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Lexus SC 430



  • I had a Honda S-2000 traded for a Boxster & the Boxster for an SC-430 it is a beautifuly put together car.You can see the quality everywhere.
    The interior is gorgeous.I am glad I made the switch. Leo-K
  • toyotas1toyotas1 Posts: 134
    An L-Tuned, or factory Sport Pkg., SC430 is a great idea!
  • Lexus is selling the SC, in part, on the basis of performance.They should spec the car correctly. Nissan is famous for over specing and it irks the buyers. For me, and it is a personal decision, when I'm flipping the coin between the CLK and SC these numbers are part of the process. At some point I'd expect everyone contemplating buying car would be affected and for me 8/10 is meaningful. Having driven a CLK coupe..and ASSUMING..the cab would perform equally I bought the cab. If you ever have the opportunity to drive these 2 cars, you'll feel the difference for yourself. By way of final comparison, if the SC is a 6.8 ratner than a 5.9, the ES is 7.8.
  • squidd99squidd99 Posts: 288
    All cars are sold "in part, on the basis of performance." At one extreme, Porsche puts great emphasis on performance (speed and handling at speed). With a Camary, for another example, performance is mentioned, but more emphasis is put on room, comfort and price (value).

    I certainly don't think that the SC430 or the CLK are sold as "performance cars" as I understand that term to be commonly used. The emphasis here is on luxury in a convertible, which is a small niche. Performance is thrown in because of the great big engine, and we all know that any Lexus or MB will handle well at speed. I never considered a Porsche for various reasons, and I love the power of the SC430, but I consider that power to be part of the luxury. If I wanted a hot-rod, I could buy a 'Vett or a souped up Mustang.

    Zero to 60 is not all that big a deal. As far as I can tell, the car seems to be "speced" correctly and the marketing appears to be right on target.

    Maybe the new SL500 would be a better mix of performance and luxury, but the ticket goes way up.

    I forget what point I was making . . .
  • badtoybadtoy Posts: 368
    I agree -- the SC and SL are both boulevardiers, and thank God for that -- there are plenty of performance coupes to choose from out there already.

    I hope Mercedes doesn't overdo it and crank up the complexity, performance and price of the SL to the point that it becomes unobtainable. Or at least offer it in several states of tune, as before (SL300, 500 and 600, wasn't it?). That way, people have a real choice between "equals".
  • merc1merc1 Posts: 6,081
    Well this time around the SL500 is about a cheap as the SL will be in this country. The 469hp SL55 AMG will come in around 110K or so, and then finally an SL600 sometime in 2003. The SL is much sportier than the SC430 this time around. There won't be a SL320 in the U.S.

  • badtoybadtoy Posts: 368
  • toyotas1toyotas1 Posts: 134
    Rumor has it that Lexus will sell a fixed top 6 cylinder version of the SC in 2003. If they put a stick in there.....price it in the low 40's, and find a way to get it's weight down to about 3400, that would be 2SWEET! Don't know that current SC430 owners would be jumping for joy....
  • toyotas1toyotas1 Posts: 134
    Rumor has it that Lexus will sell a fixed top 6 cylinder version of the SC in 2003. If they put a stick in there.....price it in the low 40's, and find a way to get it's weight down to about 3400, that would be 2SWEET! Don't know that current SC430 owners would be jumping for joy though........
  • squidd99squidd99 Posts: 288
    We've heard that story before. We all know that, about 18 months after the '92 introduction of the SC400, Lexus introduced the SC300: same body but a 6 cyl engine with a stick shift available (and smaller tires). I don't recall the SC400 owners being upset.

    If Lexus introduces a 6 cyl version of the SC430 with a fixed top, I for one would welcome the addition to the line. It certainly would be a different car, but I don't know why all the compromises made to create the folding hardtop (eg: the high beltline, the small back seat, the shape of the top itself) would be of interest to to a purchaser of a coupe only version. It seems to me, and I'm no engineer, that Lexus would have to do a lot of engineering work to make this less expensive version.

    Look at the Jaguar XK8; the coupe version is very good looking, and less expensive than the (cloth top) convertible, but I think accounts for only about 10% or so of sales. A coupe version of the SC430 would have all the disadvantages of the folding hardtop design without the big reason for buying the car in the first place: putting the top down.

    Maybe it would sell; I hope so, but I don't think that there is much of a market for it. But as an owner of an SC430, I would not object or feel disappointed in any way.

