliciously tried to strangle me on a couple of occasions.

porknbeans

Will the 6 be larger than the Legacy? I've read posts here about all wheel drive, but there has been no confirmation on this ever being an option, correct? TIA

kenoka

at Automotive News. It discusses the launch in Japan, as well as forecasted sales.

http://www.autonews.com/news.cms?newsId=2303

porknbeans, there has been no official confirmation that I can find regarding AWD, but several European sources seem very confident in an AWD wagon version being offered a year or so after initial launch. Mazda has confirmed that they will be offering a MazdaSpeed version of all their models. AWD is a gimme on the MazdaSpeed 6. Drool.
Regarding Size:
Mazda6: Legacy:
Length: 183.9 184.4
Wheelbase: 105.3 104.3
Width: 70.1 68.7
Height: 56.5 55.7
Both measurements are from the sedans. Although the Legacy has greater overall length, the 6 is wider, higher, and has a longer wheelbase. I've always thought the Legacy was a good size, but could use a bit more width and rear legroom, so this looks great on paper. I don't like the cavernous trend in mid-size cars (Altima, new Camry). I know that for a lot of people it's a necessity, but I'm glad Mazda is bucking that trend.

ateixeira

The problem with the mice was having an unfamiliar passenger stick his head out the window and open the door. It's like a noose and it happened more often than you'd think.

AWD would be a big plus, 219hp will create torque steer I'm sure.

-juice

ambull

Actually, it's torque that causes torque steer (duh) and since it is 202 lb-ft at 4750 RPM, it just might be minimal. The '03 Saab 9-3 is supposed to have eliminated it, so hopefully Mazda does too.

ateixeira

Call me a skeptic, but I'll believe it when I see it (feel it, actually). The Altima has terrible torque steer, enough that I'd argue that the 4 banger is better balanced.

Then again, I complained about it in the 1.8T Passat, even before they got a power boost.

-juice

ickes_mobile

said that the Mazda6 was comparable in size to the Camry, bigger than the current Accord and the 626, and smaller than the Altima. The authur said he was 6'5" and comfortable both front and rear.

I have read that the Mazda6 platform will accomodate all-wheel-drive. Such a system is available in the corporate parts bin from Mondeo...

newcar31

is caused by un-equal length half shafts and torque. Just because the Mazda 6 has X amount of torque doesn't automatically mean it will have torque steer. It could be all but eliminated with equal length half shafts.

ickes_mobile

in a front drive car because the engine is mounted longitudinally with the transmission on one end.

newcar31

You can greatly reduce torque steer to the point where you might not notice it with equal length half shafts. BTW, most FWD cars' engines are mounted transversely, not longitudinally. I can only think of Chrysler LH cars, some Acuras, VW Passat, that are FWD with longitudinally mounted engines. There may be a couple more, but that's it.

ickes_mobile

your're right - I meant transversely...

ateixeira

I spent some time under our 626, changing the tranny oil, and in all likelihood the 6 will be similar, with the tranny off center. I'm pretty sure the engine is laid out transversely.

So, unequal length half shafts + FWD + open differential + big-time torque = torque steer.

Nice thing about the Protoge5 is it's extremely well balanced. I know people ask for more power, but that upsets the balance a bit.

The 6 may actually be better balanced with the powerful 4 banger.

-juice

newcar31

I know for a fact that the new 6 will have a transversly mounted engine.

ickes_mobile

http://autorepair.about.com/library/glossary/bldef-763a.htm

johnclineii

I just got Sirius satellite radio put in my current car. Mazda is a Sirius affiliate. Wonder if Sirius ready radioes will be available on the 6? The center console design will make after market radioes difficult at best. (And yes, I like Sirius. A LOT)

ickes_mobile

what the fourth lamp is for in the headlight cluster? One for low beam, one for high beam, and one for turn signal. I assume its a fog/driving lamp, altough some of the photos show driving lamps in the lower facia. Thoughts...

kenoka

I belive the last set of lamps is for Daytime Running Lights. Aren't those going to be required by 2006?

ickes_mobile

That would make sense as I now recall the press photos from Rome having such lights on...

tbay

Stopped in to chat with the salesperson I've dealt with for many years at the local Mazda dealer. The latest word is that he doesn't expect to see the Mazda 6 until January and said it might then be introduced as a 2004 model..........also he told me not to hold my breath for the wagon as it will likely not be available for a long time after that.....boy what a downer........