    Still, I think the rumor has no foundation.
  • 43810774381077 Posts: 31
    Offer the current SC in a front wheel 6 version and take $10K or so off the sticker. Although I don't have the satistics, in the northest the ES appears to be their biggest seller by a wide margin and I'd further speculate that the GS 3 outsells the 4 version 3 to 1. You'd have a more reasonably priced car that's good in the snow that maintains the SC's #1 selling point, the top. Be pitting this new car against the SLK and IMHO it would kick MB's [non-permissible content removed]. Let the SC430 bang heads with the new CLK retractable hardtop when it comes out. Great for the consumer.
  • toyotas1toyotas1 Posts: 134
    You can't make a rear wheel car into a front wheel drive car based on REGIONAL demands/sales!! We're not makin' pizzas, people!! Let's keep these entries serious and well-thought out. Thanks.
  • 43810774381077 Posts: 31
    Wasn't suggesting a regional car. Granted I can't think of anyone who make a rear/front version of the same body style, but isn't it true that the principal reason for the SC being rear is the hp and twist? Take those down below 250 in a front wheel version and you have a nice cruiser that still gets out of it's own way. At the risk of bring MS magazne down on me, my wife loved the car but it was too fast for her taste and impractical in the winter. You can write off those who might want a less expensive, less powerful but more practical car, but Lexus might view it differently.Lexus is still the king of cruisers, not performance and Toyota doesn't exactly run scared when it come to producing front wheel drive cars. Try and contain you outrage, but your pizza analogy is on point, but in the reverse. The principal differences between Toyota and Dominos are price, array of colors and temperature of the delivered product. They're both banging out millions of the same base product in differing versions. Ten years ago anyone suggesting that Lexus take a crack at the sports market would have been laughed out of town. Incidentally, how many components of this revolutionary car are straight out of other Toyota inventories..starting with the drive train.
  • badtoybadtoy Posts: 368
    if Lexus were to introduce a lower-price-point SC to fill out the Es and IS range.

    In fact, the Solara was originally intended to be the ES version of the SC300 and 400. However, the demise of the Supra and MR2 left the Toyota division without a sports or touring car, so they decided to let Toyota have the car, which was then introduced as the Solara. Note the general proportions and insterior detailing -- especially the wood trim that curves across the dash and into the door panels.

    Hoever, rather than front wheel drive, I'd base the coupe on the RWD IS platform. I think it would be a home run for sure in the 30-35k category.
  • toyotas1toyotas1 Posts: 134
    The Lexus IS300 coupe joins the lineup, and a convertible is not far behind. Lexus is not Cadillac. They KNOW nobody wants a $40-50k car with 250-300HP worth of torque steer! Luxury car buyers (and performance buyers) WANT rear wheel drive! That is THE BEST drivetrain configuration, period! We're not making Honda Accords, we're making perfect automobiles, that drive and handle and accelerate with grace and balance
  • sphinx99sphinx99 Posts: 776
    If we're making perfect automobiles, how come there's no AWD? You can't just make a sweeping generalization like that, or you'll give the wealthy masses all the reason they need to buy an Audi A4 with quattro. Personally I'm waiting for Audi to come out with a coupe.

    IS300 coupe sounds nice. They should scrap the sedan while they're at it because the two back doors don't do anything but add extra weight. I was genuinely surprised that the IS300 had about the same rear seat room as my Prelude despite having the two extra doors. Also, the rear seats didn't fold down - another astonishing surprise. The IS300 coupe could be a fun car, if they lower it a bit, lighten it up, and put some more grunt in there. Does Toyota have an engine? I know they're competitive with BMW and Honda on the high-revving inline 4s and the company also has a series of great V8 powerplants. However, to my knowledge, they don't have any V6 in a production car that matches up with the kinds of engines Honda, BMW and Nissan have been putting out for a while. An IS300 coupe would be nice but I don't know if anyone cars for a 215hp IS300 coupe anymore, when everyone else is pushing 260hp and 240ft/lbs torque.
  • badtoybadtoy Posts: 368
    if the IS300 (really the Altezza) was designed without a fold-down rear seat in order to keep the chassis as stiff as possible. Just a thought....

    Scrapping sedan would be a big mistake, and I'm sure Lexus has no plans to do that.

    toyotas1: When you say "we're making perfect autmobiles" is it safe to assume that you work at Georgetown? Obviously you're a Toyota employee. No shame in that, and it should really appear in your profile, along with a disclaimer that states that your opinions are your own, and are nmot sanctioned by Toyota.
  • sphinx99sphinx99 Posts: 776
    Maybe. I'm not sure how much the seats contribute to chassis stability. However, I could see the back seat supports also being load-bearing braces for the car.
  • joe166joe166 Posts: 401
    How about helping everyone rewrite their profiles while you are at it?

    How do you know that he works for Toyota? Even if he does, how do you know that his opinions are his own and not those of Toyota. For a full fledged conspiracy theorist, it is not beyond the realm of possibilities that he is a total shill for Toyota and that he is only on here to put forward their positions to elicit opinion about them, but I kind of doubt it. Seriously, you are certainly entitled to your opinion and can evaluate his comments with whatever built in bias you may have, or even to comment on his apparent (to you) conflict of interest but it is kind of nervy for you to tell him what to put in his profile and the words he should use to do it, isn't it?

    I kind of thought I might get some insight into owners experiences with the SC430 as I am considering buying or leasing one, but it seems this has become some sort of acriminous debate on future cars that may or may not ever be manufactured.
  • exmoexmo Posts: 5
    Well, here is one owner that has had the car for 10 months and about 11,000 miles. It is, as has been stated in recent messages, a luxury convertible.

    I've never clocked the 0-60 time but I really don't care about that. I am more interested in the 40-60 or 60-80 acceleration for passing and it is very responsive. When you punch it at highway speeds it has plenty of guts. I get around 20 mpg for local driving and 25 mpg for trips. I use premium fuel as Lexus recommends.

    Interior comfort is superb although the ride can be a little hard, I suspect primarily due to the run flat tires. Sound system is very good and the GPS is a neat tool when it is needed (although the voice prompts are hard to hear with the top down). Lots of little niceties that one should expect in a luxury car. The back seat is useless for passengers with legs.

    There is an archived thread that has many comments in it from owners that you may find helpful. The Host was not able to resurrect it so this new one was started. Look for it at Town Hall->Coupes, Convertibles & Sports Cars->Coupes, Convertibles & Sports Cars - Archived Discussions->Lexus SC430 (owners and admirers).

    Bottom line is would I buy it again. The answer: in a heartbeat!
  • tkntkn Posts: 3
    I just watched one of those autoshows and they were comparing the SC430 vs the SL500 through the slalom. I, for the most part, think that MBs are overpriced junk, but watching that slalom I may have to rethink that. That SC430 was swaying so much it was scary, especially compared to the SL. So the real question is when will Lexus have a similar suspension setup to the MB?
  • toyotas1toyotas1 Posts: 134
    I don't work for Toyota, or even own a Toyota, or live in Georgetown. Two, I just believe that the SC430 is the sexiest coupe/convertible available REGARDLESS of price. It just needs stiffer shock/suspension tuning for people who AREN'T 50 or older. That is THE LONE weakness! This is THE dream car of mine. The new SL is beautiful, and does handle MUCH better, but is not worth $85k+ (I don't believe ANY car is!).
  • badtoybadtoy Posts: 368
    I should have said "It would be helpful if [toyotas1] were to include this information in [his] profile, so that we can better understand [his] perspective, experience and expertise". (I note from your own profile that you are an attorney, and I respect your perspective in this area.)

    Actually, I edited my remarks, which may have been a mistake. While working for Toyota, External Affairs made it clear that they discouraged Toyota employees from participating in chat rooms that might compromise Toyota's interests (usually by misrepresenting Toyota's intentions or products). They also made it clear that doing so could be a CLM (Career Limiting Move), if not cause for outright dismissal. Toyotas1 is obviously a Toyota enthusiast, and I would hate to see his career cut short by getting into areas his employer does not recommend or condone.

    The reason I though he was an employee is because of his post #136, which said, "We're not making Honda Accords, we're making perfect automobiles, that drive and handle and accelerate with grace and balance." Use of the word "we" led me to believe that he is either an associate or vendor for Toyota. Apparently that is not the case, and this subject is moot.

    In terms of writing EVERYONE'S profiles, you're right in the sense that I wish everyone would include enough personal information to give me (and others) an accurate idea of the writer's perferences and perspective. But of course, that is a personal choice. It just seems that anytime a troll comes on board, their profile is blank, whereas those who really wish to engage in thoughful debate tend to be more open and honest about their experiences and prejudices.

    Re, "How do you know that his opinions are his own and not those of Toyota. For a full fledged conspiracy theorist, it is not beyond the realm of possibilities that he is a total shill for Toyota and that he is only on here to put forward their positions to elicit opinion about them, but I kind of doubt it," you are absolutely right -- that is probably the first thought that would cross the mind of a conspiracy theorist. However, anyone familiar with Toyota's business model knows that they are far too conservative to engage in such a clever subterfuge.