kenoka

The factory isn't expected to begin retooling until July. Asahi news had a little blurb stating that the US version sedan would be released "early next year" so that part looks probable, although I've seen a November release from several sources. As for the "don't hold your breath" comment - I say don't hold your breath waiting for reliable information from a dealer. Everything I've read says that the wagon and hatchback will go into production as soon as they have enough inventory on the sedan. In Japan they are anticipating sales splits of 50/30/20 for the wagon/hatchback/sedan, and in Europe they're expecting a 40/40/20 split, according to Automotive News. Given the rising popularity of wagons and hatchbacks and the fact that Mazda has already turned 180 degrees from being very reluctant to even introduce the wagon and hatch to the US market, I think they'll ramp up production as soon as inventory of the sedan achieves some equilibrium. The Autonews article also states that the US release will be six months after the Japan release. The Japan release was 5/20, so therefore 11/20. Woohoo!

maltb

I tend to agree with you. I've heard that Job 1 is supposed to happen in October.

jfgoing

I was surprised to see the Mazda Japan announcement say that the japanese version would feature active anti-spin control (every car manufacturer has it's own name for this) - a feature that I've experienced on the BMW Z3 and decided I liked after that

Anyone know whether the US version will also get this? Will you have to get the six cylinder version to get it? VW is making it available as an option across the whole product line, and I'm hoping other car co's follow suit...

wgr

I am new to this board so maybe most of you know this, but if you go to www.mazdausa.com you can sign up to receive any official announcements, etc re the 6. On this site it says the introduction date will be "early 2003".

tomcat630

They are probably pushing the dates out to avoid any disappointment with being later then expected.

Better to get the car quality correct, then to push it out the door and have recalls.

kenoka

I believe that Mazda is planning this as a standard option across the model line, as well as the ABS with EBD. It looks like some features that show up on the European version (self leveling rear) or the Japanese version (DVD Navigation) won't be available in the US initially. Whether these will be added in later model years is up to speculation. Does anyone know if there are any other features that will be on other versions but not the US?

verozahl

"Better to get the car quality correct, then to push it out the door and have recalls."

... nothing that Ford wouldn't know, eh?

audia8q

The release date is still slated for late Nov...with the "official" launch happening at a later date....

but you will be able to purchase the car inbetween the release and official launch. Selection will be limited.

ickes_mobile

are typically staggered to allow inventory to develop before the ads come out. It doesn't do any good to have ads out for a car you can't go see at a dealer...

ickes_mobile

are available at http://www.atenza.mazda.co.jp

newcar31

"Yes, and even Honda is doing recalls, check the headlines from this week's Automotive News."

So what? Every manufacturer has had a recall at one time or another. It is the FREQUENCY of recalls that raises red flags. Don't even try to put Honda in the same league as Ford with regards to recalls.

audia8q

honda isnt in the same league in volume either

newcar31

"honda isnt in the same league in volume either"

"I'd like to see Honda even attempt to make F-150's and other heavy duty trucks in the numbers Ford makes and still have the "touchy feely tofu burger import quality"."

What do either of these statement have to do with anything? I never said Honda could or would build better trucks than Ford. I guess I'm not sure where you're coming from and don't understand how your previous post relates to what I was talking about. Ford builds a lot of trucks therefore they have more recalls? Ford builds more cars therefore they have more recalls? What kind of logic is that? Recalls are almost always due to design or production deficiencies. Despite what the two of you imply, there is no correlation between volume of production and recall frequency.

soundhack

Thanks for the link to the japanese mazda
site for the 6 (atenza)!

I thought it was amusing that the
streaming videos for the three types (sedan
sport, and sport wagon) featured cars with
california plates and a right side steering wheel
Only the sport wagon video seemed to be
taken on a regular road (I assume in CA) and not on a test track.

I thought the sport wagon looked too much like a honda civic, (style-wise, not to scale), so for me it will be a toss up between the hatchback and the sedan. I guess it depends on how impatient I am

ickes_mobile

Note that the incentives on the Accord are for a four-year old design. And, the incentives aren't anything like what Detroit has to give to move product. It is surprising that the Camry already has incentives. It points to a very competitive market.

The Accord and Camry are probably the perfect car for 90% of the population. I think that the new Mazda6, as well as the Altima, give people looking for a little more performance an option.

Having seen the spy photos of the '03 Accord, I find myself leaning more and more to the Mazda6. Given our experience with a '01 Accord, I'd be more than happy to buy another. But, the availability of a V-6/5-spd. and the hatchback body style may tip the scales...

ateixeira

Are you sure the Camry has incentives? Isn't is just the Solara? According to Automotive News it's just for the coupe.

The new Accord comes out at the same time the 6 does, so it's a moving target.

Volume does affect recalls, because you're simply using a greater number of parts and even more suppliers. So does the number of different models sold, because again more parts are being used.

You gotta remember Ford has the F150, F250, F350, in short- and long-bed format, in regular, extended, and crew cab formats, with flare side and sport side beds. That's about as many variations of the F series alone as some manufactures' entire lineup.

-juice