    If you're looking for owner's experiences, I would suggest scrolling back to the beginning of the topic, where you are more likely to find the kind of feedback you're looking for. All topics on this board tend to drift over time, as there becomes less to say about the original topic. Good luck on your search!
  • toyotas1toyotas1 Posts: 134
    why personal profiles are NOT so detailed, badtoy. Since I have come here, I have never reviewed someone's persoal profile, because it has no bearing on the gist of the conversation. People come here to share personal opinions and experiences, and debate the current marketplace. I should have said I was a postal employee, then you would have an all-new respect for my views, eh? Anyway, there ae no "shills" here, just people kickin' it, so relax! And when I used the word "we", I meant when a luxury car manufacturer designs a car for the luxury market, this car usually must reflect the ideal paradigm in several regards, that is why rear-wheel drive is common in luxury cars, and front-wheel drive in more pedestrian vehicles. Frontwheel drive has efficiencies that are appreciated at a lower price segment, but are not when higher prices are required and technology is more a part of the architecture. Ask BMW why they ONLY make rear wheel drive......
  • joe166joe166 Posts: 401
    I HAVE read all the posts in this forum. I found them interesting. I will continue to lurk in the background for the most part. Thanks for the suggestion. Perhaps I was too harsh also, but it did seem kind of presumptious. I guess I really don't have a dog in that fight.
  • 43810774381077 Posts: 31
    The conversation here has gone off track..and I confess I've helped to derail it. In compensation here's everything you need to know about the SC in a nutshell from me who knows all and did a ton of research before not buying. Facts is you probably know all this already. The SC designwise is either loved or hated, although the haters appear to be warming up a bit. Pick a dark color if you're not crazy about the style.
    Handlingwise it's a compromise, BMW lovers say it's too soft, middle age fat guys coming out LS's say too stiff. I think for what it gives up in handling it more than makes up for in comfort. If you have to have nimble, go BMW.
    Performance is generally rated as good. Again, it's not fast, but it gets out of it's own way and if fast is #1 for you Corvette, Porsche or M3 is where you should be.
    Reliabilityand has to be great, it's a Lexus. Complaints in this regard seem linited to minor rattles, wind noise and the like, but these probably come from Lexus owners that have never heard such things in their cars.
    Overall it seems a great car for the money, but I decided I'd prefer the quicker, less expensive, more comfortable GS if i were to buy Lexus, a CLK cab if I wanted pretty as the #1 priority, and an M3 cab as the perfect balance if you can get your hands on one. There are just too many choices. God Bless America ( and maybe Japan and Germany)
  • joe166joe166 Posts: 401
    middle age fat guys coming out LS's say too stiff.

    Do you know me? Good guess if you don't. Frankly, I like the styling, but I fell in love with my wife's GS300 when I first saw it and the longer we have it the more I like it. It is hard to really get serious about buying one since my LS is really great. The major objections I have are related to the dealer base. They really don't know how to treat a customer. They send me accross town to the Budget Rent-a-car stand and give me a Town Car. If I have not had my dramamine, I can't take it so the option is a mustang or worse. It takes almost a half day to drop the car off, get a rental car and get to the office. Returning it is slightly faster, but when I compare that to my wife's experience where her selling dealer (50 miles away) sends another lexus to the house, drops it off, takes hers and returns it when it is fixed, I get very envious. This is for routine servicing and pretty much guarantees that the routine services will get done there rather than in my driveway or over at Jiffy Lube. Just a world of difference in the way we are treated. My wife had her bridgestones replaced (all four) at no cost at 27000 miles because her service writer thought they were wearing prematurely. Try that at the local L-M dealer.
  • mike10mike10 Posts: 5
    Has anyone else had a problem with the sun visors staying where you put them. Seems that mine have several preset positions (which are never the one that I want) that you must use or else they will flip all the way up at the slightes bump. Not good when the sun is in front of you. If anyone knows of a fix for this I would appreciate the information.
  • squidd99squidd99 Posts: 288
    No problem here. My visors have no preset positions; they move smoothly into any position and stay there until directed otherwise.

    I think maybe your car has a screw loose.
  • calstercalster Posts: 2
    I've had my SC430 for about a year, and I love it. I certainly watch the weather reports more often than before, and spring can't get here fast enough.

    Two questions --

    1) can the sc430 go through an automatic car wash. i realize it's not the BEST solution, but it is even feasible? What should I avoid if I have to do so?

    2) rear windows -- i realize that they go down when the top is down, but is there any way to program them to go down without the top being down? Can the dealer program this option? My dog would really like to know .

    Many thanks, all, for any insight you can offer.
This discussion has been closed.